Flock Camera Privacy Debate, the Nancy Guthrie Update & a Cold Case ID | The Particulars Ep. 1

Headlines end. The details begin. In Episode 1 of The Particulars, Lacey and Nic launch the show with the lens they bring together — a private investigator and law student alongside a former federal agent.

Legal Minute: Flock Cameras & the Fourth Amendment. Two Flock Safety cameras were cut down in Pageland, South Carolina — the story that opens a Fourth Amendment rabbit hole tracing back to Katz v. United States (1967), the case that gave us the "reasonable expectation of privacy" standard. Lacey and Nic walk through Justice Harlan's two-part test — is there a subjective expectation of privacy, and does society recognize it as reasonable — and run automated license plate readers through it: how much privacy does a driver have on a public road, and does 30 days of aggregated location history change the answer? At least 30 cities and towns have canceled Flock contracts since 2025 amid the ongoing legal fight.

Case Update: Nancy Guthrie. Nancy Guthrie, mother of Savannah Guthrie, has been missing since January 2026. On July 2, a man from Hawthorne, California pleaded guilty in federal court in Arizona to two felony counts of harassment by telecommunications device after posing as a kidnapper and sending the Guthrie family ransom demands. His plea calls for five years of probation, with sentencing set for September. The FBI has confirmed it received multiple ransom notes in the case — some hoaxes, some still under review.

Case Update: Paul Pelosi. On Friday, July 3, Paul Pelosi, 86, struck a legally parked car in Yountville, Napa County, California, briefly stopped, then drove away. Deputies found his disabled vehicle about a quarter mile down the road; a breath test showed no alcohol involved. The Napa County Sheriff's Office referred the case to the DA's office for a possible misdemeanor hit-and-run charge under California Vehicle Code 20002 — a referral for review, not a confirmed filed charge. Pelosi has a prior 2022 misdemeanor DUI conviction from a separate incident. (Update: prosecutors have since filed formal charges, with a court appearance set for August 14.)

Evidence of the Night: Iowa's Longest-Unidentified Jane Doe. On April 11, 1975, a fisherman found the body of a young girl in the Mississippi River north of Clinton, Iowa — ruled a homicide, shot in the head, and unidentified for over fifty years. Forensic genetic genealogy has now given her a name: Cheryl Edwards, 15, of Waukegan, Illinois, approximately ten weeks pregnant at the time of her death. A team of volunteer genealogists traced her family from Louisiana to Wisconsin before confirming her identity through a San Diego birth record. She's been identified — her killer has not.

OUR OPINION. OUR ANALYSIS. NOT LEGAL ADVICE. Everything here is our commentary and opinion, based on the public record — not legal advice, and not an active investigation. Accused/alleged throughout; charged is not convicted; presumption of innocence applies, every time.

⚖️ New episodes Monday / Wednesday / Friday, 9 PM ET — live on TikTok, replay on YouTube.

Chapters
 00:00 Intro & Cold Open
 01:40 Meet Lacey & Nic
 17:55 Disclaimer
 20:01 Flock Cameras & the Fourth Amendment (Katz v. United States)
 42:57 Nancy Guthrie Case Update
 1:01:41 Paul Pelosi Hit-and-Run
 1:09:06 Iowa Jane Doe Identified (Cheryl Edwards)
 1:13:00 Wrap-Up & What's Next

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Let's just give this a little quick wrap-up here because in our planning, um, TikTok was not our friend. So we had everything. Well, I didn't, I didn't have it set up.

SPEAKER_00 0:13

I don't do the TikTok requires you to go live so many times before you can add special features. And I thought I had all that set up, ready to go, but obviously I was wrong.

SPEAKER_01 0:26

But um, we had to improvise. So I feel completely exposed because I don't have my cell phone on my person. I don't like that. I feel very um just like going with the flow. And I do have like we have it set up in our basement, which is what we call the podcast studio.

SPEAKER_00 0:48

Jay said he's been there once or twice.

SPEAKER_01 0:50

Uh oh, well, TikTok is not my friend when it comes to anything that I try to do. But long story short, hello and welcome.

SPEAKER_00 1:01

Is that better?

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Oh, yeah, that's better. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:04

You're welcome.

SPEAKER_01 1:05

I see, I struggle with seeing things. So, anyways, we're kind of improv tonight, halfway sort of, because uh normally what we do is a podcast version of things, and I guess we're gonna start kind of all the way at the back. I like at the front.

SPEAKER_00 1:20

First off, can everyone hear us? Yeah, please let us know in the chat if you can hear us.

SPEAKER_01 1:28

I mean, we could just be talking to ourselves. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:31

Okay, Jay's on that. Who is that? Jay? Jay Uso. Jay Uso says they can hear us.

SPEAKER_01 1:38

Awesome, thank you. So I guess we'll kind of rewind. Um, so I'm Lacey and I'm Nick. And we are married, obviously. Maybe, maybe that's not. I don't know. Um so we have a a podcast that is, I guess you would call it Investigative True Crime. Um, I'm a private investigator in the state of Indiana. Oh, nice to meet you as well. Um so I guess I'll I'll give my little blurb and then I'll pass it over to you. So the majority of people, what they say when they interact with us is that the interaction with us, like between us, they always say we're kind of like, I don't know, I don't know how to describe what people say, and I want to like put words in other people's mouths. But so we created the podcast. Um, I have a bachelor's in criminal justice with um concentration on forensic psychology. And I'm currently in law school at Texas AM. So we have that that we put into our podcast where we cover cases, and people kept telling us, which it's kind of the standard. Uh, we do have two kids, and constantly we get, you know, our family, friends, questions about cases. They want to know our perspective on things. Um, so we kind of thought this would be a really good way. Um, the way we the Casewalker Chronicles covers a case is a little bit different. Um, we do all record-based as uh as far as like the docket goes. So we go by um public record. And if you haven't listened to the podcast, you need to obviously start at episode one um and listen through. But this is kind of a short snippet version of that. So we're kind of covering more recent things um as far as like what's kind of going on in the news. Um, but we're people want to hear our version of it, our family and friends. Maybe you guys can disagree with that eventually. You'll have to let us know. But um we kind of just wanted to give our spin on things because like our kids, like we have a daughter in college and she was recently home for the 4th of July, and she always has questions. Um, and we try to answer those, and we may have a different view um and parenting style, obviously. So we kind of wanted to put that out there um because people have always said we went to CrimeCon in Vegas this year, and the feedback we got from people was they love the vibe. So we wanted to give it more frequently than we could in my um what we get for our podcast is very in-depth. Uh, it takes a lot of effort and a lot of work. And so we wanted to be able to push this out quicker and interact with people more. So that was a long introduction. And I hope some people got the gist of what I bring to the table. Um, and now I'm gonna I'm gonna pass it to Nick because I feel like I talk a lot.

SPEAKER_00 4:49

Oh, is this my introduction?

SPEAKER_01 4:50

Yeah, go ahead. Sorry, tag you're it.

SPEAKER_00 4:53

I am Nick. Uh obviously the worst half of this couple. Um that's not true. I am very technical when it comes to looking into these investigations as far as an investigative standpoint, from a law enforcement standpoint, and from an actual investigator standpoint. Um form I was formerly an 1811 credentialed agent with Air Force Office of Special Investigations. Um I was stationed doing that job, I was stationed in Grand Forks, North Dakota. Um I covered, I was a case agent, lead case agent on everything from gosh, um, murder, suicide, sexual assault, rape, uh drug cases, fraud cases. Um also worked in counterintelligence with OSI. Um, yes, SVU. Dun dun. So when I got into OSI, the Air Force had switched sexual assault investigations over to OSI from security force investigators. So uh we did it all. We did homicide, narcotics, sexual assault.

SPEAKER_01 6:13

A jack of all trades.

SPEAKER_00 6:14

Yeah, we did fraud. We had to learn all of that. Our training consisted of uh months at the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center with DHS, and we went through a basic special investigator training course as well as a criminal investigator training course that was on the federal level. Um but yeah, I that was my dream job in the Air Force. Unfortunately, I was sent to Grand Forks, North Dakota, where we didn't have a whole lot going on. Um also it was cold, and I didn't want to stay there another four years, so I decided uh we decided to back it.

SPEAKER_01 6:57

Let's just say what really happened. I decided that I couldn't find a job.

SPEAKER_00 7:01

Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_01 7:02

And I was like, all right, peace out, home skillet. I'm headed back to where we live, Indiana. So I kind of left him because I was like, nope, North Dakota's not for me. Um, so yeah, keep going. I that was the blunt version. Yeah, he tries to be kind.

SPEAKER_00 7:17

I try to, but it it was one of those decisions we both made, and we decided that we were going to do things on our own, do our own thing. We wind up working for a school corporation for a long time, didn't care for it, even though we did it because it paid the bills, and now we've moved on to where we're at now. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:42

Minnesota.

SPEAKER_00 7:43

Texas is where we need to go. But we decided we had a five-year plan about three years ago.

