The Truth About Belonging No One Talks About

The Belonging Podcast by Elev8 Villages | 025 | Pastor Shawn

Have you ever felt like you didn't truly belong anywhere?

In this inspiring episode of the Belonging Podcast, Melissa Kay sits down with Pastor Sean to explore identity, neurodiversity (ADHD), belonging, authentic living, faith, leadership, and the power of radical acceptance.

Pastor Sean shares his personal journey of never quite fitting into traditional spaces—from church to business—and explains why creating communities built on love, safety, and acceptance is more important than ever.

Together they discuss how belonging differs from simply fitting in, why diversity strengthens communities, how ADHD shaped Pastor Sean's life, and what it means to create environments where everyone feels seen and valued.

In This Episode:
- Belonging vs fitting in
- ADHD and neurodiversity
- Authentic leadership
- Faith and inclusion
- Love over division
- Building safe communities
- Diversity and acceptance
- Foster care and belonging
- Creating meaningful relationships
- Community building

If you've ever struggled to find your place, this conversation will encourage you to embrace who you are and help create spaces where others feel they belong too.

Follow Pastor Shawn:

TACA Church: https://taca.church/
TikTok:  https://www.tiktok.com/@shawnriffraff
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/taca.church/

Learn More About Elev8 Villages:

Website: https://www.elev8villages.org/
Download your FREE Belonging Kit: https://www.elev8villages.org/FREEkit

💭 If this episode inspires you, don’t forget to LIKE, COMMENT, and SUBSCRIBE!

#belonging #belongingpodcast #pastorsean #community #authenticity #adhd #neurodiversity #leadership #faith #acceptance #personalgrowth #mentalhealth #podcast #foryou

This podcast exists because we believe belonging is not a luxury. It’s a human need. Every story shared here helps us imagine a world where no one has to walk alone. 

If this conversation resonated with you, please follow, rate, or share the show with someone who might need it today. To learn more about the movement we’re building (or to get involved) visit Elev8Villages.org.

Thank you for joining us for this episode of The Belonging Podcast by Elev8 Villages - where belonging becomes a place we build together. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome to the Belonging Podcast by Elevate Villages. I'm your host, Melissa Kay, and we are here today with Pastor Sean. He's the pastor of Talka Church, which is east of Washington, D.C. He is a musician artist, and he's a fierce advocate for the marginalized. I'm so happy to have him with us today. Pastor Sean, welcome to the Belonging Podcast.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

Thank you so much for having me. I I appreciate being here. I appreciate being invited. It's fun. Let's let's jump in.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

Let's just start in the deep end. When was the time that maybe one of the biggest times you can feel in your body that you felt like you didn't belong?

SPEAKER_00 0:42

Well listen, let me tell you, let me tell you something about me. Okay. Please. I am I am I'm a person who can do a lot of things. I am really good at a bunch of different stuff. I'm Pastor Sean, the church planter, the sort of, like you see, sort of public theologian. Started in ministry as a Christian hip hop artist, all of that stuff. That puts me in like the Christian hip-hop world, the traditional church world as I grew up. I'm also an entrepreneur, also, you know, employee. So the corporate world, the progressive Christian world, the black church world, the tech world, and most things that I'm into, I'm really, really good at. Right. And so generally speaking, I don't necessarily fit in, or or I have to shrink sort of to fit in. Not saying there's anything wrong with the people that are in those spaces, but it's sometimes you have to be, you know, when you're in church, you're kind of a church person and you don't want to talk entrepreneurship in church because nobody here understands you. Or when you're when you're in an entrepreneur space, you don't want to talk pastoral in an entrepreneur space because nobody understands you. But when your brain is firing 12 things simultaneously, you can't help but to think about that. So belonging for me has always been trying to find a space that fits me when no space, when I'm the puzzle piece, I'm the puzzle piece that doesn't fit in any of these, in any of these slots. So that has been my life journey. I've always been like this. I've always been multi-talented and always into stuff, very neurodivergent. And so that has been my that has been my experience. So like when you say find a place you don't belong, I'm like count the ways, no place. It's like no place. Well, I've never really been like I've been in church all my life, but I've never really been churchy. I don't know how to, I don't know how to explain that.

SPEAKER_02 3:05

That that's a good explanation.

