Why 75% of Owners Regret Selling Their Business — Amy Morin (EP. 10)

Amy Morin grew a construction company from $0 to $40 million and exited it after 22 years. Then she bought and turned around a fly fishing resort in Montana, exited that one too, went to graduate school, and became an EOS implementer. By every outside measure she had done it right. And yet, she will tell you she got the most important part wrong. In this conversation with Christine Watts and Kris Snyder, Amy walks through the exit-planning concept she ran headlong past the first time around: the three legs of the stool. She had business readiness in spades. She had no plan for financial readiness or personal readiness, and that gap reshaped what came next for her family. Amy now combines EOS implementation with work as a Certified Exit Planning Advisor, helping owners build companies that are valuable to sell and lives that are ready for what comes after.

Key topics:

• The three legs of the exit-planning stool, and why business readiness alone is not enough
• Why 75% of owners regret selling their business one year later
• How identity loss shows up after an exit, especially for the founder who built the thing
• Going to market through connectors with a real reason to connect, not just an intro
• The cost of ego, and what Amy would tell her younger self

About Amy Morin:
Amy is an EOS implementer and Certified Exit Planning Advisor (CEPA). She previously built and exited a $40M construction company and ran a fly fishing resort in Montana. She also hosts the Exit Velocity podcast (formerly the Mastery Partners Podcast).
Connect with Amy: LinkedIn

Mentioned in this episode:

• Multipliers by Liz Wiseman
• Start With Why by Simon Sinek
• Exit Velocity podcast (hosted by Amy)
• Value Acceleration Methodology (Walking to Destiny by Christopher Snyder)
• Exit Planning Institute (EPI) and the CEPA designation

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Connect with Kris: LinkedIn
Connect with Christine: LinkedIn
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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome to Impact Moments Powered by 90. Today we're joined by Amy Warren. Amy grew a construction company from zero to 40 million and exited that after 22 years. She bought and turned around a fly fishing resort in Montana and exited that too. She earned an MBA, she became an EOS implementer. She's also a certified exit planner. So she has a great depth of experience. And what's really cool is Amy gets vulnerable and tells you all of these things that seem like she did right. But one of the most important parts that she felt like she could have done better. And she built these businesses ready to sell, but she didn't build the personal or financial plan for what came after. So in this conversation, Amy shares that impact moment that reshapes her family's life, now drives the way that she works with her clients. We get into ego, we get into identity, the parts of the exit that nobody warned her about. So can't wait for you to learn from her. Let's get into it. Hey, welcome to Impact Moments Powered by 90. I'm Christine.

SPEAKER_01 1:04

I'm Chris Snyder.

SPEAKER_02 1:06

And I'm really excited. We've got Amy Morin here today with us. Thank you for joining. Yeah, thank you. It's such a pleasure to be here. Yeah. So tell us a little bit about yourself. You're an EOS implementer. So how did you kind of get your start and land into the EOS space?

SPEAKER_04 1:19

Yeah, so I am an EOS implementer and also an exit planning advisor. So I'll kind of weave some of those stories together about how I got into this space. So uh owned a construction company, grew that from zero to 40 million, and then we had a beautiful exit of that after 22 years. And then took a little bit of time off, and I'll kind of weave that into a story later on as to the impact of that whole thing. But then purchased a fly fishing resort in Montana. So that was in need of a turnaround, turned that company around for nine years, and then had an exit from that as well. And so now you can start to see this natural transition of buying, selling, owning businesses, right? And needing uh some way to function them to increase the value in order to create an exit. And so not knowing any of that language during that whole process, it was a natural transition. You know, I we were together um, you know, a few days ago or whatever, talking with somebody about um different phases of life and including different phases of our business journey. So having owned these businesses for years, right? I mean, if you do the math, I'm now at probably 35 years in business. It's like, what's the next phase? And the next phase for me wasn't, well, let me go buy another company and have 52 employees again. Yeah, I didn't really want that. Well, no, thank you. I haven't done that. Exactly. So the next phase is I had also, um, when we sold our construction company, I went to graduate school and got my MBA. It was one of those things where uh our kids were going to college and I thought, hey, I missed a step. You know, I have a college degree, but I forgot about the graduate school thing. And um uh so it was a great opportunity for me to go to school and get that. So uh now I have my MBA. I've sold these couple of businesses that were successful, and I thought, you know, I'd really like to do some coaching or some consulting or whatever, and didn't didn't have the exact framework that I thought I should bring to the marketplace. So my first consulting gig was for a construction company, right? Construction background, construction companies love you, and they were looking to grow and scale, which is what we had done. We had multiple offices in multiple states, and so they brought me in and said, hey, help us create all these processes so that we can use that to duplicate where we're going and how we're gonna get there. They were running on EOS.

