Breaking The Silence Together: The Aftermath of Suicide; Episode 4

The Masks We Wear - In this episode, James and Shawn explore the “chameleon effect” of warriors — how so many hide behind a smile or positive words while silently battling hurt, trauma, stress, and fear. Too often, they carry these struggles alone, afraid that asking for help will make them seem weak or less masculine, when in reality they’re simply trying to survive another day.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Please be advised that the following podcast contains language that may be triggering or traumatizing to some audiences. Viewer discretion is advised. The views and opinions expressed by guests on these episodes are solely those of the individual contributors and do not necessarily represent the official views of heroes in the sky or an article solution.

SPEAKER_07 0:57

Welcome, Sean. Episode four, can you believe that?

SPEAKER_09 1:03

It's uh moving very rapidly.

SPEAKER_07 1:06

Yes, rapid, rapid, right? But so welcome everybody. I'm James Collins. I'm the president and founder of Heroes in the Sky Foundation. We are joined by Sean Hibbard, the man, the myth, the legend behind Nautical Salute, right?

SPEAKER_09 1:22

It's it's something, yeah. Founder and uh executive director of Nautical Salute.

SPEAKER_07 1:27

Right. So welcome to Breaking the Silence Together, the Aftermath of Suicide podcast. Tonight's episode is titled The Mask We Wear. And but before we get into that, uh I do want to say thank you to our sponsors, the American Legion Post 135 in Savannah, Georgia. Uh, you'll notice they're in the top right, top you know, left up there, you'll see their logo up there. But the American Legion Post 135 is located in historic downtown Savannah, Georgia at 1108 Bull Street. They are a member of the largest veteran service organization in the nation. They were founded on the principles of service to our veterans, to our community, state, and nation. Their membership is open to any veteran who has served honorably and to active duty service members. They are home to the local 1110, Betty Bombers, Brighter Day, Centennial Bean, and Lee Chai. And their bar is also open to the public throughout the week. They hold several events in their ballroom each year that are open to the public. And here's the best part, Sean. If you're inner, if you're in Savannah, Georgia, or you're thinking about doing an event in Savannah, Georgia, their ballroom is for rent. So if you're ever if you if you're in, you want to use that space, it's a beautiful space in the American Legion Post and beautiful downtown Savannah. Contact our friends over at the American Legion Post 135. And yeah you go. So I think we got a good episode tonight, Sean. I think we got it.

SPEAKER_09 3:03

I think it's gonna be one that a lot of veterans can relate to. I think we've outdone ourselves. What you think? Well, um I'm definitely thinking that we're gonna we're gonna not ruffle feathers, but make a lot of connections where people can kind of relate to it.

SPEAKER_07 3:22

Right. Okay.

SPEAKER_09 3:25

So why don't you tell me what it's about?

SPEAKER_07 3:27

All right. So I guess we're talking about the mask that we all wear when we're dealing with our emotional trauma and our post-traumatic stress. And you know, you know, we we hide these feelings and these emotions, you know, behind this so-called mask very well to some of us, right?

SPEAKER_09 3:48

Yeah, but it's it's one of those things that like you know, you know, it whether it's a fake smile, it's the I'm fine, and I'm just gonna shrug it off, right? Like no one needs to really see the the cracks in my in my emotional armor, you know, or the version of ourselves where um the world, you know, doesn't see how we're falling apart uh underneath the surface. So I like to call it the community, I like to call it the communion effect in a lot of ways, right? Just fitting into whatever environment it is, keeping our emotions down and just existing.

SPEAKER_07 4:31

Right. And I think what's important here is we need to we need to highlight and focus how well some of us have become at hiding this pain. Almost uh we're almost experts at deceiving the public of how we're really feeling emotionally and mentally.

SPEAKER_09 4:53

Well, it's kind of like how like when people say, Oh, you're a disabled vet, what's wrong with you? Right, you know, it's like, well, I don't go around just broadcasting, except for you know, my license plate does say I'm disabled vet, right? So that's that's one way, but they don't see the outside of the physical things that are obvious, they don't see the other thing that's hidden beneath the layers of our skin and and our brains and uh the torment and the trauma that that kind of just stays right there, either at surface level, above, or right below.

SPEAKER_07 5:28

Right. And here's here's what's really important because as we as you serve your country, you serve your nation, you serve, you know, whether you were a first responder, the uniform you wore does not matter. No, what we're really starting to learn is when you raise your hand or you serve this nation as a as a public safety official, you pay an almost sacrifice with your life. And sometimes that sacrifice is seen when we when we lose warriors in the line of duty. Sometimes that sacrifice is seen when we lose warriors by their own hand due to their trauma. But most often we we lose our warriors gradually over time to this so-called mask that we all wear and we hide our demons so well that people around us don't know they're there.

SPEAKER_09 6:25

And then you know, I mean I'm gonna I'm gonna deviate real quick because you know we have some people that are tuned in or watching, and I kind of want to highlight a few little comments that people who are listening are are responding to some of the things that we're saying. Uh so I hope you don't mind, but I'm gonna read a couple things from uh Michael Van Buren, aka Boomer. Um, he says it's easier to pretend things are okay than to explain to someone who only cares in that moment. That's that's that's that's spot on, right? Um the second thing, yeah. Go ahead, respond to that.

SPEAKER_07 7:04

The energy, the energy it takes to if you were to portray or let somebody know how deep you are really feeling or how emotionally strained you are really feeling, would that would be it, that would be a task. And like it makes perfect sense that if someone walks up to you and says, Hey, are you okay? I'm fine. That's the easiest way out.

SPEAKER_09 7:28

I mean, how many times do you is that that's what we say at the VA? I'm fine, I'm okay. But they write that down. That means something totally different to them than it does to us or another brother or sister who kind of gets that. It's like, how many times have you uh in in your relationships you'd be like, is everything okay? I'm fine. Well, I'm fine is not a positive thing.

SPEAKER_07 7:55

No, no, for those listening, if you have if you're if you have a loved one that is a veteran or first responder and they use that term quite frequently, please know most of the time there you know there's something deeper there.

SPEAKER_09 8:13

Yeah, that's you know, it's just I'm gonna I I'm gonna figure out an acronym for FINE that we can that that we can break down, and it'll come to me, but uh that'll have meaning. And you know, I can tell you from personal experience, I got great at pretending.

SPEAKER_07 8:30

Oh, you know, we still I mean you you got great at pretending. How about we're still great at pretending?

SPEAKER_09 8:39

Exactly, exactly. Yeah, no, that is Rich's phrase in the comments. And that's I'm fine, you know.

SPEAKER_07 8:47

Um and I it's it's yeah, and I want to and I want to welcome in. I don't and I'm sorry if I mess up your name. Uh last name is Cruz. Thank you for joining us and joining our live stream. We're glad you're here. And yeah, glad that you're watching us. And there's another comment down here, Sean, that most people don't understand the mental disability that comes with service.

SPEAKER_09 9:14

Yeah, you know, but I wonder why. Yeah, I yeah, I I think I think with all my years of experience and your years of experience and being in leadership, right? I it comes down to just simplicity of it's easier to just Charlie Mike and move on and treat everything emotional as a speed bump. Right. I'm gonna get through it, so I'm just gonna go ahead and blow past it at 40 miles an hour when I should really drop down to about five miles an hour, take my time, make sure I don't do any damage. And I mean, right, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 10:01

Hey, wow, we got an acronym. We got an acronym. Thank you, Jen. I'm gonna read this, and this this, so this I'm not gonna apologize for this because that you, you know, there was a warning content for you came in here. So we're gonna read this exactly like this is, and I'm not gonna sugarcoat anything. So fucked up, insecure, neurotic, and emotional. Put some you put some that's some strong letters.

SPEAKER_09 10:29

Get out, get out of my head because she she has to live with me, so she's describing me. Oh she's that's uh no truer words spoken.

SPEAKER_07 10:44

I know, and then I'm thinking we need to keep that around. Thank you, Jen, for future episodes. Start so when people start talking about I'm fine, let's let's put some real meaning to it.

SPEAKER_09 10:55

Hey, welcome in. You know, why can't we print that on the back of a card? We let's make a shirt with that. We can absolutely do that. Dude, a shirt with we'll just do the uh the asterisk and different things like that.

