The Million-Dollar Domain: Colleen Joyce on Building Lawyer.com with Ray Lakhani & Adam Warren

What does it actually take to run one of the most premium domain names in the legal industry? In this episode of Open and Raw, Ray and Adam sit down with Colleen Joyce, CEO of Lawyer.com. 

Colleen breaks down the fascinating 1994 origin story of the domain, the reality of being a female CEO in a male-dominated industry, and how she's evolved the company's brand beyond just a directory into a massive answering and intake service for over 800 law firms.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Welcome to Open and Roll, hosted by Ray Lakani and Adam Warren. This episode features a real boss in the legal marketing world. Welcome Colleen Joyce, the CEO of Lawyer.com. She's light and easy to be with, but when it comes to her brand and her business, she's not to be underestimated. Let's get into it and see what Colleen is all about.

SPEAKER_04 0:35

And action!

SPEAKER_02 0:39

How's the conference been so far for you?

SPEAKER_04 0:41

It's good. We uh we had to be a good girl last night because we spoke this morning on stage.

SPEAKER_02 0:45

Okay, that's good. Yeah decision.

SPEAKER_04 0:47

So, you know, now it's the night to happen.

SPEAKER_02 0:49

Yeah, 2x.

SPEAKER_04 0:50

Yeah, diplo. Everyone's like, uh, who's diplo? I'm like, oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 0:55

I wish we were gonna be here. Me and Megan, you get to meet Megan's girlfriend who helps me run the company. She had to go back to grab our bags from uh get it ready because we're flying straight to Jacksonville. She we have a celebration of life of meeting a family for the first time tomorrow. Not her parents each other for some years now, but the her entire extended family. Oh, that's so I'm a little nervous, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:15

Rightfully so, and out of celebration.

SPEAKER_02 1:17

Out of celebration, yeah. So there someone in the family passed away about a month ago. The celebration's happening this weekend, so this will be my intro to the family. So I have that, and then I'll be traveling next week for work, and then I'll have then I won't be traveling for about two months.

SPEAKER_04 1:30

That's uh see, this is it for us too.

SPEAKER_02 1:32

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:32

It's a lot.

SPEAKER_02 1:34

Yes. Well, to be to be frank, I the most of the conferences I've gone to in the last five years of doing this. I I've never really like done anything like this. Yeah. It was just uh I don't know if Adam told you the story, but I'll just tell you now. Yeah, because he's been telling everybody. Um, about a month ago now, I I had been watching Open Jar for some time. Yes, maybe a year and a half had gone by, and a month ago I really admired him and his work and stuff. I reached out because he's he's been in this game for two or three decades, and I'm still technically speaking, I'm a baby, and five years is nothing. And so I knew what I had to offer, but I wanted to put together something that just didn't exist in the industry. No, it's genius, and so I felt like there's nobody better than someone who's in the traditional side of media where I'm on the social.

SPEAKER_04 2:23

We can bridge that gap that's generations and and he's such a great like I met him in April, it was the first time. Oh, yeah, and it was just like he felt like I've known him forever, right? And it's like in this space, there's so many like sketchy characters.

SPEAKER_02 2:36

Oh no, this guy and me are like it's we can sniff you out. Yeah, I just could roll.

SPEAKER_04 2:44

Yeah, let me get back to the um no.

SPEAKER_02 2:48

For some reason, it's like I there's something in our blood that's way too similar, but I love that.

SPEAKER_04 2:54

Yeah, I was hearing the origin story. Love a good origin story.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

God, I just love that story. Uh and I think feel like um, and that's one of the things we'll probably talk about is the story of Laura.com. I just think if there's a good story to go with it, yeah, it it begins to sell itself.

SPEAKER_04 3:10

A hundred percent.

SPEAKER_01 3:11

Um, one of the things that Ray and I both work on when we're doing differently what we do for our clients, um, is we have to determine their story to figure out the best way to position them because neither one of us are like in the recycling business. We definitely hey, I did this for this lawyer, so now I'm gonna do it for you, you and you.

SPEAKER_03 3:29

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:30

Um everything is different. And uh that he and I have this special story of this show that I never dreamed I would do. I never thought there was a way I could even launch this. I didn't know where to start. Showing up at PimCon, boo. Love 10. That that in one day, 10, one day, the first time ever, and I only met him the night before in person.

