Does New York Fashion Week Still Matter

We take a hard look at New York Fashion Week and ask whether it still has a clear purpose in a world where runway shows compete with off-calendar events, social media, and direct-to-consumer shopping. We weigh the criticism about creativity and commercial sameness against the real value NYFW can still offer to emerging designers, community builders, and anyone willing to use the week strategically. 

• NYFW’s shifting identity and why people argue it feels fragmented 
• What fashion shows are for now versus then, buyers, press, and entertainment 
• Why commercial pressure can flatten creativity on the runway 
• Off-calendar shows as a strategy for cost control and tighter storytelling 
• Sustainability regulations abroad and what they could mean for US brands 
• Digital product passports, traceability, and extended producer responsibility 
• Return on investment beyond sales, community, content, and credibility 
• The role of social media evidence, step-and-repeat moments, and visibility 
• Why metrics matter, mentions, traffic, and connecting activity to outcomes 
• Practical tactics for emerging designers, guerrilla marketing, pop-ups, digital lookbooks, collective showrooms, and collaboration 
• Fashion and politics, authenticity, and finding your tribe 

If you find value in this conversation, please subscribe, share, and leave a review. It helps us bring more meaningful voices to the table. And what call to action did you take? Let us know in the comments.

Transcript

Welcome To The Fashion Situation Room

SPEAKER_01 0:01

Welcome to the Fashion Situation Room, a podcast from the front lines of the fashion industry. I'm your host, Michael Jordan, and these are my two co-hosts.

SPEAKER_02 0:10

Hello, I'm Britta Cabanos.

Why New York Fashion Week Matters

SPEAKER_01 0:12

And hey there, I'm Peter McLaughlin. In this podcast, we offer you real talk about what impacts the fashion industry, particularly through the four S's: strategies, sustainability, storytelling, and solutions. With our finger on the pulse of the most meaningful business trends, which will also bring to life with impactful guests along the way, we aim to provide you with actionable insights that will benefit you. Thank you for joining us. Let's jump in. Hello, everyone. Welcome back to the Fashion Situation Room for episode two. And today we're going to discuss a cultural institution here in New York City, the New York Fashion Week. It happened actually a few weeks ago, but no worries. We're going to do today what we call in journalism a second day story, not just focusing on the story that was, but looking forward. New York Fashion Week does it still matter? Does it still play an important role in fashion? Fortunately, both Peter and I are here in New York City. Brita was here during New York Fashion Week. She hosted another show. We'll talk to her about that. And by the way, just a bit of background, I myself was looking this up that New York Fashion Week was first established in 1943. Back then it was known as Press Week. Then the Council of Fashion Designers of America then turned it into New York Fashion Week in 1993. And nowadays it's a twice-a-year event. So we just had the spring-summer New York Fashion Week. And much of the coverage, there was quite a bit of criticism that we found. For example, talking about is there an identity crisis for New York Fashion Week at the same time that it's fashion week uh season with uh London Fashion Week just finished up.

SPEAKER_00 2:05

Milan Fashion Week is about to, Peter, you said about to no Milan Fashion Weeks are already done, and Paris is about to wrap up. So they're all new. Yeah, maybe a few days left only.

Identity Crisis Or Open Platform

SPEAKER_01 2:17

Shaisa. Okay, and and there you go. So juggling the four major fashion weeks from around the world. But much of the criticism that we saw, for example, from Business of Fashion magazine was talking about Fashion Week's identity crisis. Does it have a clear identity? Is it in need with one, in need of one? We'll talk about that in just a moment. Then there's can you see this, by the way, everyone? Yes, from Vogue Business, New York Fashion Wrestles with Reality, plus other takeaways from New York Fashion Week. Lastly, we find another article that actually shined a positive light. We framed it in a much more positive way. This article coming from the Philippines, uh, a publication in the Philippines lifestyle in Q, which is hey, stop being so harsh on New York Fashion Week. It's not dead, in fact. It's a platform, it's a very democratic platform for new and upcoming, up-and-coming fashion designers. So, to kick off our discussion, let me ask our two co-hosts, my my friends Britta Cabanos and Peter McLachlan, what not just what your your impressions were, but does New York Fashion Week suffer from some sort of identity crisis?

SPEAKER_02 3:36

Peter, do you want to go first? Or should I dive in?

SPEAKER_00 3:40

You dive in.

SPEAKER_02 3:41

Okay. There it I'm kind of like on the fence because I think there's pros and cons to both angles or both of these articles. For me personally, I love that New York Fashion Week has become an open an open platform for anyone to participate. So if you are an independent brand, emerging designer, an event host, you can still hold your own events, you can hold your own fashion show. And you know, obviously you have to find the venue and you need the audience and all of those things, but it's an opportunity for anyone really that's in the space to participate. So I do like that. I think that's a very positive thing.

SPEAKER_01 4:31

How about an example, Brita? Because I know you were actively involved during that stretch visiting.