SPEAKER_00 3:07

I've been like the end, I I've been there my entire life. I've been in in corporate world, corporate executive world, but not necessarily fitting in the corporate exact lifestyle. You know, like everybody, hey, let's go to happy hour. I don't want to. I'm not I'm not a happy hour person. You know, like I know, I don't hang out like in that, you know, in that particular world. So I don't fit into the social structure of this, even though I do the job very well. But when it when it comes to the social structure, I I don't fit into that very well. So I think my my entire life has really been a life of trying to figure out where it is I I do belong, because place most of these places I like, I stick out like a sore thumb. I was I was ordained as an elder in an apostolic Pentecostal environment. In this particular environment, this particular wing of the black church, they dress up for everything, right? They, you know, they wear, you know, nice shoes to go to the gym, right? You're like, this is this is inappropriate, but they dress up for everything. I wear jeans and and polos, and and when I come, when I come to church, it's like I don't, I don't, I'm, I don't want to dress like you. That doesn't that doesn't make me feel like I'm being my authentic self. Or so there, I stick out, you know, I stuck out all the time, like like the guy that won't, you know, won't fit in purposely. So that is that is my life experience.

SPEAKER_02 4:46

So what I'm hearing is that in order to belong, you have to sort of like turn up a part of you and dampen a different part of you where you feel like you might belong a little bit, the way I think belongs here and this part belongs over there. Never finding a place where all of you truly belongs. The tensions between the music and the entrepreneurialism and the faith, and where's a place or a person who can hold all of that and let you fully be you when you're there?

SPEAKER_00 5:17

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. That's that's that's exactly it.

SPEAKER_02 5:22

Have you ever felt have you ever found a spot like that, even just for a moment, that you're like, wow, all of me gets to be here?

SPEAKER_00 5:31

I think my but the plight of my life was to create the space that I wanted to be in. I think one of the one of the the one of the plights of my life is creating spaces for people who may not specifically fit any particular place where the place you create is a place that it doesn't matter who you are, bring all of you to the space and you're accepted and you're loved, no matter what that means. And so I think that has been my plight to really create a space I needed growing up. Now, there have been people that I feel like I belong who allowed me to be me, right? But I don't know if there's been a collective corporate space that could really handle all of what it means to be around me.

SPEAKER_02 6:18

Yeah. Is is that where Talka Church came out of? You trying to create a space where you know you could feel that and wanting to bring others in where they could fully be authentically them in that space?

SPEAKER_00 6:31

I I think that's where the culture of it comes from for sure. That's where a lot of the Yeah, yes, the culture of Taka comes from that and just sort of understanding Jesus and understanding how he wasn't um interested in the things that everyone else was interested in. He wasn't interested in being a part of the clique or the crew or the, you know, he wasn't uh uh interested in being a part of the religious elite. He wasn't interested in being in being a part of the powerful, he was interested in the ones who were outcasts, he was interested in the ones who didn't feel like they belonged anywhere. He was interested in those people. He was interested in the tax collector and the poor, and he was interested in the widow, and he was interested in all, you know, the sick. So all of the people which weren't accepted in society, he was interested in them. And so that's how I feel. I'm I'm interested in the ones on the margins, right? Like I'm interested in the ones who have been pushed out, you know, because a lot of times people are pushed away because they are different. So like differences is what puts people into the margins. And when you, you know, when you look into the margin, there's somebody who wasn't accepted because they didn't work for one particular group of people. And because they don't work for that group of people, it's like you're, you know, you're quote unquote the outcast.

SPEAKER_02 8:05

Okay. You've brought up I have three different directions I want to go. So let me um choose one at a time here.

SPEAKER_00 8:11

This is what happens when you deal with me. It's just like neurodivergent, and it's like I'm I love it.

SPEAKER_02 8:17

Let's start with neurodivergent then. Um you say you're neurodivergent, and I've heard a lot of different sort of definitions of it. Um, how do you what's your experience with being neurodivergent? And how could somebody who's not, how could they understand you better?