SPEAKER_01 7:51

I was gonna go back even further than that, but go ahead. You you can use that version. That that makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 7:57

No, this is a short and sweet version.

SPEAKER_01 7:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 7:58

Uh we had a five-year plan three years ago that we were gonna our son was gonna graduate high school. We already have a daughter that's in college, she's getting ready to graduate college. We were gonna it's a journey. Set out to be investigators and find people, find missing people, um, open our own private investigation business and do that for a living, something that we enjoy doing. And we kind of sped up that five-year plan due to circumstances that were not really in our control, but that's okay. Um, we left our jobs voluntarily because we felt we were at a position, okay, it's do or die. Let's do this.

SPEAKER_01 8:47

Well, there was a there was a lot going on.

SPEAKER_00 8:52

We're not gonna, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:53

I don't know. Um, no, I was laughing at that. I'm not gonna go into it, but I mean like with with like I was finishing school, so I actually we graduated high school in 2006.

SPEAKER_00 9:04

Yes, we were both 38 years old, and that sounds very long ago.

SPEAKER_01 9:09

But we're old, you know. I we were actually teen parents as well. So um I finally in January of 2026 graduated with my bachelor's. So I have a 20-year bachelor's degree. Um, it took me a hot minute to get that, and that's awesome, Jay. Like it, I really can't say enough about people that um put education, like their their education as a a pillar of something that they're really willing to work towards because that's what I felt like. I mean, no, it was not 20 years consecutively, like we lived overseas, uh, we raised children, like all the things, right? It wasn't just, oh, I was a very slow learner. No, that wasn't the case. Um, I would every time we moved to another country, I had to get a different university. So it was kind of like I don't feel like this was ever gonna happen, but it did. I did graduate um finally, and then um pretty quickly after that, I applied for my master's. Um, and that's that's what I'm working on right now. Um, I started that in May. So I do um my master's online. I was accepted into the school of law with Texas AM. So I spend all of that was was happening while we were working full time and we were doing the podcast and running the PI firm and all the things. So it became a point where it was like we were up all hours of the night and then going back to work the next day. Um, yeah, it it's a very hard process. Um, and and like I said, that's where we kind of got to the point where we were like we had to choose what we were wanting to do. And this was always the direction we thought we were gonna go. So we had to kind of just say, okay, well, we're gonna head out now. So we had to try it.

SPEAKER_00 11:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:02

I mean, and it's sink or swim, and that's kind of like where we are. Um, as far as hiring, um, I wish that I could hire all the people that have asked, are we hiring? Um, to be honest, I don't even pay my husband, like who, you know, is the main investigator, so to speak. I don't want to say main investigator. That sounds bad. Um, I do a lot of the paperwork. Like, and when I say paperwork, I mean like I'm the one that's pulling the public record requests, like, and we're gonna go into all of that. Like, our hope is that this is a public front. Like, there's there's some great creators, but I feel like there's this huge gap. You're either like trying to sell people things, or you're too like legal and too crime, and we're kind of trying to mesh them all together to where it's public friendly, if that makes any sense. Yes, I agree. And like I feel like we have always had the same goal, it just changed and evolved, and here we are. Um, we thought this would we're hoping to do a Monday, Wednesday, Friday weekly supposed to be quick. It's supposed to be uh in theory, it's like a news dump. I don't watch the news.

SPEAKER_00 12:17

I don't we don't watch the traditional news.

SPEAKER_01 12:20

The traditional news, correct. We we don't feel that um that's our area. So we do a lot of research, a lot of digging. Um, and so that's what's time consuming. Um, and so that's kind of what led to the podcast. We give a very in-depth breakdown of some of the cases, and it's not the standard true crime podcast. So this is more of our public-facing, hi, we really are people, we're friendly. Um, and so you get to kind of interact with us a little bit more. So, I mean, we are all for questions. I want people to ask questions, um, sharing, getting the name out there because I I really would like to help people understand more because I think we understand things from our perspective, and there's definitely a gap.

SPEAKER_00 13:14

Big gap. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:15

That was, you know, our last episode of season one. That was what we called it. But anyway, sorry, tag, you're back yet. I I'm really gonna follow. This is why you will see me refer to my paper because I am a talker. Um, and we actually have it in paper format because I'm old school, and we have it in digital. And like I said, Nick worked really hard getting all of this set up, and then TikTok was like, no, no, we're not doing it that way. So we're improvising.

SPEAKER_00 13:41

We're usually like this is gonna be a basic setup stream. Yes, our first stream, our first several streams will be will be really basic. Um you know, we're not gonna be able to elaborate a whole lot as far as showing.

SPEAKER_01 13:58

Yeah, I'm kind of bummed about that.

SPEAKER_00 13:59

You know, showing documents. We may have to circle that.

SPEAKER_01 14:01

We're gonna do a wraparound and come back to that maybe.

SPEAKER_00 14:03

But but showing documents, all that kind of stuff. Um, I I have an easier setup that we can do where I can actually use my computer. Um, everything right now is being filmed from a phone. I will have a setup eventually where we're we're each on two different cameras um so that you know it looks like we're talking to each other. Uh, even though you obviously can see talking to each other. We're sitting next to each other, but um to be able to run stuff through the computer that throws onto TikTok. Um, because we we know eventually we're gonna get a lot of interest in wanting to see certain documents, um, things like that, wanting to see certain web pages where you can find out information. And that's that's our whole goal. Our goal is to spread information that's from the record.

SPEAKER_01 14:58

And with that, because it ties in directly to your comment, Jay, um, with confidentiality, in regards to like the private investigation side of things for me, I do have a code of ethics and professionalism that I have to adhere to. However, comma, um in regard to most of what we will discuss, it is general in nature um or publicly sourced. And when I say publicly sourced, I want you to understand that it's readily or easily available to any person that can access it. So that's where a lot of things um I don't like to give in our podcast, you'll see I don't like to give our theory because I feel like that's too much of what everything is. Uh, you turn on the news at night, it is someone's theory. Narrative is the word that comes up often. I don't like to use that word, but it will come up a little bit. But um, like tonight, I'm kind of bummed that we don't have all the stuff because we are gonna talk about, which if you saw our little uh social that we put up, we are going to talk about flock cameras. And how we are going to kind of segue that is Nick does he has a fitness brand, and he that's the other side of our basement, is all fitness. That is our home gym, and he goes live every day, and he's actually in I'm not telling your whole story.

SPEAKER_00 16:27

So why goals is a brand that I created. Um, it is a fitness brand, it is a mentality brand, it is a motivation inspiration brand. Um, goals stands for get out and lift shit. So, that being said, we had uh a comment about a shirt that I was wearing during one of our workouts.

SPEAKER_01 16:50

I think it was last week.

SPEAKER_00 16:51

Last week, and I got the shirt from a company who they it wasn't a sponsorship or anything like that. We just showed up, we wanted to get a vinyl wrap for our boat, and they weren't able to do it because they only do fleet vehicles, but they referred us to somebody who could. They had merch and shirts they wanted to give us, and one and the one of their shirts, um, their design says don't drive naked.

SPEAKER_01 17:20

Bum bum.

SPEAKER_00 17:22

So the don't drive naked got a comment, and that comment led to Hi, that's mine.

SPEAKER_01 17:30

Um, can you like make that bigger for just the smidgen? So if um I I do have to, I am gonna back up and I'm gonna have you scroll down because I do have to read my disclaimer because I want uh the other way, babe. Like, yeah, from the beginning. Oh thank you. All right, disclaimer. Say this verbatim. So, a quick disclaimer before we get into it. Everything you hear tonight is our commentary and our own opinions. This is not legal advice, and this is not an act of investigation. We are two people with backgrounds that give us a different lens on this stuff that we're going to discuss. We are not experts, not authorities, and we, you know, want you to take it for what it is. So don't be coming after me because I gave you my disclaimer. Okay. So go ahead and now we're going to resume your regularly scheduled broadcast.

SPEAKER_00 18:29

And we're gonna talk about this, right?

SPEAKER_01 18:32

Yes. That is that is where we are going. So, um, but we're actually in it. There's a lot. So last week he was doing his workouts online. One of our friends had made a comment, um, and it tied into it's coming, it's full circle. Okay, are we ready? This is what we do, is uh the Case Walker Chronicles. Okay. So we had a friend that said, Hey, can I drive naked? And then that opened up a legal conversation because I am in law school. And so we were talking about your Fourth Amendment. And then we discussed that in school, and then our daughter came home for the 4th of July, and she brings up a whole nother piece that's going to put it all together. So the tease line for tonight was a South Carolina town where someone cut down two surveillance cameras, an update on the Nancy Guthrie case. We are going to also talk about Paul Pelosi's hit and run, and a 50-year-old cold case that finally got an answer. So hopefully, in the longest probable way that we can probably end up doing this because we're long-winded, we're going to try to cover all of those. And it's going to make sense. Um yeah, probably, I would say. So we had this legal question that was kind of brewing um when it came to, you know, what's the harm in driving naked, right? And again, the the hardest thing with law, and again, I'm not giving you legal advice. I am only telling you what I have learned as someone in school. And um human and decent.

