The Planet Earth Guide to Investing in Cryptocurrency with Sir John Hargave

In this episode of Soft and Savage, John Hargrave—CEO of Media Shower and author of The Intelligent Crypto Investor—cuts through the confusion of crypto by reframing it in familiar terms: blockchains as shared spreadsheets, cryptos as companies, and tokens as stocks. Drawing on his own journey from early Bitcoin gains to devastating losses and recovery, Hargrave emphasizes disciplined, long-term investing over hype, advocating for diversification, dollar-cost averaging, and a maximum 10% allocation to crypto. He challenges conventional thinking by arguing that crypto is not just an asset class but a foundational technology poised to replace the global financial system, while also making a provocative case for a future global digital currency. Throughout, the conversation balances skepticism and clarity, transforming crypto from an intimidating abstraction into a practical, investable framework. 

Show Notes

Guest

• Sir John Hargrave – CEO, Media Shower

Books & Publications

• The Intelligent Crypto Investor
• Blockchain for Everyone
• The Intelligent Crypto Investor newsletter

Company & Platforms

• Media Shower

Social Profiles

• LinkedIn: John Hargrave
• X (Twitter): @sirjohnhargrave

Key Concepts Covered

• Crypto as companies; tokens as stocks
• Blockchain explained as a “shared spreadsheet”
• Bitcoin as a volatile tech asset—not currency or gold
• Stablecoins as a bridge between traditional finance and crypto
• Long-term investing strategy (≤10% allocation, steady investing)
• The case for a future global digital currency

Notable Mentions

• Coinbase (retail investing platform)
• Circle Internet Financial (US stablecoin issuer)

This content is for informational and educational purposes only and does not constitute financial, investment, or legal advice. We are not financial advisors. Always do your own research and consult with a qualified professional before making any financial decisions.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:25

John Hardgrave, you are the author of the recently released The Intelligent Crypto Investor. Welcome to Soft and Savage.

SPEAKER_00 0:34

Thank you, Louise. Looking forward to being here.

SPEAKER_01 0:36

John, I know that you founded the longest-running crypto newsletter that reaches thousands of investors, and that you founded the Boston Blockchain Association, which is the leading trade organization promoting the responsible growth of digital assets. But what else do we need to know about you?

SPEAKER_00 0:57

Well, I got involved in crypto very early. I bought my first Bitcoin uh in 2013. The price of Bitcoin at that point was$125. Uh, today I think it's closer to$70,000. So it's been a really terrific investment. Um, I made a fortune early on, but I lost it all. And then I built it all back. And it was that process of going through that experience that really gave me the battle scars that uh taught me the lessons that I'm passionate about sharing with people, both in my book and on your podcast today, how to invest in this exciting new asset class, but to do it in a way that minimizes your risk.

SPEAKER_01 1:47

Fantastic. Okay. Well, before we get started, I just want to apologize because this is going to be more of an interrogation than it is a conversation, because I think I'm pretty sophisticated. I have two master's degrees. I've traveled not all over the world, but I've made a pretty good dent in it. I'm very well read. When somebody starts talking about crypto and blockchain and Bitcoin and all of that, I just completely glazed over. I mean, it's just, you know, it's ridiculous. And you have suggested that there's a reason for that. And you said that you think that the reason for that, and I'm paraphrasing here, is that technologists are the high priests of crypto and that they're terrific coders, but terrible communicators, and that this is the reason why this space is so confusing. You know, but now that I've read your book and listened to your book, I feel much more comfortable in the space. Um and I want to get to all of that. I want to, I want to, you know, help explain to people how they can get involved in this. But before we get into that, can you tell us about the inception of this phenomenon and give us a little bit of the history about it?

