EVERYONE IS A DJ

EP. 30 WITH UMINOLA GANCOSA: THE MAN BEHIND THE BIGGEST AFRO HOUSE PAGE ON INSTAGRAM

• KLUB RECORD • Episode 30

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SPEAKER_01

Alright, so we're back with another episode. This is episode 30 of Everyone is a DJ. My name is Manu. You got my co-host Wesley in Toronto. And we have a guest today, Uminola Gankosa, right? That's how you say it? Yeah, that's how you say it.

SPEAKER_04

Uminola Ganosa.

SPEAKER_01

That's easy.

SPEAKER_04

You're good at it because it's not easy at all.

SPEAKER_01

No, no, no. Thanks for joining the podcast. Of course, she's uh yeah, I would say what the man behind some of the biggest pages on Instagram and TikTok, pushing Afro House, Melodic, Indie Dance, and uh yeah, good music culture. Uh, how are you doing?

SPEAKER_04

Very good, thank you guys. Thank you for having me. It's a real pleasure to join you both uh today. Uh really exciting because uh I think there's a lot of value you can create together, you know, regarding this discussion, and maybe more in the future, we never know. But uh real pleasure to be uh to be with you uh today.

SPEAKER_01

Cool. And uh where are you based right now? Are you in uh Barcelona or where are you at the moment? Uh in Barcelona, yeah, in Spain. Okay, super nice. I saw Wesley wanted to ask a question.

SPEAKER_00

No, I was just gonna say it's super sick that uh three of us are are you know doing this. Our faces are out there. You know, for me and uh Uminola, you know, we don't put our face out there that much. Um but yeah, three three content creators now on a podcast, bro, that's pretty sick. No, umla is quite active though, with his top five. I've seen the top five. I like the top five. I like the top five.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, the top five videos, those are quite good. Um, yeah, we'll get into that. Uminola, give us a bit more context into your background, how you got into Afra House and and your, I guess, how are you so good at social media? That's what I'm trying to understand. How are you so good at it?

SPEAKER_04

Thanks, thanks a lot, bro. Well, at the beginning, uh we started actually in 2023. Um, we started with Electrac. And actually, you know, when I started, my goal was more to start my music uh career, let's say. And back in the days I was working at a consultant at a company, but in uh marketing. But actually, it was more B2B marketing company. So we were doing automation, helping people finding clients, and uh I think that's where I got in touch with the idea of social media, how you create demand, let's say, how you create an audience, but it was quite different back in those days. And I decided to launch like to be in the music, like to become an artist. I think it was around 2022. Uh, and it took like one year to start. I bought my first uh um, well, I belt on at the beginning, also my keyboard. I don't remember, it wasn't MPG, but the first keyboard, you know, uh like in this case, and then I started on my own. Um, and then yeah, being into this process, I was like, okay, I didn't want to be uh dependent on the music, you know, on my art in terms of economically. So the thing was I was like, how can I also maybe create something that will allow me to go from this activity that I have that I want to stop to something that is like more connected to what I want to do, uh and that can also bring money on the table because that's also a big topic, and I think we're gonna go deeper on that. But uh it started this way, and at the beginning, Electroc was really just the desire to share the music I love that I discovered. I discovered actually um house music. Well, back in this day in Barcelona, because you know there is the brunch electronic.

SPEAKER_01

Yes, brunch.

SPEAKER_04

Every Sunday, probably you heard about it. Now they are everywhere, but they started in Barcelona, and I remember this body was one of the best uh in the city, you know. Every Sunday you go from two to ten around, and it's like a really chill place, you know. Everyone loved it because it was quite different from the clubbing or stuff like that, and the music was sick, like they had a great creation and stuff. So that's how I discovered it, but I wasn't like deeply into it, and then I took the way from well, the beginning of not the beginning, but when me I discovered them kind of music, you know, in 2022. Uh I went to some show of them, it was like kind of uh astonishing what they were proposing back in those days, and that's how we started. We we just launched the page uh on Electric with the idea to share music. So at the beginning, it was only sharing the artwork, you know, and the name of the artist. And the funny fact is that the first track that we put, we got a comment from the artist saying thank you. We had like maybe seven, eight followers, I don't even remember, but uh it was really you know nice to have the first one already commenting, so they started, and then after this, we started to well develop more, put some videos and yeah, let's industrialize the process. But at the beginning, it was really just uh sharing the music we loved with the idea of growing the page.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I had you know what my Afro Street actually started exactly the same. Like I would just post the artwork, no like design or anything. Yeah, I was just like, you know what, I want to share this music, put it out there, and they're like, it's still there way, way, way at the bottom. But it was that that's what that's where we started, man. That's how it goes.

SPEAKER_01

That's the way.

SPEAKER_00

I mean, I did the same thing.

SPEAKER_04

Exactly, it's that's the way. Uh it's really well, my opinion is that at the beginning you just need to do what you love, you know, without too much um, let's say, expectations or plan, because you don't even know, you know. Back in those days, I didn't even know how the industry worked. I didn't even know how the social media was working, also for a page like this. So, you know, and if you're too much thinking about it, eventually you you will have too much expectation. So you're gonna stop because you don't you won't get results until a lot of time. Or you're gonna be like, okay, I don't know where I want to go. It's not working the way I want it. So I think you have, you know, no expectation, just do it and see how it goes, you know. Take the feedbacks, of course, and then it's a loop, you know, uh, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_01