SPEAKER_03 3:48

Oh, very interesting.

SPEAKER_04 3:49

So that was my first entry point into wow, there is a structured business operating system that works that you can duplicate throughout an organization and to use to grow and scale. And uh, but they were self-implementing and were like, you know, had read the traction book, where they were part of a peer group, and and um they thought that that was the end-all of traction or of EOS, but yet weren't wasn't they weren't really gaining any traction. And so I said, let me go to an EOS conference, get some more information, and I think I can really help you. I just we all need to know more here. And so that EO at that EOS conference, I sat in all those breakout sessions and I thought, my whole entire life's journey has brought me to this exact moment in time to be an EOS implementer. Wow. So one of the owners of the company, the company was owned by three people. Uh, she also went along to this the conference. And so we get back and we're having a uh, hey, tell me your best nuggets, you know, what what were your biggest takeaways and stuff from the conference? And so I said, I'll be honest with you, uh, my biggest takeaway is I was, I would, I'm just like so enthralled with EOS and the power that it can be, um, bring to an organization, I feel like I need to go be an EOS implementer. And she said to me, I'm so glad you say that because I sat in all those same breakout sessions and thought Amy was born to be an EOS implementer. So I finished my contract with them and then uh uh became part of a the franchise.

SPEAKER_02 5:31

That's so fascinating that they were running on EOS and brought you in without being an implementer first. Yeah. And just as like a business coach consultant. Yeah, is that right? Wow.

SPEAKER_01 5:41

But the process work is separate work, right? Like you were, and there are plenty of good companies out there doing process work for EOS companies. Yes. Because as an EOS implementer, we'll talk about process and we'll talk about eight to fourteen core. But that's you were doing the work.

SPEAKER_02 5:56

Yes, exactly. Yeah. So what what happened next? Did you jump right into it? You went to boot camp, used to be a few. I did.

SPEAKER_04 6:04

So it was the year that we all had to, you know, buy the franchise, right? So I was the first boot camp class that hadn't been a hadn't been a boot camper before, hadn't bought the what is the what's a mem it was a membership model before versus the franchise. Yeah, there you go. So I didn't know any of that. So I mean I'm green as green can be. However, I saw it run in a company. Like I I was part of a company that was running on EOS, so it was incredibly insightful. And I had all that business knowledge, right? I mean, I we had done EOS-like stuff in our construction company. Um, that was before traction, right? And so I knew what it took to be successful. I just didn't have the same words of what Gina was doing. You know, I mean, we had our VTO, we just didn't call it a VTO. Right. Right. We were answering the eight questions, maybe not exactly, but I saw the value of what it looked like to run on a business operating system because we created an incredible company. You don't get from zero to 40 million running blind sided. I mean, you just don't, right? Right.

SPEAKER_01 7:13

You piece it together. Yeah. That's the most of the concepts that, and I'm not downplaying what Gino did, but most of these have been around forever. Correct. Right?

SPEAKER_04 7:21

And he admits that.

SPEAKER_01 7:22

And he assembled them in a in a really simplistic way such that they could be, you know, absorbed by the entire company, not just the leaders.

SPEAKER_04 7:30

That's correct.

SPEAKER_01 7:31

And that's what, you know, from my experience of those, whether it's a construction company, you know, manufacturer, if you can get everyone working as one on EOS, that's where you really feel that traction, that lift take off.

SPEAKER_02 7:41

That's exactly right. Yeah. So you go to the conference, you become an implementer, you're getting your first clients and starting to do EOS as an implementer. Yes. Where do you find EPI? How does that start coming into the picture?

