From Rock Bottom to Running Recovery

In this episode of The Law of Cassidy, I sit down with Brooke Shaw and Olivia Jorgensen — two recovered addicts, co-hosts of You’re Not Drunk Friend, and co-founders of Ignite Recovery.

What makes this conversation so powerful is that the center they now run came from the same recovery world that helped change their lives.

We talk about:
💋what addiction actually looked like behind the scenes
💋growing up in Utah and the stigma around drinking and recovery
💋trauma, shame, motherhood, marriage, and coping
💋what sober sex is really like
💋the difference between surviving and actually healing
💋why addiction doesn’t discriminate
💋how they went from rock bottom to helping others recover

This episode is raw, honest, emotional, and deeply important. If you or someone you love is struggling, send them this.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

So you know what's interesting is I'm sitting here and I'm hearing these stories, right? And like we talk about like lives are on fire, like we all have shit, right? Um, I've had probably I'm gonna cry, um, one of the hardest years of my life. And in my marriage, shock, I'm still married. Like I love that man, but um, I lost some friends that really were my people um in a business dynamics, like lots of money lost, like me carrying my household right now because Josh is also an entrepreneur and I said I got this, you know. And isn't it funny? Like, I you hear people where you say, like, people who are addicts choose to be addicts. I don't know if I believe that because here we are in a very similar dynamic, right? And I could cope with drinking. Absolutely, you know what I mean? But in my stress situations, maybe it's the candy, maybe I'm addicted to candy.

SPEAKER_00 0:56

Girl, after hours, me and candy have a different kind of role. Like it could be worse. Maybe that's it, but I've never, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 1:03

Like it's that's why I truly believe that there's a situation there that we need to be a little more open and less judgmental and realize that it is a it it is like a disease, and some people just have it in them. And coping with helping those people and like understanding that I I don't get it, right? Me being complete, I'm like, I've never what do you mean you were in your car?

SPEAKER_02 1:27

What do you mean? You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 1:29

Like I'm like, I never have coped that way. I guess I just eat candy, but like literally, I shouldn't joke like that, but I'm sitting here processing and I'm like, we are very similar. Welcome back to The Law of Cassidy. Today I have two women who are doing something I deeply respect. I actually know both of them in two different ways, which is kind of interesting that we're ending up in this spot together combined, is one. So, Brooke, I call you Brooke Rose Shaw, but is it Brooke Shaw? Is it Brooke?

SPEAKER_01 2:04

Yeah, I mean legally it's Brooke Rose Shaw.

SPEAKER_03 2:06

Okay, I just see the rose, and I'm like, yeah, I see that too. Okay, and then Olivia Jorgensen are both recovered addicts. Congratulations. That's an awesome, awesome feat. I think that's so amazing. I can't wait to get into this. Um, you guys are co-hosts of your own podcast, You're not a drunk friend, which I love that name, and co-founders of Ignite Recovery. Yes. Yes. So, but here's what makes their story unlike anything else. So it sounds like the center you now run was formerly Renaissance Ranch. Yep. And it was the same outpatient program that helped save both your lives. Yes.

SPEAKER_05 2:40

So I actually was not, I did not go to Renaissance Ranch. Okay. Um, I was at uh LDS hospitals where I went, but these guys went to Renaissance Ranch and I just met them. I met Brooke through a good friend of Dane who I've known since first grade. Um, he introduced me to Brooke, and it was kind of funny because it was like instant connection. We just clicked always, yeah, we just clicked.

SPEAKER_01 3:03

We well, and it's interesting because I guess to kind of jump into it, I had gone through a point in my recovery in my life where I was just selling businesses, cutting off friendships, doing just cleaning out house.

SPEAKER_00 3:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:20

And I got done dirty by some of the closest people in my life. And so I've had these huge walls and guards up towards other women, maybe like Olivia could feel that when we very first met each other. Not that I was like intentionally putting a wall up by any means, but it was a very real quick connection where you're like, we've known each other in past lives, we've lived some of the most similar, scary situations. And she's like, you can trust me.

SPEAKER_05 3:56

Yeah, it's just comfortable. Like it's always weird getting in a car and driving somewhere where you don't know someone, but it's just like we never like we don't ever skip a beat. It's weird.

SPEAKER_03 4:05

It is we'll get into, but yeah, that's I mean, if anybody gets that girl, it's me. Yeah, yeah. I literally so we're gonna go over their childhoods, what shaped them before addiction, um, what addiction actually looked like for each of you, uh, full circle moment about taking over the center, like how that happened. Um, why sober sex is real fucking weird at first. We're gonna talk about that. Is that okay? Yeah. Okay, cool. I'm excited. Um, the shame of living in Utah and dealing with this, so a lot of good stuff. So I want to warm up so people can kind of get to know you guys. And like I said, I know them from two different angles. I was trying to think of it like high school. Yeah. And then I did that party at your cute salon that was on 25th. Yep. Which no longer doing that. So that okay. And then through Anna Lise.

SPEAKER_01 4:55

Is that what it was through Anna Lise? I think, I think so, isn't it? I think so. Okay. Yeah. And that's in the parties.

SPEAKER_03 5:03

And I remember I did a party at Ashley's house back when she lived in like the old like historian Ogden. Yeah. So yeah, interesting. That's so crazy. Weird connections. Okay. So I'm just gonna ask these random, like get to know you, like also funny questions. So like warm it up. So first thing you do every morning sober that you never did hung over.

SPEAKER_05 5:25

First thing I do every morning, um, I always say a prayer and I do my gratitude list. That's like the first thing that when I wake my eyes, open my eyes, is I always say five things I'm grateful for, whether I'm just saying it, whether I'm writing it down, and I always ask um for me, my higher power, guide me in the direction that you want me to go.

SPEAKER_01 5:44

Love that. Brooke. Yeah, absolutely the same thing. I think that comes hand in hand with sobriety is your gratitude. And the days that I don't do that, wake up, say my prayer, do my gratitude. It's a shitty day. Well, I need to start doing that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 6:03

Is there a process? Teach me your ways. I need to pray and just write down. Do you just have like a notebook?

SPEAKER_05 6:08

Like a yeah, I just so I do AA, I do meetings every morning at 6 30 a.m. Honey's Breakfast Club, and we just do it on uh Zoom. So it is, I do it every morning because it's a good reminder of where my life used to be. And, you know, we have newcomers, we have people that have been sobriety for sober for 35 years, people that have been sober for 30 days, for however long it is. And you just always you are remembered because we tell our stories, everyone speaks. We usually have a group of like 30 to 40 people, and it's just that good reminder of where I don't want to go again and how fast you can lose sobriety if you're not working on yourself on a constant basis. Makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 6:49

I have a little book and it because I have to have something guided towards, you know, not just like an open journal, and it says, you like write the date down, and then it has like a positive quote, and then it says, um, three things I'm grateful for, three things I'm looking forward to doing today or want to accomplish today, and then like a positive affirmation. So I'll write, you know, something different every morning, and then at the end of the day, it says three things that made today great. And I usually do that the next morning before I fill out the next day, so I can reflect on, you know, by the end of the night, I'm like, yeah, I'm not writing it like you're at all, you know. But I've loved that one. I'll send you the link. It's just on Amazon. I love that.

SPEAKER_03 7:34

I think even somebody who hasn't been through something like you have, like me, just the daily stresses of being stressed about, I don't know, our lives being on fire. Like you said earlier, our lives are always on fire. Yeah, it really is.

SPEAKER_05 7:44

And it's that I I do a lot of podcasts and a lot of um listening and a lot of reading of books and stuff on self-help. And one thing that stuck out to me that is so relatable is you physically cannot be in stress and gratitude at the same time. So choose your poison. Like, and it's as simple as that.

unknown 8:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 8:01

Like when I start getting stressed out, immediately, you know, um, I'll just make this short and sweet. My house flooded in my kitchen. My kitchen's completely torn out, and there is not been, this has been four weeks. And this is like right when we took over. Right when we took over Ignite. Yeah, I mean, everything was up in flames, and I didn't even, I didn't even, I didn't even bat an eye about it because the first thing I thought about is are my kids healthy? Are the people that surround me healthy? Am I healthy? Yeah. If all three of those boxes are checked, nothing else matters. This is trivial, this is stuff that'll get fixed, this is future stuff. I don't have to worry about it. Where is my life today? What do I have to be grateful for? I can manage with no kitchen. Yeah, I'm fine.

SPEAKER_03 8:42

So I mean, DoorDash is a thing, right?

SPEAKER_05 8:44

Yes, and there's a lot of that going on.

SPEAKER_03 8:46

Yeah, perfect. Okay, most used emoji right now.

SPEAKER_01 8:50

Oh boy. Um, I use the flame heart right now. Yeah, you do use the flame heart a lot. The flame heart is flamin'. I've never used that. I know, neither had I until recently. And I was like, I just like it because it's like just a little extra bang. Yeah, extra.

SPEAKER_05 9:07

Mine's pretty simple. I just use the heart. I love like instead of you know giving a thumbs up that I just got a message, I always love to heart it. Like it means something significant. Mine's probably the eggplant emoji. Just kidding.

