Idle Treasure: a Christian response to the wealth sitting in donor advised funds
There are billions of dollars accumulating in donor advised funds and we are here to ask the question, is this okay?
Some Christians say everything is fine; the system is working as it should. Others say this is a major problem.
Hosted by financial counselor, Courtney Markley, this mini-series will take you through a narrative journey to explore what really lies beneath this number.
But this story isn’t just about donor advised funds; it is about each of us and the elephant in the room: Christians give less today than during the Great Depression. It’s simply become normal in our culture for God’s people not to live generously.
Could our lack of giving be a sign that something greater is going on?
Throughout the journey we will hear from industry experts, ministry leaders, entrepreneurs, and biblical scholars. We’ll be joined by John Rinehart, Randy Alcorn, Ronald Blue, Peter Greer, and Craig Blomberg – just to name a few.
We'll explore the challenges people face when giving to charity, the obstacles of passing down generational wealth, and the vulnerable reasons we often keep money to ourselves.
The goal of this podcast is not to convince you to give more money away.
This is an invitation into a gentle discussion about giving, discipleship to Christ, and our idle treasure.
Idle Treasure: a Christian response to the wealth sitting in donor advised funds
The Burden Of Blessing
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“I hate having money.”
When a young inheritor says that out loud, it exposes something most of us rarely name: wealth can bring loneliness, fear, and constant relationship tension.
In this episode we sit down with Kate, who inherited millions of dollars at 21, to talk about the burden of blessing and the hidden pressures many next-gen inheritors carry while families navigate the Great Wealth Transfer and the growing DAF dilemma.
Dr. Gary Hoag also joins us to explore how scripture challenges us to think differently about legacy building.
If you’ve ever felt conflicted about wealth, suspicious of generosity talk, or stuck deciding what to do with charitable assets, this conversation is for you.
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Idle Treasure is sponsored by the Center for Financial Discipleship.
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Idle Treasure is sponsored by the Center for Financial Discipleship.
I was once facilitating a workshop during a family meeting. It was the type of meeting where the parents owned a company worth millions of dollars, and once a year they would gather with their adult children to discuss the family's plans for their business, their wealth, and talk about their giving strategy. As we were talking about money mindsets and how we each relate to money differently, the youngest inheritor stood up and said, I hate having money. I hate thinking about money. I hate not knowing whether my friends like me for me. The room stopped. And everyone felt the weight of her words. Imagine a world where you always feel like a target. You can't walk into a room without people knowing your family name and how much money you have. And you can't help but wonder what people's motivations are in befriending you. Imagine having the immense pressure as someone in their early 20s or 30s being responsible to carry on the family legacy and manage millions of dollars. Imagine feeling constantly judged and misunderstood. This is the reality for many next-gen inheritors. But thankfully, it doesn't have to be this way. In today's episode, we'll discuss the challenges facing families of multi-generational wealth. If we want to see more money deployed from donor advice funds, we need to understand the needs of this particular group of people. So pull up a chair and sit with me as we learn about the burden of blessing.
A Young Inheritor’s Confession
Speaker 2One day I'll make it.
