Writing Life Problems: Did You Share Your Draft Too Soon?

Uncover the hidden fears that hold writers back from sharing their work—and discover the simple mindset shift that can help you overcome them. Whether you're just starting to show your writing or struggling to share with the right people, this episode reveals key insights to help you find your confidence and protect your creative energy.
When is the right time to share your work? Sydney and Lisa dive into their contrasting experiences—Sydney’s confident sharing as a beginner versus Liza’s cautious, trust-based approach. They explore how the people you choose to share with can build you up or break you down, and why surrounding yourself with supportive, wise voices matters more than ever.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

When is a good time to share your work with other people? Never. I've been quite productive today for once. I've had weeks and weeks of a lull. And then finally today I woke up and I don't know what's happened. Well, actually, I do know what's happened. I've had like really bad anemia. And I didn't even realize it, but I got some blood work done. And so my ferritin was like 10, which is like severely low. And so I just was so much brain fog. Couldn't I would read my sentences in my book and then immediately forget them. Like I would read them and forget them, read them and forget them. I just had no energy, sleeping all the time. So it's been weeks and weeks and weeks of me doing nothing and thinking, oh my God, this is who this is how I am now. And I'm never gonna write a book. I'm never gonna get anything done. We have our writers group coming up next week. I haven't written a word in a month and written what I promised either. Oh no, I was so looking forward to that. And so I went and got five infusions done. And now today I am like a new person. I woke up and I was I wrote, I've already written, well, I did stuff for the podcast, and then I did like 1300 words of writing. So that's probably what I'm gonna submit this time, is just 1300 words, and that's it. I mean, that's incredible. That's awesome. So I'm feeling really proud.

SPEAKER_00 1:19

Your writing almost at nano rhymo. What's nano rhymo? You don't know what nano rhymo is? No. Um, I don't know if it's still around, but it was a um it was a big deal over the past few, I don't know, over the past decade, maybe longer. Uh, but basically it was a national novel writing month, NanoRimo. And it was, it was not a competition, but it was kind of a communal activity that happened, I think, in November, where people would write a novel in a month. And there's a whole website, community, and you would try to get, I think it was like 40 to 60,000 words done within a month. And yeah, you could log a diary of how many words you were writing per day. And yeah, I it was funny because one of the biggest pieces of advice back then, some years ago, on like on YouTube was do not pitch your nano rhymo book to an agent right after you finish it. Like it's it's pitching to agents in December was a bad idea. Yeah, because they would all be like, is this a nano rhino book? Should I even look at it? Is it is it so hot off the presses that like it's just yeah rife with problems? Like it's just not ready, it's underbaked. So anyway, that's nano rhymo, and writing several thousand words a day was the you know the goal.

SPEAKER_02 2:47

That sounds fun, stressful, but fun. Yeah. Also, you should never pitch an agent in December because they're all going on vacation and they're totally checked out for the end of the year. Yeah just a side note. As a side note, uh as an additional reason to not pitch an agent in December, yeah. Don't do it then. So I'm I've written a thousand words and now I have like 9,300 words written in this novel. I that's a huge first milestone for me. The first one to ten thousand words of any novel is like pulling teeth for me to get that written. It's the hardest part of the novel besides 30,000 to 40,000. Those are my two stuck points. Uh so I'm just so happy to be past this 10,000. Probably at this point now, it's just like my own barrier in my mind. I'm like, oh, it's the one to ten. I guess I'm gonna have a hard time. And then I do. Uh but I'm just so happy to be almost done with the first 10.

SPEAKER_00 3:34

Yeah, I uh I've been planning out the first thousand to two thousand words in this side book that I'm doing. And I'm I'm doing it differently than I usually do it. Like I'm really planning it out because I'm realizing that part of the reason I write long is because I I let myself wander into different areas, which I think is fun. It's come up with good ideas in those areas and you can keep the pacing good, then it's it's a good time. But if you're trying to write something super commercial, I think that commercial is more planned out the better.

SPEAKER_02 4:08

I've been finding that too. Yeah. I I feel like the more books I've written, the more I become a plotter. It just makes my life easier. And then in my free time, I let my mind wander. Like today, I came up actually, I'll probably need your advice because I came up I changed it and I came up with like this whole Russian family lineage. Okay. Kind of based on your advice from our last writer's group about like really thinking of the history. So I'm gonna have to use you as my sensitivity reader if you don't mind, because I have a whole Russian South African situation going on. Interesting.