I think that's the best approach for anything in life. It's just do it for the passion, don't expect anything in return. If it comes, that's a plus. You know, that's just uh cherry on top. You didn't expect it, right? And again, it takes time to build, but just build things without expectations and and yeah, the thing will come back. Um, you keep saying we, so is it just you on the pages, or have you got some team members and some support?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, actually, we we launched it with my fiance. We two are yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We we we launched it together because her she has a profile more like uh um on uh an artistic one, but more on the paint. She's a painter at the um like at the beginning where she she used to paint. And so she took care of all the artistic direction of the page. And she's it's her that like you know decided what you just say, Wes. Uh putting the artwork, we're like, yeah, but the feed is not looking nice, and you know, we were like, we want to have a good feed, even if now today the feed is not like the main topic. But she said, okay, maybe we can create kind of our own style and put the cover inside it, and so that's also we we we we we started to have something more uh uh industrialized in the process, and so yeah, we launched that together uh on on Electrac and then with Afro School, but we we'll be able also to develop more on the on this side. Um one year and one year later, with which is the crazy thing actually. Afroscal is is more recent than Electrac. Afrosco has like one year and a half, maybe. That's crazy, only a year and a half.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, yeah. Well, we we launched the page. The thing you're gonna love about the story, how it how it uh began. You you know, Afro's community, I think, uh started in end of 2023, if I'm correct. Or I think it's around this time, and they blew out with the Kind of Music uh posts. I remember because we were we were on the we were on the we were like around 2k followers on our side, and they just arrived, bro, and they put a real power 50, 60k followers in like one what something that happened to you, I think, Manu, with one of your content. Yeah, on my videos, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, brought you a lot of followers. And I was like, shit, we're struggling, trying to put a lot of content. And the the guy just arrived, they put the good uh real, and boom, it it exposed, you know. And I think they also inspired a lot of people putting a lot of kind of music back in those days because there was the guy, you put some kind of music, you have you have some music. It goes crazy. And and so um basically we launched, we were like, okay, maybe there is something around Afro House that can be interesting to go on. Um and but we we we we left this idea on the on the side, and then one year and a half, actually in 2025, there was the debate, you know, around uh what is Afrohouse, you know. And I don't know if you remember there was a period that it was a real still now, but back in those days, in every discussion that I could see in the on the different you know page on my social media, it was about no, but this is not Afro House, this is Afro House, the rapture is not Afro House. Yeah, but Black Coffee is uh is is it an Afro artist? And so we we got back to this page, we decided to launch the page because we're like maybe there's an opportunity, and we put a wheel of Shimza that was playing in uh the ADE actually, where we met actually, uh both of both of us, yeah. Yeah, at ADE, the one in 2024, a video of Shimza performing, and we just put on top this is after house. And this one, like same blow up. I think we got 10k followers from this, and then on a short term, like let's say two to three months, we had like three to four posts like that, and it was really the the the way we were posting, you know, just the video and something on top, and this blew out. Like, I think on the first months we had already 40 to 50k followers, and it was crazy. I think around May last year, it was around 5k per day, huge numbers. Actually, yeah, huge numbers, and then we got the restriction actually by your Instagram. That's how like we stopped because you know so do you know do you know what it is?

SPEAKER_01

I think uh there's a key um message in here, and I always tell people you have to find format and a template that works for you that hasn't been done before. You know, you say you have the video, there's something on top, no one did that before, right? It's simple. You weren't thinking about it when you did it. Again, no expectations where you do something without expecting anything back, you put it out there, and it works. But it's a key thing to to find that differentiator that that only you can do at the beginning, and then obviously everyone's gonna copy you, but you know, that's another story. But I think that's that's very interesting. Very interesting.

SPEAKER_00

You know, I wanna I wanna I wanna talk about how that that whole debate about what is Afro House, what is not Afro House, and content with kind of music. So I'll tell you guys a story. I was at Miami Music Week probably three or four years ago now, and I was sitting with Kitty Amore, and she was like, she's like, oh, I was the only page before you guys started blowing up. She's like, oh, if you post kind of music, you're gonna ruin like the impression of what is Afrohouse. And she's like, I'm gonna unfollow you if you post about kind of music. And then Afro House community, Afro House crew started posting kind of music, and your pages went like this, and I was like, Oh, kitty, why did you tell me to do that, man? I missed out. I missed out. So but that's the game, man. Kitty owes you some followers. Kitty, kitty owes me some followers, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_04

Oh man. But it's a it's a real topic, and uh and you know, to develop on that, we are the we have a lot. Currently, for instance, the real topic is like kind of the same as with usual, for instance. You know, is usual uh an Afrohouse producer or not? Uh why is he on the page? We got a lot of comments like that because we're covering a lot uh what he's doing. And I think that you know it's it's kind of the same topic on the authenticity commercial in a way, meaning you try to have something that is Afro-House in the roots, what and and actually, even this definition is tough to have, you know, what is it? Is it the Afro House from South Africa? Is it all the South African genre that is now very famous thanks to all the artists they have there? Or is it even before, you know, with the bodhisattva and stuff like that that you could have even, you know, at the early 20s that have it shaped and that actually inspired a lot also the South African then uh um artists that uh that created their own. So I think that you need to find the perfect balance between yeah um having the roots, but also being able to expand to people that are also um uh taking and giving also in a way uh back their flowers to Afrohouse. Because look, an artist for you, like usual, in my opinion, is bringing also a lot of attention on Afrohouse itself. Yeah. On the genre. So I think it's always always a topic of try being able to have your roots, your identity, but being able also to be more open in order to include, you know, what is now on the topic, what is on the page, and what is also influenced by the genre that you want to cover. And it's true that the Frontier, the limit are really not really easy to find and you know to put uh to put especially in the after house, I think.

SPEAKER_01

But I think I think you guys, obviously you have your pages, but I think before you post a video, you have an idea of of the engagement, right? You have somewhat a good sense of of how well it's gonna do, depending on who the DJ is. If it's Black Coffee, you know it should do okay. If it's Shimza, if it's Carnamisa, if it's a girl, Francis, maybe, right? There's like a key key names that you know, okay, this should do well, and if it does, I'm gonna get followers. What I'm trying to say is like you have to kind of leverage those names to educate new people and and generate new fans for Afrohouse, right? Yeah, so as you use those names, then you can maybe introduce them to, I don't know, the Africa Deep or FK Mash and other people, right? I think I think I think that's part of the yeah, your job, I guess, as as creators of these pages.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's I mean, that's where a lot of like my in the beginning, that's I was like, yo, I think like nobody's posting about Draga or like, you know, even like a Sun L musician who's really big in South Africa is huge there, but like rest of the world, you know, maybe not. Um and like I think that's like that's where I started. I was like, yo, I want to tell the world about yo, go check out this guy, go check out that guy, right? And it's great, it's good to do that, but like then you break down from a social media strategy perspective. It's like, is it the most strategic post? Not really, because it doesn't, it doesn't like you return much engagement or followers, but then you know, it's part of the game. You can't only post of five artists over and over again. People are gonna get tired of your content, right? So it's it's an interesting world to operate in, man. Uminola, how how do you feel about like that side of things posting like artists that are not necessarily at the top top, and you know your engagement is probably not gonna be as good?