SPEAKER_00 20:26

So uh about that, Jay, um technically, no. You cannot get cited, fined, arrested or any of that. Um, it is not against the law to be naked in your vehicle. Now, can a prosecutor potentially try a case where someone's been arrested for being naked in their vehicle? Yes, it is very possible.

SPEAKER_01 20:54

Now, I'm gonna stop you there. I'm gonna stop you there because so here's the thing, okay? This is a case we call, we're gonna refer to this as case law, okay? And case law for this specific thing, we're going to call cats the United States. And this one, I believe it says, let me look at my note because I want to get the year right. It was 1967. So let's let's rewind in our mind a little bit back to 1967. Um there were no cell phones. So if you think about it, to explain this case, if you think about um 1967, what was still out in the public? If we didn't have cell phones, what did we have?

SPEAKER_00 21:43

We had pay phones.

SPEAKER_01 21:45

Phone booths, yeah, right? So we had phone booths, okay? So there was um the man, Charles Katz, he was actually transmitting illegal gambling information from a public telephone, okay, from the booth. And the FBI. Agents actually attached a recording device to the outside of the booth. Now, typically, which if you've followed any of Casewalker Chronicles or my PI firm, I am giving some of these snippets in regard to some of the case law and some of the specifics, the more specifics. So basically, um the standard of law at that time was that you didn't need a warrant because you were never entering that expectation of privacy area. So in that situation, because he was out in the public, he had no expectation of privacy. However, when we think about the old school phone book or um telephone booth, what did you have to do? You had to open the door and close it. You had to go in and you close the door.

SPEAKER_00 22:55

Which gave you, which gave you an expectation of privacy.

SPEAKER_01 23:01

So that was where it kind of spun into the car situation, right? So in your car, you you're clo you close the door when you get in, right? And you're driving down and you're like, okay, well, I'm in my personal vehicle. I have I can make a phone call. However, there is a case currently being litigated? Being litigated because this individual had his Bluetooth volume up so loud in his vehicle that law enforcement could hear what he was talking about. So they were that's where this whole litigation is kind of coming from modern day today. That we're not actually talking about that case tonight. Uh, we could always do that. But um, so that's kind of where you get that interesting piece of it. Um, again, if you're really wanting to go down a rabbit hole when it comes to case law, cats was very interesting. My my professor did a fantastic job of explaining it. She did a much better job than I did. I apologize if I butchered it. I'm trying to keep this short, sweet. Um, and to kind of tie this back to the flock cameras, which I'm telling you, it's all connected. This is how our brains work, our poor children. This is why they can't ever get like um quick answers from us. It's uh we sit down with them.

SPEAKER_00 24:24

We analyze everything.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

And long story short, our daughter says, so we're eating at the table, and she's like, hey, so flock cameras. Do we have those around here?

SPEAKER_00 24:36

Yes, they are everywhere.

SPEAKER_01 24:40

She probably, in in her defense, she probably didn't think in her head, oh my gosh, this is gonna lead to whatever it's gonna lead to. But um, what's what's so upsetting about this live not working the way we were going to have it work, I was gonna show you guys a map. So there is a map that you can look at and it will show you. You can search addresses, locations, and things, and it'll show you where the flock cameras are located.

SPEAKER_00 25:08

Actually, keep talking, and I want you to get from the chat some uh say a city, just like okay.

SPEAKER_01 25:15

So, anyone in the chat, if you've shared, if you've liked, if you've added us as a follow, any of those things, and you're willing to make a comment and tell us, give us any random city, we're gonna see if we can try to make this work, potentially. Um, any city in the United States that you would be interested in seeing whether there was a flock camera. And while we wait for that, so Terre Haute, Indiana. Okay, that one's gonna probably go. I actually looked at Indiana today for a couple of these. I didn't look at Terre Haute, but um the story that I was supposed to be telling you, the news story, the whole point. Um, it was over the weekend there were two flock cameras that were cut in Pageland, South Carolina. And um that is where we're kind of at because nationwide, flock cameras are actually owned by a private organization. Um, and there's 30 cities and towns that have deactivated or canceled their contracts since the start of 2025 um because of some of these uh privacy things that are in court. So anyone um oh, I did not know that, but that's one of those cool facts. See, that's what we're trying to get out. We want people to kind of know some of this stuff. So um Jay, that's that's interesting. I mean I'm gonna have to look into that because that's where you've probably introduced introduced like a rabbit hole for me. Um, I don't sleep anyway, so on a school computer. Oh, you know. He saved it. He's he we're roundabout way here trying to do this because we were gonna like live it while we were showing it, but for purposes there you go. I think you could potentially see this, right? Yeah, okay, because you see what I see. So this is a um one of the this one's deflock, so you can literally pull this up and search anywhere, and it's gonna show you where those flock cameras are, which I thought was interesting. And if you've never actually seen like what they look like, it might be fun for you to do kind of what we do. Date night, we go, we go do some. I mean, you know, like I would say, hey, babe, we're gonna go down here and we're gonna see if we can see what this flock camera looks like, just because, because then, like, when you think about that story, that took some some effort to cut that down. Like, and I get it, people are upset about privacy, and we live in such a very interesting time right now with social media because we are willingly, for the most part, willing to give up a lot of our privacy, but it's only on our term. So that's where that's where that flock camera case. Um uh, yep. Anything, you know, we've got public roadways, like it's very, we've got, you know, like we think about Chicago, they have like one of the most heavily like um camera-wise things. Oh, Chicago is a great so many cameras in that city.

SPEAKER_00 28:40

Indianapolis is crazy.

SPEAKER_01 28:41

It's and and so that kind of is one of those things that interests us because we do a lot of research when it comes to like missing people. And so it's fascinating to me that we can have people go missing when when we've literally got like we can show you some of those maps. Like, if you look at that, you know, the flock cameras is like there's cameras all over the world. Like, how how do these people just vanish? But that that was kind of the whole point of the flock cameras that it's it's AI, AI interactive, um, or based. And the whole purpose is it they're supposed to be license plate readers. So the whole kind of process Because they do so much more than that. I know, I know. But that was that was what they were being like sold to these law enforcement agencies who are like, hey, no, that's that's what they sold it to your politicians, yeah. And it and it was like, okay, we're gonna set these cameras up, we're gonna give you grants, and you know, we're gonna install these cameras, and then people started kind of realizing it's like those places where you know, I've I've this hasn't happened, I should knock on wood, but you know, like you're driving and they say uh radar enforced, and then you get that speeding ticket in the mail.

SPEAKER_00 29:59

In the mail, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:00

And it's like I didn't even see a police officer, but yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:04

Which I mean, okay, you can you really can coming from our criminal justice background, um you can channel that down to community policing when it comes down to it. It is actually trying to be proactive. Am I for flock cameras? Absolutely not.

SPEAKER_01 30:28

However, I like to I like to watch cameras.

SPEAKER_00 30:31

Of course.

SPEAKER_01 30:32

I don't want people watching me.

SPEAKER_00 30:34

What we have to understand is there we evolve as a community and we change our culture. Law enforcement has to do the same. So, you know, when there is a decline in those who want to join law enforcement, and there is a different view of how people view law enforcement because it used to be back in the day, you know, in the 50s, 60s, 70s. The bobbies. Not not that long ago. But no, it got to where, you know, you could call up your you know, law enforcement officer, and they were good people. They always were. And I'm not saying that law enforcement was a very good idea. Well, it was deterrence for a lot of it was it was deterrence and and and for a long time it was just d deterrence, and then they got around to some psychology on it and said, okay, community policing is what is working. So they got into community policing, but now the community policing, they're adding more technology, and those technologies can seem invasive. Um, but if you're not breaking the law, it's not invasive, you know. Uh, but I I do get it. Uh like I said, I'm not for or against the flock cameras. Um it's one of those things where you're gonna pick a side, plain and simple. It's it's just like the Amber Heard and Johnny Depp case.

SPEAKER_01 32:01

Uh I I specifically didn't go down that one.

SPEAKER_00 32:06

You're gonna pick a side and you're gonna pick what is favorable to you.

SPEAKER_01 32:10

It it's all about your bias, but that's enough rant for me on flock cameras, as far as the whole but okay, the whole point of that was to kind of get people to understand, in a way, there was um when it when it came to interpreting cats into that, the case law for that, it was there was Justice Harlan had a two-part test, and it's still used today. Um, so the first question does the person have a subjective expectation of privacy? So that's the first question that you would ask. And then the second part of that question is it once in your society, do they recognize that as being reasonable? So, like if we put that into context with driving naked, okay, do you think that that person should have a reasonable expectation of privacy within their own car, even though they're in a public area? If the answer to that is yes, then you go to the second question. And the second question was, does society agree? Is does society think that's a reasonable assumption? So that was kind of where that case law came in into play with that.

