EPISODE 19: SHAOLIN COWBOY - CRUEL TO BE KIN

We're back... with kittens!

This week, we're looking at GEOF DARROW'S 'SHAOLIN COWBOY - CRUEL TO BE KIN' issue one from DARK HORSE COMICS. 

Darrow is one of the greatest cartoonists to be working in comics today, with his hyper detailed style of drawing, heavily influenced by Franch cartoonist MOEBIUS. (Fun fact, Geof worked in Moebuis' studio early in his career.)

Darrow is one of my favourite artists working in comics today - polar opposites in terms of style, but I love his storytelling and approach to art.

Enjoy... and listen out for our new kittens, Oberon and Ophelia causing chaos.

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Welcome back to Morgan Talks Comics. This week we are looking at Showeling Cowboy, which is one of my favourites for a long time. This is the first issue of the series Cruels Be Kin from 2022. Written and drawn by the amazing artist Jeff Darrow. Coloured by Dave Stewart. Jeff Darrow does everything else on this. And as a nice little nod to another one of my favourite artists, this one has a Mike McCnola cover. Because there were variant covers throughout this series. It was a seven-issue series from Dark Horse. Hello to Elizabeth Chamberlain. I was just thinking you'd forgotten about me.

SPEAKER_02 0:40

Nope. Yes. Hello. And you know what my first impression is? What? What a dreary cover.

SPEAKER_00 0:48

Well, it's it's um dreary.

SPEAKER_04 0:51

Mignola tends that when Mignola's work is covered, which is usually in this more of a flat colour style, um, Dave Stewart, who predominantly colours his work, works with a very muted palette. It's because he's writing kind of dark horror kind of stories. Well, he works with a buffer thing. So this is the Shaolin Cowboy in the centre here with two with a katana, a samurai sword.

SPEAKER_01 1:18

Things aren't going well for him, aren't they? They're not going well for him, isn't it?

SPEAKER_04 1:23

No, and then there's this big giant robot crab. I think bate what really what's uh Jeff has said that it just go for it with the character and Did you say Jeff Darrow? Jeff Darrow, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:37

Is it Jeff with a G or will you have J.

SPEAKER_04 1:39

Jeff with a G and one F.

SPEAKER_02 1:42

Oh, how peculiar.

SPEAKER_04 1:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:45

Right, well that would never mind. Just wondered. Crawsby kin.

SPEAKER_04 1:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:51

Right. Is there any colour in my things inside? I think that's there is.

SPEAKER_04 1:58

A bit yellow. Uh Jeff draws in uh he's before before we sort of like dive in sort of and and start talking about the issue, Jeff w was a big fan and actually worked with the uh French artist Meebius, uh, who did comics as well as film design and animation and stuff like that. Um looking at how Jeff's style has developed, you can I I can certainly see um uh a very heavy influence by Muebius, so it's more of a European style as opposed to an American style of drawing. Um but what what Jeff does beautifully is he does really incredibly detailed illustrations, so you can you can dive into it. You can spend days looking at one of his pages, he tends to work these days in full pages, but there is so much detail, like little things like signs and stuff like that in it as well.

SPEAKER_02 2:55

Do you think he does it larger than it's like?

SPEAKER_04 2:58

Yeah, he he draws draws on like lot the almost the full the size of the board we've got the comic on here, so he draws on a very large scale per for each page.

SPEAKER_02 3:10

What's that A3?

SPEAKER_04 3:12

At least A3, yeah. I wouldn't be surprised if he draws bigger because industrial scanners can scan from almost any size.

SPEAKER_02 3:19

Right. It is interesting. I is that a cat?

SPEAKER_04 3:22

That is a cat.

SPEAKER_02 3:24

Right. And what's this supposed to be that there? Is it bridge or something?

SPEAKER_04 3:30

I think this is like the so we're we're overlooking a a city that's appears to be on fire. Um, and I think this is the edge of the top of a building. So the cat's walking along the edge of the top of a building.

SPEAKER_02 3:42

Right, I didn't even notice the fire there. I was so busy looking down here.

