Built Under Pressure: The Weight of Discipline | Riley Harshman | EP #3

In Episode 3, I sit down with Riley Harshman, known to many as the face behind @harsh_customs and Trail Coins. We talked about balancing discipline with passion.

We dive into:

- His career in the Navy

- Managing stress and time while building something on the side

- How he got into off-roading and the Jeep community

- Why keeping your inner child alive actually matters

Riley has built a strong presence in the off-road space while navigating the structure and demands of military life. This episode is about identity, pressure, passion projects, and not losing yourself while chasing responsibility.

If you’re balancing career, creativity, and adulthood, this one’s for you.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:19

So this is Ramble and Reflect. And so we're gonna we're gonna talk and talk and talk, and then we're gonna reflect on some things. I want to start this off uh by introducing you. Uh so Riley Harshman. Uh a lot of you guys know him as Harsh Customs on the internet, uh uh trail coins, uh, and now your newer venture, which we'll get into. Um, and so I think that what's really cool about this is you're not one of my buddies that I grew up with. Uh were more colleagues turned to like friends and kind of doing things off-roading, and that's that's where I'll start. What are who are you to the people that would be listening and watching?

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Uh like I said, you know, Riley Harshman. Um, I've been in the Navy almost 20 years now. Um, so I've developed a lot of friendships and relationships through that, but another big part of my life is um, you know, off-roading and exploring and stuff like that with vehicles. And so I have this whole huge network of really close friends and and people that you know I really care about and they care about me that are not Navy.

SPEAKER_04 1:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:24

Right. So it's really awesome to have this like supporting group in the Navy that I've been around, and then this whole other group that I'm a part of, you know, and I, you know, love, you know, the off-road industry, and I love being a part of that. And so I have like, you know, this group and I have this group, and so it's so cool to have two different groups that I'm you know actively engaged in.

SPEAKER_02 1:46

Before I said something about 60 on 68. Yep. Nobody off the the ship or out of the navy, uh, even in our little spot, really knows what that is. But that's kind of something that you and me uh I like a bounce the idea off you and and and I kind of I just ran with it. Uh and then you know, I got hurt and stuff, and and now I'm doing this. Uh and it's kind of like tied to the same. It's interesting because that is similar to this in the sense of how it's set up and how I want to do it and what the reasoning is.

SPEAKER_05 2:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:18

Uh, but there's differences, obviously, we're out in the middle of nowhere right now, no service, no nothing. Um, and I think what's really cool and why there's the Jeep in the background, which is yours, uh, is because that's what you like to do. Yep. And so you're your navy, uh, and you're also, you know, you go off roading, but you also have a family. There's a whole bunch of things that I want to kind of dive into.

SPEAKER_01 2:41

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 2:42

Uh, and so uh one of them is why the navy? Like, why where where did that come and why why?

SPEAKER_01 2:50

Yeah, so I grew up in Oregon my entire life, central Oregon, class of 25 kids. Like, and you know, K through third grade, I was in a small town called Wamick, you know, no stoplights, single street.

SPEAKER_05 3:05

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 3:06

Um, my mom was my teacher for several of those years. Holy cow. And then the school shut down. So school shut down, and then I had to be busted 20 miles to a new school, mopping. Um, and then I did, you know, fourth through eighth grade there, still only having about 25 kids in my class. Like small school.

SPEAKER_02 3:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

Um, we played eight-man football.

SPEAKER_04 3:28

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 3:29

Right? Yeah. And so, and like we played eight-man football, but I was I was a quarterback, but I was also outside linebacker.

SPEAKER_04 3:34

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 3:34

And I also played special teams.

SPEAKER_04 3:36

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

So, like, you're playing the entire game.

SPEAKER_04 3:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:38

Right. But um, growing up in Oregon and growing up in that type of environment, loved it. Yeah. Looking back on it, it was like the greatest thing because we were so close. Yeah. You know, me and my classmates. Yeah, yeah. But like every sport, because I was big into football, big into baseball and basketball. And uh I had always envisioned myself, you know, once we got to high school, going to state, playing state, you know, basketball. Yeah. Because we had a very good basketball team all growing up. Yeah. We go undefeated every year. Yeah. And so, but then we had to move.

SPEAKER_04 4:13

Dang.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

Which was rough.

SPEAKER_04 4:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

Right? Because it was like, you know, I grew up with these kids, yeah, you know, and I had this idea these ideas, and then uh unfortunately we had to move to Washington. Uh dad had to work there.

SPEAKER_04 4:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:24

Dad worked construction his old life and what? Dad is my stepdad. He's been there since I was four.

SPEAKER_04 4:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:30

Um, I've never met my real father.

SPEAKER_04 4:31

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

So, but he's been there since I was four. Um, I consider him my dad. Everything he's taught me, you know, I appreciate. But uh, we moved to Moses Lake where you know the bulk of his family is. And uh, you know, I go to high school now. This high school has 380 kids in my graduating class. 25, yeah. 25 to 380, right? So that was like super lonely.

SPEAKER_02 4:53

And what at that what age was that? That was like what freshman. Okay. So I showed up like two weeks before high school started, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:00

And uh that those were some of my loneliest times, especially that freshman year.

SPEAKER_04 5:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:05

Um, because I I remember eating lunch in the locker room.

SPEAKER_04 5:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:09

But eventually I figured out people were playing basketball during lunch and stuff like that, and so I go play basketball. And you know, eventually I made friends. Yeah, right. Yeah, of course. But but those first few months were tough.

SPEAKER_04 5:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:18

Anyways, you know, high school gets better. Um, I play basketball, get in some sports and stuff like that. I get into speech and debate, uh, which is not something I ever imagined because like I hated giving speeches in front of class. But I got into speech and debate, which was uh eye-opening, and I had a lot of fun with it. Yeah, and I did that in my junior and senior year. I actually lettered in speech and debate. That's the only thing I lettered in, okay. Um but so to get kind of back to your question, you know, like you know, why the Navy is because Navy is first to call.

unknown 5:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 5:53

I remember my senior year, um, actually there's no junior year. I think in social studies, some some class. Uh Navy recruiter comes in and they kind of give their spiel, whatever, and then they hand out cards together.

SPEAKER_04 6:04

Yeah, of course, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:05

And it has like, hey, are you interested? You know, phone number.

SPEAKER_04 6:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:08

Sure. Like, not really thinking about it, but yeah. And so, you know, I get a phone call one day. Hey, I see that you signed, you know, this is payoffs of so-and-so, blah blah blah. Um, I see that you signed this, you know. Would you be interested in coming down taking, you know, taking a test?

SPEAKER_04 6:24

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

And I was like, okay.

SPEAKER_04 6:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:27

Like I always knew that I was just going to join the military. It was just like something I felt inside. Yeah. Um, my grandfather was in the air force, and then I had a cousin, you know, that was in the Navy, he's a submariner, and then I had another cousin that was in the National Guard. So, like I had military in my family, but we weren't like a military family, right?

SPEAKER_04 6:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:49

But we couldn't afford for me to go to school.

SPEAKER_04 6:53

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 6:54

Like, that wasn't an option.

SPEAKER_04 6:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:57

And I and I knew that, I understood that. Yeah. And so I wasn't going to put that pressure on my parents. Yeah. Of course. You know?

SPEAKER_04 7:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:06

And uh I I kind of decided I was gonna join the Navy at the end of my junior year, which was nice because I went into depth, and then the entire senior year was like stress-free.

SPEAKER_04 7:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:16

Because I wasn't worried about scholarships, yeah, you know, applications, grants, you know, like the rest of my friends were that you know were had those plans.

SPEAKER_04 7:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:23

And so it was actually kind of nice. It's almost like you had a scholarship for sports, but exactly.

SPEAKER_04 7:28

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:28

Exactly. So I just knew I was gonna join the military because I couldn't fund school. I also didn't know what I want to grew up, and I don't know what I want to do when I grow up either, right now.

SPEAKER_04 7:37

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:38

Um, but yeah, the Navy called and I was like, sure. And I took a test, and they're like, hey, you score really well. You could be a nuke.

SPEAKER_04 7:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:48

Right? What's that?

SPEAKER_04 7:49

Yeah, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:51

And like the recruiter, he I don't even know what Ray was, but he had been in the Navy 10 years and never been to see, right?

SPEAKER_04 7:58

Oh wow, okay. Where can I sign for that?

SPEAKER_01 8:00

Yeah, right, right. That's that's my sister right there. Yeah, but the recruiter didn't really know much. Yeah. And so I go to maps and I take the real as fab, and they're like, yeah, yeah, yeah, you scored well enough. Like, you could be a nuclear operator, yeah, right? And I can offer you the world. Yeah, and I remember the dude saying that, like, I can offer you the world, you know, all this money and bonuses and stuff like that. And I'm like, wow, that sounds pretty cool, you know. Being a junior, going in the senior, yeah. Yeah, yeah, let's do it. But then as time goes on, like I'm like, Oh, I don't, you know, I didn't know what the job was. I signed for it. Yeah, I said, Yeah, yeah, I'll do it.

SPEAKER_02 8:34

Because it sounds everybody's making it so cool.

SPEAKER_01 8:36

Like they're like, Oh, this is the world, like you're gonna you're gonna get money and all this stuff. And so I signed up, but then months go by and I was like, Man, I don't I don't know what this job is, like, what did I sign up for? And then I went and I was like, hey, I want to change jobs. And they're like, No. Yeah, and I can't. I'm like, well, I don't want, I'm not gonna go to boot camp. I want to change. And they're like, phu, no. Right? Because what I didn't know was like nukes are like the most valuable people to enlist into the Navy.

SPEAKER_04 9:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:05

Right? Like those recruiters get like awards, nams, if you didn't know, if they meet their like nuke bonus. Oh, nice, right? Right? Of how many nukes they enlisted into the military, right?

SPEAKER_02 9:16

So the minute they see that score, they're like, You're going nuke. We're not gonna be everything that you can.

SPEAKER_01 9:20

Like that's their priority, is to bring in you know, nuclear operators into the Navy, right? So I didn't know that. And they were like, it's not an option. I was like, well, I'm not going to boot camp, right? And so we kind of go hem and ha about that, and then they they're like, okay, well, the only thing you can change to is a mastered arms. Or like, I think there was a gas turbine mechanic, and then like a cook. Gotcha. Right? Super fun stuff. Yeah, super fun. Yeah, none of that really sounded appealing. Yeah, but they end up having this chief from Seattle come over. Yeah, and he was the nuke recruiter for the for Washington stuff. Yeah, so he knew more about he was an actual nuke, yeah, right? So he comes over because they couldn't explain anything to me.

SPEAKER_02 10:04

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 10:04

My recruiters, what the job entailed and whatever. And so he comes over, and I remember this scary-looking dude. He was in his whites and bald head and just looked like a you know, a badass. Yeah, but he was a chief and uh he was a nuke mechanic, yeah, um, like me. And uh he uh sat me down, explained the whole job. And I was like, oh, okay. So like Sounds kind of cool. Sounds kind of cool, and actually, you know, I'm into mechanic type things, yeah. Yeah, you know, fixing stuff and whatever, so like, okay, maybe this is something.

SPEAKER_02 10:37

Okay, I'll This is the first, like you were like, uh, and then now you're here and you're like, maybe, okay, this is actually he's kind of scary. That's you know, yeah. I think as kids, I think you kind of lean towards the things that are like where the badass stuff is, and uh, and I'm sure that was kind of like a okay, maybe this is actually not just for like smart people, but for cool people, maybe a little bit as well.