SPEAKER_03 9:18

I just no way it was this one, which I didn't even know it was this. I thought it was something else. And then I realized and I was like, oh my gosh, wow, we learned something every day. Okay. Um, what do most people get wrong about sober people?

SPEAKER_01 9:34

Ooh, that's a good one. That is a good one. You should have let us read over these. Um, just kidding.

SPEAKER_05 9:41

I would say we kind of talked about this today on the on the podcast, the the stigma around addiction. And that we have all these character defects, and those character defects, when you are in the middle of addiction, I mean, we all have character defects, right? But when you're in the middle of addiction, those character defects, there is a light on each and every one of those. And you are manipulative and you are a cheat and you are a liar, and you are all of these things. But when you get sober, you change, you completely change into a different person. You are not the same person that you were before you started drinking or using, and you're not the same person as when you were a kid. And those changes, I mean, the changes that occur just within my life, where I can see where I was 10 years ago to compare to where I'm at today and the way I feel about myself, that is what changes so much. And I think we have this stigma on addiction of, you know, yeah, this person that was addicted to alcohol, let's say they robbed a bank, they're still a piece of shit because they robbed a bank. Well, they were in the middle of addiction. And it's completely different. If someone's never experienced that or experienced what the brain does when you're in addiction, you are that you're not in control of anything. Nothing. There is one thing that you're in control of, and that is finding your next fix. And so the fact that these, you know, we addicts, we change as long as you're working a program and you're, I say, helping others and you're reaching out, we're different, completely different. And those things, you know, I think that we've made just coming out with our stories. And I know a lot of people that have been able to see me grow and said the same thing, like, you are night and day from what you used to be. And that's what's so cool is the change, the growth that happens.

SPEAKER_01 11:37

I think uh a lot of the time too, people are like, alcohol was a problem. And in our mind, alcohol was the solution because we didn't know how to handle the problem. We didn't know how to sit with these feelings and these situations and how to get out of situations and out of that thought process and out of that pattern. And so um realizing that we are still human, I think, rather than putting the label of like a recovering addict. Um, like we were talking about earlier, I think it's can be sensitive of like, well, we don't want to invite them because there's gonna be alcohol there, or we don't want to make them uncomfortable. And at the end of the day, we're two minutes away from getting alcohol or our fix anywhere. Right. Alcohol the problem.

SPEAKER_05 12:33

It was us that was the problem, right?

SPEAKER_03 12:35

And that was just the way that we coped out, just like anyone else says, whether it's shopping, porn, drugs, alcohol, I saw something on the Ignite page about cell phones, yeah, where you said people don't understand, they just think addicts should just stop. Right. And she's like, Okay, put your cell phone away and don't reach for it. Every time you reach for it, that's your fit. And I was like, that is a great perspective, yeah. Because today's society, like, it's a dopamine hit, right? You know, and it's yeah, and that's so true. Like sometimes you'll get on your phone and not realize what you're doing, right? And that's probably how it was for you guys when you were in those moments of needing that, you know, yeah, craving that.

SPEAKER_05 13:15

Like, yeah, it's a numbers, and there's never enough. I mean, you take you take one shot and you get that feeling, and you want to go back to that feeling, and so you start drinking more and more and more. And before you know it, where I was at, I mean, I was a bottle and a half to two bottles, big bottles of vodka a day by the time I ended up getting sober. Yeah, and it's just you can't, I couldn't pass a liquor cabinet without taking a shot. Like the it was complete insanity.

SPEAKER_03 13:44

Yeah. Okay. Well, I want to get into your I want to ask one more. Okay, your go-to drink order now, non-alcoholic.

SPEAKER_01 13:52

Say that again. Go to drink order now.

SPEAKER_03 13:54

I'm just non-alcoholic.

SPEAKER_05 13:55

Diet Dr. Pepper girl all the way, man. I am orange tangerine, Neo, and water all day long.

SPEAKER_03 14:02

I could give you some of Josh's hydro. You would like it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:06

Yeah. I love the beads. Does he still do the beads?

SPEAKER_03 14:09

No, he still has me. I'll give you something. So he's actually gonna put it into a pouch. Oh, okay. Yeah, he's working on it. It's just the delivery. He didn't love Josh is a perfectionist. He wanted a better delivery. But yeah, he does. I could I could bring bring lots of beads.

SPEAKER_01 14:22

Good girl on beads. It's a fun experience. Yeah, it's a nootropic.

SPEAKER_03 14:26

So it's a focus, it's like a calm energy. Oh, you're created and it melts underneath your tongue. Oh, okay. That was his first initial product. I love it. So now he has a hydration supplement and it's it's clean. It's made with Himalayan pink salt, vitamin B6, B12, vitamin C, coconut water. Yeah, sign me up. He has a pina colada one that's coming out April, I can't remember the day. In April. So good. Love it. So good. Okay. Take me back. What did your child because this is interesting, right? Like someone I've never had an addiction, right? Like for us, like I can maybe count on my hand um how many times we like are sitting in our home and we entertain, like, and I'm like, oh, I'm gonna make myself a drink. Like it's not, it's not a problem for me. Never, I mean, I'm a very social drinker, like, and sometimes socially I don't, which that's a blessing, right? Like everyone's different. Some people are born with dynamics and others aren't. So, what did your childhood look like and what was home like growing up?

SPEAKER_01 15:25

Um for me, I grew up in a very LDS home. Um, and was just told, don't drink, don't do drugs, it's bad for you. Um, but I was always the one to kind of challenge everything. Call me the black sheep of the family, call me whatever. But I was I had to figure things out my way, yeah, the hard way, you know. Um, but what I have also kind of found through my addiction is at a young age, I lost my grandma. So my mom's mom, she was only 55 when she passed away. So my mom, 35-year-old, losing her mom, yeah, very devastating. We were very um involved. She had breast and ovarian cancer, she lived with us. We went down and lived with her for the summer before she passed away. So I at a young age saw a lot at around 10, 11 years old. I'm seeing, you know, my grandma pass away before my eyes. And I didn't realize how traumatic that was for me and the experiences leading up to that and after of how I saw like my grandpa handle her death and had some suicide idealization and things that I just kind of compartmentalized of like, why am I thinking this way? Why do I do this when I'm this way? And anyways, so going back to trying to dig out all the pieces of why did I get here? How did I get here? Um, I think that I maybe on a level felt like my mom was she was emotionally crushed losing her mom. And I I she, while she was available, absolutely an amazing mother. I think I was always searching for, I don't know, maybe that I don't even know.

SPEAKER_03 17:29

Like an emotionally stable dynamic. Yeah, because she and it's I mean, anybody, I mean, I'm thinking about that, right? That'd be like me. I mean, I'm gonna be 39 this year. That'd be like me my mom passing away. Like, that's devastating, right? We had this young daughter, like, so she just emotionally was devastated, right?

SPEAKER_01 17:46

But you, yeah, it's emotional regulation, like just having that almost like I think it just rocked a lot more than I was able because I'm like, I had everything growing up. I had a great childhood, a great upbringing, my parents were great, you know. But that was something that that left me broken. And um I wish looking back to that I would have been told more of the why. Why shouldn't we drink? Why, and you know, you can hear it just takes one drink to become addicted. You know, come to find out I have a lot of addiction history on both sides of my family. Yeah, not immediate to where I saw anything, but you know, it it's in my bloodline, both sides. So I I wish I would have known more. I I don't know if it necessarily would have stopped me by any means, but I just was living my life because I used to be a normal social drinker, like it it was no big issue at all until it was, yeah, you know. So I think going through and starting to like really dig up those pieces and honor and and heal my inner child, it really found a lot of I was able to like ground myself and take root of why I was doing these things. And it wasn't like this huge traumatic no, you know, like and you know what I mean? Like where it was just I don't know, I don't know why I ended up the way I did. It just a series of events um kind of led me to that. A lot of it also was um my first husband, my current husband. I don't know, do you want me to get into any of that right now? We'll get into that.

SPEAKER_03 19:40

Yeah, we'll get we'll get into that.

SPEAKER_01 19:42

But more like the childhood like childhood dynamics, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:44

And I think a lot of I mean, I am pro-therapy. I think people should have to go to therapy to graduate high school. I think it should be regular curriculum because it's wild. And I know my husband would be fine with me saying this because we openly talked about our relationship and therapy in on episode two of this, but like stuff that happens in your childhood sticks with you. It's crazy, and people don't work through it and it causes so many.