SPEAKER_04 3:56

Amazing. Is it open and raw or N?

SPEAKER_01 4:00

Uh that's a really good question. I'm not really sure.

SPEAKER_04 4:04

But you can stack it really nicely, right, KJ? I don't know if we're we're filming, but open and because and and raw three, four, you know, four, three, three.

SPEAKER_01 4:15

Okay. Well, the logo hasn't been built yet.

SPEAKER_04 4:18

Yeah, well, we're already, we'll help you out. Yeah. I'm like already thinking. I'm like, okay, let's get it. Yeah, right?

SPEAKER_01 4:28

Amazing. So I'm gonna call action. Yeah, and then we're gonna roll. It's 22 5, and we should be done by about five o'clock.

SPEAKER_04 4:36

Fantastic.

SPEAKER_01 4:37

That's when the show. So is Ray.

SPEAKER_04 4:39

Yeah, well. Are you going to the show tonight?

SPEAKER_01 4:40

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 4:41

Okay, good.

SPEAKER_01 4:41

So, and action.

SPEAKER_04 4:44

Hi, my name is Colleen Joyce, and I am the CEO of Lawyer.com.

SPEAKER_01 4:49

Amazing.

SPEAKER_02 4:50

I gotta go. I gotta go. So I'm a super curious person and we just met. Totally. Lawyer.com. What the F, how on earth do you have that domain?

SPEAKER_03 5:00

Because holy I remember the first time we spoke. Yeah, totally.

SPEAKER_02 5:05

Or we were on social media exchanging messages that went to your thing, and I was like, Are you kidding me? Lawyer.com. I need to hear this.

SPEAKER_04 5:14

Okay, so I can't take any credit.

SPEAKER_02 5:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 5:17

Our parent company, uh, World Media Group, the founder, started a company back in the 90s called mail.com. This was at a time when you could only get an email address at Hotmail and AOL. So what he said is, hey, why don't I go buy a thousand class A domains and give people email addresses based on occupation, location, and special interest? So fast forward to when we started Lawyer.com, we were part of our parent company and we were looking through the list of domains. And it was like, hmm, what business should we start next? So we're like, Lawyer.com is such a strong name. We threw up a directory thinking the internet wanted to be free. And then lawyers were calling us, being like, oh, how how can I pay you to be listed? And we're like, oh, this is fun. So that's a long way of saying. Uh, we've had it. Uh Jerry bought it in '94.

SPEAKER_01 6:11

Yeah. No, we were there in '94? No. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 6:15

No, I'm a little baby. You I started working. Um, we started lawyer.com about 14 years ago.

SPEAKER_01 6:22

Okay. You were still in high school.

SPEAKER_04 6:23

I was still a baby. We're Benjamin Buttoning things or whatever that is.

SPEAKER_01 6:28

Sorry. Yeah. Middle school.

SPEAKER_04 6:30

Middle school, yes. Um, we like that.

SPEAKER_01 6:33

How very interesting, and it it just has that similar vibe to you stumbled into a business you had no idea was about to happen. Very, very similar to that.

SPEAKER_04 6:42

100%, right?

SPEAKER_01 6:43

Um, it is an epic brand. Therefore, how much branding, when you have a name like that, do you even need to do? Do you you had mentioned that you do sponsorships and I've seen it, and you also have your own conference, which we want to hear about. Yeah. So how does that name make branding easier for you?

SPEAKER_04 7:05

So I think to start, we were lawyer.com and there were two people in the room, right? And I would very like, oh, hi, this is Colleen from Lawyer.com. People just assumed that I knew what I was talking about because we had this powerhouse domain. We really had to grow into that over the years. We're now at a point where we've definitely grown into it. Do we still need brand awareness? Yes. I really think that you do. Having the name itself helps, it gets you in the door. But as you guys know, you need that constant reminder in order for it to stick. But it's a great door opener for sure.

SPEAKER_01 7:41

Yeah. It's incredible. Um, what made you then decide, especially with all the conferences that exist now? Um, you know, we go to, I met you at a mass tort conference.

SPEAKER_03 7:54

Right.