SPEAKER_00 8:37

Um patience. Um, but but so my experience with neurodivergent is um being ADHD, right? Okay. Um, and I am 46 years old, and I didn't know that I was ADHD until I was 42. And so my entire life, I have been ADHD. And I think part of my part of my struggle, my experiences in life come from this way that I am and having to navigate that through everyone else's definition of normality, right? And trying to be normal and wondering why I couldn't do or I couldn't, I wasn't built like everybody else was built, right? Um, you know, my brain fires so fast, so much faster than my mouth. And so there are times that I'm just not, I cannot focus on anything. My dopamine is spent. I can't, I can't uh can't uh focus on anything. And I think that growing up through adulthood, it was the constant struggle of why am I not normal? And um, and so because of and because of that, I think, I think that kind of shaped when I when I was diagnosed with ADHD, I was like, this makes so much sense. You know, like this makes so much sense as to why all of that is. And so I really dug deep. The reason I'm I'm I'm happy telling people about being neurodivergent is because when I found out about myself, it was such a relief. It was such an understanding of which direction I could go and understand this about myself, not that I want to take medication or anything like that, because I actually don't want to be normal. At 42 years old, at 46 years old, I've accepted my abnormalities. Like I don't this is not even that that normality isn't fun. You should have caught me when I was 12. And so and so yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:37

But in a way, thank goodness they didn't.

SPEAKER_00 10:39

Right.

SPEAKER_02 10:40

Like this is you. This is the gift you bring to the world.

SPEAKER_00 10:43

Right. It is a gift. It is a gift and not a curse. You know, it is a a gift.

SPEAKER_02 10:50

So, okay, so that brings me to the second thing I was thinking. When we talk about belonging, when you got that diagnosis, it sounds like it relaxed your nervous system a little bit. Like, oh, okay, there's a reason. And in in a little bit, you're like, okay, this is a place I found a little bit of belonging in knowing that my brain is working different than you know, somebody else's or people I've been around, and that's why I felt different. I felt like I didn't fit in. But now I fit into this wider group of being neurodivergent, right? Right. But then on the flip side, when we give things labels, now other people don't belong to you. I'm not coming to a conclusion on this. This is my brain wandering. When we give something a label, while the person labeled feels a little bit of belonging within that label, what it's doing is it's creating an us and them, so now we're different.

SPEAKER_00 11:47

Yeah, and then we're a group.

SPEAKER_02 11:49

You know, so this whole topic of belonging is so nuanced because in order to belong one place, it may create that you don't belong somewhere else or someone else doesn't belong with you. How does knowing you belong to yourself help you work through all of the places that you don't belong?

SPEAKER_00 12:08

I think, I think knowing what what drives you, right? Knowing how you function, getting to know yourself, even if that's a life path, right? I I feel like I'm gonna figure something else out about myself in five years. Like, you know, like it's a life journey to know yourself. And yourself changes over time. And so the the self you knew 20 years ago is not the self you know today. And so um, I think I think that knowing yourself, and for me, knowing yourself helped me navigate this the groups, the the different places in which I felt I didn't belong. And so it gave me a piece about the places I felt I didn't belong. Oh, I didn't belong there because I didn't know myself because I was trying to fit in. I was, I was, I could not explain to them why I did not fit in the same way that they did. And so they would look at me like, what's wrong with him? He needs to be more like us. And a lot of times it's like, I can't be like y'all. But these days, I'm like, I'm too ADHB to do that. And and now everybody understands, oh, this is how he's functioning. And so the more we get to know someone, right? The more we get to know someone, we accept that person for who they are. The more that person pretends that they're like you, the more you expect for them to be like you. And then they fail you because they're not like you. They disappoint you because they're not like you. And the truth is, relationship, and that's why I preach so much about love. It's why my whole church is built on the idea of love. Because the vulnerability of relationship comes through the intentionality of wanting to love another human being. And the the the vulnerability in relationship will allow you to have love for an individual, for who they are and what makes them fire, and you begin to accept, one, that they're different than you, but two, that we're strengthened by our differences, not necessarily by the the things that bring us together, but we're we're sharpened by our differences and and we can and build upon that. My best friend may be completely opposite of me, but actually makes it work, right? Because I need a left wheel and a right will. Like I, you know, if you know what I mean, like I need a left shoe and a right shoe, a left foot and a right foot. They're opposites, but not really. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_02 14:44

Like, but they're both shoes.