SPEAKER_00 4:40

I mean, I I find the term sensitivity reader so annoying. Yeah, I'm gonna say too. I think it goes to because I'm just like, so you mean research and accuracy? Okay. Like you mean you mean a primary source? Okay, great. Like there are already set up terms for this, and it's like it's not about offending people. It's about like, do you want, do you want some accuracy and authenticity to your work? I don't I don't know. Maybe I'm just going off now.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

Well, like, for example, their last name is, and I don't even know if I'm saying this right, but Dimodov. But you know, the girls' last names are supposed to be Demodova, but because they've already immigrated over and they're a third generation, and so they had to change it on their passports. So now their official name is Demodov, so even the girls will be Demodov.

SPEAKER_00 5:29

I mean, it's not so I guess it it was not a thing for me. So my last name is Petrov, and I have, I think I think my aunt goes by Petrova. I don't know if my grandma goes by Petrova. I have no idea what her passport says, but like to me, that's like a sure, do it. Like if if it was a problem for them with their immigration stuff, then that that works. It's just not like a a big it wasn't a big thing for me. I'm just petrol. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 5:57

Yeah. You just have to do that. Those are the kinds of things I just want to make sure. Because I don't want a Russian person to be reading and being like, they're using the masculine last name, and that's not what you're supposed to do, you know?

SPEAKER_00 6:07

I I know the feeling because I've I've I I used my mom to help me with a bunch of things that I didn't know. And like she she was she was very helpful in all these different areas. Uh so I know the anxiety of it. And it was like really nice to have someone go like, no, no, no, that's correct. Don't worry about it. Uh so you're fine. You're like on that level, I know what I'm talking about. You're totally fine with uh whether they have an A on the end of their name or not.

SPEAKER_02 6:36

So and then and we're talking commercial fiction, so I'm not gonna be getting deep into the history. I just need this to be surface level correct.

SPEAKER_00 6:42

Yeah, that I I agree. Yeah, for for me with uh the book that I'm writing right now, the side book that I'm gonna present to you, I'm having fun with this first intro chapter because like I I'm really planning out what information I want to deliver to the audience when, because it's a mystery as well. Uh so if you're doing a mystery, you have to have all your red herrings, you have to have all your suspects, you have to create the puzzle ahead of time. It's very plot-heavy. And also it's a romance, so you're deciding when to up the tension, when to release the tension, etc. And one of my favorite things with planning abstract information first to deliver to the audience is then you go, okay, what is the most interesting way I could present this piece of information? So, like it's a mystery. There's a discovery of a body at the beginning. Okay, what is the most interesting way for me to give the audience all the information they need about my main character and this dead body showing up? Like, what is the relationship between her and the dead body? Like how, and and I was like, okay, I started brainstorming. I was just like, okay, maybe like she's uh she just landed a role as an actress and uh she's doing a promo interview. Like I was like, okay, that's fun. She's not just like, I don't know, in a cab. She's not just at home, she's not in an empty room. What is she doing that is novel for the reader to experience? She's on set in the middle of an interview promoting a a film with a cast member she doesn't particularly like. You have you have immediate energy, and I was just like, okay, this is the magic of writing. I love this. So yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:20

Yeah, you really uh impacted me last week or whatever, a couple weeks ago, I don't know, when you told me that commercial fiction is an art that you can constantly perfect and make better when thinking about things like how do you present your hooks? How are you bettering your pacing and keeping the audience grabbed page to page? Yeah. And since then I've been very motivated. I kind of attribute my new gusto to you because I've really started thinking like, okay, let's look at the actual art of this and try and better it. And so thank you for that. So excited. Well, uh, that is actually our stagecraft for this week. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 8:57

Really excited about it. How to just easy, quick ways to pep up your writing and make it less boring, let's just say punch. Yeah. Uh help it back punch, avoid those terrible reviews that tell you, oh, it dragged, it was boring, have your beta readers' eyes glaze over. What are some simple things you can do with writing that you're either in the middle of drafting or going back into? It's like how can you zaz of a page that you've already you've already written?

SPEAKER_02 9:31

And it kind of sets you apart from being like an amateur writer to, okay, they've been doing this a while. They seem like they're more of a pro.

SPEAKER_00 9:38

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Exactly. So I know that you have a few tips. I have uh a couple that I can give after you. So why don't why don't you go with yours first and then I'll I'll tap on mine.