SPEAKER_00 2:50

Yeah, well, crypto started, of course, with the introduction uh of Bitcoin. Um so this was around 2008, uh, as Obama was coming into office, and of course, this tremendous financial crisis was hitting. Um, and the government's response at that point was basically to bail out the banks and also to print trillions of dollars uh to get us out of that uh mess, which worked, but it also had the opposite effect of devaluing the dollar. Well, a um little-known uh anonymous programmer who goes by the name of Satoshi Nakamoto sees all this um happening not just in the US, but globally, and he says, we need a new kind of money. And so he um creates a white paper first, which is sort of like a technical document that um outlines a vision for this new invention called Bitcoin, and he posts it to this uh obscure little mailing list that's sort of read only by cryptography geeks. Um and he then decides to build it. So he creates this uh invention called Bitcoin, and the way it works is that people kind of hook their computers up to this network that he's building, um, and that creates these uh Bitcoin. And in the beginning, uh single Bitcoin had no value, and then it uh kind of had you know a few maybe hundredths of a penny of value. Uh, but as this idea caught on and more people started joining this network and creating this Bitcoin, the price began to uh rise in value. And uh in the ensuing years, as you know, this has really taken off and it's created um a whole new industry. But more than that, it's really a new technology layer that is transforming the entire global financial system. So you think of the traditional financial system, the technology that it runs on today is very slow and inefficient and expensive. It's actually expensive to move money. Um, and this new crypto or blockchain technology, as it's called, is much faster, much easier, and much cheaper. And that's the real invention behind Bitcoin is the technology that runs it. And that's what we're investing in when we start to think about investing in this crypto is this big shift over to this new financial technology.

SPEAKER_01 5:31

Yeah, and a lot of the big, the big firms like uh um BlackRock and Fidelity and Schwab, who were naysayers in the beginning, um, have not only taken it on, but they've got their own financial instruments that they're developing.

SPEAKER_00 5:45

Yeah, that's the first page of the book is all of the leading financial uh CEOs who dismissed Bitcoin at the beginning, and then how they walked back their comments, you know, five years later. So there was a tremendous amount of skepticism about Bitcoin and crypto in the early days, but certainly what we've seen in the past year, especially, is it's just becoming common sense. It's becoming part of the financial infrastructure. So a lot of people are saying, wow, crypto is really making inroads into the traditional financial system. I see it as the opposite. I see that crypto is going to eat the financial system. In other words, if we look ahead five, 10, 20 years, the whole financial system is gonna run on this crypto technology. It's just a better technology. It's faster and it's cheaper. And therefore, to me, it's just um uh common sense that we're all gonna go um in that direction. And that's what we're really investing in when we invest in crypto today, is we're saying, okay, this thing, like the internet in the early days, this this technology is really going to start running the world. And how can we make some um smart bets on the companies that are likely to be leaders um in this industry today?

SPEAKER_01 7:06

Okay, all right. So this is that at a meta level, okay? Are you ready for the interrogation? No, I just because nobody understands what's going on, you know, and I thought I would really like to break it down. So, okay, so lightning round, okay? Crypto. What does it mean? We need definitions. We need definitions for all of these.

SPEAKER_00 7:30

Yeah, well, crypto is based on this technology called blockchain. I'll give you the world's easiest explanation of blockchain. Imagine a giant um uh spreadsheet, like an Excel sheet or like a Google sheet that's basically just recording transactions, kind of one row after another. But instead of a spreadsheet that's like stored on you know your hard drive, this is a giant shared spreadsheet that's shared among thousands of computers all over the world, and they're all kind of checking each other's work, basically. Um, when we write a new row to that spreadsheet, we call that a block. And then we put them in sequence, we chain them together. So blockchain, that's how we get that word. And that's really all you need to know is it's just a giant shared spreadsheet, essentially, that we're using to keep track of all the transactions that are happening with these new um financial assets like Bitcoin. It runs on that blockchain or crypto technology.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