SPEAKER_04 7:53

So all this sounds incredibly successful, right? Yeah, I've grown these great companies and and uh, you know, now you ride off into the sunset uh with a big bank account. However, I missed a few steps on the whole exit part too. You know, yes, we built a great company, but our exits really weren't as successful as they could have been. And so when we start working with an exit planning client, you talk about three legs of the stool. And those three legs are business readiness, financial readiness, and personal readiness. And so we had great business readiness. We had created a business that was not key person dependent. Um, we had a depth in our company, we had structure, uh, scorecard, I mean, all of the great business readiness stuff. We forgot about the personal readiness and the financial readiness on the personal side. And I didn't even realize it was such a thing, to be totally honest with you. And so, as I've now had uh the fallout of the financial readiness piece and the personal readiness piece, um, I go start looking for, you know, hey, what did I miss? And that's where EPI came in. And so the exit planning institute. And so for me to become a certified exit planning advisor again was a natural, I've messed this whole thing up in my life. I don't want that to happen to anybody else. And I've got all this boots on the ground knowledge. Again, this is not theory. I've lived through this. So to say all that, EPI and the Exit Planning Institute really encourages a team, an exit team. And it's that team that I missed, right? I had the CPA who did help us do a business evaluation, I had the attorney, all the things that you think you need in an exit. I had no financial planner at all. And so that matters because there's so much of the business, uh, the way that you live, you rely on the business. Great example, cell phones, right? I mean, I didn't pay for a cell phone, I didn't pay for health insurance, I didn't pay for any of that stuff when we were a business owner, right? I mean, do you how much do you pay up for that, Chris?

SPEAKER_03 10:01

Right.

SPEAKER_04 10:01

Right. And that's just natural part of owning a business. Well, you don't own a business anymore. It's like, oh shit, who pays for all that stuff? And we need to make sure that we planned on that. You know, I still had two kids going to college and I was in graduate school. You know, there's a hundred thousand dollars worth of college debt every single year we didn't plan on. I mean, you just all of the you're so excited about, hey, we're selling our business. We've created a nest egg, something of value that somebody's willing to pay us for that you forget about that side.

SPEAKER_01 10:39

It's fascinating, um, because I've got to do a good good amount of this work, is where the that that wealth gap. So people are quick to put a value gap of what they what the business is worth today to where the business needs to go, but they don't do what you're doing in that, which is their wealth gap, because now how much do I you're not you're not done. Right. Correct. You got a lifestyle, you've got all this stuff, and it sounds simplistic, but though though, you know, I had one one client that um she was ready to sell her business, and like I was helpful, so I got her to that place, and then she was done and she regretted it. She came back because she did her earnout and she was like, I didn't sell my business for enough. Yeah. I'm like, no, you sold your business for an appropriate amount. What you didn't think about in the moment was how much did you need, right? For the run the rest. And even more importantly, every existential like you, she didn't she didn't know what she's gonna do next.

SPEAKER_04 11:29

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 11:30

So now you were founder, you built a business, you sold it. And I think that's where so much of the exit planning starts to come in on the personal side. It does. And do the personal planning for what happens next.

SPEAKER_04 11:40

Absolutely. And that I didn't feel that as much, Chris, as my husband did.

SPEAKER_01 11:45

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 11:45

So and it's because, right, I finished graduate school. Like I had other things that I was that I was being drawn to, right? I always tell tell my clients, what are you being drawn to versus pushed out of? Right. Those are two very different thought processes and mindsets. So for my husband, our business was started in the same town we both grew up in. It was his initials on the side of the building. Right. And so now he's walking down Main Street and he does not have the identity of I'm a business owner anymore. And it took him years to recover. So on that personal side, that is something that's also often overlooked. And nobody talks to you about that. Nobody even puts that little bug in your ear of, hey, don't forget about this side. You know, what are you gonna do next? And it's easy to going back to your your the business owner that you mentioned, the statistic is 75% of business owners regret selling their business one year later. And it's because that one year is kind of like a honeymoon. You're like, oh, I'm gonna play golf and I'm gonna go fishing and I'm going to travel the world, and I'm not gonna have to get up every day at the certain time, right? Or my schedule is much lighter. And that feels good when you think about it initially. And then a year later you think, well, my life sucks. It is not as fulfilling as it used to be. I've lost my purpose, right? Now what? And that is real. That's real. Now I don't help people on that side of the business other than to ask the questions and then send them, you know, to somebody on my team who helps them with that. That's right.