Speaker 5But it led me on a journey to discover what really lies beneath this number. Some Christians say there isn't a problem. Others are frustrated by the amount of charitable assets not getting deployed. But this story isn't just about donor advised funds. It is about you and me. This is a story about how our culture has shaped the way Christians behave with money. It's a story about the goodness of wealth and the weight of responsibility we feel to steward it wealth. It's a story about the vulnerable reasons why we often keep money to ourselves. And it's about the opportunity of a moment. Journey with me as we seek the answer. How should Christians respond to this idle treasure? If you've been following along in the Idle Treasure series, you've probably felt some of the heaviness in our most recent episodes. There are real emotional and spiritual obstacles to generosity. These things aren't often talked about because it can be really uncomfortable. So I appreciate you leaning into the uneasiness with me as we continue learning why money is accumulating in DAFs. The conversation around donor advised funds, giving, and the Christian walk is not all black and white. Our challenge includes leaving room for the Holy Spirit and acknowledging that we serve a mysterious, complex God. He is moving in some incredible places, and although I
The DAF Dilemma And Our Money Stories
Speaker 5think many of us desire hard, concrete rules about generosity, we shouldn't attempt to put God in a box. In today's conversation, we're going to hear from a next-gen inheritor named Kate. Her testimony is going to be a breath of fresh air, and it may also challenge some of us to think differently about stewardship. The tensions that exist between those who have a lot and those who have a little are new. On one end, wealth can foster a spirit of entitlement and self-centeredness. And on the opposite end, a lack of wealth can create a false sense of righteousness or spiritual purity. Many Christian circles believe having wealth is wrong or inherently evil. On multiple occasions, I have sat with women who grieve over feeling rejected by the church because of their wealth. If money continues to divide people and produces an us versus them mentality, the church will remain fractured. The goal of our conversation is to accomplish three things. To help us recognize that we're more alike than we think. That generosity is for all of us, not just a few. And we each have a unique role to play in the building of God's kingdom. Here is some brief context to help shape our story. We're currently living through the Great Wealth Transfer. It's described as the largest transfer of wealth in history. Over the next two decades, baby boomers are expected to pass on an estimated $124 trillion to the next generation of inheritors, who are mainly millennials and older Gen Zs. And many families who are engaging in the Great Wealth Transfer are leaving what's called an early inheritance, meaning the older generations don't wait until they die to give the younger generations wealth, but they're passing on assets while they're still living so they can help disciple the next generation of inheritors. And here's where we begin.
Speaker 4I inherited millions of dollars at age 21, and I have been on a journey for 10 years of discerning how to serve God and make impact out of my legacy narrative.
Speaker 5Admittedly, when Kate inherited money at such a young age, it was an isolating experience. She felt overwhelmed, and for many years she kept her inheritance a secret. She didn't know how to talk to people about it or what they might think. But after seeking the Lord, she began to catch a vision for how she could honor God, not only with her money, but with her whole life. The first thing she did was begin tithing. Kate refers to the tithe as her giving training wheels. Writing those first few checks felt a little daunting, but she was amazed by the amount of joy that came as a result. Kate began catching a vision for what it could look like to make her whole life become about giving to others. The next thing she did was create a network of 60 missionaries to partner with. She wasn't only supporting them financially, but she would meet with them regularly to build relationships and pray for their ministries. During this time, Kate began connecting with other next-gen inheritors and found out that they shared similar struggles. Many of them felt alone. They desired a safe community for discipleship and encouragement. So she created a ministry called Magnify to begin serving these unique individuals. Kate also co-hosts
Kate’s Inheritance And Giving Path
Speaker 5the Ascendance podcast and has recently written a book. It was Kate who first taught me about the struggles facing families of multi-generational wealth.
Speaker 4Early on, because this is my story, I realized that those of us who have last names that are famous, or patriarchs, matriarchs who have started businesses, or sometimes just money that is passed down expectedly or unexpectedly, that there is a unique burden to that. I like to call it the burden of blessing because, of course, it is a positive thing in many ways, and an opportunity to have more resources, to know more people. And at the same time, it can come with some very specific and oftentimes very nuanced complexities that can be very, very hard for people. And I feel very called, I should say, to enter into that complexity and to bring validation to it, to say this isn't just, you know, my life is a fairy tale, everything is easy and just a charmed life experience, but to really get into the details of what can feel very heavy and give people a sense of being used or being judged or pinholed into something that maybe isn't their story or the narrative that they want to live. So I help people find Christian community in that space specifically.
Speaker 5Along with creating community for people, Kate counsels families who are passing wealth to the next generation. I began my conversation with Kate by asking her about common hurdles families experience in this space.
Speaker 4Some common hurdles would be communication and trust, which are such big areas, obviously, but I see so much there where there isn't a sense of cohesion or understanding that is embodied between the generations.
Speaker 5The statistics show us that many families struggle to communicate effectively about money. A recent study by National Christian Foundation revealed that 62% of the older generation say they are prepared for the wealth transfer, but only 39% of their heirs agree. 72% of next-gen inheritors say they're still waiting to fully understand their role in their family's wealth transfer. 41% of next-gen inheritors feel a sense of burden. And 17% say they're not ready.