SPEAKER_04

Um I I think I I see this as a funnel in a way, meaning like I know that the the big artist actually will help expand the reach, and then it also brings more people to which you can make discover the artist also you want to share and you want them to be put on the map. And then if we take, let's say, in terms of editorial calendar you're gonna have, let's say if I'm posting five five times a day, I will try to have one post around an artist that I know it won't perform, it won't be for the rich or for you know reaching new followers, but it will be in this part like educating also the community and being able to share what you love, what you think like this artist should be way, way more bigger. Um, this would be yeah, regarding the the this debate between should I really get more rich or should I get put like people that won't work necessarily but are really relevant for us because we love what they do. And maybe, yeah, 20% versus 80% can work. And then there is also a real topic. I think on that the thing is also there is a real topic on our side, I would say, regarding the content. Because you know, a lot of artists you cannot get also the content. Let's say you want on your page to have this type of video, you want HD quality, you want to be sure that also it's like because it's also this. Even if someone is not very known, if the content is sick, it has also a bigger opportunity to work. And a lot of artists, what I saw on my side is like there's no content, that's not really good content. I think they maybe should be also working more on to what the content they are creating, you know, in order to be also more able to share. And also to send the content actually to the page. To be honest, you know, a lot of artists we need to contact them, not even to make them pay, but contact them to say, look, can you send us some pictures, some picture, or can you send us some videos from your show? Did you record the show? Would you like to go with the show? I think also it's something where you need to educate a lot of the artists. And I'm not only to I'm not talking only about uh small artists, I'm talking also about artists that are still on the on their way. They're big today in for us, but they could be way, way more bigger, in my opinion, if they were more into this direction. But I think also it's something that's quite new for everyone on this uh on this side.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I totally agree with that, man. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

No, it's interesting. I think I think um I'm hearing uh comments around organizations and artists being organized and yeah, taking content more seriously. I think uh I wanted to ask which artists, so say someone like Huguel, for example, right? I think he's one of the best at content, right? But how do you think, why do you think actually his content does so well and and maybe some artists that you mentioned could be bigger? What can they take from someone like Hugel to get to that or progress their careers in terms of content?

SPEAKER_04

I think that usually the the the really interesting thing with him is like if we take three pillars, meaning being able to have your project, your music in this case, you know, and then being able to find a way to put it in front of the right audience and creating also the whole universe behind all of this, he might he managed perfectly the three these three pillars. Meaning, you know, when you think about UGL, you think about the Latinas, then you know, you know that you're gonna see him also uh having music like every week, and it's also a big debate today. How he's producing this music. It there was also with Move into the Sun, we'll be able to talk about this if you want later, but yeah, yeah. And then the way he he he managed to put both on Instagram and in TikTok, I think that they just industrialize this the best way, meaning they know that when they go to a show, they have a way to take the food the video. It's always the same type, and a lot of people got inspired from this. You know, there is starting with him, then there is a girl on the back, and then he's coming back on the drop for Omim, etc. And he has a great velocity. So when you manage to have those three things, I think it's really easy. And I can name a lot of artists, they have the universe, you know. They are like you can feel that there is something different around them. That and I would even more say there is something unique about them that you cannot see to other other artists. If you want to see this, it's with them. Um, but maybe there is not the same velocity in terms of creating the content and posting it uh really like on a constant basis, you know, to be really consistent. I think it's also the really uh important side uh of the of the aspect. So I would say yeah, to record more to some of them, um and and also you to be able to post to see what's working and post it more and more and more and more and more. And actually, this works for everyone. If you manage to find one format that is working well, you should try to replicate it the more and more possible, you know.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, there's an artist called Brunello that is doing it. Yeah, that is doing this very well at the moment.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And he has a sound for me, it's the same, you know. When you say about Brunello, you think about the music. The music is like direct, it's also really unique in this way because it's maybe a frontier between take house, melodic. You know, the the style is quite organic, also. The the style is very, very new, unique, and then you know, he has also this way to put some videos that are quite unique the way also is doing his show. He did a recent B2B, I think, with Raphael the same. There was a lot of video coming from this. So I think that yeah, the the content, the more you you have gigs, you should maybe you know, not post every gig, but to evaluate every gig. To give you an example, I think that Kanye Music was really good for that. You know, they don't do Kanye Music, for instance, they never do uh what is the summer seasons, and they put like 20, 30 dates, and then you need to pick the dates. They always valuate one event. We're gonna be in Mykonos, then we're gonna be in uh, I don't know, New York, then we're gonna be to Toulouse. And I think it helps also, it allows you to really see this as uh a story behind this, you know. Yeah, because you you'll be like, What is the what is next? There is also this idea of very interesting you need to be to be um always there because there is a real topic about quantity, how much you post, but also how do you create something where we want to know what's next. Yeah, interesting. You know what I mean? I think kind of music was really good for this.

SPEAKER_01

I actually never thought about that. I actually never thought about that. That's very interesting. That you said that. Have you thought about that Wes? They never post their tour days as a list, and it's more like singular show by show. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's true. So it's not like, yeah, all at once, catch me and we'll show you again next month where we're gonna be, right?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, exactly. It's really like we're gonna be here. And then that's why, you know, I remember to some show because we went to the one they had in Egypt. There were people from everywhere in the world. Yeah, yeah, and they followed them around. Yeah, yeah, there were people from the US, and there were even people that was followed them all the year. There was like, now I'm in Egypt, then I'm going to, I don't know, to uh New York because they will be in New York next week, then I'm flying to Toulum. And that's why also they had like kind of the biggest audience in terms of uh wealth and this the how they were managing to sell those tables and stuff, because they they they've perfectly found their audience, the right, you know, the right target to the show and the way they wanted to build it. So I think you need to really have a strategy between what is your world, what is you know, the music you're doing, but also the world around it in terms of because today it's not only music, when you see Peggy Goo, Black Coffee, all those artists they have way more than just music, you know, that's also what they represent and what they associate with uh with it. And and then yeah, being able to really create a story around it and use social media this way. It's not only saying, yeah, you should post every day when you do something, you should post, but how do it, how does it bring value to what you are as an artist and how we can see as yourself as an artist? I think for me, my my perspective would be to to this, and my advice would be this for every artist actually. You know, there is one that's doing this great, but some that can uh perform better, I think, on that.