Bitcoin.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

Yeah, so um originally Satoshi Nakamoto thought Bitcoin would be a currency. So sometimes you'll hear it called a cryptocurrency. And he thought, well, this will replace the dollar. Um, but it hasn't happened that way because the price of Bitcoin, as we've discussed, is so volatile. So you wouldn't buy something with Bitcoin when, like in a few months, it's going to like perhaps double or triple in price. So then people started talking about Bitcoin as if it were like gold. They called it like digital gold. So, in other words, you could hold your value in Bitcoin. Um, and as other things like the dollar uh devalue, your your Bitcoin would hold its value. But that hasn't worked either because, like right now, um, Bitcoin has dropped uh in value by about two-thirds over the last few months, and the price of gold has gone through the roof. So it's not really digital gold. Um, in the book, I talk about it being essentially like a high-growth technology stock. So if you think about this just as a technology, which is what it is, and you just look at this as like, okay, this is going to be an extremely volatile stock that's kind of tracking our progress toward this crypto technology taking over the global financial system. I think that's the better way to think about it. And that's a more useful model that you could then use to uh put within your investing portfolio.

SPEAKER_01 10:03

And so tokens. Is is Ethereum and XRP and are all those tokens? And is Bitcoin a token as well? Because I know that Ethereum has a use. It's actually tied to something. It's like what you call it the Microsoft of this space. So are Bitcoin and Ethereum are all of those considered tokens?

SPEAKER_00 10:25

I'm really glad you're asking these questions, Luis, because in the book we talk about thinking about these cryptos like companies. So just as like a traditional investor would look at a company like Apple, for example, and then we would look at their fundamentals, we would look at their, you know, the all of their financial statements, we'd look at the company itself, the leadership, the growth prospects, the market, et cetera. We can do the same with these cryptos. That's the basic idea behind my book. So treating cryptos like companies, then the tokens, which um are the things issued by these companies that have value, we can think of those like stocks. So cryptos are companies and tokens are stocks. Now, technically they are different, but mentally, if we use that model, it's very helpful because we can then start to analyze these crypto companies like we would analyze a traditional company. And in the book, I give a lot of frameworks and a lot of um tools to use to do that basic analysis. And then we can look at the token price, which again is like the stock price, and we can say, you know, is this overpriced or is this underpriced? Is this like a really good value? Because we think this is a strong company that's going to take over the world, and maybe their token is currently selling at one-tenth the price that it was a year ago. Well, that's a great value, and that's a great investing opportunity. So the the traditional investing idea here would be like value investing, like finding great companies at a good value that are selling at a discount. We're trying to do the same with these crypto companies.

SPEAKER_01 12:05

And that's where I had my first aha reading the book.

SPEAKER_00 12:08

So thank you for that, because that's a huge piece of the book. I think a lot of people are doing this kind of intuitively when they look at these, but nobody's ever spelled it out and said, just think about the cryptos like companies. It really helps.

SPEAKER_01 12:23

Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so mining. You know, when I first heard this, that there's miners that are mining, I thought, oh, are they actually? And they say that mining is so expensive and it uses so much electricity into that. And I thought, oh, they're actually making disks, they're making coins, but that's not the case.

SPEAKER_00 12:42

Yeah, so we're going deep into the technical now. But with Bitcoin, as I said before, it is run by this giant network of computers. And when computers are hooked up to this Bitcoin network, um, we call it mining. And the reason is uh because in the process of kind of running or supporting that network, you're also helping create new Bitcoin. Now, new Bitcoin are created on a very strictly defined schedule. So it's not like the more computers you get, the more Bitcoin is mined. But um, as you continue to add computers to the network, um, it grows more robust, more secure. In the same way, the internet is run by a giant network of computers. And the more computers that are attached to that network, obviously the better it gets. So it's a similar concept here, but the process of supporting that network um, in effect, creates these new coins. That process is called mining.

SPEAKER_01 13:43

Okay. Stable coins.

