Are You Manifesting Great Outcomes? | Deb Krier

What happens when life doesn’t just challenge you… it tests everything?

In Episode #35, Frank Zaccari sits down with Deb Krier, communication executive, cancer warrior, and leadership coach, who doesn’t speak from theory… she speaks from experience.

After facing multiple cancer diagnoses, life-threatening complications, and years of treatment, Deb made a decision:

She wasn’t just going to survive… she was going to lead.

This conversation goes far beyond mindset clichés. It dives into what it really means to manifest outcomes, not by wishful thinking, but through clarity, intentional leadership, and resilience under pressure.

 In this episode, you’ll discover:

• How leaders can continue to perform during personal crises 
• Why vulnerability is not weakness, it’s leadership strength 
• The importance of controlling your narrative when everything feels uncertain 
• How preparation, communication, and culture determine whether you break… or bounce back 
• Why “trying not to die” isn’t the goal, living is 

As Deb shares:

“You are in charge. You get to decide how you lead, how you respond, and how you live.”

🔗 Connect with Deb Krier:
Website: YourCancerWarrior.com
Support Initiative: tryingnottodie.live
Coaching: yourcancercoach.live
LinkedIn & Facebook: Search Deb Krier

This is more than a podcast.
It’s a reminder that leadership isn’t proven when things are easy…

It’s revealed when everything is on the line.

Are you manifesting great outcomes… or just reacting to circumstances?

#Leadership #Resilience #BounceBack #MindsetMatters #ExecutiveLeadership #PersonalGrowth #TrustTheProcess #CancerAwareness

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Have you ever felt stuck in pain, loss, or failure? Wondering how to rise when life knocks you down again, then bounce back is for you. So gather your resilience, hold tight to hope, and get ready to reimagine what's possible in your life. So here's your host, Frank Sakari.

SPEAKER_02 0:30

Welcome to Bounce Back and Business and in Life. Today, we're gonna dive into one of the most real and the least talk about challenges in leadership. That is, how do you lead an organization while managing a personal health crisis? Just think about that. And let's be honest, leadership is not tested when everything is going right. It's tested when your world is falling apart. And the people are still looking at you for the answers. So let me ask you this. What happens when the leader becomes a patient? When the people everyone depends on is the one fighting a personal health battle. How do you lead your organization while managing this issue? Let's find out. My guest today is Deb Cryer. She doesn't discuss theory. She's living with her own personal crisis. And she's showing leaders how they can continue to lead and undergo medical treatment. Deb, welcome to Bounce Back in Business and Life.

SPEAKER_01 1:38

Well, thank you, Frank. I am so honored to be here to be able to share this important story with your listeners.

SPEAKER_02 1:44

And this is important because it's something that's hidden. We don't want to admit it. We don't want to talk about it. So, Deb, you're a very successful communication executive. Tell us the journey and how this diagnosis and how you found out and the impact it's had on your life.