SPEAKER_02 4:37

Yeah, yeah. So there's multiple fashion shows that are not listed. So the main calendar is through CFDA, and there's a couple other fashion calendars that do the main big name designer schedules. But then you have all the other peripheral events that are happening. And those, I mean, there's at I think I found at least 200 events total, and it's panel talks to workshops to networking, you know, after parties, all of those things. So I did attend, gosh, I attended maybe three or four different events, and they were all well attended, well over a hundred people there. I found them just through my own connections or WhatsApp groups or Googling, you know, Luma, Eventbrite, all of those, those platforms list events. So for anyone who wants to attend something, you can certainly find a place to go. And there's different pricing. Some are free, some are$40, some are donation, some are$300, and includes a VIP seat with a cocktail. So it's it's really just finding what resonates with you, you know, a brand you want to support, that kind of thing. So there's all these opportunities to either host your own event or attend an event. And as you all know, like unless you're a Vogue editor, you're not really going to get into those big name tent shows unless you're paying thousands of dollars. So that was really meant for, you know, industry buyers and retailers and magazine editors, and those are the folks that are in the front row and the celebrities. So I guess going back to the the question of identity crisis.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

Peter. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:26

Yeah, Peter, what are your would what would you say?

Creativity Versus Commercial Survival

SPEAKER_00 6:29

Well, I think first of all, I think the public in general don't really understand the point of fashion shows, and and that's very understandable because today's fashion shows are really more about entertainment and really trying to reach beyond into actual consumers. But what it was is originally was really just getting like press and buyers, the buyers then for the stores, so it was a very practical thing, and then also they like designers would then show this is what we believe in for the season, and ultimately, you know, that's why some things that are seen in a fashion show don't always end up in a store because the buyers may not necessarily buy it. Now, one of the criticisms from these articles that was saying is that ultimately, like New York Fashion Week designers were really lacking creativity, and the majority of is because they were only making things that would be bought. So a lot of the times you really have to balance your creativity to get the attention and what the fashion is, and then often in the showroom for the buyers are the more commercial pieces that will more often end up in stores. So if this the designers are really lacking the creativity, A, you're you're gonna kind of bore the you know, the people who are creating the magazines and the photographers and what's going to end up in a magazine if they're not going to be inspired. And ultimately, you know, where do the buyers buy things as well? You know what I mean? If everything is basics, like you know, you need some differentiation, but ultimately, because there's the threat, continual threat of a recession happening, designers inevitably play it more safe and really try to do things that will sell because ultimately they're a business and they're trying to keep their lights on and survive.

SPEAKER_01 8:25

You know, just one thing I'm curious about, Peter, as we're as I'm listening to you, and I'd be remiss to not mention the fact that you worked for for Versace out of Milan and Hill figure. So back in the day when you were a creative designer there, how important were the the New York Fashion Weeks for those brands? And and and and does it remain, is it the same priority that it was back when you were on the front lines of creative design?

SPEAKER_00 8:52

Well, let me just say I was never creative designer of Bersace, but beyond that, the like I have to say that we didn't really pay attention to New York Fashion Week. New York Fashion Week, whenever you're talking about the history of it, it used to be at the end, so it used to come at last after Paris, and they had no choice but to go first because ultimately after Paris, you know, people didn't really like care what was happening in in New York. And saying that, then whenever you go to the famous Battle of Versailles, where the French designers really challenged, and this was in like the 70s, whenever they had a bunch of the American designers come over and do a fashion show at Versailles, and ultimately the Americans won. They had Liza Minnelli, they had Halston, and they were competing with the more fuddy duddy. They seemed like a breath of fresh air, that it was all very new, as opposed to the fuddy duddy and you know, ladies who lunch clothing that seemed that Abe Saleron and stuff was doing. But it seems that like New York, with its identity, as you're bringing it up, you know, it's just seems very commercial. And so it's more commercial and less creative, whereas London, it's so creative because it is really these young, hungry designers really trying to grab for attention. And then Milan is much more, you know, your mosquitos, your Versace, your Armandis, like commercial but designed, and then you go to Paris, which is then the pinnacle.

Off-Calendar Shows And Fragmentation

SPEAKER_01 10:24

Well, just to follow up on that, in addition to the identity question, uh critique was about fragmentation, that not every designer feels the need to be present at New York Fashion Week versus having their own shows or or or or pop-ups, I suppose. How how would you two describe that in terms of the necessity to be involved in New York Fashion Week versus doing something on your own? Brito, what what do you see?

SPEAKER_02 10:48

Yeah, uh, you there's big name designers that are doing their own off-calendar shows. And, you know, why is it like Peter, yeah, like Peter was saying, originally the shows were for the buyers and for the magazine, for editorial. And you know, for a company to decide to do that in-house, off-calendar, you know, they can send those personal invites to the people that they really want there. And avoid, on the one hand, they're avoiding the huge cost and expense and time and development for all the runway collections to show during New York Fashion Fashion Week. And then they're really focusing in on what do they want the buyers to see? What do they want for editorial and making it more of a personalized experience for them? And it's so I, you know, it's kind of one of these things where it's if you're a big name and you have the budget to do this entertainment style show, like we were saying, it's entertainment, that's great. But if you're not in that financial place to be able to do that, I think you still have a great chance of inviting those people to an off-calendar show and going around your business strategy that way. So yeah, it's just like even, you know, we're looking at Saxwith Avenue bankruptcy and all the designers that we're showing there. And you just it it's really tough out there with the state of the economy, the everything that's happening now. So I really think it's a financial and business decision decision and still very doable.