SPEAKER_00 14:46

They're both shoes. And they're they're you know, they're both doing a job just on a on a different on a different side.

SPEAKER_02 14:55

That's beautiful. I love you bringing it back to love because if we can truly love someone, then we don't need them to validate who I am by being like me and by agreeing with everything I say. But actually finding delight in how are you different than me and what can I learn from that.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:15

Um, is really cool. I think also you, I think you touched on something really important that I've noticed in my own life, that in the times I felt like I least belonged, often it like now, decades later, I can look and go, oh, I didn't understand why I felt that and I didn't have the vocabulary or the words or the communication ability to communicate that to the people that made me feel most vulnerable and most outside. You know, if I could go back, I could have those conversations and they would probably understand me. So sometimes I think that as humans, that's part of the complexity. No matter how much I love you. If we're in different seasons, if we know different things, if we don't have a common set of words we can use to understand each other, that can create a lot of that misunderstanding or or division or us and them.

SPEAKER_00 16:10

Yeah. And and I think I think one of the things that is important to think about or to know that is that to me, belonging is not agreement. You know, it's not necessarily that we agree on stuff, right? Like I have a church full of people who don't agree on everything, right? Like, you know, we don't agree on everything. And it's not necessary that we agree on every point in the, you know, in the cosmos of everything. We've got our church is built mostly on virtual members who are states away in different places. And so they've got cultural differences and all of those things, but they come together in our virtual space and they are accepting of each other and know that we are from two completely different sides of the country, but we we all belong here, right? We've got a lot of people deconstructing faith or finding out the facts or the the details about Christianity and finding out why unhealthy groups are made or dust everything. We have a lot of people who do that in our church. There are a lot of people who are solid on the foundation of their faith, but we are all in this one space because to accept that we are all different. I've got former evangelicals and LGBTQ and traditional believers and doubters and seekers, and we're just all here. And I think there is an understanding, there's a realization that to belong does not necessarily mean we all agree. We just all have to have a consensus that it's okay to be who you are. And I think that's that's one of the most important parts about doing ministry, anyways, is is really can people be safe around here and not be the same as you?

SPEAKER_02 17:56

Safety. I like that you brought that up. What role does safety play in helping people feel like they belong?

SPEAKER_00 18:04

I I think safety is I think it's it's is is I want to say primary. I think safety is primary.

SPEAKER_02 18:11

How do you how do you create safety for someone someone new is in your place? How do we make them feel safe?

SPEAKER_00 18:18

I think acceptance is the first thing. It's no matter who you are, where you come from, you know, how you got here, none of this matters. I think what matters is that we are accepting of you regardless of any of this. Um I can tell you this story. This is a fun story. On Valentine's Day, we had I had this really fun thing that I wanted, I wanted all the couples to like dance, right? And uh so I, you know, I just kind of brought up this bright midnight song, and this couple has walked in. These two ladies, they're a couple that, you know, they were they were a queer couple that walked in, and or whatever. And so when I told everybody to stand up and I was pointing out like, you guys stand here, you guys stand here, blah blah, and this couple was, they were there. And I don't know, I didn't remember everybody there that morning was straight, but I don't I don't know that they felt comfortable. I think they were just kind of checking us out, and and I'm like, mm-mm, y'all a couple, come on now. Just stand right here. We're gonna dance to this Brighton I song. And and it was sort of like a beautiful thing. And it was like you kind of know that they were like, oh, okay, this is fine.

SPEAKER_02 19:32

And it's like It's okay for us to be us.

SPEAKER_00 19:35

To exist. Yes, it's perfectly fine that you exist and that you love. And this is about love. And so come here and be in love and you know, be okay with it. And so I think stuff like that is how a person or people can feel like they belong somewhere. It's like I accept you for who you are. I'm not here to argue whether or not I agree or disagree with you. That's not the oh, who cares? I accept you for who you are. And I think a lot of that um creates safety. That creates a person feeling safe around you, safe to talk to you, safe to exist in your presence and not feel like they are playing defense or being defensive or having to argue their existence or their truth or their reality with the what a great example of creating safety.

SPEAKER_02 20:27

Thank you. You often talk about division. Yes. Do you think that division is the opposite of belonging?

