In It Together - Sibling conversations on life in the Kingdom of God.
In It Together is a podcast hosted by siblings Amy & Scott where they have honest, loving conversations on Kingdom Life centered around the teachings of Jesus.
In It Together - Sibling conversations on life in the Kingdom of God.
Episode 7 - Disciple (Part 1) - Living to become like the one we follow.
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What if the tension you’re trying to escape is the very place God plans to form you? We dive into a lived vision of the kingdom of God as a present reality and explore how practicing God’s presence changes the way we speak, decide, and love when life gets complicated. From a quick recap of core ideas—kingdom culture, the inner throne, repentance, reordered desires, and love as the game’s new rule—we move into a practical framework for seeing conflict and discomfort as invitations rather than interruptions.
We redefine discipleship as becoming like Jesus in every way possible, focusing on character over performance. The difference shows up in motive: two people can do the same “good” act while only one is being transformed. We unpack how the fruits of the Spirit grow when we pause in real moments—naming impatience, surrendering control, and asking God to teach us a new way to be. That shift turns belief into practice and doctrine into presence.
A powerful story ties grief and joy together in one weekend—mourning a friend’s loss, celebrating a wedding, and welcoming new life. Instead of guilt or avoidance, we learned to be fully present in each setting, holding space for sorrow and celebration without compartmentalizing. That is what kingdom imagination looks like: asking, Father, what do you see? What do you want to do? What do you want to say? When we approach daily life with that posture, tension becomes a divine appointment, authenticity grows, and love leads.
Walk with us as we trade performance for formation and hurry for attention. If you’re ready to practice the presence of God, reframe the tension in front of you, and let love set the rules, press play. Subscribe, share with a friend who needs hope today, and leave a review to help others find the show. What’s the one tension you’ll reframe this week?
Welcome And Series Recap
SPEAKER_03Welcome listeners. This is uh this is Scott again, and here we are in our next episode. This time you guys get to hear us live, as in Amy and I are together and not trying to have a conversation over the phone. Uh so you know, uh, welcome back to the podcast. Um, here it's a sibling conversation. Uh, my sister Amy and I are trying to uh invite you guys to some of the conversations that we have of learning how to have live life in the kingdom. And uh we just want to invite you guys to sit down and and recognize that you know life is not easy, but uh, what does it look like to join Jesus and what it would mean to live according to his kingdom and his teaching here on earth? So uh just a quick recap of the things that we've talked about so far. Um, you know, over the past few episodes, we've covered um a few different teachings that are kind of foundational for Amy and I'd conversations over the years, and it's kind of created some language for us to use.
Kingdom Culture And The Inner Throne
SPEAKER_03The first was um living in uh the culture of the kingdom, imagining that heaven has a culture and what would it look like to live according to that culture? Um, I believe the next one was the throne. Um, you know, there's a throne over each of our lives where uh God is um it's God's throne to sit on, but since the fall, it's our nature for self to sit on that throne, and that creates a conflict in our life. The third was repent. Jesus showed up and said, Change your thinking. I've made my kingdom available to you, and you can begin embracing it and living in it now, but you need to start changing the way you view and see and think about things. Um, the next one was a broken water, like we all have uh desires, and where we find ourselves living with desires at the helm of our life and in control behind the wheel of things, then pretty well we're headed to a big crash. Um, because God's desire and how he created us was for who he
Repentance And Desires Reordered
SPEAKER_03is and what is good to be at the forefront of um what's leading us into the life that we have. And desires um have a place in the car, but they're in the backseat.
Love As The New Rule
SPEAKER_03And then finally, last week we talked about the rules of the game. And the rules of the game is just the kind of this um analogy piece of imagining life as a game, and Jesus showed up with a new rule, and a new rule meant a whole new type of game, and the new rule was love and love will. And what is agape love, and um, how do we learn how to engage that? And so, anyway, that was a lot to say, but welcome to the podcast. And um where are we, Amy? What's next?
SPEAKER_01Well, I think it's good that you kind of I recapped all of those because we did as intentionally because it gives us language for a lot of the discussions that we have, but and it's just really helpful foundationally to uh kind of understand when we want to walk with Jesus and be like Jesus. Um a lot of the things involved in that and hurdles to that. So anyway, um one of the big things we've talked about kind of throughout all of those is being curious and watching for the tensions that arise as opportunities to invide us into what God is up to in our lives. So um, so if we're gonna talk about following Jesus, we have to agree on the life that he's inviting us to. So we got another topic for today.