SPEAKER_01 13:27

There's other advisors that they specialize in that work, not the work that you do.

SPEAKER_04 13:30

Right. The point is that we have to talk about it. It's part of the exit planning process. And it's one, again, that I've lived and so I'm incredibly passionate about. So for me, the passion lies in bringing EOS, right? Getting this operating system up and running to get your business ready. And also uh the personal financial side, asking all the appropriate questions and the and the personal side about what are you going to do next, that really is going to fulfill your heart.

SPEAKER_01 13:59

It took me a while. Um, by the way, at night we're big fans of EPI and all the great work and all the SEPAs. Um, but it took me a while to understand value acceleration methodology, which is the other Chris Snyder's walking to destiny, his framework. Yeah. That that he really did create a framework such that EOS can slot in if you choose that, right? Um, which we're excited when they do.

SPEAKER_04 14:23

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 14:24

If you choose that path because the his his approach isn't as detailed as what Gino wrote, right? It is a framework, not an operating system.

SPEAKER_03 14:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:32

And that that delineation for me when it clicked was like, oh no, I get it now. Yes. That's why there's a couple hundred EOSIs that are CEPAs now. I've lost track. Yeah. There's so many. Because it is a community, it is an approach that's more holistic in that exit part of it than just the build and run part, which we do really well with EOS.

SPEAKER_04 14:50

Yeah. Right. Because one of the ways that we close that value gap is we uh strengthen the four intangible capitals, right? And those four intangible capitals are human capital, social capital, structural capital, customer capital. So, what better way to do that than run your company on EOS? Because we speak to that in the six key components all day long.

SPEAKER_01 15:11

Now we're I'm gonna do a shameless plug on two fronts.

SPEAKER_04 15:14

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

The first front is that 90 actually can help you with those things as well. And a lot of people don't realize that if you want to do personal planning in our software, you can do that.

SPEAKER_04 15:23

Awesome.

SPEAKER_01 15:24

You just make yourself an individual team, or if you wanted to be a company, you could do that as well. And then we configure the template, if you will, inside for doing personal planning, similar to like a personal VTO, right? And if you want to think of it that way. And then you can collaborate with your your other partners if you want to, let them come and see that personal plan inside the software itself, such that you can have more of your advisors involved than just the one.

SPEAKER_04 15:48

Yeah. So can I ask a question about that? Sure. Um, is there a plan or is there already uh something in 90 where you can do a roadmap, create a roadmap for the future?

SPEAKER_01 15:59

Tell me more about your roadmap.

SPEAKER_04 16:01

Well, so in exit planning, one of the greatest tools is to say uh take a look at where your value gap is right now, right? And then help you create a roadmap for where you want to be in that three to five year time frame. Definitely.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

We have a we have a new tool called Planning Board.

SPEAKER_04 16:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 16:17

And in the planning board, it's meant to do that. So you can think about it as what if I was going to plan an annual goal and I wanted to chunk at it four quarters. Yeah. You could do that. If you're five years out, you could just change the time frame for the tiles in the planning board. Yeah. Set the objective. It's kind of like the getting what you want tool to some degree, right? That's the same. Just start at the end in mind and go, okay, what are the things I need to do along the way? And the good news about this is it also can link to rocks and issues. There's multiple linking into the tool itself.

SPEAKER_02 16:46

Yeah, it's really nice because it's flexible enough where it's talking about what's now, what's next, what's later, what's in the future. You're not trying to time bound everything, but you're showing how it links back to those one, three, five-year objectives that you have. Yeah. So you can start to actually plan out what it's going to take to get those bigger things done. Nice.

SPEAKER_01 17:04

It's actually, it's actually really interesting, Christine, because I don't think we've thought of that application for the exit planning side of it.

SPEAKER_02 17:10

Yeah. Right.

SPEAKER_01 17:10

We've been thinking of more for the longer term VTO type of stuff, whether it's the goals that you set annually or sometimes even the three-year picture. But I like your thought there on how to tie that in.