SPEAKER_01 1:59

Great. Well, I'll give you the reader's digest version because it got far more complicated than we had planned on. But I was running my marketing communications business. It's called Wise Women Communications, going along just fine. Went for my annual checkup, had my mammogram, and was called and told I needed to come back. Now they don't say there's a problem, they just say you need to come back, right? Now I worked for an oncologist and I worked for the American Cancer Society. So I know just enough to be dangerous. And so I went back, had my mammogram redone. They called my primary care doc, called and said that I had microcalcifications. Now, even with my background, I didn't know what that was. And so I turned to Dr. Google, and I always want to warn folks be very careful about that. Dr. Google is good, but Dr. Google will also give you so much information that it will freak you out. But microcalcifications, I discovered, are things that every woman over a certain age gets as we age and the hormones in our bodies change. They're teeny tiny little specks. In fact, the human eye could not see it. This was almost 11 years ago, and so this was before AI was assisting. But the computer saw it. And most of the time, obviously, there are no issues. But with me, the little teeny tiny specks had started to gather. And so what I was diagnosed with was stage zero, which is considered pre-cancer. Hey, we just need to watch this breast cancer. I did get a surgeon, did not get an oncologist because everybody said, hey, you don't need one. And so eventually, several months later, though, we did do some tests and determined that we did surgery for uh to check the lymph nodes. And eight of 12 lymph nodes were positive for cancer. So that meant that I went from stage zero to stage three, just plunk, right? And so then I did get an oncologist, you know, because it was like, uh-oh. Met with her. I decided to do the traditional route of treatment, which I felt and still feel is the best for me, but it is obviously a very personal choice. So I was going to do chemo surgery radiation. My first chemo was massive. It was eight different drugs because these little speaky spots were floating throughout my body. And I got a complication that happens less than 1% of the time. And, you know, luckily, my oncologist had someone that she had dealt with that had this, rushed me to the hospital. Initially, I was I had sepsis, but then I did go into septic shock. And that usually is fatal about 75% of the time because it attacks your organs. But even though the surgeon did not want to operate because he said it was a waste of time, I was going to die that day. The oncologist, I know, I was like, excuse me, I can hear you. And but the oncologist insisted and obviously prevailed. And so they were able to do the surgery. I spent seven weeks in the hospital, in and out of surgeries, in and out of ICU, all sorts of really fun things. Then, you know, was doing better, obviously, and opted to, as I'd said, have the surgery. I had a double mastectomy without reconstruction, but I got a complication from that the doctor had never seen. Yeah, right. I'm special. And then obviously healed from that, got sepsis one more time because we did think, well, maybe we should try chemo, tried a totally different regime, but chemo does not like my body. And so ended up back in the hospital again and then sailed through radiation. I had absolutely no difficulties with radiation, which they were surprised at, not only because I'm me, but I am a red-headed, freckly kid. And radiation can cause burning, especially in people who are very fair-skinned. So yeah, I had no issues with that at all. The most of the time I continued working, and we'll talk a little bit about how you deal with some of those things. But, you know, it's been a bumpy journey the last 10 and a half years. I did develop two other cancers that were totally unrelated. One is basal cell carcinoma, which is scary as that sounds, that's your basic garden variety skin cancer. You know, like I said, the red-headed freckly kid. I also grew up in Colorado at over an elevation of 8,000 feet and did not know what sunscreen was. And so they were actually really surprised that I was in my 60s before I had an issue. And then several years ago, I developed uh thyroid cancer, and it is a different cancer. So three totally separate cancers. But I worked, like I said, almost the entire time.

SPEAKER_02 6:38

Wow. Again, you're one of the very few people that is at three different bouts with three different top same people, talk to people who've had the same one multiple times.

SPEAKER_01 6:48

Right, right. Or miss a metastatic, a spread, things like no, no. I'm like I say, I'm special. I'm the overachiever.

SPEAKER_02 6:57

Oh my goodness. This is crazy. So I've been spoken to you and just listened to you again. I know you're not someone who throws in the towel, obviously. Right. And you uh started moving forward. And uh last time we spoke, you said you had an organization call in. Try not to die. Tell us what that is.

SPEAKER_01 7:16

So it's trying not to die. And that came about because we get so caught up, especially when we are very ill, in trying to not die, that we forget that we have to live. Even when it's hard, when it's rough, when you're thinking, oh, I'm circling that drain. I mean, my husband was told three different times that I would not make it. But we have to continue living for whatever period of time we have, you know, and and so how are we going to do that in a way that is most beneficial to ourselves?

SPEAKER_02 7:52

Exactly. What does this uh site do?

SPEAKER_01 7:55

It provides support to anyone who is on a cancer journey. It's an initiative. I don't know that I'll ever make it a nonprofit. That's a lot of different work, but it is for anyone who is on a cancer journey, whether they themselves have cancer or if they know someone who does. One of the biggest questions I get is my spouse, my coworker, my friend has cancer, and I don't know what to do.

SPEAKER_03 8:20

Right.

SPEAKER_01 8:20

And so we work with folks again to help them through this journey, however long it's going to be, and to help people support them in the best possible way.

SPEAKER_02 8:30

Well, what I've noticed is when someone discovers that a friend or family member has cancer, they tend to back away.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

Right. Oh yeah. They ghost you.

SPEAKER_02 8:40

Because they just don't know what to do or what to say. They don't want to offend you. And then they have that look, that look of pity, which just crazy, correct?