SPEAKER_03Right. Yeah, I'm I think
Practicing God’s Presence Daily
SPEAKER_03you know, just to stick with our main focus of the podcast, it's about what Jesus essentially was saying life is all about. And that is to live life according to his kingdom and in his kingdom, to live life. Going back to imagining an interaction with God and a relationship with God before the fall, that there was the ability to have an interactive, um, ongoing conversation, living in community with God present. And wouldn't you know? Um, God is omnipresent, right? I mean, this is one of the things that we talk about, like the omnis, right? God is omnipresent, he's omniscient, he's all-knowing, he's omnipotent, he's all-powerful, right? But how many of us, you know, I think most Christians would agree, yes, those are three kind of tenets of what we believe about God. But, you know, I'm just asking you, listener, you know, what would life look like if you lived with the perspective that God was ever present before me? How much would life change? Now, I can just tell you that I work with sailors in the Navy, and there are a lot of stereotypical things about sailors in the Navy. One of those things that is very true is that there tends to be some colorful language. And so they come over to my house on Friday nights, and sometimes that colorful language slips out. And but for the most part, these these guys and gals are very respectful and try to try to live and speak differently when they're in our house, right? Well, why? Because they're present in you know, a setting with us, and that's not necessarily how we talk. Well, what if they lived or you and I lived? What would be different if we lived thinking that God was present? I mean, would you change your language? Would you be careful? Like if your mama was present, you know, fully around you all the time? Um, do you need to change your language? Um, imagine, I'm just using kind of the language mindset and the fact that I work with sailors as a as a potential thing to think about. But the main thing that I'm trying to bring up in this little God is omnipresent piece is how much more God has available for us if we actually lived practicing and engaging what we say we believe. How much life could be and would be different if we actually practiced what we say we believe.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I you know the kingdom of God now, this was a really life giving concept to me because I guess I mean maybe I I've been a Christian a long time. I live in the bubble of the Bible belt. So I hear about the kingdom of God, and this is not a new concept, but I tend to hear about it like one day, like, you know, when everything is made right, and that's so so true. But when I think about the kingdom of God being here and now, that poses a lot of questions. Like, how do I be about that? How do I be about bringing the kingdom of God just as an instrument of Christ? And I think it very much aligns with how would you how would you live if Jesus was right here right now. And you know, just a total different way of thinking.
SPEAKER_03Right. Well, I mean, it aligns with that first lesson, you know, living according to the culture of the kingdom. Like if you were in heaven, if if we were in heaven, we would be more cognizant and aware that God is present. Right? I got a feeling that we would be, if we needed to be careful, I don't think we necessarily, you know, we won't get into the heaven aspects, but have to be careful with what we say. But I think that there's just an awareness of God being present that shifts and changes a lot, right? I know that as a teenager, when my parents were present, I was much more careful with the words that I used. And um, you know, so what's another thing that would change in
Kingdom Now, Not Someday
SPEAKER_03our world if we lived with the recognition that God was present? As an example. Um, recently I had breakfast with someone who was really going through a hard time and was telling me about the hardship that they're having with somebody else and how difficult the situation is with this person that they're they're connected to and what's going on, you know, in that person's life and their the hardship that they're having. And the the person that I'm meeting with is telling me how hard this is for them. And and basically where the conversation went was just in the you know, like what we're talking about right now, is I just began to encourage them. Well, what if we lived life under God's reign and everything that we're involved in, he can turn into something good. Right?
SPEAKER_01Right. I think it's like a narrative change. I think it requires imagination and to think about things differently and to be willing to challenge our thinking. Um, which is really what this whole podcast is about. Like, just figuring out together, we're in it together to figure out how do we live this life to be like Jesus.
SPEAKER_03So, like this person that I'm having breakfast with, like their perspective of this tension in their life is this is really negative and this needs to get fixed and to go away. Um, and you know, I'm not sure if we've said it yet here before, but it's definitely something that language that I like to use on a regular basis is like, look, God does his some of his deepest work in the tensions in our lives.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_03Like, so this tension that you're dealing with is actually a really, really, really good thing.
SPEAKER_01It's kind of like a divine appointment.
SPEAKER_03Like a divine appointment, that's a good way to say it, right? That this like this tension that you see as a negative, there's a repentant moment. And what I mean by that is change of thinking because you've been imagining this tension as a problem. And while I agree that the circumstances of what your tent's about aren't good, the fact that you are a believer and that God wants to use you, God is always showing up to come and redeem and to reconcile things. And so the fact that you as a believer are in relationship with this person that has this these things that need some help with is one of the most beautiful things that you can experience in your life. God wants to use you as an agent to bring about transformation and change. But I think oftentimes maybe we need to recognize that these things that we spend a lot of time and energy trying to avoid, these tensions, we want to get rid of them rather than see God redeem them.