SPEAKER_00 13:47

Super important concept. So stable coins are one of the first big real use cases of crypto, where undeniably this is a movement. And the idea behind a stable coin is unlike Bitcoin, which as we said goes up and down in value, a stable coin always uh keeps a stable price. And typically um it's uh pegged to the US dollar. So if you buy uh one stable coin, essentially, uh you put in one dollar and you get one stable coin in return. And then you can redeem it by selling back your stable coin and getting one dollar back out. And the reason they're so useful is because we can put a lot of money into this new crypto ecosystem or this this uh this new system that we're building, and then you can operate within this new parallel financial world of crypto. So there's sort of a bridge, if you will, between this new crypto financial system and the traditional financial system. So uh just this year uh there was legislation passed to basically uh create a legal roadmap for stable coins to uh become uh legal and fully regulated under um the US financial laws. And that has caused an explosion of these stable coins where suddenly every bank, uh every major financial institution wants to create their own stable coin product. Um so for investors, I think what's important to know here is there's a few companies that are leading this kind of stable coin market. Um, the biggest one in the United States is called Circle or Circle Internet. That's a publicly traded company. Um, and they have uh one of the most popular stable coins on the market. It's a great company. They just released the earnings um yesterday, had a fantastic um previous quarter, and it's it's a great company. I'm personally invested in them and I think they're great.

SPEAKER_01 15:57

And I don't want to jump ahead, but the other thing about stable coins is that you can earn interest on them. Is that correct?

SPEAKER_00 16:04

Yes. Well, there's a lot of controversy around this uh legally today because the banks are really lobbying against this. So the banks obviously are resisting a lot of this push into crypto because it threatens a lot of the systems and businesses they have in place. So the banking lobby is heavily uh trying to push back on the idea that you can earn interest on stable coins. With that said, there are platforms today, such as uh Coinbase, where you can store money in stable coins and effectively earn interest. Um they call it yield, but it's essentially the same thing. It's going to put your uh money to work for you.

SPEAKER_01 16:49

And Coinbase? Well no, what is Coinbase next? This is part of the interrogation.

SPEAKER_00 16:57

Oh, yeah. So Coinbase is one of the um leading, I think of them like a crypto bank. They do much more, but they're one of the leading platforms where uh consumers like us can go in and easily invest in these new crypto assets, whether it's Bitcoin or Ethereum or stable coins or all the other things we're talking about. Uh they are um extremely reputable. Uh, they've been around for over a decade. They are also a publicly traded company, um, and they really are the leader in the US in terms of making it easy for people to come in, just everyday investors to come in um and uh invest in these various assets and do things like earn interest on them and so forth. So again, I'm oversimplifying, but you can think of them like a Bitcoin bank.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

Okay, and finally, NFTs.

SPEAKER_00 17:58

NFTs, uh so this is uh one of the weird backwaters of crypto. But NFTs stand for non-fungible tokens, which really means nothing. As I said, everybody in crypto when they name these things, they're just terrible about the naming, Louise. But an NFT is basically like a digital collectible. So if you think about like collectibles, so you think about like baseball cards or collectible wines or uh, I don't know, vintage cars, anything that people sort of collect over time that that hold their value. NFTs are kind of the digital equivalent of that. So when you buy an NFT, you're basically buying sort of a one-of-a-kind item, like you might buy a one-of-a-kind, you know, wine vintage or um, you know, collectible trading card. And you're hoping that the price of that goes up in the future so that some future collector might be willing to pay more for it. Um, NFTs, I would say, have had, again, this very volatile kind of uh hype cycle where for a few years they were all the rage, then uh things kind of cooled off. And I believe the technology behind NFTs are going to power things like um concert tickets and membership clubs and things like that in the future. So I'm very excited about the technology itself. I think these early kind of NFT experiments are just kind of fun and silly things, probably not appropriate for most investors, but useful to know uh what they are and what the technology can do.

SPEAKER_01 19:36

Didn't somebody just pay 60 some odd million dollars for a work of digital art that everybody in the world can avail themselves of, but that person owns that? I just I don't get it.