SPEAKER_01 10:58

Yeah, so then that was it. Like, um graduated high school and spent like maybe a month at home, and then I was at boot camp July 11th, 2006. Jeez, so date myself a little bit, yeah, yeah. Right? Yeah, so but yeah, join the Navy and boom.

SPEAKER_02 11:13

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 11:13

Now I'm a now I'm a machinist mate, you know, yeah in the Navy.

SPEAKER_02 11:16

Yeah, so uh I think uh for for me, I'm just gonna tie mine in there a little bit. Uh I watched like Jag growing up and and that kind of dates my grandpa. I think uh we watch like every Jag and uh you know I think that's what I grew up on. And then I I think people kind of get this weird notion for the military and stuff. Uh it's like for like tough and uh you know, like manly men, you know, like because you see like David Goggins or like uh Jocko or all these guys that are like special forces and they're like the hardest of the hard and and all these things, and and I'm I'm sure there's harder branches, maybe I don't know, but that's what you see, and like I remember as a kid, I would watch like the war movies and stuff, and even before like the big war movies, I was like, I want to be a Navy SEAL, you know, or like a pilot or something, you know. And uh and in those and in life, people don't realize that like even the the cool shit is like there's a lot of like brain power that gets put into that and studying and learning and all this education. And when I signed up, I was in it like I said, necessity. It was like something that I needed to lock myself in. Basically, like I'm I'm signing myself up for prison, like basically. Uh I didn't realize how much uh of that was gonna be true when I got to the ship, uh, but I was just doing it because I had to. And then I look around and I see a lot of kids, like like you, uh, you know, and uh when you were just coming out of high school, those are the guys that I saw. And when I went to boot camp, I think that was the hardest thing because it was like everyone was little kids, and there was like some 40-year-olds or whatever, I guess they signed some cool waivers, but uh a lot of them were just super young, and that was the hardest part was like the maturity, and I think that was the hardest part when I finally got to the ship, and that's kind of tying into how I met you. We both kind of got to the ship at the same time. Uh well, you got back to the ship, but I I just my first ship, you know, uh, and that was the Nimitz, and which is a carrier for people that don't know what that is, and a carrier is the biggest ship in the in the Navy, the ones that the planes go shooting off and stuff, and you know that's the one that you see on like TikTok where you like don't touch the big ships, you know. Yeah, uh but for me, I was kind of separate. I was uh an MM, you're an MMN, right? And uh again, I'm trying to put this in English, uh, but it's a mechanic. You're you're a mechanic and you just happen to go to two years of schooling that kind of teaches you a language, basically, and like the fundamentals. Myself, I went to like 30 days of uh uh like art school. Yeah, like you know, uh, and then they're like, okay, if you go, if you get picked for the nuclear stuff, just find a rope, basically. Uh no, like I'm not trying to be like insensitive, but basically that I mean they said that, you know. And so then when we get there, again, these are all kids and stuff, and we get there, and there's like five of us from A school that uh like got sent to the same ship, same uh division, which was the reactor. So we get flown to San Diego. I moved from Florida to Washington, then we get flown to San Diego and with our fucking seabag, and uh which is just full of random shit. Nobody told us what we really need. There's like pack of your undies, basically, and uh that was it. And it was like bam, now you're in this this, you know, and then you get to the ship and you don't even I don't even know. There's supposed to be sponsors, supposed to be organized. Nobody seems to stay organized. Everything in the Navy makes the easiest thing the hardest. Um, and so we get there, and there's like five of us, like I said, and we're like, okay, we're going to A-Gang, you know, that's what we know from A school. And A-gang's like the normal route for a regular mechanic, and uh that's like you're doing like AC, like refrigerant, hydraulics, hydraulics getting dirty, whatever. Elevators, and none of this stuff I really wanted to do, but again, I just picked the job because that was the best one that I had, and I just needed to sign myself up to not be able to quit. Yep. Uh so I get there, a bunch of kids, and we get to the ship, and nobody knows our names. Nobody knows, we're not on any lists, nobody knows anything. And finally we get taken to our birthing. And I'm looking around, and I'm like, that guy's name tag just said reactor. So I asked him, I was like, is this? Like, are we in the wrong place? He's like, No, no, no, you're you got pulled over here. Yeah, yeah. And I was like, fuck. And so for like a week or so I had like a pissing contest in my head of like fuck, fuck, fuck, this sucks. Wham wham wham, right? Uh, but then you realize that you can't really change it. Yeah, and from there, it's like this whole new thing. And like I said, it's like signing up for prison. Um, because the food sucks. Yeah, the people are immature, and you're living in this tiny space, and I don't know, when I first got there, it was just ice spice playing in the background every day, all day on the TV. And yeah, these guys that are like I'm I was 27, I think, when I was when I first joined. Yeah. And uh, so it's like these guys are 21, if that, and they're like telling me like, get the fuck out of Berlin and stuff, and like get the fuck out of here, like and telling me that I'm a piece of shit. It's a culture shock, it's like so strange, and one part of you is like, fuck you, yeah, and the other part is you of you is like trying to respect how things are, yeah, and these people, and uh it takes you a second to learn uh that maybe they're misguided, maybe things are fucked up, and for me, I'm very solutions-based, yeah, and so I want to fix shit. If things are fucked up, I want to fix them. Jumping to then when I met you, I was still in this training section of the reactor, uh, which is just where you study, study, study, study, study to get these qualifications that make you allowed to then do your actual job. Yeah, which though they seem to never end. Uh and so again, that's when we when we met, and you are way higher ranking than me, and so you are a leader. And I really didn't know that when I first met you. I was just I just noticed people were talking to you a little bit differently, and you got to not have to like listen to these guys that were telling us what to do and telling us that we're idiots and shit. Yeah, uh, and so I was like, okay, that's interesting, but everybody else like talked to you really strangely, like they were like nervous and stuff. And for me, I'm not I don't care. Uh I I I respect who I need to respect, and that's everybody. And then if you're an asshole, then you're an asshole, and I'm gonna just hey, I know that you can fuck my life up in some way or another, so I'm not gonna be disrespectful to you, but I'm just not going to play that game. Uh so it's like talk to you normal, and I think that's when we started talking about you know the Navy stuff, and you helped me learn a lot of things, and then it was like somebody that wasn't super immature, and then I was like, that was refreshing. And so for me, it was like, okay, this is this is a little bit better now, you know. Uh, but then I also know that there's these like weird things, and and I understand there's like levels and rules and all these things, so it's like kind of like sketchy to like not be friends, but just to be friendly, yeah, you know, so it's just weird. Uh, and but I understand why they're there. So in those times where you're transitioning, you're still kind of you've been on the ship before multiple times, even this one you've been on multiple times. So you're back, you're having to get maybe re-qualled or learn some things or whatever to get yourself back proficient. Yep, and then here you are. You're now the boss of this entire division that you I happen to be the same division that I was going into. Uh, and so it was just like, oh, interesting. And then I was like really interested to see how you're gonna lead. Yeah, uh, and I didn't get to fully uh get that chance to see how that happened uh because I didn't get to go on deployment. Uh so I'm still I got to see a lot, and so I think that's something also where I was like, this guy is not just I've noticed a lot of the chiefs and a lot of the leadership lacks leadership and lacks maturity, and I understand why again, because they're surrounded and they grew up in this you you started and you're still in the Navy now and you're an adult. And so you just were surrounded by basically high school energy, and it just is this cycle of that immaturity, and so it's just easy to just stay in that uh spot, but again, you have a family, and so I think I don't know how long have you been married?

SPEAKER_01 20:29

Uh let's see. God, we just had our wedding anniversary. I think 18 years. I'm getting you in trouble. Okay. 18 years? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:37

Yes. Hopefully 18 years. 18. 18. 18.

SPEAKER_01 20:40

2008. So math, math, math.

SPEAKER_02 20:42

About the time that people can be in the Navy now. So that's a long time. So it's just interesting. How do you think that you and your wife uh have like kind of balanced that? And I I would like to know kind of for people that are maybe in the Navy or maybe just new in marriage. Uh, I'm not saying that you're an expert on marriage or something, but 18 years means something.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

Yeah, like everything comes from experience, right? You rarely go into something knowing any of the answers, right? And it's it's a trial by fire, it's you know, figuring it out. And I've figured out a lot of stuff, you know, over the years. Um but I think what helped Lacey and I in the beginning was that so we're high school sweethearts.

SPEAKER_05 21:28

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 21:28

Um, and so we were together, and then I went to boot camp, right? Which you know, separated us by three months. Yeah, and then when I left boot camp, I immediately went to A school, which is another three months. So we spent, you know, six, seven months apart. Gotcha. And then that right there, and then I would come home on leave for about a week and a half, two weeks.

SPEAKER_04 21:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:52

Try to spend all my time with all the people that I had to spend time with, yeah, which is always a pain because it was like, you know, obviously I want to spend time with her, but then I want to spend. To my my my family, but then I've got friends, you know, that want to see me, and so it's it's always a pain coming home because it was trying to split up your time, right? But then I would go away for six months again, go to another school, come back for two weeks, and then go away for another six months. Yeah, and so she lived in Washington that entire time that I was going through school in South Carolina. Gotcha. So what that allowed us to do was really develop a relationship that was long distance.

SPEAKER_04 22:30

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 22:31

So since we could survive through a long distance relationship, we could survive through the Navy.

SPEAKER_04 22:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:38

Right? Because I end up proposing to her after prototype.

SPEAKER_02 22:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:44

And then or no, sorry, after power school.

SPEAKER_02 22:47

Which is just another school.

SPEAKER_01 22:49

Yeah, it's school number two, six months long. Yeah. Right. And so I uh proposed and then I went back to school, left her alone for six months. I would just like send some money, you know, because we had to pay for our wedding ourselves. Um and so I'd send some money home and whatever. She'd work on the wedding stuff, and then I graduated from uh prototype, and then I drove from South Carolina with my mom all the way to Washington. Got married, yeah, right, and then we immediately packed up all the stuff that we owned, which was literally nothing.

SPEAKER_04 23:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:22

And then drove from Washington straight to San Diego.

SPEAKER_04 23:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:27

Got an apartment, and then like a week and a half later, I was gone for three months. So I like drop her off in San Diego, figure it out, yeah, and then I'm on the ship for a three-month deployment. So I think us, we're able to be apart and survive. Yeah. Now, a huge part of that to make that work is communication.

SPEAKER_04 23:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:51

You've gotta talk. Like, well, what's great about carrier is like, you know, I could call every day, but that's expensive, and it's it's a pain because there's a delay on the phone back in the day when we had pay phones, right? Back in 2008.

SPEAKER_02 24:04

Those things that carry desk now that nobody uses, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:07

So pay phones, you had to buy a phone card, and then when you actually got the phone to work, there'd be like a one or two second delay. It's like boot camp. Yeah, very hard to hold a conversation because there was a delay. But I can email every day, yeah. Right, and so it always was a priority was to email every day, and I always looked forward to her emails. And I and I'm the worst person at emails because like, and you know, on the ship, like every day is the same.

SPEAKER_02 24:35

Yeah, yes, right?

SPEAKER_01 24:36

Yeah, I got up, it's horrible, I stood watch, I did some maintenance.

SPEAKER_02 24:41

But you're just on a boat.