SPEAKER_02 9:48

So the first one I have is to reduce unique dialogue tags. When you first start writing, you start thinking, okay, I really need to up my vocabulary. I want to make it snazzy and dazzly. And so what an amateur writer will do a lot of times is they will, after every piece of dialogue, put a dialogue tag like he snarled, he gr he said with a grimace, or he he snapped, he snapped and shouted, he whatever. He laughed and just like he grumbled. Yes, exactly. And while that is a tool you should use sparingly, it actually slows down the reader and takes them out of your work a little bit. And so actually most of the time you should just use said or says because the reader just grazes over that, doesn't really stop on it, and moves right along. Where dialogue tags are really helpful is if it's unclear uh how the reader should be reading it, especially if there's like sarcasm involved or they're saying something that sounds like it might be a friendly statement, but then they're actually saying it in like a rude way. So it helps orient the reader to what you're saying or what or w the way you're intending it to sound. Those are the good times to use dialogue tags, but most of the time you should just use said, which doesn't sound like it's what you should do, but trust me, it is.

SPEAKER_00 11:10

Yeah. Sometimes you want your writing, especially the more utilitarian part of your writing, to just disappear. And that's a good thing because you want your reader to focus on what's important, the most fun parts of the book already, which is your plot and your character development, the drama. You want them to focus on that, not on the utilitarian aspects of just that someone said something. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 11:37

So let's say your inclination was to say that he snapped. You're trying to show anger in this character. So you just say said, and then what would be more interesting is if the next sequence before there's another piece of dialogue is if you break it up with some action and you show the character doing something that demonstrates that they're angry, you know, like slamming something down on a desk or stomping away or sighing deeply, and then now the the reader is more immersed into your writing, and then the next dialogue tag could come, and you don't need to say he's angry because now we know based on this action sequence. So really breaking up dialogue with action as well gives the reader a break, helps them fall further into the scene. So that's the next tip I have.

SPEAKER_00 12:24

I would say I've heard uh I've heard some disagreement about really not about that. Uh that that is fantastic advice, but it reminds me of some disagreement that I've heard, which is I've heard people, experienced people, writers, editors, say you don't even need the dialogue tag all the time. Like even be sparing with he said, she said. And you can even have whole sequences where if you know who's speaking when, you can just have the dialogue. That like I have I have seen that in books. I have heard people say that that is a fine thing to do, but I've also heard people say you must always have a dialogue tag.

SPEAKER_02 13:02

No.

SPEAKER_00 13:03

So the I I've heard professional editors say this. And so I just I want to the only reason I'm bringing this up is not to say which side is right. I personally tend to be sparing about my dialogue tags, even if like I like to leave off the dialogue tag if I can. Because oftentimes the dialogue tag is just a notation to allow the reader to definitely know who is speaking. That's it. Because obviously it's not a movie. You don't automatically know who's speaking. You have to make that clear. But I like I know that there the an opposite opinion exists, and just be aware of that.

SPEAKER_02 13:40

Actually, that is like one of my biggest pet peeves in writing. If there's a dialogue sequence and it's just back and forth, yeah, I cannot stand it when each line has a dialogue tag. That takes me right out. Like, I don't I hate when it says, Okay, he said, come here, she said. Just like my God and then it says he said, and then she said, and it's et cetera. Yes. Takes me out of it, it slows me down. Uh I cannot stand that.

SPEAKER_00 14:04

That's like one of my incredibly impressed when I see scenes that are written with many people in the same room speaking, and the dialogue tags are well done.

SPEAKER_02 14:15

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 14:15

Where you know exactly who's speaking, it's not overstated, uh, it doesn't get in the way. And like there are some really artfully done scenes where you read it and you're like, okay, it it's working not just on the basic utilitarian level of I know who's speaking when, but also there's humor infused in the dialogue tags, there's there's drama infused into them, just so subtly and elegantly. I I I've seen several writers do this. You know that the Dexter books, you know, the you know, Dexter. Yeah. I like the books. I I I've read the books, I've watched the show, thought it was fun. Uh, but uh that author or his editing team, whoever makes the final decisions about dialogue tags, like he definitely does the like he said, he said, he said after everything. At least in the first book. And I was like, this is so funny. So anyway.

SPEAKER_02 15:08

Well, maybe it's because it's the first book. I actually have been challenging myself after your advice this time. So my first book, my debut, I only have it be between this husband and wife, and I kind of keep it to that. I don't have a lot of scenes. There is like one major scene where there's four characters, but them for the most part, I'm just dealing with two characters on a page. And I this time the way I'm trying to challenge myself is I have a large cast of people. So I have to give them all different personalities, all different backgrounds. There's people from all over the world coming to this event. It's a it's so I'm really challenging myself to increase the dialogue, having multiple people talking in a scene, and see how I can pull that off.

