Mupota Muchelemba Highlights the Role of Technology and Innovation in Driving National Development

 In this episode of Humanise, Mupota Muchelemba, Executive Director and Delivery Manager for Technology and Innovation at the Presidential Delivery Unit (PDU), shares insights into the strategic role of digital transformation in accelerating public sector delivery in Zambia. From championing innovation-driven solutions to enhancing efficiency and accountability across government programmes, he reflects on the importance of leveraging technology to achieve measurable national impact. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:22

In every society's evolution, there comes a moment when progress demands more than vision. It requires execution. A moment when technology is no longer a luxury, but an equalizer, when national transformation must be translated from ambition into access. From Potam Chelemba, that moment has defined his career. From early days implementing enterprise systems to scaling analytics and supply chain solutions across Zambia, South Africa and Australia, his journey has been one of building, integrating and accelerating. Today, he stands at the center of Zambia's digital transformation as the delivery manager for technology and innovation at the Presidential Delivery Unit, known as the PDU. From expanding high speed internet to 80% of the population to modernizing a national civil registration system dating as far back as 1965, his mission is clear to ensure every citizen from the farmer in Lukulu to the student in Ikelenge has equal digital opportunities. This is his story. This is Zambia's story. And this is Humanize Behind Zambia's Digital Transformation. Welcome to Humanize Behind Zambia's Digital Transformation, Powered by Infratel. I'm your host, Rosemary Kaluane. In today's episode, we explore how Zambia's digital transformation is being delivered not as concepts, but as real improvements in people's everyday lives. Joining us is Mr. Mpotam Chelemba, Delivery Manager for Technology and Innovation at the Presidential Delivery Unit. Welcome to this episode.

SPEAKER_03 2:56

Thank you very much, Rosemary. It's a pleasure for me to be here today.

SPEAKER_04 3:00

Thank you. We will start with you taking us back in your personal journey. Can you walk us through your early journey in technology, the kind of projects you worked on, and how this experience shaped the porter here today?

SPEAKER_03 3:24

Well, okay. Very interesting. I think my my journey really started before my career started. So I think one of the memories that I have is of being a 12-year-old boy, um, learning to code. Um came across these books, these old university books that my father had from his days at the University of Zambia. And I remember being intrigued finding that these books were teaching you how to code. And I was like, wow, you can you can program a computer. So I started to write code, learning, teaching myself how to how to code from those books. And um before I even ever touched a computer, right? I'd never touched a computer before, and I started to write the code, and I would imagine the code running just using my creativity and in my head, right? So that that it it started then and it um really drove my curiosity and and led me to later on pursue you know topics in technology and building things like building companies, building teams, uh, building products. So when we say uh what what else really shaped me here is uh is that I worked across Zambia, I worked uh in South Africa and and Australia, like like you said in in the beginning, and I think these different environments really um sh shape the person that I am and how and my approach to to delivery.

unknown 4:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 4:50

I I I do believe that um you know technology is an equalizer. I think from the experience that I've had, uh technology can really um get everybody to a level playing field, and I think that that really informs uh the interest that I've got in it.

SPEAKER_04 5:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 5:10

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 5:12

Wow, I was I was trying to imagine a 12-year-old busy with uh these books that have can we say.

SPEAKER_03 5:20

Yeah, do you know that story the the interesting addition to that story is that um once you know still was a 12-year-old boy and and I lived in Dollar with you know with the fam my family back then, and uh there was a time that the the it was it was time for the international trade fair, and there was an announcement that was made by Zambia State Insurance Corporation that they were going to have a personal computer on display. So I made it a mission, bought my ticket to the trade fair, I went there by myself, stood in uh in the queue, and everybody got five minutes to play these computer games on on this PC. So when it was my turn, you know, embarrassingly, I I got to ask the man who was standing beside the computer watching over it, uh, does this computer allow me to code? I want to try the code that I was that I was writing on paper, and this guy was he was just manning this thing and he's like, kid, you know, it's either it's either you play this game for five minutes or ship out, you know. So so yeah, so it started from there, you know, and and after that, you know, I was bitten by this technology bug, right? You know, so so I I always look back to to that time and and think that um also sometimes in in businesses we don't know the impact that we're making, even with things like our corporate social responsibility aspects. You you know you put a computer out then you forget about it and not not know that it's going to really uh inform the future of one little kid who comes to your stand in something completely different from your industry.

SPEAKER_04 6:52

Yeah, that's wonderful. Yeah, one moment you were coding, the next moment you are shaping the economy through digital transformation.