SPEAKER_01 12:22

I mean, we'll we'll get to the question of whether it's still worth the the return on investment. But but do you expect, Peter, do you expect that trend to continue that that some brands may go it alone and not feel the need to be involved with New York fans?

SPEAKER_00 12:36

Oh, definitely. But it it takes uh because it really envelops the story. Like if you look at a Dior, whenever Maria Grazia was the creative director of that, whatever her story it was, whether it was going to India or to Morocco, like you know, it it therefore set the scene and the whole story then would revolve around the designs of what she's talking about at this the time. But that is a huge expense because I mean Dior is owned by LVMH. So they could then invite all of these people to come to that and then they take their time. Whereas if you're having like a Paris or Milan or London fashion week, ultimately everyone comes to that city and then it's event after event after event, which means that the schedule gets very tight from, and it that's one of the reasons why New York would have it all in one tent because it was all just one after the other. But then, of course, designers want to be individual or they want to make it an experience, so it becomes very difficult then for the buyers or journalists to then like scoot all zigzag all over time to each all of these different events, so that's why having it in one place or in one time it just makes it easier. But the the visuals for a fashion show will inevitably last a long time.

Sustainability Rules Catching Up

SPEAKER_01 14:00

Moving on, that's very interesting. Moving on, what about sustainability? What role did you see sustainability playing at this most recent fashion week?

SPEAKER_00 14:10

Well, what was really interesting was the news that London Fashion Week now they are going more sustainable, so they are replicating what is happening in Copenhagen and also even Berlin. Berlin has also said that the designers who are showing need to adhere to certain sustainability regulations.

SPEAKER_01 14:30

Such as what? Such as what? Just to paint us a picture of what the product is.

SPEAKER_00 14:34

Well, they can't like if they're doing a set, for example, they can't just destroy it, or the collections that they're showing have to be certain, have certain sustainability standards within it. So the clothes that they're showing as well. But sometimes like these designers make huge big sets and then it's all just destroyed. It's like a one and done. So they're trying to be more cognizant of that. And ultimately, if New York Fashion Week and the CFDA did adhere to that, then they would make themselves more relevant. So as Copenhagen, for example, is getting more and more prominent, that like people are now going to it. It's not just a little sideline fashion week anymore. And because it's its sustainability is really built into the whole entire event, it's getting more and more prestigious and getting more attention. So it makes sense that then London follows suit, but it would also make sense if New York then paid attention and made themselves more relevant to do it. I think for Milan and Paris would be much more difficult because they're such bigger companies that really show there. But for the smaller designers, it can definitely be a way to differentiate yourself.

SPEAKER_01 15:44

Brita, anything that you'd like to add?

SPEAKER_02 15:46

Yeah, well, I was just thinking about all these regulations that are being put into place, and Europe is way ahead of us as far as these sustainability, you know, requirements, and that's trickling over to the US. So at some point, they're gonna be required to follow those regulations, which are gonna make them more sustainable or following at least the the you know, all the things that they're gonna be required to do.

SPEAKER_01 16:12

For example, for example, especially for some of our uh students who may be tuning in or some aspiring uh designers, well, what sort of issues do you see?

SPEAKER_02 16:21

Yeah, so one that popped into my brain first was like the digital passports, you know, that's gonna be a requirement, and that shows the traceability of the the entire garment. So whether it's where the fabric has come from, what farm it comes from, all of those, that's gonna be a requirement. So that automatically is gonna show the customer okay, it's organic, organically farmed, and the textiles came from here, and then it was sown with a fair wage, you know, fair labor factory, you know, all of that will be listed in the digital passport. And then there's things, I don't know, Peter, maybe you're more aware of the final. There was one that if you're over, I mean, if you're a big company and you're over a hundred million, like you are not allowed to burn excess inventory or destroy it or ship it to a landfill. But those are for the big names. And I don't know exactly what the what those regulations were, but that you know, there's the Fashion Act, and so there are things happening that are gonna start forcing the companies to follow those regulations.

SPEAKER_01 17:28

Well, certainly we're gonna be following up on that in later episodes, the sustainability issue, of course. But Peter, I'm sorry, what were we gonna add?

SPEAKER_00 17:35

No, I was just agreeing with Rita because the extended producer responsibility, which is EPR, it it means that then they can't just they have to deal with their own waste. So they're that's one of the reasons why they're not allowed to burn things, which goes back to the scandal of Burberry a few years ago, because Burberry to keep their clothing exclusive, rather than putting everything that didn't sell into a seal or an outlet, they burnt it all, including perfumes and things like that. So this that whenever that came out, their their business actually took a hit because, of course, people were up in arms that it's such a waste. So they ended up then doing some PR and then did a sustainability collection. But it's true, like all of the big brands that sell in Europe are gonna like American brands like you know, Ralph Lauren, Calvin Klein, all of that, they're gonna have to adhere to these. So it'll be interesting if they take on board what they're learning that they have to do in Europe, and if they put and if they adopt those policies, like you know, company wide, or whether or not they just you know keep it fixated on purely in Europe.