SPEAKER_00 15:47

So you know, one tip that I have for that, the thing that I noticed happening most often in scenes with many people in them that worked for me as a reader, and I've tried to apply it to my own writing, is when you s you use the dialogue tags, but you also follow your second piece of advice where you you kind of lean on it more. Uh, you you state that a character is doing an action, and then you just say the dialogue right after that. So, like so-and-so looked into his glass of wine. I don't like this, you know, something like that. Like uh that that I found was a very effective way to say, this is who's speaking. I don't have to have a dialogue tag, I just have action, speech, and then I can have another so-and-so raise his hand and said, I do like this. You know, you know what I mean? Like I have no dialogue in my head to say, but it was an easy way to zip from character to character and be clear about who was speaking, and yet avoid any clunky dialogue tags just being like, he said, he said after everything. Right.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

And you do that very well in your writing because you have a large cast of people.

SPEAKER_00 16:59

I do. I wanna I wanna tone that down. But uh, you know what? I seem to not be going in that direction with my other book because I've made a crazy family for my main character. And that's gonna be so fun.

SPEAKER_02 17:10

It's so I love when it's very insular though, because that makes it really fun. You can really get into the dynamics and the personality quirks, and that's so fun. I love insular books.

SPEAKER_00 17:19

I I have I've always had a thing for movies and books that have large amounts of people having some sort of kinetic energy with each other. I somehow it feeds me. So we are 20 minutes in. I think I'm just gonna add one more, and we're gonna can we save some of our other things.

SPEAKER_02 17:37

Yeah, let's save it and have a continuation another time.

SPEAKER_00 17:40

Yeah, so I have uh a kind of slight riff on tags, and it's more around character movement. Uh, this is something that I have I've I've been a student of when I read other people's writing, how they do blocking with characters. So again, you know, if you have a lot of people on a scene or even just two people on a scene, it's or just one. It's it's a really important part of show don't tell. Uh but it's also knowing how to use your verbs, knowing when to spice them up and when to tone them down is a really big marker of how far along you are on your writing journey, if you are kind of a newbie and trying to figure things out, or if you're a little bit more advanced. So my basic piece of advice is with character movement, intentionality matters. And there are three levels for me. I'm I'm reading up, it's just saying so prepared. So if if action is not important in your scene, so it's like it's just people talking in a room, and it's not like it's an action scene where it's like really important to convey that someone moved across the room for a specific reason. Like they're not like diving for your MacGuffin, you know, they're not diving to save somebody's life, they're just getting up from a chair, okay? Uh so if action is not important for your scene and just necessary blocking, brevity and bland verbs are your best friend. So, like, and and the there's a common piece of advice to spice up your verbs. And what I mean by brevity or blandness is like my example is the character crossed the room. You can spice that up to saying traversed the room. But what you're not saying is exploded across the room. Like no. What you want is a an interesting verb but with a flat feeling to it. And you can you can find very utilitarian verbs that work in that way that help you communicate very briefly, disappear into the background, character movement. And I would say one of the biggest mistakes in new writer writing is they make their verbs too explosive.

SPEAKER_02 20:00

If that makes sense. Yeah, and I dramatic. Now that you say that, that is like a good, I've in the back of my mind known this, but you bringing that up is so helpful because if it's always intense, it's gonna distract your reader. And they're not gonna pay attention to the things that you're wanting them to pay attention to. Because like maybe him crossing the room is not important. It's like what he's doing when he gets across the room that's important. And so you don't want to have them spend time on that. It's kind of like the said tag. You just want them to know where they are and then get to the action. That's such a that's such a unique and helpful tip.

SPEAKER_00 20:32

Yeah. You have to you have to pick what you're concentrating on there. So it's like if you don't even want to focus on if it takes too much time to focus on crossing the room, then don't even have it. But if you need to have that someone cross the room, if you need to have the movement, but it's just utilitarian, go as basic as you can so that it disappears. And I promise you, careful readers who are trying to learn will notice. Uh, and then so the next level up is um so if action is important for your scene, spice up the verb to bring the reader's attention to it. So basically, across the room becomes raced or sped or bolted across the room, flew across the room. That but use that specifically for when the action they are diving for the MacGuffin, they are trying to save someone's life. That that is when you want your verb to be very bombastic. And then the final one is uh if you are building your world or you're building a character, and that's the important part of the scene, then you need to make your verb a character specific. So for example, if you are introducing a careless young flighty character, they didn't just cross the room, but they flounced across the room, if that makes sense. They skipped, they twirled, they did something, or if uh if you're introducing an old character that has trouble walking, they hobbled. Yes. But you're not saying hobbled when you're just you're not always saying hobbled for for that old character. But if you're introducing them, if you're trying to define them, then you're going towards those more descriptive verbs. So picking your time and place for your verbs carefully and intentionally is key. I love you.