SPEAKER_00 20:41

No, I think division is I don't think it's the opposite of belonging. I think it's the toxic version of belonging. Right? Because because when if belonging is acceptance, division is acceptance of certain people on a certain thing, and then creating a wedge between that person and another group. So if if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 21:05

So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:07

So uh I hate talking about politics, but this is the easiest thing I can think about right now. There is Republican and there are Democrats, right? If you are a Democrat and you were in the Democrat circle, you feel like you belong because this is where my people are, right? There are Republicans, and when you are in this group, you feel like you belong. When a politician turns uh a disagreement of policy into a wedge between people, right? Creating division between the people and not just disagreement in political policies, which it which is everybody's gonna have that, right? Um But now we're we are we are seeing people as enemies, or we're seeing people as radicals, or we're seeing people as As a problem instead of saying that we have differences of political opinions, now it's us versus them or my side versus your side. We wedge an issue in the middle and call you immoral on this side and call you extremist on that side. And all of a sudden, the same thing that could bring us all together is the very thing being used as a weapon to group people together and shoot this weapon at another group of people. And so it's like, it's not necessarily the opposite of belonging, because in order to build, you need belonging. And I think I think a lot of a lot of the toxic uh politics in our country, the lot of the toxic politics first starts with belonging of people who felt like they didn't belong. And you you take that feeling and you weaponize that feeling and you manipulate those people. And now they have a group that they belong to and they're they're weapons against their army now, and not thinking from a human being point of view, they're thinking as an army and a weapon. And so it's the it's so in my my particular in my point of view, when you ask the question, like, is it belonging? It's like it is belonging because those people feel like they belong in that group. You know, so and so that that's kind of you know, I hate to use a power.

SPEAKER_02 23:28

The toxic side of belonging, that's oh no, I I hadn't thought of it from that lens, and that's really powerful. I had thought of that from the lens, like watching the NBA weekend, the NBA finals just happened before we recorded this podcast, and you had the Knicks and the Spurs, and the beautiful thing was like you could see like New York coming together, and it felt like belonging. But then the way my brain was, I'm like, wow. But all of the people who aren't fans or Spurs fans, they don't belong. And so again, it's not, I don't think it's nearly as toxic as what's happening politically, but it's not true belonging because it it excludes.

SPEAKER_00 24:10

I think I felt like I belong in New York this weekend. Right? I felt like I belong. I I've never lived in New York. I'm not a Knicks fan, I'm not really a basketball fan. So um, but to watch the celebration, I felt like I was a part of it, right? I think because it's a competition, right? Because this is based on the competition. You have your your winners and you have your losers, somebody has to win, somebody has to lose. This is a game, right? Um, I don't think the celebration of the winner is the the the exclusion of the loser. And when it the celebration of the winner becomes the exclusion of the loser, that be and that uh becomes because as a loser, I can celebrate the winner.

SPEAKER_02 25:10

Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:11

Right?

SPEAKER_02 25:12

And I noticed that actually in San Antonio, with that final being in San Antonio, I noticed afterwards, I was like, wow, even though they lost, they're still being really supportive and sticking around and like fit, you know, like that energy.

SPEAKER_00 25:26

Yeah, absolutely. Sportsmanship is when you can when you can celebrate the winner even though you're not the winner. So I don't think that because we have a winner and a loser, because this is a game and it's sports, and there's there was a winner, the loser, whoever got most point more points, is the winner. Um I I don't think that now when you become bitter about it and you and you and you use that you know emotion, that you know, that negative emotion to manipulate, you know, your people to gather in this to become hateful because you lost, then that becomes the toxic version of belonging. But I don't think because a loser loses doesn't mean you can't celebrate the person who won. I could celebrate the person who won. I wasn't involved at all. I was very like excited about the Knicks and watching them sing in the streets and being happy that the mayor put the uh put the game up so everybody in the streets could watch it. And I was like, everywhere.

SPEAKER_01 26:31

It was so cool.

SPEAKER_00 26:32

Yeah, it was cool. I could I could celebrate with them. You know, if it was the Spurs, I probably could celebrate with them too. Um, and so the Spurs, even though they lost, if they're healthy, they'll say, hey, we'll try again next season. And we're gonna celebrate the winners this season. We'll try again next season. So I don't think that's to to disinclude the person who didn't win in that particular context. I and I think that's a great example because we haven't heard any negativity coming from the Spurs. We haven't heard any any curses of the the Knicks coming from the Spurs. And so we we know a good sportsmanship says there's our there's a winner and there's a loser, and we celebrate the winner and we try harder next time. And I think that's still belonging.