The Real ROI Of Fashion Shows

SPEAKER_01 18:49

Wow. Okay, so so moving on to is New York Fashion Week still worth the return on investment? And I suppose, again, I'm I'm something of an outsider to the industry, I guess we could break it down to the larger brands, the known brands versus emerging brands. And so I'm wondering, Peter, anything to to to say about the return on investment for for the bigger name brands? Because Britta, with your event, I know you had some emerging designers. And so we could talk about that. Was it worth it for them to show their their designs? But Peter, first, anything for for the bigger name brands, do you think it's worth it?

SPEAKER_00 19:28

I mean, I I think so because with the bigger names, like as we were saying earlier, like, you know, it it's gone beyond the practicality of a fashion show to you know show the magazine editors and I mean sales of magazines are gone down. So it's really now about clicks and social media and really trying to get things out there. So for the bigger brands, I think yes, uh, to the point that we were saying that they can create their own events, so they're obviously like still doing it, but considering that uh like fashion shows can be like$200,000, you know, you're talking about a venue, then you need chairs, you need music, so that's DJ, you need then the ability to whatever the music is going to be, then you need like the audio, you need the video equipment, you need the models, you know. It used to be a lot cheaper in the sense that models often got paid with clothing for experience, you know. Like so, if you had brand new models, they would get the experience to really like do that. And I think sometimes they still they still do that, but it's it can be very, very expensive. So if you're a young brand, it may like, and you're just constantly trying to sell and trying to keep the lights on that you're living paycheck to paycheck. That's one of the reasons why with Sachs' bankruptcy, like they owe so many small brands and they are like you know, fighting for their life. So to then pay like$550,000 to$200,000 for a fashion show, it's it's a it's a lot of money.

SPEAKER_01 21:04

And and and Brita, since you did co-host an event, why don't you tell us about that? Since Peter and I attended as two of your biggest fans, of course. But you had two panel discussions, including one panel where it involved several young designers who simultaneously showed their their creation. So go ahead. Well, first of all, what speaking of return on investment, if you could paint us a picture as to what your objective was and whether your objective was achieved by organizing and hosting that event. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:35

Well, I started doing events several years ago. And for me, my objective is to get my name out there and my brand out there, and we're a supportive community platform where we want to support those emerging designers. So, and bringing people together for networking. So the main goal isn't to produce a fashion show for beautiful imagery, it's to bring the Community together, hear the stories of the designers themselves.

SPEAKER_01 22:04

So here's one example. This is from your event.

SPEAKER_02 22:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:09

And so right. So not only did we have the panelists, as you see off to the left, but then they brought out several of their creations, which you can see to the right. This was an Indian designer.

SPEAKER_02 22:21

Yeah. Yeah. And so we combined the panel portion as an educational platform and opportunity. So we bring in industry experts and leaders, and they get to share their work and their knowledge and wisdom with these designers and you know the consumers that are attending in the audience.

SPEAKER_01 22:42

And here's the second.

SPEAKER_02 22:47

Nope, still on the first one.

SPEAKER_01 22:48

Oh, hold on, hold on, real quick, real quick. I have the technology here. And then there was this panel discussion involving several professors and and more academic teacherly types talk talking about their same and all that, right?

SPEAKER_02 23:06

And so these are these are top industry pros. So for them to be at our panel, to be able to meet them, to chat with them in person and hear about their work is just was such a great honor. And you know, it was great to have them there. And what we found is afterwards the attendees were just flocking to them because everyone wanted to talk to them. And and as far as the return on investment, yeah. So the this was broken down into two panels as an example. So the first panel was three designers that are upcycling, recycling, doing all sustainable, you know, zero waste or whatever their their process was. But they bring their own models, oftentimes their friends, volunteers. They do their own hair and makeup, you know. So what if they want to hire professional models and use them? That's totally up to them and their budget. But this also gives an a platform for, you know, models to volunteer. They are getting imagery. We had five photographers there. Um, and we didn't even hire them. They were volunteer photographers. Some of the panel speakers brought their own photographers. So we're getting all kinds of press and imagery and social media posts for me without even really doing, you know, doing anything besides hosting the event. So there, there's all of those things that do happen from participating and hosting these kind of things. And, you know, to see a real return financially, you know, that's going to be a longer game if the designers get some sales, you know, it's hard for me to see what happens on their end, but at least the return for me is giving that opportunity and a space for a small brand to share their voice and their vision. And I mean, we had 150 people there and we were at capacity and tickets were still selling, and we had to, we had to cut it off because it was just getting too crowded. So people are interested and they want to support these kind of designers and hear from these leaders. So to me, that the return for my event event was is definitely well worth it.

Social Media Proof And Measuring Impact

SPEAKER_01 25:22

And I mean, one critique was that the free wine ran out early, but that's something else. But but but just actually from a strategy from a strategic communications perspective, I'm wondering ultimately, is it all about evidence, generating evidence and the social media content? Because, for example, with you, you founded the the conscious fashion design academy in Portland, in which you're bringing together community. And you can't just say, hey, part of what we do is we bring together community. You need evidence to prove that you bring together community. So there you go, you organize it, you got the photos, you got the videos, you plant a flag, and it's very persuasive to someone like me or anyone who watches, like, oh, your CFDA presumably is impactful. At least you're active. And then for these young designers, it's worth it however they spend out of pocket. Then they say, and I we need photographers, not just models, but photographers. We need it for Instagram and our other platforms. Is it really all about generating evidence and and the social media platforms?