SPEAKER_04 17:20

Yeah. I think we should work on that together. Because that'd be really I mean, it's just great to bring that to your clients for sure. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:26

There's a lot of people getting excited about it, especially as they're going into like departmental teams where like marketing as an example, there's all of these little nitpicky things that have to happen and for them to be able to see it laid out and have it be sequential and have it tie up. Yeah. Like a lot of people are getting excited about that concept. So I like the idea of elevating that. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Yeah, that's great. Well, um, you brought an impact moment today. Yeah. Um, so I'd love for you to tell us that story and the ripple effect that happens. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 17:54

So I think the impact moment kind of goes into what we've already been talking about, right? Is the what happens when you are not fully prepared in the in the life story lessons that that teaches you, right? I mean, good, bad, and the ugly. And for us, that or for me, that impact moment was the financial readiness, right? I mean, what really has been the driver or the lack of financial readiness is really how I need to put that. And the the driver of who I am today and what I'm passionate about and where how I teach uh has to do with that whole financial readiness part. That's the dose of reality that hits you in the face that says, you can't take this lesson and and be and continue to be shameful over it, right? Because the initial thought is I have a lot of shame around that. Again, people look at you and say, Man, you sold a company that was w worth $40 million. You must, you know, have done really, really well. Why, A, why are you still working? You know, why are you still as passionate as you are? And so you don't want to share the, well, it's I forgot a whole section. You know, I mean, and again, going back to your top line revenue is 40 million, but people don't pay you on your top line revenue. I think that's the other part of this conversation that we must tell business owners is you get paid on EBITDA or a multiple of EBITDA. And so um, you know, and in the construction industry, you're really heavy on assets. Not that we didn't have good EBITDA, but you know, again, it it it sounds more glorious than it is. I just want to say that.

SPEAKER_01 19:36

Well, and I think it's fair because there's there's a lot of owners' envy that happens because of lack of understanding.

SPEAKER_03 19:41

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 19:42

They're like, well, you must have because look at the look at the trucks that you own. Exactly. But it is it is the bottom line that that it the value of what the business has created and therefore sold on. Yes. And I don't think that translates really well to most most people.

SPEAKER_04 19:56

Right, right. So I I a shameless plug for me. I I do a lot of podcasts, right? I'm a podcast host, and so I always bring guests on who help to educate business owners about really how to calculate the value roughly. I mean, I'm not to replace a business valuation expert, but know what all the dynamics are involved in order to sell your company or kind of create a worth around your company.

SPEAKER_00 20:20

But going back to my impact market, but you haven't you haven't you haven't actually plugged your podcast, you can tell us the name. I'm waiting, I'm waiting for it.

SPEAKER_04 20:27

It's called Exit Velocity, is we're just changing the name. So it's the new name will be Exit Velocity, and that'll happen in the next couple of weeks. But it's been uh a Mastery Partners podcast. Awesome. Yeah. So to get rid of the shame around uh, you know, when you say who you are and what you've done, uh, that you missed a whole step has really been a big impact moment in my life.

SPEAKER_02 20:51

Do you have a specific like client or story related to somebody that you had to kind of help get there? Like they were struggling in the moment. And like, were there any specific tactics or things that you did to help kind of pull them through?

SPEAKER_04 21:04

You know, as an EOS implementer, I feel like we coach, challenge our clients a lot, almost in the space that they're in. And my impact story is not uh like clients don't come to me because they've got financial unpreparedness on their personal side, right? They come to me because they're having an issue in their company, they're hitting the ceiling, their business isn't as valuable as they need it to be. Yes, that wealth gap, right? It all feeds in, right? I mean, it's almost like when we talk to EOS clients about, oh, strengthen just the people component. I'm like, you can't. It's this, it's one holistic system, and they all work together, right? And the same thing in exit planning. I can't just strengthen, because I'm a great picture of that. I can't just strengthen my business readiness and forget about the other two legs of the stool. That's not gonna happen because it's it's all gonna fail, right? Where do I really like the biggest impact is I'll say, hey, exit. Planning as a team, I realize that I'm working with you to strengthen the business side, the operating side. But let me get you in contact with a financial advisor or a wealth advisor or uh, you know, a bet business valuation expert or somebody on the personal side who will help you also prepare because I've done it wrong, right? And then I'll share all those stories. But nobody comes to me specifically for just the financial piece, right? Which was the biggest impact for me.