SPEAKER_04 3:46

Yeah, like I say, he's he's almost intricate in his in the amount of detail that that you that you see in his comics.

SPEAKER_02 3:54

Yeah, and I can I notice he's got a thing about um insects.

SPEAKER_04 3:58

Yeah, so he puts a lot of na even though he's drawn a lot of mechanical stuff uh over his uh career, he he puts a lot of natural life into it as well, which we'll see as we go through as well. We'll see a lot more like natural life as well as you know architecture and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_02 4:17

That's right. Is it just um it just there for the fun of it? I think kind of, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 4:23

Um he Darrow's just one of those artists who's who's you know really good at drawing kind of everything. Uh he spent a long time working in animation before he before he moved into comics. So he was a production he was a anime he was a designer for Hanna Barbera animation.

SPEAKER_02 4:43

Right. Funnily enough, I'd always thought it weren't the other way, comics first, animation afterwards.

SPEAKER_04 4:49

Yeah, I mean, yeah, it it's interesting. Um I thought that it's quite common that for as a as a career path you start in comics. Um other artists, Jack Kirby, I was just reading about this morning. Jack Kirby uh started in comics and then moved into animation later in life after he you know he had a successful comics career. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:11

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 5:12

Yeah. So this is like I say it's very in indicative of of Darrow's style, a big full page with lots of detail.

SPEAKER_02 5:24

Are the um insects accurate?

SPEAKER_00 5:29

I would say the insects are quite accurate, yeah. Right.

SPEAKER_04 5:36

Oh, that's interesting. So moving into the story in full, you can see here how he puts in Darrow puts in like little puns and stuff on s on the signs of buildings and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_01 5:47

That's clever.

SPEAKER_04 5:48

Yeah, I really like that. And you see here, he's I say he's very good at just as good at drawing natural life. So we've got these lizards here talking to each other. There's big I think they're like big Komodo dragons.

SPEAKER_01 6:01

Are they?

SPEAKER_04 6:02

They are. They're like Komodo dragons. They are big, yeah. They are really big creatures. Scary. Can be, yeah, very scary. Um down at the um down at the bottom of the page here we see our our hero, the Showeling Cowboy. I can't remember if he's ever actually named or if he's just he's just referred to as the monk or something like that. This is sorry.

SPEAKER_02 6:33

I said you're gonna have to do these folks.

SPEAKER_04 6:35

Yeah, um this is uh Jeff Darrow doing his own ver it's it's his own character, his character the the Shaolin Cowboy's been around for most of this century. So I think he was first seen, first published in t in 2000, after it after Jeff had worked with other writers like worked with Frank Miller, who's one of the one of the godfathers of mod modern comics, they did two series together.

SPEAKER_02 7:06

That looks like that face, but it also looks like it might be a dog. Yeah. What is it? What do you think is?

SPEAKER_04 7:13

I think it's another Komodo dragon, because there's there are as we go through the the dragons are talking to each other and they do a bit of a flashback to when they when they actually hatch out of their egg out of their eggs and then they're clever, aren't they? Yeah, and um, yeah. So that this is this is where um take a deep breath. This is where the the young Komodo dragon is talking to his father. And it looks like the the dad's just about he's gonna try and eat him so he doesn't so he does a runner.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Is that the cowboy?

SPEAKER_04 7:50

So this is the cow, yeah. So we've seen at the bottom at the bottom of the page here as a sun uh sunset, and the the we see our our hero, the showering cowboy, um picked out in the sun, and he's walking along with a uh an an old-fashioned bamboo uh sunshade.

SPEAKER_02 8:11

I thought that looked incongruous.

SPEAKER_04 8:14

Yeah. So we see we see the the the baby dragon that's that's telling the story come running towards the shawling towards the cowboy with the dad dad chasing after him. And these this is quite common as well as as settings for the stories, it's set sort of like in the deserts of America.

SPEAKER_02 8:35

Yes. So uh at those places he doesn't particularly put detail in the same as the buildings.