SPEAKER_07 11:11

What dude? Let's let's make a shirt with your lo with nautical salute, here is in the skies logo on it, maybe on the sleeves, and that the be the be the back of the shirt, or we use the podcast official logo on the front and make that the back of the shirt. We could. Well, see, welcome in, Chrissy. Thank you for joining us. Welcome in, Philomena and Jessica. Yes, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_09 11:39

So what you got yes, you know, I kinda like this aspect of it, being able to interact a little bit. I do, I do know because this will also kind of help keep some of the conversation uh uh realistic uh as well to to our audience who are you know veterans, spouses, supporters. I think it's important to kind of hear a piece of their voice within it. That interactive piece is is key. Um staying where we're at here currently, you know, we're talking about the mask, right? Um, hiding some of those things like our reactions, hiding to either fireworks, loud noises, um, masking um our position in in areas uh to maintain hypervigilance. We've talked about that last week a good bit with the hypervigilance piece. Um, but those are all masking issues that we're dealing with because we're still in that operator mindset. And it's that fear, right? So we have a guest later today that's that's gonna really kind of emphasize uh the fine message, I think, because it's as a face. So you know, yeah, talking about that, like what are what are some what are some things, James, you know, moving back to you a little bit about um after like you know, pretending, you know, being exhausted, but pretending that you're still gonna go, go, go. Like after that, what what do what do you think are some further add-ons to that?

SPEAKER_07 13:18

It's so there's this one hits home for me as far as the mask, because I suffer significantly with nightmares and flashbacks, and trying to pretend that I don't have those or trying to mask the fact that while I'm in public at any point, if one of those triggers goes off, I'm on the ground holding my head screaming. And and when those things happen, people treat you like you're not a person, like they look at you different. They they you know, it's it's and they don't even and they don't understand how to accomplish. I think it's the fact that we don't have enough training or conversations with some with the civilian sector about when a veteran is triggered, this is the steps you should take. Because you know many times I've been triggered laying on the ground from a softball hitting the top of a dugout behind me, and I didn't know it was coming, and people were trying to just run up on me and grab me or touch, you know, make sure I was okay, when in reality, that's the worst thing you could ever do.

SPEAKER_09 14:23

But at the same time, is it is it is it the community's responsibility to react to us, or is it no? I mean, no, so knowing those people that are closest to us, you know, if they're with us, I think they would do a pretty good job at saying, you know, just leave them alone a little bit, give them some space, don't crowd them. Um I for me, Jen will often be like, she knows when I'm starting, when I'm getting worked up and I'm you know, I'm having issues, and she just kind of jumps in and just takes control, I guess you can kind of say, to say, hey, I got this. You like you just kind of take the time you need, I'll deal with this knucklehead.

SPEAKER_07 15:08

Yeah, and that's and Jess is really good about that. The the more they're around it and they understand it, and two, it you know, that's the mask that we wear, we have to start dealing with some of these emotions that we're trying to hide because what while we're in public, we should really be trying to get a better grip on on our emotions and our behaviors. And I don't know, it's it's really difficult sometimes, but surrounding yourself with the right people, no, and it and especially making sure that you're that the ones closest to you, I think you just hit something right on the head on the nail, right? The ones closest to you that are always around you that you trust the most, they know how to deal with those triggers, they know how to notice those to maybe pull you out of them or maybe make you feel safe when you're going through those things.

SPEAKER_09 16:00

Yeah. Um Philomena uh posted James. I I think you should definitely uh address and take that comment because um this definitely is in your specialty in Wheelhouse here.

SPEAKER_07 16:14

Okay. I'm gonna read this if you don't mind, okay? Um uh it's she put it in here. It's been nine months since my son made his choice. Days before I found he would stay, he he would say he was good. I would invite him over for dinner, he would say he was good, checked in on him, and he would respond he was good. I beat myself up because I never went to his house or followed up with him. It breaks my heart. I don't hold and I know that this is hard to answer because this is you know dealing with a loved one and when it when mental health, but that fine word, I mean not not often they did do people give us signs, and that's one of the things that we struggle with, and and that's why I say not to beat yourself up, is because in most cases when we lose people to their own hand, they didn't leave signs, and if the signs were there, they were very subtle, they weren't hey, I'm in trouble.

SPEAKER_09 17:22

They not it didn't red flags weren't raised, it was they got they got good, they got good at hiding and masking to protect that piece of them that they didn't want the world to see, especially their loved ones.

SPEAKER_07 17:35

Correct, and then and sometimes too, it's I can tell you personally when I my personal story is I've survived two to two attempts, and both of my attempts were came from fractured relationships, but I really felt like I was a burden to my family, and that's the and that's a complete myth. Let's go ahead and put that out there right now. It is a complete myth that you are a burden to your family because you are never a burden to your family, you are never a burden to those that love you, your battle buddies, those that believe in you, and you never will be a burden. But in that emotional toll or that emotional cone of distress, as I like to call it, when you can't see anything but your mental pain, you don't see that. And it's the farthest from the truth. And I just want to say, I want to thank Philomena for coming in here and opening up and and and having the courage to to talk about this because the the the tragedy she's dealing with, a lot of a lot of people would would tuck tail and run, or they would just hide and definitely shy away from it, absolutely. Right, but she's in here talking about it openly. So it's I really I can really appreciate that, and I want our audience to just lift her up and lift her family up for the courage that she has. And I hope I answered that that response, but it's that's just it's hard to answer that.

SPEAKER_09 18:57

I think I think the fact that you know part of the mission that you know Heroes in the Sky has is about the education as well and being there in the aftermath for the families um to help not only process, right, but you know, relieve some of that that burden that they may carry of the weight of maybe I should have done more, I could have done more, and I didn't, but you know, it's just not it's just not always possible. Um, welcome in, Kelly. Uh Antonio, uh Antonio says, I use my kids and I focus on them, like literally laser focus, bring them everywhere with me. It's crazy as it may seem, it helps. Look, it sounds like to me, Antony, that you have put in a measure in place that serves two purposes, right? One, you love your kids, and spending time with them is never a bad thing. You know, absolutely the the closer you hold them tight and show them that you love them, it should feed some of that back to you. But I need you to I need you to listen to this. It's okay to love yourself too, and and we don't always know how to do that. Um, it's something that I'm gonna encourage you to take time and and and pull the best pieces of what you get out of that and just also look at the positive things in yourself. Um, because in my darkest days, I've I've been learning how to love myself and even affirm that to myself that I'm worthy of that.

SPEAKER_07 20:39

Right. Yeah, you're you're worthy of so most often, and I and I have a really bad, I'm I'm I'm telling on myself in here tonight. So um a lot of times I suffer with a diminished value of self-worth. And my self-worth, that diminished value comes from so much before, where just losing a relationship with children, or just so many other things that I felt I could have done better at. But what I'm starting to learn over time is we we can use this example in in anything we do. Our personal failures sometimes they can beat us up, they they can drown us, right? Or we could try to use them as stepping stones. Where, and I could be the first to tell you, I probably need to take this advice because I have beaten myself up so much over so many things. But you know, when you go through tragedy and you do and then there's trauma present, a lot of times we will diminish our self worth because we feel like we didn't do enough, or you know, we didn't say the right things. When in reality, there's if the signs weren't there for you to see, it would have been hard for you to know. To say anyway, right? You know, and that's just the reality of what we're talking about of mental health. And so, you know, you have to you have to try to focus. Like, I love that I love this idea of of self-worth and self-love, that you know, you you have to be you outside of all the vices you put, right?

SPEAKER_09 22:22

So well, the great thing about our guest clear is that is one of the principles and platforms that they utilize for their company that they run, uh, and even even the lives that they produce is it's about self-worth, it's about taking the time. You know, um, when you spent years trying to maintain that control over your emotions, um, finally opening up can feel both freeing and scary as hell. Absolutely scary because you don't know what people are gonna do with it, and you're vulnerable. Yeah. So, you know, when you when you're when you're exploring that, you're looking at you know grief and you're looking at you know fear of judgment or becoming a burden, like it's like yeah, I'm just gonna close down.

SPEAKER_07 23:17

Well, and then most oftentimes what people don't see is the value of cur oh the value of courage, right? Courage most often comes with self-doubt. It comes out with you know, you're you're opening yourself up for people to you know say certain things or for you to have to deal with certain things, and you have to be ready to own that courage and say, you know what, I know I have problems, or I know I'm struggling with this, but this is my mental health. Like this is you know, I'm the you know, I'm the one reliving it every day in our heads, like and a lot of things what what people don't see is what we actually live through in our heads, and so we have to learn to deal with those emotions, and sometimes that's really hard, and but it takes courage, it takes courage to open up to admit that there might be a problem or you might have some issues, you know, thinking about some of the some of the those emotions, right?

SPEAKER_09 24:23

Whether it's grief, guilt, oftentimes anger and uh fear, uh, and the memories, the memories also of like survivors' guilt that continue to play a part in everyday life. Um why why am I here? Why are they not? And it should have been me, or um and and even opening up and expressing those, also give control to other people to either exploit it, embrace it, or help be part of the healing. Right. And I I hope that people have someone that's a loved one that they can turn to, whether it's family member, uh a friend, a service, a battle buddy, a service member that they've that they've grown close with, you know, hopefully, hopefully there's somebody out there that people feel comfortable enough being vulnerable with about.