SPEAKER_00 33:25

And so if we think about flock cameras with that, does the driver have that run that through, run flock cameras through the CATS test?

SPEAKER_01 33:36

Yep. And go ahead. You can let's see, let's see.

SPEAKER_00 33:41

It's the same two-part test. Does a driver have a subjective expectation of privacy in where they drive on public roads? Probably not much. No. Uh, but you know, it's 30 days of aggregated location history every time you pass the camera mapped out. Something society recognizes as reasonable to keep private. That's the actual fight. So that's what it's looking at. If you're driving on a the first question is, do you have privacy driving on a public road?

SPEAKER_01 34:23

I I'm personally gonna say no. I don't think you have to do because I mean, yes, it's my car. Like I don't want people in my car. That's my car. But I'm in the public. Like if I'm if I'm driving out on the farm.

SPEAKER_00 34:35

No, you don't have privacy.

SPEAKER_01 34:37

Yeah, that's my private area. Like I right.

SPEAKER_00 34:40

But on a public road where these cameras are located. However, that's there have been some cameras that have shown to be looking in people's backyards, things like that. That is all allegedly. None of that is really verified.

SPEAKER_01 34:58

We can only say allegedly here.

SPEAKER_00 35:01

Um we have not verified that.

SPEAKER_01 35:03

I'm not. But I'm not going down that slippery slope.

SPEAKER_00 35:07

But now we look at it in the second part of that test, which is okay, it's collecting data of your license plate driving down the same road at generally the same time, Monday through Friday, because it just so happens to be on the road that you drive by every day to go to work because we commute to work. But now, does that trigger the Fourth Amendment for a law enforcement agency to now have that data known or accessible?

SPEAKER_01 35:51

I think I think accessible.

SPEAKER_00 35:52

But now let's let's run this one more test. Because this is where this is where we don't think. A lot of people stop thinking right there, and it's like, oh, well, no, I I have privacy to that. You shouldn't know that. Well, get over it because a cop can sit out there for 30 days straight and sit there and watch you do it, and you don't have any reasonable expectation of privacy for that cop to sit out on a public road and watch you drive by every day around the same time. And if they put that in a report, guess what? That's part of their investigative report that they found, and it will be upheld in court. You have no reasonable expectation of privacy driving on a public road if a if a law enforcement officer is there to document it every single day, five days a week, whatever it may be. So there, I that's what that's why they're such a problem because they're using the flock cameras as an agency.

SPEAKER_01 36:52

Right. But I I think and I think that's what people, okay. So it's like when you're driving down the road, for the most part, you can see a cop car sitting there, right? So you you see that and you're like, okay, there's a cop car. I think So what do you do?

SPEAKER_00 37:09

Hit the brakes.

SPEAKER_01 37:11

Yes, most people do. But no, I think, I think what people are kind of upset about is in theory, the flock cameras are such a new technology. And for example, like where my daughter's like, hey, where are these? They're kind of elusive, but not like they're literally in plain sight.

SPEAKER_00 37:32

Yeah, but because there's really not been a lot of we have to be educated to know what they what they look like, and that's and we have that ability, but people don't always look into it.

SPEAKER_01 37:47

A lot of people want information just like handed to them. And when, you know, like if you see, like honestly, the first time, because I was in I was in class one time when somebody said flock cameras, and I was like, it was like a bird's we're watching birds, like a flock of geese, or what I looked into it when I first heard about it, but it's been it's been months ago. It was kind of surprising to me because I was like, What? What are you talking about? Wow, and it was still new and coming into things, and and so then that that was intriguing to me. But you know, I think that that's kind of where people it's the unknown, and because we are still trying to create that bridge, I think once we have that precedent set, then we'll have a but it's the unknown, yeah, because it's not really been tested yet, which it's currently, but you know, it is what it is. So kind of that that I want I want people to kind of take that away from tonight. Um, when it comes to that, like when you're thinking about should this should this be like a privacy thing, um yeah, yeah. I mean, it it's just when you look at it use that that cat's two-part test and think like, okay, if I'm choosing to be naked driving around in my car on a public road, do people think does everybody agree with me that that's like acceptable? That's standard. And would someone else you know, is that like a private thing? And does everybody agree with that? Like, is that my privacy? And does people like I think if you break it down into those things, like I don't I don't advise anyone to drive around naked. I mean, I think men probably have an easier time doing that than females would, but I mean, you know, uh to each their own. Maybe somebody could do it and then come back and be like, hey, this is what happened when we did it. Don't I'm not advising you again, we are not giving you legal advice, okay?

SPEAKER_00 39:51

Regardless, is it a crime?

SPEAKER_01 39:54

Depends on the state. But final answer.

SPEAKER_00 40:01

What? Is it a crime? No.

SPEAKER_01 40:05

But now there also is state and federal law, which there's two different forms of law, which I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 40:11

I will tell you from what we have learned about case law and law in general, and the very little limited knowledge that we have, anything can be fought in court and won. Anything can be fought in court. It needs to be clear and convincing. Yeah, I agree. I think you know you could fight for Honestly, you are not convincing the justice system. You are convincing a jury of your peers. A jury or a judge. That's it.

SPEAKER_01 40:47

Yeah, it depends. Bench or jury.

unknown 40:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:50

We're that's another conversation for anyone. Oh, that's a whole nother spiel. Like, because I I don't feel like I have peers. Like, I would be I this is gonna sound really bad.

SPEAKER_00 41:02

I'd be mortified to have a jury decide my fate.

SPEAKER_01 41:05

Like, I I think that I mean, no offense, but it's like we look at some of the stuff that goes on and it's like hey Jay, it was nice to meet you.

SPEAKER_00 41:16

Thanks for stopping in. We appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 41:17

Hope to catch us Wednesday.

SPEAKER_00 41:20

Hey, user 9108, a bunch of numbers. Who is it?

SPEAKER_01 41:24

Amy.

SPEAKER_00 41:25

Oh, is it Amy? Hi, Amy.

SPEAKER_01 41:27

He's slow.

SPEAKER_00 41:27

I can't see I can't see uh the pictures, so I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 41:31

But hey, we don't interact with anyone on TikTok, so that's why yeah, I don't have anybody on TikTok. So well, we'll try to be on time for Wednesday.

SPEAKER_00 41:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:39

Um, and and we'll be quicker on Wednesday. And I'm I think if this is in if we can get it to work, we'll try to push this out maybe on YouTube or something as well, so that you can maybe do like a replay. I don't know. Technology.

SPEAKER_00 41:51

Yeah, I can record it and put it on YouTube and use it.

SPEAKER_01 41:58

You guys have a good night.

SPEAKER_00 42:02

Next segment. Yeah, we're gonna close that.

SPEAKER_01 42:05

Yeah, we're we're gonna close that. Uh it's not we're not gonna say, you know, whether it's constitutional or whatever, because it's litigated in court right now.

SPEAKER_00 42:17

Um it varies state by state, and uh I think you're gonna see some big There's gonna be a lot of lobbying and fighting uh for it and against it.

SPEAKER_01 42:30

Yeah, I agree. I agree. I think it'll be interesting to see where it goes, you know. Um, and then this one this is something that we have not touched on for a lot of reasons, just because I I've I've debated on whether I was gonna put this in there, but you know, we we're gonna cover it briefly just because it was in one of the quick hit things um as far as like what happened over the weekend. Your quick update. So the Nancy Guthrie case.

SPEAKER_00 43:03

I've stayed away from this so much. Like I have legitimately ignored every bit of anything that's online about this case.

SPEAKER_01 43:16

So I for people that don't know, um we'll we'll we're just gonna give a really quick um the underlying disappearance kind of thing. So Nancy Guthrie is the mother of Savannah Guthrie, and she has actually been missing since January of 2026. And on July 2nd, 2026, an individual from Hawthorne, California pleaded guilty in federal court in Arizona to two felony counts of harassment by telecommunications device after posing as a kidnapper and contacting the Guthrie family with ransom demands. So the key takeaway facts here was the plea agreement calls for five years of probation. Sentence sentencing is scheduled for September. Of 2026. And the FBI has confirmed it received multiple ransom notes overall. Some were illegitimate, um, some were, you know, uh under investigation. And the thing I think that was most interesting about the the Guthrie case and how it how it kind of unfolded is it had a chokehold, probably not a good word to use, but it I kind of I think of like when we think in like OJ, um, the OJ trial, and you could even say very similar to um what the one oh the Johnny Depp Amber Heard case.

SPEAKER_00 44:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:39

I think that this is kind of the 2026 case.

SPEAKER_00 44:43

But it pits it what pisses me off is we've the we've delved into a bunch of missing persons cases.

SPEAKER_01 44:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:52

And what pisses me off, I'm sorry, I'm I'm raw, I'm unfiltered, I'm gonna say what I want to say. Uh that's how I've lived my whole life, and and you'll you'll find that out real quick about me. Um I'm pissed off that we do this in these instances where we we glorify uh a particular missing person.