SPEAKER_00

So, what about we had we had a conversation last week about like the balance of how frequent you're posting and also like the type of content that you're posting, right? So, like for artists that you know posting gig posts gigs, you know, like that kind of content is important for you know, showing that you're on the road, you know, your upcoming releases, your current releases, maybe what would be an experience um if if they were to go and see you live, but if they were doing a more lifestyle content, like a Leva K, for example, and the balance between Instagram and TikTok, what do you think? Like, how should artists approach like that balance?

SPEAKER_04

I I think it's uh it's a great question. Um and Liva K is a is a really good example. I remember when he he was uh showing, you know, uh he he he missed a flight and then you know all the touring that he has to do and the logistics. And this is crazy. I think it's a really good example. Liva Ke is my opinion is working well on the on the social media aspect. Yeah. And then I would say that if it was me regarding the the social media, depending on the the resources, the resources you have, obviously, I would start with you know one primary social media that you can manage. Because TikTok is not working the same that uh Instagram. Yeah, if you have then both content videos, you can definitely put because you go to TikTok, but you need to have like a real strategy to one of the social media where you performing best at the beginning, in my opinion. Let's let's say if naturally when you post content on Instagram it's working well, you have a good fit there, you should focus primarily on Instagram and then put what is relevant for TikTok because you have like this real uh format you can put directly with the small legend, but you don't really care about it. Yeah, um, and then you have train to find what is like also uh working for you and also what is unique, because if everyone I I remember a video of that, like you know, a girl I think was saying we don't care about your uh gigs uh carousel, you know, carousel, you know, everyone is doing this, maybe you should put something different. So I think I won't agree 100% with her because I I think that it's always good to share things, and a lot of people can be interesting by this, but it's interesting to think, okay, what can we do more or what can I do that no one is doing now? And and for me, if we think with your example, Manu, I think that it's it's it's one of uh the uniqueness that you have, you know, being able to be um represented as I'm sharing the best after house, what I'm what I'm seeing as the best afro, what I'm binding with. There's only you that is doing that. And and look, when you were doing this, the growth was huge, also, you know. And I think that it's really about it. It's like what do you have that is unique, and then try to find a way to create content around it. You know, it can be the way you travel, it can be the way you produce if you're like uh uh you're using a lot of instruments, or you have a specific, you know, way to produce tracks, can be the way you're living, also. Actually, it's not most of the time, it's not even something really close to music itself, it can be like around it.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

I think it's uh do you know how how do you feel about cringiness and posting um yeah, cringy videos? Because I think that's the I think that's that's the biggest thing for me on social media, right? It's I feel like that's the biggest blocker from people doing well on social media is posting content that you might be thinking about, but it makes them feel weird and cringy, right? Um but how is how have you managed to yeah deal with with that?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, it it's really into it's really funny. I'm I'm directly thinking about Marco Carriola, for instance, you know, and the cringe, cringe volume vibes and stuff. Would I would say there's two things. Uh let's say and and at the beginning, Wes, you were saying this, uh or no, I think it was you, Manu. Uh on our side, Wes, we we had pages. And me, it was this also at the beginning. I was like, I'm not that comfortable to put my my face in social media right now and that much, and being also forced to be, okay, if I'm starting now, I will have to do it on three, four, five years until it's really paying off.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

So let's start maybe with something that is not linked to me. And there is an advantage for this, there is also inconvenience for this, you know. And I think for this is the first question you should ask yourself. Is it really not even cringe, but how do you feel around putting your yourself on social media? And if it's like really a challenge, maybe you should do something that is not connected to your image. But when you're an artist, then it's really difficult. But still, you can maybe create a truly or AI artist, an avatar, and have like a full uh strategy around it. And then if it's not that, you shouldn't care. If you're like, I'm okay with it, you shouldn't care about what people say. And I think that it's the worst is not being like uh having comments, people saying it's cringe, or like put being on a Marco Cariola page. The worst is like being invisible, no one cares about you. This is the worst, actually. As an artist, it's like you put music or you do things on the social media and you have no comments, no view, but you do this every day, every day. And at the end of the day, no one cares. If I have to choose, honestly, I prefer to have someone saying you're cringe rather than someone, no one, no one around, you know.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, I've said it before. But yeah. My best videos were always the most the ones that make me make me feel the most cringy before I posted, right? Those were always my best videos. The videos that got me, yeah, always. The videos that got me 50,000 followers in two weeks were the ones where I was like, bro, don't post that. That's hard, that's hard.

SPEAKER_04

And and and why, how how would you explain that? Like, what was the the the feeling or what makes you think like this is so cringy? It's more cringy that another average one.

SPEAKER_01

No, I think again, it's almost like hearing your voice or looking at yourself in a video. Sometimes you're like, why do I look like this? It's just like insecurities that people have. Um but also like sometimes you do see the comments. You know, you do see the comments, and some people might be like, shit music, or this is not real DJing or whatever, right? But again, when I have negative comments, that is a successful post for me because that just creates a debate. People are in there, it's engagement, and it's always worked. I agree with you though, like it's it's really difficult for some artists, but I would argue if you're an artist today and you don't have a social media presence, that's that's a huge opportunity lost. Like it's it's it's really difficult now. It's really difficult.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, it it it's almost impossible to be, but I I'm I'm even seeing this as let's say you want to be like, let's say 20 years before you want to be an artist, but you don't go to a studio. Like it's impossible. You have to be on the social media now. Yeah. The question is, how do you take it the way it's nice for you to do it, and it's not like a pain in the ass to see it, like, okay, I have to post, because it's more about the energy behind it, you know. But you need to find a way to to use those those uh those tools. And AI for me is a bit the same in the in the topic, and maybe we can also then uh discuss more about it. I would love to know what you think about it, but I think that now it's not it's not even an option if you really want to be successful. My opinion is like it's not an option anymore, you know. You can still have a career and not be that much on the social media, it's also what are your goals. But if you want really to be successful, you need to play with the tools that everyone is playing with.

SPEAKER_01

I know Wes has got a question already, but which which artists in our space are you you kind of think they're doing well and a good job with their social media profile? Um you know, we mentioned who of course we know he's a content machine, but anyone else, like you know, there's obvious names that we mentioned, but I wonder maybe you know on the ground, more up-and-coming artists that uh you think are doing well on social.