SPEAKER_07 25:21

Right. Well, with vulnerability, like you said, you just used a perfect word, is fear. Because fear of judgment, right? We we talk talk about that. How how are people gonna see me? Uh looking weak. That the looking weak part is probably one of my biggest pet peeves with mental health. And I try to explain that very, very openly because it it baffles my mind that someone can call you weak because you openly you openly admit that you're having mental health struggles, and you're you're still fighting your demons every day, you're not letting those demons win. You're you're you know, and and emotionally you could be just hurting, but you never let the demons win. What sign of that is weakness? Where where is weakness come into that? Because when I look at it, that's a sign of strength and resilience because you're not giving up.

SPEAKER_09 26:17

But what does history tell us though, James? History tells us that a man to be strong needs to bear the weight of the world on his shoulders and his back, shut up and drive on. Mike Mike in the comments says, I also feel as a man that we're looked down on for our mental health. Also, like we are expected to just deal with everything and never have any chips on our armor. And if we do, we are less dead. I mean, okay, I I just read that. You need to get out of my head because I just said that. And that's the crazy part about, you know, you must have been reading some of my books, Mike. Um, so that's that's one of those things. And uh welcome in Cooper. Um wow, I tell you, we've already been we've already been live, you know, for almost 30 minutes. And I feel like we're just scratching the surface, man.

SPEAKER_07 27:15

Oh, we are, and I I think the having having other inputs in here for us to discuss has has opened this up, this conversation up significantly. And yeah, that I mean, I'm I love the way it where it's going. Um I like that we're involving other people in our community that may need to hear a word of encouragement, or maybe they can offer a word of encouragement. Maybe they yeah, we can maybe we can be inspired by something that somebody comes in here and says.

SPEAKER_09 27:48

Well, and and just the little things, right? You know, you how many times are people listening to us, but they don't actually hear either us or somebody else that has a positive message or has experience with something that could then help them. So I'm gonna say that again, guys. Just because you're listening doesn't always mean you're hearing it. And that's the key. Take the time, like the speed bomb, slow down, don't roll past it fast because you might destroy some stuff. Take the time, slow down, go over it, process it, share it with your loved one, and then you can charlie mic with it.

SPEAKER_07 28:36

Yeah. Well, here's another one nobody is weak when being real about life's test. Strength is reaching out when there is a need. Well, they I think is identifying the need, and I think we need to start highlighting the fact that the need we we need to start making it a priority where we start focusing on our needs, right? Yeah, if you know, focus on your own needs, because you know many, how many times that I've been I've been doing this for eight years. I've been in the nonprofit sector, mental health sector for eight years. We've helped 170 families, 100, we've honored 170 families and helped 100 and and their and their families and their warriors. And I most commonly hear, you know, well, you're doing all this stuff for other people. What are you doing for yourself? And I can't answer that.

SPEAKER_09 29:34

Because I me let me answer that a little bit for you because you don't know it, but you're surrounding yourself with people who have a shared vision and mission that's also gonna show up for you. Absolutely. Yeah. So you're building you're building your support team for you. Yeah, and the more you get to know somebody and know and learn their little idiosyncrasies and and how you know the tone of their voice changes or when they're high, they're low, you know, you're you're doing something special, brother. And I'm just I'm blessed to be along this journey with you.

SPEAKER_07 30:18

Well, and we but when you know, when we talk about the families, right? You know, look at look at the families we have in the comments, see opening up with open the having the courage to open up to us. That's why we do what we do is the families, because oftentimes when we lose warriors to suicide, that trauma and that grief does not go away. It transfers directly to our families, who are then expected to not only deal with their trauma and their loss, they're dealing with the demons that just got transferred to them. Yeah, and and that's that's important for us to start. How do we advocate for those families? What can we do to give them a voice, to give them an identity, so they feel like they're they are worthy, that they are wanted, so they don't follow in the steps of the high, the elevated suicide risk for families once the warriors lost to suicide. Like, what are we doing? And that's that's what drives me with Heroes in the Sky is what am I doing for the families?

SPEAKER_09 31:18

You know, what you know, we uh so Marty, Marty's in the chat, and I I've got to highlight this because it it it couldn't be better said. I think it's a double-edged sword, you know, on the men versus women. Uh, like men are told to be strong without feeling their emotions, but as a woman, it's difficult because people don't expect females to have um uh part of it cut off, uh, but have that, I guess, the ability or the strength, right? But you know what? I think oftentimes as females typically being the nurturer, I think it's emotions kind of expected. And and I I think more attention also needs to be paid, you know, to the female voice of as a veteran and first responders and and family members, right? Because think about this. As we go through our stuff, it's not uncommon for us to know this. Who takes the brunt of the veterans demons? It's the it's the uh it's the family. The families, whether it's male and female, right?

SPEAKER_07 32:37

The spouses, the the brothers, the the sisters, the ones closest to them. And I personally, I mean, I kind of share my story about how what my wife has had to deal with. But I wouldn't think it was it was so severe until I was staring at a window holding a loaded pistol because I thought someone was coming to my house for three nights. But and that and I can't be the only one that has those episodes where other spouses and other family members are put under some kind of stress because they're trying to understand that warrior who has post-traumatic stress, and they're trying to do their best to be there for him, but that's not an easy role.

SPEAKER_09 33:19

Well, and with post-traumatic stress also often is coupled by depression, and you know, they don't really talk about this a whole whole lot, but the functional depression, right? Where you still go to work because there's an obligation or a feel of an obligation. Um, there's the showing up at family functions, showing up to work, showing up to your kids' baseball games or softball games, whatever it be, participating, but still being just a shell of that person, of having that mask on, you know, because that's the whole purpose of this episode today, is really living with the mask and uh the in the fake smiles. Um we also said, you know, oftentimes the funniest people in the room are the ones that you know die by suicide. And it's and it's not and it's you think it's a shock, but stop and look at the Robin Williamses and you know the battle buddies that you that were always goofing off down range and just being silly, the class clowns. I I mean it's it's overwhelming, actually.

SPEAKER_07 34:30

It's those ones that always check on other people, it's those ones that always seem to have it together. That it's always that you think they're the strongest person in the room, but physically and mentally they're not like mentally, they're not as strong as you think they are. And that's and that's why we lose our warriors to suicide. And that's and because we're so good at hiding these masks, masking these emotions, it often does come up as a shock of I can't believe, I can't believe that. We got a comment down here real quick that, and I'll just paraphrase it, of you know this how painful the struggle really is, and how many unanswered questions that were produced because their warrior died by suicide. Yeah, and and if they hadn't seen it, if they hadn't seen it themselves, then they wouldn't believe it it was real. That's that's powerful.

SPEAKER_09 35:28

The amount of trauma that produces that's frighteningly powerful at the end of the day. Like I don't wanna I don't want to shy away from how major of an impact you know some of you guys make. And and yeah, you do you do carry these birds, right? Think of it like this what happens to a house that is not lived in, that's not maintained, you know, the outside can look strong and sturdy, but the bones start breaking down if you neglect it. Yeah, it's it's a fact. If you don't live in a house and take care of it, the house starts crumbling and dying. While outside is the last to go.

SPEAKER_07 36:21

You don't see that from the outside. Nope. That's no, and that that um that emotional shell that that we that we put around ourselves, we we think that people can't see through um some the ones closest to you can see through it. There's times when I've been at my lowest, and maybe you've reached out, or when I disappeared from TikTok for like three months, and then people are like, Hey, are you okay? Like, some sometimes you do get the people around you that that notice your behaviors and your mannerisms and know when you're know when you're not okay. They can see through that that that shell.

SPEAKER_09 37:03

Yeah, combat, combat down there, Rich. And uh, you know. All right. So you know, I can't help but want to just scoop them up. I can't help but want to scoop everybody up either, right? You know, not trying to save them, but just show up for them.

SPEAKER_07 37:18

Right. Well, I've attempted three times in my life and had the thoughts a dozen times, and nobody knew about it. Well, I'm glad you failed three times. Okay, I have failed twice. And anyone else in here listening to us, um, I we're we want to celebrate the failures, especially in this context. If you're still here fighting, are you you got a loved one that's still here fighting? Let's celebrate their failures.