SPEAKER_01 24:42

Yeah, I went, you know, had some crappy food, yeah, went to the gym, yeah, went to sleep, got up, stood watch again, right? Yeah, it's like the same stuff every day, and I'm not gonna go into detail. So, like, I always look forward, I always made it a point. If I got up, check my email before watch, or as soon as I got off watch, yeah, check my email because I always look forward to her emails, and she would write a page, page and a half email, you know, about the most random things. Yeah. But I enjoyed every second of it.

SPEAKER_04 25:08

Yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_01 25:08

But my emails would be like three sentences long.

unknown 25:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:12

I and uh eventually she got after me.

SPEAKER_04 25:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:16

Um, but because I just didn't have anything to write about. But I think that's the big thing is communicating um and being able to be a part for the Navy. Yeah, right, to be independent enough that you guys can survive. And that thing and I've seen that throughout the years where I've seen people immediately get married after high school or immediately get married after boot camp and they've never been apart, and they immediately get to the ship and they go on a deployment. It's like, yeah, and either them or the spouse cannot handle the separation.

SPEAKER_04 25:48

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

And so I always try to like tell people that are in those relationships, like that are thinking about it. Yeah, I'm like, all right, man, I know you want to do this, yeah, but like a good test to do is like go on this underway, this month-long underway, three-week underway, right? Yeah, do these things, make sure you communicate every single day, yeah, right? But see how it goes, you know, test that relationship because if you can't do it, it's not gonna work.

SPEAKER_02 26:15

No, yeah, and I think that a thing that maybe you haven't thought about either is like the the change in how you grew up compared to this. It's like I grew up and I didn't have a phone, and then I got a phone when I was like 12. Yeah, you know, and that's kind of when phones were kind of becoming a thing.

SPEAKER_01 26:28

Yeah, I got a razor phone in high school. That was my first phone, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:31

Yeah, and so it was just like, yeah, it was just like these like keyboards and all this stuff, and and uh and so like and then social media and all these things, and so it's just like instantaneous like responses and like you know when somebody read something and all these different things, and then you get to the ship and it's like why like why can I not send an email? Or like maybe it's the first time you've ever sent an email, and you're like, I don't even know how to do this thing. I I've sent emails, I have an AOL account still. Uh but uh a lot of these guys, like I said, were like 18, and and so I'm you're talking about a lot of these guys are real young and and so are their wives, and so they're they're not really testing the waters, they're just diving in, and uh it's really interesting, but it's cool to see that you can still be in a relationship in these types of situ uh situations, and uh so it's just it's really interesting. And then you started to have kids. Yep. Like did something change when that happened or was it harder? Because I I can't imagine for me, I can't imagine having to leave then. Uh and I don't even I don't have kids or anything, but just like just leaving in general sucks.

SPEAKER_01 27:41

Yeah, it always sucks. Um but I think okay, so our first child um didn't go full term. Okay, it was an ectopic pregnancy. Um, so the child, you know, it had to be aborted, essentially.

SPEAKER_03 28:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:01

Um the roughest part was I was underway for that. Jesus and she had to 100% deal with that by herself.

SPEAKER_03 28:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:09

Like that killed me. Um, we were underway. It was stationed in San Diego at the time, so was that that happened. We were so excited, you know, because we were trying for a child and then boom gets pregnant, and then hey, it's it's it's not gonna work. Yeah, right. Yeah, and so that was hard to like deal with, and then I didn't know at the time, I didn't even think it was an option to be like go up to my chief and be like, hey, so this is happening in my life. Yeah, can I get out of this underway? Because I think the underway was like a week or two weeks. Yeah, you know, it wasn't a deployment, yeah, it was just a an underway. Yeah, hey, this is going on in my family right now. Can I be home to support?

SPEAKER_04 28:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:51

I didn't even think that was an option. Yeah, you just thought you were stuck in. I didn't even bring it up to my chief.

SPEAKER_03 28:55

Jesus, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:55

That like this was going on. Yeah, right. And so I've been fortunate enough now to where I'm at where people have gone through situations exactly like that.

SPEAKER_04 29:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:06

And I know that I can take care of them. Yeah. And we've gotten people off the ship for you know, underway to take care of something they should they need to be there for.

SPEAKER_02 29:16

Yeah. Yeah, I I think that's huge. I and and we were talking about like your leadership and kind of your your past and how you became like who you are right now and in the navy and everything. Uh, because you're still in the navy right now, uh, which is a long time. Uh and that's your whole career. And so you really haven't done anything besides high school in the Navy, uh, in the sense of like career, right? True. Um, and so that's like something where i I I kind of like uh am teetering of like is a bad thing, is a good thing, is a bad thing, is a good thing. Uh but it's inter it's super interesting, and I think it doesn't matter because everybody is so independently like driven and they just have these every single person no matter what, even if they're like going through the same scenarios, can come out of it differently. Yeah. Uh and so I've talked to you know, master chiefs and and officers, and they are still as if they were in their they're in an adult body, but they're 18 years old still, uh, which is super interesting. And then you have people that are you know have no rank and they're like a fireman recruit, you know, and they're very mature.

SPEAKER_05 30:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:32

Uh but even myself, I find myself to be pretty mature, I think. Uh, and I've had previous jobs and all these things.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

And I and I think that's that's the big part of it is experience, right? That and that's that's usually you know runs with that maturity that you see in in people, especially because you can always tell when you know someone joins the navy and they they come to work for you. Yeah, and you can always tell if they've held jobs before the navy.

SPEAKER_02 31:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:02

Because there is a a maturity uhness about them.

SPEAKER_02 31:06

Yeah, there's like a giveaway, right?

SPEAKER_01 31:07

And it's easy. You can tell the people that you know got out of high school, did nothing in high school, right, and were babied the entire time, and then joined the military because they hadn't they hadn't they didn't even think about anything past their diploma. Yeah, right. And so then they realize, oh, I gotta do something. Yeah. Hey, join the ma join the navy, okay, right? And they go do it, and then they have zero work ethic, maturity, you know, this that that type of stuff.

SPEAKER_04 31:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:33

And I think I'm I'm blessed because I held a lot of jobs through high school. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_04 31:38

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 31:38

I had a lot of um different experiences, okay. Um, different types of bosses and expectations and accountability, like all of this stuff. So join yes, I joined the Navy right after high school. But you had experience, but I I had all these experiences and I had all these great people around me.

SPEAKER_05 31:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:57

That made my life hard. Yeah. Right? And it was hard at the moment, yeah, but it really helped later on.

SPEAKER_02 32:04

So, what do you think that does for you in this sense of now you're in this spot where you're in charge of how many people? Like 75? About 100. Yeah. Uh, and these guys are, I mean, you're in charge of these guys, and and you're kind of this tie for their leadership, the people above them telling, hey, this is what we're gonna be doing, and like telling you what to do, then you're telling them what to do. How do you think that scenario, that maturity, or those experiences from before high school or in high school to then now your your career in the Navy, how do you think those tie into how you then treat the guys that you know don't have that maturity or are growing into who they are as young men or young women? So it's and how do you tie that?

SPEAKER_01 32:54

So it's really because you know, I know what I've done and I know what I've been through, right? So therefore I can typically see what these people are missing.

SPEAKER_04 33:02

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 33:03

Right? Based on their work ethic, yeah, how they carry themselves, conversations, right? You can tell, you know, what is this person missing in life?

SPEAKER_04 33:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:11

Um, because they've never been held accountable or they've never had strict guidelines or this, that, and the other, right? Things that I've gone through, there's a good chance they haven't gone through it because they're acting this way.

SPEAKER_04 33:22

Yeah, I gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 33:23

So then it's like, okay, then how do how do I lead the that type of person?

SPEAKER_04 33:28

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 33:29

And all these other ones. It's not like you're you can just focus on one person, it's like you got a hundred people to deal with.

SPEAKER_01 33:35

Yep. Um, and I think the one thing about leadership um that I've noticed is like you have to be flexible. Yeah, like there is not one style of leadership that works for everybody.

SPEAKER_04 33:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:47

Right. Some people you can just have a simple conversation with them, like if they're screwing up, yeah. You can just have a simple conversation. Yeah. And they'll be like, oh damn it, I'm screwing up. Yeah, I'm you know, letting senior chief down or whatever, and then they'll just go fix themselves, right? Uh some people need to be yelled at, yeah. Right? They need to be scared.

SPEAKER_04 34:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:09

Some people need to be humiliated. Yeah. That that's a harder one to do. But there's every person, you know, some people need disappointing dad, like different flavors to get to motivate people to do what they need to do. Yeah. And so you can't just be that one-hit wonder where you yell at everybody. Yeah. Right? It doesn't matter. Like there's some people that are like that. They hit every, like anything that comes at them in a negative way, it's aggression. Bam. Aggression back, right? And that works with some, but it doesn't work with a lot, and especially with uh people nowadays, young sailors nowadays.

SPEAKER_02 34:48

How's the change like in this generation now compared to five, ten years ago?

SPEAKER_01 34:53

Yeah, it it it is, it has changed quite a bit, and you can't meet them with aggression.

SPEAKER_04 34:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:00

Because it doesn't phase them. Yeah, just like they're just like, fuck you. Yeah, they just look at you and like, okay.

SPEAKER_02 35:06

Yeah. Right? And and have you learned that like uh gradually, or was it like a one thing that was like, holy shit, like this is gonna be fucking hard.

SPEAKER_01 35:14

It seems like every time I come back to the ship, yeah, right, you learn something new. This is the third time I've come back to the ship and you see the culture change. Yeah. Like me growing up, a chief was a scary person. Yeah, right. If she said something, you did what chief said, yeah, and you didn't question it. Yeah, there was no, you know, talk back, there was no yeah, whatever. And it's like chief said do this, okay. Yeah, right. And you didn't want to disappoint chief, or you didn't want you want to stay, you know, under the radar, like, because you were scared of this this person.

SPEAKER_02 35:44

Yeah, now that's not like that.

SPEAKER_01 35:45

And uh back then, like we called everyone by their last name.

SPEAKER_02 35:49

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 35:50

Right? Yeah, even our friends in birthing. Yeah, then when I came back to the ship, people were calling each other by their first names. I was like, what is going on? Like, what I don't like it. What happened? You know, like and then I came back this third time, and you know, the sailors are doing exclusively first names, and then they're they don't even care what environment they're in, if they're around other khaki, you know, or whatever. And you're talking about the no most recent, yeah, most recent, and then and then the phones having Wi-Fi in the ship that's completely oh god, yeah. That's crazy to me because I've never experienced that, and it's a whole new world. And yeah, I mean the transition happened when I was on the ship, and it was like, this is awesome, but like then I started seeing little things that's like it's awesome because you know I can text Lacey or you know, I can post to Instagram from my rack, right? Yeah, you know, yeah, and it's or look something up or whatever. It's super convenient, but sometimes I feel like people need separation.

SPEAKER_02 36:48

Yeah, I think honestly, I think that the I mean, we're out right now, we have no service, yeah, and I think that is a good thing. Yeah, I think that is a a healthy thing. Uh, and I don't think people put themselves in that situation for one, yeah, and for two, I think the the Navy had that as kind of like a positive, yeah. Uh, especially the Navy uh compared to other branches and stuff. Um and so I I don't know if I truly like it or if I think it kind of hurt the Navy, but I mean that's just up for debate in so many ways.