SPEAKER_00

I have one. I have one that I think it's it's also a little bit different, but he's I think it's doing well because it's creating so much engagement is Bodhisattva's monologue of opinions. Like it's so it's so different to what you see like elsewhere. So that's doing well in its own world, but then you have like other guys, like I think Shimsa's killing it just because he has that consistency. What else? What else?

SPEAKER_04

Um I think in in in like artists that are more than emerging, like Shimsa, I would say I had a name, but it it just went um yeah. I would say all the all the kind of music members they are good at it. And it's a great example because they're not that much posting things, but you know, they really manage to have like disengagement on what they whatever they can post and the way they post also as well. Um who I was seeing recently.

SPEAKER_01

Um I think my favorite is always blondish.

SPEAKER_04

Um I would say yeah, some and Ajna is good are good also for this. Yeah, they're really good.

SPEAKER_01

Saminajna doing well. Yeah, I would say right now, like this week, I like Saminajna's content. Blondish is just very active. Francis on TikTok, he's quite good. I think he's he's test he tests a lot of videos on there. He's he's starting to understand the the text on the video as well. Yeah. Um, which is so powerful on TikTok or even on Instagram. But for me, I would say Blondish.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, blondish for me is like the best for me.

SPEAKER_04

Blondish is great too. Um, yeah, the the way the way she does she does is uh it's the same, it's really unique in this way, in her way, you know, the energy this she she has, also the the the topics that also she's covering, you know, around the frequencies and stuff. I think it creates and with her label, like you had a few whole universe, and all of them, I think the the the thing you can have that is like uh common to all of them is really the universe also around them. They have all the label, they have all you know, all the the aesthetics also around it. It helps a lot. It helps a lot. Not only just the music, but really all the universe that when you think about it, you know, you tell blondish, I'm like a bracelet. It's yeah, the association that you can have, you know. And uh and this is also a real real topic. Even before thinking, okay, I will post a lot, is what is your universe? How you can say it's you and it's not some something else, someone else could be the same, the exact same interesting.

SPEAKER_01

Luch is a good one as well. Luch is quite good.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, Luch is really, really good.

SPEAKER_00

What about what about for like for artists? Okay, so when I feel like when you're on the road, it's maybe a little bit easier to make content because like you're out and about, you're doing things, but then like there's a lot of people at home, you know, they're grinding and they're working hard behind their computer, making music. Um how like what do you guys think like is some maybe some advice to people like that where it's like maybe you don't have that interesting of a life because you're trying to work hard and grind and like what kind of competitive look at Aggri.

SPEAKER_01

Is that is that you say his name, Agri?

SPEAKER_04

Aggre, yeah, he's a great example, I think. Agri is good.

SPEAKER_01

Aggri is good. And it you know, it reminds me of of when I started making videos and I was posting a lot. Now I just can't don't find the time. But I think he was he's good. He's good because again, you're at home, you have to do with what's around you, right? You get a controller, sure. Some DJs look at a controller and they're like, bro, you're playing on a two-deck thing, but get a controller, post some videos, be yourself, and he's not only doing that, right? He's also talking to the camera, sharing his opinion. This is Afro How, this is Afro Tech. He's quite good, I think. Again, just do the most with what you have.

SPEAKER_04

There it is. There it is. I have another example also. I don't know if I I'm spelling right his name, but Trondo, you know, that now is like is now blowing, he started also the same, well, with the technique, you know, on the deck. And that's why you can I even I don't remember the name, but I discover a guy that is like doing mixing but with uh iPad or something like that.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I think his name is Patient, right?

SPEAKER_04

Something like that, and I was like, yeah, it's crazy. And on TikTok, actually, there is a lot of examples, or you know, and it's more, I think most of the time they are more young than the others because maybe you don't have that much bias in your mind, but they do crazy stuff, bro. And you see the numbers, the numbers are sick, and they have already, I'm pretty sure you take those guys, you're saying, okay, let's make a tour with them. You pick some cities, they're gonna have an audience, you know. Because people, you're like, of course, I want to see you play. Look, look what you're doing in your room. I want to be there and to see in my my my on my own, you know. So there's no, there's no uh you always have a way. Let's say it's this way. There's a way, there's a way, you know.

SPEAKER_01

I think Vidajan, Vidogene was very good at the beginning before he started touring like this. Yeah. Right? He's in the studio, obviously, again, he's being himself. He's I don't like sometimes he's wearing like wigs and sunglasses and just being funny. But again, cringy content usually performs the best. You know, like you know when you can I think there's a video of like uh he did a remix, I forget the track, and he used the the baby filter so that he looks like a baby and like different weird things that he was doing. But again, yeah, for any artist that looks at successful artists that are touring, and of course you have content. If you have shows, you're out there, you're in Mikro Seditha, there's content, right? But if you're at home, you still have your studio, right? You go to the park, like there's there's things around you. It's all about again sitting down, what is my brand, what is my sound? Are you into fashion? You know, find a way to include that in your in your content. But yeah, man, there's there's there's plenty of artists up and coming now that that are doing well. And I mean, I was I was just nodding my head listening to music and getting followers, right? So there's you can you can do it definitely.

SPEAKER_04

Uh there is also another example, you know the the two the duo, they are brought twin brothers, uh Seto, they're French also. I don't know if you're brothers there's Seto is like S-E T and O W.

SPEAKER_00

Are they doing the content that's similar to On Fire?

SPEAKER_04

Uh kind well, it's different, like they do mix, not it's not the same like uh on fire, like the real format, you know, and putting the tracks. Them they are doing they're starting with uh sets outside on YouTube, so long formats. Yeah, they're more they're more known on YouTube, you know, they're not that uh that uh present on uh on Instagram, but now they're they're very huge on YouTube, and them they started like with uh sets that they were doing on Crazy Location, you know, and then it blew out, and now they're also true to starting to tour. They produce also very there's there's one track that performed really well, also, I think last year, that was really last year, and now they're on their way, you know. And at the beginning, they just start being outside. And last one that I saw, so I love and I love this guy at Tefo Fox. He just released like one of one of uh, I don't know if you saw it, he released one of uh his sets, like beautiful location, and also what is crazy with this set, apparently it's his own production from our one up. Wow. So this is sick also, and Tefo has like a style that is like quite uh special, you know. So now it's full product, like full set, one hour, full production. But when you see this, you can say like, okay, then you need maybe a good management in order to be able to contact people and say, okay, I have this artist, you should book him. But look, you can just say this guy has a one-hour set, the music will be unique, exclusive. Like there will be no one elsewhere. Now, Tefo, I think, is gonna be one of the big names uh in yeah, the next one, two, three years. Can be easily uh with regarding it's a bit underground the way still, you know, and also the music, but we track with Abasasi. You can like eventually in one year, two years, this will be this will be the sound uh more more more and more you know heard everywhere, I think.