SPEAKER_01Right. Tension has been a key word that keeps coming up. I feel like it's kind of like the little light uh um that comes on. Like whenever we feel the tension, it's probably a time to just pause and go, hmm. Maybe there's something a little more going on here.
SPEAKER_03Right.
Reframing Tension As Invitation
SPEAKER_03Like our three things. Hmm, God, pause. What am I thinking right now?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And how am I viewing this tension?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And so maybe this is a good moment for you, listener, to consider um, hmm. What is the tension that I'm dealing with today? And maybe I need to pause and ask God, is there a different way that you want to lead me in this tension to see this as it as as you see it? Like that you see potentially this tension as an opportunity for your kingdom to come here on earth as it would be in heaven. And this tension just invited that to become true and real and how I'm imagining what this circumstance I'm walking into looks like. And that changes how I now live in view of that circumstance and how God is inviting me into be an agent of his kingdom by being a change agent to bring about something actually very good.
SPEAKER_01So I think that leads us to the topic of discipleship.
SPEAKER_03Discipleship. You know, I've had discipleship conversations with a number of different people, and I like to talk about, you know, kind of the root of that disciple before we get into discipleship. And I've asked a lot of different people, you know, what do you understand? If you had to define the word disciple for me, um, let's just say I've asked a hundred different people. I've had probably a number of different answers that don't even generally relate necessarily, a lot of different definitions that have been thrown my way, and only a couple people out of those hundred that have really said something very similar to you know what I would um say. And so I've kind of um I'm stealing part of this from uh some of what I've learned from Dallas Willard, but I would say that a disciple is a person who is living to become like Jesus in every way possible, right? And now I'm very intentional with that language, like um we're not going to the what would Jesus do thing. Like we're gonna we're gonna have a big conversation about doing versus being um at some point.
SPEAKER_01That's big. That is that is a big conversation.
Discipleship Defined: Being Over Doing
SPEAKER_03That's a big topic, um, but right now we're gonna I want you to just be able to kind of focus on who would Jesus be? Like, so who is Jesus and who would Jesus be in this situation or in this moment, you know, of whatever the tension may be. And how do I become like that in every way possible? Like, we know that the attributes of who God is, let's just let's just kind of point at the fruits of the spirit, you know, that the fruits of the spirit, you know, love, joy, peace, patience, gentleness, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, self-control, right? We know that Jesus would be patient, right? Just to pick on one of those. Right. Like he would embody the very nature of God. And so because we were created in his image, then having a word like patience set before us, where we find ourselves not being patient, where can the kingdom now come into the room, come into my life? For me to pause and recognize, okay, I'm not being very patient right now, and for the kingdom of God to come into my life, then if I'm recognizing that I'm not being patient, then me desiring to want to follow Jesus by becoming like him, then I need to surrender that I'm not being patient and invite him to teach me how to engage being patient in this moment. And I get that that is something that then you go act on. But in being a disciple, it's about there's there's a core essence of about character change, right? So let's just take just a minute, Amy, because I to unpack where what you and I both see as a big conversation, the difference in doing and being. And one of the ways that I like to kind of speak to this, like Amy, let's just imagine that we both went to um the homeless shelter on Saturday morning and we both stood in line to scoop out soup to hand a bowl of soup to a hungry, homeless person downtown. Okay, right? And you show up to do that because your heart is broken for and you your heart has compassion for these people, right? And I show up to do that because I think it's the right thing to do, and it would be a good thing to do, right? God would look at the motivation of our hearts and see, I think, something different. He would look at the motivation of your heart and see this compassion that you have, and he would see, you know, potentially me doing this out of just trying to do good, and I think it's the right thing to do, but I really don't have a heart for the person that I'm handing the bowl to. Right?
SPEAKER_01Right. And so
Fruit Of The Spirit In Real Time
SPEAKER_01is it's really yourself.
SPEAKER_03100%. Yeah, focuses on me, right? Right, very good. And so the the doing, you and I can do the exact same thing, right? But because the motivation is different, then nothing is really but that this radically different from a spiritual perspective, right? And so that's why we're focusing on being rather than the doing, and being comes before doing, right? Because for God, it is about the motivation of the heart, and it is about a character transformation. We could both be doing the same thing, but if I'm not looking for my character to be affected, well then I could memorize the whole Bible and be able to recite it to you and look like a really good person.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_03But if just because I can quote scripture doesn't necessarily mean that my heart has been affected and transformed by it.
SPEAKER_01Right. It's about formation, not performance.