SPEAKER_01 37:21

So many ways, yeah, right. And because I can see, you know, sometimes people are so in tune with what's going on home or the drama at home that's not really they it's not in their lane, it shouldn't be in their lane, but they're forced, they're making it in their lane because they have so much connectivity, yeah, right, that it's affecting them, it's affecting their work. Yeah, but that's what was nice about you know back in the day not having Wi-Fi and only email was like it allowed you to really not focus or worry about the drama at home, and really it was more focused on your friends and birthing and the job that you had to do.

SPEAKER_02 37:58

Yeah, you had to build this these people, the camaraderie, you had to build these relationships so that you can survive because everybody needs connection in some way or another, uh, which is really interesting. And and it, I don't know, the navy itself and that whole experience is so interesting, and there should be studies and studies done because I think there's so much to learn and so much to see. Uh, and I think it could be done in so many different ways, and maybe the old ways are better, maybe the new ways are better, who knows? Uh, but you're kind of coming up to like a turning point in your like in this career and stuff, and I I'm gonna I want to go that direction in a second, uh, but I want to see you were talking about you know, that we're talking about these changes of like generations, and every time you come back to the boat, it's kind of different. Yeah, I know a lot of the guys on the ship. I can I was kind of like in this like weird spot where I was like, I'm I'm I'm seeing your side of things, and I'm getting to talk to you, and I'm putting myself into positions where I get to talk with higher-ups and all these different things. But then I have the guys that I live with in birthing and in my tiny rack with three, five, six other people, and then right next to that is another and another and another, and it just keeps going. Um, and you're you're hearing all these complaining and all this negative and all this blah blah blah, and get out of there, good to fuck. And and then you hear ice spice in the background playing, you know. Uh and so it's just it's such a weird thing. Um, and so I'm just curious because like for you, you're you're in a whole different sleeping environment, whole different kind of world. You get to eat somewhere nicer, kind of it's it's better, it's a step up, and that's kind of what people work for. You know, that's a you that's a promotion, that's part of promotions. You make more money, you get better things, whatever. Um, and then you know, officers get another whole different thing, right? And it's kind of these like levels, and and and it's I it's the same thing as in regular work, you know, promotions, you get to the get to the next spot, maybe a different floor, whatever. Uh these guys I can relate to a lot of things that they have to say, and uh, but then I can also like have the ability to like no, like I don't think you're trying to see this side, uh, but at the same time, then I can step back and be like, I'm living in this shithole, and and I'm like, I want to see this change too, but I just don't think that the way that you're going about it or the way that this person's going about it is the right way. And who am I to say you're fucking wrong, especially being newer to the ship, right? And so I'm curious, the problems that we have now, or that the people in the birthing and in in the reactor specific area, because it seems to be its own niche area, uh has it changed the problems, or do you see it repeating problems and they just keep coming up in the same in different ways?

SPEAKER_01 40:53

Uh I mean, we'll get through a rough patch. A rough patch will come up with behavior or something, right? But we'll always get through it.

SPEAKER_04 41:02

Of course, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:02

There's gonna be you know, something else is gonna come up and uh and we'll move on to the next problem. It's are they repeating?

SPEAKER_02 41:10

Like, are they the same ones that you had when you were before you were a chief? Not maybe the same in the same exact format. Obviously, nothing's gonna be the same, but like in the same sense.

SPEAKER_01 41:20

So we I mean there was always problems, right? There was always problems when I was a junior sailor, right? It was always you know, kicking people out of birthing because they weren't qualified, right? Or the food sucks, or you know, yeah, I'm not getting any sleep, or you know, it's the same complaints, yeah, right. But I think there's kind of a cultural shift a little bit. When I was a junior sailor, we cared more about each other, yeah, and the overall goal of whatever was trying to get accomplished.

SPEAKER_02 41:51

You're kind of proud to be still in the new plant.

SPEAKER_01 41:53

Exactly. We were proud to be down on the propulsion plant operating, yeah. Like we took a lot of pride in being very smart, yeah. Like we operated a lot of stuff without procedure, yeah. Right, and the only way you can operate with without procedure is to know it, yeah, yeah, yeah. Right is to be familiar with it and to do it. And so we were always racing each other, starting up or shutting down a main engine or a turbine generator, or you know, doing something like that. Like, you know, we took pride in in how much we knew and what we could do, and you know how tough we were or whatever, yeah, and as a team, but today it's more everyone's kind of looking out for themselves.

SPEAKER_02 42:32

Yeah. Which is do you think they're looking out for themselves, or do you think again I can I have it from a different perspective? Yep. Uh, and so I I'm this doesn't mean that I believe in these things, but I just want to I want to challenge you in the sense of like maybe like your view versus theirs, and and I might not be doing a good j job from their point of view, you know, who knows? But uh do you think that maybe they're not as selfish as you're saying, and and maybe they are just maybe there's like their camaraderie camaraderie is in complaining and how shitty this place is, yeah, and maybe that that's the way that they go about it, and it's you versus them, and you are representing the people above you, and so on and so on and so on. And so they're just like this like they're like a rebellion, and and like basically, yeah, and like and it's like them being idiots to you, or even to me and at times, right? Uh, and I've said it to these guys, I've argued with a lot of these guys, a lot of these guys that I call friends, you know, and uh I've argued and and said, God, what the fuck are you talking about? You know, uh and like I've I've defended you and other other leadership because I'm like, God, I don't think you guys are using common sense here. I think you're just going basically just you're you're finding like defense and happiness out of this camaraderie that you're just complaining.

SPEAKER_01 43:55

Uh yeah, they and and and they just love you know, sometimes they just love to complain, you know.

SPEAKER_02 44:00

Yeah, but how do you as a leader then step in and like fix that? Or it's such a it's such a a a hard thing. And so like how do you do it with without losing the grip, without losing the respect, without losing and is that stuff important to you?

SPEAKER_01 44:18

I think it I think it depends on the scenario, but sometimes like um people are so narrow-minded, short short-sighted, yeah, they don't see the big picture, right? And sometimes sometimes I have to do something that's big picture, yeah, um, and they're not gonna like it, but it actually benefits them in the end.

SPEAKER_02 44:38

Yeah, and so how do you share that with them? How or do you think that is pertinent information to like do it?

SPEAKER_01 44:43

So I always try to be as transparent as possible.

SPEAKER_02 44:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:46

Right. And then also in those times of struggle and hate and discontent or whatever, like I also like to just let people talk.

SPEAKER_04 44:56

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 44:57

If they if they're pissed off, let's talk about it. Come to the office, right? And pull me aside and chat.

SPEAKER_02 45:03

No, I remember I remember doing that, and I remember having uh the whole division, everybody, all hundred people go ahead and just argue with each other. And I remember like just sitting there and going, Yeah, guys, what the fuck?

SPEAKER_05 45:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:17

I so I kind of want to jump away from this in the sense of like I said, that path that we were uh going down. And uh what are you without the Navy? What do you like to do without the Navy? What are your that's a big question. What there's so many questions in this. Um, so let me just give you one. You are close to the end of your career, correct? Correct. What is the path that you want to pursue after that? Are you want to be a mechanic? Are you gonna be a lot of these guys are like, oh, data or some sort of something? What do you what do you want to do?

SPEAKER_01 45:52

Um, I don't really have like a specific like I want to be this. Yeah, yeah, right, but I'm also I don't want to throw away, you know, by the time I'm done with my contract, it'll be 24 years, 24, 25 years of experience in this field, right? So I'm not going to throw that away, right? So whatever I do will be something in line with what I'm doing now, but you know, will that go into be me being a mechanic, you know, being an operator, or I'm you know, taking orders from somebody above me, some supervisor, yeah, you know, or will I be that supervisor? Yeah, I don't know, yeah, right. I'm totally okay with going somewhere, going somewhere and just being a mechanic. Yeah. Being an operator, right? And then I'm staying in my lane, making sure that I'm doing my job and this, that, and the other, and not have to worry about anybody else. Because like I say that's the hardest part of about my job now is I have to worry about other people.

SPEAKER_02 46:54

In a bigger sense than just the regular supervisor.

SPEAKER_01 46:57

Yes, yes. Like like the military, it's not just you know their job performance. You're you're concerned about what's going on at home, or are they paying their bills, the morale and everything you have to be in touch with, right? And then anytime something goes wrong, yeah, you know, d DUI or you know, a family member passes away, or they decide to smoke some freaking pot or something. Yeah, you're involved the entire time, right? And so that is the most taxing part of this job.

SPEAKER_04 47:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:25

So it's like when I get out, I'd love to do something where you're not, I'm not in charge of anybody, right? And I'm just like doing my own thing. Yeah, but who knows? Because uh, you know, I'm also big into like I don't ever want to lead somebody if I've never done it. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_04 47:39

Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:39

So I'd be totally cool with going into something, learning the ropes, yeah, being the operator, being a mechanic, or doing something. Eventually, you know, I work my way up to some sort of supervisor.

SPEAKER_02 47:50

Yeah, of course, but you're not gonna be living there or something, yeah, more than likely. Uh so I think that's uh it's interesting. I I think that I think that what's more interesting is why we're sitting in the rain out on the side of a mountain. Uh and and I think that's where I want to go next is why are we in the rain sitting on the side of the mountain? Uh why is there a jeep in the background? Why why?

SPEAKER_01 48:18

So talking about my other life? Yeah. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. So obviously, you know, Navy's been a huge part, right? And I have zero regrets. Like I said, I've been here 20 years. I didn't I never planned on 20 years. Yeah. You know, I'd live my life one reenlistment at a time if Vin Diesel was in the Navy. Like that's how he'd probably do it. Oh wow, yeah. Yep. So I never planned on it. Each reenlistment, there was a decision behind it. Yeah. And then, you know, I'm here. Yeah. Right. And I have zero regrets because like what the Navy has provided me, super thankful for. Yeah. Because I would not be here. Um, you know, have a family of three, you know, own a house, you know, yeah, and everything else that I do without that, right?

SPEAKER_02 49:00

Yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_01 49:01

And all that experience I've gained. So, but this whole other thing, this uh this hobby, this fun, this Jeep thing, yeah, right? Yeah, I just became super passionate in it. Like I was always kind of a gearhead um growing up, watching you know, spike TV, watching Jesse Combs and Ian Johnson on Extreme 4x4, building stuff, but I wasn't necessarily into Ford Wheel Drive. I was just into cars. Yeah. Right, just into cars, right? My buddy back in when I was in middle school, Brandon Ashley, and like we made racing lawnmowers. Gotcha. Okay. They weren't fast, yeah, but we painted them blue with white racing stripes and like drove around. Take the governor off and ripped around, yeah. Yeah, but because that was fun, yeah, right. And then uh, you know, getting into high school, I always wanted to have some sort of cool car or whatever, but uh uh slowly started, you know, my dad would teach me the things about lawnmowers or whatever. But then when we moved to Moses Lake, my grandfather owned a small engine repair shop. Okay, and it's a little bit more of a taste, so he he would fix lawnmowers, yeah. Right. He worked there, my uncle worked there, and uh my aunt worked there, and my grandma worked there. Okay, and so it was always a fun place to go because there's you know benches and tools and lawnmowers and engines and just like all this cool stuff, yeah, yeah. And I think I was a sophomore, and one day this farmer brought in this wheel line engine uh for irrigation, and it wouldn't start. And he dropped off. My grandpa's like, yeah, yeah, I'll get to it. You know, you always put the farmers ahead of ahead of the line, yeah, because you know they got stuff to do. Yeah, they got shit to do, right? And so I started kind of looking at it, you know, looking at the gas and spark plug and whatever. And so my grandpa just kind of let me do it. Yeah, let me do it, and then he helped me fix it, and I was like, hey, that was fun. And so then my grandpa was like, hey, you know, so every time I went to the shop, yeah, hey, why don't you go, you know, do a service on that lawnmower? Yeah, you were learning, yeah. And so then eventually that became my job after school. Okay. It it sucked it. I only worked two hours a day. Yeah. But I would uh ride my bike up to the shop, and you know, I'd be able to get one or two lawnmowers in, and I loved it. It was and it's probably one of the greatest jobs I ever had, honestly. Like you can't make a living off fixing lawnmowers, yeah. Not a very good living, yeah, but the pure enjoyment.