SPEAKER_04 8:45

There's still a lot of detail in the rocks and stuff like that. There's a lot of line work. Jeff Darrow he Darrow draws with quite a heavy line style, you know. So there's lots of attention to detail. Thing things like when um guns are fired and stuff like that, you'd see all the bullets coming out of it, that kind of thing. You'll see every single bullet. It's it's that kind of detailed in some of his earlier work. Do the lizards or whatever they're called, do they jump?

SPEAKER_02 9:14

It looks like it.

SPEAKER_04 9:15

Yeah, well it looks like this one's jumping. So he's jumping towards the the the cowboy, and then he uses martial arts to And his umbrella. And his umbrella to stop them.

SPEAKER_02 9:28

Mmm his parasol.

SPEAKER_04 9:31

Yeah, his parasol.

SPEAKER_02 9:35

What's this?

SPEAKER_04 9:37

So there's a small panel here, you see the parasol and the the cowboy is wearing a uh blanket, uh cloak. They can see him they can see it in the previous panel where he's he's that that's floating off him.

SPEAKER_02 9:55

Oh I see, so there's just his things just floating away.

SPEAKER_04 9:59

Yeah, just floating away. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:02

Evidently a windy desert like like Egypt's. Do you think all deserts are windy? I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 10:09

I think they probably are. Yeah. So there's a bat there's a fight going on between the the father Komodo dragon and the cowboy.

SPEAKER_02 10:20

I'm really sorry, I'm so tired. I was just talking to somebody on the phone and they were yawning. They started me off. So I I can look uh properly now. They're just having a Barney really, aren't they?

SPEAKER_04 10:34

They're having a Barney. Basically, what uh quite often happens in in Shaolin Cowboy is that it ends up because of the because of the way that Darrow draws, I mean, at the moment we're looking at pages to which I've got lots of very small detailed panels in, but gradually they sort of spread out to become more like full pages, and they quite often will be uh a Barney because he takes time to let the fights um flow, so you'll see you'll see every blow being landed, especially because he's using like martial arts and stuff like that as well.

SPEAKER_02 11:11

Oh so he's not drawing it for me then. No. Because I'd say like that's a Barney move to where he's finished.

SPEAKER_04 11:20

Kind kind of the the Barney's, we put it all fights, are it it? Are it, yeah, is is is all part of the story time. Is that tail? Yeah, the f the the father Komodo has has managed to get the the cowboy's gun and is he's g is trying to shoot him using his tail. He shuts himself. But the Shailin cowboy is then uh uh unfurled? Not unfurled. Unsheathed is uh katana and cuts off the end of the tail with the gun and then he slices it here. Well he slices the the Komodo the dragon's tail. But for dinner. And you see lots of little slices of tail. So again it's very you see all the detail within it, you see like the you know the the muscles and the bones and everything.

SPEAKER_02 12:12

So he just cut it out because he felt like it.

SPEAKER_04 12:15

Well, because they're fighting each other.

SPEAKER_02 12:17

Yeah, but you once you cut the tail off, you don't need to do anything else to do, do you?

SPEAKER_04 12:21

Or do you it's kind of a it's a thing that you see that you see a lot in samurai films and so on, that you know, especially with with sword fighting, that you'll see lots of you'll see a a small movement from the sword, but it causes a lot of damage. Um things like you there's a classic one where uh a candle is cut and it looks like it hasn't been cut and then slowly the candle sort of slides into two slices.

SPEAKER_02 12:47

Is it a bit like professional chefs cut cutting up a cucumber? That kind of thing, yeah, yeah. If you've got the sound effect.

SPEAKER_04 12:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:58

Oh well they've stopped fighting now.

SPEAKER_04 12:59

They've stopped fighting. So he said so he um sits on it? No, he's just crouching down. He asks the he invites the little um the little dragon to come with him. And he's he says, I'm trying to walk the path of Buddha and Funny Sildum a part of my life, so he he invites the the young dragon to go with him, so they go walking off into the desert. Right.

SPEAKER_02 13:25

Is the father keel has been killed, has he?

SPEAKER_04 13:28

I don't know if he's been killed. He runs off, he runs off with his tail gushing blood. What's blood, so he runs off. So he invites the cowboy then invites the um the young dragon to come with him.

SPEAKER_02 13:43

Has it got a name or does it get I don't think so.