SPEAKER_03Very good, exactly. And so that's the that's the general gist of where we would be going in a big conversation about doing versus being. And so the reason that being is so important in the definition of being a disciple is that there is a formation and a transformation that takes place in you and me as we seek to follow Jesus, where we're joining in a transformative work, desiring and hungry for God to change the things in me and in my heart that don't look, smell, sound, and respond as they would if he was living as if his heart was in me.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_03And I don't know if that made sense to anybody, but if you comprehend that, then it is a very different life than if I'm just trying to be a be a good person or do the right thing. Like there's a deep work that the Spirit of God is constantly doing, inviting me into a different place, and I would say inviting me to come alive into who I was created to be, which is a
Story: Grief And Joy In One Weekend
SPEAKER_03person who bears his image.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, um when I find myself in a situation where there is a lot of tension and angst and I pause to say, okay, I have no idea how on earth the kingdom of God comes through me to this place. And then I realize how desperate I am for Jesus. And then sometimes he gives just idea that blows my mind, and I go, oh, that must be how the kingdom comes in this situation.
SPEAKER_03Right. Most of us walk into a room or walk into you know any given scenario and we look at it and we again, by that nature of sitting on our throne, we kind of become judges of what we see to be good or what we see to be bad or what's happening here, or what do I think about this, right?
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_03And so if we're living to become like him, then one of the very ways that we learn to become like him and that he wants to lead us to become like himself is to walk into any given moment. Presently with him and to see things as he would see them.
SPEAKER_01Right. And we usually, well, I'm speaking for myself here, like in this circumstance as ancient. I would never have these ideas on my own. Like I know when he gives me some idea like that, that it is clearly the kingdom of God. Because I would not see it that way. I'm not that clever. I'm not that smart. I mean, it clearly has to be his idea. Because I couldn't have come up with that myself.
SPEAKER_03100%. Like Jesus models for us, like you see it repetitively in the Gospel of John. Jesus says, you know, look, I simply do what I see my father doing and say what I hear my father saying. Now, if Jesus is saying, Well, I don't walk into a room and just imagine my own self, what I think is going on. Like I'm walking into a room and I'm asking the father, Lord, what do you see here? What is it that you're wanting to do, and what is it that you want to say?
SPEAKER_01Can I tell you a story? Because this literally happened to me two weeks ago.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_01So I'm gonna try not to talking about it. But the scenario was Kate, my daughter, she and I were hosting two parties in one weekend at my house. One was a bridal shower on Saturday. The other was a baby shower on Sunday for her. Two very her some of her dearest friends. One's getting married, one's having a baby girl. So I did a lot of prep to get ready because I knew this was gonna be a really busy weekend. So I this is not normal, but I had everything done by Wednesday of that week. And on Thursday, a totally different friend texted me. She had a family crisis. And because I had everything done, I was able to help my friend in the midst of this crisis. And the crisis continued through Friday. And on Friday, my friend lost one of her children. Her her oldest daughter died. And the moment that I got that news, I just thought, oh, this is not right. Like, how how could something like this happen? Like, how do uh is how does one friend lose a child and another friend is getting married, and another friend is welcoming a child. This all does not fit together. But the Lord then gave me this idea. This is what I mean about the kingdom of God going. Yes, it fits it all holy. You grieve with us who grieve. You rejoice with us who rejoice. So you can grieve in this moment with this friend, and tomorrow you can be purely present with the other friend that's getting married, and then you can be present with the other friend that's welcoming a baby and celebrate and not feel guilty, and then you can go mourn with your other friend because this is all holy, and it's all holy assignments, and I was just like, oh, and you know what? It was a great weekend because it was as if the Lord gave me permission to be happy and celebrate and not feel bad about that, but then also to grieve when it was time to grieve and to to just really ponder and cherish all of those things
Authenticity, Formation, And Hope
SPEAKER_01is a lot.
SPEAKER_03A lot of holy moments available for us, and you know, what otherwise would have maybe well, you know, what I hear you saying too, back to the beginning of the part of the conversation, is this was a big tension till you felt like God breathed into it. Totally like of how am I supposed to be able to be all of this at one time? Yes, and he's not he's like, I'm not asking you to be all of this at one time, I'm asking you to be fully present in the thing that I place you in front of because these are all things it's beautiful, right? Yeah, and so rather than living under guilt and under condemnation, that you're not still grieving while celebrating new life, the Lord's like, I have let me show you how I would do this.
SPEAKER_01And I wasn't living under the weight of the world, yeah. I knew that God totally had his hand in the timing and in each one of my friends' lives, and he he was the one carrying it. It wasn't up to me. I was just gonna be present for what was happening for each one in his give and die.