SPEAKER_02 26:29

Yeah. Yeah, I don't know if you have that clip of the interview. So we had also a we used all volunteers. So we had a volunteer gal who went around interviewing people, attendees, and just getting their feedback. So there was one clip you had that just kind of demonstrates the excitement and why that person is there. And yeah, and it does, it just continues to grow and build that community. And you know, you're building up a reputation for like myself as a brand and a business of what I the type of event that I can do, and then eventually leading people to look up the Conscious Fashion Design Academy. If they need more education or support, they have a place to go.

SPEAKER_00 27:11

See, it's an issue. I mean, ultimately, ultimately, that ultimately that's one of the beautiful things with social media is that it became everything democratic. I mean, just to move on to like talk about strategies that designers can do, like one of the things that I had seen recently was La Watch Party. So it's this guy called Elias who created an app and then also was really trying to create a community similar to yourself, Britta, that to have this huge big screen where people could actually gather and watch fashion shows. And the whole idea is that it's really about bringing people of similar interests, and then they all, you know, just like come together and watch the fashion shows so that it's taken that entertainment and an event one step further. But what was interesting on his Instagram account recently, he was saying that like Vogue had like stolen his idea, and what they were doing, the same as most fashion shows, that you know it's all very exclusive, like his whole thing was trying to make it inclusive. And so they were again trying to therefore that the public can't join and can't be a part of it, even whenever you go on to Vogue today. It used to be you could watch all the runway shows and things like that, and now you have to pay for it. I mean, of course, that's partly to do with the fact that a lot of magazines people aren't buying magazines as much because they're all online, and so they're trying to have to make money some way, shape, or form. But ultimately, then that immediately makes all the teenagers and people who are into fashion who can't then afford these subscriptions, that then, okay, so where do they go and get their fashion fix? And so now that other people are really trying to build strategies around that to make it inclusive, the the doors of these fashion shows are still being closed on them.

SPEAKER_01 29:09

And and one last thing, by the way, Peter's Peter and I attended a couple events together where I did notice that during the breaks, um, people love to, especially the more glamorously dressed folks, love to jump onto the runway with the signage in the background, like, okay, take a photo of me. Okay, okay, now that you know, and posing or in front of the signage. And so I guess it's not just evidence that I was there, but you could also present yourself as perhaps more involved than you actually are because I went and I got my photo taken in the beauty show.

SPEAKER_02 29:42

I found that I found that really fascinating because I didn't witness that the last fashion week that I attended, but this time around, every show I went to, there were people attendees dressed up, they put on their best outfit. They went just like you said, they went onto the runway, they were walking the runway, and their friends are filming them. And so they're creating social media. It looks like they're walking a New York fashion to a runway.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

Great news.

SPEAKER_00 30:11

Which also shows what I mean, that also gives evidence to why it is beneficial to do it, because oh, if everyone posts a thing that they were there, well they're trying to feel exclusive, then you're spreading the the word of your event.

SPEAKER_01 30:26

And then please, Britta, please remind me of the name the the roll-down screen with the different brand names and organizational names on the back.

SPEAKER_02 30:34

Oh, the the step and repeat, step and repeat, right?

SPEAKER_01 30:38

The red carpet and all that. So people love standing in front of those and having photos taken. And you're right, Peter. Then it's like, hey, it's a win-win. Yeah, you post something on your social media, and Brita's CFDA is in the background, for example.

SPEAKER_02 30:52

You've got all the logos on there and the sponsors, yeah, and that's great opportunity for anyone that's sponsoring. You know, they get their name out there, everyone tags everyone else, and so it just kind of spreads. And and so, speaking of return on investment, you know, if it's not financial, you're getting at least the publicity and it's marketing, yeah, and so they're all positive, that's all positive part of it.

SPEAKER_00 31:15

It is, but the only thing I would also caution is that you need to then have metrics in place. So, for example, if you do decide to go and you know have a fashion show, like you need to be able to measure, like, okay, how many mentions did we get? How many posts did we have? How many so that therefore you can then translate that. Like, did we get a bump in sales? Did we get any more buyers visiting us? Was there right, was there more traffic to our website? Was there more sales on the website? You need to be able to connect the dots so that whenever you decide, like, okay, are we going to do another fashion show? You need to have the metrics and evidence in place to be like, okay, yes, it worked, or no, it didn't, or if it didn't, like, how can we do it? And there needs to be a strategy in place and to know how to measure it.

Scrappy Strategies For Emerging Designers

SPEAKER_01 32:09

Cool. So, so just moving forward, moving forward and segueing from the question of whether it's worth it or not, New York Fashion Week. If you were an emerging designer, right, what's what strategies would you employ for a successful show? And keeping in mind that we may have some emerging designers and aspiring designers listening in. What what are your top two, three tips, perhaps, that you would share?

SPEAKER_00 32:38

I mean, for me, one of the one of the stories I always loved was like Kenneth Cole, whenever he was started his business, like he hired, I think it's about being scrappy and being original, you know, and I think that then people are gravitate towards that. Him, whenever he started, there was a big fashion show and he couldn't afford to do a fashion show. But what he did was that he rented this big truck and he kitted it out inside as if it was like a pop-up store. So when people were coming out of the fashion show, he was trying to get them into the truck to sort of get his name out there and also get sales, get attention, and it worked. And so, based on that, like that's what then really started his career and company.