SPEAKER_05 7:01

Yeah, awesome.

SPEAKER_04 7:02

Are you able to share um how the experience across like Zambia, South Africa, and Australia where you've worked, how this influenced your experience, your execution uh strategy and leadership?

SPEAKER_03 7:18

Well, yes, I suppose um if I think back to South Africa, I think South Africa really taught me about scale and complexity of projects. I was coming from an environment where um some of the things that I had studied in at university, and I went to Copper Belt University to study computer science, by the way. So the things that I studied there, the things that interested me, didn't have such a large demand in the market at the time. So I uh made efforts to to sort of go to where they would say the the grass is greener, but it really wasn't about the money, it was really about the experience. I was frustrated as a young as a youngster. I wanted to experience um you know enterprise enterprise software. So I went to South Africa and in South Africa there was really a boon in the in the market. Um there was a lot of tech uh that was being used there. So I found myself in a lot of different projects, Rosemary, like from industry to industry. And um, I was dealing or working with uh with a software called SAP, which is a really big global um powerhouse of enterprise software. Okay, and we were taking this software and implementing it in small and mid-sized businesses, and um we found that even if this software was so popular around the world and it did everything with in South Africa, we still had to push it to its limits, we still had to extend it, we still had to do all sorts of things to get it to to suit the businesses that were that were there. So that was my experience in South Africa, and then Australia, I believe Australia taught me about discipline, about you know governance in projects and just you know being accountable for for things. So there it was a lot more advanced, right? It was an advanced environment. There were so many consulting businesses that were selling the same thing, the same SAP software, and the business I worked for was just one of the many, one of the hundreds. Okay, so we had to differentiate ourselves from the the last man, right? So, what we had to do was was demonstrate expertise in certain industry verticals and also certain areas of the same large software. So I think that's what Australia uh taught me. Um I worked a lot in in different sectors like agriculture. The agriculture sector of Australia was super advanced, I had never seen anything like it before, and I learned so much from that, and also in things like um mining and and all of those things. So then coming back to Zambia, and I think Zambia is where my real entrepreneurship story started. I when I came back to Zambia, I opened a business and um selling the same software that I'd been I had been working with, and then also found that you know in entrepreneurship there was no room for failure. That if I decided that morning I was not going to work, or if I decided that I didn't like the client or the prospect that I was working with, that meant that I did I would not make that money and I would and my family would go hungry, right? So I I really was very humbled and got taught the art of the customer being right all of the time. Um famously I remember talking to my wife and and saying to her, you know what, I don't understand why nobody is going to buy my beautiful enterprise software, but every time I'm driving down the street, I can see that woman there, she sells groundnuts. People stop and buy her groundnuts. Must I also now start selling groundnuts, maybe you know? So there was a bit of a frustrating moment, but then it taught me eventually that if you found a real problem in in an industry or in business, and also if you cared very deeply about if you cared very deeply about the success of your customer, your own success would then follow. But you had to understand, you had to understand all the intricacies of the industry you were working with and what problems and opportunities that you can bring to your client. And that's what consulting was about. So those that's what I think I learned from the three um uh different countries, and I think that those things kind of shape shape the way that I that that I operate.

SPEAKER_04 11:39

Okay. So you have um delivery, South Africa, you have issues of governance in in in Australia, then you have entrepreneurship in Zambia in Zambia. Yes, and then you navigated private sector and and public sector.

SPEAKER_03 11:58

That's right, yes.

SPEAKER_04 12:00

How does that uh play into your delivery approach today?

SPEAKER_03 12:06

Well, I find that um I think the lessons that I've learned from all of those things, of course, all of those experiences that I just described, first of all, didn't have this angle of government, right? Public sector, and and coming into the public sector in in Zambia taught me um taught me a lot, things I never thought I would learn. And I think the biggest lessons for me were about uh equity, things like equity and inclusiveness. That everything that you attempted, everything that you approached in your projects, had to have this element about who was going to benefit from this, who's who's you know, which which demographic are you targeting? Is it everybody? And usually it is. All citizens must benefit. Um, and when you're looking at that, you've got to think, who's who's not going to be able to benefit from this? Uh are they are they going to feel the impact of of what we're doing? So I think that inclusive the inclusive angle of of government taught me a lot about how to make technology matter in in people's lives.

SPEAKER_04 13:20

And I bet uh from this public sector government institutions must have taught you patience as well.