SPEAKER_09 37:48

Yeah, you know, Marty, uh, you bring up a very, very good point. If if people don't check on you and and they don't really care or you don't think they care about you, how long would it be before somebody checked on somebody? And I know randomly, Marty, I'll just when I'm it's been a while, haven't heard from you. You know, I've I've definitely reached out to some of you guys, not patting myself on the back, but just checking in, doing a good pulse check because you know what? Not because I I fear like something bad's gonna happen, but it's good for people to show up for you. And um, we're uh here in about five minutes. We're gonna be taking a break. And when we come back, and and uh we're gonna be bringing up a special guest, um, Lance Price with SFH. So uh we're gonna get ready to uh wrap this up that wrap this the until the break here in five minutes. So let's go ahead and respond to a few more comments if if you don't mind, James.

SPEAKER_07 38:46

Yeah, absolutely. Let's let's let's read some more. So I see some comments down here that I like this one too. The only time that failure is an option is when we're talking about this. You know what? And I'm okay with that. You know, I'm okay with that one. And you know, I see it in here that let's try to find some more comments. There's one in here about manic, you know, people checking on you or are not checking on you if you just disappear, you know. So you have to absolutely, you know, I don't know. I I I am thoroughly enjoying this comment section and people interacting with us. I don't know about you, but I am I am thoroughly enjoying this, and I hope that those listening will will share this out and more of y'all will join our our our podcast and and come in here and share your thoughts because it's really powerful and moving to me that yeah.

SPEAKER_09 39:47

I saw Kelly pop in earlier. I don't know if she's still here or not, but uh right, you know, it's so many people that we've all come close with, we just we we have to show up for each other.

SPEAKER_07 40:00

Absolutely, yeah. Because sometimes that battle buddy's all you got, sometimes that battle buddy that knows you the best is the first one that sees the signs of distress, and they're the ones that need to act. Because if if it's someone that's not around you all the time that may not notice that you're acting differently, they don't know any different. But someone like you that knows me very well, you're gonna be or my wife or Jen that we that we've become family with, y'all would be the first ones to say, hey, something's going on here. That this isn't right, and then and reach out and be there and just and and show a presence. And that's what we all need to do is show a presence for those around us that we love and let them know that they're worthy, that they're worthy to be here, they're not a burden, and and to tell them to stay so they don't so so we don't lose them to their mental health.

SPEAKER_09 40:57

So uh just to just to kind of be completely open and transparent, uh, I think some of you may have heard uh excerpt on maybe TikTok or something like that of a spoken word song that I had done. Uh so here in a couple of minutes, we're gonna be playing a full song in its entirety. And uh we definitely want you to kind of just take it all in because it is a journey, it's it's about being in our darkest places and then also still having hope. You know, I never want to be doom and gloom, and neither one of us do, but at the same time, you gotta acknowledge the past and the present in order to not dwell on it, but use those pieces so that you can go forward and and be and just be ready to live versus surviving, right? All right, yeah. Jen's Jen's comments real quick. You go ahead and read that. It's better to come to you since he's my spouse.

SPEAKER_07 41:55

As a family member, it is important to get to know the battle, to know the battle buddies, know who you can call for backup. Absolutely, Jen. I I know from the time we've met from the met with y'all met with y'all that if anything ever comes up, I know who to call and I know who's gonna check on me. And there's another one in here. Ryan's in here. I cannot go without this. Is my brother, I grew up with him, and he has been there for me, even though we haven't lived in the same state for years. He's always checked up on me, he's always been that presence, and I could not, I probably wouldn't be here today without him. And so thank you, Ryan, for being in here and amazing, dude. Amazing Cooper. All right, yeah, everybody in here, even if we don't know you, thank you for coming in here. Thank you for having courage to come talk to us and and tell your story. And y'all keep it up as we keep going lives. Y'all have y'all get y'all share this out and let's fill these lobbies and let's get this all across the United States. Can y'all do that for us?

SPEAKER_09 43:04

All right, I guess without further ado, we're gonna go to commercial break. Watch this video and Lance, be ready when you come back. Yep.

SPEAKER_02 43:18

Like sitting in the truck too long after work, because home felt safer when the engine was still running. Like staring at a grocery store aisle, trying to remember why your heart suddenly started racing. Like waking up at 2.13 in the morning, sweating through memories you never asked to keep. See, they trained us to survive the battlefield, but nobody really taught us how to survive ourselves afterward. Nobody talked about how trauma follows you home wearing civilian clothes, how it hides its fireworks. Crowded rooms, empty bottles, divorce papers, missed phone calls, and the sentence. I'm fine. Especially that sentence. I know veterans who carried entire teams on deployment. But struggle to carry groceries inside the house now. Men and women who could navigate chaos overseas but can't navigate their own thoughts when the room gets quiet. And still, they wake up. Still, they fight. That matters. You hear me? That matters. Because hope isn't always loud. Sometimes hope is just making the appointment. Answering the phone. Talking for the first time, saying, no, I don't think I'm okay. That's courage too. Maybe even the purest kind. See the world loves the image of the warrior, but healing asks something harder. It asks the warrior to become human again. To let people in. To trust again. To stop apologizing. For wounds nobody can see. And that process, it's ugly sometimes. There are setbacks, bad nights, anger that shows up uninvited. Days where depression feels heavier than body armor ever did. But there are also moments, small moments, where light gets through. The kids laugh, a sunrise after a sleepless night. Brothers and sisters sitting around the table finally telling the truth. A stranger saying, Me too. That's where healing begins. But in realizing the trauma doesn't get to right the ending. You survived war. You survived loss. You survived becoming someone you barely recognize. Now comes the hardest mission of all. Believing you deserve peace too. And maybe peace doesn't mean forgetting. Maybe peace is learning that your scars cannot prove you're broken. You kept going. So to every veteran still fighting battles nobody sees. For needing help. You are not forgotten.

SPEAKER_01 46:43

And your story. It is not over.

SPEAKER_09 47:42

I don't know how to do this yet. So we're still playing with some of the bugs now that we've got three in here.

SPEAKER_07 47:47

We've got to figure out how we well say you're just gonna have to play with the see which one fit, right? There you go. There you go.

SPEAKER_04 47:56

Hey, we're all the same size.

SPEAKER_07 47:59

Boom. Welcome in, Lance.

SPEAKER_04 48:04

Thanks. Before we get too far into it, I was listening to you guys, and I'm gonna say the mask, you know, don't wear anything. Those motherfuckers out the window, y'all. Let's do this.

SPEAKER_09 48:16

Right. I love the analogy, yes. So so Lance, uh man, I tell you, what you guys do is phenomenal.

SPEAKER_04 48:24

And for those listening, I was just looking to be a t-shirt brand, bro.

SPEAKER_09 48:29

Yeah, tell us a little bit about the uh the concept, a little bit about who you are specifically and what you've done in the past and why SFH came about and kind of what your all's mission is.

SPEAKER_04 48:41

Yeah, absolutely. I did uh 18 years before getting medically retired as TDI and PTS. Um when I got out, I wanted to continue to serve, and I partnered with multiple nonprofits, and the majority of the nonprofits that I partnered with was not doing what they said they were going to do. And of course, my conscience kicked in. And if you're not going to do what you want to do, I don't want to put my name on a label that the right things aren't being done. Um my friends had a concept to come up with a t-shirt brand, and a good friend of mine, Tyler Stubborn, triple M first triple MPT American, just about Afghanistan, um came up with a phrase that we've all said time and time again, we are still fucking here. Wow, that just happened, but we are still fucking here. Um and it stuck, and then we went with SFH, and from there we got the EKG, um, which as you can tell is a sicily pause, and then the heart beat coming back. The reason for that is Ty's heart stopped over a dozen times on the table. Um, but his resilience um led through, and that's the reason between the live out of spy and the heart on our very first design that we have. And since then, our goal is just to reach out to people and let them know no matter what lurch you're in, you're not alone. If you're in that darkness, there is a way out, no matter what walk of life you're in. Not just, we're veterans, yes, so the veteran community found us first, but there's so many more out there that need our help, whether it's PTS, whether it's drug addiction, whether it's human trafficking. We've had the opportunity to work with organizations that work with all of those things. And how did we do that? We were just ourselves. We told our story, and people got behind what we started. Like I said, it was a clothing brand. The brand became a mission. The mission has now became a community, and it's just like continuing to grow. And now Ty and I travel around the U.S. and do motivational speaking and share our stories and sell our clothing lines. We partner with all different nonprofits across the U.S. and 50% of the net proceeds goes back to that nonprofit at every event that we're at.

SPEAKER_01 51:19

Awesome.

SPEAKER_04 51:20

So there's the nutshell.

SPEAKER_07 51:22

Yeah, so we've got some comments coming in. There it sounded like there's a bleeding in the mic, but we are we're working working to address it. So uh okay, is that on my end? It sounds like it.

SPEAKER_06 51:34

Is that better?

SPEAKER_07 51:36

A little bit, but it okay.