SPEAKER_02 27:18

I think so, I think you're right. I like this is why you're on the podcast. Um, I love how you're I I just I don't think I've had a guest yet mention toxic belonging. And I'm gonna now, like my brain's gonna be there for a while now. And I think you're right. If now we expand the lens from sports, so we know that even though somebody loses in sports, they can still belong in a greater sense and a good sportsmanship and being happy for the winners. So if we're in the wider world and someone feels like they don't belong. Hmm. Now I'm trying to figure out where I'm trying, I'm trying to draw a parallel. So um I'm gonna stay out of politics because that has a lot of different nuances. Uh let's say churches. Perfect, Pastor Sean. So let's say you have a church that is the politics. Well, you're not wrong there. Um, they're all sort of intermingled, I'm afraid. Um, but let's say you do have uh one denomination and another that are relatively opposite, except you still have love. I don't know of a religion that wouldn't say love your neighbor. I'm not saying they all do it, but I'm I think at the core, they all believe in love. The wider belonging within the divisions of churches, we're all loving. So why do we have to add that toxic spin to it and be like, oh, it has to be our way? Like you're wrong and I'm right. You might be able to straighten that out for me.

SPEAKER_00 28:59

I don't know if I'm gonna straighten this out because this is a this is a century, this is centuries of of exclusion. But I think, well, actually, no, it's not. I think in the in the 19. Let's start here. Let's go here. I got it. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 29:16

Okay, okay, here we go.

SPEAKER_00 29:17

1901. It was 1901. It was the Azusa Street Revival in in California. And it was a revival in which a lot of people came together and we saw signs and miracles and wonders. Um, this revival lasted for years, right? And what happened was there were churches burst out of this revival, people wanting to carry the fire of God. Now, the problem is this was the US of A. And the US of A, we don't worship together as far as race in 1901. So there were churches that came out of here, like the Church of God, which is white people, and the Church of God in Christ, which is called Kojik, which is black version of the church of God. So if you go to these two churches today, which is over 100 years later, you go to these two churches, you'll find some similarities in the way that they behave and the culture and the dancing and the music and the emotional expression. But when you go to the church of God, you see it in a white way. When you go to the church of God in Christ, you see it in a black way because they believe in the same doctrine. But the exclusion of the culture makes two completely different spaces. Whereas if you today, if you say, you know what, I'm going to a black church this week and you go to a Kojic church, you would feel accepted. You would be like, hey, they would love the fact that you were there. They would, they would say, Oh, girl, you got to learn how to do the dance like this, play the music, whatever. And you would feel accepted. And if you yourself today went to a church of God, again, you would feel accepted. You wouldn't think about the fact that the the way these two churches were birthed were out of the pure evil racism of the US, right? And it's not, it wasn't, it was way more than two churches birthed, but I can give you the example. But it was out of the pure evil nature of the US. We were we were built into this thing. And so now, yes, you can individually go to these churches because maybe the individual people wouldn't think like that, and the doctrine is all the same, but the nature of which what we came from divided us by color. And so now it's like there is an exclusion here, and the exclusion here, I fit here, I don't fit here. And that is how some of the American denominations, the Western denominations came to be. That's why there is a black church that exists and a white church that exists. That's why we even think about this in that way, is because of the way that the the nature of how we came in to be.

SPEAKER_02 32:04

I love that history. Thank you. What I'm hearing is that because the basis of the church was Jesus and love and doing good, that it seems like has prevailed over a century and a quarter. The fact that I could walk into either and be welcomed means that something was bigger than the division that would that hate caused 125 years ago. Right. And I think that's a beautiful thing. And I think that brings love and belonging a little bit closer together, even.

SPEAKER_00 32:36

Right.

SPEAKER_02 32:37

So let's go to our final segment in this podcast for today. How do we create it's I know the time is flying. Um, how do we create belonging? What's our responsibility for creating belonging and how maybe have you done that?