SPEAKER_04 13:46

I don't the quite a lot quite common in this that they don't generally have names. So you can see the panels are great growing bigger now, so there's less panels in the page. We come to the centre of the comic. So they walked, they got they've gone off walking into the desert, and then the the dragon says that things get weird, and then the other dragon that he's actually talking to. So there's a conversation floating over the story as we're telling it, sort of like a voiceover. Um, and then one the the main dragon turns up, hello Oberon. Oberon the kitten, just about to get involved, and then it they say the one of the drag the the main dragon says then things get weird, and the other one says weirder than they already were, and then there's this big kind of it almost looks like a mushroom spore float comes floating through the sky.

SPEAKER_00 14:39

I thought that looks like um um a dragon. This yeah, that looks a bit like a uh move on pterodactyl.

SPEAKER_04 14:49

It's moving over on out of the way. It looks most indignant. He did look most indignant. And it looks like, yeah, there's a pterodactyl, so it's quite often there's um there's dinosaurs in in Darrow stuff, he enjoys drawing like reptiles and stuff like that. So we see that there's another character here who's actually who's actually piloting this like mushroom spore type thing, using it as like you do, like a ship.

SPEAKER_02 15:16

Oh that's an eco-friendly ship, isn't it?

SPEAKER_04 15:21

Yeah, and then the the terror the pterodactyl type character comes along and catches the grabs the the young dragon by its tail. Oh dear. Oh dear. So then the cowboy swings into action and tries to stop the pterodactyl character from flying off taking off with the um with the dragon. Sorry, I'm a bit out of sorts today. Um I think we're both tired. I think we're both tired.

SPEAKER_02 15:51

I thought I was made to start yawning. Yeah. It distracts you, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_04 15:55

Yeah. So we see the the pterodactyl and the spore type thing are uh are flying off, and the the cowboy is has grabbed has lashed out with his blanket and tie them both together. Here comes Zophelia as well. And then this is more this is quite indicative of view of it.

SPEAKER_00 16:18

Oh, thank you. Thanks.

SPEAKER_04 16:23

Um the joys of kittens. This is this is where uh Darrow's work really comes to life. It it it uses like the whole spread of the two pages to put together a um much bigger thing, but it will you'll see the character repeated through, so you'll see the action taking place.

SPEAKER_02 16:49

That um dead thing, the skeleton, I take that that's nothing to do with the cowboy. Um she's biting the wire.

SPEAKER_04 16:59

I'd noticed she's trying to help but help help help edit the podcast. Put that back on. We've got kittens all over the place today.

SPEAKER_02 17:10

Right. And now we've come back from being distracted. That is very detailed, as you said. Yeah, like skeleton, it's not just a few white lines.

SPEAKER_04 17:21

No, you you see every tiny little bit of detail. This is this is um you know Daryl Darrow's um style. He he puts so much attention to detail into it and texture and lines. I like that.

SPEAKER_02 17:37

I just wish they'd use nicer colours.

SPEAKER_00 17:40

Yeah, I mean the colour the palette is quite muted.

SPEAKER_04 17:43

There's Ophelia sitting in shop now. If she tastes it in there, it's fine.

SPEAKER_02 17:50

Yeah, yeah. She's distracting you again.

SPEAKER_04 17:53

Um yeah, they tend to work quite a muted palette. It's not it's not that bright. No. But whether that's because it's sort of like more of a natural palette, it's the you know, as the the the rocks out in the desert have got this sort of red sandy colour to them.

SPEAKER_02 18:09

Yeah, red.

SPEAKER_04 18:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:11

Not poo-coloured.

SPEAKER_04 18:16

But yeah, so the cowboy is is caught onto the tail of this like pterodactyl character, it's trying to fly across, uh, and it's still got the baby Komodo dragon in its mouth.

SPEAKER_02 18:28

Oh yeah, I've forgotten about that. Quick read on says we can rescue him quickly.

SPEAKER_04 18:33

Yeah. And he manages he by barging into the skull of the the uh skeleton that we've seen. The whatever it is. Of whatever it is, this sort of big dinosaur type skeleton, he manages to stop the pterodactyl, and actually by actually gets the the skull chops its head off.