SPEAKER_01 8:49

Right, right. You know, and that's one of the things that people who, you know, had dropped off the face of the earth told me. They said, We just didn't know what to do. We didn't want to make you feel worse. We didn't want to make you feel bad. We didn't know if you even wanted to talk about it. And I said, Well, it's like this. Hallmark has cards, and I still have all of the cards that were sent to me, but it's easy to say, I'm really sorry this is happening to you. Then the person can decide if they're going to go further into that conversation. They may just say thank you and go on, or they might decide to talk a little bit more about it. But you know, it reminds me of a time when I was talking with someone who had lost a child. Now, I have not had children, but I know there's no grief like that, especially young children, right? You know, parents are not supposed to outlive their children. And he told me, and it had been quite a long time since that child had passed, but he said, no one ever speaks of that child. And he said it's like they never existed. And so, you know, I do try and say, I'm I'm really sorry that happened. And then again, they can go wherever they want with it, but yet not talking about it doesn't mean it didn't happen.

SPEAKER_02 10:04

Exactly. I was a medic in the Air Force back during the Vietnam War.

SPEAKER_01 10:08

Thank you for your service.

SPEAKER_02 10:09

Well, thank you. And you saw a lot of death. And in those moments, it was just listen, just be there. Just be there. Some of them recovered, thank God. But it was just in those moments that you're just there, just sitting, didn't say a word. But we just sat.

SPEAKER_01 10:27

Yeah, people who came either to my hospital room or at my house and just sat, and part of that was I would fall asleep and you know, things like that. But you know, I tell people go and take a meal if they want, but sit, have their favorite TV program on, their favorite music, whatever, and just sit with them. Let them decide how to interact. Because, yeah, sometimes just having somebody there is precious and golden.

SPEAKER_02 10:58

Absolutely. Now let's stay on that topic here. Now we hear all the time about transparency. Let everybody know what's going on. Right. So when you're in a situation and you're a leader, what should be shared and what doesn't need to be shared with your team? How do you go about that?

SPEAKER_01 11:13

Well, obviously it's a personal choice, you know, and I'm being who I am, very open about everything. But what you want to do is you want to control that narrative. And my background includes corporate communication and employee communication. And so I know that when you don't communicate and there's a vacuum, people make it up. And they never make it up in a good way, right? You know, it could be, oh, he's looking a little rough every morning. Maybe he's been drinking at night. You know, and and obviously there are times where there are very obvious signs. You know, if you've lost your hair, had surgery, you know, things like that. But you want to control that narrative, and you can disclose as much or as little as you want. I know people who have said, I'm going through a health crisis, I'll let you know what you need to know, but I need your help. And that's the thing. You want to empower your people to step up and you want them to feel like they can help. And let's be honest, if they go, oh, okay, and they really don't care, do you want to be working with them?

unknown 12:21

Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:22

Exactly. Someone I went to high school with was this assistant superintendent in a school district in Kansas. And when she discovered she had cancer, she wasn't gonna tell anybody. I'm just I'm just gonna write it out. I'm just gonna and then the superintendent said to her, You probably need to open up to some people here. Let's talk about making an education process because what are you gonna say when you lose your hair?

SPEAKER_01 12:49

Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:49

I mean, people are gonna notice that you can do everything you want physically and build up your strength and your stamina as much as possible. But there are gonna be signs, they're gonna happen. And when we spoke before, you said you coach people how to lead with strength. Right while not pretending everything is fine. What do you tell them?

SPEAKER_01 13:10

You know, well, first of all, to me, fine is a four-letter word that starts with F. You know, it's good. We tell the the you know, the person at McDonald's when they say how you doing, oh, I'm fine. That's okay. But when someone you work with, work for, all of those, you know, care about when they say how you doing, now you don't have to give them every single detail. I don't give every single detail. But you can say, I'm doing okay, or I'm having a rough day. Here's what I need. I tell people when they ask me how you doing, I say, I'm hunky dory. And everybody knows if I don't say hunky dory, there's probably something that's going on. But yeah, it's okay. It's really okay. You know, you mentioned leading through strength. Sometimes the biggest strength you can have is to be vulnerable and to ask for help. And I think that is so important for people to know. It doesn't mean that you are weak, a lesser person, a lesser leader, any of those things. It means that you value them and you value what they can do, whether it's help you with a report, lead a team meeting, go meet with a client, or again, just sit with you. That's okay. It's okay to let them do that because it's a benefit to them to be able to help you too. We all feel good when we help someone else, so why not let them do that?