SPEAKER_01

It has to be, I mean, I think where Afro Houses now, we can talk about this now actually, right? You have to come with something different, right? You have to have artists like Tefo that make you go, you know, jump out of your chair because he's different. He's doing something that no one else is doing. Right? And again, Afro House needs that at the moment because I think everyone's looking at indie dance, more melodic styles, and you know, they want to play in Saint-Trape and Ibita and Ikonos, where there's more tech house now, indie dance, right? Afrohouse, only Shims and Black Coffee really are playing Afro House and that are traveling like that, you know, in these places, and maybe the B3B guys.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

But everyone else is really pushing like tech house and indie dance, right?

SPEAKER_04

So yeah, it's uh yeah, it's funny, yeah. But you see, you saw, I don't know both of you, but uh we saw the the change because you know Afro House was really the sound of last year, thanks also to Manzani. Uh the year before, maybe with move, Yamore. You know, there was always big tracks that allows like to have the genre represented. But it was funny also to see all the producers producing Afro House last year and now it's getting to indie dance. And I think that's also the one of the issues I'm seeing is like if you're following trends, then you cannot build nothing, you know, because now okay, it's indie dance, takeouts, but what will it be is it will it be the same next year? Not sure, you know. It really depends. This year is maybe this because another blew out which you know talk to you. You had also Naprosper that is like, wow, they are crazy, also crazy with which free your mind. But I was really because my me, it was my first two years, you know, as a producer and and and also following the scene. And I was like, but there's so names, what are they doing now? And I'm going to the Spotify uh page, and okay, now they're in takeouts. And I was like, but doesn't sound the same that last year. And it was good actually, you know. Yeah, I was like, I love what you're doing now. What would be the what would be next, you know? And I think I'm really agreeing with you, uh Manu, it's it's about and Tefo, you can feel that also. It's more like foundation, roots. The sound is not coming from somewhere like a trend, or because you know, you you went to a tutorial and you were like, okay, how do I create this type of tracks? It's really, you know, how do I really express myself, my sound, my origin, whatever, you know, you you want to represent also. And this should be everyone should be also in this energy when you're doing music, I think, and not chasing trends because trends they go, they I mean, it's the same, like, I mean, you you would know this, man, as like artists I used to post about quite a lot.

SPEAKER_00

It's like I can't post about them anymore, their releases or their gigs, because it's just like it's not on brand anymore, right? Um, and I won't say names because I feel like we might get ourselves in a little bit of trouble, but yeah, things things have changed, man. And like, you know, where where like from your perspective, you know, being so you know, ear to the ground on Afro House kind of music, like how like where do you see kind of things going like going forward, man? Like based on the content you're getting, the sound, like are we going back more to like focusing on southern African artists like a TEFO, or like are we gonna see like what's happening in Europe? Like, what are your thoughts, man?

SPEAKER_04

I think it's gonna depends. Uh there is the two things, you know. On the side, you will still have artists because they are not following a train, they're really trying to build something, and also I think as an artist you need to understand that it will take time. It will take time to find your to you find your sound, to find your universe, to define it, to be able, you know, to really also build all the foundation around and then to blow out, actually. So and and this also the interesting fact, because all the artists that are now famous, you know, you take black coffee, usual, all the best, even Shimza, because Shimza is also not that young when you see it, you know, even if it looks a lot younger, younger than the AJ has. But they all have 20, 20, sometimes 15 years, you know, behind them. And I think now that we are in the social media, we have the feeling that if it's taking more than two to three years, it's it's too long, you know, like uh you're not, you know, you're not good at it. But no, bro, it can take still 10 years. But where are you on the process? When did you start music? Are your music mature enough? So on the side, there is, and this I think there is actually not that much profile that are existing. Maybe there is 10, 15. I won't be able to name them, but I know that they are existing. And you know, guys like Tefo, I think are uh good example. You you were talking about Draga. Drega is a great example, also. Actually, there is so much talent, you know, and especially in Africa that you can name that for me as already the sound, and now they need the platforms to to go be to grow, you know, or the management. On the other side, it will depend. If you have a new a new anthem next year or even you know, uh this year coming, you will have again, you know, all the people coming and starting to use more after house, and it will eventually create also good tracks, you know. But it really depends also where you are what the artist is gonna do, you know, and if yeah, there will be a song that blows out, and then yeah, the trend is coming back. But from I I see this as that there is the the the core, and then sometimes getting bigger because of trends, and then it goes back to the core. But the core, on my opinion, my side, my mission is like, let's make the core getting bigger and bigger, you know. And this can take yeah, 20, 15, 30 years. Because look, yeah, I'm really astonished always when I'm talking with people that are not in the scene and saying, Do you know usually? No, who is it? Who is? And I'm like, you don't know, like they don't know the name, they know the tracks when you put bam bam or you put you know, there is still because we're also in a transition where it's really underground DJ. It's not like artists like The Weekend or Drake, that you know, the the names are linked to the music and because they're singing. On a DJ side, it's quite new to follow DJ, to be able like the producer and stuff. It's something that is still in a niche in a way. So there is so room for improvement and for development, actually, in my in my opinion. Well, for my opinion is like we are the beginning of the movement, still.

SPEAKER_01

Still.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Interesting. I wanna I wanna get into you as a producer, right? And more on what your strategy is and how you're leveraging your platforms to, of course, progress your career and your music, right? I think I look at this with Club Record, where obviously, for one, I look at it as a way for us to push artists, obviously create revenue and and uh be profitable with business. But also as Manu, as we build our platforms and our playlists, right? I can also put my music in there and that's also gonna let elevate my music. So similar to how you have with your platforms, right? But how important is it to have your own assets that you own as an artist, so that then you can put your music in there?