SPEAKER_01 45:14

Yeah, I think that's the key takeaway for me.

SPEAKER_00 45:16

And it's like, what about all these other missing people?

SPEAKER_01 45:20

The the information that is spread, the rapid fire that this stuff comes out. I mean, like, yes, this as of today, um don't get me wrong, some of the memes are funny.

SPEAKER_00 45:33

They are.

SPEAKER_01 45:35

Yeah, I guess it is, but it's like there's a general family, there's a person at the bottom of it, you know, like that's and and to me, but what I don't understand is how we have so many missing people in the United States every year, and it's like there how, and there's also some very good psychology, you know, aspects of things, but how we can, so to speak, as a society, pick and choose which case gets that kind of exposure.

SPEAKER_00 46:01

And and then when when you do that, what I want to highlight, not to cut you off, but when you do that, how are investigators supposed to take real leads? Because you are publicizing this so much that because of the way the culture is and the because of the way social media is, everyone wants to have their 15 minutes of fame. So people are willing to just make shit up to send to law enforcement because law enforcement is not gonna follow up with a bogus lead, you know?

SPEAKER_01 46:34

Yeah, but they're they're gonna find out that it's no, they have to vet it.

SPEAKER_00 46:38

Yeah, absolutely. They have to vet it. And then once they find out it's bogus, they're not going to re do anything to the person that sent in the bogus lead. That's the thing. Because there's too much that they have to do to begin with. So people have under started to understand that and they take advantage of it and they hear about something and they want to be a part of it because false leads, kind of thing. Yeah, and they and they genuinely think they're doing the right thing, but they're not.

SPEAKER_01 47:05

But this case, that's what I've that's why I thought this one was so so intriguing. Uh again, I I am kind of giving you a snippet. Now, I can actually put out at some point when we get all of our ducks in a row, I can put out some links to some of this stuff if you want to, but I I strongly encourage people to actually do the research, okay? Because, like, for me, I thought this was interesting because this is one of those things where it's like, hey, yeah, the FBI is involved and they are taking this serious. Like, they've had so many of these people send these false, you know, hoax kind of things that they are starting to put, you know, the weight of the law behind it, and they are kind of going after some of these people. But what I thought was really interesting with the Guthrie case personally was that it was like, I mean, um, like Gabby Petito, it was kind of one of those things where from day one, and and to me, like Gabby was different, obviously, than you know, um, Nancy Guthrie.

SPEAKER_00 48:07

But it's like they a narrative is produced.

SPEAKER_01 48:11

But but the way that society picks up on some of these things, like one of those things that's really interesting, it happened this weekend. It's not true crime. I really wasn't even, I was kind of debating if I was gonna say something about it or not. But I was I I kind of went down a rabbit hole this weekend too, because uh maybe potentially, who knows? I I think there's kind of a toss-up, but supposedly, allegedly, the Taylor Swift had her wedding this weekend. And what was so fascinating to me is TikTok, you know, hashtag Swifty. Um, TikTok went absolutely wild with people, you know, like oh, she didn't really get married there. But here's all the picture of my toe, and this is what it thinks. This is what this means. And it's what? Like, how are how do people even get some of this stuff?

SPEAKER_00 49:01

Because that's a crazy book.

SPEAKER_01 49:02

It is, it really is. And it's like, I I I was scrolling, you know, I'm doing what the majority of people are right now. Nine to ten. Yes, everyone wants to be famous, and it was like they just kept giving this stuff out, and it was like, okay, she sung this version at two o'clock in the PM mountain time, and that's why this is the it means this. I was like, okay, and what does this have to do with like a a a doily or a nap handkerchief? Or like, how does this seem but that's people will grasp at anything, and I think that's where some of it really just that blew my mind this weekend. I mean, how we choose as a society what takes off and what doesn't is interesting, and I that's part of the thing for me with the Guthrie case because TikTok went wild with it, you know. There was one creator that, like every day, you know, I he was on I I was following, and every day he'd be like, Well, day 63, and where is this woman? Yeah, and like there was so much content, and yet it's still one of those things, like she's still missing, right?

SPEAKER_00 50:20

And and talking about that, that's that's another talking point of why we created create Casewalker Chronicles is because of all of the social media fluff that is that is out there, which there's just gobs of it. And we don't want to be that. We we want to we want to be the creators that bring you the facts of what's on the record and what can be verified. You will not hear our opinion on how we think a case we will we will give a little more of that here. Yeah, on our on our in like a short form because I but our podcast that we record, we do all of that. Uh Lacey does a ton of work on the back end as far as vetting information and making sure that we're not providing information that is you know something that we believe um when it comes to making a determination about something, this and that. We just don't do that because obviously the internet is full of that, and it it you can find anything you want. Yep.

SPEAKER_01 51:35

If it if you wanted Amber Heard to win her case and you thought she You've got a whole slew of people that felt the same way, and and the way the algorithm tracks, I mean, you you're gonna find that group of people. The algorithm is gonna find it for you.

SPEAKER_00 51:50

So it really goes back, go back to Clinton and Trump.

SPEAKER_01 51:54

Yeah, like it it it doesn't it doesn't do us any good.

SPEAKER_00 51:58

All that we saw on our TV screens and social media feeds was Trump good, Clinton bad. Yeah, you know, and it was just because we like stuff that was more Republican, I guess, you know?

SPEAKER_01 52:11

I mean, and that that's a that's a big thing that I really wish people would.

SPEAKER_00 52:14

Social media is totally tailored to the user you believe, yeah, and it wants you to watch you're missing that whole other side.

SPEAKER_01 52:24

And oh yes, yes, mm-hmm, preach it. I listen, I am I have taken a step back. I am uh technically, I'm still Amy, right? Yeah, I'm still kind of somewhat That's why our son doesn't go to public school anymore. He does not, he does not go anymore. Um, he is online. Um there's a lot and it it's just that's a whole nother day. I'm not I'm not gonna go into that because I know that I know that she knows we anyways, but there's two sides, actually there's more. There's more than two sides to everything. But what our our podcast really tries to do is focus in on like the the fact or what's provable and not from like I try to pick what I'm going through. I actually try to look if there's like a court document. So um, so in the state of Indiana, we have Indiana My Case. And if there's any kind of litigation at all, there is a a public trail. Um, and a lot of those documents are already, you know, on the docket, and you can just readily pull those.

SPEAKER_00 53:36

And most of the most of the discovery during the case is not on the docket, like the discovery documents exchanged between parties. But if there are But you can get your PDF our motions, usually within those motions, you will find exhibits and they will contain a lot of the discovery documents. So a little digging in my case goes a long way whenever you're looking for information about a case.

SPEAKER_01 54:06

So that that is where I do spend a good chunk of my time. And if there is something, you know, that I see on the docket and or the chronological case summary, the CCS, whichever you you know choose to call it. Um if I can't find what I'm looking for that way, that's when I will then go in and submit the public records request. And that is where a lot of times I get that information. I am not a huge fan of saying, well, it was reported on WLKY. I don't like to say that because again, I want to be able to say, okay, well, this is what was court proven. So there's more weight in my mind for those documents. Um, and that's kind of what we try to do with our podcast. We try to really, we have like a tiered system for information. Um and that's what we build the case through. And and we actually like with the with the podcast, we start at the time of whatever it was. So if it's a death investigation, we start with that and we move forward like the investigation would do. And that's how we build each um we build the timeline. And I like to I like to kind of get family interaction, but at the same time, I don't because a lot of times families have their own view.

SPEAKER_00 55:31

And I feel like breaking that down, um But it it's it's part of the process of understanding how the investigation went. Because typically the cases typically the cases that we're looking at, the investigations are over, they're done, or they're they're cold, they're ongoing.

SPEAKER_01 55:51

Um they're not getting as many, you know, current new leads or you know, things like that.

SPEAKER_00 55:56

So to get a grasp on okay, how did this investigation unfold and why did why were these steps done but not these steps? Um and then you start to look at you know a little bit of investigation and background into the family, and then things start to make sense. Oh, of course, they wanted to push towards the world.

SPEAKER_01 56:22

Or this way, yeah, or that way. They're leaning a certain way. Yeah, and and that's what I like I like to say that leaning a certain way because um when we discuss the like the news, news media, okay. So if you think about I actually have the subscription to I don't remember what it's called, it's newspaper something or other. It it's like the microfilm from decades ago. Yeah, and I can and I do, um, I will sift through newspaper, newspaper, newspaper, newspaper, newspaper. And I will go through and I look at the different um the different writers and editors. And I, so if I have one, like say if we're gonna do Nancy Guthrie, I would pull any and all tagline Nancy Guthrie. Okay, and then I'm gonna look at, okay, well, the Wall Street Journal did this and so-and-so did this, and there was two different reporters on both new. I'm gonna compare them and you can pick out the key pieces, you know, that um we spoke with state trooper, yada yada yada. That's the information that I will kind of pull rather than all the filler that is built into the articles, because that a lot of times has a lens. And so we try to remove that lens and kind of yes, try to just get back to the fact. And it's it's really hard in some cases. In some cases, we have chosen not to cover because of that, the lack of, for instance, uh, the availability of some things. Um, and we've we've done some record requests where they were denied. They say the case is still open or whatever. And I'm like, okay, well, then I can only say this because I can't prove anything further without, you know, more more detail. And and this is one of those, um, you know, where I feel like the the Guthrie case was one of those where there was just so many theories and speculation that happened from the start that I think it I think it I think it took away from the seriousness of the case.