SPEAKER_06 51:38

I don't know.

SPEAKER_07 51:39

Yeah, I don't know if it sounded when you were further away from it because it it it there were times when you were speaking that you're the clarity was a lot better.

SPEAKER_04 51:49

Interesting.

SPEAKER_09 51:50

Yeah, it may be just the game.

SPEAKER_04 51:52

Oh no, it's me to figure out technology, guys. I just I just joined the podcast, bro.

SPEAKER_09 51:59

Yeah, well, I mean, we'll do we'll deal with it, but you know, at the same time, um, like you know, the positivity aspect, you know, of the lives that you run on TikTok and such, and and when you and when you speak at different events and such, you know, where where does that positivity come from? Um, number one, and number two, um, did you just wake up one day and say, This is our mission, this is what I want to do? Like, like what gave you that drive to say, I'm gonna do this now.

SPEAKER_04 52:33

I don't know if it was a drive or if it was just the passion of wanting to continue to help others, but not really knowing how to do that. But it it kind of came about itself. Like I said, we were just supposed to be a t-shirt brand, but the name took off, and what why the name was what it was, uh took off to the point that we couldn't keep it a secret anymore.

SPEAKER_09 53:03

I was just uh just uh Natalie uh Brett has just joined, so okay.

SPEAKER_04 53:08

Is it any better now?

SPEAKER_07 53:11

So I'm hearing comments to see if you backed away from it if it does it. I don't know that.

SPEAKER_04 53:16

Okay. Does that work?

SPEAKER_07 53:18

That's a little better. It is a little better.

SPEAKER_04 53:20

A little better, then hold on. How was that?

SPEAKER_07 53:24

Uh it's I think we can roll with that. I mean, I don't think it's gonna be perfect, but it's the it does sound like it's the first thing.

SPEAKER_04 53:30

Now you're gonna have to ask the question again because I have no idea what we're talking about.

SPEAKER_09 53:34

Yeah, just just yeah, just just about you know how how like at what point, you know, with your positivity, the walks you do, the messages that you post, and and and even how you work with people, like at what point did you wake up and say, you know what?

SPEAKER_04 53:52

It's my well, you don't just wake up and and and become positive, especially not through all the darkness. Um, many years of darkness and many years of staying in my way and staying uh choosing to be around people that were in that same darkness with me. So it felt comfortable and uh realizing that there's no comfort in the possibility of losing your wife and your children because of the demons that you face. And we started getting trying to get answers, and we went through years of mental health appointments, all different types. Uh, one of the biggest results that I've had is the stelic ganglion block shot, which is a shot in the neck, and the theory behind it is it puts to sleep the fiber flight nerve, and when it wakes back up, it is not as agitated, so it's easier to be more in control of your PTS instance than done controlling you. Um, that was been a major turn for me and gives me the ability to do what I do now as far as running the ends and ins and outs of a business like the RSFH, helping other nonprofits and other businesses that I have my hands in as well.

SPEAKER_09 55:11

Now, in with that, um you know, I'm sure that there are days when you you don't feel up to it to kind of you know be out there and be rah-rah. Uh, but when when you do make a decision on those days to do it, when you're not what's the driving factor behind that?

SPEAKER_04 55:35

That's the hardest part. There isn't a driving factor, it's discipline, is do it anyway. It's push yourself out there and do it anyway. The hard days are gonna come. How you face those hard days are up to you. If you lay in bed and don't face them, you're gonna end up in that dark tunnel that I was talking about with no way out. So when I say a lot of problems, a lot of issues that we have as veterans, and I think first responders as well. Um, we don't get out of our own way. We got so used to taking care of everyone else, we don't realize that it's time to take care of us now. And before you can take care of others, you've got to take care of yourself. And we didn't realize that for a very long time, and now we are.

SPEAKER_09 56:33

And being okay with uh not being okay and asking for help and or just showing up. I know for me, if I have to ask somebody to show up for me, I'm not gonna ask.

SPEAKER_04 56:49

I'm just gonna do it. Or it's not gonna get done one or the other, or it's not gonna get done, right?

SPEAKER_09 56:55

And then, but then again, it's like but then I can be mad at me.

SPEAKER_04 56:58

I can't, I don't have to be mad at anybody else. I know where you're going with that.

SPEAKER_08 57:01

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_04 57:02

Yeah, we're all guilty of that.

SPEAKER_08 57:04

Well, I don't know if we're all guilty of that.

SPEAKER_04 57:06

I I think the veteran mentality and the first responder mentality, we're all guilty of that, though.

SPEAKER_09 57:11

Yeah, James, um, has there been a time in the last year? Well, actually, that's that's too far back. Is there has there been a time in the last three months where you have found yourself kind of struggling and you know you've had to kind of force yourself to just show up because you didn't want to let somebody down or you had an obligation, but you really didn't want to?

SPEAKER_07 57:36

Mine started back when this new conflict started. Um, I'm gonna just be honest, I have not been okay uh since we since conflict has started back in the Middle East. And I know I do explain that. It's yes, I was an an Operation Ira Operation Iraqi Freedom veteran, but what people fail to realize is all of the munitions, all of the explosives that that were provided to that theater of country that they were using to blow us up with IEDs were provided by Iran. And I get triggered by that because I remember seeing the writing on the side of some of those munitions, and just this new conflict has there have been days that spiraled me where I have not wanted to do anything, but I know I had to. Um, you know, I know that there's some days I don't feel like driving four hours, right? But I have to drive four hours to see my family and and be there for people. There are days I don't feel like going to work, or I don't feel like, you know, whatever it may be. But when I go to work, I actively get to help people and and help them with their mental health. So yeah, there's there are there are a lot of times where mentally I'm I'm just suffering inside, but I I just walk it off like people expect us to and continue the mission. But what I what I'm getting with going with this though is that is very dangerous because the longer we do that, the longer we mask it, it builds up and it becomes a bigger problem than we that we already we already didn't want to deal with. And then you and then you have to rely on your battle buddies that are close to you to notice that oh, he's not okay.

SPEAKER_04 59:27

Like because when you know you stack that wall so hot so high, you can't get past it after so long.

SPEAKER_07 59:33

Yeah, it yeah, and it it's you start going into like into isolation because of like that trauma starts when it builds up to that point, and isolation is the byproduct, that's where your battle is that but you cause that isolation by allowing it to stack up because you're building that wall that's putting you in that isolation.

SPEAKER_04 59:56

You are closing yourself in.

SPEAKER_07 59:58

Yep, and that and most we always do. We and I've done that to myself multiple times over the years.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:04

Oh, we're you we're all guilty of it.

SPEAKER_09 1:00:06

Yeah, think back tactically, right? 2500 repetitions for something to become muscle memory, 2500, yes, so therefore it only takes three days to create a habit. Exactly. So therefore habits become lifestyles, and a lifestyle is what changes because that habit has set in, and you've got that, and you've got that that muscle memory of the effort, the the reaching out, and I'm gonna challenge people who are listening to to find a battle buddy or a support person that that doesn't have one right now, right? Or that is like and if you need to reach out to one of us, yes. Um remember this the hardest work to ever be done in something is the work that you have to do to change it.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:13

And the silver lining's always there, you're just not looking hard enough.

SPEAKER_07 1:01:18

The recognition, you know, that you have to recognize that it it it is your responsibility to pull your a lot of times to pull yourself out of those those dark holes.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:29

Yes, we are responsible for the majority of our suffering, and we have to get out of our own way.

SPEAKER_09 1:01:36

Because it's can you can you can Lance? Can you see the chat? I don't know if you can or not on the side. Okay. Um Cooper, I just want to read this real quick. Uh yeah, absolutely. So she's she's like that. She says, I've got me. It's hard to seek help from others, and when I don't feel welcome, I won't be around. That that is probably some of the strongest statements that anybody, if if you don't feel welcome, why the hell am I gonna go in there? Yeah, or am I why am I gonna show up?

SPEAKER_04 1:02:09

You know, I want to be around people in that situation, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 1:02:13

It's not fun. No, no, because you just feel like people are judging you, or you feel like I don't know, when I go into those crowds like that where I just don't feel welcome, I feel like one, I don't like crowds, but two, if something were to happen or something were to trigger me, I'm in a room full of a whole bunch of strangers that they're just gonna look at me in some kind of awkward way and not even understand what's really happening.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:42

And that that is a level of that's a level of discomfort for and that's why everyone deserves their small support team that they have, because we all need that sometimes.