SPEAKER_03 13:30

Yeah, you said not me. But yeah, actually uh it did, but it also really taught me it ought taught me I think an an important lesson that and I have this mantra that I I always you know speak and say to people that digital inclusion is a team sport, that nobody can do it by themselves, not even government can do it by themselves, not private sector, not a development partner, not a citizen, and that you all have to come together for it to to move. I found um you know the power of of collaborations in government.

SPEAKER_05 14:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:08

Um that with a lot of competing priorities that government has, particularly a government like ours, um, you know, you have to be creative and you have to use the different strengths that people bring to the to the table. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:22

You yeah, talking about um agile governance and uh agile governance and collaboration, you have different methodologies that are adopted in order to uh deliver accordingly and to what the sector requires.

SPEAKER_05 14:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:41

Um I'd like you to just share what you have adopted uh in terms of IGO principles in uh delivering government um targets. How have you placed that into to government to ensure that you accelerate delivery?

SPEAKER_03 15:02

Yeah, okay. Um good point. I think but first of all, the PDU obviously brought these different methods, right? Working with our different partners, uh, we brought these different project methodologies um uh to the table at a time when you know government uh different government organizations uh have their own individual approaches to project project management, right? There isn't one standard approach in the government of Zambia. So now we bring this method to the table and it's a very agile type method, and you know, people are used to these traditional project project uh delivery methodologies, and so that in itself was a challenge to start with. It just looked like we were from two different worlds, but I think people started to see the point after after a while. The we we have these we have these different aspects of the the agile methodology that we have, such as uh I think we have things like weekly check-ins. So, what we do as PDU is to offer this of oversighting um or oversight uh capability and also the ability to unblock where things are blocked. You might take it for granted that you know, because it's a government organization, they would be able to fly through everything that they need. But government organizations also face um challenges such as permits, licenses, you know, um, and so you find that um things like that are waiting in a pipeline somewhere, so the PDU come in and block some of those things. So, what what we do is then we have a whole project that is defined with the implementation organizations like the government organizations and even private sector sometimes. Okay, once you've defined that project, uh you have these weekly, what we call these weekly check-ins, which is just an interaction that you have with the project leads of of the project in it in the different government organizations. So every week at the start of the week, you're looking at what you plan to deliver. End of the week or the following week, you're looking at accountability of the things you planned. What did you deliver? Now, these check-ins are usually um multidisciplinary, right? We've got multiple different organizations that are meeting in one place, all of them reporting what they've done, all of them reporting uh where the challenges have been. So um it brings a lot of uh uh clarity to that. So there's a weekly check-ins, we've got things like uh what we call monthly deep dives, which is really to bring, if I can put it this way, like a magnifying glass, you know. If you've got grains of sugar on a table, and then you magnifying glass, you look at how the grains are organized. So the the monthly deep dives are there to scrutinize the project and to see how healthy it is, if there's any challenges, and and whether it is still going to deliver on the promise that you've started off with. That's the second layer, and you can start to imagine a bit of a pyramid. So we're starting at the bottom, weekly check-ins, then we come to monthly deep dives, then we come to quarterly, what we call quarterly check-ins, and these ones are usually chaired by the minister in charge of whatever ministry you're working with.

SPEAKER_05 18:19

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 18:20

Um same style, same everything, except as you go up the ladder, you are problem solving at that level. So whatever challenges uh blocking the project will be unblocked at the particular relevant level. The last level above the quarterly check-ins we call the presidential stock stock takes. And these are done, I think, usually twice twice or three times a year with the president. So same thing, same style, same reporting. So I think um those are the main instruments that we use in this um agile methodology that that we're using, and I think these are the these are the things that are very helpful for our projects. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 19:07

It it brings to mind that maybe if we all adopted the agile methodologies across all sectors, yeah, every granular detail of every project that is being done will be taken into account. We won't have backlashes like a month later, then you begin to realize, oh, this wasn't done. But your type of approach, um, the agile approach uh has brought out and blocking, like you are calling it, at every level. So when you look at these um daily check-ins as you call them, the weekly uh deep dives and the quarterly uh stock take end, when you look at all this, how has that um helped in the execution of projects at PDU?

SPEAKER_03 19:58

Okay. Yeah, um so maybe let me let me put it this way. Number one is transparency. You know, when you keep bringing up the same issue, you know, stuck, stuck, stuck the same problem week after week, month after month, eventually it starts to show you out, and then you know, you you um motivate yourself into making sure that that problem is resolved because everybody's watching. So that transparency into progress is I think the first thing. I believe the the second thing is about speed. Because these things are happening quite regularly in a timed manner, you get to problem solve and make sure that and blocks happen, right? So they they bring this um element of speed of execution and also accountability, right? People tend to be more accountable when things are shown on the screen, everybody's sitting, everybody's watching. And I think those maybe three areas uh are what are what really help bring the benefit of this type of uh methodology.