SPEAKER_01 33:22

That's what they call guerrilla marketing, you know? Trying to do something clever in the streets, daring, right? In the streets.

SPEAKER_00 33:30

Yep. And it's also cheaper, you know what I mean? It's like you work with the budget you have. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:37

I don't know if you saw the video of the Chanel fashion show. It was done in the New York subway, underground. And they had all the models. I'm sure it still cost a a fortune, but because they they had chairs set up and they had attendees, and you know, but they had the models coming off of the subway, and they were all, you know, coordinated, and it was a really interesting show. So I think there's if you can be clever and think out of the box, you can come up with those ideas. There were some fashion shows in the street last September, you know. I mean, which would require, I guess, in New York City, some sort of, you know, you've got to block off the street, and there's all those things. But I think people can be creative and clever and scrappy and find a way to show your collection. And, you know, we were saying earlier models want the experience and they want the photos. So you can get volunteer models who are just trying to break into the industry. And so there's ways you can do it. I wouldn't say it's it's certainly not impossible. It's challenging, but I believe that you know, if you've got a story to tell and you've got a nice collection put together, you can find a way to do it.

SPEAKER_00 34:52

And the other thing, yeah, sorry, the other thing I was gonna say is like because Michael, I think you mentioned uh the other watch party closer, C L O S R, which also then linked to directly to SEALs. So as people watch, then people can also buy. So adding on top of all of that, there is then the digital thing where people have a computer in their hand where they can immediately buy something, or at least being driven to your website. So with the tech with technology added on to all of this, there is definitely many different ways and strategies you can really employ.

SPEAKER_01 35:29

And and to be fair, for for anyone listening in who may feel pressured at okay, I had to come up with something original, something creative. You know what? I suppose you could also steal some ideas because even uh just imagine that those if it's Kenneth Cole with the with the truck, maybe he didn't invent the wheel on that one. Maybe I'm sure it's very rare to come up with a truly, purely original idea versus adapting what's worked. You can research what sort of guerrilla marketing tactics have worked and adapt it to to your local reality. Hey, we have a subway, we could do something in our city, you know, that sort of thing. Now, okay, what do we do? Right.

SPEAKER_02 36:09

And you know, if you've got one of these, yeah, you can you can create your own videos, there's all kinds of apps to do editing and and you know, text overlays and and promoting your brand. So there's multiple, you know, tools that people can use.

SPEAKER_00 36:27

But yeah, because even going back to like the pandemic and the alternatives that Dan people had to be inventive whenever you couldn't do a fashion show, which ultimately was also more sustainable. But you know, if you look at the spring show of Moschino from 2021, like they had done all these little mannequins, so all these marionettes puppets were like going down the runway, and they had all little different, but they had an under-winter version and all the people who would be on the front row, and then they had mini versions of the clothing, yeah, that then they could so that then the these marionettes were then modeling the the the clothing, and because it was so original.

SPEAKER_01 37:09

Beautiful picture. I mean, it's a brilliant idea as well, right? Look at that, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:13

It was shared like consistently throughout, and then beyond that, obviously you can take videos, the joy with videos, or it's the the tried and tested lookbook that whenever you do it, you print it, you can send it to whomever. With a video digital, you can do it being creative with whomever, and then also send that out. Like it's really there is many different alternatives that you don't have to do a fashion show, and ultimately it's easier to share if you're having like digital images or videos to you can email them to any like magazine, editor, buyer, whomever, just to hopefully like come and see your showroom. And on top of that, you don't even have to have your own showroom because there is collective showrooms that if you know, like a showroom can have multiple designers all in the one space.

SPEAKER_02 38:07

And now with AI as well, you know, you can create, you could do a whole AI type of lookbook, things created that you've designed that you've designed, not designed through AI, but you can take your creations and create a 3D avatar and create a lookbook and show it that way. And that's maybe for a designer who makes to order, you know, that they don't have an inventory, they're a smaller brand. They can they can sell and show and even put together some sort of fashion show digitally to show their designs and then take orders directly from a customer.

SPEAKER_01 38:43

Just one can you think of one example?

SPEAKER_02 38:45

I mean, just to provide some useful information for uh well, I what comes to my mind is tools that people use like Clow3 or you know, browseware, those where you can actually, you know, you put on the garment the fabric that you're using, and you can show a front and a back, and you can adjust the seams and so you can create, you know, this kind of 3D avatar to the through these tools, and then you take that image and you plop it into a a blank page and put it together like a lookbook. So there's there's many tools out there now that you can do that kind of thing and still have authentic design behind.

SPEAKER_01 39:23

I was just wondering if there's any designer who specifically did that caught your eye that you might suggest as as a reference for people to go check them out.

SPEAKER_02 39:32

I haven't seen a specific designer do a whole collection like that, but I've seen you know, like things online where you could look up a lookbook type of thing. But yeah, no, I can't really think of anyone specific that's doing that.