SPEAKER_01 7:55

We're here now at a basically a personal injury conference. Yeah. How did you decide that, hey, I'm gonna throw my own conference?

SPEAKER_04 8:03

So we I've done conferences for a very long time. And I remember one fun story is we were in California at a conference, and the deal was sign up for directory listing, and you'll get one Bitcoin.

SPEAKER_02 8:15

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_04 8:16

One Bitcoin. I'm dating myself here. So I was like, oh, dude, we've got this. We're gonna blow up at this conference. Not one person made eye contact.

SPEAKER_03 8:28

No way. I had what?

SPEAKER_04 8:30

Well, because no one knew what Bitcoin was at that time, right?

SPEAKER_02 8:32

Wait, when was this?

SPEAKER_04 8:33

When was this? Um 20. It was like Bitcoin was like $100.

SPEAKER_02 8:37

So like how did you guys know to offer that?

SPEAKER_04 8:41

Um, because our parent company was big into crypto at that time.

SPEAKER_02 8:44

And so do you own a ton of Bitcoin?

SPEAKER_04 8:47

I, you know, one regret I have is I was young and dumb. We were mining Bitcoin in the office, and I'm like, what's that noise?

SPEAKER_01 8:57

Oh my god, what a story about that. Um, by the way, you may notice us flailing about. Uh, there are flies that have decided to come into our shoot. We've asked them to leave, but it's not working. So you're just gonna have to talk about it. Um that's a really incredible story.

SPEAKER_04 9:17

So it was like, I've been in that position. You've been in that position, you've been that where it's like you go to a conference and no one wants to talk to you. And I'm like, we just spent like 20 grand. We disrupted our whole day-to-day. So I don't want to do that, right? Like, yeah, I want people to connect, and that was why we started our own event.

SPEAKER_01 9:37

And you uh you brought in Ashley. Yes. Um that Matt just only likes you, by the way.

SPEAKER_04 9:43

We're fine.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

I'm like in my guy.

SPEAKER_02 9:48

What is going on right now?

SPEAKER_01 9:49

It's chosen you for the last like two hours. Um you brought in Ashley to help you. She's become kind of a wizard of this. She's phenomenal. How effective was it to bring someone in to help you do? Did you know you were going to lean on someone of her expertise when you went to put the show together? Like, how did that all?

SPEAKER_04 10:12

No, so we we were doing our own like little boot camps prior to when we had met Ashley. And we'd get lawyers in the room, tell them that their baby was ugly, and then make them buy products. And it was great, it worked, and we learned a heck of a lot, but it really wasn't going to give us that oomph that we really wanted. So I by chance met Ashley at MTMP in the halls at the league event, which is the women's organization. And we hit it off and we were brainstorming, and I said, Hey, this is what I want. And she's like, Hey, why don't we try something like this? We collaborated, and that's how we ended up with the Lawyer Growth Summit. And and having somebody with that expertise paired with our knowledge of our product and our vision, money. Yeah, right, like you guys know about for sure.

SPEAKER_01 11:01

We have we've had um a lot of women as guests on our show. Great. And this industry has long been synonymous as male dominated. Yep. Not even that far back. I've been around for quite some time and I've noticed that, but I'm noticing a pendulum shift now. And you, you know, the attorney before this just that we just met with, another woman, uh, very successful. What's happening? What why do you and I actually we met with this couple who's a husband and wife attorney, and the the husband who's been in the limelight is stepping back and pushing his wife forward because he believes women have a different talent for law uh from a detail, yeah, a lack of emotion, just uh another talent for law. Now, here you are, yeah, a CEO. Um, tell us what's happening. Are women starting to get more presence in this industry?

SPEAKER_04 12:01

You know, you you definitely see more women on stage, which is nice. You know, I've always been in the camp where the person who has the best knowledge should be the one speaking on it, right? Male woman, whatever it is. But you are seeing more women, myself included. I was on stage this morning. And it's great to hear a different perspective, 100%. I think women struggle in the workplace, as we all know, because they have children. And I think that post-COVID, a lot of things kind of changed. Like maybe COVID is a factor of why we're seeing more women come forth because that allowed women to be at home, be working, be with their children, and kind of have that all and not being forced to pick between both. Interesting. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 12:47

Well, it's it's uh as a girl dad, it's it's certainly something I like to see. I want my daughters, uh, as any father should to want to see his daughters have the opportunity to become the players they want to be. Um, and it's something I've definitely noticed in this industry, and it's been, I think, very exciting to see.