Speaker 4One of my biggest areas that I've continued to counsel a lot of families in is specifically around the pressure that I feel wealth creators or previous generations put on themselves to quote unquote figure it out for the next generation. And I think that comes from such a beautiful place of parents wanting to care for their next gen as well. And I totally affirm that. And at the same time, especially when we start talking about adults or even young adults, I really believe there needs to be a conversation. And I call this actually my hack in family legacy right now. And what this hack is, is for the wealth creators or the wealth stewards to actually just straight up ask the next generation what they
The Burden Of Blessing Explained
Speaker 4want. And that might sound
Family Hurdles Trust And Agency
Speaker 4so simple, but I actually really believe that that simple step of let's say a 60-year-old parent asking a 30-year-old child, hey, what do you want for the next generation of our wealth that can do wonders, both for coming to an actual conclusion about the practical next steps, as well as just that next gen themselves feeling like they have agency, feeling like they have buy-in. I would say, back to your question about hurdles, one of the biggest issues I see across the line in the next gen space is victimization, which might sound funny because we're talking about abundance. We're talking about overflow, right? These things sound so good and positive, but I think the actual act of wealth transfer or inviting next gen into philanthropy and things like that can actually create a very much a victim mindset, which needs to be dealt with in order for the legacy transfer to be done well.
Speaker 5I asked Kate to share a few stories of people experiencing victimization.
Speaker 4I'll give you two examples that are very different. So one is my story. So in my situation, my parents sat me down at age 21 and they said, Here is this money. We've invested it for you, we've prepared it for you. And obviously, that's beautiful. That was my dad's heart of generosity. At the same time, the pain point or the victimization that I felt was that I had no agency in this. My parents didn't ask me, do you want this money? It was just in my name, all of a sudden. So that creates an internal work for me that I've done for the last 10 years of I didn't ask for this, I didn't want this. And that also starts with the realization that I think is a really important building block for wealth stewardship, that it is a burden. Yes, it is a blessing, but it also creates a ton of complexity of what to do with the wealth. The way I tell my story is that if my parents had made that one little shift, and I actually know a family that's done this and they did it really well, of saying, hey, we have this for you. Do you want it? That would have given me and my dignity and my humanity the opportunity to respond with a yes or a no. So I think that's one example of victimization feeling that it makes it makes the money feel icky to me. It makes it makes it feel bad, even emotionally, that I have it because I didn't want it. And that is just the work that I have to do. And I'm grateful God has met me in that. I feel like I've transformed. I feel like I have gotten to a good place and I know there's more to come in my own journey as well. But that would be an example. Um, one more example from a very different family, different situation that I'll share briefly, is the story of a family where they want the next generation to serve on the family foundation board. And that's beautiful, right? That is a step of empowerment. We're giving you agency, we're giving you opportunity to do philanthropy. The problem in this situation was that the ideas and the strategies that the next gen family members were bringing to the family foundation board were very different than what the wealth creator wanted or intended. And so that also created a victimization experience for the next gen because in that case, they're trying to step up, they're trying to use their agency as young adults, and it's being shut down. And so they're also having a very negative experience of, oh, well, I guess my voice doesn't matter. I guess what I see and what I dream about isn't a factor in this. And so in both situations, the next gens feel controlled, they feel dictated to, they feel patronized because again, their voice or their agency is not being fully acknowledged.
Speaker 5Misalignment and unmet expectations are common pain points
Victim Mindset And Control Dynamics
Speaker 5for families managing wealth. It seems there are a lot of strings attached to this money, and it's a sticky dance people do where we say, Well, we want to bless you, but we're also not sure how not to control you. If families began by simply asking each other, what do you want? What is God inviting us into, we might see something new begin to take shape.