Fashion Meets Politics And Authenticity

SPEAKER_01 39:45

Let people go to ChatGPT and so one last question. I'm curious because several of the shows became a bit political with with ice and the the anti-immigration fervor of of the of the of the Trump administration. We can name names here. There was some resistance to that, and including at a couple of shows, people wearing some of the the models wearing ICE outs or some anti-ICE messaging. And so it's uh raised an interesting question about the mix between fashion and politics. Is this something new, Peter? Or is there some historically as has fashion always been a place where politics mix?

SPEAKER_00 40:29

I mean, what I find interesting was that there was in New York Fashion Make, there was really just a handful of designers who either addressed it or talked about it. Some just vaguely in the notes, the show notes would say, like, oh, in the times we live in, blah, blah, blah. But ultimately, fashion has always been political. Like, you can if you look out at the the history, like, I mean, Vivian Westwood, she started a career as punk and created that whole look. So beyond then punk, then Catherine Hamnet in the 80s, like she was then doing these big that became a whole trend, like even then, Wham started wearing it, that these brightly black and white graphic T's that she wore to make a political statement whenever she went to meet Margaret Thatcher at the time. So fashion ultimately is a reflection of culture. And so if this is the culture that we are in at the minute, then it's it should be political. People should be making a statement. And ultimately, just to go back to how you know designers coming up can make a statement, is by gaining the attention. I understand in you know, New York or in America, considering there is so it's so divided and there's a continual backlash that people do not necessarily want to alienate consumers or cust potential customers. But at the same time, I think it's also about finding your tribe. And if your if you as a company have certain values, like that's how your customers will connect with you if you're able to share that.

SPEAKER_01 42:10

You know, just one side note back in the day, my namesake, Michael Jordan, a basketball player, in case you you've heard the name, back when he was at the the the pinnacle of his fame and selling his Air Jordans, and him being a black man, of course, there was some pressure that, hey, why don't you speak up about some of these racial issues? And he famously said, Republicans buy my sneakers too. Okay. He did not want to get involved, like he just said, not wanting to antagonize perhaps half the country at the time, right? And to to have that big net, uh big tent approach to to trying to attract customers. Uh Brito, is there anything you want to add about the about the mix between fashion and politics?

SPEAKER_02 42:54

Yeah, I think it is again about finding your tribe. And fashion is a way you can express your personal values. And if it's your own brand, your namesake brand, and you are anti this or pro that, I say use it as a platform to share your beliefs and your value system. And if somebody doesn't like it, that's not gonna be the person that's your customer. It's not gonna be the person in your tribe. You're gonna find the people that do resonate with that. And they'll be loyal customers, I think, because of that. So, you know, you're always gonna lose some people. You're not gonna get everyone that's gonna like you or like your style. So focus on what you do best and what you believe in. And fashion is a great platform to share that story.

SPEAKER_01 43:37

Well, actually, that also connects to strategic communications more than find your tribe. It's also thinking about okay, this is who I am, this is what my product is, but who exactly is my target audience and why, right? Yeah, because I think your ideal just to finish and your ideal client's profile, thinking through who and why and justifying the Defending people. And you can say, I don't care about appealing to all of America or all of Europe or the entire world. I see who my tribe is, but you can also justify and defend. And you think there's potential to earn money from that tribe as well, ideally, to stay alive. I'm sorry, Peter, what were you going to say?

SPEAKER_00 44:18

No, I was just saying that I do believe that people connect more through authenticity because again, where we have like social media, people are aware that there's a fakeness to that or there's a veneer and that ultimately they want to see beyond that. So if they feel that there's an emotional connection to what you're doing, like one of the ones that I thought was really inspiring, again, just to show how it can really set you apart, is leaning into it. In Paris Fashion Week this week, there was a brand called Mathieu Facao, which did a whole show around the 1%. And it was in three parts. So the first part was about the 1%. All these billionaires that were walking around with cans, and they had white, yes, with top hats, and they were blinded with money. They had glasses and their eyes covered with money. They had white gloves with red palms to show they have blood on their hands. They didn't have handcuffs, they had their hands bound with like strings of pearls. And then the second part was about community, and it was about the cult because they're these people on the fringes, but therefore they have created their own community and their own 1%. And then the last third part of this show was about the power of the future. And so it was really taking this idea of where we are now and where it can go. And because it was so creative, it was making such a statement. It like, oh my god, it was all over like social media. And so everyone then raving about this show, which therefore means it's got attention, it will get more sales, it'll attract and you know, buyers to want to jump on what's cool and stores. And it's it's that's where then, just to make it full circle, where we started about the identity crisis of New York Fashion Week and how if it is purely commercial, like I don't think anyone needs to see a pair of khaki pants walking down a runway. Everyone knows what it looks like, knows what the fit will be like. It it's like people are creating something new, interesting, and what is your perspective and point of view?

SPEAKER_01 46:28

And authentic. I like that. Authentic. And by the way, your your French pronunciation is excellent. But what's the name again and the translation?

SPEAKER_00 46:36

Mathieu Fecal. I think the translation I think means fecal matter.

SPEAKER_01 46:42

Oh, well, that would grab a little attention too.

SPEAKER_00 46:45

Yeah, yeah. So it's that's the thing, they're making a statement right from the name. Yeah, right. Okay, I'm gonna have to look that one up.