SPEAKER_03Right. And you got to be authentic, yeah, and I think that's one of the things that we have both talked about in the past of what we're discovering. Maybe we didn't even realize before these ways that the Lord's teaching us how to live with him in given moments. Thank you for your story and your experience there. But that when we do that, he's always inviting us to become more authentic and more authentically ourselves, maybe even ways we didn't know before the moment. Um, that we were less authentic when we had these tensions or had this, you know, before. And so again, I mean, in a thousand different ways, he's in the midst of these tensions. And I think as Americans, we mostly live trying to get tensions out of our life. Like we have this utopian perspective of let's just get back to the garden where everything's provided and I don't have to do anything, and there's no problems in the world. Like let's let's get away from having any problems in my life, and if it's a problem, it's bad. And that's not what how Jesus lived. He walked around finding problems and seeing issues that were problems for people and addressed those issues and brought healing, physical healing, spiritual healing.
SPEAKER_01Right, and we don't have to be afraid to enter into the problems with whether there are uh or whether there are friends, because often uh that's where it is is is working as tensions through those problems, right?
SPEAKER_03And so living to be ge to become a disciple is to live to become like him in every way possible, and not that Amy and I have this figured out. No, we don't, we do not have this figured out, but we we have had enough conversations and enough circumstances and enough tensions that we've walked through over the past number of years that we find ourselves encouraging each other and discovering life. Like that's the amazing piece is where this character, where our character gets addressed, and it's not just about doing the right thing, but that it's there's an invitation toward change. Like it's incredibly life-giving.
SPEAKER_02Right. Right, right.
SPEAKER_03Just imagine the progress. Okay, I was very impatient, and I paused and I had a moment where I was connected with God because He's present in the room, and five minutes later, I found myself being incredibly patient with a person that I wouldn't, I wasn't patient with five minutes ago, all because I recognized and turned to God and asked him to teach me how to be patient, and then I found myself being patient. Like that is a life-giving experience. How many of those are we missing out on by not living to become a disciple and having that at the forefront of the life we're trying to live?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, like to just kind of have to some of the things we've talked about. Like, to me, like the story, I just don't remind me a lot of the rules of the game because I was feeling the tension of right and wrong. Like, it's not right to have all of these things mixed together at one time. I hate the most horrible grief a parent could imagine with bridal showers and baby showers, you know, like this is not right. Who would put all these things together? Um but the rules of the game in the kingdom of God is love, and that's what ended up coming that weekend was just the supernatural ability that God was providing for me to love each of these friends where they were. So it was just a really different way of thinking about it. It truly felt like holy assignments. And anyway, it's just not how I would have typically thought.
Questions For Your Next Step
SPEAKER_01Right and wrong would be my typical way of compartmentalizing all of those things. But the Lord just be a different way to think about it.
SPEAKER_03I think for so so many years I probably lived with tensions, you know, wanting them to go to go away before I truly began to understand the invitation to be a disciple. Yeah. And recognizing that these very challenges are the things that shape and mold and transform me into his image, and are the opportunities and the tools that he uses to shape and challenge my character and point out where you know I'm still trying to live according to me. And, you know, how many of us do that? How many of us are missing the very thing that Jesus died on the cross to offer us? Um, it is not solely salvation, it is about transformation and a return back to who we're created to be and to live that out here on this earth, here and now, as we will for eternity in heaven. And so we've been saved from the old self that was spiritually dead and now invited to a spiritually alive way of living, and that transforms the way we see things, the way we imagine things, the way we interact with people, the way we, you know, engage the world and all the tensions in the world. And so, maybe, listener for you, uh, I think a simple question would be you know, name attention. And how does Jesus want to invite you to become like him and seeing that and engaging that the way that he would as he comes to restore and redeem things here on earth?
SPEAKER_01Right. And those invitations or those tensions really are invitations, they're not burdens. I mean, they they can be just like a divine appointment.
SPEAKER_03Well, uh, we've got more to talk about. This is probably just opening up uh maybe a number of questions for you guys, or maybe we just lost you all together. I don't know. We're trying to be helpful and encouraging. Um, I know that we've been able to encourage each other a lot through these sort of conversations, but yeah, again, trying to maybe keep this um relatively short, but yet open, you know, some thinking in a magnitude way to uh consider things differently. Um, hopefully it's helpful for you. So, you know, what might change for you if um you're living to become like Jesus uh and trying to discover a life with him, with him present, and discover the things that he's inviting change to as you live life. Uh look forward to seeing you guys next week.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, what are we gonna talk about? I don't know. Okay, we'll figure it out next week. See y'all later.
SPEAKER_03Take care.