SPEAKER_02 22:21

That's super good advice. I'm going to take that and put it in my pocket.

SPEAKER_00 22:24

Well, now we're 25 minutes in.

SPEAKER_02 22:27

So let's move on to our main act. So let's move on to our main act where we're talking about when is a good time to share your work with other people?

SPEAKER_00 22:38

NAT work. That's not my official answer. I'm just I'm just saying it.

SPEAKER_02 22:44

You know, I think it's like the first step outside of like when you're writing for yourself. And then it's like, who do I share it with now? Do I share it with friends or beta readers or editors or whoever it may be? When is a good time to do that?

SPEAKER_00 22:56

I okay, I have a I have a fun little activity for us to do with this. Okay. When was because we have completely different writing personalities. I want to know who when you shared your writing for the first time with someone, and how quickly did you do it?

SPEAKER_02 23:14

Like very quickly. I started writing the first book when I was 18, maybe. Uh-huh. And who'd you share it with? Uh my whole family.

SPEAKER_00 23:26

So, okay, so immediately and with everybody.

SPEAKER_02 23:28

Yeah, I I like wrote chapter one. I was like, I am a good writer. This book is awesome. Everyone needs to read this. So I started pestering. I would send it to my aunts and my uncles and my cousins and my sister. I was like, follow along on this book. None of them read it, except for my a few close people, like my mom, my dad, and my sisters and stuff. But I just was like, this is the most fun hobby. I love this. I love this story. I want to share it with everyone. And so I did. And I've always been that way. It wasn't until college when I took my first writing class where I was in there with a bunch of older people. Like I was a freshman. And I don't I don't know how I even got into this class because it was all juniors and seniors. And they were to me, they were so brilliant. And they were writing these like poetic prose. And then I I had to share this book that I was writing. And I was oh, then they do the critique groups. And I I remember my teacher saying to me, Sydney, you are in this class and most of your grade is your participation. Why do you not talk? And I was like, I am paralyzed with fear and anxiety. I feel like I have nothing of value to say.

SPEAKER_00 24:31

Sydney, you have been ever paralyzed with fear and anxiety. I can't, I can't believe that. You're so confident. You're like a bulldog. You're you're just like, let's just go.

SPEAKER_02 24:43

I mean, it's taken a lot of years, and I still get paralyzed with fear and anxiety. I just tell myself, do it and fake it till you make it. So most of the time I'm faking it. And on the inside, I am like a small child that's like trying not to cry.

SPEAKER_00 24:55

Amazing. Amazing. That's so funny. I I'm I'm a small child trying not to cry on the outside.

SPEAKER_02 25:02

You are not. You don't give yourself enough credit. You are like a vivacious. I was drawn to you at the when we first met, I was like, this girl rocks. She's confident, she's hilarious, she's smart, she's beautiful. I was like, I don't know what I gotta do, but I'm gonna be this chick's friend. Like my God, I was singing the exact same song.

SPEAKER_00 25:20

Like it's kind of crazy. Well, so it's amazing to me that you shared so quickly. Uh I because I'm the complete opposite. Again, I'm the complete opposite. Where I shared completely anonymously. That's the way that I shared my writing because I felt like I had some talent. Like I knew that I liked it and I had read enough books and I I'd been a reader for long enough that I was like, I think that I can replicate what I'm reading on a page and do it well. And so by anonymous me, I I mean I put out some fanfiction. That's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_02 25:52

Would you do what website did you do it on?

SPEAKER_00 25:54

Fanfiction.net.

SPEAKER_02 25:55

I missed this whole trend. I wish I knew about this. I I didn't know about this fanfiction.

SPEAKER_00 25:59

Well, I I feel like you were probably never a nerd like I was. Like I I loved anime. Just just this is this is like 13-year-old Lisa. Like I I really I liked that. I was into different geeky subcultures. I was I was very like into that back then. And so if you if you didn't like nerd fandom, if you weren't obsessive about a show, then you probably wouldn't have gotten into fanfiction. If you weren't obsessive about Harry Potter, you know. Well, hmm, then I don't know how you missed it. But anyway, so I put it out and I got a good enough reception that I kept it secret even longer. Like, like I people responded well, I got good reviews. People would say, like, I, you know, I can't wait to see what happens next, etc. But I had to share it anonymously. And then after that, it took me years and years and years to even tell a member of my family that I wanted to do it seriously, that I wanted to write a story. And then it took years after that to share the actual writing. So I don't know. Like, I think my advice to people like me is don't wait so long. Share sooner than you feel comfortable in general. But for people like you, I don't know what what the advice is because like sooner is like there is no sooner than immediately. But you know, I think would you advise younger Sydney to wait a little longer? Or are you happy with the way things happened? And it should just generally be like, just put it out there.