SPEAKER_04 21:08

Okay, yeah, it's it's definitely uh paints a picture that the over execution is always on point, or at least in the in the stipulated time.

SPEAKER_03 21:22

Yeah, look, I mean it's it's um it's not a hundred percent science, right? It's got a human side to it as well. There's a lot of change that needs that people have to go through in order to adapt to these these methods. Um so some people uh adopt these methods a lot faster than others. So the different organizations that are different maturity levels of adapting to this project management methodologies. So, but because as a PDU you have all of these organizations, multiple of them, sometimes I uh my program, Digital Inclusion, has maybe seven. or eight government institutions um and you know m many different private sector and development partners and they all have different ways um or different rates at which they assimilate this these uh management methods so you find that you have to be patient a lot with with people and and handhold sometimes and also listen and adopt a certain certain of the methods that do not really infringe on the core um because you also have to listen right and it's it's not you're not right all of the time right so so they it does allow for a few deviations right here and there um but on the overall I think it takes people having to uh adapt these things over time and warm up to them but as they do that to the projects that they're working on remember they're also working on other projects that may not be a presidential priority yes so they then they start to transfer that knowledge to those other projects as well slowly slowly and we s what we see is that over time over the years it's starting to get better as as we go. Um Stam Chalemba let's let's look at um the agile governance and collaboration I know agile methodologies are associated with startups but how have you incorporated these uh principles of um agile methodologies in the delivery well okay inter interesting um I think I I I did say say earlier how it's a bit of a challenge to get these new new methods in within within government but ultimately it started to it started to happen and how how we did it is by first of all engaging with uh with uh the president um there was buy-in from the president to be able to use this kind of methodology and this also the buy-in came from from ministers we had to demonstrate and show what the benefit was going to be for for these methodologies and from the ministers to the permanent secretaries to the directors and so you had to have all of these conversations before you got started and also I think importantly we had to be hands-on and involve people sitting around tables um showing them what the methods were and explaining to them how they fit in into the grand scheme of things um and then eventually then creating these creating these structures like we talked about um your weekly check-ins and your your deep dives and things like that we have to schedule them ahead of time and ensure that we are reporting the results of all of these things all the way bubbling them up to the top all the way up to the president for instance so so that meant that meant that um you know people understood that this was the method that we were going to use and and so that was the the the way that we used um or that we we got buy-in aside from that uh one of the things was that we demonstrated to the implementation institutions themselves like the ministries that this was actually beneficial right that we took these methods within the organization and we could show that they could uh elicit value um out of them if even if they were not working with the PDU for instance they're working on on several different things I think that's um would would be uh how we we did it just really through a lot of engagement with with the people in the in the various institutions. All right um since adopting these agile routines like you've made reference to the weekly check-ins the the monthly deep dives and the quarterly uh stock techs I just wanted to have you share what changes they've br uh brought to the project velocity and the over execution um uh uh first of all I'll give you I'll give you a practical example uh we were brought in to help with a project um regarding uh medicines distribution um where there was a a project to to integrate two different enterprise systems um starting from the the central distribution hub uh for ZAMSA and into the the the pharmacies in the healthcare facilities so these two systems um originally did not talk to one another and so it brought a lot of problems in in the delivery of medicines and and in um the availability of these medicines in in the different facilities excuse me so so we and when we came in we found that there seemed to have been a bit of a challenge a bit of an impasse in the project it had taken uh a number of years and the project had kind of run aground been put on ice really because of different different issues around the project so we brought these methodologies on board but largely it was really just to ensure that there was um mutual respect between different parties and that there was recognition for each other's strengths and that when they adopted a single um methodology um such as the ones that we brought we we found that we were able to close the project within six to eight months and so you know from maybe something like three four years that it had been delayed within six to eight months it got delivered so I think that in practice speaks to the the execution speed that you can gain from from methods like this because we had the weekly check-ins we enforced the weekly check-ins we enforced the deep dives we enforced the reporting structure and made sure that decisions and and problem solving was done at every level so it started off really quite slow but then it picked up pace and then eventually we we got to the end of the project. So and now we we we're sitting in a position where um you have um you know you've raised the availability of essential drugs in health facilities to um if I'm not mistaken I think it's somewhere between 80-85% um availability of of medicine so and then that also now started to facilitate for another project which was going to be about access to drugs right so I think that that example really shows us how you can accelerate from something that takes so long using these these uh methodologies.