SPEAKER_05 20:09

So, your childhood, Olivia, what's um so my childhood was from the outside, it looked perfect, right? Like my my family had money, we lived in a great house. Um, we went to a private school. I saw, I did see a lot of drinking, uh, the friends that they were hanging out with, and the friends that I was friends with in school, their parents drank, they all got together. So it was kind of a normal thing. Um, what I thought was normal that was going on inside of my house was not normal. And, you know, my dad was um was and is an alcoholic and he still battles. And I saw a lot of abuse with my brother, not necessarily with me, but a lot of abuse that happened with my brother, and a lot of it had to do with when my dad was drinking. Um, and that I didn't realize the effect that that had on me growing up. Um, you know, I was also, I talked on our podcast, and I'm open to talking about it. Um, when I was around eight years old, I was molested by a family doctor. And that was another thing that was, it was something that was always on my mind every single day. But, you know, when when that happens to you, and the wording that was used with me of, oh, I was just checking your temperature, she seems to be fine, you know, that gaslighting that I did to myself for 30 something years, and not talking about it and thinking he was a doctor, this is not what it was, all of these things. And then jumping from, you know, always going out with older men and jumping from relationship to relationship to relationship. And it just, you know, I started drinking at 15 years old, and when I took it, it was my first drink that I ever took. And That changed everything, you know. And and looking back when I was growing up with my dad, I mean, he'd be like, Hey, boo, go get me a beer, and I'd run and go get him a beer, and I'd take a sip of the beer and give it to him, and he would laugh, you know, and think it was because that's just, and it's not that they they parented me wrong. They parented me how they were parented, right? Like they did the best they could with what they had and what they saw growing up. Um, and it wasn't until, you know, I got older I ended up getting with Dare and he had two young kids. I was 21 years old and they were two and four. And that just what I thought was gonna be this amazing family, blended family, did not turn out to be what I thought. And the only way to cope with that was was drinking. And the drinking just, I mean, it spiraled, it spiraled really fast. I was when I was in high school, you know, I ended up drinking an entire bottle of Parrots Bay and ending up in a party naked with puke all over myself, all over the floor. And I don't even know how many people were at this party, over well over a hundred. And you think that that would have been one of the first things that would have made me take a look a step back and look like, whoa, okay, this just happened. And it did, and I was, I didn't drink for probably about a year after that. But then once I picked up and I got that same feeling back again of I can take a shot and I can be more personable, I'm prettier, I'm a better friend, I'm a better partner, I'm a better mom, I'm better at all these things. Why would I not use this to my advantage on the daily basis? Yeah. And I used it to my advantage until it sunk me.

SPEAKER_02 23:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 23:43

And then I still used it because I didn't know how to cope. I didn't know how to cope.

SPEAKER_03 23:48

I knew that about like high looking back on high school, like I knew that about you. Like, I was like, oh, she's crazy. I mean, I told Case that I was like, I went to high school with her and she was wild. Wild. She was wild, like so wild. The one time, I don't even know if you remember this, but the one time I hung out with you was my first drink ever.

SPEAKER_00 24:08

And look at where we were.

SPEAKER_03 24:09

And it was we were with the crew, like Cass, Angie, like, and it was a senior in high school. Yeah. And I always stayed away from it because I was a cheerleader. I didn't want to get kicked off cheer. I think Tara was there. God rest your soul, Tara. Anyway, so like literally, like, and it was the shot of 99 bananas. Yeah. But I that's just so funny because you to me in high school, and I hope that doesn't offend you, but it was very like, she's a crazy one. If you want to go get drunk, she's the girl. She go girl.

SPEAKER_05 24:38

She's the, you know, like, and I love that. Like, I love that people were like, oh my God, she's so wild and she's so crazy. And it was like, it built this ego. And we it's so funny because we talked about this today of like, you know, that ego building of what people thought, people thought I felt inside. Yeah. And it was just a facade. It was just something that kept me in with the in-crowd of pretending like I had it all together. I had my shit. Like I was good. I was everyone's friend. I could party, but then I could also show up to Jumba Juice the next day and work my ass off. Like, for God, you were gosh.

SPEAKER_03 25:14

I was like, we're going down memory lane.

SPEAKER_05 25:16

Yeah. Yes. And my, you know, and I'd watch my parents party their asses off and do all the crazy things. And they were successful and they had these lives and they were raising children. So it was just that cycle that it was just continuing. Like it's just helping me get through the hard days. Yeah. Like I was, I was Olivia. I was a party animal. Like you were want to have a good time? Call me. Call Olivia. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

Did you drink in high school? Um, I actually drank in junior high. Oh, okay. And high school was more, uh, yeah. High school was more like I chilled out because I was on the drill team, and you know, but I kind of dabbled in it earlier on. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 25:57

Um, growing up in Utah, what messages did you get about who you were supposed to be? We kind of touched it here. You didn't not, you were not raised in a more family. You went to a cat Catholic private high school. Um, so you probably didn't didn't care nor have that dynamic, or did you?

SPEAKER_05 26:13

No. With the I mean, the Catholic Church is like that's where a lot of the partying went. Like you go to Catholic functions and everybody is drinking, and the teachers go and the parents go, and like that's just kind of it was the norm. And so to see the LDS side, that's like now drinking, you know, you have that stigma when you're little and you're like, oh God, they're so lame. How lame is that? And they don't want to drink. And here us Catholics are like parting our asses off. And but now that in in sobriety, like the stigma, the stigma is real here. It's real. And that's kind of that's I think that's why I'm so vocal about sobriety, is because I never want anyone to feel that depth, that despair, that I want to die every single day. I don't ever want anyone to feel like that.

SPEAKER_03 27:05

No, and it is the stigma too. Like, I relate with that because there definitely is the stigma with what I do. Right. Like how I get blacklisted, how I don't get invited to events, how I don't like it's like she talks about sex, and I'm like, you're all in my DMs, like you're all out, you're all buying stuff. Like, and I think there's a lot of like closet drinkers users in this state. I think there is a pressure dynamic with the whole Utah culture that like nobody seems to talk about or actually underwith head on. Yeah, yeah. So to take us back kind of a little deep into your like addiction world, alcohol for both of you, that was it.

SPEAKER_05 27:43

Uh yeah, I dabbled in uh pain pills kind of at the last of my addiction. Like I was doing hair, I've done hair for 20 years, and I had clients that would say, Hey, I can't pay you cash, but I have lower tabs. And I was like, perfect, that's better than cash. Oh yeah. So it was like, I mean, it just started like it was one addiction and then it started feeding into another. But it was never that I went out and really searched for pain pills like I did alcohol. But if someone was had a pain pill or whatever, I'm like, hell yeah, pain pill, shot of vodka, game on, off to the races. Like this is this is the best.

SPEAKER_03 28:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 28:20

And yours was just alcohol.

SPEAKER_01 28:21

Mine was alcohol that I had the issue with, but I coincided with needing Xanax because the come off of the alcohol was always debilitating for me, like the worst anxiety from drinking. And so I would drink and then I would take my Xanax to sleep. So it Xanax is a bad one. Yeah, it but it became something to where ultimately I tried overdosing with Xanax to take my life during a three-day bender with alcohol.

SPEAKER_03 28:53

So the brook I know, and I hope this is okay. I mean, we I I always check with my guests about what's on the table, what's on the table. Like, and these girls were like, We're an open book, ask it all. Yeah. So, like the brook I know, like dabbled in the church thing. Like, I had no idea. All I remember, and I feel like I vividly watched this on social media, is I saw you happy all the time, and you're doing your salon stuff because I used to go get spray tans by you all the time. And then I just feel like you, your husband got injured, fell off a roof or something, right? 30 feet. Yep, yep, okay. And then you just like disappeared. She died. So what happened?

SPEAKER_01 29:28

Yeah, I think ultimately him falling. I'm not gonna put the blame on where it all started, but uh twins. Twins is what did us 30 actually, we so I have three boys, a 13-year-old, and then twins who are almost eight. So yeah, when Taylor, my husband, he fell 30 feet, that shook my world. We were running a salon, running multiple training academies, opening up twisted sugar franchises. Forgot about that. And then my husband had fallen the 30 feet, he owned his own framing business, and it was right during COVID. So we it he spent three days in the ICU, didn't know if he was gonna walk, talk again. It was scary, but that left a lot of health repercussions. So it was interesting because that's when he developed a drinking problem. And I was just keeping everything afloat. I was financially holding our home, I was, you know, the mom, the the everything, keeping everything going. And he's tied up in a recliner just fine for his life. And he started to cope with because you know, falling, the it's his body is just so messed up now. Yeah, he lives with daily chronic pain. And what do you do when you're living in daily chronic pain? You want to numb yourself out. So that's when he really started drinking heavily, and I started seeing like him just progressively sitting in puke every night, and you know, that pattern, and he would just be crying of like, why can't I stop? And I'm like, Why can't you stop, you mother, ever? Like, what are you doing? Like it was so mind-blowing to me to see the pattern of him sick, I'm never drinking again, to him literally drinking the next day, like the definition of insanity that I got myself into, you know. So yeah, it it that really shook me. It was just fight or flight, dealing with everything on my plate, and um then developing um him starting to get realize he had an issue of me really using to cope now at that point. So it was this weird like dance around each other. He couldn't get sober, then I started drinking real heavily, and he's like, Why can't you stop? You have an issue, and I'm like, You're just judging me because you're sober now. You know what I mean? I'm like, get off your high horse, like, come on now. Like, I shouldn't eat enough. So I blacked out, you know, we need enough but yeah, I need more food. I just drank on an empty stomach. Took an Adderall today, that's what it was, you know, just one excuse after another. So it has been interesting for the dynamic of us to be on both sides of recovery and me being like, why can't you stop? to him being like, Why can't you stop? Yeah, and your kids. Yeah. How was that? Um, you know, I definitely think it took it addiction takes a toll on family. And I that's another reason why with Ignite, why we want the family to be involved because there's so many people that come to us and they're like, I'm not an alcoholic, but my daughter-in-law or my son or my sister, like, how do I handle this? You know, so there's such like a gap of, but yeah, it it it was hard. I was already dealing with a really sticky co-parenting situation um with my oldest and um, you know, twins, man. That's it's just you know, it survival. So we luckily had some amazing family in our lives that really kind of picked up the pieces of the lack of presence during our journey of sobriety and whatnot. Um, but it's definitely something that you live with day in, day out of the guilt and the shame of not being a present mom and the what ifs. Um what if I wouldn't have pulled through? What if, you know, but at the end of the day, more than anything, you're just proud that you got yourself out. And it's more of an advocate to talk to my kids about where we were and not just don't do it because it's bad for you. Yeah. Um, Wyatt, my oldest, he we got in a cycle where he'd be like, You told me you never drink again. Like, and here you are. So he started to kind of pull me out, call me out on my bullshit. And so this last time around, um, it was kind of like, I'll believe it when I see it. And so that was just like, even to this day, mom, when are you gonna be home? Like, cause he he sees me going out with my big old bag, and usually that was like a three-day bender, you know, like gearing up because it's like that's where I would fall through the cracks, is I would, I'm not, I don't have an issue. I don't drink every day. That's what I would say, you know. But then I would go on these three-day benders.