SPEAKER_02 18:56

I'm a bit mystified by that.

SPEAKER_04 18:58

Chops the head off of the of the of the pterodactyl character, and the little com the little baby Komodo dragon is is is then freed from from its jaws.

SPEAKER_02 19:08

I would argue it's more likely that the big thing wouldn't be injured and the little dragon, whatever it was the thing is, that'd be squished into the skull. But then it's not real.

SPEAKER_04 19:20

It's not real, no. So it's talking about they're talking about the uh the cowboy saving the the dragon where a big boulder comes flying down. Sorry, Eliza Moray's giggling because we've just had to see the kittens jumping all over the place.

SPEAKER_02 19:38

Well, jumping and missing. Right. Well that's a nice button.

SPEAKER_04 19:44

So we've got a really big we've got a really big double double page spread here. It's a sing one big single panel with a lot of that a lot of detail packed into it. So we've got this spore-like thing flying through the air, and it's actually throwing it's picking up rocks with its tentacles and throwing rocks at the at the cowboy and the little dragon.

SPEAKER_02 20:09

Why?

SPEAKER_04 20:11

Because the pterodactyl character was like his sidekick, so I think he's trying to sort of like avenge him. No.

SPEAKER_02 20:19

The um the they're getting smaller again, the panels, aren't they?

SPEAKER_04 20:24

Yeah. So the so as more as more movement is happening, he slows the pacing down by putting more panels into it. And show shows the uh the rot rocks being thrown at the at the cowboy.

SPEAKER_02 20:41

Well, have they got their teddy? I do apologize. My middle's making singing noises.

SPEAKER_04 20:48

So this lit this kind there's this weird little character who's dress he's almost dressed in a costume like a little teddy bear, who's the one who's controlling the uh mushroom spore craft.

SPEAKER_02 21:02

Oh, so he's a baddie.

SPEAKER_04 21:04

Yeah. Oh, he looks so cute. Yeah. He's a baddie. But um so he keeps throwing rocks down at the cowboy. And the cowboy and the and the and the dragon are running off.

SPEAKER_02 21:20

Oh, he looks a bit evil in that one. Looks like a bit piggy.

SPEAKER_04 21:24

Yeah, it does look like he's got a bit of a piggy face.

SPEAKER_02 21:28

What's happening here then is.

SPEAKER_04 21:30

So what's happening here is there's a there's an old car left to left to the desert, left to the desert air. And there's a run and the uh the evil creature on on top of the spore thing is there's sort of like a runny dialogue, he's talking about the car and all the rest of it.

SPEAKER_02 21:51

Why don't we give him a name? Call him Bob.

SPEAKER_04 21:54

He could be called Bob.

SPEAKER_02 21:58

There's lots of tidgly bits there. Isn't it?

SPEAKER_04 22:00

Yeah. So the the frame the frame count here has gone up to lit in it's got into double figures on a page. The the the the sweet spot for page layout is supposed to be six or seven panels.

SPEAKER_02 22:13

But you can do what you like.

SPEAKER_04 22:15

You can do what you like, but to keep a story sort of flowing quite nicely and everything, you is supposed to, but the optimal is supposed to be about six or seven. Some people say that when it gets too too busy. Excuse me, sounding in the background, the kittens are now having a fight. And they've knocked things down. They're knocking things down.

SPEAKER_02 22:37

Um But he just does what he wants.

SPEAKER_04 22:40

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And it's not saying that you must do that, it's just saying that like the kind of the sweet spot for it.

SPEAKER_02 22:48

Yeah, but who said what's there? I'd want to know evidence. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:53

Evidence probably probably we would look at uh Will Eisner's sequential art, comics and sequential art. And which is uh a book about how comics are actually made and how they how to put themselves.

SPEAKER_02 23:06

So did they research before that? That's what I was saying.

SPEAKER_04 23:09

Yeah, how do you research? I don't know it but Eisner would have researched because I Will Eisner is again is recognised as one of the most important figures in modern comics, even though he started working in the I think in the 20s and 30s.