SPEAKER_04

It's a great uh question, and to be honest with you, it's really the one of the the key challenges now, because I think that I'm arriving at a point where also I need to make choices in a way, you know, because being an artist and being like uh uh owning a media and trying to get it bigger and create an ecosystem is actually two things that are you know at the beginning connecting, but connected, sorry, but also really different, you know, and also in terms of time consuming. When you want to really create something huge, you need to put all the efforts on there. So recently I was like, okay, should I have met should I maybe focus more on you know the pages, the way we want to develop it, because there is so much things to do, and maybe go a bit slower on the music, maybe producing only one track, because at the beginning I was like, I need to put one track every month. I produced a lot when I started, you know, and also I arrived at the point where, yeah, but where am I in terms of music, you know, on my own, what I'm what we're discussing around myself. And I was like, okay, it's not that clear, you know, what is my universe, where I want to go as an artist. And it's also, I think, even more challenging while you are looking to everyone, you know, and getting inspired and seeing also all the great guys, what they are doing, and you know, you're challenging yourself even more. You're like, yeah, but baby, what I'm doing is shit if I'm comparing, you know, to those guys that are really doing these things good. So currently I'm really into this. At the beginning, obviously, I was like, this platform will help me eventually, you know, to grow also, because I will be able the same that you were saying for for you with Club. But now I'm really into this position where I'm still figuring out what is the best strategy, meaning, should I focus more now on the on the media and try to find a way maybe 80%, 20%, or should I still continue to really try to do both? I don't have the answer right now on my side, but it's really the the question that is uh now in my head.

SPEAKER_00

Just a super quick question, man. You you're doing this full-time, like no day job, or like uh what what's your day like?

SPEAKER_04

Now it's uh now it's a full-time, yeah. Now it's really full time. Like in in um and yeah, there was a funny, I think it could be interesting also to have your your your answer on that, but yeah, it's like when you have to find the content, you know, I think the worst time consuming is to find the content. Yeah, good content, finding a way, like to say. And today we're really trying also to go from like we post things to we create a story, actually. You know, we really try to amplify the culture. How do we do it? You know, how do we go beyond the music, beyond the events, what they represent, uh, you know, what the black coffee will represent for people, how they are inspiring also, uh, and for each artist, because you know, each one has really something different, something unique. So, how do you take this and you manage to also get it in a way that it's relevant and consistent into your own uh uh calendar? So today, yeah, the the most time is regarding those topics, and then it's also all the discussion, you know, the meetings with the teams we're working with, uh preparing the campaigns. And you know, also it's quite challenging because we're working more on the weekends because that's when there is also the events. Yeah, so uh yeah, today it's it's really full time, and actually it's like a lot, lot, lot, lot of work. Uh, from now currently my days are from starting to 10 because I'm not I'm not someone that like to wake up too early, changing, let's say, but 10, 11 until yeah, 1 to 2p to 2 a.m. And the end of the day is really a lot to find what I missed, you know, during the day. Maybe there is other content we can find, and also what we're gonna do uh the day after. So it's taking more and more and more time. We are trying to uh hire also people now, not you know on the on the um uh daily daily jobs, but more you know, in then that can help us also for this. Uh because yeah, it's uh it's a lot of work. But uh it's going it going well, and I think yeah, that there is still room for improvement actually.

SPEAKER_01

There's so much content. Do you do you find that you're busier in certain times of the year? Summer, winter, like when do you feel like it just goes crazy for you guys? Obviously, summer, there's a lot of shows, but yeah, how do you how do you manage manage the year?

SPEAKER_04

It's also a great question, bro, because as we started, you know, only two years ago, and we really studied like professionally, let's say two years ago with Electrac. Um we now saw the the past year, you know, 2025 were really our first years as you know as a business, let's say. And yeah, it's really uh summer. Summer is like the busiest period. And then winter is a bit like slower, like starting from November to December, like November is starting to slow down in terms of release, in terms of also, you know, all the artists releasing music. December is kind of dead, and then it's starting again slowly, January, February. And this year, for instance, starting from April, May, started again to to blow a bit, you know, in terms of uh the music we're gonna receive, the the teams that are contact that will contact us also regarding gigs or regarding release also as well.

SPEAKER_01

You're so um you're so quick though with the content. Like let's let's use uh a real example, right? Early in Haaland, he was in Saint-Trape twice in the span of a week, right? Yeah, from the moment you see this happening, obviously you might find this on on social media, but do you actually find this online? Does someone send you the video? And how quickly from the moment you see it, do you post it and what what is that whole process?

SPEAKER_04

Well, for those type of events, sometimes people send it to us, you know, uh, because also we try we tried really to make people singing, sending us uh video while you know with the format we put from your eyes, so then we can also say to people, okay, they are putting content that are sent, so maybe I can send my videos. Um, but then it's really kind of uh luck or not, you know. Sometimes you're gonna receive great videos, sometimes we receive things that you cannot use, but I think it's the same for music in a way. Um and then uh otherwise we use a lot. Um we're working with people also that help us to find content on TikTok because the good things on TikTok is that you can get the HD that you're gonna not gonna get also on Instagram, so it's also kind of all a strategy, and then yeah, obviously, when you see some things happening, I said yesterday, for instance, you you had Travis Scott with uh Black Coffee.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04

And you know, we discovered this, we were like actually starting to chill, and then you're like, oh, there is something happening. You know, we need to jump on this, and we're looking lucky to find uh to find one video because there was not so many actually. And then you try to put many types of posts, you know. If you look at the page because we already done it, we put one wheel, which when you can be first on the topic and on the news, is the best, like you know that you're gonna be fast, yeah. Yeah, yeah, in terms of KPI uh and engagement in rich. And then also I discovered, but I'm looking a lot to um uh techno in house music, you know, the account that the biggest today in the in the electronic music, so it's one of my my main uh source of inspiration. And they used to do this to do like real and then a carousel for the same news. Because you know, they and I was like both are working well, it's not even like you know, cannibalizing it, like you have both content that are working pretty well, the same content, but it's just packaged differently, right?

SPEAKER_01

Right.