SPEAKER_02 27:36

I think just put it out there. I to me it excited me to have them excited about it, which is like what we love is when readers want to know what happens next. And probably were just being nice to me because as we all know, my first writing is actually not that good. But they I don't know this. I haven't read your first, I've told you it is. And so they, you know, I think they were just being nice, but that their enthusiasm made me enthusiastic about writing. The advice I would have though is while you're trying to find your voice and while you're trying to figure out who you are as a writer, to be careful about taking in tons of advice in terms of your writing style. Because then you start thinking, Am I I and recently I've been going through this a little bit too. I I started thinking like, well, my writing's not like as beautiful as this person, or this person's doing their writing differently. Maybe I should be more like them. And I've started I've really been tripping, like, no, you have your own voice, you have your own writing style. This is what makes you you unique. But I can find other people's voices sometimes in weak moments getting in, and and I have to push those out because I do share so much with people.

SPEAKER_00 28:40

Yeah. And my my biggest piece of advice riffs on that, which is basically it all depends on at what point in the project you're in. So if you are in the drafting part of your project, you want no one in your head. Just do it. Just get in there, get messy, make a mess, you know? Write yourself into that corner. Write all those dialogue tags exactly the way that you want to write it because you're the only one in the room and you're just there to please yourself for for the beginning. And I again, I'm always talking to perfectionists, like that that is that is what a perfectionist should do. I don't know what someone who will share immediately should do, but like generally during the drafting process, get everybody out of your head there for later.

SPEAKER_02 29:26

Although you're gonna have a different experience if you're gonna be submitting this side project to the group as you're drafting. Because I I submit to you guys my draft. Like the one I'm submitting, I haven't edited it all. It's this is rough first draft. And what I do in our writers group is I tend to just hear your ideas and decide what fits and what doesn't and have to filter it. Uh, that's because I value that so much. I talking to you guys has really saved me, I think, from getting I hate writing myself into a corner. Maybe I need to work on that. And that's like if I write myself into a corner, it is like doomsday for me.

SPEAKER_00 29:59

I'm like, no. So look, I r I said this advice months and months and months and months and months and episodes ago. I think it it's don't be afraid to write yourself into a corner because if you can think your way out of it, that's my fear. But if you can think your way out of it, you put the reader into that corner, and then it's this amazing magic trick that you actually like pull the rabbit out of the hat. Like that that is something like don't be afraid to make the the complex situation that feels really difficult. That's all. I am afraid of that.

SPEAKER_02 30:36

I'll admit that. I don't like to feel stuck, I don't want to feel lost, I don't want to feel like I'm trapped in a book, like written myself into a corner and can't find my way out. That stresses me.

SPEAKER_00 30:47

You gotta you gotta treat your plot points like your characters and be ready to kill them off. And I'm actually serious, that's that that is what creates a corner. Yeah, being in love with too much of your plot and not being willing to get rid of, you know, this character has this motivation and it's so dramatic melodramatic and amazing and stuff. It's just like give them a different backstory. That will that that will cure your the corner that you wrote yourself into, you know. Sometimes it's just like it's it because when you're writing, it's all architectural. Everything is is building off everything else, everything is dependent on everything else. And if you shift one piece, it can have a domino effect on all these other parts of your plot, loosen things up enough so that you're out of that.

SPEAKER_02 31:33

I've actually found that because I was really struggling with my midpoint in this book and like what's what's gonna I can't share much, but I was struggling with my midpoint, and I found that adding this Russian heritage really helped me prevent that corner that I was about to be written into.

SPEAKER_00 31:47

Nice. Excellent. I mean, and obviously, like being ri writing yourself into a corner when you are drafting, like when you're at the pros level of drafting your book instead of like just doing developmental bullet point lists of like this is what happens in this act versus this act. Like it's way better to be in the in the writer in in to write yourself in that corner when you're early on just like not actually like drafting like full on.