SPEAKER_02 23:23

He's he's he's still with us.

SPEAKER_04 23:26

No, he's not now. He he was about 92 when he died. Um another another artist and writer that I'm a big fan of, he did a lot of sort of syndicated strips for newspapers, especially Sunday colour strips. Um but he's he's recognised as he was recognised as a real authority on how comics are actually made and how they're put together, you know, and how to you know how lighting works, all kinds of stuff, and how sort how sequential art, which is what this is, um, works. So I've got quite a lot of his stuff because it is it is really special stuff, it's really good stuff.

SPEAKER_02 24:10

I see.

SPEAKER_04 24:11

Yeah, so the spore creature has managed somehow to get this little car going and then he's brought managed to bring some um skeletons to life who get in and start driving the car.

SPEAKER_02 24:24

Oh it's clearly real life.

SPEAKER_04 24:27

It's clearly real life. Now we're coming on to the last page of of this first issue where we can see the spore controlling the car, driving up, driving after the show and cowboy and after the little after the little dragon.

SPEAKER_02 24:47

Hmm. It's kind of just telling you how they um met and introducing the baddies, isn't it?

SPEAKER_04 24:56

It is really. I mean, given that given that this is the first issue, it's just it's setting setting the scene for this for the story to come.

SPEAKER_02 25:05

I tell you what I like about that is that it's got the story, and it's not got a lot load of old took advertising things and well no, here they've turned they've turned over the the the whole page count of of the issue to to the storytelling. That's what I said.

SPEAKER_04 25:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:23

I like that.

SPEAKER_04 25:24

So yeah, it's really good, and it's quite it's something that doesn't happen a lot. Um because at the end of the day, companies have got to advertise their products, you know, that's how they sell.

SPEAKER_02 25:36

But if you've got good enough story, they'll want the next bit.

SPEAKER_04 25:39

Absolutely, yeah. Absolutely. So, yeah, that's that's Shool and Cowboy. I've got a I've got most of the Shower and Cowboy stuff. I've got the some nice collected editions of the other stories. But it's really nice to have single issues as well. It's nice to see um it's nice because you you can spread out the the pages and actually see the the you know the big spreads and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_02 26:07

Yes. Do you like my uh assessment? My pleasure.

SPEAKER_04 26:12

Assess away.

SPEAKER_02 26:13

Well, first of all, um not struck on the colours because it's just well flat as it you said it was and that might that's not about such a bad page. That one struck me as better. But on the whole, I don't like the colours. Um it could have just been a brighter background on things, just to make the characters pop more, yeah. Although obviously the background is something as important so to that artist, and you know, he wants to put backgrounds in like that. But on the whole, but the paper looks fabulous, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:55

Again, really good qual printed on really good quality paper. Um, this is sort of like the sort of default uh kind of stock that that that comics are printed on now.

SPEAKER_02 27:07

No. Um yeah, sorry, I I was looking at that, but I de actually liked the fact that there were different shapes and yeah uh panels, but it's not illogical.

SPEAKER_04 27:22

No, absolutely not. I mean, it's very much it's like it's almost almost like storyboards for a film, you know. You see you see how things and and Darrow has done a lot of storyboard work in film and you know, for big films like the Matrix series, which were popular in the late 90s, I think.

SPEAKER_02 27:43

I don't know. I don't think I I don't think I saw them.

SPEAKER_04 27:47

No, he was he was sought out by the people who made them, the people who created them to do storyboard and and and development work, which is why he does it like that, I suppose. Absolutely, yeah. Sorry, we're getting distracted by kittens running around all over the place.

SPEAKER_02 28:03

Next time we won through one of these, we'll have to put them in their in their cage.

SPEAKER_04 28:08

We will, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:12

Well, it hid she hid in a corner because it was something uh a f a little while ago and she was frightened and she stayed there right next right next to me.

SPEAKER_04 28:22

She stayed curled up in the corner, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 28:25

Yeah, so sorry, you you carry on with your with your analysis.

SPEAKER_02 28:28

Um they mostly had a big barney all the time. Not overly struck on that, I'm waiting for the story. The little thing is cute. That's cute. Um oh, I can't see. What about the eats uppercase, isn't it? Yeah. I'll give that about four.