SPEAKER_01 22:31

What I and what I love about what you said in inside the kind of the EOS implementer community, we talk about you go to market not through cold calling and blasting, you go through connectors. Yes. And what this universe of the community actually has is reasons to connect. Because otherwise, my experience with those connectors, like, well, just do an intro. It's like, well, what's that doing for them? But if you actually have a reason to connect them, then it's and A, they trust you. Yes. Well, then you're building the community of connectivity through those introductions of value. And I think that's something that we miss, in my opinion, inside the EOS implementation world when we just talk about connectors. It's like, let's get to the reason for that connection, the value created in the connection. And then I think, you know, then you're gonna have your financial planner do more connections for you, right? Because it's at the right time that the need is there versus just randomly, oh, you're a good person. Let me introduce.

SPEAKER_04 23:23

That's right. And and to your point, I think in the EPI world, um, because co EPI corporate is so focused on creating exit planning as a team sport, right? That they just naturally, when you become a certified exit planning advisor, you realize that connectors are so important for the business owner, right? For you, but really for the business owner. Like this whole thing, and we use exit a lot as a word, right? But it's just succession planning also. Like I've got a lot of EOS clients who are um nonprofits and they need succession planning, I would say almost it as much, if not more, than a for-profit business is gonna go on the market for sale. Because if that nonprofit relies just solely on the executive director, what's gonna happen when that executive director leaves? You suddenly have a nonprofit that has a great mission with nobody to run it.

SPEAKER_03 24:22

Right.

SPEAKER_04 24:22

Right. And so even if you're not thinking about exiting your company, just it's really good business strategy to put in play what we're talking about here this morning. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

And I I always throw in the word optionality when I say exit because it just softens it for people. It's like exit optionality. That just means you have options. Yeah. And one of those can be your secession planning, right? Like, are you ready? Is there readiness for you to not be here without the dependencies that often exist, especially for founders?

SPEAKER_02 24:51

Yeah. It's interesting too. I I've been at 90 since day one. And I remember early on um one of the founders came to me, and this is like maybe more of a process story, but he was like, Okay, tell me what happens if you get hit by a bus. And I was like, ah, I should probably write it, write some things down. Like it's just like the whole frame up of like, there's a lot of things that could happen that like you don't know if they will. And so I feel like that is a lot of what that exit planning motion is, is helping them think and plan for that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_01 25:20

And the the the some of our experience has been around this topic is that people think just like we think we're gonna live forever in that example, that you have all the time in the world to build your business and they're not measuring it out and saying, well, I'll get ready for what I'm a year out. Well, then you're not ready for it a year out. Yeah. Right. If you start the conversation now, maybe it is five years, maybe it is 10 years, but at least now you know what you're building and how you're building it.

SPEAKER_04 25:44

Right. Yeah. And so, you know, the impact is much longer, right, in the work that we do as EOS implementers and combined with exit planning, right? As an EON EOS implementer, our impact is typically that two-year journey, right? And then you send them on their way. But exit planning, it can be much longer. And really, that impact is for their life. It's the legacy, right? You're creating uh family wealth. I mean, it it's a it's a much longer runway than just a moment in time, if that makes any sense. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:14

Well, you talked a little bit about some of the things that you're classifying as like a fla failure or wish I did it differently when you were selling and like really thinking about the other legs of the stool. Yeah. But when you look back, are there any specific stories or moments where you feel like this was a fuck up and I wish I could go back and do it differently? Do you have any other examples or things that you would go back to in that instance?

SPEAKER_04 26:37

Oh man, you know.

SPEAKER_01 26:39

I always say how how much time do you have?

SPEAKER_04 26:40

I was gonna say, where do I start, right? Uh for me, I would say ego. I wish that um I had lost some of my ego a long time ago.

SPEAKER_03 26:52

That's a good one.