SPEAKER_02 32:13

Yeah, yeah. Cause then it's it's scary. It's like it's like that's like my you know that trend on Instagram, it's like my horror story, and then it's like no, I don't know this trend. What is this trend? Okay, it's basically like my horror movie or something, and then it's like funny things like chewing with your mouth open or enemies to lover's stroke. My my horror story is like writing myself into a corner.

SPEAKER_00 32:34

That's so funny. Well, what is my horror story? Uh now finishing my book. That's my horror story, and it's it's a constant part of my life. Wait, so let's get back on topic. We've talked about the right time to share, but there's another key component to it, which is who do you share with? When you are first starting out, giving your work to the wrong person is really detrimental. Like it can stop you in your tracks for months, it can stop you from pursuing writing as a craft in general. And I would say just like if if you are if you're tender, if you're a tender little flower, you know, pick someone that will be careful with you, I guess.

SPEAKER_02 33:18

And I would say, like, you know, I'll just share something personal here. Even though I've shared with a lot of people, I've only ever shared with people that I trust implicitly. I actually had an ex-boyfriend years and years and years ago who was very verbally and emotionally abusive. And I never he thought that my writing hobby was pathetic and you know, all the horrible things. And and I knew if he were to if I were to ever share my work with him, he would destroy it. And me in the process, uh, you know, he had already broken me down so much. And I knew that if I shared my writing with him, it would just kill me. And I went I went home, yeah. I went home to for the summer to to my grandfather's house, and I was really close to my grandfather, and he actually paid for me to go to writing conferences, and and I wish he was still here to see that I had a book deal.

SPEAKER_03 34:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:05

Before he died, he had um dementia, and I grabbed his hands and I told him I finished my book, and then he died a couple months later, and he uh was just like a father to me, so close to him. And he asked me that uh that summer, have you shared this with your partner? And I said, Oh no. And he was like, Why? And I was like, Because he would make fun of it, he would tell me it's terrible, he would make me feel really bad about it. And and then my grandfather was like, What are you doing with him? Like, this is not this is not you. And I went I went a month later back to school and I dumped him. And amazing. I and so uh that if if you're really afraid to share your work with somebody because you're afraid they're gonna destroy it in you, they probably shouldn't be in your life anymore. So that's kind of a good way to judge relationships. Like, is this someone I would share my work with? And if the answer is no, then you probably don't need to have them in your life.

SPEAKER_00 34:57

I I would definitely Okay. My knee-jerk reaction is to agree with you. If the if the situation is like that, like if if they're gonna be so there are two different situations for me. One is that, yes, absolutely, 100% I completely agree with you, they don't belong in your life, and it's a waste of time and emotion to have them there. There's another uh relationship that you can have where you uh put too much emphasis in what someone might think of your writing, and you need to reflect on the way that you perceive their criticisms or or or their compliments. Like if you if you're so hungry for this person's compliments, that's a you problem. So if they're not abusive, they're not they're not overly mean, but you are hanging on every word from them, and and it's a purely emotional relationship, you should assess within yourself why you're so dependent on that reaction from that particular person. That's what I would say. No particular person should have that level of impact on whether you believe you're a writer or not, or should continue with the craft. So that's I I like I think I'm just being pedantic where I'm like, oh, it depends on the situation, but no, I think you're right.

SPEAKER_02 36:20

You bring up a good point. And that's also something that people struggle with is they o everyone has that one person that means a lot to them, and they crave that compliment. They crave to hear that it's good. And so I can understand that you have to that you have to have the internal confidence and not rely heavily on other people for that external validation. It's like what we always come back to of like, are you a real writer? You can you it always has to come from you, it always comes back to that.

SPEAKER_00 36:45

Yes. So if you feel like you're at that part of your writing journey where anybody saying anything bad will break you completely down, that is a sign to yourself to work on your self-confidence and build yourself up a little bit more and to understand that whatever your vision is, even if everybody in the world hates it, it still has merit. And I know that that sounds a little bit like everybody gets an award. And I know that everybody's annoyed with that nowadays. But when it comes to writing and art, no one knows. It's like fashion. No one knows where where or when something is going to become extremely valuable, chic, and in vogue. That it that is a traveling spotlight. You know, you you don't you don't know when it's gonna come come on you and be like, hey, this person that writes radically dramatic dialogue tags is the best writer ever.

SPEAKER_02 37:46

You know what I mean? Like you you always know who's talking with them.