SPEAKER_04 13:07

I also bring my daughter, she's six, she's in the hotel room right now. So I think that also helps, right? When you go to events like this that allow you to have your child with you, then it makes it a lot easier to leave home.

SPEAKER_01 13:22

That's that's very interesting. And I think one thing Lottie Gras uh is we spoke with Bob this morning about it. Yeah. Lottie Gras uh is uh somewhat representation of Bob wanting to go to things he wants to go to. Yeah. And be able to feel safe uh to bring his family to it. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_04 13:41

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 13:42

As I've looked around, I've seen more and more presence of children. I'm like, oh, this is also not common in our world of that story. They have to go to bed early. It's a different world. Yeah, but I notice more and more as I go to personal injury uh conferences, it is a different vibe. Yeah. And do you have any way to quantify that, what you attribute it to?

SPEAKER_04 14:11

That's a good question. I don't know. I think everything just kind of changed, it's very cyclical. Um, I don't know if I have a good answer.

SPEAKER_01 14:20

I mean, there's no bad answer. I know. It's tough. Well, that's okay. I like that we just you notice it though. You see, like, there's a difference in the conference vibe. Um, this is obviously different too. We're not in Vegas, we're landlocked, there's nowhere to go.

SPEAKER_04 14:36

And and it that is nice.

SPEAKER_01 14:38

And at pretty much midnight, boop, everyone's just like either there's people in the bar doing their thing, yeah, or most people are just going and going to bed.

SPEAKER_04 14:45

It's also less emphasis on like the learning education. Like that's just a small part of at least this show, right? Because everybody's really, like Bob says, the network effect. He's made a space where everyone is hanging out all day, which is, I think, very different. This is my first Lati Gras. I'm used to going to a conference, freezing my ass off for six hours in a dark room, right? And then opening the doors, and then everyone's guzzling down alcohol, right? This is a little different because it's open, it's focusing more on, hey, let's just hang out.

SPEAKER_02 15:19

Yes. This is my first one too. And I have the I got the same side of it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:23

Yeah. Uh, which has also been cool because much like the last conference we were at, um, also very centric to personal interview. We just found people more willing to be engaging and uh generous with their time. Which is nice. Um, you know, we show up at these conferences, we have no schedule. We don't have a scheduler or a booking agent, except for not yet. Except for Ryan Ronello. Yeah. Um and so it's been interesting how generous people have been and how much they want to share their knowledge with those who are viewing us for the colours. Absolutely. So you're speaking to lawyers right now. Yeah. What would you like to tell them about lawyer.com that could benefit them?

SPEAKER_04 16:05

Sure. So I think a big part about lawyer.com is we've been around for a long time. We help lawyers grow their law firms. Um, we do call answering and intake for over 800 law firms. It's really something that is our core core competency that we have. We very passionately want to help people, right? That's why we're all here, is because we're in an industry that helps consumers who need legal help. And it's really amazing that every day we get to do that. And a byproduct of that is that we can drive more business to lawyers.

SPEAKER_02 16:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 16:38

And that's kind of the cool part of things.

SPEAKER_02 16:40

I got a question for you. Yeah. You've been in the space for some time now, and you may not have a definitive answer for what I'm about to ask. But in your opinion right now, from what you've seen, what do you feel like lawyers are doing wrong right now? And what are they doing right?

SPEAKER_04 16:56

Um, what they're doing right, we'll start on the positive. Um, we'll play to that. Is that they are they're trying, right? When we first started, I remember I had a lawyer, and I'm again dating myself. I don't know why I keep doing this, but we send out email referrals, and he says that every day he prints out the email referrals. And I'm like, wait, what? What are we doing? Right. So I think that lawyers have definitely adapted to technology more so post-COVID than we've ever seen before. I don't know if you guys see that as well, but I think that what they're doing is getting out there and trying technology. You know, there's also what $28 billion of money being poured into legal this year alone to make tech better. So that does help. Um and then that's the good. What they're doing bad is, you know, maybe not be getting out there and talking to people like us, right? Like, how can, Adam, how can you help them grow? Right? You know, it's like, how can we help them grow? I think that's a big part of that next step that lawyers have to take.