SPEAKER_01 46:52

It's yeah, I haven't seen it, but that's why I wanted you to repeat it. So in case anyone's jotting it down at home. Very intriguing for sure. Okay, and any any final words, or are we wrapping up here?

Calls To Action And Closing Thoughts

SPEAKER_02 47:03

Yeah, I think we can wrap up. And you know, we were talking about in our first episode how we'd like to wrap up with a a call to action for our listeners. So I was as you're talking about this final fashion show you mentioned, Peter, I'm thinking, okay, call to action for listeners. And so what would that be?

SPEAKER_00 47:20

I think one of the things that people should do is really support young designers, you know, like really like research them and dig them out and support them and what they're doing, because ultimately you will get a unique thing in your wardrobe that no one else will have. You'll have so you'll look way more individual than everyone just dressed continually the same.

SPEAKER_02 47:44

And you're supporting those small brands, which most likely are doing sustainable methods in some manner, you know, small batch, made-to-order, upcycled, recycled, rebuilt.

SPEAKER_00 47:56

Ultimately, if you buy directly from their website, then you're also cutting out the middleman of, you know, some of those stores. But either way, I think supporting small brands would be my call to action for people. Do a bit of research. And and just go ahead. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_02 48:11

I was gonna say, I'll add in that if you've ever wanted to go to New York Fashion Week, it's not just for the buyers and the journalists and the magazines. Like we were talking about, there's you know, estimated of 200 events, panel talks, mixers, you know, 40 bucks,$30,$10. There's all these events that you can attend. And so don't let the idea of the big white tent and big brand names, you know, scare you away because those are you know two grand and up maybe per for a ticket. But there are so many ways you can get involved and attend things as just you know, a regular attendee. And so just do Google searching, find something that interests you and and show up.

SPEAKER_00 48:53

Well, it's and you were staying there on Eventbrite, wouldn't that?

SPEAKER_02 48:57

Yeah, look, any of the kind of those invite platforms, you know, Luma is a good one. And you know, when you find somebody producing an event, you can follow them on that, you know, Luma or Eventbrite, and you can see all their upcoming events. And, you know, if you just even Google search fashion events during New York Fashion Week or, you know, just do some research, so many things will pop up. And so I I don't think it would be difficult to find something to attend.

SPEAKER_01 49:26

Well, just to add two things. One to what Britta said about attending the events, don't underestimate the value of being there and networking. So if I were you too, I would also have a batch of name cards. I know it's old school, okay? Even name cards to hand out at these events because there are lots of schmoozing opportunities. You probably wind up chatting with half a dozen folks and maybe planting seeds for future partnership and following up on what Peter said, supporting young designers. Uh also in terms of your own strategic communications, if you are emerging or aspiring and you feel the need for evidence to prove that you are who you say you are, that it may be worth some modest out-of-pocket expense, or you can think of some way to really do it on a shoestring, but for that photographic or video evidence for your social media platforms to create your own online showcase of or gallery of your work in action.

SPEAKER_02 50:26

Yeah, share, share your experience on LinkedIn and you know what your goal is. If you want to reach certain people, you can use that experience as, you know, I went here to learn this and I met these people, and this is how I'm going to use it moving forward. You know, send me a message. There's so many great ways you can capture that and and use it for that outreach.

SPEAKER_00 50:48

Okay. And I would also, I would also just last point, sorry, Michael. I would also encourage young designers to create their own community with each other because what can take so long is sourcing. So whether it's sourcing materials, buttons, zips, or a specific kind of fabric that you're looking for, and if you're able to lean on each other to say, like, oh, do you know where I could find fusibles or you know, any other like materials that would be necessary, like that can be very helpful.

SPEAKER_01 51:21

And I did be prepared to reciprocate.

SPEAKER_02 51:24

Yeah, I did hear a really good example at one of the events. This was a real collaboration that was already happening. Is there was a clothing designer, all small, independent. So this clothing designer met a handbag designer and they met a jewelry maker. So they all got together and put together their own little show. And so they split the cost, whatever they wanted to, you know, budget in. They all worked together. And it wasn't necessarily sharing materials, but they were banding together to form one, you know, showcase. And they had just met through networking and ended up having a great time together. And that's just domino effect, too. You know, then they bring in maybe a friend. And so that whole networking side of it and collaborations is, you know, definitely, you know, I feel like when I was started in the industry, it's so cutthroat and so competitive that we would never be sharing our creative work with somebody else. You know, that's not the case anymore. Now it's, you know, people are coming together to support each other and collaborations are a great way to do that. And that didn't happen so much in the past, but it is looking very bright for that in the future. And so, yeah, come meet people, network. And yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:40

On on that note, speaking of networking, now you see some of our various specialties here. Uh, we would also encourage viewers, listeners to to also reach out, engage with with us. Certainly, we welcome comments, subscribe, forward on links to to these recordings. Thank you very much for joining us, and we look forward to seeing you in episode number three.

SPEAKER_00 53:07

Bye, everyone.

SPEAKER_02 53:09

See you next time. Bye. Thanks for spending time with us on the front lines of fashion.

SPEAKER_00 53:16

If you find value in this conversation, please subscribe, share, and leave a review. It helps us bring more meaningful voices to the table. And what call to action did you take?

SPEAKER_01 53:26

Let us know in the comments. See you next time.