SPEAKER_04 28:38

Yes that's that's great and here I am listening to you and I'm like so it's not only for startups other institutions can also adopt the the methodologies and it will bring the growth and and the delivery to a speed.

SPEAKER_03 28:55

No absolutely I think it it does work like I said that you really have to approach it from the angle of the benefit that it brings the citizens.

SPEAKER_05 29:04

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 29:05

Government takes somewhat of a if I can call like a fiduciary um responsibility for the money that taxpayers are paying so um yes you with that we tend to be very very careful and very guarded in the way that public money is is spent but that sometimes it kind of blots the the process. So there's a lot of checks and a lot of checks and balances because this is the people's money but then sometimes those same things that are there to to protect the public money sometimes could also lead to to inefficiencies that actually start to cost the the Treasury. So um the agile methodologies um seem to kind of help and block that and make sure that things can can move along yeah so government can definitely benefit from from these sorts of things.

SPEAKER_04 29:53

Okay that's that's awesome.

SPEAKER_03 29:55

Last time we were talking to the head of PDU there was a mention of um inclusive um strategy uh digital inclusiveness are you able to just share a bit more since you are involved in the technology and innovation aspect absolutely thought you'd never ask um this is really the project that we're currently very very active with it's a presidential priority now it's called digital inclusion it's quite generic the the term but the goal of this um from the president and also is found in the Eight National Development Plan is to connect and empower 80% of the citizens with um broadband internet access and digital literacy whilst enabling 20% of them to actively participate um in the digital economy by either learning online or transacting or trading online and all of this um is there so that we can bring prosperity to to the citizens it's not really just just buzzwords but it is there is a a benefit that we're looking for at the end at the end of that so why was why was this vision formed um I think it was also found that because the vision 2030 does intend on making Zambia a prosperous country by by the year 2030 and one of the ways um that you can bring prosperity to a nation is by using technological tools technology to bump up everything that you're doing so um it was also found that you know there's we still as a country have a modest level of let's say a level of digital inclusion we want to get to 80% but as at last count you have under 40% of the of the citizens who have real access to broadband internet. So we're doing well right um uh even as a sector ICT sector performed the best as a single sector last year its contribution to GDP almost half of the GDP growth came from ICT so we're doing well as a sector however we want to do more yes so and in in wanting to do more we identified what those problems are that are causing these gaps and we found that uh we have issues such as infrastructure gaps particularly in rural areas um other things are to do with affordability so affordability of things are internet data bundles we have um part of the population that may not be able to afford um these these bundles that you're you're buying every day uh in fact even the rest of us also struggle sometimes when it ends I've struggled buying bundles until you know until I get paid for instance sometimes so um the the cost of internet data bundles there's also the cost of the access devices right now you're holding a tablet in in your hand and it costs quite a lot of money right for anybody let alone um the people who live in what you would call an underserved um area or a more rural setting right um they will have challenges buying that device up front but you need it for for digital inclusion to happen you also have the challenge of uh digital literacy you may have the device you may even be able to buy data bundles so you're sitting with this thing in your hands and you don't know how to use it you don't know how to access banking services you don't know how to access government e-services and and these sorts of things so you need the digital literacy to be able to to um engage with the with the electronic services that means you need you need to be taught um how to use these things so digital literacy becomes um the third pillar very very important and um that really fourthly you need the same platforms that we're talking about the same government services you know your even private sector um services being exposed online to the citizens so that they're accessible anywhere that the the citizen is those are the components of this digital inclusion program that we are that we are looking at and not to forget that really the digital inclusion that we are trying to bring is about getting all citizens regardless of where they are to be able to access these digital services in a in an equitable equitable manner so that they can participate in in in uh in the society so that's um that that is the digital inclusion agenda that we've got so the solutions that come from that now relate to these these pillars we've we've spoken about talking about increasing uh connectivity how do we increase connectivity how do we deal with the problem of of the cost uh or the affordability of devices and internet how do we deal with the digital literacy and also the apps and platforms so there's multiple strategies that we have in something that we call a roadmap which is coming from all those agile um uh agile methodologies we are referring to okay when when you tabulate the um the pillars of digital inclusion it brings to mind therefore that uh national digital transformation requires collaboration and it gives the picture that when you explain all these requirements how you're trying to get um people in Zambia uh connected it brings out that at the center of digital inclusion digital transformation you have the people so how are you working with partners are there any partners to help you because when I look at all these pillars definitely you require some collaboration yes indeed um we have a lot of partners by definition um digital inclusion requires collaboration from many many different um uh stakeholders yes and so at the core in government we have um partners like the Ministry of Technology and science this is the owner of the the the digital inclusion agenda um largely in in in the country and you also have um um closely working with with them and with us as well is the Smart Zambia Institute that look at uh that looks at digitalization within government okay so those two institutions become then the anchor institutions for for digital inclusion um but besides them we have a lot of different other partners like uh Zikta um Infratel we have um private sector we have development partners like the World Bank um UNICEF um NGOs like healthy learners and and um you know others then we also have the private sector and in private sector you've got ICT you've got um