SPEAKER_00 58:39

Like I think Yeah, and uh to to kind of wrap up with the Nancy Guthrie case, again, I tried to stay away from it, but uh the reason being is because it was so publicized. Yeah. Um that's why I like to stay away from it because it it as when there's that amount of publicity on it, I can I can almost guarantee you there is gonna be more investigation done than you can possibly imagine. Every, you know, after every avenue is gonna be looked at, vetted, cross-checked, double-checked, just because they know law enforcement knows when anything's a high profile, high public eye, they have to, you know, buckle down. Which again, another reason why it ticks me off that they make these things so blown out of proportion on in, you know, in social media and with the public, is because now you're forcing the hand on a public agency to drop what everything that they're doing and work on this because it has so much high profile. Yeah, and that's what ticks me off. And another, you know, another thing is how are they supposed to separate what are what's real versus what's a hoax, you know, and a lot of times that's why information is deliberately withheld from the public during those active searches.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:18

Yeah. Yeah, I I agree. And it it's it's just the way social media, it's like a blessing and a curse, I think. I mean, here we are, literally social media. Hello.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:30

I want to get on to this next segment because I did not know about this.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:35

You didn't know about this?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:36

And this is fresh.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:37

This is fresh.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:38

We've just okay, we've just had 4th of July weekend, so you know, I was concerned about making sure the boat was good. We were going out to the lake, having our boat sodas, you know. I'm still trying to figure out my business. I got all this stuff going on. Lacey's got all this stuff going on. I had no idea that this stupidaso.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:00

Hey, we are not gonna say that. We're just gonna say that when I was going through some things, I found this and I thought this was one of those things where it just and then and then it got a little deeper. So I'm this maybe one of those like follow-up segments because I I thought this was I can't.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:23

Nope, not when it comes to people like this.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:25

No, so nope. So this one's kind of, and I I again we try, don't come after me, okay? People get on all the social medias and they say all the random things, and I'm just trying to share the news. Okay, so here we go. Bum bum. On Friday, July 3rd, 2026, around 2:30 p.m., Paul Pelosi, 86, husband of former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, struck a legally parked car in Yuntville, Napa County, California. Briefly stopped, then drove away. Deputies located his disabled vehicle roughly a quarter mile down the road. He had um, he told deputies he knew that he had hit something, but he didn't know what. So, uh preliminary alcohol test showed that it was.00, so no alcohol involved, and the Napa County Sheriff's Office referred the case to the district attorney for a misdemeanor hit and run charge. This is a referral for review, not a confirmed filed charge. Separately, Pelosi was referred to the DMV for a driver re-evaluation, standard practice for older drivers. Pelosi has had a prior 2022 misdemeanor DUI conviction from a separate incident for which he served two days in jail plus one day in a work program. California Misdemeanor Hit and Run Vehicle Code 20002 requires a driver involved in a property damage collision to stop, locate the owner if possible, and exchange information or leave a note. Briefly stopping and then leaving without exchanging information does not satisfy the statute. So I thought this was very interesting because for me personally, I think of Louisville. Okay, so we uh for instance, um Bardstown Road, I think is one of those prime examples.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:30

Yeah, Baxter Avenue, Bardstown Road.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:32

Yeah. Oh my goodness. It feels like down there that is a hot mess express with all them cars parked on the side of the road. And I I mean, I could see, like I'm not, I'm not gonna say here or there or forever, whatever, you know, but I think in my head, like I'm now okay, 2 30 in the afternoon. I was gonna lean more towards I was thinking, like, if it was 2 30 in the morning, that makes sense to me because I'm I can't see. So that makes sense to me how you could hit something. But again, this was one of those things where I I'm not passing judgment. I'm not even saying anything. I just thought this was interesting that I I really didn't see this anywhere. Like, I I'm not seeing anybody age restrictions on driving.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:22

The dude's 86 years old.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:25

Okay, so this kind of also ties into uh for a prime example, when our daughter was home over the weekend, we were talking about some of the um government positions and the age thing. So this kind of played into one of those because, like, for instance, when it comes to the Supreme Court, they have life, lifetime tenure, and that's supposed to insulate them from political pressure.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:50

So in theory Well, they want to keep their job, is what they want. So it's it's it's not a pressure from well, it is I'm telling you what the constitution is. I know, to get away from pressure of political pressure. It does not have they're not like but they also want to do the right thing by the people and the constitution, and if because if they don't, they can lose their position.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:14

No, you need to check that fact.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:18

I'll double check, but they they they have to follow the law.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:23

Well, yes, that's what I'm saying. But we're I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about like they're supposed to be like that's one of those things. Like we have some of these rules that have been in place for eons and eons. And this is one of those where I think they're in the process of leaning towards changing some of these things because so, for instance, you you know, we uh even in the state of Indiana, July 1, we had a slew of of laws that changed or went into effect. And one of those was uh driving.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:53

So, you know, we've got that that now in play where uh now you can, I think you can day one. 16.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:00

Get your license.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:01

Get your license.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:03

There's some prerequisites, but right.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:04

I'm not I'm not claiming facts because I haven't like waiting period now. Right. So we've changed that. But in theory, a lot of places, from my understanding, of course, I took driver's ed uh a hot minute ago.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:18

But I I don't feel like Kentucky used to be 18 at one point.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:22

But I mean, like, we don't have a point.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:25

Oh, for old. Yeah, like staying there.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:27

I don't think, I don't think that's as no, you just have to be able to see. Yeah. Like you just have to pass your when you go, you know, and like each time you go and renew your license, I think that gets further and further out. So I think I think what we're seeing, yeah, like that exactly, like a cutoff age. I don't think there's a limit where they say, hey, no, you're too old, like you need to stop driving. I think a lot of times more so it's families. It's families that are making that call. Like, hey, gramps, listen.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:56

Yeah, our uh my family has made that call.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:58

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:59

My grandma is not allowed to drive anymore.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:01

Yeah, like we have we have the same thing. Like my grandma doesn't drive either. And and I think it, you know, well, she had she had some vision problems and things like that, and it it just wasn't safe anymore.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:10

But I think Yeah, because uh uh we we're decent human beings and our our family it was we were raised to be decent human beings.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:18

Um see that's what I'm telling you. That's what I'm saying. Yeah, 96 years old.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:22

But if they have the cognitive ability, that's different. But there there are there are people in their 50s who shouldn't be driving because they've lost their cognitive ability to drive, plain and simple. And we don't test for that. Um just like just like we don't test for you know a a 90-year-old being the president of the United States.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:45

I'm just saying, I'm just thinking, I I I thought that was interesting.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:49

Yeah. I I have a feeling that I think it's gonna, I think there's gonna be You're gonna see a lot of lobbyists out there that are gonna be pushing the law.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:58

And what's interesting is I don't think this is really mainstream news right now. And I think that I I'm just interested to watch that one.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:08

I I think that one's gonna mean I honestly think it'll come down to a law that is put in place on a state-by-state basis that requires probably 60 starting at 65, that there is some sort of testing that they will have to do for individuals to earn your privilege to drive.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:33

I I think that's a I think that's a stretch. But I think I do think I mean I I I'm not gonna say that this case is the one case that's gonna need to be a good one. No, but I see it's a follow this.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:42

I definitely see it happening in the future.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:44

I think there's gonna be more of this kind of thing, and that that's gonna, I think, I mean, like you look in Indiana, like I said, July 1, we just had a ton of law that changed. And and I think I think you're gonna see more law changes in regard to state law across the board, you know. But um finally, which I think is probably the most exciting segment that we have in tonight's episode, um comes from Iowa. And this is a case. Um let me see if I can get this right.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:24

So it's quite old.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:26

It is, it's from 1975, and actually, a fisherman in the Mississippi River north of Clinton, Clinton County, Iowa, um, discovered a body on April 11th, 1975. Um, initially, it was believed by investigators to be an unidentified African-American girl between the ages of 12 and 23. And the autopsy determined the cause of death to be homicide. She had been shot in the head. Known for decades in Iowa case files as Jane Doe, 1975, she was the longest unidentified Jane Doe case in the state. And she has been identified. Um, her name was Cheryl Edwards. She was born in 1959 in San Diego, California. She was living in, I'm probably not gonna say it right, Waukegan.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:21

Joachegan.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:22

Waukegan, Illinois, at the time of her um of her disappearance in 1975. And actually, she was 15 at the time of her death. Um, and what's even more tragic about that was she was approximately 10 weeks pregnant at the time of her death, which is just like one of those things where she, first of all, was 15.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:45

15 in 1975 and pregnant.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:49

Like, uh, so there wasn't a whole lot of options.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:54

No. And sadly, I think that that could so uh interesting. It says that she was identified through forensic forensic genetic genealogy, matching crime scene DNA against public genealogical uh databases to trace the family lineage.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:10

Yeah, you're 23 and me that you all did.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:13

Guess what?