SPEAKER_09 1:02:53

Yeah, and for those listening, and I don't even know if I told you this yet, I think I've mentioned this to you, but uh for those listening, um Lance with SFH uh is has already has actually been on the backside and he's getting ready. I don't know if you've pushed it out or not, but he has accepted his role uh as uh an advisory member uh to nautical salute. Um, because one, he is in the veteran space, two, he's a business owner, and three, he's got a message of positivity, and he's gonna cut out a lot of the B CS the BS of it. And you know what? We need more people to build a coalition. Think of it as like our own little coalition of doers, right? Of doers, people that are gonna show up, uh, people that are gonna put things on their back and say, you know what? I'm okay saying that I'm not a community, man.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:50

We weren't built to go at anything alone. So why do people continue to try to do it? Because I'm gonna tell you, I did it for a few years, and doing it alone, it ain't possible. So stop.

SPEAKER_09 1:04:00

No, you know, the camaraderie is the word we use, right? That was the word that was used in the military, but we've transitioned out of the military, and where we're living, the people that were that is community.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:16

Camaraderie is community, it's just now we're still here, and we owe it to those that aren't to to do a positive thing and do the right thing for one another. Bottom line. Yes, we serve them, we serve those who are no longer here. We we speak their name and we continue to serve others and their in their names, you know what I mean? That's just it.

SPEAKER_09 1:04:39

You know, one of the things that yeah, go ahead. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_07 1:04:42

Speaking their names is is is really important. Yeah, but what the what people don't see is yes, we speak their names that are no longer here. But who is the population that you don't talk about behind that? Their families. Yeah, they're the ones that are are dealing with the trauma or dealing with the tragic loss, whether that be to, you know, whether that be to suicide or any, you know, falling in the line of duty, either way. We've we really need to start start making a a movement to focusing on these families. And I love what you just said. You know, we owe it to those ones not here to to be the best we can be, to keep to keep honor and recognition in their name. But part of honor and recognition is recognizing that family left behind that's that's that's carrying that leg that's carrying that legacy forward. We have to show them they're worthy, that they're they are valuable. And I wanna we got a good conversation going, but I'll we we always throw some statistics in here and because that's kind of what we do with our education, right? So let's talk about veteran suicide, just veteran suicide, right? And if you're in the comments. I I encourage you to join us. I need someone, you know. So take four, so right now we're at 44 veterans a day. Could be higher. We know it's not lower. We know 44 is the minimum. And we're going to lose 44 veterans a day. Well, each suicide is going to take is going to affect five family, a minimum of five family members. Probably way more. We're just counting the minimum. And then each each suicide, veteran suicide, will affect 135 community members, your battle buddies, your platoon sergeants, the ones that serve next to you, whatever they may be. Your brother, your sister, your spouse. Now, Sean, you want to are anyone to do us a favor of multiplying those together because this number is staggering. And then we're going to add one on top of it. So we so what is 44 times 5? That's right. 44 times 5.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:01

Okay, there we go.

SPEAKER_07 1:07:02

Times 135. You want to give us that answer? I'm going to show you. What is that?

SPEAKER_04 1:07:10

Oh, you did you cheat? You technology. I thought you had paper over there.

SPEAKER_07 1:07:14

Yeah. 29.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:16

I thought you were one of them real genes.

SPEAKER_07 1:07:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:18

Dang it.

SPEAKER_07 1:07:19

44 times 5 times 135. Because five is the family members, 135 is the community members. So every veteran suicide will affect five family members and a minimum of 135 community members. So you have to divide it by 135 to or multiply by 135.

SPEAKER_09 1:07:38

Yeah. 29,700.

SPEAKER_07 1:07:41

That's how many, that's how many that that's that's who's affected by veteran suicide every day. Right now, let's go to a year. So, right? So take 29,700 and multiply that by times 365. I want someone to this one's gonna get you. This is the problem just with just our veteran suicide. Cooper's on it. Go ahead, Cooper, hook us up. So 29,700 a day times 365 for a year. 10,840,500, 500,000 people are affected by veteran suicide every year. 10 million people, over 10 million people. And we have not talked about first responders, we have not talked about any public safety officials. Do you know that this is the that a firefighter, most firefighters have reported responding to at least one suicidal call in their career, but some of them have reported at least 12 suicidal calls in their career? Can you imagine what that does to a firefighter over time in 12 years reporting to 12 suicides?

SPEAKER_09 1:08:59

Yeah. I mean, that's staggering because everybody does look at the the veteran, right, as like this this this, I don't want to say fully relevant, right? But it's not just the veterans. It's and the veterans, while we do suffer from the PTS and the traumatic stuff, these first responders, police, firefighters, they deal with this on a daily basis and oftentimes go home and have to be back in six to ten hours later the next day to do it all over again.

SPEAKER_07 1:09:37

Right. You want to get you want to take a guess how many law enforcement officers we lose every day? Or not every day. We lose a law enforcement officer every 17 hours to suicide. When's the last time anyone's ever talked about law enforcement officers suicide or the fact that when we lose a law enforcement officer to suicide, most commonly they never get a full honor burial and they're and they're not even recognized in the national in Washington DC's national monument for first responders? They don't even count them. They're completely excluded.

SPEAKER_09 1:10:13

That's unacceptable. And you know, but it's also you know par for the force, right? Because there's I want to say insurance reasons, things like that, where you know military and veterans who potentially do have life insurance, not all of them do, but you know, unless they're active duty or whatnot. Um, but as a veteran, you know, they have to purchase that, but there is at least some level of protection for them, but it's not for for law enforcement and first responders. No.

SPEAKER_07 1:10:50

So I won't can Lance, do you mind reading that last comment down there for us? I think that's pretty that's pretty spot on.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:59

Yeah, we might fight a war outside our borders. They're doing it inside on borders. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 1:11:08

So our public safety officials and our and our first responders are fighting the wars inside these borders. They're responding to calls every day with traumatic events, losing losing children in the you know, having to deal with the loss of children, having to deal with suicidal calls. I don't know. Having it over there. It's a big moth.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:32

I was like, no, somebody just like mock rough or something just cross went across the space, man. I thought it was gonna get eight. I don't know.

SPEAKER_07 1:11:38

Yeah, but no, but it's it's it's it's the the things that law enforce or our first responders are are exposed to. Loss of children, loss of you know, loss due to suicide, you know, irregular sleep patterns, all of the things that can diminish your mental health over time, they deal with every day.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:01

Yeah. But the thing is, is the is the U.S. as a whole is in a mental health crisis. Our first responders and our veterans are even in a more mental health crisis because of the jobs that they do. Even our nurses and doctors after COVID are in a worse situation. Teachers are and there's so many. That's why we could not be a veterans-only um organization or or company, because there's everyone falls in the lurch sometimes, and everyone deserves to have someone in their corner and to let them know that you're never alone. Like whatever you're going through, someone else has gone through and can help you find that little wing of light that gets you where in the right direction. Because I talk about all the time, it's that pendulum. Either you've got that pendulum positivity or you've got the pendulum pendulum of negativity. You choose each day which way your pendulum is going to flow. And you choose each day to do good or to come out negative. I tell people, open the door for someone or tell them good morning, because that starts a trickle effect, a positive trickle effect, opposed to that negative trickle effect that that suicide has on people because it causes a horrible trickle effect on the opposite direction of the pendulum.

SPEAKER_07 1:13:20

Listen, I like I'm glad you said that. Because think about you just opening the door for somebody or telling them good morning or doing something polite for somebody when you're going out through your day. You don't know that what that person's going through. You don't know if that person is contemplating suicide or they're they're going through a bad divorce or they're going through a bad breakup or they're going whatever they're going through, you don't know what they're mentally dealing with. So that the the smallest act of kindness we can do is just, hey, good morning, or let them know that they are valued, and it doesn't take much to do that. Like it that how long how long is that day does it take to you for you to open a door for somebody and say good morning, good afternoon. You know how many times I've went to gas sessions.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:12

You know how many times I've just to send someone a smile across the way if they look like they're frowning, and you you just smile at someone across across the way and passing at a gas station or something. Yeah, you sometimes will literally see them light up like that was toward me.

SPEAKER_09 1:14:29

Yeah, you just changed their whole fucking day, yeah. Or being silly, right? Like, yeah, or just being silly.

SPEAKER_07 1:14:37

Look, think about this. There's times I've been at the gas station and I've seen county sheriffs or law enforcement officers getting fuel. And I'll go over there and I'll just, hey, do you mind if I get you whatever they were going into the store to get? He said, Oh, okay, I'm just going to get a monster coffee in this. I said, Do you mind if I get that for you? Thank you for what you do. And I will go in there and I will buy that monster coffee or whatever they were doing to start their shift or whatever they needed, and I would give it to them.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:10

And it and I don't know how much impact that had, but if they were just coming to TSA, remember when TSA they weren't getting paid, right? And when we were traveling, we had like six water bottles, and they thought that, well, you can't take that with you. Oh no, these are for you guys. And to see some of their reactions, like, are you serious? Yeah, me and my wife are handing you these six water bottles because you deserve some type of something because we know you're not getting paid. So hopefully this you know cheers you up a little bit.