SPEAKER_02 51:33

Yeah, you you were that's where you kind of got your mechanical love, yeah, which then led you to this big thing behind you.

SPEAKER_01 51:40

Because it I I love the fact that a doctor could drop off his lawnmower and say it doesn't start and I don't know what's going on, and then I could put it on my bench and I could yeah, I could fix it, yeah, right, and then give it back to this doctor, yeah, yeah. Right? Yeah, so I loved it like and then I love working with my grandpa. Of course, yeah. Yeah, my family, but my you know, I learned so much from him. Um every day after school, I'd sit down with his bench and he'd he'd have a lawnmower working on something, yeah, and he'd ask me about my day, and we'd have a conversation.

SPEAKER_04 52:07

Of course, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:08

And I think what a lot of people didn't know about my grandfather is like he used to be a college professor at the University of Idaho. Oh wow, that's cool, right? Yeah, and so he was an educated individual, yeah, but he's sitting at this bench fixing lawnmowers because he loved it, yeah, right? Yeah, so learn a lot from him, um, you know, attention to detail, accountability, type stuff like that. Because like sometimes I'd feel like I was hot shit, and I would do a job too quickly, yeah, and it wouldn't work. Yeah, or the customer would bring back the lawnmower because it wasn't yeah, it's all still screwed up, yeah, surging or something like that. And then he'd be like, Well, you know, you went too fast on it, you skipped these corners, right? And he let me know, and then I always feel bad, you know, and so I'd force myself to slow down and you know, pay attention.

SPEAKER_04 52:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:56

So but yeah, so getting into that love of just thinking how things work and stuff like that, right? And then, you know, I had a truck and I had to work on that truck and I rebuilt that engine, and yeah, you know, I just wanted to go fast, and you know, I wanted a loud truck, and so I just naturally was doing these things. But I didn't get into the Jeep scene probably until 2015. You know, at that point I'm already like 10, 11 years into the Navy.

SPEAKER_04 53:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:27

And so I was in South Carolina. I was going through a bunch of vehicles too because I was like bored, I was like fixing them and selling them and fixing them and selling them.

SPEAKER_04 53:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:34

I went through so many vehicles, but I ended up getting this like 86 Suzuki Samurai.

SPEAKER_04 53:41

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 53:42

Little tiny thing. Yeah, and uh four-wheel drive, little 31-inch tall tires, and yeah, it was so I loved it because it was like so simple.

SPEAKER_04 53:50

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:50

It was like plain Jane, simple, and so I fixed it up, put some tires on it, and started learning some things about suspension and whatever.

SPEAKER_04 53:57

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 53:58

Fixed it up, and then I install it, and then I got a Jeep Cherokee. It was actually a trade, and uh, it was all broke.

unknown 54:05

Nice.

SPEAKER_01 54:06

And I was just fixing things, and I was like, this is like this is kind of cool. And I went, uh, we went, there was an off-road park, Gulches, um, South Carolina. Went there and like, but I've never been off-roading. Yeah, never been on a trail, I've never like drove over a road.

SPEAKER_02 54:20

No doorbox, no four-wheelers, no nothing.

SPEAKER_01 54:22

I mean, I had a four-wheeler growing up, but that was just like just out in the field. Yeah, yeah. I wouldn't really call that lawnmowers, yeah. Yeah, I really wouldn't call that anything. But uh it was me and another buddy who had a Jeep, and we went to this off-road park, yeah, and the owner was there, nobody was at the park. Yeah, and there's this other dude that just worked there. He was basically a trail guide. Gotcha. Nothing was going on, nobody was there, and the trail guy was like, Hey, I'll take you guys out. Yeah, yeah, sure. Like, we don't know anything, we don't know anything about airing down tires, you know, sway bars, nothing. And uh he takes us out, and I remember this guy had one arm, one arm, yeah, driving a Jeep TJ manual. Jesus, right? How's that? I can't even picture that. So he's got his toes on the yeah, he you know, you know, whatever. Oh my god, right? Yeah, and so we're going through the trails and you know we're having fun, yeah, and then there's like this steep hill climb, and he just goes right up it, and I was like, Oh, I guess I have to follow. Like, I don't want to be a bitch, right? Yeah, I go right up, and there was like that like adrenaline rush, like because it was a big hill, you know, with loose rock and rocks, and I just did that, yeah, right. So there was like that adrenaline rush of like wow.

SPEAKER_02 55:37

So that was like your intro to like adrenaline in the vehicle, kind of like your moment almost.

SPEAKER_01 55:43

Yeah, so like, oh that was cool. Yeah, and then fast forward, I ended up trading that Jeep Cherokee for a Jeep YJ, which is a Wrangler. Gotcha. Okay, yep. It was a 95 YJ. And I remember getting in that in this freedom that I felt every time driving it. It's almost hard to describe because it was like it was this YJ, it had half doors with a soft top, bikini top. Yeah, um, and it was loud, yeah, but it was you were so open to everything else because like you know, half doors and bikini top, yeah, yeah. Wind blowing in your face and the jeep flowed and it was slow. Yep, it was only a four-cylinder, but like I you weren't buying it for speed. No, it was you know, nothing but smiles every time I drove that, and it was just like this this feeling of freedom, yeah, whenever I drove that. And it was just in South Carolina, so yeah, we weren't doing anything. So I was like really starting, and I started to really start to get into the customization of that. Yeah, but I still didn't know what I was doing because I wasn't really wheeling it. Gotcha. And then there was a time where um I was on shift work and I had to stay up, um, transition myself from a day shift to a night shift, and so to do that, you know, you stay up all night, force yourself to stay up all night so you can try to sleep through the day to help transition, right?

SPEAKER_04 57:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:07

I got on YouTube, I'm looking at YouTube, and I come across this YouTube channel.

SPEAKER_04 57:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:12

And this YouTube channel shows groups of people going out with jeeps on these like five, seven-day adventures. Nobody knows where they're going except like you know, the lead person.

SPEAKER_04 57:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:24

And they're in these big new four-door jeeps, right? These uh four-door jeeps, and uh, you know, big 40-inch tires, but they're doing all this epic stuff, they're driving to every trail, right? They're not trailering, they're driving, yeah, seeing these crazy views, doing these awesome experiences, yeah, and then they're breaking stuff, but they're fixing it, and then the camaraderie is there, like and I really like the camaraderie that they had, and I was just like, that's what I want to do, yeah. Like, and they at that point they'd already been out a couple years, and so I just started binge watching all these seasons because it was like four or five episodes per trip.

SPEAKER_02 58:03

Yeah, so I just started Game of Thrones right now, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 58:05

Basically, right? And so I just started binge watching, and I was like, This is what I want to do with my life, like this adventure, yeah, this is what I want to do.

SPEAKER_02 58:13

Yeah, so that was like your you had the moment, then you you were like, you just kind of kept going for it because it was like this felt sweet, like this is really cool. And uh I think I can relate to that to that feeling because that was like I I came with you guys for the my first run basically in the snow with a Ford Ranger. Like it was a 2021 or something, Ford Ranger, it was newer, right? But I was in four low the whole time. I don't know shit about shit when it comes to mechanics and stuff. I don't even like getting dirty. I I can't call myself mechanic at all. Uh I I I am my title is uh mechanic maybe, but I don't like getting dirty, and that's why I like that's why I work hard to get to the leadership side of things, because I I hated it. I'm the guy that I get a little bit of shit on my hand, and I gotta go wash my hands, and then I'll come back and I'll do it again. Yeah, yeah. And I'm like, no, you got that, you get that one, you get that one. Uh but I bought a Bronco because I wanted I had so much fun with what you guys were doing. And I again I'm not mechanically inclined. So I bought a fucking Bronco with the Sasquatch package, knowing that I'll be okay. I'm not gonna be able to do the shit that you guys get to do, and you guys got your big ass tires and you guys were airing down. I didn't know shit about any of that. Uh and I when I went on that run with uh the ranger, I didn't air down. Like I was just there uh in four low the whole time. And I mean, no, I have no I don't care. I got wenched for the last part of it, you know. And so now I get to not do that and and I get to drive and take the roof off and take the doors off and do what I want. Uh and I can relate to the wanting to do that. I don't think I've had the the biggest adrenaline rushes that I know that that will bring me, but I'm so excited to do it.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:00

Yeah, you just started and you're just scratching the surface right now. There's so much more.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:03

Yeah, and I'm I'm so excited, and uh I can't wait for all the the four jokes, and and I'm excited for it. I I don't I don't give a shit to be honest. I just am excited to be around the guys that are in these types of things because I grew up four-wheeling, I grew up dirt biking, I grew up hunting, I grew up shooting targets in the backyard and getting smacked in the mouth with the pellet that just bounced off the metal target because we're not smart enough to realize that that's gonna happen. I've done that. Um so yeah, I I I think that's really cool, and I think that it's awesome. I think that tying it into your family and stuff is somewhere where I want to kind of dive into a little bit because you have kids, you have Lacey, your wife, and and so it's just interesting. You have all these friends, you have all these experiences, you kind of started with this, and then you you're in the navy, then you got a Jeep, and you kind of just kept diving deeper into it, and now you have this monster behind me. And uh, and some people might not think it's a monster, I don't know, but uh it can do some cool shit and you drive it to work every day. Yep. And you drive your kids around, you drive your family around, and I think that's pretty s fucking sweet. Yeah. Uh and I think other people do too, because I mean you got a good amount of followers, which I didn't realize until you know uh recently, and uh so it's it's just it's interesting. Um and so the the main question was why are we here on the side of the mountain? Yeah and uh it's because you found a love for off-roading, and you had a love for mechanic, like the mechanical side of things and and building and and fixing and breaking and fixing and big and and that whole cycle. And so it's really cool because I learn shit every time that I get to go out uh and the walkie-talkie's sitting on my dash, and I'm learning shit just driving, you know. And so it's really cool. Uh, but what I want to kind of dive into is we live in a world where it's internet, internet, phone, phone, phone, phone in your face, and people are we're getting people that are like hunchbacks because of their phone use, you know, like and and there's like medical things that are because of phone use, and it is just nuts. Uh and again, we're sitting on the side of our mountain. And I think that what do you kind of do you kind of think of that when you're ta when you're talking to your kids and when you're going on these runs? Do you think that maybe that you're doing it for more than just the mechanical side, or maybe you just haven't thought about that? Uh that this is like something that maybe your kids will get into, or maybe it'll just like inspire somebody else to get a jeep and learn mechanics and and do these things instead of yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:43

That's like that's the biggest thing is like I want people to get out and have a good time. I want them to experience these, you know, these adventures. So I love taking out new new people, yeah, because they've usually have never done something like this. Yeah, I've taken people from work or friends, you know. Hey, I'm going out in the mountains going off-roading. Would you like to go? And usually everyone's if they've never been off-roading, when you say off-roading, they're picturing a mud hole. Yeah, because that's most people's experience off-roading is they went through a mud hole at one point in their in their life. Yeah. Right. But I take them out and I go up into these mountains and show them crazy views or do these crazy obstacles, you know, where they don't think that's even possible for a Jeep to go. Yeah. Right. And to to see that like that light in their eyes, you know, that excitement, also like that's fear, right?