SPEAKER_01 1:11:14

Solving cases.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:15

The government knows about all of that.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:17

Identifications made through the partnership between the Iowa Department of Public Safety, the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, and the DNA Doe Project. In October of 2025, a team of 16 volunteer investigative genetic genealogists from three countries worked the case during the DNA Doe Project's annual gathering in Texas. And they traced her family to Louisiana, then to Kenosha, Wisconsin area, before confirming her identity and San Diego birth record. The identification was announced publicly in a Clinton County Sheriff's Office media release June of 2026. While this case is not fully solved, only the victim's identity has been confirmed. The homicide itself, um who shot Cheryl Edwards, that remains unsolved. And investigators say they're continuing to search for her killer, and they refer to this as identified or named, not solved or closed. So I thought that was probably one of the most important things to discuss in today's um I just thought that was very fascinating. That that they have, you know, that was that was closure. Um and hello, welcome our our dog who thinks she needs to be.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:38

This is our hound dog that sniffs out all our cases.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:41

Yeah. As she's surprised she hasn't jumped up on somebody's lap yet.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:47

She wants to come here.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:51

She's laughing. But you know, yeah, she's our mascot. She's uh she's kind of lazy. She just likes to sleep a lot. Yeah, see. She's pr and lick people. Like that's that's her say hi.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:08

I'll lick it like that. All right. That's enough of that.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:12

Well, that that pretty much at this point, that's all that I actually was gonna talk about tonight. If you can believe it, I think I am at only took us an hour. An hour 14 minutes.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:24

And I think given that we 14 minutes was like an introduction. Yeah, I agree. Which we'll do nearly every time.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:29

I feel like that was that was uh a good solid conversation time. Okay. I hope, I hope it was informative.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:37

Um we'd like to get more people involved in the chat so that we could talk, you know, we can talk about anything. Honestly, we have a little rundown of what we want to talk about, but we can be on here for this. Is our job. Yes, this is what we do now.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:52

Um talk to us.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:54

And we would absolutely love to get more people involved in it. I think that personally, I think the live video, the QA kind of thing is more fun when there's more people involved, obviously, and you know, sharing, getting that information out and having people ask questions and communicate with each other because I feel like you know, like you can learn so much from people.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:18

And we may be different, we may, we may be the only ones out there, but we question everything. Yeah, you know, and uh we have those questions and we want those answers. And anytime we get a place where we can ask those questions and have that forum, we that's what we enjoy doing because um, you know, we went to CrimeCon in Las Vegas.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:42

And I I do actually, now that you say that, I do think that we should cover um so maybe like maybe this Wednesday or this Friday, because we're uh like I said, we're planning to do every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Um, and again, we need some, we need some feedback. That's what I need. Like, do we like TikTok? Do we want to do like a YouTube live? Do we think you know Facebook is better for live?

SPEAKER_00 1:15:04

Again, TikTok is gonna be pretty primitive these first few episodes.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:07

We need feedback, and that's where we're hoping to get to because we're kind of wanting, you know, what's your thought? Do you want to hear about our um experience at CrimeCon? Do you want to hear kind of what what was crime con like? Um, do you want to hear more about what is law school like? Um, maybe you want to hear more about what um what we're working on with the podcast. Like that's that's what we're hoping to do. We're hoping to bridge the gap between, you know, because um we've been those people that have watched lives, that have, you know, watched some of this stuff unfold and we're like, why don't they answer me? Why, why don't they look at my question? Why does it feel like I'm just screaming into a void? Like we post a poll on Facebook. Yes. See, that's how I am. I love all the things.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:58

I'm on all the platforms, and I feel like you have to be a little bit of a dork to do this kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:04

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:05

I mean, as far as the technical side, I I legitimately had everything set up. Like I thought TikTok was gonna let me have all this stuff and do this like how I wanted, kind of like I do with my live stream, my uh goals, TikTok live stream with my workouts. And then I get to a certain point and I go to load it up, and it said, Oh, never mind, you can't do this until you have so many live streams. Well, we've only this is only our second live stream with Case Walker Chronicles. So with that being said, it's like, yeah, you're restricted to only doing this until you get other benefits.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:45

So yeah, so we're really trying to push that because I feel like, like I said, the more people we get involved. Um, sorry, I have a bug bite and it's dig I need to put more hydrogorsome cream on it. I yeah, we do. We want to go, like I said, we want to go every Monday, Wednesday, Friday, and we need to kind of know a time. Like Monday, I am not available until after 8 p.m. So that's why, but you know, like Nick does a lot of the lives on his TikTok for his fitness brand, and he's been doing that trial and error thing with trying to figure out the all different times of the day. Yeah, so that's what we're trying to do here because we want to get maximum participation. We want, and I think again, getting what do the people want? What do you want? It's not that simple. Um I feel like getting getting okay, ask the questions because sometimes I feel like you know, you ask questions and nobody answers, or you don't know where to look, or whatever. And again, we're not we can't give you legal advice, but we can we can give you our lived advice and and we can kind of help guide you or offer, you know, like hey, um maybe it's a private investigator question. Maybe that's what you have a question about. Maybe it's what do private investigators do. Um, because there's a big misconception.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:11

The biggest misconception ever is that when um, first of all, most of the people think that Nick is the investigator, which he actually falls under my license. Um, yeah, see.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:25

Um, and then Amy, we'll send you a my uh my case link that you can look at.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:31

Well, she's wanting she yeah, she uses my case, but for Illinois. Yeah, all states have a different yeah, they're all different, and some charge, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:41

That's some charge.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:42

Um but what I was saying, I think I brain farted there for a minute.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:48

Hi, Haley.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:49

Um, yeah, with private investigation. Everybody either a thinks that Nick is the one that's the private investigator, and I do his clerical stuff, which whatever. And the second thing, they're like, Well, do you find cheating spouses? Okay, listen. Private investigators do more than just find cheating spouses. Okay. There there's a whole like thing. If you want to know, if you need a private investigator in the state of Indiana, money trail investigations, you can look. I have a whole website.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:26

It could literally be anything.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:29

Public records research, uh, you know, like all the things. It that I've we've started the new July uh July series. So we're doing different little um like casewalker's doing for the record. Uh money trail investigations, we are on Facebook and we have the website, but we push stuff out. Like, what do investigators do? Because that was the one of those things we thought this the lives Monday, Wednesday, Friday would be good for. Kind of getting, instead of me saying, Hey, yeah, here's this graphic, look at it.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:02

It's a way that we can break it down, um, discuss some of it with you.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:06

We want to give resources, we just don't know what you want.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:10

Yeah, and I don't it just doesn't work well for us to push stuff out. And I I see like two people viewed it, and I'm like, well, that took me two hours, so that was great. Like, um, so that's kind of what we're trying to do. We're trying to get a feel for for what the temperature is and and where things are and and be guided in a way that is is helpful. Um, again, I had uh over 10 years in public education, so education is one of my my things I'm very passionate about. Um I want to educate and help. So that's kind of that's kind of where we're going. But again, the the sharing of things, you know, even if it's just telling people we do have stickers too. We have stickers, but yeah, getting the word out is extremely hard.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:03

Um we're we're finding that out, which we knew. We knew that was gonna be the case starting this.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:10

Um yeah, but we don't fit the general mold. No, we don't.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:13

We don't fit the true crime podcast mold, um, which is fine. I don't well, I don't want to fit the mold. I don't yeah, I don't want to fit the mold either, but I it's it's it's hard because people give you like right now, like and and I'm sure for those people that are doing the true crime shtick that I hate that word, it's the same way. They're having the same it, you know, not I don't want to call them issues, it's part of the process.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:39

And we know that we have to continue doing what we're doing and continue being vocal, continue showing an online presence. We know that we have to do those things, and that's what we're here for. So some things are gonna get a little monotonous at times.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:56

Yeah, just bear with us.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:58

But uh we we promise that we will continue to work on finding new content, and um it's gonna be when money trail investigation really gets going, content is gonna be really cool. Um, it's gonna be something that we'll be able to share kind of an inside look.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:22

Gener, I never can say this right. General we can we'll be able to share within the confines of the confidentiality. So we will we'll be able to give you like general things, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:22:36

And whether or not a client is willing to share information, um, because that will be you know a precursor to us taking a case is you know, we also have this, and you are 100% within your right to say absolutely not, nope. I want all this to be completely private, don't say anything. Absolutely, we respect that 100%. But as part of our the business that we're running, one of the things that we want to be able to put out there are those investigations that we cover. And if you know a client were to say, absolutely, no problem, then that would be also something we could uh look into doing.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:25