SPEAKER_03 34:54

What's a three-day bender? I sound so I sound so like ignorant, but I'm like, like, would you be drinking while you were working?

SPEAKER_05 35:00

Were you drinking like yeah, like you're just drinking nonstop, like like drinking and driving?

SPEAKER_01 35:05

Like you just check out of your life. Like I unintentionally, like I would say, be at my salon, and instead of going home, I would go to my office and just drink and drink. And then whether I was sleeping in my car or in my office or getting a hotel and just isolating myself and like drinking until I blacked out, and then would just be like, what day is it? How why did I do this? Like, okay, just the stress of everything. I didn't know how to cope with it. So I would just numb myself out, and then I would literally lose three days, and you know, I'd get, of course, calls from everyone, where are you at? What you know, and so it became very noticeable when I was on a vendor because it's like, oh, we're we can't get a hold of breath.

SPEAKER_03 35:53

Is that also so your dynamic? I just feel like you always I guess I'm like kind of wanting to know, like, when were you like, okay, we've got to do something about this? Like, what what's a little bit of your like, or was it just like you just continued, continued, continued, and then I am a slow learner.

SPEAKER_05 36:12

Stubborn. I'm stubborn. I'm stubborn, very, very stubborn. Um, I had known, you know, when you're Googling, am I an alcoholic, or you're Googling how much is too much to drink, there's a problem.

SPEAKER_03 36:24

And I was like, I've never Googled that. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_05 36:26

It's like, wait, what? People do that, yeah, yeah. Okay, like you normally, like, and I can tell because you're like, well, what's a bender? Yeah. Like, what? So I don't know. I know. Yeah. So it's um it started like when I had, I remember thinking because it was it started being like Dare and I were drinking to with every function. I mean, we went to Lagoon, we had a a bottle of vodka, we went to the movies, we had our cocktails made, we went to dinner, we were pretty gaming. Like whatever it was. Pre-gaming.

SPEAKER_03 36:58

I haven't heard that in so long.

SPEAKER_05 37:00

Like we always had alcohol on all the all the time. And I started drinking, it was probably like I don't know, two years before I got sober that I started realizing, okay, I can drink because I was getting the shakes in the morning, or I'd go like the weekend, we'd have a really hard weekend, and then I would have a glass of wine, which start at, you know, four or five o'clock at night. And then doing hair, which a lot of stylists do, which you're kind of known for, is drinking during the middle of the day. Like that's what we do. And we offer our clients alcohol to combine or whatever. Yeah, going to the wrong place. Right. You're just gonna die.

SPEAKER_03 37:38

Just kidding, Cam. Love you.

SPEAKER_05 37:41

It's insane. And so when I had hair candy, that's kind of where it started really spiraling, is because I had my own business and I could, you know, you realize really quick if you have a problem, I know what it's gonna take it down, and that's to have a shot. And then that shot turns into two, three, four, five shots. And I mean, I was driving home every night wasted and doing the 10 and 2 of like trying to pay attention. Yeah. And then it got to the point where I was driving around my my son drunk all the time, my stepkids drunk. I mean, I was, I don't know how I never got a DUI, is unbelievable to me. Like, I have no idea. In the last two years, um, it got so bad that I had uh I got pancreatitis, didn't even know what my pancreas was. I was like, went to the hospital because horrible stomach ache, worse than childbirth. I thought I was dying. And they had asked me all these questions, and I just got back from a girls' trip. And mind you, in two days, me and my girlfriend had finished off two gallons of vodka, two of them. And was having, and I had been having stomach aches and just kind of like not feeling great, being really have a hard time to eat. Well, I went to the hospital and they diagnosed me with pancreatitis and basically told me you can never drink again. And you know how doctors are bedside manner, like he's coming to an alcoholic, which is my coping device, and he's saying, you can never use that again. And I remember thinking I stopped for it, it was probably 30 days, maybe 60 days, um, had to be on a liquid diet for 30 days. Like it was just, it was crazy.

SPEAKER_02 39:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 39:18

And picked up again, and it was right back off to the races of drinking, and then it just, I mean, I got pancreatitis back in the hospital, and then I was blaming it on because I had a greasy cheeseburger, but I wasn't really date, I wasn't really drinking anymore. And I mean, it was excuse after excuse. I went for into the hospital with pancreatitis five times, um, ended up atrophying part of my pancreas. So I've got all sorts of digestive issues, stuff like that. And it still didn't wake me up. And I remember thinking in my head, like Derek, you know, he was someone that he is not, he's not a controlling person. So I think in his eyes, he just kind of thought, she's going with some through something, she'll kind of she'll pull it together. I don't need to be riding her ass. It's this will come together. And I knew the only thing that was going to get me to stop drinking is when he pulled my son from me. And I knew that he would, like, that would have been his last measure, like the very last thing he would have done. And I remember I, because at this point, I was waking up. He'd wake up at six in the morning, he'd hop in the shower, I'd go to my closet, I'd start drinking, I'd puke because I was so hungover. And then I'd wait five minutes after I'd puked, I'd drink a little bit more, I'd puke again, I'd wait five minutes, I'd drink a little bit more just to stop the shakes. To stabilize, to stabilize everything. And that was every single day. And it just, and I was going to the gym, I was working, I was, I mean, I'm not saying I was doing great things, but I was a functioning alcoholic. And there was one morning where I was puking in the toilet, and my son ran out to him and he said, Mommy's really sick again, and Dared known. And he said, Um, we're done doing this. You're not gonna be around your son, you're not gonna have anything to do with him. I know you've been driving him drunk. I know that you are intoxicated 24-7, and I'm done doing this. And I knew in that moment that my drinking days were over because I was not gonna give up. Sorry. Okay, I was not gonna give up the one thing that I had wanted my entire life. And this beautiful little human that I had, I wasn't gonna give it up. I wasn't gonna do that. And my dad had, you know, he had drank all my life. And I remember that day being like, How the hell did I get here? And I he checked me into detox. Um, I was sitting in detox, mortified. And even in detox, even after all of this, I remember thinking, I can't wait till I get home because I'm gonna have a drink. I stayed in there for two days. I was the fastest person they ever released because I refused to take medication because I was just, I just wanted to get out of there. It was so crazy. And I think I made it, I don't know, maybe 90 days. We had a party at our house July 4th, and everyone was drinking, and I just thought, whatever, like I'm fine. I needed a break, my mind's probably reset. And once again, I was off to the races. And it just, I mean, it was this continuum over and over and over again. And finally, you know, when he I came home one night and he had a breathalyzer and he said, I know you're not drinking out of a liquor cabinet, so where are you hiding it? And I had it stored in my closet. Um, and he went and got the bottles, and he basically was like, I'm done. I am done doing this. And so I hopped on a meeting the next morning, which was an AA meeting, and put my number in the chat, and who's now my sponsor called me and she said words that no one had ever said to me before, and it just I hadn't had a drink since. And she said, Olivia, who cares that you're an alcoholic? And that's all she said to me. And that was the first time that someone took the weight off of an alcoholic like me and let me know that it was okay. I just had to fix myself, and I've never had a drink since. Well, almost six years now? It'll be six years in September.

SPEAKER_03 43:22

That's crazy, right? I mean, you've had a glow up, like I've watched it.

SPEAKER_05 43:25

Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 43:26

Like you, like, I'm like, man, look at it. She looks so good.

SPEAKER_05 43:28

Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 43:29

Like, and you don't realize, like, you've always been beautiful, you've always been very talented, you've always been very successful, like you said, but like there definitely is a glow-up for sure.