SPEAKER_04 1:03:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:43

I enjoy that. Yeah. Right. And so, yes, like social media is huge. It's a huge part of what I do. I'm very active on social media. Um, but really, like, I want to just be able to influence somebody, and it's not influence somebody that purchased something, yeah. Right. That's not that's not my goal.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:02

You don't own a dealership.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:03

I don't, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:04

Like, you don't need to sell vehicles.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:06

Yeah, that's not my goal.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:08

I want to positively influence in somebody either to get them out of their living room, get them away from that phone, right? Get out and go do something. Yeah. Right. Or go learn something. Yeah. Go have these experiences that I get to have, right? So, or I also like teaching. Um, and I and I'm very transparent about, you know, because I built my entire Jeep, right? Myself. Um, so I'm very transparent when people message me and say, hey, I see that you have this part. Yeah. What is your opinion? Yeah. Right? And I will give them my honest opinion, either it's good or bad. Yeah, yeah. Right? Because there's so many fake people online these days. God, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:49

I I I want to I'll I'll kind of interject there. Uh the the amount of I've had the Bronco for six months, maybe. Uh, and I haven't done really anything to it besides put the the compressor in it. Yeah. Uh, but the amount of people that are just posting random things, and then I know that it's so tempting because I've had my cart full of shit from multiple places, and then I'm like, I'll shoot you a message, and it's like, please don't do that. Like, because it's it's you didn't you didn't do the research, or maybe, or yeah, do this one, or like think about like, hey, you're gonna buy this bumper, but then you gotta get the lights, you gotta get the winds, yeah. There's so much more. There's whole, there's a whole world of things, and so the tie between just make it look nice and what you're actually going to be doing, like what you're using that vehicle for is something that you've taught me. And so I think that I think I want you to kind of like give that that same like advice.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:50

People message me all the time. Yeah. Or I'll go to a Jeep show or some right something, some event.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:57

And they'll look at my Jeep, or look at you know, my buddies. Most of my friends have big jeeps as well, right? Yeah. And so they'll be like, I want a Jeep on tons and 40s, tons being the axles that are underneath it.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:08

From a one-ton truck. Um, I want that, right? Because it looks cool, right? Yeah. And it does cool shit.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:16

And I will say no. Yeah. And you know, they're very confused that I'm not like, go for it.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:21

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:22

Do it, do it, do it. Because the financial investment that's involved to get to that point is extensive.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:31

Right? And a lot of these people that are first-time Jeep buyers, yeah, owners, right, they're learning to be Jeep enthusiasts.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:44

They want that. They don't know what it takes.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:46

And then some will slide that YOLO card and purchase all the things. Yeah. And then realize that they don't actually like it. Yeah. Like, because unfortunately in this industry, if you have a big Jeep, they want you to go do big big Jeep things. Yeah, of course. Yeah. Right. And some people are not comfortable doing that. Yeah. Right. Or you break something that's expensive.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:09

Right. So they get into it and then realize I don't like doing this. Yeah. And but they're never going to get that money back. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:17

I mean, they already spent it. They already clicked checkout. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:19

Yep. And so I'm like, no. Go out and use your Jeep. Go out and wheel it as is. Yeah. Right. No matter what it is, if it's camping, if it's, you know, and you also have to figure out what your vehicle's going to be used for. That's going to be a play a huge part into how you build it.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:37

The question you kept telling me is like, what do you want?

SPEAKER_01 1:07:39

Yeah. What is the purpose? Yeah. Right? Because some people are like, I want to go fast across the desert. Yeah. Or sand dunes. I love sand dunes. Or crawling or just or I want to go over rocks. Or I want to go camping. Or I just like mud. Right?

SPEAKER_04 1:07:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:50

But each one of those is a completely different build style. Yeah. And it's going to require different parts. Yep. Right. And so I really try to hone that in, make them figure that out for themselves. But I'm like, okay, I want you to go out and do things.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:05

Now when you finish a trip, at the end of the trip, you always ask what went well, what didn't go well.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:11

I think it's hard though, because you asked me that a couple of times. And it's hard to. I'm like, I don't fucking know. Like it that one it made me nervous to do this. But if I had bigger tires or like something else, how the fuck would I know? Unless it's there. And so I think that's a tough question. And I don't think it's easily answered, especially if you're not mechanically inclined.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:31

I think it's a tough question because you haven't been tested yet. Could be. Because the majority of the majority of the stuff you've done is just four service roads, right?

SPEAKER_04 1:08:39

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:39

And so if you at the end of it, you're like, man, I don't know what I need to do better, then you don't need to do anything better. Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:47

So But does it take something to break to like know that you need to do better, or you're like, fuck, I cannot get out of this spot without a winch.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:54

Yeah, like you know, you get stuck and you can't recover, and you're like, thank God somebody was there with me. Well, that's yeah, that's a lot of things. And then you're like, okay, I need a winch. From now on, if I'm going out, I need a winch, right? Or you know, you go out with your buddies and um you're scraping your belly the entire time, and you're just like getting high-centered. Yeah, okay, now you needed tires and a lift, right? Yeah, gotcha. But doing that post-trip evaluation really identifies what needs to be changed. Gotcha. So therefore, you can make an educated decision on what needs to be changed. Yeah. And then when you do the change and you see the improvement, you have that appreciation for it. Because it's it's it's expensive, and some people will get in and they're brand new. Yep. And they'll go on a stupid Jeep Facebook page. Oh, yeah, no. And there's so many experts on there. Yeah, just buying. And they'll just go and like, oh, I need all of these things, and they'll know purchase all of these things, and then they actually get into it, and then realize all the things they purchased are cheap, they're only for looks, they're not functional, right? And it's not what you want. Yeah, and so they end up ripping, either, you know, breaking, yep, damaging their Jeep, yep, or vehicle. Doesn't have to be a Jeep. Um, and then spending money twice because what they purchase is not the right thing. Yeah, yeah. And then they have to take it off, repurchase. So I always try to tell people just it's okay to take your time, take your time, and learn and that way drive your bone. Appreciate it. Because that was bone stock.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:28

When I bought it, it was the ugliest Jeep. I hate four-door jeeps when they're stocked. Yeah, they're so ugly, they're long, they're low, tiny tires, right? But like this Jeep has gone through four different lift kits. Yeah, it's gone, you know, it's had 33s, 35s, 37s, 38s, and 40s for tires on it, right? It's gone through all of these different stages. Is that a lot of money? Absolutely. Yeah, great thing is most of that stuff can be sold again.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:53

Yeah, of course, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:54

Right. Um, if I had to build another Jeep, right, I would go straight to this. Yeah, you know, I wouldn't do this, but I but you learned. But I learned all this stuff, so I'm appreciative of everything I've learned. Yeah. And everything that I have on the Jeep now, all those parts have been tested, yeah, and abused. Yeah. And so basically everything on the Jeep is something I stand behind, and it's not someone sending me something.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:19

Hey, can you put this on your vehicle? And you've never even it yeah, yeah. So everything that I run on the vehicle is something that I actually stand behind. Yeah. That you use. And I use. Yeah. Right. Because the Jeep is used. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:32

So I I I definitely understand that. And I think probably the majority of people that know you off your social media, they might know the stuff that is on your Jeep, but they probably don't know the stuff that we've talked about. No, they don't. I I think it's pretty interesting to kind of get you in the spotlight of like talking.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:48

But I think there's something that I kind of want to touch base on. I don't know. Uh, I don't know if you're wanting to talk about it or not, but the uh little race uh idea that you had, I I want I think that's fucking badass. And that hit me out of left field. I wasn't prepared to talk about that at all. Uh but before we get into that, I'll let you kind of like you know, uh settle on that. But yeah, like people slid into your DMs for I'm sure a ton. I mean, I even I'm very new to this side of the the internet and and social media and stuff, and I get people like reaching out to me for questions, and I'm like, don't you need to get out of my DMs because I don't know anything. Here, go to this guy or go to this guy, and uh, so I'm sure there's plenty of people that have slid into your DMs because I was like, this guy has no idea what the fuck he's talking about. He sent me to you. Like, yeah, uh, what are the what are the big questions? If you had to uh narrow it down to like top three questions that you get.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:42

Top three questions usually deal with choice in parts. Okay, um people always want to know what fenders I run. It's like one of the most popular questions, and those are MCE narrows, but it doesn't matter because that company's not making them anymore. They've just kind of gone silent, so that's super unfortunate because I need a new one. So MCE, if you ever watch this, like hit me up. Yeah, uh uh the other thing is the ORI struts, which are those black and silver shock looking things. Okay, right? Yeah, you don't see those on this type of rig very often. Yeah, you see those more on like competition style buggies where it's only a cage, like you just see tubing everywhere and tires and they're crawling up a rock wall like that, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:13:31

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:32

You typically only see those on that type of rig. Okay. Uh, and not a big daily driven Jeep. Yeah, right. And so I wasn't one of the I wasn't the first. Definitely wasn't the first. Yeah. Um, but I'm one of the few, especially with you know, putting 12,000 miles on a year for the last five years, daily it on that setup. Yeah, people are very curious. Yeah, they always ask me, why did you choose it? Um, you know, what pressures, why not coilovers, you know, this, that, and the other. And then I will always give them my very honest feedback with it.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:09

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:10

So that um people ask about the tires. I'm on my second set of nittos, as you can see on the windshield.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:17

Alright, wait, wait, wait. I gotta interrupt you here. You know that I'm what am I about to say? Uh you have a giant sticker, and I'll zoom in to with one of these cameras uh to the giant sticker. Maybe I'll just put it in the in the corner or whatever. But uh you have a giant sticker across your windshield. So you're sponsored, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:14:35

Uh negative. Not a single bit. I'm not sponsored on anything on this Jeep. Okay. Some people think I'm sponsored. Yeah. Um, because you know, I run a lot of Evo stuff or you know, nittos or whatever, and I'm always posting you know, nope. Gotcha. So uh someday, hopefully, you know, hopefully they they f they figure out who I am. Putting this out into the universe here. I I'm just saying, like, I, you know, am pretty loyal because I'm on my second set. Yeah. Right? Yeah. Second set.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:07

Well, I don't think even if you didn't have the nitty-tire zone, it matters. You have the nitty sticker across your fucking forehead. Basically, you got a face tattoo uh of the place that you are like wanting to like work with.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:20

Yeah, and yeah, they they sent me that in a care package, yeah. And I like to switch up the Jeep every once in a while, you know, like change and whatever. And I was like, you know, why not show my support for that company because you know that is probably one of the the most important parts on this vehicle.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:40

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:40

And I made the twice, you know, the choice to run them again. Like I put about 35,000, 40,000 miles in my first set.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:47

And then I bought another set, right? To replace those. I could have gone to any sort of tire company, I could have actually probably reached out to a certain tire company that won't be named, and they probably would have given me a free set of their tires. Yeah, um, but yeah, that would have been cool, a free set of 40s. Yeah, but you want the what do you want? The quality that that you work with and that you can exactly. Like, I don't want to sacrifice quality and just I didn't want to be a person because there are people out there but just go for the free stuff. They will go for the free stuff, they are not loyalist, and they will just jump brand to brand.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:20