SPEAKER_04 26:53

I, you know, I I guess as you're starting, um, this is a big birthday year for me.

unknown 26:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 26:59

I won't tell you how many, but I love to think that I'm maturing well into these years, right? In terms of uh thoughts and actions. And if I could have even dropped that ego, you know, 10 years ago uh and and been maybe a a little bit more great, had a little more grace in my life, um, I probably would have made less bad choices.

SPEAKER_01 27:26

I love I love their intentional word choice. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 27:30

Um but and that's a tough one to do, right?

SPEAKER_01 27:32

Again, nobody really wants to admit that they've got this ego or Yeah, and Mike's, I think for me is I I thought that that was part of my um that the ego was part of my protection mechanism when I didn't realize that it wasn't protecting me. Right. Right? Like that doesn't it's that's right. It doesn't do that, right? Finding your moments of grace, it that does it. There's ways in which you can can find it. But it it's it's going back to your younger self and going, all right.

SPEAKER_02 27:59

Right, exactly. And now you know Well, it's interesting too, because you talked about a little bit earlier from a business owner's perspective, identity and like losing that identity when you sell the business. And I feel like some of that kind of gets into the ego play of like you're making all of these emotional decisions, and that's really hard. Yeah. So when you're wrapped up in it. So my last question is what are you reading, listening to, watching that's helping you grow personally or professionally?

SPEAKER_04 28:25

Yeah. So one of the things I didn't talk about today that I love doing um with teams as well as with exit planning clients, though, is I'm really passionate about creating other leaders.

SPEAKER_03 28:36

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 28:36

And so I tend to read a lot of stuff about leadership and teach a lot about leadership. So my favorite book right now is The Multipliers by Liz Wiseman. And so that book is all about creating other leaders, right? And we think as a leader, and this is where my ego comes in from prior, right? Right. Is that a leader was like, I need to create a whole bunch of followers. I'm gonna lead so great that everybody's gonna follow. And that is so far from the truth, right? You cannot make people follow you, first of all. Right. And lead it's really the leader's job to create other leaders.

unknown 29:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

Are you Simon Sinek fan at all? I am. Yeah, me too. So I love his a lot of his work on very similar to that, that topic and that approach of it's not about the followers.

SPEAKER_04 29:24

Yes. And so now when I teach leadership courses, we start out first with the foundation of knowing who you are first. Because I'm a firm believer in you cannot lead others and or create other leaders unless you are so secure in who you are as a human being and how you want to lead. Like, what do you want to be known as as a leader? And so we start there and we build from there. And then typically our third session or so, we move into um how to create other leaders. What does that look like? So anyway, Liz Wiseman's book on the multipliers is all about that. And her her her tact in there also is that we think as a leader that we can't hold anybody accountable, and that's the worst kind of leader.

SPEAKER_03 30:10

Right.

SPEAKER_04 30:10

Right? I mean, so uh she goes into a lot of that too, which is why I'm really liking that book. So, all right, so that's what I'm reading uh and things on that line. Um, but listening to, I I love to geek out on health podcasts, you know. Again, as you kind of get up there in age, yeah, you love to figure out how what's longevity look like. Yeah. Um, and so I listen to a lot of health podcasts. I also literally listen to uh Cody Sanchez, all about businesses. I mean, so you know, I'm geeking out on health and business and leadership these days.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

Those are good geek outs. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:42

Yeah, awesome. Well, thank you so much for being here today. I loved hearing about the merging of EPI and EOS and the work that you're doing there and hearing more about your background. So I really appreciate it. You're very welcome. It was a pleasure.

SPEAKER_01 30:53

It was great fun.

SPEAKER_02 30:54

Yeah, awesome. Well, thanks so much for watching Impact Moments Powered by a 90. We'll see you next time. Thanks for listening. Amy's story is a real reminder that business is really one aspect. You can build a company that's valuable, structured, ready to sell, and still walk away unprepared of that life waiting for you on the other side. EOS gives you that clarity from a company perspective, and the exit planning work gives you clarity for what comes next. If today's conversation resonated, take Amy's lead. Look at those three legs of your own school business readiness, financial readiness, personal readiness, and ask which needs the most attention from you right now. Thanks for listening. If you like this episode, please subscribe, please share it with a leader who's building with you, and we'll see you next time.