SPEAKER_05 43:38

It was so much like it was so much fakeness before, is what I it's the only way that I can put it. It was so much fakeness, so much trying to keep up with what I was seeing around me and trying to keep up with that facade of beautiful women and you know, dating beautiful men and whatever it is, and the success that we all we all chase. When we're young. And it was such a facade. And now to be in my to be in my own self and love myself the way I do, and look in the mirror and be like, damn. Like the places that you have been to the places you are now and the fact that you love yourself and not only love myself, but I can pour that out onto people. It's the coolest thing about being sober. It is absolutely the most beautiful thing is to pour that your self-love out onto all of those around you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:32

I love it. Okay. Got me all teary-eyed over here.

SPEAKER_03 44:35

I know. I know. So um I kind of want to talk about. Hold on. I'm I'm like going through this. I'm like, what's next?

SPEAKER_05 44:45

There's so much.

SPEAKER_03 44:46

There's so did you give up the salon? Like, was that part of the mess? Like you were just, it was like a trigger. Like you were just like, and you two, right? Like, because you both had these businesses and no longer do.

SPEAKER_05 44:58

It was one of those things for me. Like, I kept having, like, we had a really when I first opened the salon, we had a really good group of girls. And then it was kind of like things started falling apart, but I wasn't connecting the two. Then I would show up, like one week I would show up as this powerful business owner, and we're gonna redo the salon, we're gonna redo the colors, I'm gonna ignite this place on fire and all of these amazing things. And then the next week I couldn't even clean out my color bowls. And I was coming in late for clients, and I was putting uh black on a blonde client. Oh yeah, like just the freakiness. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:38

Oh yeah. But like the poor blonde was like, what did she do? Thank God it was black and never go back.

SPEAKER_04 45:45

Thank god it was my aunt.

SPEAKER_05 45:46

Thank God. Thank God it was my aunt. But just seeing like then my stylist started quitting. And I was like, Bitches, like, how do they not have my back? But I was never relating it to what I was doing and how I was running my business. And what I was doing is running my business into the ground because alcohol had taken over. And I mean, I was stopping at the liquor store. Like, I would stop by the Newgate liquor store and then the Leighton liquor store and then the Salt Lake liquor store, and then this one and this one and this one. So no one would know that she's been in here for more than once a week. She's not an alcoholic. Like the craziest things ever. It's crazy. So I just got to the point where it just wasn't a passion anymore. And I was for me at the time, I was like, I'm tired of babysitting these girls, and I'm tired of doing all this and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But as I sit in the seat now, look back, I sunk my own business. Yeah. Easily. Like I sunk it. I let it go. I let the alcohol. The alcohol was the most important thing in my life at the time. So yeah, when I got rid of it, I thought I was gonna get rid of it. I was gonna move into the you know, Fifth Avenue suites where it's just a tiny space. There's no break room. You can't just pull out, you kind of disappeared in the break room and take a shot. And I thought that was gonna get me sober. And that didn't even get me sober. I just go out to my car and drink. Like you find a way. There's a well, there's a way.

SPEAKER_03 47:11

There's a well, and I think as a business owner, too, something I've learned and something I've watched is there's a dynamic of as a leader of being the business owner and following through. And so in the moment you were not cleaning the bowls, you were coming late, you were just kind of like, meh, I don't care. But then you did get and it it creates an animosity with your employees where they stop respecting you. Right. And they stop, you know what I mean? Like, I don't believe when Covet launches, and I have, I mean, I have employees now, but like they know I grind it out. Like, I'm not just like, oh, you do this, you do, you know what I mean? Like, I'm not expecting things from them that I'm not doing myself. And I think that probably was part of it, and they were like watching that unfold in that whole dynamic, and I'm sure you had the same type of dynamic with your salon situation.

SPEAKER_01 48:00

Kind of, yeah. Mine's a little complicated because it was tied to a long-term friendship, yeah. Um, and multiple businesses with different partners, and so um, yeah, we were kind of talking about this earlier today. Of I kind of felt like while I am taking accountability for my actions, I was also getting nailed to a cross for similar things that all these other people were doing. But because I was alcohol and alcoholic, it was easier to throw the blame or the problems or me out for that matter. So um, it was kind of a situation where over time I knew something had shifted. I knew something was off in the dynamic of my life where I lost the passion, where normally I was just so proud of my businesses. And they carried me through, I mean, providing for my family during really hard, devastating times. And, you know, so it was very protective over my businesses and my babies and my babies, like my businesses is what I meant. So uh for me to like sell the all of these businesses, it it came to a point where my life came crashing down, crumbling down for me to be okay with that. Um, I was dealing with somebody who was giving ultimatums, like if you pick up one more time, then I I'm done with you as far as being in business. And you know, I I I think I did it intentionally, knowing that's where I I needed to go, but I couldn't do it without like the liquid courage, I guess. Right. Yeah, the black sheep, yeah. So um back it came to a point where I yeah, like I could feel something was off, but I didn't know which direction to go. Like where this is what I know, this is what I do, this is what you know. So I kind of was just in a in a hard situation. Um when I started in my recovery, and I was having these 30, 60, 90-day relapses. It it was I was still in the same position. And I think that's why I couldn't, I wasn't fully surrendering to my alcoholism, but also to just changing my whole entire life and my whole entire inner circle. And so um I was down in Mesquite at my son's motocross races one one month. We were traveling a ton, and of course, in that environment, it's just surrounded by alcohol. Yeah, on top of a really hard, sticky co-parenting situation. So that is just a recipe for disaster. Um, but ultimately I ended up just doing a three-day bender down in Mesquite, and I was 90 days sober at the time, and I remember my purse had fallen. I had calling my husband, and I'm like, I messed up, and he's like, obviously, I haven't heard from you. I knew something was going on. I'm proud of you for calling me. Um, sleep it off, travel home tomorrow. And I remember just like I pulling into a gas station and getting in the back of my car with my pillow and just crying and being like, How did I get here again? How did I get here again? And there was alcohol in the back of my car, and I'm like, perfect. I already I already called and told them I messed up. And what did my mind tell me to do? Because I felt like shit, just just drinking. So I just kept drinking throughout the night, going in in the maverick, getting like little buzz buzz balls throughout the night. Yeah, like multiple. And um just I remember I got to a point where I couldn't like move because I was so drunk, yeah, belligerently drunk. And I just had like a thought pop in my head like you have 20, 30 Xanax, just get put out of your misery. Like your boys don't deserve this. And so I ended up taking those, all of those. And um by the grace of God, my husband had just he he knew something on top. Yeah, he's just he knew something was off. He called the mesquite fire department and was like, you've gotta go find her. She's parked somewhere in the back of her car. So they found me completely lifeless, dead in the back of my car. They got me to the hospital, and I was transferred to um the St. George behavioral unit for a week. And that was a time where I I wish I would have gone inpatient. My husband was trying to get me to go inpatient for a long time. And um, I was like, no, I'm not an alcoholic, I don't have an issue. Like wild. Yeah. Um and that was where everything had kind of changed for me because I all the noise was I was disconnected from my phone, I was disconnected from my businesses for the first time, and I don't even know how long. And that's where I knew when I got out of there, everything had to change. I knew that I could no longer live the same life or else I was going to get right back in the same position.

SPEAKER_06 53:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:56

And from there, that's where yeah, I I sold my businesses. I cut my friendships off. Um, and it's been so freeing and hard, but it's, I don't know, it's kind of incredible when you look back at it because it's it just God picking me up out of this situation and like dropping me off over here. He's like, girl, you're not done yet. Girl, yeah, like you're gonna go meet your homies and like, you know, like because and it was hard. I I really for a long time stayed in a shell of the shame and the guilt, and almost like the stigma of I cannot be an alcoholic. Like the world can't know I'm an alcoholic because I haven't lost anything. I still have an amazing, beautiful family and a house and all these things, you know, to where I think you look at an addict and you're like, they're like some homeless person chilling on the street that's lost everything. And so finally, when I was courageous enough to vocalize my sobriety, that's when I felt like I just all the walls came down and I didn't care what people think of me or thought of me or thought I did or didn't do. And I am who I am, and I've gone through what I've gone through, and I'm so unapologetically okay with it because I wouldn't trade it for anything because it's brought me to where I'm at today. But yeah, it took fully surrendering for me to just be like, yeah, like I am, I am who I am.

SPEAKER_03 55:37

Yeah. So you know what's interesting is I'm sitting here and I'm hearing these stories, right? And like we talk about like lives are on fire, like we all have shit, right? Um, I've had probably, I'm gonna cry, um, one of the hardest years of my life. And in my marriage, shock, I'm still married. Like, I love that man. But um, I lost some friends that really were my people um in a business dynamics, like lots of money lost, like me carrying my household right now because Josh is also an entrepreneur and I said I got this, you know. And isn't it funny? Like, I you hear people where you say, like people who are addicts choose to be addicts. I don't know if I believe that because here we are in a very similar dynamic, right? And I could cope with drinking, absolutely, you know what I mean? But in my stress situations, maybe it's the candy, maybe I'm addicted to candy.