SPEAKER_04 28:50

Oh dear, that's quite low. So not not as much of a fan of that one then.

SPEAKER_02 28:57

No, no, not much of a fan. All they need to do is do up a lowercase just to get themselves another couple of points. Yeah. But do they care?

SPEAKER_04 29:08

I'm trying to think, because um given that that Darrow's uh kind of his primary influence is Mebius, who's a who's a French artist, uh, and I know from looking at some of his other stuff, quite a lot of early uh European comics, especially from the 1970s and so on, did use upper and lowercase in their in their speech. If you look at Tintin as an example, uh, I mean Tintin started in the 20s but went through into the early 70s. That was done upper and lowercase.

SPEAKER_02 29:45

Before I comment on that, I must say that Breeze the Dog is making it, I'm stroking them and she's making peculiar noises. I think she likes it. Um you think about upper and lowercase, but I'm thinking that they don't actually nobody's ever told them why it helps to be like that. That's how they do it. That's all we've always done it, and they don't even think about it.

SPEAKER_04 30:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:13

They need telling.

SPEAKER_04 30:14

Yeah. It's it's an industry thing and it's it's something that's that's that's been there for possibly as long as comics have existed almost.

SPEAKER_02 30:25

Yes, but that's because uh in the 50s and what have you, they had this funny idea that well they for children at that time, the children could understand uppercase letters better than than lowercase. So initially everybody learnt uppercase and all their names on things would be uppercase. We know better now.

SPEAKER_04 30:52

Yeah. But uh but um yeah, it seems to be just carried on. Comics have just carried on with what kind of works for them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:03

No, what they've always done. It makes as far as their little pokey holes to put the white writing in, I wouldn't have thought it made that much difference. If anything, it might take up less space.

SPEAKER_00 31:15

Yeah. True.

SPEAKER_02 31:18

Right, I think that's really all I've got to say about it. Okay. Um yeah, it's comic. It's got some nice um I like that page, the one that that's I've just inside.

SPEAKER_04 31:32

The the opening opening panel, opening page.

SPEAKER_02 31:36

Now I like that. Um and and the colour works there because you've got smoke over the place, which then makes it misty to look through, and I think that's done extremely well.

SPEAKER_00 31:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:49

Um, that really gets that that's good, that's so good. But on the whole, apart from that, I'm sorry, Mr. what was his name? Darrow. And close to the thing that it would Mr. Darrow and Mr. Stewart, but you're gonna have to do better.

SPEAKER_00 32:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 32:15

I'm sure they'll take it out of board and rush to do it, won't they?

SPEAKER_04 32:18

Well, given that there's a new season new series literally just about to start.

SPEAKER_02 32:23

Well, they'll just have to do it for the series after that.

SPEAKER_04 32:25

Yeah, there's a new series just about to start. I'm waiting for that to come out. Yeah. So there we go. Um Sharon Cowboy, uh, Cruelty Pekin. Start that was a uh seven-issue series in 2022, and yeah, there tends to be about two to three years between each series because obviously it takes a while for them to be put together.

SPEAKER_02 32:48

Changes the subject slightly, we've got quite a lot of new um people looking in, but that's yeah, absolutely. I I haven't seen perhaps I've not looked properly recently enough, but I've not seen much in the way of comments, not much feedback. Um it is switched on, isn't it?

SPEAKER_04 33:09

It is switched on, and we are poke we are po we are back to our regular schedule of post of of of a new episode every week, but at the moment, yeah. We're we're not we're not getting comments. Let's let's hear what there are obviously people like last weekend we had 20 downloads of our show, but we've had no comments from that.

SPEAKER_02 33:30

So it's a bit strange.

SPEAKER_04 33:32

We'd like to hear what people think, you know.

SPEAKER_02 33:35

So yeah, but politely.

SPEAKER_04 33:37

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 33:38

Constructive criticism only.

SPEAKER_04 33:41

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So there we go.

SPEAKER_02 33:45

Okay. Right, I'm gonna say bye. Bye. Okay, bye.