wholesale and distribution you've got everybody who has some sort of reliance on on on digitalization in order to grow their business we've got five finance um institutions like banks and mining so there's a lot of them that that we work with so those are those are the partnerships that we we we we use. Okay yeah yeah I know if we have we have to go into what you're doing with the partners how effective it has been it will become a story for another day that's absolutely true okay so looking ahead what legacy do you think the PDU would want to leave for Zambia so okay talking about legacy I actually that is in the digital future that is in the digital future legacy um I actually would like to start with a small sort of analogous story if I can get you to just put your mind in imagination mode because when we're designing particular personally when I'm designing anything in in terms of the digital inclusion program I think about I think three or different three or four different places in the country and always designing for them one of them is like Ike Lange um the other one is uh Muanjavantu in Petauke and Alolo in Western province and and um also I think I have also like a a district that is in in Wapula um somewhere up there. So I always look at these places and think so whatever we're doing will it will it work for those areas or for the people in in these areas um and so in in doing that I'll pick uh one one of the areas like Gwembe it's very close by right it's I think about three or four hours drive from Lusaka and Gwembe's got for in in my opinion a a great story and a great um potential for getting into this digital inclusion agenda because when you look at Gwembe there is a fiber optic cable internet super highway that goes towards the district goes towards the town it it it it gets into the district but it and ends up at a commercial fishing company somewhere all right so this is like a uh a big thing there but then the economy of Gwembe part of it is driven by goat goat farming so a lot of the families there depend on on goat farming because it's quite hilly quite mountainous so you find the goats are like mountain goats they climb they climb up the mountains to to browse so um and you know once there was a bit of a calamity you know the recent drought that we had and you found a number of these families lost the goats that they that were their livelihood because they had to sell them off because they didn't have anything to to eat right so they sold off the goats including the breeding stock for instance and they you know pretty much wiped out these goats um not all families but in a number of them quite a number of them and then down the line you find that um they have nowhere to start from again they they need breeding stock but they don't have the money to buy the breeding stock so recently I saw in the news that there was a there was a a donor who came in with a number of goats I think I don't know there were about a hundred goats okay and they came and sort of helped restock gave a few of these families um goats as starter packs right if you can call them that way um but then I start to think imagine if you could get that fiber optic cable that information super highway that is just waiting um to be used and combine it with this situation if you if the people of Gwembe could then bring this connectivity into into town spread it around with a few Wi-Fi hotspots for instance in community halls and markets and places like that give the people that are trading their access to this internet get everybody to be skilled up with digital skills yes um and then you end up with uh a population where they're able to advertise their their goods and services and goats to the global village yes they're able to uh look up responsible efficient methods of goat farming so they can improve those yeah and um maybe even be able to to do things like you know Gwembe has got a lot of tourism potential and they advertise it like that even the local authority there puts out a lot of effort to say we've got a lot of tourism assets here please come so now the young people there you know who have these digital skills could then advertise start advertising the the tourism to the to the world and the people that are coming to visit Zambia will not only end at Victoria Falls they'll say I also want to go and see what's in Gwembe right so they they get there and of course they're going to spend some money in that environment they'll get a B or bed and breakfast and leave some money in that economy. The other thing as a as a knock-on effect of them interacting with the global um village the people from Gwembe is that they would then show the world that look there's there's places in in the world where you can go and maybe build a little house somewhere and stay there there's fast internet connection so I can still work do some remote work whilst I'm living living next to the lake for instance so the so-called um what we call them we call them uh uh we call them uh digital nomads right so these these sort of digital nomads they leave their silicon valleys and say I'm tired of this concrete jungle let me go to a place that has um some serenity so they come and set up there and say I'm going to be here for two years three years or something like that they of course they're going to start spending in that economy as well right and uh lastly the same people of Gwembe particularly the younger the younger generation can also become what we call gig workers right they've got some digital skills and when they look up online for jobs and things like that they find these short term short term pieces of work clean up this data for me tag this data or wherever they pay them a dollar here five dollars there they're exporting skills see so I think that at the end of that now there's a here's the connection right the goals will still be a part of the everyday lives of the people in Gwenbe but now when you bring digital technology alongside it let's say that the digital skills become the new livestock right which is perpetual no matter Whether there is a drought, whether there is a flood, they will still have these digital skills and they are with them for life. And that that sort of adds to the goat farming that they have and brings this economic prosperity that we're speaking about. So that I think is the sort of the story, the background story to this when we're talking about legacy. If we can get to a stage where we see Zambia operating like that, I would say that's great for the legacy of the PDU. Following that, really, is to say is to see you now at a country level that everybody, all citizens are able to use this digital technology without it looking kind of exclusive or um elitist or anything like that, and it's just supposed to be normal, like everything, everything else. Lastly, I would say uh what would be great for the legacy of the PDU is to see government, government institutions being able to deliver complex technology projects, digital inclusion projects, um, in a timely manner, within budget, and also with the with the with inclusion and impact in in mind. I think those are the things that would for me be the legacy.