SPEAKER_02 18:01

What do you have to say to some of the attorneys out there that have a hard time finding the right vendor, though? Because there's a lot of people that get burned in this industry.

SPEAKER_04 18:07

Oh, well, I mean, I think we've all been burned, right? It's not, it's being burned by these Nats.

SPEAKER_01 18:12

We're gonna call timeout a second. Do you think maybe because we're sitting so close to the plants, that could be a function? That's possible. We can be screwed up if you want to try that, and I can push that back. Yeah, I just want to get us away because I can't stop slapping myself in the face.

SPEAKER_04 18:24

Oh, who's you who's having the um the mate? And do you like it?

SPEAKER_02 18:28

That's mine.

SPEAKER_01 18:28

Uh that means you love it.

SPEAKER_04 18:30

Did you? Okay. Yeah. So we like mate, but I was like, ooh, I hadn't seen that.

SPEAKER_01 18:33

I love it. I think it's at their coffee club.

SPEAKER_04 18:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:36

Like, I feel like I am a I feel bad.

SPEAKER_04 18:39

There's one that just keeps coming in and out of your ear.

SPEAKER_01 18:42

It's been so awful. He's you're gonna have to do so many overlays to try and cover this show. Don't worry. Don't worry.

SPEAKER_04 18:48

Um did he give you the bracelets or just the champagne? Oh, good. Thank you. Is it cold?

SPEAKER_01 18:53

Uh that's all. There's only a few. I'm framed and we're not hopefully we've got away from those money partners. All right. So um We don't I don't have to worry about this then. No, but you you're it's all right. It's far enough away, too. Okay. Um what were we in before I started flipping out about that? He's coming over here, but maybe it's a control.

SPEAKER_02 19:15

We talked about the good and the bad.

SPEAKER_04 19:17

The bad, yeah. Lawyers are bad at trying new things. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 19:20

Oh, oh, and then I talked about being burned, right? Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 19:23

So that's the thing is how do you regain that trust?

SPEAKER_02 19:26

Yeah, well, so the thing is is I I've had a lot of conversations in the last, let's say, two weeks for here, um, specifically about like what I do, for example. Right. And I I've talked to so many firms that have so many bad tastes about social media in their mouth because a lot of people come in, they'll deliver you a video, and then they'll post it, and like that's where they leave it, for example, right? So they're like your mother, your father, your neighbor, these are the people interacting with it. Right, right. And then they firms get frustrated, nothing's working, they fire the media company, and now they never want to work with a social media company again. Um, and so like I've told them when you work with the right person and you actually see the results at that point, then you're gonna be like, holy shit, this is what everyone's been talking about on social media. Yeah. Oh my god, I just was with the wrong person. And so the thing is, is we all know like there's great vendors here.

SPEAKER_04 20:10

100%.

SPEAKER_02 20:11

And there's also very likely some really shitty ones, I'm sorry to say, but they have to exist. Of course. How do you sift through these?

SPEAKER_04 20:17

I it's it's tough. And and just to kind of pile onto that is how do you how you solve that is that you come to conferences, right? And you have connections and you're meeting with people, but you can't be on the road all the time. You got to be home driving the business. You got to be home making sure that you're going forward. So I think the challenge personally that I have is I want to be both places because I see how valuable going to events and networking is. Yeah. But I also know when I'm not in the office, I'm not driving the business as much as I need to. So I think that like to answer that question, I don't know. And I someone can give me that answer because it's difficult.

SPEAKER_01 20:57

I'm already I you get that throughout the day. I'll be at a conference looking at my phone. My God, my emos are just popping up. And I'm like, I know. I don't even know what I'm not scrolling through to see right now. This is literally and we're talking, I've I can drive here so I can have the flying impact. Yeah. Um, I've been here since Wednesday. What am I 48 hours? I'm already flipping out. I know. Um, and so then we get back to the room and we have to sit there and try to download as much as we can at 30 minutes before we just want to go to bed. Yeah, 100%. It's something that I've struggled with uh balancing. Yeah. Um, and something that I don't think as new conferences continue to materialize, picking and choosing gets more and more difficult. It does. And then other conferences start to die because of that fragmentation. So it's a it's a quandary, um, but it also speaks to how this business just will not stop evolving.