SPEAKER_06 1:15:42

Yeah, it's that simple, simple act.

SPEAKER_09 1:15:44

Little acknowledgments, right? Uh of just of human decency goes a long way.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:56

I keep a pack of water bottles in my vehicle all the time. Only people that don't know me ask me why those water bottles are there. Because if I see a homeless or someone um on the street or whatever, I grab a couple of water bottles and I hand it to them.

SPEAKER_09 1:16:10

Right. But guess what, veterans? Here's another here's another key piece. It works just as well in your own home.

SPEAKER_06 1:16:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_09 1:16:22

To your loved one, the one that's been there, been dealing. The little things, the small things of just saying, I appreciate you. I know I'm not always the easiest to deal with, but I appreciate you.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:33

People think that they're so minute. People, what Cooper just said, people think that they're so minute that you can't see them. Everyone deserves the right to be seen, and everyone deserves the right to have someone in their corner. Bottom line.

SPEAKER_07 1:16:49

Especially in your home. I love the way he's going with this because the ones in our home are the ones usually catching the brunt of what we're putting them through because of our post-traumatic stress.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:01

The ones we love the most are the ones we hurt the most.

SPEAKER_07 1:17:06

That is correct.

SPEAKER_09 1:17:07

And remember this when a three-year-old's having a tempered tantrum and crashing out at home, but they don't do it in public, the same exact reason. They're comfortable enough at home to be vulnerable and themselves, but that doesn't, that's not an excuse, and that's not a pass, right? We as veterans need to also acknowledge and like I said, do the small things, show up, and you know, and also how about this? Why can't we start our day letting our spouse and our loved ones and even our kids know where we're at in our own headspace and be like, you know what? Today, I'm feeling a little rough, I'm starting off a little rocky, you know, like communication that is key in all of the things.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:00

Or even, or even like, I mean, those that know my background know why, but I just throughout the day, if I'm having a bad day, I'll reach out to my wife because she's my confidant. I was like, I'm not doing so hot. And and she knows what to say, but you you but that's later, you find that in everything. But when she's not having a good day, she'll message me as well. It's just you those common, sweet gestures. If you're thinking it, oh, that would be sweet to do, just do it. Do it, just do it. Don't don't, because for the longest time I'm like, yeah, that'd be really sweet to do, but I wouldn't do it. Just freaking do it. It's worth it. If you think it's gonna be sweet, it probably is gonna be sweet.

SPEAKER_09 1:18:48

I've got an idea about something, James. And you know, I talked about it last last week. Um, I can't do it today, but at some point I want to get this in there. Um, I want to see about bringing some of those clips uh from that one from that movie, right? About how families sometimes show up for veterans and how we don't always make it easy for them. Uh for the from the movie Thank You for Your Service, because I do think that playing a snippet of that and and getting a couple snippets to kind of show the general.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:27

That's been trademarked for a while.

SPEAKER_07 1:19:30

Yeah, just do it. Yeah, we we can't we can't especially use that one. Yeah, that we'd be in trouble.

SPEAKER_09 1:19:36

Yeah, you know what we can what we but what we can do is once somebody learns how to show up and you know you know having the fine piece of it that we talked about earlier today, but then also the Charlie Mike piece of it. Um but you've got to learn what that mission is, and you gotta be in a good place to be able to accomplish that mission in order to just continue to miss it.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:03

In order to even see the mission.

SPEAKER_09 1:20:05

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:06

You can't you can't see the mission in front of you or what you're supposed to do until you literally you move that darkness and you get out of your own way.

SPEAKER_09 1:20:13

Yeah, absolutely. I I know we're we're coming up on uh uh to almost an hour and a half, but you know, one of the things I would love for you to do, Lance, is uh if you don't mind, kind of let people know where they can find you know your merchandise, uh the stuff that you do, you grow. I'd love for people to be able to connect with you on that as well.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:33

Absolutely. If you're looking for us as far as merge, um motivational speaking, any or our roadshow, uh you can find us at wearsfh.com or at any social media at SFH. And then uh you can also find me on TikTok at Marine Doc, and then you can find me on Facebook, Facebook, and Instagram under Lance Price. Nice, nice.

SPEAKER_09 1:21:01

That's it, and I believe you also are connected on our nautical salute group where you've posted about you as well. Um so welcome in Patricia.

SPEAKER_07 1:21:10

Thank you. We've got uh so Patricia, they actually run the 99 radio network, and they are big, they are big sponsors of what Heroes in the Sky does. We've already they're one of the the key factors of why we're in Texas twice a year dedicating battle vests in the great state of Texas because of their support. So welcome in, Patricia. Thank you. Uh very nice, very nice. You'll you'll know her by her screen name Pitbull if y'all listen to them.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:40

But if y'all are called y'all about the calling it, do you guys have anything coming up soon? Or yeah, so can I talk about what we got coming up? Absolutely.

SPEAKER_07 1:21:50

Yeah, we're gonna have the floor right now. You got the floor, and then we'll close it out.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:54

Well, Ty and I are doing our very our longest trip yet, the longest trip before this, we drove um to Cincinnati. Because of Ty being triple APT, it's just easier to travel by vehicle than it is by plane because they always fuck up his wheels. But anyway, um, so this time we are actually driving to the third uh primary owner of SFH to Pennsylvania. Or yeah, to Pennsylvania. Hanover PA, and we get the luxury, it it's it's a twofer. We get the luxury of going out there, and he always comes down to Florida because a lot a lot of our events are down this way. We get to hang out with him, and we also get to talk and represent for the love of a veteran, which is the organization that paid for the shot uh that I got the SGB shot that has worked wonders for me. So it's gonna be awesome. So if you usually don't get to see us because we're always down south and you're near Hanover PA, don't ask me where it's at. I don't know. I'm just gonna follow the directions until I get there. But uh yeah, go say hello. What do you guys got going on?

SPEAKER_07 1:23:09

So um we've actually got a battle vest dedication actually in two days. Uh on the 16th, we are dedicating a battle vest to VFW Post 660 here in Savannah, Georgia. It is in honor of comrade Rich um the one of their comrades, David Bussing, who was a Marine Corps veteran who lost his internal war. And so we are honoring David and his family, and also 18 other warriors that have died by suicide right here in the Savannah, Georgia area. So if you're in that area listening, come out VFW post 660 at 3 p.m. on Saturday. And then Sean and I have a lot of other events that we're trying to plan collectively to so let's just put it this way. I'm gonna be in Florida quite a bit in the last year. At least quarter quarterly going forward. Quarterly, yes. I will be in Florida at least quarterly, yes.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:08

Do you want someone to apologize? No, okay, because we're not going to anyway.

SPEAKER_07 1:24:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_09 1:24:15

John, what do you think you want to? I I mean, wow, thanks. Thanks to an awesome introduction that that Lance has made for us. Uh actually, tomorrow morning at 8 45, I'm gonna be live on Fox 35 in Orlando talking about nautical salute and what we what we do uh to assist veterans um with PTSD and also uh the outlets that we that we uh provide through fishing and spending time on the water and the barbecuing events, the different seafood oils and poker runs uh to raise awareness and talk about the books as well. And then Monday, Rich is going to from aka Combat Kitchen is gonna be on Fox 35 to talk about what we're doing in the initiative with uh Combat Kitchen and the cooking and bringing food in with veterans. Uh so it's gonna be it's a busy couple days, and then you know, we've got a big uh wedding event going on next weekend. It's worth it.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:16

You guys are gonna have a ball. She's freaking awesome, man. Um I mean, and you're just having a conversation. Yeah, you're just gonna have a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_08 1:25:24

She wants to do a second one later.

SPEAKER_09 1:25:25

But get this Rich has to actually cook something live and put it together um to kind of talk about, and we're actually gonna utilize the menu for the poker run in 2027. Nice. So we're gonna take in some smoked mac and cheese and some ribs uh there. So it's gonna be pretty awesome.

SPEAKER_07 1:25:47

Yeah. So we always have these these moments in the show, right? And and I have to be careful how we do this because I don't want to get, we know we talk about songs or something that kind of impacts us, right? I don't know if y'all are, and I want to call out a country artist, uh Taylor Holder. I don't know if y'all know who he is, but um, and once again, these are not my words, these are these are from his song. We do not own any of the words, I'm just calling out what he does. Um, but he's got a song that's called When No One's Around. And I want to read some of these lyrics and I want y'all to tell me what it how if this hits home. And it's very simple. It says, When no one's around, I start to drown. So throw me a rope because I only know one way out. Is this how it ends from losing a fight with myself? Are those not powerful lyrics? Like I listen to this song every day for like driving to work. I mean, this song's on repeat, but it brings back so many memories of our feelings when it when it comes to dealing with trauma and stress and mental health. So what what are your thoughts when you hear those words, Sean? I'm not alone.