SPEAKER_04 45:24

Okay. So we've we've talked about the legacy. Maybe let me just push you a little. Oh, okay. When you think about delivering the presidential digital vision, how do you define success? Not in technical terms, but in terms of citizen experience.

SPEAKER_03 45:48

I mean, it's not for me, it won't be a very difficult question to answer because this is how we live and breathe in the in the PDU. We design for people, right? Awesome. That's also the the thing I think that sets us apart is that we're always designing with a citizen in mind. You know, I'll veer off a little bit and talk about, you know, we have the energy challenges and we talk about how many megawatts we need to this project is going to bring into the grid. And that one, 10, 100. But in the PDU, we do recognize that and we take that into account. But you know what else that we measure? Tell me. We're looking at okay, how many hours of uh load shedding is the citizen going to have reduced because of the megawatts that are coming in? How many um minutes or hours of the day will the citizen be uh be saving if they use the digital technology to access government services? Everything comes from the demand side, from the citizen side. That's why even when we're talking about digital inclusion and I was talking about the goal, we're talking about the popul size of the population. We want 80% of the population to be on this, 20% to be on this, and that translates into actual numbers. So we are constantly measuring that. So we we we do that, we design for the people, we look at who's going to benefit and and uh who's going who's going to be excluded. Uh, and also would be would be looking at things like uh, you know, how how does that translate into economic prosperity for for the citizens? So all of the measures, the indicators that we create um are mostly veered towards the citizen side, you know, number of citizens benefiting, number of citizens whose income has risen because of this. So success um for me means a citizen being able to access, let's say, um, services, these e-electronic services, um citizens being able to access these electronic services without any sort of uh favoritism, and we need to do it in a manner that's um faster, right? That they can access these services faster, cheaper, and maybe uh even with uh without having uh connections in government somewhere, you know, like you can access a service in government from from Lukulu. You mentioned Lukulu earlier, that you can actually access a government service without knowing somebody who can help push push it along because I don't know how to do it, or they need to see my face, or that or I need to live in Lusaka because I can then walk into an office. So, success is going to mean that the citizens can access government services from wherever they are in a manner that is inclusive, that doesn't cost them more when they are in a rural area than it does when they are in an urban setting. I think that's for me what it's going to be.

SPEAKER_04 48:59

Okay. Are you about to share some digital initiatives that are examples of an education or in connectivity or in identity?