Speaker 4I think that some of the surprises, the positive experiences of what would happen if more communication, trust, shared agency, shared control came about is empowerment of these young adults. And I think that's what parents really want, right? Is to see their children flourish. Let's start with that. I think there is a lot of fear that gets in the way. And I think that there is this, I almost want to call it a forgetting of how people grow, which is through pain and is through mistakes. I think there's this sense for parents that they want to shield their children from making mistakes with money, which makes total sense. And again, comes from a beautiful heart of wanting to help their kids not feel pain. But I actually think unfortunately it's doing the opposite. It's actually creating a lot of pain because they're not allowing their next gens to go through the human experience of messing up and learning from that. And again, that takes a lot of surrender of control and a lot of trust. Maybe trust in God, maybe trust in their kids that they can learn as they grow. And again, I think that this is part of the best side of my story in this, is that I was given full agency after the money was given to me without my agency. I was given the opportunity to make my own mistakes, and I have. I have made significant mistakes, and I have learned from them, and it has built my passion to do more philanthropy and to serve God even more with money. And I think that is, again, the positive frame on what the adults would see is that they would see their kids build passion for being good stewards. That is what they want, I think, right? Is and that's why I think people want to do wealth transfer in the first place, is they want their kids to thrive. But again, I think it's it's really surrendering fear and control of the children that has to happen for that wealth transfer to go successfully.
Speaker 5You don't need to have money to resonate with a child who wants to please their parents and live up to their expectations, but also struggles to feel heard. And you don't need to own a million-dollar company
Fear Of Mistakes And Letting Kids Grow
Speaker 5to empathize with a parent who wants to shield their children from harm. At the end of the day, we all want the same things. We want to be loved and accepted. We want to feel valued and contribute to something meaningful. We want to feel safe and connected to community. We want our families to thrive. However, wealth tends to complicate all these things. You know, someone once told me that the wealthiest person in the room is probably the loneliest. It makes me think of Job. Scripture tells us that he was blameless and upright, and he also had significant wealth. Job used his resources to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, care for the orphans and widows, and yet during his time of greatest distress, there was no one to care for him. I think it would do us all good to step back and ask ourselves, how are we caring for those who steward wealth? Are we being judgmental or supportive? Are we looking to serve them or to gain something from them? This can take on many shapes, but one of the signs we know that it's working well is when we can speak to one another in both truth and love. When King David started going astray, there were prophets and friends who loved him enough to tell him the truth. Compare his story to King Solomon, who didn't have anyone to challenge him or warn him that he was getting off track. Wealthy leaders need to be embraced by a community of Christians who can speak truth out of love. They need people in their corner who see their potential and encourage them to continue living out the countercultural message of the gospel. Someone who
Caring For Wealth Stewards In Community
Speaker 5does this really well is my friend Dr. Gary Hoag. Gary is the founder of Global Trust Partners. He is a biblical scholar, an author, and perhaps best known as the Generosity Monk. Gary both encourages and challenges people to steward their resources in alignment with Scripture.
SpeakerIf we look in Scripture, when God provided more than enough, my mind goes to Joseph and the resources God provided. It takes us to the scriptures, which is Genesis chapter 41. And there's an expression in verse 58 where it says, Joseph opened the storehouses. Now, um I believe when God provides an abundance, it's to be put to work. Now, it may not be put to work in that year. In the case of Joseph, it was put to work over a season of seven years. And so my answer is going to be I think those resources, it's what, you know, 200. I mean, the numbers probably changing every day, 250 billion, 1.6 trillion in foundations. My answer is I think we need to open those storehouses. I really want people when they hear me talk on. Money in DAFs, money in foundations. You're always going to hear me say, put it to work, because remember the cryptic statement to the rich fool in Luke chapter 12? He has land, which is, it reminds us of the
Open The Storehouses Biblical Challenge
SpeakerGenesis account. God wants us to make the land fruitful. He makes the land fruitful. He has this abundant wealth. But then at that moment, when he's got all this abundant wealth, he decides he's going to keep it for himself. He's not going to put it to work. And the cryptic statement we hear in Luke 12, 20 is, but God said to him, You fool, this very night your life will be demanded of you. And then it says, Then who will get what you have prepared for yourself? Okay. In other words, those were his resources to steward. And if he didn't want to steward them and put them to work, God says, basically, you're fired. I'm going to make sure these resources get to work, whether you participate in it or not. Think about the implications of this. Someone might feel led of God to build a family legacy. And you know what? I would encourage them to do that by keeping putting the money to work. The key is if we if we think I've arrived, I want to get out of the game, that's where I think we make the mistake. So if you want to do a family legacy and you're good at building wealth, and you decide our family legacy is not going to be building wealth, it's going to be building the kingdom. And you stay working that land, doing that thing God gave you to do for generation to generation. And we can think of givers who do this where God owns their business and supply comes in and they put it to work fruitfully for the kingdom. That's a beautiful legacy.