SPEAKER_02 14:40

That's exactly right. One of the things that that I learned coming through the channels was the more you explain to people what needs to be done, and then ask them, have I missed anything? And let get them engaged in the development. So when you come in and you do have a crisis like this, they're accustomed to stepping up, correct?

SPEAKER_01 15:02

Right. You know, you hired them, whether they're a true employee, VA, whatever it is, for their knowledge and their skills. So let them show those, you know, and it's one of the things that we do is so many times we will say, Oh, Frank, just tell us if you need anything. And we mean well, right? We really do mean well. And we're there to help. But when you're going through a health crisis, your brain has shorted out. You are thinking, you know, am I gonna make it through today? Am I gonna see my kids' graduation? You know, how am I gonna survive this? All those various things. And so when you're vague like that, we can't answer. So be specific. You know, if it's somebody you work with and you know some things they're working on, offer to help on those specific things. They can always say no, but you know, they know that you want to help. And even if they say no, they might say, well, I don't need help with that report, but oh, I do need help with something else. You know, and and we, of course, as the person going through this, we don't want to bother people. Oh, you know. Um, we don't want to seem like we're whining, complaining. You know, we often do not ask for help. And I tell people, you know, you really need to ask for help to say, here's what I need, whether it's personal or professional. I had to ask people to go to the grocery store for me. I actually got COVID. That was really fun. Didn't have a very bad case, but I got COVID. And my doctor, he said, you know, because you had one of the complications I got was uh blood clots in my lungs. And he said, because of that, we're worried a little bit more that you could develop pneumonia. I want you to get one of those doohickeys, pulse oxometer, I think is what they call it, the go on your finger, right? That measure. And he said, just go to CVS or Walgreens. And I'm thinking, okay, first of all, I got COVID, so I'm probably not supposed to go out of the house. And I didn't feel like it. And so I asked my neighbors, you know, could you go? Now the nice thing is Amazon and various other things deliver. But sometimes you need just one little thing. You know, maybe it's I need ice cream. I really need ice cream right now. Ask people, you know, tell them that's what you need. And again, they then have the opportunity to say yes or no.

SPEAKER_02 17:18

That's outstanding. It's sometimes just little stuff. Like, who would have thought of that?

SPEAKER_01 17:22

Oh, yeah. When I was in the hospital the first time for so long, my doctor came in. Now I had, like I said, multiple surgeries. And so my brain got very fuzzy. It actually still is fuzzy on occasion. You know, I'll blame it on anesthesia and age, right? But one of the things my doctor said, she said, Are you reading anything? No, I couldn't, I could not focus. And she said, I don't care if all you're doing is reading People Magazine. Get your brain going by reading. And so I sent somebody down to the gift shop, right? You know, go get me a couple magazines. Please, and thank you. You know, we want to remember those words, those are very important. But yeah, you know, little things are gonna make a big difference whether it's a magazine, ice cream, whatever.

SPEAKER_02 18:06

Now, so many small organizations they work on the word of mouth process management, right? And when we spoke last time, you talked about empowerment and delegation and the importance of written details. How do you explain that to small business owners who are used to just doing everything?

SPEAKER_01 18:24

And it lives all in our head, you know, all of the processes, everything we do. And just as good business practice, we need to have things written down. We need business continuity plans. And really, if it's even just you, maybe it's one page that somebody can follow to go, okay, here's their bank account, here are their vendors, that whatever it is. But get those things written down. It's also some crisis management planning, the what happens if, and we should have those. You know, I live close enough to the coast here in Atlanta where sometimes, you know, we are affected by hurricanes. Obviously, if you are much closer to the coast, a hurricane could happen. So, what happens to your business if, say, the power's off for a week? We really saw it during COVID when you know so many companies went, okay, we'll send our employees home. That was a great idea, but oh, they don't have laptops. And you know, things like that. Just plan those things out. If you cannot pay your bills, who is going to pay them for you? Now, there are some people who say, I don't care, I'll be gone. Well, no, you know, be be kind to the people that worked with you. And so have those things written down and other things like your passwords. One of the things that that we discovered was an issue when I was so sick, I paid all the bills and I did it all electronically, right? Um, that's great, except my computer is password protected. And so my husband couldn't get in to even do that. You know, it does get a little bit tricky now that a lot of things are done with your face, with your thumbprint, all of those various things. But those systems all do still have backup ways that you can get in using a password, two-factor authentication, all those various things. So just make sure that people know those.