SPEAKER_04 21:52

No, and uh, and rapidly.

SPEAKER_01 21:54

Rapidly. Yeah. What is something you think has been like the number one evolution of this business in the last two years?

SPEAKER_04 22:00

I'm gonna say the networking effect, really. I think that that has been because social media, I think, is a big part of that. Because, hey, I met you in April, right? And then it's like, okay, we met, we had a fabulous dinner, we had so much fun. But between April or April and now, I feel like I know so much about Adam and OpenJar because I'm following him on social media, I'm interacting, I'm engaging. And I feel like that's been a game changer. We've only met through DMs through GMs until now. And it was like, I was so excited because I feel like I I know you. Yeah. And I do think that that's a big advantage that we should all be using to be able to connect outside of these events. And I do think that that's changed in the last couple of years.

SPEAKER_02 22:45

Yeah. Yeah. No, like that. That makes a total. I did want to ask about your your your conference though. Yeah. What exactly goes on at the your conference? It's called the Lawyer Summit Conference.

SPEAKER_04 22:56

The Lawyer Growth Conference. No, Lawyer Growth Summit. I don't know why I said it. I was just going with you.

SPEAKER_02 23:02

Say it again. So if you cut the Lawyer Growth Summit Conference.

SPEAKER_04 23:07

The Lawyer Growth Summit, yeah. So what we try to focus on is content. Yeah. Right? That's a big thing for me. I want unique speakers that are going to talk about their experiences. The one of the best panels, we had a like a lot of good ones, but one we had uh was about the great acquisition era, right? It's very hard to not talk about what's happening in the industry. There are roll-ups, there are mergers, there's so many things happening. We had Jen Gore, we had Jason Hennessy, and we had Andy Kavech who've all publicly talked about their journey of selling or rolling up their business. And that's raw, right? Because everyone kind of tries to keep that private. I thought I was, I've seen Jen Gore speak many times on stage. I thought that she was just brilliant, opening up. And then people in the audience are like, wait, that could be me. How do I get to that next step? Then you pair in someone like Mike Morris. Okay, you want to be able to sell your law firm? Great. Let me help you get from 10 million to 20 million. Like use that ecosystem. And that's really what we're trying to do at the at the at Laura Grove Summit.

SPEAKER_01 24:18

We got it. You now just mentioned three people, um, all that we've been fortunate to have.

SPEAKER_04 24:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:24

Um I love it. Thank you, yes, and uh Jason and Mike.

SPEAKER_04 24:28

Oh, I love that.

SPEAKER_01 24:29

But what they've done is they have shown us it's possible. Yep, they've lived that dream that so many of us think is not attainable, it can never happen to me. But yeah, I think what they're showing people is why not you? Yeah. 100%. Why not? Yeah. I did it. And now Ray made a comment, not negative or positive, just a comment of, well, it might be easy for someone who's now made it to say anyone can do it. Yeah. But you know, it's not like they were born on the other side of the wind. Yeah. They grinded. Yeah, for sure. Many of us work hard, uh, yes, and it doesn't happen, but for those who do, it's not any less uh crediting. It's actually major kudos to those people because they got where all of us would like to be.

SPEAKER_04 25:21

And they left a roadmap.

SPEAKER_01 25:22

And they're coming and they didn't abandon their industry exactly. They came back and said, Okay, let me tell you what I did. Yeah, right? That's huge. Amazingly. He's amazingly candid and amazingly, you know, uh humble about it. And I found that with with Jen as well. Mike just has so much information. Uh one one interview isn't enough.

SPEAKER_04 25:48

No, I'm like, anytime Mike speaks, I'm like taking so many notes. He's an inspiration. And it's like, I just want just to like write it all down and then go back to my house and live it, and then come back to the next event, listen to him, and then just continue to grow through through through all of these guys.