SPEAKER_04

And you know, I was I was I was also studying this, and there was like kind of a lesson saying it's not about using the same content or not, it's how you tell it, you know, the story around it. Like, and if we can take an example, you can say like Black Coffee and Travis Scott. Okay, there was black coffee with Travis Scott in uh Shelona, this would be the first thing. Then you can say all the rap artists going to the to the to the show, electronic music show, you have another way to use the video, etc. etc. You know, it's really about how you do it, and a great example of this, I think also they're they're among the best to do this, is complex. You know, uh the the the account complex? Complex is great, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, but but them and it's like another level, they are posting, I think, I don't know, 60 times a day, 70 times a day, yeah, every 10 minutes, you know. And this was a lesson because at the beginning I was like, should I follow, you know, my uh followers' uh pick? Should we follow this or should we follow, you know, what would be the rule? But actually, there's no rule. If you can bring added value, you can post whatever you want. But that's the real topic. Do you have something that can be interesting for your your audience or not? Because otherwise it will be the total total opposite, and yeah, you're gonna lose like uh reach and everything because you're annoying people.

SPEAKER_00

One one question, I know we're we're getting a little bit closer to time here, but what what about AI? Like AI content, we see a lot of that, especially during the World Cup. There were all kinds of posts, and also like AI tooling to help with posting schedules, source, sorting, sourcing content. Like, do you use any of that at uh on your on your pages, or what are your thoughts on on that?

SPEAKER_04

Um, yeah, for for for me in terms of process, uh AI is like uh everyone should like integrate AI to their processes. I I think we're not that good at it still on our side. Now, how we use it, we use it a lot for the capture caption, we use it a lot for the now it's a new way to use it. We just discovered it, but you know, to do the um uh the first picture, you know, the cover of the post, it's actually now really good at it, way better than before. Uh you know, one year one year ago. Yeah, now bro, it's really nice. Like just for a picture, uh, you just put some photos, like let's say, I don't know, for instance, yesterday I can give you a concrete example. There was like not a really good picture of black coffee with Travis Scott. You had like both on their side. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And and you know, and then I remember the content when they used to put you know one guy and then the others in a small cycle. But I I hate to use Canva on my side, or you know, I'm not a guy from I don't like this at all. And now you can do it with uh with ChatGPT or Claude, you know. You just say you take those two pictures, put one in a cycle on top of it, and it do it really perfectly, you know. And it's still like uh also uh like people will look the same, you know, they are recognizable. It's not like uh what you can have uh in the past. Yeah, so yeah, I think in terms of process, yeah, we should. And and honestly, my goal is now in the future being able to have the full process handled by AI. This would be like my I would be like, okay, I it's end game if I'm able to have like a platform that is completely automated and still with the same level of quality, you know. Because today you have two choices. It's either you are hiring people, you need to train them, you need to, you know, uh uh like really give them like the the way you do and like to train them on your on your point of view, or either you're using AI to do this, you know. And on the process thing, I think that it's really yeah, a good challenge and the way it is going. Uh, on the artist artistic side, I think it's another topic. You know, today I'm not against AI, but it's more like now you can feel too much that it's AI. Still, you know, and the vocals and the instrumental. So it's not that I'm against it, it's more about we're gonna get fed up about it like soon eventually, because even people that are not into it are now starting to say, oh, okay, this is quite similar, you know. And it's true to every genre. Like you listen to a track, okay, this is AI, you know, it's a Suno track. And I think it's gonna get better, obviously. But that's why I'm more like, okay, we should maybe think about it more in terms of artistic where we want to go. Uh, but in terms of process, yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_01

Cool. Okay, I think uh, you know, we can keep talking for 10 hours. But uh maybe maybe we do a part two, maybe we do a part two with pleasure, guys.

SPEAKER_04

I I had also a question for you. This one, maybe just one if you if you have time, uh yeah. I would like to know, you know, in terms of uh well, first regarding club record, um is there a date? Maybe you can give an exclusivity to everyone, but is there a date for the new web drums uh remix of uh of uh like that? We're waiting, guys, because you know it was like teasing a bit.

SPEAKER_00

That's West we want to know if are we allowed to say? We're allowed to say, yeah, yeah. Uh we're right now, if everything works out, we're looking at September 25th.

SPEAKER_04

Okay, this and cool to uh I'm I'm glad that you know it's also kind of after summer because it will also you know bring uh brings a lot for the end of the year, actually.

SPEAKER_01

Have you got a have you got a favorite club record track, but that isn't you know a like that or one of the white lines, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_04

Well, I have to to tell you that the last one away, I'm taking it poof.

SPEAKER_01

Do you like that one?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, yeah, I love it. Like and especially the big for me, it's the killer opener for an headlight set. You know, you arrive, you put this track, and okay, I'm here, you know. And that's what you said. No, it's it's amazing. Like the intro is for me, to be honest, with the radio version, I didn't listen to the extended, but I was like, I wanted more, actually. You know, at the end of the track, I was like, where is my where is my joke with like it it it's more ended too early? You know what I mean? It was a bit again, but it's still a great, great, great track. Um, I'm thinking, I think that I I also really love uh the first one you had actually with uh Kalimija, because I'm a I'm a huge Kalimija fan. Yes, exactly. Sudden Movements was also one that I that I really like um on my side. Is there another one? Great track. I think yeah, I don't remember the name, but there is another one. Uh I think it was with system, I don't remember. It's it's a it's a red cover. My my system, my system. My system, yeah, exactly. This one also I was like, uh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because I'm I'm really also you know finding loving those Afrotech trials. Yeah, the one that really push a club, you know. You like, and and that's why it's also relevant with your name, so yeah, those one. But our way recently is really the one I'm like, wow, okay, this one is great. But I love Vido Jean and uh Oliver Loin. They they have a sound, they know how to make people dance, to be honest.

SPEAKER_01

They're crazy, they're crazy. Okay, so how can people get in touch with you? I mean, of course, they know Afro's crew, Electrac.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, on my page directly. Uh, you know, I'm I'm kind of uh I try to be uh to be there the most. So yeah, directly on my page and with pleasure, you know, to give advice, to support also. Uh, because yeah, I know it it's a it's a struggle at the beginning for everyone. Being an artist and being on a like being an artist and being a dependent is like kind of a challenge. So it's hard. You know, if we can support and share also uh some some lessons and some uh things we learn on the way, it's always a pleasure.

SPEAKER_01

Absolutely. Okay, man. Thanks for taking the time and uh we'll chat soon, bro. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, with pleasure, guys. Thank you so much. Have a good day.