SPEAKER_03 49:11

Oh, okay, all right. So I'll I'll pick one for connectivity. Which is, and the reason is because it it comes from the the point of view that we have that gap that we need to close, and we know that some of the citizens are unable to afford the internet data at present. So we've worked with a lot of different partners. The mobile network operators themselves, internet service providers, and the like, they start to come together and say, How do we solve for this problem? And so we came up with this concept for ZAM free Wi-Fi, which is to take public free Wi-Fi into public places like markets and bus stations and hospitals, these sorts of places where they can be highly populated, highly concentrated, highly concentrated with people. Um and and what that has done is that it has helped us reach those people that are usually unable to afford these data bundles. And we're doing it with the same the same uh partners that would that are um approaching connectivity from a commercial aspect as well. So that Zam Free Wi-Fi, I think, is a great example. We you know it's it's you know, some people in the beginning were thinking, you know, it's just giving free bids internet to people. So what? Actually, you should be taking it to schools, don't give it to marketers. What will marketers do with internet? You're already being exclusive, yeah, right? You're trying to say some people deserve the internet more than others. And that is what for me is is exactly what we're trying to work against. And so we have found that even through the deployment all of the of these uh Zamfree Wi-Fi or hotspots in these markets and and the different places, it's starting to turn these markets into digital hubs, into places where people are uh trading, not only in your in your traditional in your traditional economy, but also in the digital economy. So they're starting to now improve their household incomes because they've got this sort of parallel universe that also has so much potential, the digital uh universe. So from a connectivity standpoint, that is the project that I I would highlight. Um it's connected, I think, close to 10,000 people so far. We're aiming to get to try and triple that number within a few months by taking it to different places, different provinces as well. So from connectivity, that's it. I think from a services or platforms perspective, I did speak about that uh medicines, medicine supply chain project that we had, and I think that's one to really talk about because it's got impact on the ground as well, right? And which translates into bet better health care. Um getting the the service the service the two services to integrate uh from ZAMSA and the Ministry of Health so that drugs are efficiently distributed to healthcare facilities, increasing the availability of drugs in those facilities. So I think for me that has been very um impactful. I think those two, I'll stop there because we have got a lot of projects in different areas.

SPEAKER_04 52:28

Okay. And just to to close, we're looking at humanize digital transformation from the angle of PDU. How do you explain that, or how do you share that, or how do you make it clear to someone that indeed the PDU is equally humanizing digital transformation?

SPEAKER_03 52:51

So the the proof is in the pudding. We because we have this delivery approach, that you know, projects must be delivered. But then projects projects must not um simply end in some sort of published strategy and then they're packed on a bookshelf. We we ensure that the PowerPoint slides that were created actually ultimately you know become a real project on the ground that actually delivers something and closes. So I think I think that the way we the way we show it, the way we explain it is first of all through the delivery mechanism itself to ensure that it actually gets to the people. And we take the measurements from the from the citizen side. So we're constantly measuring, constantly simplifying and constantly measuring and checking what the trajectory uh is. But on top of that, we encourage all the partners that we work with, and including ourselves, to communicate, to communicate um the story, to communicate the impact, communicate the projects and even the challenges along the way. So I'd say that's how we do it. I think it's as simple as that.

SPEAKER_04 54:03

No right.

SPEAKER_03 54:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 54:05

Um thank you very much, Mr. Mchelemba, for having joined us on this episode. Do you have any last remarks you'd want to comment on?

SPEAKER_03 54:16

Last remarks. Um, I I know sometimes there's there's questions from maybe the younger generation talking about uh, you know, how can I walk a similar path, for instance? Uh I've been getting some of these questions a lot. And my advice um to younger people would be that if you want to enter this this realm of delivery uh in technology, you must start from identifying the problem. Make sure that you identify properly and quantify the problem. Don't start from the technology. Don't say, oh no, because there's AI now, therefore I'm going to make a. No, no, no. Wrong approach. Look at what the problem is, define it, and then see how the tech can help. But most importantly, uh, and it's something that is often overlooked in our careers as ICT people, is that we understand we speak the language of tech, but then we forget to learn to speak the language of business.

SPEAKER_05 55:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 55:21

And in this case, we also forget to speak the language of government. So you need all three languages. You need to speak tech, you need to speak business, you need to speak government. Government as a language, also, as I found out. So if you do that, then you can communicate better your products and and and services. Then I think lastly, um don't stop being curious. I was I'm a very curious person, so I'm always trying out different things. So, but don't stop being curious, but don't start projects that you can't you know you won't finish. Rather start projects that you think you're going to finish and fail along the way. So just make sure that you you settle on projects that you know you're going to carry on to the very end.

SPEAKER_04 56:03

Those are my last remarks.

SPEAKER_03 56:06

Thank you very much.

SPEAKER_04 56:08

Thank you so much, Mpota, for coming on this episode. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 56:12

Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 56:13

There you have it. This has been an episode with Mupota Muchelemba, where we were looking at building Zambia's digital backbone. And I'm sure from his uh explanation, his sharing, his experiences, we have picked that at the center of digital transformation or at the center of technology, you still have to have a passion for the people. How is that translating into change of lives? Thank you for joining us on Humanized Digital Transformation.

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