SPEAKER_02 20:15

Yeah, one of the things that that I saw when I was we're going to small companies who are failing. It wasn't that the leader was dying, but the company was dying. Was how do we do this? What's the process here? And then we'll go talk to John. Well, where's John? John's not here today.

SPEAKER_01 20:32

Yeah, John went on vacation.

SPEAKER_02 20:34

Yes. What if John gets hit by a truck tomorrow? Right? And it's forcing. How do you convince them to not to force them? How do you convince them the importance of having procedures documented so people can step in and say, Yes, I know what to do here. Here's what we need.

SPEAKER_01 20:50

Well, you do need to kind of do the worst case scenario conversation with them. Now, for some people, they're gonna, they're ostriches, right? That's never going to happen to us. So maybe the worst case scenario isn't the worst case. Maybe it's okay, John goes on vacation for a week. Who can do John's job while he's gone? One of the things that people always fear is okay, if I write it down and someone else does it, oh, they might decide they don't need me. And whether you're, you know, a support person or the leader, that could happen, right? But, you know, and and of course now we have this lovely thing called AI. Uh, you know, and and that that does get things scary. But the company business, you know, that organization, whatever, they need your brain. They need you as that person. You know, so they're probably not gonna say, okay, well, we don't need you at all. You know, and and so yeah, let them know. And and the worst case scenario is hey, you want to go on vacation. You know, you just won the lottery and you're gonna go on a two month cruise, but you still want to have your business function while you're gone. How do you do that? And If you're one person shop, there are still some things that need to be done, even so that you can maybe just go and not be bothered on a weekend, you know. So automating like your email responses, you know, things like that. Because we do want to have a good life also.

SPEAKER_02 22:17

One of the things you said to me before was you don't have to be invincible to be a great leader. Right. But you have to be intentional.

SPEAKER_01 22:24

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 22:24

Elaborate on that.

SPEAKER_01 22:26

You know, you think through these things. We've all worked for the people who just they don't plan. They, you know, whatever happens, happens. And that's exciting, but it's scary. And that is then where if something bad happens, it becomes catastrophic. Yes, I am a type A personality. I've always planned on the, you know, hit by bus theory. If something happened to me, could somebody pick up and do whatever it was? You know, that I even if it's just like a volunteer position. But, you know, it's okay to plan and have things written out. And that's where AI really can help you do some of these things. You know, and even if you're just talking to it, one of my friends now has one of these really fancy cars that he can carry on a conversation with his AI as he's driving. Okay. What if you talk through? Here's how I do invoicing, and AI just puts it out step by step and then you've got it written down. And I do recommend, because things happen, have printed copies of these things. Don't depend on it being on the cloud or on your server or wherever. If it's important, it does need to be printed out and maybe in multiple locations.

SPEAKER_02 23:39

Exactly. Having been in the military, one of the things that they would teach is we would train and train and train and train for things that were never gonna happen. But in the unlikely event it did happen, it avoided panic. And when you come in as a leader, as a manager, owner, whatever, and I have cancer, or I have whatever I have, right? A good friend of our family is a Supreme Court justice in Arizona, and he's had uh cerebral palsy like almost his entire life. And he walked, he now has a scooter, and he's got slurred voice, slurred speech, and everything. But but he's already in front of the Supreme Court and walking out.

SPEAKER_01 24:20

His brain is still a hundred percent.

SPEAKER_02 24:23

Exactly. And he is the master at documenting everything. And he talked into a system at his house. Here's the key, here's here's the the alarm, here's and he gives it the trusted people, obviously. Here's how we get to work, this is the path that I take to work, here's how I usually park the car, here's how I this is the door I can't get through with the scooter, right? That type of thing. And then all the procedures for his clerks. Here's what we have, whatever we have. And I've been in his office, I was in Arizona last week, and the people who work for him say, This is the easiest job I've ever had. Right.