SPEAKER_00 32:53

I think I think that the number one responsibility, right, is understanding that we are in a divisive world. And not pretending like we're not. Because I think the most harmful thing is to pretend that we're not in the world that we actually are. And when you and when you know that you're living in that world, you know when it's showing up in you. But if you don't know that you're living in that world, you will pass it off like it's not like it's not happening. And I think it when you recognize that it's happening, that is that is the first step. Therefore, when you're in the office and you see someone who you know doesn't fit in and they're eating alone or something like that, and you're like, hey, you're eating alone. Do you want to eat alone? Because I don't really want to eat alone. Do you mind if we if we eat together or whatever? That is recognizing that we live in a divided world and and saying that because I recognize we live in a divided world, there are some people who will live outside of this, outside of whatever our normal is, and and they don't fit into our group. Let me move closer to that person. To me, that is the behavior of Jesus. Move closer to this person who is sitting alone, who needs to be seen, who needs to be accepted, who needs to be loved. And so I I think knowing your surroundings, recognizing where you are, who you are, um I think that is the one of the most important things that you can do uh, you know, to to begin to make a difference in a in a really, really harshly divided and polarized world.

SPEAKER_02 34:41

That was a great example of the little things that we can do, just being intentional. This is where I'm comfortable, these are the peeps I know, this is where I'm gonna hang. But then if if we want to really express love and belonging, then we have to go outside of that and make that one person welcome that's on the outside. It's easy to see them if you start looking at. Absolutely. And you're right. Hey, come sit with me.

SPEAKER_00 35:07

But you'll never look at if you if you don't recognize the world is the way the world is, you'll never look, right? Like you'll never you'll never you never examine the world, you know. That's why that's why it's so easy for people to say things. I don't keep talking about race, but it's it's a very divisive subject, right? Absolutely. That's why it's so easy for people to say things like I don't see color. The problem with you not seeing color is that color exists. Right? And while it may sound easy for you to process, because if you don't see it, you don't have to accept that it exists, right? And so when you say something like I don't see color, it means that when someone is being treated unfairly, you won't say anything because you don't see color. And so you you won't connect with a person that has a different experience than you because you have blocked your mind from seeing that difference. Not that there aren't when people say I don't see color, it's not you're trying not to, right? Colorblindness is it's a handicap, right?

SPEAKER_02 36:19

Like you you see what you're saying, because then you're not taking into account the wounds that that person has or the experience that they have, and you're expecting them to be just like you, which isn't belonging because that's you only belong to me if you're like me.

SPEAKER_00 36:32

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 36:33

Oh, that's good, Pastor Sean. Thank you. That was wow.

SPEAKER_00 36:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:39

Hmm. You can keep going. We can sit here for a second.

SPEAKER_00 36:44

No, that's I mean, that's what I you know. So I I think that knowing recognizing the world that you live in and being accepting that the world is full of differences and is full of people, and everybody does not have to be like you, and everybody does not have to agree with you. And it's okay, it is okay to disagree and still accept. It is okay to, you know, everybody does not have to function like you, and everybody can't function like you because everybody doesn't have your experiences. But just knowing that the world that we're in will make us much more accepting people that will build a much bigger community of of love around you because you can you'll be able to see people. If not, like you said, if you can't see them, you'll expect that they look just like you.

SPEAKER_02 37:33

Right. Right. So I'll I'll tell you a little bit, Elevate Villages. Um, we're gonna be building villages for youth who've aged out of foster care. Um, foster care, speaking about going roots and history, back in the late 1800s, when it all started, was called the orphan train, and they were taking the street gangs, the street urchins in New York, and the wealthy didn't like to see these kids running around and they just didn't want to deal with it. So they shipped these kids to the Midwest to go work on farms. It went wrong in all sorts of ways, as you can imagine. But it's the culture that is still steady within the foster system, that it's about hiding them, keeping in the shadows. So you have youth or you have humans who went into foster care very early, never got adopted, the parents never got recon reconnected or are no longer living. And now these youth are 18 or 19, and the state's like, okay, we're done. We don't have any responsibility. And now these youth who've never belonged, who've never had a steady adult relationship in their life, are somehow supposed to know how to do it. So that's what the villages are about.