Well, I think that is something that is part of social media, and I think that is something that is what people are going against now. I think it's that there's a there's a wave that is kind of coming across, and I think 20 2022, yeah, and behind it was like that wave where it's like I'll take anything for free.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:39

Yeah, and and it wasn't just in the Jeep world or the Bronco world, it's in the whole influencer type of world. You have all these influencers and ambassadors, and like this is the greatest thing I've ever seen. Yeah, use my promo code, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:52

And then you have all these people that are then doing it, and they're like, This is dog shit. Yeah, yeah. Like I bought it and it's dog shit. Yeah, or maybe it works, whatever, but yeah, it's it's interesting. So we were talking about you know, like the off-roading and their top three questions, but what I really wanted to dive into and what we kind of talked about for a second was a race team. Uh, and so this is very new to me. Probably very new to you. Uh probably uh way too soon to maybe be putting it into the to the ether. To the ether, but uh well fuck it.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:27

It it yeah, it's only gonna bring haters and criticism. I want to hear it. So what what is the haters and the criticism? What are those things gonna be uh talking about? It's like you can't be competitive, you can't complete it, like that's a dumb, it's a dumb vehicle choice, it's a dumb engine choice, like you know, just add like you're not gonna succeed. Like I think you're dumb for trying. Yeah, because and I've already heard it. Yeah, um, I heard it from a couple friends recently. We were discussing the races, and uh, and it's a very common thing, and I've seen it throughout. Um, so every year I watch King of the Hammers around you know, first of February, which is a week-long hardest off-road race.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:18

Yeah, you sent me that video first time I've ever seen it.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:21

Hardest off-road race throughout the year, and um what intrigues me about it is like the challenge. It's and you know, it's it's the journey and the destination, but it's like trying to finish that race because it's the hardest like race ever, like would just be a win in itself.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:43

Not yeah, you're saying you don't need to place or nothing.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:45

Yeah, like like I have zero like desire to even place. Yeah. Because like, like, for example, the uh attrition rate this year for the and no, this is the uh King of Kings race, the the big kahuna event. Yeah, I think like 88 cars left the starting line and two finished after 14 hours of racing, you know, through through the desert and through the rocks, yeah. Right, and that's crazy. Yeah, it's nice. And but the footage is so good, the coverage of that, because they have drones in every single canyon and across the desert and helicopters, and like they have all the things, right? And so you can sit there and watch, and you can and nowadays a lot of these racers are live streaming in the car.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:26

Oh, that's cool.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:27

So they have their own YouTube channel and you're live streaming, you're watching them race. Yeah, but you can just latch on to these stories of these people and just see the fight. Yeah, the fight that they go through um to just complete, yeah, you know, multiple rollovers or fires or breakage or flat tires and just that like that fight, that persistence, that endurance that they have, yeah, you get to see that. Yeah, and it's like I want I want to challenge myself. Yeah, I wanna put myself in the suck and see what happens. Yeah, right, because I know it's gonna suck. Yeah, like leading up to it's gonna suck, the amount of money is gonna suck, right? And just the prep work and you know, you could get there and in the first mile break and be done for the race, right? But that's that's the risk.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:24

I mean that's the whole that's the whole thing with everything, right? Like uh sports, yeah. Like the last person that I had on, uh Nuke, he he uh you know got some he got too many concussions and everything that he worked for up until that point done in a second. Yeah, and so it's like no, it's totally understandable, and I think a lot of people can relate to that in the sense of like wanting to do something that is there's a risk, you know, but like you just want to do it because one, it's fun, and kind of two, to prove yourself, like yeah, just you in general, you're not trying to prove anybody else, you're just trying to prove to yourself, like, oh, I can I can finish this or I can do it up to this point or whatever 88 and then two, yeah, like if you could be the third or part of that too, like how fucking badass would that be? That would be right.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:09

That would be that would be crazy, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:10

But of course there's gonna be haters.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:12

There's always and the thing is it's like you know, because I'm not a a shop, yeah, you know, I'm not a reputable company brand, yeah. Yeah, company brand. I don't have any sponsors, yeah, right. No one's sponsoring this race car build. Yeah, like it's like I think of uh um Talladigan Knights with the cougar on the front. Yeah, it's just me, right? It's just me. Um but it's something like and I every year I watch, I sit there and I'm like, I want to do this. Yeah, and it and it's not I want to do this and I want to win. Yeah, yeah, right, which is weird because you know, anytime someone wants to do something, they want to be that guy on top.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:52

They want to be the guy, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:53

But like because this is so naturally challenging and hard, yeah, it's it's like it's almost unfathomable to think about like what the prep that goes into it and the endurance that has to happen to actually complete these races is yeah, you know, it's hard to to grasp. Yeah. And so I want to do that.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:13

Right? And I want, like, and it's gonna suck.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:17

Right. And there's gonna be so many people that don't understand. And there's just there's actually, you know, some of my close friends that aren't gonna understand and they're gonna think I'm stupid. Yeah. Right. And it is what it is, and but I think I want to do it. Like, I wanna, and I I got it. People make fun of me, and I'll, you know, if I make it to the course, I'll be the slower one they show doing the you know the qualifying lap.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:40

Yeah. But but you'll be there and you'll be having fun.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:43

Yeah, it is what it is. I think it's gonna take us a couple years, yeah. But I want to build a team, I want to build a team of like-minded individuals. I have some very close friends that I know that would jump in, yeah. Um and just support. But I think if we could get a team together, get a rig together, get a team together, I think we would create some of the the longest lasting memories.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:08

Yeah, for sure, yeah, that'd be awesome.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:10

Right, and that's that's what I look forward to. Yeah, is like that connection with a core group of people, yeah. And being able to say, we did this and we accomplished it, or we did this and we failed. Yeah, but like let's be proud of what we did because we actually got here and attempted it, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:23:29

So, yeah, so this core group of people the you you've met them throughout your life, or they've been there for a long time, or you met them through GP and it's kind of everything, like in none of these people are identified.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:43

Yeah, I just I'm I'm I might sign some people up.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:46

Yeah, yeah, but uh you just know they're they're that who they are.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:49

Yeah, I've talked to a couple already, and they're you know, they're they're down. They're like, yeah, you call me up, like let's do it.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:56

Yeah, and then so like what are you what are you gonna do after? Like, are you guys gonna just do one and if you fail, you fail, and you're done. Yeah, I don't know. You kind of just keep going. It kind of, you know. This is just a very much a very new uh idea this first time I've heard about it.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:08

Right, it's super new, so it's like like I said, I don't even think we would be ready within a year. Yeah, I'm just being realistic. Oh, yeah. Um, because I'm very big into like I need to drive it and put a ton of miles on it. Yeah, like I got a engine swap that I'm working on right now for that. Yeah, like and building a race car is expensive. Yeah, like there's no cheap, there's no cheap race car out there, right? Like even junior dragsters, I think, are expensive. But um, so ideally would be to get a new vehicle, a brand new one, you know, not brand new, but a different vehicle, strip it all the way down, and then throw all the money and parts into it. Yeah, but I just can't do that. Yeah, I can't, yeah. Um right now I don't have the time or space for it. Yeah, um, plus it'd be re it'd be starting over. And I already have so much invested in that, so that'll probably be turned into a race car. Does it make sense? Not really, but people have done it, yeah, and people have been semi-successful, yeah. So whatever, I don't care. Yeah, it's just the evolution of that Jeep. But you know, whatever. We'll we'll see what happens. Um and just go from there.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:21

Yeah. Right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:22

And then somebody else reached out to me who has the same dream.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:25

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:25

Uh, another guy in the Navy. Yeah. Um, just reached out to me a couple days ago with the same same dream.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:32

No way. I sweet.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:33

And he wants me to co-drive. Okay. So be the navigator and then be the person that's out of the Jeep more than in the Jeep because I'm winching, you know, through a trail. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:42

So if you if you were uh speaking to people that are, I'm sure that you got a plot plenty of people that are watching this uh from your side of this uh the tracks that are they know kind of more what you're talking about. Yeah. Uh but for me and for probably a lot of your followers too, even uh they don't have no idea what the hell you're talking about, uh like a race car. They're probably thinking like NASCAR, like I don't know, like F1 is becoming big. But uh for you, you're talking about like this off-roading, like so many like obstacles and things and different terrain and all these things, and you're trying to race, but you're saying that you know, obviously, you're not looking to place or anything, you're just looking to have fun and experience it and to finish, yeah. Uh, which is a feat in its own and an accomplishment on its own. Uh and you're talking about, you know, you you don't this is so new that you have you don't really have the people signed up for it, really, uh, in the sense of like, you're gonna do this as this is my team, this is what we're representing, um no team name yet. Yeah. So uh I'm kind of just spitballing with, you know, I'm more curious than anything. Uh so you're uh a couple years from now, but you're saying so you are getting out of the Navy pretty soon, in the sense of like four years. Yeah. So I mean in the in the sense of Navy time frame, that's like a contract, you know. So that's pretty soon, and uh after that you'll work so that you can make that you can support your family and all this stuff, but you want to dive into this route of things. Uh what are you are you nervous of spending money like that? Are you nervous of going for that venture? What are things why now? Why, why now?

SPEAKER_01 1:27:38

Why now? Because it's like why not? Yeah, right. If I keep just saying every year watching King King of the Hammers on YouTube and just like, you know, get all sappy, you know, like hyped, but then also like mopey because like oh I'm never gonna do this or whatever. Like, I just gotta do it. You just have to pull the trigger sometimes and just send it. Yeah, so I'm Um and right now this is just kind of to dip the toes to learn some stuff. We're gonna learn a lot of things, right? Learn it from senior people that have been there. Um we're gonna there's gonna be a it's gonna be a full year of hard lessons learned. Yeah, yeah. Right? But that's expected. Yeah. And that's and so maybe, right, eventually, if this does lead to something, yeah, like this is the new passion, yeah, right? Racing. Yeah, right. Then you're like, okay, I want to go full in.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:32

And then you dive into getting an actual built race car that actually makes sense and actually is competitive. Yeah. Right, go from there. Yeah. I think sometimes people make the stake of going in like too hard in the beginning.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:47

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:48

And then realize it's not for them, and then they just spent this ridiculous amount of money. So it's kind of like mountain biking. Like, some people are like, I want to get into downhill mountain biking, so they go out and buy a$5,000 mountain bike. I did that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:00

I literally did that, and then I was like, uh, and then I went on my first ride and I and like because I had I hadn't done it before. And I used to ride bikes all the time and dirt bike and all this stuff. But I went to go do it and I was like, for one, I'm not in shape to do this. Like, two, I just spent this much money on this bike and I can barely do it. Yeah. You know?

SPEAKER_01 1:29:21

So it's like shit. I'm a big uh supporter of like if you want to try something new and cool, but do it in a cheap way.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:29

So that way, if you find out it's not for you, then you're you know.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:34

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, what I so I had uh the canyon camera, like I've had that for a while. I've done photography for a long time. Video I've I've dabbled in marketing media, all the different things, uh, but never what's the what's the saying?