SPEAKER_00 19:47

Yeah, uh I tell the story uh in the book, yes, and it's by this artist who goes by the name of uh Beeple, and he uh created this uh magnificent work. I tell the story about it on the book. It took him um uh almost a decade to create this work. Uh and during the pandemic, when everybody had lots of uh stimulus money to um invest, uh the famous auction house Christie's put his uh NFT, this uh this masterwork um uh up for auction. And yes, it was digital, which means what the buyer was getting was essentially just like um a digital image, like a photo that anybody could get just by you know saving it uh to their computer. So there is sort of a philosophical question here about like, what are you really getting when you get this if everybody else can make like identical copies? It's not quite like owning fine art where you own the original, and lots of people can get sort of uh, you know, a replica um of the Mona Lisa, but there's only one. Um, this is something kind of different. But regardless, I think the technology, again, the technology behind it is the really exciting thing that we should watch for the future.

SPEAKER_01 21:08

So, how do you know what you have? You know, how do you keep a record of what it is that you have? You know, where is it stored? You don't get a statement, and you hear all these horror stories about people who had, you know, a million or tens of million dollars in in crypto and they lost their password or whatever it is that they need to get into their account, and that it's gone. That's the end of it.

SPEAKER_00 21:29

So yeah, so uh you hear these horror stories, uh, especially from the uh the early days, from the old timers, from the OGs who went and bought their Bitcoin the the hard way, like I did. But today there are just so many better options that are just safer and way more user friendly. So we just talked about Coinbase. I'm not getting paid to endorse Coinbase. Um, it's just one example of a really easy to use platform. Where you can go and buy this stuff and they'll store it for you. So it's very much like having an online brokerage account with e-Trade, or it's like your, you know, your online um checking account uh with your bank. And you can go in and obviously move that uh money around. Uh, you can buy new assets and so forth. They'll hold on to it for you. So uh I think the days of this being really difficult to use are kind of behind us at this point. And in the book, I talk about this: like, here's how to do this step by step using Coinbase. Uh, you know, it takes less than an hour to get your whole account set up and start um investing uh in your first crypto.

SPEAKER_01 22:44

So where do you think this is all going? Where do you think the financial institutions are going? Where do you think the government's going? Do you think that uh crypto will ever be a reserve currency?

SPEAKER_00 22:55

Yeah, I'm glad you asked because that's really the reason I wrote this book. And in part three, I lay out this vision where we basically say, you know, trust in the dollar is declining. Um we can see this uh right now with people putting more money into um gold and silver and other countries holding fewer dollars and diversifying away from the dollar. We call this trend de-dollarization. So we in the United States um enjoy this incredible privilege of having the dollar as the world's kind of default or reserve currency. And we've had that since uh the end of World War II at the Bretton Woods conference. Um, but other countries have also held the reserve currency before us. So before that, it was the British pound, and before that, the Dutch Gilder, and so on. And these things tend to have a lifespan of about 80 to 100 years. And after that, something replaces them. And generally that empire and that reserve currency kind of start a slow fade, and something else comes to take its place. Well, I paint the vision in the book that it's time for a one-world global digital currency. So, what that means is this would be one world money that all nations would use, um, all nations could enjoy, that would be built for the good of humanity and not just one country, the United States. And it's digital, which means it's built on this crypto technology we talked about. Um, and it's money. So global digital money. Now, to be clear, we could still have our US dollars or your Euros or what have you. Those would roll up, however, to this kind of supranational or uh global digital money. And in the book, I paint the picture for how we could build this in a way that truly serves humanity and it could help us, for example, get more money and more value to the people and places that need it most. So I think this is a radically new idea. Most people, when they hear this idea, don't even know what to do with it because it's so new. We just assume the dollar is the default. But I'm saying I think those days are numbered and we have the opportunity to do something much better. That's what we're really investing in, is this new vision of global digital money when we invest uh in crypto.

SPEAKER_01 25:31

Okay, great transition. So now that we understand the space better, unless you think that there's something that's vital that I have and essential that I haven't asked, how do you invest in the space? And this is what your book is all about.