SPEAKER_00 38:38

Um I learned that. I learned that um in doing homeless work in DC with a with the group that most like 60 or 65% of the homeless population in this city were foster background, foster of the foster uh system, which surprised me. And I was like, yeah, because where do they go? And you know, like, where do they go when this when the state no longer has to take care of them? We haven't taught them how to function in society. We haven't, we haven't helped them. And so, you know, when we used to, uh there's an organization that I worked with a lot, um, Faithful to City, with Pastor L. Frazier White, and he was just go. And he'd just stay on the street. And there was one night where I was filming for him, and they was like, We're sleeping in tents tonight. I want to feel what you feel. So they went to what's called Tent City here in DC, whereas it's like a lot of homeless people that that have tents. And so he took him and his whole crew took tents and set up with the homeless people and were giving out it was really cold. He was giving out hand warmers and hot chocolate and whatever they were doing. And it was, it's just like you begin to, you, if you actually have conversations with those who will have conversations with you, you realize that a lot, you know, and then uh for for me, I'm I can't, I sometimes I don't believe things. And so then I have to go back and study statistics. It's like that can't be possible. And you go study statistics and you realize that 63, 64, 65% of all of these homeless people have the same story. And it's like, if you don't know that, if you can't see them, if you don't listen to them, all you see is a problem of people on the street. That's it.

SPEAKER_02 40:28

Why don't you just get a job? Why don't you just, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:31

And even if you're nice, right? You're like, I like to give homeless people lots of money. But it's like, yeah, you can you can go give a homeless person a hundred dollars, but if you still can't see them as a human and a human that has a history, and you'll never be able to realize the correlation between the homeless and the foster care program. And if you if you saw that correlation, you could catch that way before it became the homeless problem, you know? And so, yeah. So, anyway, sorry. See these.

SPEAKER_02 41:05

I know, you're right. It's a catastrophic loss of family or the having that, especially in the adolescent brain, like having that consistency of or relational permanency. They get out and they they don't even have an adult's phone number in their phone. So the villages are that's why it's the belonging podcast, because the villages aren't about the housing model, they're not about the education model, they're not about the workforce model. It encompasses all of those, but Elevate Villages is about belonging. How do we create conditions that they feel belonging first as they're learning all the skills they need to go into the wider world?

SPEAKER_00 41:42

So um that's so good because if that's what if you start with that, right? If you start with that, then you solve a whole lot of physical problems. Like there's it's so interesting the uh the axis between emotional problems or problems with belonging and physical things that happen later on in your life. Like the axis between those two. And if you start there, if you just start there, how can I help you feel like you belong? You know, that's that's something.

SPEAKER_02 42:17

And asking the question, not assuming I know what you need to belong, but asking the question.

SPEAKER_01 42:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:23

Yeah. Wow, Pastor Sean. Oh, what a beautiful time um conversating with you today. Thank you so much for being here. Um, why don't you tell our audience about Taca Church and how they can find you?

SPEAKER_00 42:36

Oh well, Taca Church is a is a church where we we we found our niche, uh let's say, on a book that I wrote called The Doctrine of Love. We go by a statement that love God, love yourself, love others. We understand that Jesus said that the greatest commandment is that you love God and you love your neighbor as yourself. And I I make the assumption that if Jesus says love your neighbor as yourself, then you can't hate yourself. You have to first love yourself too, so that you can love your neighbor appropriately. And so we we go by foundational principle of love God, love yourself, love others. And that is what we try to do on a regular basis. We're very accepting, affirming a place where you just you come as you are with whatever you come with is a place to belong and a place uh to be loved. We're just outside of Washington, D.C., um, Atlanta, Maryland, and yeah, that's us.

SPEAKER_02 43:34

All right. We will put some links down below so they can find you online. Pastor Sean, thank you so much for being here and for talking about belonging with us.

SPEAKER_00 43:43

Thank you so much for having me. This is a great conversation.

SPEAKER_02 43:47

To my listeners, thank you for being here. You belong in this place, and we want to know what you think. Please put some comments down below if you have questions for the next podcast guest or for Pastor Sean. I know that we'll uh make sure we get those answered for you. And thank you so much to our patron, Dee Laughlin. Dee, without your consistent and generous support, this podcast would not be possible. Thank you for these conversations. This has been the Belonging Podcast by Elevate Villages, where we all build belonging together.