SPEAKER_09 1:27:14

I'm not alone. I'm not alone. I it it's like when people text me and they're like, Man, your latest song that you you put out or whatever, or the lyrics of this or your book, it connects with me, and I think that's what it is. It's that connection. Um I I don't have to second guess it like those lyrics speak to me.

SPEAKER_07 1:27:36

Yeah. Well, and it and for me too, it it makes me I start to realize that the closer I get to this community, then I'm not alone. Like it, you know, where the lyrics are strong, but for me it's like I'm not if some if I'm having a bad day, I know who to pick up the phone and call. And I know who's gonna be there for me. And the the the best part about this whole journey is that that support system grows. Not only is that support system growing, but I'm seeing so much of that support system engaging with engaging with us in some of these comments. And that's full that's full circle to me. That that's awesome to me that the people that are along this journey with us are in these comments interacting with us, making a difference.

SPEAKER_09 1:28:41

I think we posted it on some social media.

SPEAKER_07 1:28:49

I wasn't wasn't expecting it to, so I gotta go find it. But I'm pretty sure I do somewhere. And we'll we'll close this out with the full version of that the song that we played a little bit earlier, but it kind of started in the middle. But we'll as we close out, we'll play it one more time.

SPEAKER_09 1:29:11

So I guess before we before we close this out, are there any other questions in the chat, or is there anything else, Lance, that you would like to kind of talk about um and bring up?

SPEAKER_04 1:29:20

No, just to piggyback on what James was saying, though. Um I know there was times in my darkest, I picked up the phone and just and just called because I didn't know who to call. Because like you said, you just feel so alone that you don't think anybody's gonna understand. Call anyway, make the phone call. Absolutely, or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_07 1:29:42

Yeah, you know, yeah. Because you just never know, you just never know that that what that phone call is gonna do. You never know that person you call could be going it could be miserable and about to make and about to make a choice that they don't have to, and you you pick up the phone and change your mind.

SPEAKER_09 1:30:05

I know you you all have changed my mind.

SPEAKER_07 1:30:08

My life. Oh, absolutely. Yeah, but getting connected to Sean and Jen and Lance, we were all actually in Florida together this past weekend. So being around rich, yeah, we're we were all there in Florida. So being around this this positive group of people has given has shined so much more on my life than I than I ever thought would would become of it. I'll tell you that. I didn't, you know, I I didn't think I'd ever be somewhere where people actually listened to what I was saying. I didn't think I was worth anything. And you get around to it.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:42

Positive positivity and P start with a P for the for some reason. Uh they both start with the same letter. Hmm. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_07 1:30:51

Oh, tomorrow night, yes. If y'all, if you're on TikTok, Lance will do Lance does have a he'll have a a live tomorrow.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:59

So yeah, on um on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday actually I do mornings. Uh but on Sunday, that is the more serious live uh TikTok, and we actually get into serious stuff. But Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, if you want to come hang out, come hang out.

SPEAKER_09 1:31:15

Absolutely. And what time what time roughly do you go live in the morning?

SPEAKER_04 1:31:19

9, 9:30 on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday when I'm not too busy. And then Sunday, it's always at 8 p.m. Eastern Standard Time.

SPEAKER_09 1:31:28

And by the way, if you want to be on uh one of Lance's panels and you have a positive uh message to bring to the table, uh just connect with Lance. And I'm sure if if he's not full, he may reach out to you to just at some point to be on a panel.

SPEAKER_04 1:31:45

So I pick all the panelists prior to going up, and uh I pick them based on the topic. And if there's a topic that you see that resonates you and you'd like to be a panelist, let me know.

SPEAKER_07 1:31:56

Yeah. Absolutely. And I just, you know, we've had some we ended this on a positive conversation, and that was really good. But I just want to for those that are dealing with loss, uh, mental health losses, died, you know, there's their loved ones died by suicide. We do want you to know that Here is in the Sky does have a um post-vention outreach panel, that they are there for that purpose. Everyone on that panel has dealt with the loss of a loved one to suicide, different relationships, but they all have a story, and they the all their energies are felt wanting to help other families. So if you've lost a warrior to suicide and you do you just lost another tool like 988? Well, kind of, because it it is nationwide. It's just you you email, you go on our website, you read their bios, you choose the panelist you want to talk to, and then I make the and then I make the connection. And then once I make the connection, that's it. That panel member takes that conversation with whatever they need. Whatever whatever they're dealing with, they know exactly how to deal with it because they've already walked in those shoes. And so we just connect them, we connect them in that area. So yeah, that's that's a that's a nationwide resource that you anyone can use. And you know, it and it doesn't mean if if you've you don't have to wait until you've lost a loved one of suicide. If you're seeing signs in a loved one, reach out to us. We'll get you in contact. That can a lot of our our panelists know exactly what the signs look like. They they've been through it, and they are and they are there to help move that pendulum. Yeah, they will move that help you move that pendulum and help you walk through through your grief process.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:46

Yeah, all right.

SPEAKER_09 1:33:47

So I want to thank our sponsors.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:53

And thank you guys for having me. I appreciate you.

SPEAKER_07 1:33:55

Absolutely, thank you, Lance. Still fucking here. Yeah, love it, love it. Um, yeah, so thank you again to our sponsors, American Legion Post 135 in Savannah, Georgia. Um, American Legion is Post 135 is located in historic downtown Savannah at 1108 Bull Street. They are a member of the largest veteran service organization in the nation. They were founded on the principles of service to our veterans and to our community, state, and nation. Their membership is open to any veteran who has served honorably and to active duty service members. They are home to the local 1110, Betty Bombers, Brighter Day, Centennial Bean, Lee Chai, and their bar is open to the public. They hold several events in their ballroom each year. And here's the best part about it if you're in Savannah, Georgia area or you're contemplating doing an event in Savannah, you can rent their ballroom at a reasonable rate in beautiful downtown historic Savannah, Georgia. So thank you, American Legion Post 135. All right, before we close it out, appreciate you guys.

SPEAKER_03 1:35:04

Yeah, blubber.

SPEAKER_07 1:35:05

And that's and I and I and I want to ask everyone in here listening that this has reached, help us spread this even more. Share this to your friends, share this to those veterans, first responders, family members that you know, help us fill these the you know, these lives and just get this word out there. We're so grateful for your support, but we can't do it alone, and we need your help to push it out and circulate it. So if you could help us do that, that would be amazing.

SPEAKER_08 1:35:32

All right. We're gonna go ahead and change the screen and get it situated. Yeah, let's close this out. Thank you, everybody.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:54

Like victory speeches, like metals hitting a wooden table, like somebody finally saying, You made it. But healing, healing sounded more like silence, like sitting in the truck too long after work, because home felt safer when the engine was still running. Like staring at a grocery store aisle, trying to remember why your heart suddenly started racing. Like waking up at 2.13 in the morning, sweating through memories you never asked to keep. See, they trained us to survive the battlefield, but nobody really taught us how to survive ourselves afterward. Nobody talked about how trauma follows you home wearing civilian clothes. How it hides in fireworks, crowded rooms, empty bottles, divorce papers, missed phone calls, and the sentence. I'm fine. Especially that sentence. I know veterans who carried entire teams on deployment, but struggle to carry groceries inside the house now. Men and women who could navigate chaos overseas but can't navigate their own thoughts when the room gets quiet. And still, they wake up. Still they fight. That matters. You hear me? That matters. Because hope isn't always loud. Sometimes hope is just making the appointment, answering the phone, talking for the first time, saying, no, I don't think I'm okay. That's courage too. Maybe even the purest kind. See the world loves the image of the warrior, but healing asks something harder. It asks the warrior to become human again, to let people in, to trust again, to stop apologizing for wounds nobody can see. And that process, it's ugly sometimes. There are setbacks, bad nights, anger that shows up uninvited, days where depression feels heavier than body armor ever did. But there are also moments, small moments, where light gets through. A kids laugh, a sunrise after a sleepless night. Brothers and sisters sitting around the table finally telling the truth. A stranger saying, Me too. That's where healing begins. But in realizing the trauma doesn't get to write the ending. You survived war. You survived loss. You survived becoming someone you barely recognized. Now comes the hardest mission of all. Believing you deserve peace too. And maybe peace doesn't mean forgetting. Maybe peace is learning that your scars cannot proof you're broken. So to every veteran still fighting battles nobody sees.