SPEAKER_00 56:34

Girl, after hours, me and candy have a different kind of relationship. Like it could be worse, but I've never, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 56:41

Like it's that's why I truly believe that there's a situation there that we need to be a little more open and less judgmental and realize that it is a it it is like a disease, and some people just have it in them. And coping with helping those people and like understanding that I I don't get it, right? Me being completely, I'm like, oh, I've never, yeah, what do you mean you were in your car?

SPEAKER_02 57:05

What do you mean?

SPEAKER_03 57:05

You know what I mean? Like, I'm like, I never have coped that way. I guess I just eat candy, but like literally, I shouldn't joke like that, but I'm sitting here processing and I'm like, we are very similar, yeah. But I never, you know, and I that's why I feel like some people just have it in them, it doesn't discriminate.

SPEAKER_01 57:22

That's like the main thing not discriminate trying to drive in is like addiction doesn't discriminate. We interviewed a gal a couple weeks ago on our podcast who had just gotten out of federal prison. And you'd never have any idea, like you would never because she had gotten, I think, 11 DUIs or something of that sort. Wow. And a great, a great, great gal. She was, you would not look at her and think, like, dude, you just got out of federal prison. But she's like, I was staying in the same pod as murderers, as a lot of these publicized cases going on around us. Um, like Jody Hildebrand, like all these crazy yeah. And it's like it doesn't discriminate. No, like I just couldn't get, I couldn't stop drinking. Like I ran into my neighbor's house. I didn't, but she did, and she's that was the judge was like enough. Like we've tried, we've tried, and at the end of the day, it I mean, you have we sit in a group full of of people who I mean, doctors, bishops, entrepreneurs, regular to every side of the spectrum, and it's it does not discriminate.

SPEAKER_05 58:34

There's so scary. Empathy, I think, though, the addicts have, and I know for myself, because I work in the prison on Friday nights and I take AA meetings into the women, and the amount of empathy that has not only been shown to me as I've walked through sobriety and the shit, and I've done some shitty, shitty things, and I've done some shitty things as being sober too, because your mind's still not, yeah, you know, you're look you're still looking for that dopamine hit all the time. And sometimes that dopamine hit is not the healthiest thing, and you know what? Like, yeah, I've done shitty things. Um, but the level of empathy that I now have for people and addicts, because that was one thing with my dad growing up, is why can't you just stop? You know, like if and I remember telling him at such a young age, saying, if you don't stop drinking, that I don't want a relationship with you. And he said, Well, that's your choice. And I never understood it until now. And now the level of empathy, you know, my dad is he's still fighting, and he's still he'll get sober for three days and then I'll, you know, pick up, or he's he's back at it now and he's like, Boo, I'm gonna get, I'm gonna, I'm gonna try this again. And he had three and a half years sober with me, and then he fell off. And I get it, and I have so much empathy and love for the people that don't get it, because not everyone is gonna get sober. And if everyone wanted to get sober and it was that easy, everyone would be sober. And it's just you don't know what you don't know, and you don't know what people are struggling with, yeah, and you don't know the background of people, and you don't know why so-and-so lashed out the other day, and you know, you automatically throw that judgment of they're a bitch or they're an asshole or they're conceited. And it there's just such a level to me now where it's I always try and take a step back and think, wait a sec, what's really going on? Like, what cup are they pouring from? Because my cup's full of love, and if my cup's full of love and compassion and empathy, that's what I'm gonna pour out on other people. Yeah, and if someone's pouring out hate and volatility and all of those, you know, horrible things, I have empathy for them because that's how they feel inside. And that's really, really a shitty place to be because I've been there. I've been in those dark, deep holes. And I don't, I don't believe people are born bad. I don't. I think we all have a choice to a choice to be good, and sometimes just the dynamics that we're put in, we don't either we don't learn it or we don't do enough self-assessment or looking at ourselves and digging deep to find out. Like nobody wants to admit their character defects, right? Yeah, nobody wants to admit that they're a cheat, a liar, a manipulator. Like that's really hard. But when you get sober and you have to deal with those character defects, because that's part of sobriety, so you don't go back. It's really cool to unmask those and be vulnerable and just say, Oh, yeah, I, you know, even today, like, yeah, I totally manipulated that situation, and I'm sorry, like those defects came right back, but I'm working on it. And it's sobriety is just it's amazing, and it's so amazing. That's why we're doing Ignite, is because there's so much passion and there's so much beautiful life out there that I never would have seen that I see now being sober. Like it is this life that we have is amazing. You know, back and we talked about this is there could be a tornado that happened, and 10 years ago I would have been on the ground crying, saying, Look at all the destruction, look at all the mess, look at these houses. And today, if a tornado happened, I'd be looking at the sky, being like, Wow, look how blue the sky is now that that's just passed. And that is the coolest to have that inner peace and that growth. And it's it's work, it is daily work. It's not like you just get sober, you fix yourself, and you're off. You have to work on it every day. I do counseling, I do trauma therapy, I do my AA meetings, I talk to my sponsor, I talk to my sponsees, I talk to Brooke, like all of these things, and you just have to be open, you know. Sometimes Brooke will message me like, what the fuck is happening? I have anxiety and I've been sober for two years. And there's times where I'm like, I'm gonna lose my goddamn mind. And it's just being vulnerable and open, but it's it's also finding those people that are on the same page as you that are safe spaces, that are safe spaces, that don't another thing I've dealt with too, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:03:09

Because I like have a lot of and I one of my biggest issues is I'm I have a big heart, I'm overtrusting, right? I give and I just pour into people, and it lately it's bit me in the ass. But um, I realize that like having a safe space and accepting people, not looking at because everybody's got shit. Like, I didn't choose for someone to sell millions of dollars from me. I didn't choose for people to try and like you don't choose these things in life, and you could be a good person to embrace that person and have that empathy and be like, that's really hard. Like, how can I help? Instead of being like, oh my gosh, she's drama, or oh my gosh, she's an addict, or oh my gosh, she's like, people just need to have grace. I love that word. Right grace, right? Like, just give people grace, right?

SPEAKER_05 1:03:55

You know, like there's a human there, and if you're sharing grace, if you're showing yourself grace, you are able to show so many people grace. Yeah, like that's when if you're not showing yourself grace, how can you possibly show grace to someone else?

SPEAKER_01 1:04:07

So true. I think a huge part of sobriety is having a spiritual awakening, and uh people would talk about that, and I'm like, okay, like but then it like when it happens for yourself, you're like, Oh my gosh, yeah, that's what they're talking about. Yeah, so it's it's really cool because that helps that that grace really become such a profound part of your life, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:33

And it's just trusting the process, like believing and knowing that no matter what, and I tell Brooke this all the time, like I always get my way. No matter what I want in the world, I will end up with what I want. It's not usually how it like how I think it's gonna happen. Yeah, but it's just surrendering and letting God do the work and put me in the places and meet and introduce me to the people. I mean, I went to the gala and I was introduced to these amazing people that I had no business meeting, yeah, no business helping me with ignite, no business like anything like that. But here they are. And to me, that's God's work. That's something bigger than me, whatever you want to call it, energy, nature, higher power, sky daddy, whatever it is. Sky Daddy Daddy. I did like a Sky Daddy, but that is Sky Daddy's work of just like, here you go. And it's just because I trust it. And that's why I tell you like when I see your posts and stuff, I'm like, girl, just trust the process. Like trust the process, you are good. This is all everything is falling in line for a reason or out, or out. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:39

Yeah, I've I've definitely shifted that into like it's not happening to me, it's happening for you. For you, yeah, right. Like these people are not in line with where I'm going. Yeah, and what I'm building is bigger than something they can even cop comprehend or process, and that's been a lot of therapy, right? That's been a Lot of like working on myself. That's been a lot of working with my husband. And I think, especially in Utah, we live in this dynamic of like not wanting to be our true selves and like not wanting to be vulnerable and not wanting to admit of these things that we all struggle with and work through them. But you'll be a better person. Better people will be in your life when you do those things. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I want to, I always do little segments on my podcast. So first is like DMs. So people write the wildest things in my DMs, guys. Like I can only imagine. So we're gonna do a couple of these, and I'm kind of leaned them into um this topic. Okay. And then I want to talk about sex and sobriety for a minute. Is that cool? Yeah. Okay, cool. So first what are gonna we're gonna go to is I've been sober for eight months and my sex drive is completely gone, like zero. My partner is frustrated and honestly, so am I. Is this normal? Will it come back?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:56

Yeah, I would say one, make sure that their hormones do a hormone check. Um, because a lot of times everything is thrown off balance when you've been drinking.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:12

Yeah, and and I think when you're drinking, I'll speak from my experience, not everyone's, but when I was drinking during sex, it was like I thought I wanted to be the loudest or the craziest because I thought that's what my partner wanted. Not saying that he said, Oh, I want all this, I want this crazy, but it was just I could be crazy and not really swinging from the fan, but that's how I put it. It's like I was a naked person swinging from the fan, like, woo, whatever. And then you get sober and you don't have that liquid courage behind you. And then I was, I remember thinking, you want to have sex with the lights on? And like, and I love my body, but it was still so bizarre to me. I've been like, oh my god, oh god, like just it is so awkward, and I think it's because I didn't love myself, yeah, yeah. And once I started figuring out that I really loved myself, and it was me also playing around with me and personal things and figuring out what I wanted, and then being able to talk to my partner because that was really hard for me being sober is talking to him and saying, This isn't comfortable, this feels good, this doesn't feel good. Like it, I mean, it's been sober for five years, and we've always had great sex, but it's in this last year that I feel like we've really not just good sex, but it's that you know, when you have that connection sex, it's real, yeah. That's what I was gonna say.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:45