SPEAKER_00 37:50

Yes, look like that's really funny. But like, like, okay, last episode I brought up the sex pistols. I'm gonna bring them up again. So you have just like before them, spitting on your audience was the the no manager would say, spit on your audience, curse at your audience, do something disgusting on stage. But after the punk scene started up, you hear some insane stuff is happening. People are defecating on the stage, people are yes, you know, like there it is, it is a horrific scene. Like, but the thing is that it's the time for it, you know? So it's just like, yes, there's tons of advice out there. There's there's tons of uh things that people are gonna tell you to do when you should when you share your writing with them. And you always have to reserve that a little kernel of yourself that will not change no matter what they say, and be confident in that. It's okay. Like there are plenty of other things that you can change about yourself and your writing to fit the world, but you should always reserve a part of yourself that you keep sacred that you always believe in.

SPEAKER_02 38:59

I totally agree. Yeah. So let's go.

SPEAKER_00 39:03

Sorry about my soapbox. I loved it. I loved it. We're really into it.

SPEAKER_02 39:07

And I'm thinking now we should probably throw some tomatoes.

SPEAKER_00 39:10

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I I I have uh some good ones this week. I'm very excited to share them. But I always ask if I can go first, so I'm going to say, City, would you like to go first? Sure, mine's very short.

SPEAKER_02 39:22

I decided to do my classic poetic review. Ooh, okay, nice. I can't wait. I did it on Twilight because there's seven million reviews on Goodreads.

SPEAKER_01 39:32

Can you imagine? That's the absolute dream. Is it uh that's a topic for another day.

SPEAKER_02 39:40

So this person rated it one star, and then an asterisk wrote vomits aggressively. Wow. I like that. That's the review.

SPEAKER_00 39:50

Yeah, yeah. It's almost like a haiku. It doesn't follow all the all the rules of it.

SPEAKER_02 39:54

But it's so short.

SPEAKER_00 39:55

Uh-huh. It's so good.

SPEAKER_02 39:56

It captures everything. It's just like the audacity to write that after someone spent so long writing this book. I just like I do not understand these types of reviews. They really irk me.

SPEAKER_00 40:08

When you're a reader, you don't take in how much work it takes to create something like that. Like a book or a movie or or any sort of entertainment product. Okay, well, so with my with my I have two reviews, and I'm gonna do it slightly differently this week. I'm gonna read the reviews first and then reveal the book. Okay. Okay. Will I ever guess it? No, you're not gonna guess it because they're g they're they're just mean. They're mean and vague. Okay. Okay, so first review is disappointing, ghastly. Can't think of a recent work that I disliked more. The plot device is annoying, but the level of violent, disgusting imagery is way over the top. I completed this, but what a slog. Uh next one is this pissed me off. The author is trying too hard to be different. Just write a good story, dude. I only read a few chapters and spent the majority of the time trying to decipher what the hell he was saying. Worst not worst, worst book I ever read. I always like to call that. I love that. I love that. Uh gave it away. Anyway, you're not gonna guess the book. But the reason I said the or I read the reviews first was because they were reviewing 2025's Pulitzer Prize winning novel, uh, which was Angel Down by Daniel Krauss, uh, which was a horror novel, I believe. Amazing. But uh yeah, so I just like I'm kind of I'm spotlighting something. It's just like this got an incredibly prestigious award. Everyone was talking about it, obviously made this guy's career, and still a percentage of his reviews at this point are one star, two star, three star. And the last line of the of one of the reviews, I omitted it because it would give everything away, must have missed something that the Pulitzer committee found enticing. And it's just like, I you obviously did.

SPEAKER_02 41:59

Yeah. And I think too, we've we've taught talked about this before is that if you have a book that has all five star reviews, it's probably not thought-provoking or evoking emotions in people because the most uh divisive, well not divisive, but books that are gonna divide people and make them think and have a new way of thinking are gonna be ones that get tons of bad reviews because people don't like the way it makes them feel.

SPEAKER_00 42:22

Yeah. I would say that that's a definite reason for bad reviews out there.

SPEAKER_02 42:26

I have a question for you for next week. Yeah. Do we actually need, after this full day of what we've just done, do we actually need writer advice? Or is all we need are writer friends? Are we just looking for connection and not someone to be talking at us and telling us what we should be doing? You know that I have thoughts about this, Sydney. I know. I know you do. I know. You know, I have so many. I'm sure you do, and I'm sure they're very valuable, and I cannot wait to hear them. Well, we'll see about that. We'll we'll we'll see about that next week on PageRite. Rats. Well, thank you so much for listening. Please like and subscribe and connect with us on our new Instagram page, Page Fright Podcast. And we will see you back here next week. You just listened to Page Fright. Don't forget to like and subscribe and write to us at PageFrightcontact at gmail.com