Speaker 5Gary's encouragement to open the storehouses is for all of us who've been given more than we need. Yes, stewarding wealth can be complicated, but it can also be an immense privilege. Now, many people with DAFs and private foundations are interested in building family legacies. They intentionally keep large amounts of money in their charitable accounts because they want those assets to last for generations and encourage generosity. But I have to wonder, what if we're not creating the legacy we think we are? What if future generations learn about the pressing needs of our time and they see the money we had designated for charity that was never deployed? Is that a legacy of generosity, or is it a massive oversight and a missed opportunity in which millions of lives were lost? What if the legacy we're creating is that of a generation who could have helped, but instead we chose not to? What if the legacy we're building is that of a generation who is more interested in tax breaks than saving the lost and feeding the hungry?
SpeakerSo, how do we listen to God? We spend time in his word. His word gives us instructions on what to do. And one of my mentors was Chuck Colson, and he used to say, never underestimate the ability of the human person to rationalize their disobedience. You need to look in the mirror and be honest with yourself. These are God's resources. What's his word say? How is he speaking to you? And put it to work. And so these resources that belong to him need to be stewarded in this way. Why? Because someday you're going to have to give an account for your stewardship. And I want you to hear two words. Well done. I do not want you to hear the words, go away. Matthew 7. People take the wide path, the path everyone takes. Hey, God, look, we did all these things for you. What's he going to say? Go away, I never knew you. God doesn't need you to do things for him. He owns all the resources in the kingdom, like he owns the cattle on a thousand hills. He doesn't need you to do anything for him. He wants you to work with him. How do you work with him? You spend time with him, you read his word, you ask him how you should deploy the resources, put to work the resources in your stewardship. You take steps and you learn as you go, wow, this is actually good. He has my good and his glory in view. And as you do this, you then look in your rearview mirror and you realize, oh my goodness, look at all the impact we've had. Way bigger than we thought, because as we used his resources faithfully, he kept replenishing our pot. He kept putting more resources in it. And at the end of the day, your kids, and this is the best part, your kids will follow your example. They will only do what you do if what you do matches what you say. Think of it this way: a leading reason kids don't follow their parents' footsteps is their parents are hypocrites. They proclaim one thing and do something different. So what I would testify if you want your kids to follow in your footsteps and lead a generous legacy, live radically consistent with the gospel. They will see it, they will want it, and they will follow after it. So you don't have to build the legacy, and that's the paradox of legacy building. Christ builds the legacy.
Speaker 5Kate understands this, and it's why she's pioneering an interesting new occupation within the charitable space. She's developed a three-part DAF system where she manages three different DAFs with three specific purposes. One is for maintaining her current charitable causes, like the missionary she supports. One is for impact investing, and the other one is put aside to seek God's will for new opportunities. Now, this third one I'll note is not an account where she lets funds to continue to accumulate, but she is actively looking for new opportunities and asking God where He wants money to be deployed. For Kate, this is a full-time job. This is the beautiful work she gets to step into every day. She's challenged to learn more holistically about world problems. She uses her influence to promote Christian values like justice and mercy, and she's cultivating community through the building of God's kingdom. Kate has a desire for more next gens to recognize the potential of managing deaths as a vocation. For the inheritors who are isolated and perhaps feeling embarrassed or guilty about their wealth. Kate offers a change in perspective where your whole life becomes about giving and serving. Her desire is to see the next generation actively seeking God's will, distributing funds, and building supportive relationships with ministries around the world. Admittedly, this work is not easy and it comes with real challenges.