SPEAKER_01 26:06

But let's not take credit away from who our guest is right now, who is the CEO of one of the best branded companies, Lawyer.com. Yeah. And I think that you are showing other women, especially. Thank you. Yeah, I can be CEO. Heck yeah. You know, I'm sure there's people who are like, oh, that the CEO is a woman. Wow, that doesn't happen a lot. And I think that women, whether they're in this industry or not, have to take inspiration from you. Well, thank you. Very spectacular thing. I think I may have even said this to you the first time we met. Yeah. Wow, a woman CEO, this is awesome. Yeah. I just don't see a lot of that. So thank you for being here.

SPEAKER_04 26:43

Well, you're gonna see a lot more, I hope.

SPEAKER_01 26:45

Oh, yeah, absolutely. Yes, and it is again, it's look, look, if you're now you're sitting in that seat and saying, I did it. Yeah, exactly. I bleed red on the outside, you know.

SPEAKER_04 26:55

Work hard, have a vision, yeah, focus. That's key.

SPEAKER_02 26:59

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 27:01

Well, this is so fun, guys.

SPEAKER_02 27:02

So I got something for you.

SPEAKER_04 27:03

I love this. You guys are so good.

SPEAKER_02 27:05

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I like to end every better use that's all wait.

SPEAKER_01 27:11

We work for compliments.

SPEAKER_04 27:14

I know my audience.

SPEAKER_02 27:15

Yeah. Um you guys brought up, you brought up Jason, Mike, and Jen. One thing that all of them had similar that I caught on to. Yeah, and especially I follow a lot of people online, but I'm a person of habits and patterns. And now I'm noticing this pattern. Like over time, now I'm digesting more successful people that I look up to.

SPEAKER_03 27:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:38

Everybody that I look up to online, and now I'm meeting in person as well, too, all has the same habit of just exposing and telling the truth of what they do to everybody. Meaning they have no problem sharing that secret sauce. The reason I say this now is because I'm going to say in the last three months, I've been doing this with receiving a lot of negative pushback from some other marketers and stuff, which I'm now understanding is okay. Yeah, for you, now for the camera and everybody watching, what are give us a secret. Give us something honest and truth that like you can just tell everybody that they may know or they may not know, but just a transparent truth that you can provide some sort of value to who's watching right now.

SPEAKER_04 28:22

I think me personally, every day is not a win. And it and it can't be, right? We have as many failures as we do successes, and it's just keeping your head straight when things aren't working out, right? We at the end of the day, we're all running a business, and business is hard. It is very hard to run a business. But as long as we can stay focused and positive, I think that is what you need to get to the other side, to the more problems and more challenges, which then keeps going. I mean, it's there's never gonna be a day where you don't have a problem or a challenge, and it's just gotta have fun getting through it. And that's our that's our secret.

SPEAKER_01 29:02

I like that. I'll tell you why. Um, if you look at social media, especially if you look at mine, yeah. I show you the best of what I have. Yeah. I don't some people like to go on there and profess their misery. I I don't do that. Yeah. Everything I want you to see is what I want you to see.

SPEAKER_04 29:20

Yeah, which is fair.

SPEAKER_01 29:21

Um but people have to be very cautious to not get caught up in thinking that your life, my life, Ray's life is great every day. Because it's not just the reality that you just depicted. And I think that was a very brilliant closing remark. Yeah. So thank you. It was an absolute pleasure.

SPEAKER_04 29:40

This is so much fun. When are we doing it again?

SPEAKER_01 29:42

Uh, we're gonna be yeah, no, we are not opposed to repeat. Yeah, right. Yeah, we will bring you on and um we'll probably start shooting again at the new year.

SPEAKER_04 29:51

We'll see you in Miami.

SPEAKER_01 29:52

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:53

That's a good chance that's where we're gonna put it. Say less. By then, there's probably gonna be we'll have a lot more probably put together at that point.

SPEAKER_04 29:59

Well, I think I commend you guys for getting out there, trying something new. This is an amazing format. It's so fun. So we wish you all the success, really. Thank you. So excited.

SPEAKER_02 30:09

Thank you very much. So fun joining us.

SPEAKER_00 30:12

This badass episode has been brought to you by Open and Raw, featuring Rayla Carney of Raw Law Media and Adam Warren from Open Jar. Special thanks to the amazing Colleen Joyce of Lawyer.com. This won't be the last time we have Colleen on the show. She has a lot more to say and even more to teach us.