SPEAKER_01 1:29:49

Uh Jack of all trade, but a master of none, basically. There you go.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:52

Yeah. And so I felt that for a long time in my own life uh with like photography because I really I wasn't a national geographic photographer, like uh the best wedding photographer or something like that. Uh but I enjoy it and I think I'm pretty good at it. Yeah. Uh, but it's just a sense of like then I just I found myself spending money and money and money, and I'm like, I don't even all this shit sucks. Or this this was good, but I didn't need to buy these 10 things.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:21

Yeah, I uh so I think everybody growing up, or you know, they develop hobbies, right? We all get hobbies of this, that, and the other. Yeah. Either you know, vehicle related or fishing or hunting or whatever numb chuck skills, you know, what gaming, right? Right, gaming, you know, photography or whatever. What I see a lot is people stretch themselves thin. Yeah. Because they want to do all these things.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:45

Yeah, of course, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:46

And then they get stretched themselves thin, and then now they don't have any money and they can't actually do the things they want to do because they can't even get gas to go out and do it. Yeah, and so I realized a long time ago that it was like, hey, this off-road, this like Jeep thing, this is what I really want to do. Like, I'm passionate about it, and so I stripped every hobby away. I don't own a fishing pole, yeah, like guns. Sure, I have some guns, yeah, right. But I'm not a person to go buy guns and let money sit in a you know uh gun locker. Yeah, yeah, no, I get what you're saying, yeah. So I've removed a lot of hobbies in life so that this hobby right here can be your one that you can be the one and right. I put my money into it. Yeah. So for me, that makes sense. For others, it doesn't.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:35

Yeah. But for me, that's so uh I think we're close to the end here. I I think that uh to wrap it up, or I I think that I want you to you have a lot of fun, like you have a good amount of followers on Instagram specifically, and I don't know what the age rage is, it ranges, I'm sure. And there's probably so many people that are looking to you and going, either, you know, what parts, or should I get into this, or maybe they're just admiring, or maybe they're they follow you just to send to their buddies and talk shit to you. Who knows? But uh if you could give some sort of like advice into the world of Jeeping, what would it be?

SPEAKER_01 1:32:22

I'd say do the research, right? Don't just slide that YOLO card and purchase something. Do the research, ask around, yeah, find reputable people. Um that's why I like Instagram so much. Is like you can message somebody on Instagram, and most of the time that person will get back to you. Yeah, and like this is not we're not drag racing, right? So I'm not I don't have any secrets, yeah. Right? I don't want to give you my secret, so therefore, you know, you show up on the racetrack and you beat me because I gave you my secret to why my car is fast. Yeah, that's what's great about just the off-road community in general, is like they'll tell you, you know, what's what.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:05

Unless they're an influencer, and then you have to, you know, you then there's sponsorships and money and all that.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:10

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:11

Yeah, take that grain of salt. But like I said, do the research, ask around, plan, um, but then you just gotta do it. Yeah, like you're always gonna have those naysayers, yeah, and they're not gonna uh, you know, believe in the process, they're not gonna understand it, they're you know, and at some point you gotta start living and just do it.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:33

Yeah, I I think for me what I take from this whole conversation is that you can have a career, you can have fun, you can have serious things, you can have a family, you can do all this stuff, but for for what you are talking about, it is don't lose your your inner child almost. It's like have fun, make sure that you invest in you and the things that you truly enjoy to do.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:55

Yeah, so uh so something to add to that. Yeah, um stress, right? Stress is a big thing in part of our lives, right? Stress. Um and I went through a stressful event right when I was moving from South Carolina. I'm not crying, it's the smoke, trust me. Um, and things were stacking up, yeah. A lot of stress, yeah, so much stress, it caused me to lose my hair. Oh shoot, right, alopecia errata, which I didn't know I had. I guess it's hereditary, like it's like this like gene, and like it can be kickstarted, right? And so I went through the stressful event, there was multiple things happening, yeah, and I started losing my hair. Dang. And then you find out like what it is, yeah, and it's caused by stress, yeah. And you're now you're trying to now you're stressing about stressing. Yeah, it only gets worse, yeah. Right, and I had lost, you know, pretty much 90% of all the hair on my head. Jesus. Right? And like luckily the majority of it's all grown back, yeah. Um, but from time to time, you know, I'll get a bald spot here and there. But what a change that I made was like I can't control everything. Yeah. Um I can only control the things I can control.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:13

But I also don't need to do everything. Like, some people are very hard chargers and they will, you know, they'll do everything to the max.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:22

I when I see when I see something, I'm always gonna take care of it and get it done the way it needs to be done. But in certain situations, I mean like I don't need to do that. Yeah, I don't need to put that stress on me.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:34

Yeah. Or yeah, it's gonna lead to burnout.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:36

Exactly, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:35:37

So I can't do anything.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:39

I'm very well, I'm very good at like acknowledging, I guess, burnout or excessive like stress situations and then being able to like throttle back because I'm like, it's not worth it. Yeah, like why why would I put myself through that? Yeah, you know, and so I can throttle it back a little bit. Because it's not it in the end, a lot of it's not worth it.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:59

Yeah, yeah, I I I agree. I think there's certain things I think that ties into uh like the the navy stuff as well, and and I think that it's just really easy to get burnt out, especially if you have a good like like head on your shoulders if you're like thinking like positively and like trying to help people or trying to help yourself and trying to spread like some sort of positive message or whatever, it's super easy to get burnt out because there is a lot of selfishness and negative and you're doing so much for people and you get nothing.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:29

No, no, no appreciation, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:31

So you gotta do it for the right reasons, you gotta make sure that you're also taking care of yourself. Yeah, 100%. Take care of yourself. 100%, yeah. And I I think that I think that we should go on a ride. I have one more thing I want to do, but so I don't want to say too much, but the reason I couldn't do it up there and I had to do all this drive is because my phone went to SOS mode so so soon and I couldn't download what I wanted.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:59

Go ahead and Brisbane. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:01

Hey babe, it's me. I just wanted to tell you that I love you so much. I'm so happy that we get to do life together. We've built a wonderful life around sacrifices. Moving away from family, the long deployment, before and after kids, and then miss birthdays and holidays. Just being away from your family and the comforts of your home and your precious teeth. For many months, I know it's not easy. I want you to know, I see you. I see the sacrifices you've made over the years for our family, and I'll be forever grateful. We wouldn't have the life that we have now if it weren't for all that you've done and continue to do for us. When I was recently hospitalized, you had to step up in a whole new way. There haven't been many moments in life where you had to do the parenting thing on your own. That's usually my job. But of course, you amazed me with how well you handled the whole situation. But at the same time, it didn't surprise me. You have a way of handling any talent calmly, or at least remaining calm on the outside. Your ability to push through tough times has gotten you to where you are in life. I will continue to take you to new places. I can't wait to see where you go. I may not always do a good job of showing it, but I admire how big you dream. I want nothing more for them to come true. I have no doubts that you can make them happen. Just like wheeling, sometimes it's going to be a slow crawl with multiple attempts before you make it. But I believe you can do it. Dream big or go home, right? I'll be right here by your side, carrying you on. Thank you for the way that you love me. Unconditionally, every single day. I know I do not make it easy. But you remain by my side no matter what. And I love you for that. You've always had my back, and I'll always have yours. If I had to go back and choose all over again through all the moves, the sacrifices, this, that, and the other, I would still choose you every single time. We built something beautiful, and I truly believe the best is yet to come. I love you, babe. Always.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:32

Very nice. Yeah. How do you feel? Like, I think that like uh those types of messages are super hard. The they're hard to to get to record. I think people are like we're putting ourselves on camera and like recording and stuff, and like uh you're looking for something that is like meaningful. Uh so it's tough. I don't know. It's uh it's interesting. How do you feel about it?

SPEAKER_01 1:39:59

Uh it means a lot. Because that is what is hard, is like when you put a ton into everything.

SPEAKER_04 1:40:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:09

And then you know, you you you apply yourself to to so much or you pour yourself into so much, and then sometimes you don't even see you know what you're trying to accomplish. You don't even see the appreciation, you don't even see, you know, the impact that you're making. Um, and so when you're in those moments, it's it's super hard to like continue to push forward when you're you know putting so much into it and you're just not seeing anything from it. So uh it's really good to hear all of that. I I I appreciate her so much for all the sacrifices she's done. Like, yes, I've been in the Navy, you know, 20 years, but like she's been right there by my side going through it all um, you know, multiple deployments where I've been gone, you know, eight months, eleven months at a time, and she's home like raising three kids and like doing all of the things. Yeah, whereas like my life is easy, where it's just like I wake up and you know, I tell people what to do and like in that, but she's home, you know, just like me, she's solving problems too every single day. Yeah, so um I do appreciate the hell out of her. And then yeah, with her recent hospitalization, which was scary because it it seemed like it could be a life or death situation, and so yeah, it was uh it was it was a pretty scary moment for us, but um luckily everything you know worked out and we were able to push through. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:43

So I I this uh this segment is like I'm I'm kind of figuring it out as I go uh to make it special, to make it feel uh like what I want it to be, uh is to be like a message, uh like almost like a voicemail that you leave. Uh and like you were just saying, like out of nowhere, things can like turn and like people can get sick or like pass away. Like there's just randomness in life, and and sometimes you don't get to really say what you want to say to somebody, and uh yeah, and I'm not playing God here or anything, but I I it is I would think that it would be very nice to have a message that you can play or a voicemail. I have a voicemail from my pop up that I play often, and it gives me like hope and inspiration randomly, and it kind of pushes me forward sometimes. So, with that being said, to pull it all together, uh I know that we're soaking wet, and if we were up at an Amana Mountain, and now we're looking over fog, uh over lake, and uh sitting on soaking wet uh benches. But what is and who would you point it towards? Uh is it your your kids, your your wife, uh, or maybe your stepdad or somebody else uh or everybody uh that in in kind of give a message.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:07

I think who I am is it's it's really made up of a lot of people and a lot of different experiences. Like I said, um different jobs I've had, you know, I've learned things from my my dad. You know, my mom is very resourceful and she supported us all through school, you know, growing up when we didn't have any money, yeah, and like the resourcefulness that she was able to come up with um just to make the situation better or make us happy, and we were always number one priority. Like, you know, I hope that I can you know use that, you know, and support my kids and my family. But you know, my dad, my grandfather, uh Pa who is he's my grandfather that raised me for a portion his love and care for people, you know, there's no other like him, and then you know, Lacey and my kids, right? I I have so many big hopes for them, and they're doing extremely well for Jacob Madison and uh Ethan. Um it's exciting to watch them grow and exciting to see them to do all these new things, and I and I and I pray that they continue to do it, and I pray that you know they continue to see these new uh challenges and experiences, and then they jump into it and then you know figure it out. Yeah, some things are gonna some things are gonna work, some things are not gonna work. So um I'm thankful for everything that I've done. Um I'm thankful for the people I've met and the people that inspire me and like you inspire me. So appreciate it.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:49

Yeah, thank you. With all that, I think that's uh that's about it. But I I do want to kind of uh give it back to you. I I uh would have been pretty lost without uh somebody like you on the ship. I got a lot of guys that I looked at for some sort of guidance here or there, or maybe I looked at them for just not being alone in it in the shit. Uh, but you are one of those people that you know kind of guided me and helped me, I could bounce ideas off you and have real conversations, and there's not a lot of people out there uh like you. Um and so thank you. And yeah, and I'm I'm excited to see what what you do with your race team and and with your Jeep, and and I'm excited to see if uh if Ethan and and those guys jump into jeeping too. That'll be exciting. So it was uh it was a pleasure.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:36

Yeah, man.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:36

So let's get out of the fucking rain. My ass is soaked.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:42

Yeah, but it was a good ramble, yes, it was