Speaker 4If people choose to become more public with the fact that they are doing philanthropy, they're focusing on it vocationally or with their time a lot more so, there is the very legitimate chance that they will be reached out to more by people who work in development, by friends, by
Legacy Questions And Idle Treasure
Speaker 4strangers who have seen us. And the first thing I want to do is just normalize that. And that is real. And that it can feel unsafe. But at the same time, I feel like in my case, my own sense of authenticity of how I approach the world as I say that. And what I mean by that is I feel very strongly that I don't want to hide. And because I do focus on stewardship full time, and one of the main questions people always ask me is what you do. I do want to feel like I am secure and confident in what I do. And so I made that decision to share it with the world. And I want to completely validate it and bless anyone who is in that process themselves. It took me many years to get there. Go in public with my stewardship makes me feel incredibly authentic to the bone. And I'm willing to take on the challenges
Kate’s Three Part DAF Vocation
Speaker 4of it. I attempt to tell my story as a way of saying there is no shame in this. I did nothing to deserve this. I also did nothing to ask for this. And I am doing everything possible I can to make it good for the world.
Speaker 5After sitting with Kate for some time and learning more about the burden of blessing, I asked her if she's ever considered releasing herself from this burden and giving away her wealth in order to simplify her life. She told me that for her, giving away all she has feels like taking the easy way out. Her desire isn't to have an easy life. She wants to live a life that leads her closest to Jesus. She compared having wealth to wrestling with fire. It's where she feels the most vulnerable. It's where she encounters challenges, and it's also where she learns to trust God. Kate's desire to walk the narrow path, the path that leads her closest to Jesus, was a healthy challenge for me to hear. I sometimes need to be reminded that God does not call everyone in the same way. Scripture lifts up the widow with the two coins, and it also lifts up the wealthy women who supported Jesus' ministry. Throughout history, we've seen the church accomplish incredible good when Christians with wealth feel supported and encouraged to use their God-given gifts.
SpeakerAnd the monument says Memorial Garden in honor of John and Edna Pease Hoag. My name is Gary Hoag, and this monument is to my great-grandparents. And the monument says these citizens who helped build our community shall be the inspiration for its future. A lot of people love the Christmas movie, It's a Wonderful Life. And that's basically the movie of my great-grandparents. You see, before the Great Depression, they started First National Bank of Rocky River,
Going Public With Stewardship Risks
Speakerthe Lakewood Parks and Cemetery System, Cleveland Growers Marketing Company, Hoag's Greenhouses, all these businesses, and they put a bunch of people to work. And then when the Great Depression hit and the food lines were long, and we've seen the pictures of history, they did what makes them heroes to me. They gave away their wealth to save the town. They said, holding a cup, my great grandfather said, our wealth is like a cup. God filled it. So maybe he would say in modern terms, our wealth is like a DAF. God filled it so we'd have something to enjoy and share. And they shared their resources and he filled the cup over and over and over to the point where they were honored by the city, and there's a monument to this day in front of them. You never know if been being obedient, that legacy you leave, inspires your kids to be generous, your grandkids to be generous, and your great-grandson named Gary to inspire this all over the planet.
Speaker 5During our conversation, Gary reminded me that people only figure this out when they live it out. The invitation to generosity is for everyone, and as Kate shared, your journey will have mistakes. The Christian life isn't about staying safe, accumulating wealth, and then trying to control the outcomes of that wealth. It's about strengthening our faith, often through failing. When Peter
The Narrow Path And Wrestling With Fire
Speaker 5walked on water and began taking steps towards Jesus, his faith grew far more exponentially than the disciples who were too afraid to leave the boat.
Speaker 3Only hurt cause I tried.
Speaker 5Thank you for listening to Idle Treasure. Special thanks to Kate Gardner and Dr. Gary Hoag. Our closing song is I Tried by Kevin Toqe. If you wish to support the podcast, please leave us a rating and review. And if you'd like to receive bonus clips with exclusive content about Idle Treasure, subscribe through the link in the show notes. Join me next week as we explore another important factor in the DAF dilemma. The challenges with charities. We'll see you soon.
Speaker 3It only hurt cause I tried. Only hurt cause I tried.