It's not like this crazy, it's like that those intimate moments that are actually like you want to cry after good sex.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:51

Right, yes, yes, and you're just like you're you're just one, yeah. And I think we've had more moments like that, and it's been I think it's been hard for him as well, with me being so different because I was always like, Let's have sex, let's do this, let's do that.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:06

And now I'm like, Yeah, it just takes some time to get comfortable on your own skin again. It does, it's being in your own skin and being comfortable with it, and it's just learning a new way of life, but just keep trying. I think the more when you shy away from it because you don't feel like it, or you don't feel you're you're just prolonging the uncomfortableness and the connection, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:09:32

You know, yeah, right. It's so weird because we like commit to people for the rest of our lives. And do you know how many people I have conversations like this with that are like, I don't know how to bring it up to myself? I'm like, what do you mean? Like you guys literally like share a bank account, like you guys talk about like, but it's sex is like so hard for people, and like having a comfortable way to say, you know, I like it when you do this, instead of because you don't want to make them feel like something's wrong with them, right? And yeah, so communication, guys. We always talk about communication, but here we are communicate, like and you have to go and try and do new things. Okay, another DM. Um, I relapsed after. Nope, that's not the one I want to do. I grew up Mormon and I'm terrified to tell my family I went to rehab. They think I just quit drinking on my own. How do I tell them the truth?

SPEAKER_05 1:10:19

Oh, you gotta be loud and proud, girl. Yeah, I think it's I mean, I think it's personal, but I think the power comes when you're honesty and you take that mask off and you'll learn. Like, I think you'll be very, very shocked when you tell your family about it because I think they're gonna support you and they're gonna love you no matter what. And if they don't, there's your answer.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:42

They're not your people, they're not your people.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:44

And guess what? There's so many people in my family that I'm like that I love everyone in my family, but I've also there's pe certain people that don't sit at my table that are part of my family. Not that I don't love them, I love every one of them, but they're not my people.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:00

Yeah, and that's okay. It's also just something else that will eat away at you if you're not honest. Right. Uh obviously, it's something that is weighing you down and you you're asking this question, you know. So it it can it's a slippery slope, I think, if you're masking the depths of where you were at.

SPEAKER_06 1:11:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:24

And I feel like that's I don't know because I've never gone through what you've gone through, but I feel like when you make that decision to be sober, like you can't mask anything anymore.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:31

No, and that's that will just and I think it it comes with time because it did take me, it took me 309 days before I made my first social media post. And I remember being in groups and people being like, You're gonna change so many people's lives with your story. And I'm like, I'm not telling people about this. Are you kidding me? Like, no, but once again, that is part of what has set me free because it's just unapologetically my story for a reason and where I'm at for a reason.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:05

And it keeps us safe, yeah, right. Like that's one of my you have to create safety nets around when you get sober because it can turn so fast. And people, I you know, I've known people that have had 40 years of sobriety and give it up because they think, oh, I'm good. And so it's just when I I tell everyone, like even strangers that I meet, that I like somehow my sobriety is always because that's who I am as a person. That is one of the biggest things about me is I'm sober, and that's why I am the way I am. So the more people that know I'm sober, the more people that I have to be accountable to. So if someone sees me somewhere and they're like, What the fuck? You have martini in your hand, I'm like, I'm gonna get called out somewhere, yeah, someplace. And it's just a safety net for me.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:53

Yeah. Okay, so sober sex is weird at first. What does that mean?

SPEAKER_01 1:12:59

Because you're so used to not being present. Yeah. Um, you don't think about it. Yeah. I actually have had quite a few people after I've kind of posted about this, text me and write me and would DM me and just say, like, dude, does that make me an alcoholic that I have to have a couple shots before we have sex? Um and it's obviously a personal thing.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:24

Um, but I think that's part of the Utah shame culture and like the dynamic of your entire life. You're told not to do this, don't do this. It's bad, it's bad, it's bad, it's bad, it's bad. And then all of a sudden it's like, no, do this, it's great. Like it messes with a lot of women. I deal with them on the regular. Right. So taking two shots, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:45

Right. Just to get you loosened up out of your head, because why all of a sudden it's okay, it's good, you should be connected, you know, and it's yeah, it's a foreign thing. Um, I I struggled with it, especially where mine was a hard, it was hard because he was sober, and here I wasn't sober. And so I was even more in my head because I'm like, he's sober now, but I'm not. And so, and then when I eventually got sober, it became it was hard, but it became so special and beautiful and the connection that it brought. But um yeah, I think it's more than the the drinking, it's like where the drinking was the solution, not the problem.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:27

And it kind of I feel like drunk sex is exhausting. It's like I have to be I feel like that's those are the times that we just are like, I'm like, oh my gosh, we've been going for 40 minutes. Like we're raw talking this and I'm tapped. Yeah, I need a break.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:41

I think it's like the I was listening to your other stuff of like the what you think porn is, of what you see on porn.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:47

Oh, yeah, it's like the energizer bunny shit, and that ain't it.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:51

That's not it. You have to be, you have to learn to get vulnerable. And how many people do you know that want to be vulnerable? And like when you have sex, that's what I learned with there is this isn't about being the wildest and the craziest for him to be like, oh my god, she's the best sex I've ever had. It's about actually being vulnerable and being okay when you're in a certain position and you have cellulite or you have your boob that does something weird, or like, and you're thinking, oh my god, are they looking at this? Are they judging me for this? Are they judging me on whatever it is, my thigh that's I feel that's too fat? And it's 99% of the time that's not even what they're looking at. They're in, like, I look at Darren, I'm he's into me. Yeah, he's like, Good God, you're so hot.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:38

Whereas before I was like, oh god, he's looking at this boob that the nipple I'm probably weird and my nipple's here, and this nipple's here, and he's probably not gonna be able to get off because my nipple look weird.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:49

Yeah, and well, and I think with our culture, like that's where people turn to learn, right? Yeah, and so then you get that that imagery.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:59

That's why I always suggest um, like almost having like, I don't know if you guys have heard me talk about this, like a king and a queen like dynamics. So, like instead of you focusing on your own pleasure and like you getting off in your process, you shift your mindset to your partner. What do you like? Show me what you like, show me how to do it, let me just focus on you. Because then it almost like creates a vulnerability forces a vulnerability. Right. Because for them initially to start and do that, to like show you, like, okay, here's your toy, or here show me the toy, or show me, you know what I mean? Like, you kind of feel weird at first, but it kind of brings you closer and creates those connections. And I think also, and I could be wrong, but like sometimes in those drunk sex moments, it turns into selfish sex, right? Where when we're sober and we're intentional, I feel like it's not selfish and it's more like what can I give for you, and you focusing on your partner and that connection for sure.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:57

Yeah, I didn't know how much I needed to feel love during sex until I was sober. I didn't realize how what a big, especially from my childhood, and I think that's where a lot of that uncomfortableness came from was experiencing that sexual trauma at such a young age, and I didn't know that sex had was I didn't know the feeling of love and sex. I didn't have that connection, and so it was always you were almost like the dude, pretty much, right? Like disguise, it's very physical. This is how I show my love to a man is by giving them sex, even if I don't want it, this is how I show that I love them. Yeah, and so that was a constant, and that was just something that replayed over and over and over in my head, and so getting sober, dealing with the abuse, dealing with the molestation, and then trying to figure that out of like okay, now I have to be vulnerable. This isn't just sex anymore, like this is with the person that I love. How do I get here? How do I do this? How do I shift me being the man to me being vulnerable and doing this because it's a loving act, and it's so different, and it was so hard to get there.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:16

And there's still moments where I'm like, you get imposter syndrome. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:22

When I I also could be wrong here too, but I feel like you almost feel more sober. Like I think people think you feel more drunk, but I feel like because my next section was like orgasm and sensation, like I feel like they're better sober. Oh god. I could be wrong, but I mean I've had them drunk, but I feel like they're better. You can feel more, you can like, I don't know.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:46

It's just that attack. Like, I think when I don't know for you, but like it's just different. And this is so much information. Derek's probably gonna be like, good God, but it's just different when I reach that the climax with my partner compared to what it was before. Like it was just always trying to get off, and then like great, we I I satisfied you, you satisfied me, let's go on our separate ways. Yeah, and now it's when you do that together and you're able to build that bond, it's just such a it's such a beautiful connection, such an amazing connection.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:24

Um pro masturbation, both of you?