SPEAKER_01 25:02

And it opens them up then to be doing other things because they were able to quickly do whatever that task was, as opposed to what do you do? Right? They did it, they were done, they moved on to the next thing, you know, and and so be kind to the people who work with you by having everything written down like that.

SPEAKER_02 25:24

And the what companies that would come in and take over, something you would need to be done, and the person wasn't there and nobody wrote it down. And so now they're reinventing the wheel every time, and now they're changing the process. And now we got John's process and we got Frank's process, and which process is right. And now what do we do? How do we get this done? How do we get this accomplished?

SPEAKER_01 25:45

Right. And it's important when you're doing all of this to talk to people at every level, get everything. Went in and did some crisis management planning for a very large company. And this was, you know, 20 years ago. So before people paid online, and this was a life insurance company. And so when time came for premiums, you wrote out your check, which I know some of your listeners don't even know what the heck those things are now. But you wrote out your check and you mailed it in. And so we were talking with this company and we discovered that one of the most critical functions in the entire company was the mailroom. Because somebody needed to get those checks and at least get them somewhere secure so that, you know, at some point then they could be deposited. But yeah, somebody needed oh, they just thought that was the greatest thing in the world, that they were that important. But yeah, you know, think about those things. Is there a report that needs to be filed somewhere? And what date does it need to be filed? Again, bills, you know, when when are bills due? Who are they being paid? All of those various things. Bank accounts, you know, many companies have more than one bank account. You know, payroll, one of the really important things. Who does that? You know, granted, a lot of things are automated, but still write that down because you never know when something could happen.

SPEAKER_02 27:08

I've seen this happen so many times where I don't know what to do. Or or or people leave, even wait. Right. The person who knows what to do.

SPEAKER_01 27:17

Yeah, that that critical person goes bye-bye.

SPEAKER_02 27:20

Yeah, I've had enough. And they move on. And you haven't created to me, it seems like it's a culture issue. Do I create a culture where I'm including people and then I can leverage the strength of everybody rowing in the same direction? Right. Is that what you preach?

SPEAKER_01 27:38

Yes, you know, and one of the things that we hear a lot of are your sales team. They don't document a lot because they don't want somebody coming in and taking over. Well, that's great, but they're not that person's clients. They are the company clients. And so you mentioned culture. It needs to be explained at the very start. You will document every conversation, whatever you have with the client, and and not document as in talk to Frank today. It's talk to Frank about X, Y, Z. Here's what we agreed upon, blah, blah, blah. Because again, best case scenario is they want to take a vacation. Well, do they want their clients to be stuck in limbo while they're on vacation? No. And so it's okay for them to share that information and reassure them, hey, we're not all gonna go in and look, you know, all these things. But yeah, it belongs to the company and not to that person. That's something that needs laid out right at the very start, even in the interview process, maybe.

SPEAKER_02 28:44

Yeah, that I found that to be real important when I got out of high check and had an insurance agency. My staff, they used to hate me in the beginning. But I'd say every conversation you have gets recorded in comments. What is who you speak to? What did you talk about? What did what was the result? And they would complain, you've got so much to do. God, Frank, this is too much. But you're not there, and somebody calls in, or somebody sends a text message or an email. Someone else can go in and look and say, Oh, yeah, you spoke to Karen on the stage, and this is what we had said that needed to be done. Now, has that could have been accomplished yet? Or have you been and then your level of service goes up radically when multiple people can find the answer.

SPEAKER_01 29:26

And sometimes our own memories fail. You know, hey, I talked to Sue three weeks ago. What did we talk about? And Sue remembers, and Sue remembers you offered her a 50% discount, and you're like, I don't think I did, but I didn't write it down.

SPEAKER_02 29:47

Right. Or what's the deadline for this payment and all that all those fun stuff because everybody has their own recollection of what it means and whatever.

SPEAKER_01 29:56

It it helps the clients too, right? Because that you've documented and you're protecting them.

SPEAKER_02 30:02

And also, does it help with your customers that they know you're having a health issue, but you've got things in place, so they don't just jump shit.

SPEAKER_01 30:13

And that client conversation was the hardest thing that I had to deal with because I'm a one-person shop. You know, and and I knew that when I told my clients, hey, this is what's happening, I was gonna get probably one of three answers. The first option was you can't do the work, therefore you're fired.

SPEAKER_03 30:30

Right.