SPEAKER_00 25:44

Yeah, so the first part is the system um that we actually laid out in eight years ago in my previous book, which was called Blockchain for Everyone. And the idea was just uh have an extremely diversified portfolio, let's say 60% stocks and you know, heavily diversified within stocks, maybe 30% bonds, you know, maybe like an all-bond index fund, um, and then up to 10% crypto. So if you're a crypto skeptic, maybe you just put you know 2% into Bitcoin. If you want to do a little more, you might do 2.5% in Bitcoin and maybe 2.5% in Ethereum. That's the second largest crypto. And then if you want to do more, you could do maybe up to another 5% in high quality crypto assets. And in the book, we talk about how to find those high-quality crypto companies. As uh we said, it's a lot like looking for high-quality traditional companies. So that's it, no more than 10%. Um, we recommend setting up a um a monthly withdrawal, which is uh known as uh dollar cost averaging, but we we call it steady drip investing. Again, uh a platform like Coinbase will let you do that and let you hook it up to your bank account and just make a monthly withdrawal and kind of allocate it between these different assets. And then finally, we recommend um five or more years. So having a longer-term time horizon because the nature of this stuff is it's extremely volatile. And the big mistake people make is they come in, they put their life savings into Bitcoin, and then the price crashes and then they get burned and they feel like I don't want to touch this stuff ever again. So the beauty of this approach is that it protects you from the risk because you've only got a maximum of 10% in it, but it also lets you participate in the reward. Now, since we put this plan out there eight years ago, my team and I have been tracking the performance. And to date, this simple approach, no more than 10% crypto, has outperformed traditional investors by over 65%. So that means you would have made 65% more money by following this simple plan than the traditional investor who just does a 60-40 stocks bonds with no crypto.

SPEAKER_01 28:22

And step two. You said that you want to evaluate. You've talked about how to evaluate the different the different assets. But before we get into that, your your whole um program about investing is very much based on Warren Buffett, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 28:42

Yeah, so um the story I tell in the book is of Warren Buffett's uh mentor, this guy Benjamin Graham, and Ben Graham wrote this famous book called The Intelligent Investor. And the idea at that time in the 50s, this was kind of radical, was that you could better choose stocks or stock investing by analyzing the companies behind them and looking at like their financial performance, what we call today their fundamentals, um the management team, things like that. So today this is just common sense, but back then it was it was a new idea because people bought stocks really because somebody gave them a hot tip or something like that. So Buffett really learned from um Graham. He had him as a teacher at Columbia Business School, and then uh basically pestered Graham to give him a job after graduation until Graham finally relented and said, okay, so um the two of them really pioneered this concept of what's today called value investing. So that means two things. One is we're looking at the value of these companies, again, by looking at their financial performance and so on. Um, but also we're looking at their stock price and we're trying to ask, is it a good value? In other words, is the stock price overvalued? Is it expensive, or is it undervalued? Do we think kind of people haven't caught on to how valuable this company really is, and we can kind of get it at a bargain or a discount. So with crypto companies, we're doing the same thing, and that's why I called the book the intelligent crypto investor, uh, with a nod toward the intelligent investor. Is we're now treating cryptos like companies and then tokens like stocks. And we're using some of these same frameworks that Warren Buffett and Ben Graham introduced to evaluate crypto companies and then their stocks or their tokens and saying, is this a good value? And if so, let's invest in these early while this market is still so young, and let's hold on to them for the long term.

SPEAKER_01 30:56

And what about tax implications and what about stacking?

SPEAKER_00 31:00

Yeah, there's a whole chapter in the book on taxes, and I will um give you the quick read, which is anytime you sell your crypto assets at a profit, you are going to pay taxes in one form uh or another. It's funny that the uh US government was so skeptical of crypto for so long and refused to make it legal, but they had no problems collecting taxes on it. So uh it's that selling event that generally triggers the tax. And that's another reason why in the book we really advocate for this long-term holding approach because uh as long as it's growing and you're not moving it around and you're not uh doing crazy things with it, um, it can grow uh tax-free. We also have additional tips on how to lessen the tax load when you do decide to uh to sell your crypto assets.