SPEAKER_05 1:19:27

Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:28

Cool.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:28

I just got on testosterone, and I'm like, can't stop.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:31

We're gonna lower this down a little bit because it's ridiculous. We're gonna take the doses down on the tents a little bit.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:37

Oh my god. I was like, what is happening? You're like, mine always hits at like 11 a.m. 11 a.m. And I'm like, this timing is terrible. Like it's 11 a.m. I'm like, you want to rah dog in it? Like 11 a.m.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:52

I'm like, oh my gosh, so it's so I think how you were saying in your other um podcasts where it's just learning what you like. Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:02

People don't know, right? And then they say that, oh, my partner doesn't help me orgasm, or my partner doesn't do this. And I was like, it's just your partner's fault, it's your fault. Right. Because how are you gonna tell somebody what you like if you don't even know? Right. Right. And like that's also like a whole other episode because there's just so much there where it's shame, it's post sexual. I mean, I was abused as a child, right? Like, and you would never think, I think when I first started doing what I was doing, I think my mom kind of was like, you know, like worried, right? But I think I've taken what happened to me and turned it into something amazing, right? Right. Like we had talked about that early. But yeah, so I always do a covet this, so I'm gonna talk to you guys about this toy, and now you're gonna go want one because you know, all the teaser.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:45

Trying to today, Cass.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:48

Okay, so we spent like the last hour talking about what it means to come back to your body and actually feel things. So the covet this is the womanizer next. So this is a 3D air pleasure technology. Guys ever use an air toy before?

SPEAKER_01 1:21:02

No.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:02

What?

SPEAKER_01 1:21:03

Hold on, explain the air toy.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:05

So it's not like a vibration pressure thing, it's like almost like a little cubby hole that blows you have. You've been in my brain. The sucker blowers, yeah. Sucker blowers, it's that type of a dynamic. Yeah. So it meaning no direct content, direct content, content, contact. Oh, direct contact. Okay, so you know how sometimes when you're like using, I I mean, I'm a I'm a jackhammer girl. I need level 10, a lot of pressure. Okay. Some people aren't. Everyone, some people, are you guys the weirdos that like the no? I can't have a content. Same. Okay. I can't do that. Yeah, but you can get to the point where you're overstimulated and it almost, yeah. So this won't happen with this because it's not direct. It almost like has the air technology stimulating the clitoris. Yeah, so it's gentle enough for someone who's hypersensitive because some women are like overly sensitive. Like some people are like, oh, I just need level one. I'm like, man, I can't even feel that. Right? Okay. Um, so it adjusts to you. It's rechargeable, it's body safe silicone. It's honestly looks like something you'd leave on your nightstand. It's really pretty. You know, I'll wear it, you know, I'll wear it to get it. It's castybi.shop.

unknown 1:22:09

I love it.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:10

Love the plug. Everybody go get yourself.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:12

Oh, heck yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:13

Hey, womenizer. So, I mean, I'm gonna wrap it up with a little thing called the law of Cassidy, which is just like a quote or a blurb, and then I'm gonna ask you guys one last question and let you share a little bit. Oh my gosh, we didn't even get into the center. We can do a little blip about that too. Okay. So um, these two women sat in front of the mic and told the truth, the ugly, the embarrassing, the sacred, all of it. No apology, no filter. Thank you for that. And I promise you, someone listening needed every single word because I'm pretty sure there was someone that said something and you guys just like that person on the phone that day, right? Like, I think too many people hide in their holes and don't vulnerably vulnerability. I cannot speak today. Speak out because they're afraid of judgment, right? And I think if more of us used our voices in a positive way, we could really help the world. So, this is what authentic looks like. It's not perfect, it's not polished, it's just real. So you cannot judge someone's rock bottom if you've never been honest about your own.

SPEAKER_05 1:23:07

Amen.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:07

Like, draw that is the law. So fill me in on the center, give your little blurbs, give your little podcast blurbs, and then I'll last, I'll ask our last question.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:16

Okay. So Renaissance is where I started my recovery. Um, I started doing the podcast. When did we start that?

SPEAKER_05 1:23:26

Oh gosh, it was like eight months ago, I think it feels like seven months, eight months ago, back in October, September.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:32

So we got in the same room, we started talking about what's next. What do we want to do? Um, we're passionate about recovery, we want to do the podcast, but what else can we do? Um, so then this group were like, let's start our own recovery center, let's make an empire out of this our way, how we want it, and what's helped us. And um the stars kind of aligned, and we contacted the owner of Renaissance um just to see if we could get their backing with their clinical directors and whatnot. And um, the owner was like, you know, I've been looking to sell for a couple of years, the timing wasn't right, and now I know why. Because you you two weren't ready. Yeah, here you are. Yeah, yeah. So one thing led to another, and we took over within what, a month?

SPEAKER_05 1:24:24

Yeah, it's about about a month, and we uh so we changed Renaissance Ranch over to Ignite Recovery Center. And, you know, us being addicts, we realize that a lot of treatment centers do not work. Um, you know, you'll see the frequent of 30, 60, 90 days, and then they're back 30, 60, 90 days, and then they're back again. And we want to create something different with Ignite Recovery Center, is we want to do, we want to take our biggest thing is taking the stigma out of addiction. We're really trying to get the community involved uh with us, the tea boxes that are around here in the surrounding areas. Um, they have partnered with us, and we also want to get in with golf courses and stuff because we are an intensive outpatient program. So we do program from Monday to Thursday, but we were like Casey Scott at the event.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:10

I just interrupted you. Yeah.

unknown 1:25:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:11

So he's at the country club. So I was like, I have people I can connect you with at the Ogden Golf and Country Club. Yes. Okay, sorry, I just thought of that.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:17

I was like, Did you meet Casey Scott? He's amazing.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:20

Um, so we really want to do something where the community is more involved rather than just sticking people in an inpatient, giving them a 12-step program and saying, okay, here you go, hope you survive. Uh, we want to get, you know, ski resorts involved. If then there's anyone listening that, you know, for people that have these weekends where they go out and they're open Friday to Sunday and they're not in our treatment program. We want them to be able to get out in nature. And some people, when you're getting sober, they don't have a lot. They don't have a lot to offer. They don't have a lot of money to pay. So they can walk into the T-Box and do a round of golf for free. They can come join me on a Saturday and I can help them work out. They can go up to the golf course up in Morgan and they can get a free round of golf or a percentage off. They can go to the pie pizzeria and they can get certain money off. I mean, whatever it is, this is just kind of the ideas that we've come up with just because we want it to be so different than what we've experienced. And we want to see more sobriety. Like the the opposite of addiction is connection, and that's what we're striving for is connecting with our community, connecting with the people so they understand that we do change.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:30

And we also will be opening up more locations. So we want, so right now we're just in South Ogden. Um and we will be opening up a second IOP, hopefully, in the Pleasant View area, is what we've talked about. But our our big picture is to have the full treatment um inpatient, outpatient, detox, inpatient, outpatient, residential, sober living. That's where we're 10 locations in 10 years, baby.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:01

We're manifesting.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:02

I love goals. Get it, girls. Yeah, yes, girl power. Girl power. So podcast Your Not Drunk Friend, which I love. Y N D F Instagram at ignite underscore recovery, correct? Okay, and your website is igniterecoverycenter.com.

SPEAKER_06 1:27:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:18

So if you or someone you know, you love, needs help, reach out to Ignite. You guys are here to help. I got you. We'll put the link in the show notes. And last one, what's something you can do sober that you honestly thought required being drunk? Sex.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:35

Two shades.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:36

I got you, boo.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:37

Uh no, more on a serious note, parenting.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:39

Parenting.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:40

Parenting. Interesting. Yeah. I always had to be drunk for that. I thought I was a better mom. I thought I was a better everything. I thought I was funner. I thought I was funnier. I thought I was more compassionate. And man, he loves me sober.

SPEAKER_06 1:27:56

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:58

Um God. I still feel like I'm I'm in the early years of recovery, two years trying to figure myself out, as Olivia says, gather my marbles. But in the two years that I have been sober, it's um it's pretty incredible incredible how fast things can shift. Um I I've gotten up and I've done some public speaking, and that is just so far out of my element. Especially it was more on the spiritual side of things talking about my recovery. And you're so good at it, too.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:40

Oh that that shocks me because I know you a little bit, so I'm like, that's awesome. Because I wouldn't have ever thought that of you.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:46

Yeah, it was definitely, yeah. So things like that where I'm like, okay, like it's I can do it, and I can do it sober and I can do it with a clear mind. And I'm um I used to kind of have that imposter syndrome when I would do something and I would, you know, like when you get home and you're like, why did I say that way? And I just it is what it is, yeah. Like God directed me to say what I needed to say, and whether it's stupid or dumb or amazing, someone heard it that needed to hear it. Yeah. So just life in general. Yeah. Speaking, sex, all the things, cask.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:24

Okay, well, thank you. I appreciate you guys coming on here. I mean, I I can come on your not drug friend, but I don't have like a cool drinking store. I didn't even know what a vendor was.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:33

But we're gonna bring you on for all the sex. Okay, cool. I'm down, whenever. Because it does go hand in hand. There's a lot of people that are like, dude, I'm struggling.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:42

Oh, it's a thing. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'm I'm down. Let me know when. Yeah, anyways, thanks guys, until next time. See ya.