SPEAKER_01 30:31

Right? You know, because they need the work done. The second option could have been, we want you to focus on yourself, so we're gonna hire somebody else. Same concept, right? But different at my clients, and I was very fortunate, took the third option. What can we do to help you? Now, granted, what I do is I do marketing, I do social media, and so if that kind of dropped through the cracks for a little bit, it was not gonna be catastrophic. And they did have in-house people, but it comes back to what we were talking about earlier, communication. Ten and a half years out, I'm still in treatment. I go in every 21 days and I lose a day or two. My clients know that during that day or two, they might not hear from me. And so it's just a matter of communicating with the clients also as to what the expectations are.

SPEAKER_02 31:21

Well, I think once they if you've created this culture again and you've created that connection with your co-workers and your customers, it takes off so much of the pressure of dealing with being sick.

SPEAKER_01 31:36

Right. You know, and you might need to say, here is the backup plan, here's who you're gonna work with during that time. You know, maybe you have, again, my example, marketing firm. Maybe I have a partnership with another marketing firm that for a month is going to support them. Now, obviously that's you know, that's kind of a different case scenario, but yeah, you want to provide the best support to your clients. And so how can you do that? Just kind of think through some of those scenarios. And and there's so much that can be done in advance, you know, say social media, great example. You can schedule posts. So, you know, schedule those posts, get those out there. Maybe you're providing support to a meeting they're gonna have next month. Well, what can you do in advance for that? That's just good pre business practice anyway. You know, get it done, get it out of the way, revise it if you need to, but get it done and get it out of the way. It's gonna help both you and the client.

SPEAKER_02 32:30

Right. And that's something you can do even if you're not sick. And if you're not battling something, again, that's just good practice anywhere. Well, Deb, what last words of wisdom, and you've given a lot, do you want to leave with the listeners around the world here today?

SPEAKER_01 32:43

You know, the biggest thing that I tell people is you are in charge. You get to pick your treatment, you get to decide what you're going to do, you get to decide if your business is going to continue, you get to decide how you're going to communicate, all those various things. Now, you know, there are some little caveats with some legalities, but you know, you still get to be the person who is in charge. Don't let anybody else default to, you know, telling you what to do. And that's especially true when you're choosing your treatment. That person in that white coat is not God. You know, yes, they're very, very smart, but you still get to say, nah, I don't like that. Or you know, I fired uh physicians during this whole time. I fired three because they did not match with what I wanted to go with. And you know, just tell them you're a great doctor, you're just not the doctor for me. But yeah, you are in charge and you have to advocate for yourself always.

SPEAKER_02 33:45

How can people reach you down?

SPEAKER_01 33:47

The easiest way is go to your cancer warrior.com and then if that's just a landing page, it will link you to the two sites. One is trying not to die.live. If you are interested in working with me as a senior leader dealing with this, it links you to your cancercoach.live. And so those are the easiest ways. You can find me on LinkedIn, you can find me on Facebook. I am one of the few Deb Careers in the entire world. So if you Google and find me, I'm the one with the red hair.

SPEAKER_02 34:19

Yeah. And very distinctive red hair, folks.

SPEAKER_01 34:22

It's it is distinctive. Yep.

SPEAKER_02 34:25

Very distinctive. Well, we're just about out of time, Deb. I want to thank you again for showing us that real leaders can continue to operate at high levels despite serious injuries, serious illnesses, or serious catastrophes. And remember, folks, as Deb told us, remember to keep living. Now, the key when you find ourselves in that position is to work with someone like Deb who's been where you are and knows what you're going through and can guide you along the way. Now, let me leave you with this. None of us are in this alone. And the secret to walking on water is to know where the rocks are. And today, Deb showed us where many, many of those rocks are. And together, we're going to find more of those rocks and bounce back better than ever with this podcast. So share this message with a friend and please subscribe. Again, Deb, thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 35:15

Thank you. So that's it for today's episode of Bounce Back. Head on over to Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen and subscribe to the show. One lucky listener every single week who posts a review on Apple Podcasts or iTunes will win a chance the grand prize drawing to win a ten thousand dollar private VIP day with Frank himself. Be sure to head on over to Bounceback Podcast.com and pick up a free copy of Frank's gift. And join us on the next episode.