SPEAKER_01 32:04

And so why do you think it's taken such a deep dive recently? Why do you think that Bitcoin's taken such a deep dive? What is it based on?

SPEAKER_00 32:13

Yeah, well, it's extremely volatile. Um, and you know, my own personal story was that uh I bought this stuff, as I said early on, um, and it had this meteoric rise between 2013 when I bought it at$125, and then 2017 when it was over$10,000. Uh, and my wife and I made a giant investment in it at that time, which seemed like a really great idea um for like three months. And then the price of Bitcoin just tanked uh after that. And we almost lost everything in that uh in that very difficult, dark period that followed. But as we rebuilt um our our business and our investment portfolio in the years that followed, the one big lesson I learned was this importance of diversification. So again, if you if you go all in on crypto, um you be prepared to face a uh a really unpleasant surprise because it's still extremely young, it's extremely new, and there's this kind of roller coaster effect to it. I say in the book, like it's not a bubble, but it is bubbly. Yeah. Like you should expect these kind of waves. So the answer why it has dropped in value uh since last October when it hit an all-time new high is I don't know. And I don't care because what I'm doing is positioning for the long haul. And that's what we encourage in the book.

SPEAKER_01 33:54

Yeah. I know that that a lot of the people that I know that are in their 40s are investing and they're doing this, you know, month by month by month, and you know, it's just a little bit every month or a little bit every day or every week or whatever. And and they're investing in it because what they're saying is that this is my child's college fund. You know, they're just gonna leave it, they're gonna keep investing, they're gonna let it grow, they're gonna let it go up and down, they don't care, but they um, you know, they this is a long-term hold for them. And I don't know if you've ever done any uh demographics on this, have you ever looked at who it is that's buying this? Because if you look at people of a certain age, if they're expected to wait, I don't know if this would be as appealing to them. The thing that was appealing to me, being a woman of a certain age, is is um these um what is the coin called that's that's tied to the dollar?

unknown 34:46

Stable coin.

SPEAKER_01 34:47

Stable coin, yeah, because if you can if you've got a digital asset, because I think everything is going digitally, if you've got a digital asset and and it's safe and it's not volatile, and you can also earn interest on it, it seems to me that that would be the thing that would be the most appealing to me in this space.

SPEAKER_00 35:05

Yeah, I agree with you. I think that's uh kind of the best of of uh all worlds. But again, you know, making sure that it's well diversified within traditional assets as well. It's the old maxim, don't put all your eggs in one basket. And that is especially true with crypto.

SPEAKER_01 35:23

Yeah. So what haven't we what have not what have we not discussed here?

SPEAKER_00 35:29

This was a very wide-ranging conversation. I appreciate the breadth of your questions. I also appreciate you doing your homework and listening to the audio book. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01 35:40

Um it was fantastic.

SPEAKER_00 35:42

Thank you for the book. Yeah, thank you. Um so uh are you gonna invest? That's my question for you.

SPEAKER_01 35:48

Yes, sir. I am in stable coins. Yep.

SPEAKER_00 35:52

That's great. You're gonna spread the word?

SPEAKER_01 35:55

I am gonna I'm this is what this is all about.

SPEAKER_00 36:00

I love it.

SPEAKER_01 36:01

Yeah. Thank you so very, very much. This was lovely and wonderful, and I'm sure it's helped a whole lot of people because everybody tries to act like they know what they're talking about, or else they're intimidated. Those seems to be the two ends of the spectrum, and I think that this will clear up a lot for a lot of people. And I thank you very much.

SPEAKER_00 36:19

Louise, you're a great interviewer, and this was a wonderful conversation. Thank you so much. Thank you.