Yeah, the I think the long-term, the long-term goal in a lot of ways is that the the PI firm will help fund, so to speak, some of the pro bono work that we do. Um so it it's it's pushing, it's pushing for the advocacy and the answers and uh being able to do some of those things. And that's that's what the you know, that's what the goal is the whole the long term. But uh at this point, we are literally at an hour and 24 minutes in for episode one. So hopefully, also hopefully maybe they get shorter, but not too short.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:05

Well, we have a we have a plug to put in at the end. Well, at least I want to put in at the end. Just know that doing these records checks, investigations, records lookups, um requests, all of that takes time. It takes some of sometimes it takes money um to do these filings. A lot of times we have to pay to get something filed, and we always are willing to accept donations uh because all of that is going to be put towards ultimately finding missing persons, because most of the time missing persons is pro bono work. Um 90% of the time it's it's pro bono work. And if you look at the missing persons just in the state of Indiana for this year, you will be surprised. I believe you'd be surprised to see how many missing people there are just in the state of Indiana, and we want to help one of the purpose we feel like we have is to bring that closure to families. Um whether it be just closure. You know, f if someone is found, at least they get that closure. If someone is found alive or deceased. Yeah, because I I think of I think I couldn't I couldn't imagine my daughter going missing.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:32

Yeah, when there's no Couldn't imagine it. When you don't know where that person is, you you know, I I think for me, I would look for them everywhere. Like, you know, you get up and you go about your day, uh you would see their face in the crowds of people that you pass. And I think that that has to be the like the hardest thing ever for some of these people to to live that. And so I think that she's smelling. I think finding and doing what we can for that resolution is is it's just something we're very passionate about. And the the podcast, the the PI firm, all of that ultimately will fuel the final, you know. So my my thing is, you know, we have a lot of avenues, a lot of things, a lot of fires that we're burning. Um we literally, you know, if you want that deep, in-depth case coverage, you can always also Casewalker is working on kind of a spin-off series where it's the Casewalker Chronicles Untold. So if you know of a case that you feel didn't get a lot of um, you know, we talked about some very large named cases tonight. Um, part of why we do what we do is to get those lesser named cases out there, keep those names public. Um, if you have a case that you feel like has happened uh locally or one you know from another place that you feel like it didn't get the the the pressure, the media, the attention, the news that it should, you can submit that to us. You can go either to the Casewalker Chronicles on Facebook. You can also go to the website. You can look up Money Trail investigations. Um, right now, all Money Trail has is the Facebook. Um, but again, pushing out as much as you can, getting that reach so that we can get those Your sites down? Huh?

SPEAKER_00 1:27:40

Your sites down Money Trail?

SPEAKER_01 1:27:43

That's the only thing I have. Well, yeah. The website. Yeah, but I don't have Instagram or TikTok or Instagram. Right, right, but you have money trailinvestigations.com. I have the website. Okay. Um but we do have a submission on there so that you can, you know, put those sub submissions through um and we will do the legwork. We will find out the information. All you gotta do is submit the case. Um but that's that's untold. We are working on that. And you know Nick's got his fitness brand so he has that avenue that he's working as well. And then we've got, you know, uh money trail. So there's a lot of things working. Um we're trying to to get all things working to help. Um we have some cases that we're working on that um are very, very hard to cover. And so we have to I I have to do them in snippets because it's hard to to go down some of those paths. So again we're trying to keep things moving forward. It may seem at times we might go silent. So that's what this is for. We're hoping to keep this Monday, Wednesday, Friday quick, short if there's something you would like us, if there's a topic that you think that you would like us to cover um reach out. Yeah, send us a message. Send us um I think I think uh I'll have to double check I don't want to send you the wrong one but I think it's on like I think it's on like our Spotify link. It might even be on our link tree. So I I will double check because I think you have a Patreon on casewalkerchronicles.com I do like I got I got I I have to remember again I have a lot of hats and it's I gotta find out which where I put what because I know that it's out there um that's why I have to do my notes so I remember first of all which what I'm doing. But anything that you can think of if there's a topic or an area that you think might be interesting for us to talk about like tonight we talked about flock cameras. If there's a somebody like if Nick can figure this out because again I don't do technology he's gonna figure this out if there's somebody that you think would benefit from hearing this tag them send the video to them.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:12

Yeah I'll I'll be able to download should be able to in the live center of TikTok be able to download this edit it in CapCut and then upload it to so be watching for that YouTube.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:23

And we're we we will continue to you know I think let's see today's the sixth yes yeah so we will be back on Wednesday and hopefully let us know maybe I do that maybe I do the call to action is where do you want to see us live do you want to see us TikTok Facebook Instagram YouTube.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:53

I do want to ask uh for the viewers out there so this is the first time I've ever done a landscape view of the camera for TikTok versus portrait view. And I don't I guess I could look on my phone on TikTok and see how that comes through but I can't because my phone's are you able to turn your phone and it be like the full screen I I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:22

Give us your feedback again guidance all the things let us know what you want to see um this has been an an interesting evening I'm I'm wearing thin I've I had practice tonight from six to eight Amy knows what that's about so I'm and it is now 1049 and I was still supposed to go get vegetables from my dad's house so yeah send send me all the things let me know um where we need to go from here what you think what you like what works talk to your friends share ask them what do you think what what platform do you want us to do maybe we do like Monday is TikTok Wednesday is YouTube Friday is Facebook. I don't know maybe that's the path we take we we will go wherever you feel we need to go give us your guidance um because it's all about it's all about getting that information out I think I like to talk obviously so um and if you haven't if you haven't already check out the Casewalker Chronicles podcast start at episode one and go in order one through there's actually 11 episodes but it's one two three a three b four five six seven eight nine ten. And you go all the way through we cover several different cases um and we do it a little bit different. So don't be going into it thinking that it's gonna be the normal storytelling version of cases.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:01

And and just to show you how weird of type people we are you noticed the episodes were labeled one two three a three b four five six seven eight nine ten right three yeah um lacey hates the number three and sublimin subliminally in her mind she made sure and she doesn't realize this that she made a 3A and a 3B so that there wouldn't be a standalone number three in as an episode of our podcast because she hates the number three that we could have easily made it you know 11 episodes and just went sequential. It was 11 episodes I'm telling you she had no idea this is her OCD that took over in her mind.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:55

No it was part of the completely logical why I'm doing this and I am never even gonna think for a second it was the follow-up three it was supposed to be two parts because I was waiting for but I was waiting for records requests to come back and once I got the the well I didn't get the records request I know why there was a three day three but whatever you can say what you want to say like I I didn't do it that way.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:25

I don't like the number three I don't like odd numbers but see we had three Delphi episodes but they were labeled um six seven eight six seven eight actually no they weren't they were seven eight nine seven eight nine and ten was the gap so yeah so don't get me sidetracked we didn't we didn't have a seven a seven b7c because seven is a great number and it can stand alone on its own. No you need three seven or well I was gonna say three sevens that's still not right any either but no it was part one the number three the number three could not stand alone on its own because Lacey hates the number three just saying that's not that is not true. That is false I thought we only talked about facts on this show.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:11

Well you are giving false facts so sir that is on you I I there it's supposed to be no speculation which I guess this whole entire thing was kind of speculation in a way maybe I don't know I don't what this episode no we were just giving information we didn't speculate on you know you speculated a little oh what that you don't like the number three that is an absolute fact oh and that um we had a Stu Pedasso case that we looked at incident I mean he was convicted of a DUI back in 2022 hey you probably shouldn't drive you're 86 years old I think it's impressive that part like I listen I well and the fact that he's a documented insider trader but we won't go down that rabbit hole we're gonna edit that out because you don't know that we're not discussing it we're not bringing that into it but on that note because we're at 137 Gavin you popped in for a second so I'm gonna call you out and then he's gone the amount of people that pop in Malia we're just gonna start you know just saying the name say their names and see how long we can do that. They pop in while they're doing that quick scroll yeah and then they're they're gone. When you're in there in that quick scroll just give it a share. Just once share they're not hearing you I know they're just swiping they're not here anymore swiping swiping swiping the doom scroll all right this one wants to go pee the dog wants to go outside.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:52

I gotta try to track down vegetables too Amy thank you for listening I think you've stayed here the entire time we appreciate it give all of our love and we will be back Wednesday on a platform watch the socials we will push out what the topics will be I want to do I want to do at least a few more on TikTok so that we can get all of the okay so probably this week it'll be TikTok but yeah and I feel like we might get a little more activity through TikTok YouTube is crappy going live. I agree but anyways unless you're like uber popular or promoted by another creator one day.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:31

Alright all right everybody have a good week we will see you Wednesday same bat time same bat channel this has been the Casewalker Chronicles I'm Nick I'm Lacey you don't remember what it's called the particulars Yeah I remember all right we'll see you guys later have a good night Mia thanks for joining we're leaving though sorry bye bye