Welcome back to the Christianity and Business Podcast, an initiative of the RGW Dunham College of Business at Houston Christian University. I'm your host, Darren Scheer, and this is the show that helps Christian business leaders to integrate biblical values into business. On this episode, we're joined by Brett Harris. Brett is the best-selling co-author of Do Hard Things, a Teenage Rebellion Against Low Expectations, and also co-founder of the Young Writers Workshop in the Author Conservatory, which has trained thousands of writers in writing craft and entrepreneurship. His mission is to raise up the next C.S. Lewis and J.R.R. Tolkien and build a thriving business that glorifies God in every aspect. And somebody might hear that might, oh come on, C.S. Lewis, J.R. Tolkien. Just tell us some some of what's been going on through the author conservatory, Brett. By the way, welcome.
SPEAKER_01Oh, thank you so much, Darren. It's uh it's a joy to be here with you. And I love I love the focus of the podcast and that everyone listening is has that desire to glorify the Lord through their business and and cultivate uh a healthy and christ-honoring environment through our through our business ventures. So I just love it. I'm I'm thrilled to be here.
SPEAKER_00Yes, sir. Well, welcome, welcome. And tell us about the author conservatory and um what you've been up to.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, well, obviously, when when you hear names like Lewis and Tolkien, of course, that that feels very, very grandiose. And I think the reality is that we've recognized is that a lot of the best, most gifted storytellers uh among us and among each generation tend to do other things because writing and storytelling uh has a reputation of not being something that you can make a living doing. You know, you're you're gonna be a starving artist, you're gonna be under the bridge, you know, burning unsold copies of your book to stay, stay warm at night. And so there's this there's this impression, there's this opinion, uh oftentimes based on people we know that have tried and failed, or even our own attempts, uh, that this just doesn't work. And so the best and brightest, the storytellers who could be that next Lewis, could be that next Tolkien, um, they go to do smarter things, things that will pay the bills. And so our vision with the Author Conservatory and our high school program, the Young Writers Workshop, is to reach the next generation and not only train them in the highest levels of writing craft and story craft, help have them work with professional editors and best-selling award-winning authors so they're really getting the writing side, but also to teach them business and entrepreneurship so they know how to build a career around their writing, so they know how to sell books, they know how to make this financially viable, so that more of our most gifted young people are actually going into this area of storytelling and book writing that has such deep impact as we've seen through people like C.S. Lewis and J.R. R. Tolkien. And then the last tie-in to Tolkien and Lewis is just the fact that they did this in community. They did this through their group of writers, the Inklings, they met together. You know, Tolkien says he would never have finished The Lord of the Rings if it wasn't for Lewis getting on him and saying, Hey, you know, are you are you making progress? Read, you know, I want to read some more of what you've written. Keep going, don't give up. And so providing that sort of community for young writers where they're able to have support, they're have each other, they have mentorship, and then they're learning writing and business together.
SPEAKER_00And how important is the art of storytelling for shaping culture?
SPEAKER_01I mean, I I honestly think it's one of the most powerful ways that we shape culture. I mean, story shapes culture, and culture shapes everything else. I I remember being in college at a school outside of Washington, D.C., as a very politically focused school. And we had a senior aide to the president of the United States. This was, you know, he'd been an aide to President George W. Bush. And he came in, and his whole message in Chapel was politics is downstream from culture. And, you know, that was such a powerful thing for us to hear as young people who were in a politically focused school and who, many of whom would go on to serve in the White House, serve in the halls of Congress, serve in the strategic intelligence community, and yet to hear this sense that from someone who's been at the very top, you know, politics is downstream from culture. And so when I think about what shapes culture, I think about the stories we tell. And I mean, so much of what we think of when we think of culture, we think of entertainment, we think of, you know, television shows and movies and books, these are stories. And then, of course, you look at how business and even political campaigns use the power of story to craft a clear message. I'm sure many of our listeners, your listeners are familiar with Donald Miller and his story brand framework for branding and messaging. Well, that's the power of story in business. It's the power of story, you know, it's been used in political campaigns as well. So I think storytelling is a sense-making device. It is one of the ways we are wired to understand information, and it's one of the ways that we are shaped and our values, our principles. Um, it's like you get life experience just from reading some uh story. You get you get to learn from the character. You get to learn about the consequences of decisions. You get to see the big picture when in your life you're stuck, you know, you're stuck in the present. You don't get to see how it all plays out. And so I think stories are one of the ways that we can shape culture, shape our ourselves, form ourselves. Uh, and the kinds of stories we're exposing ourselves to are going to have a big, make a big difference in the kind of people we become.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And we usually focus on scripture on this show, which which we will, but I will say that there is an a very popular atheist author out there right now. And one of the things that he's noted is saying is that what has made humanity different from apes and from you know uh the rest of the animal kingdom and has allowed us to achieve the the success that we've had um as humans, he's saying, is the ability to tell stories. He basically boils it all the way down to to that. And I mean, there's there's a lot, I think, wrong with his starting point for sure, but there is so much truth to just the significance of narrative and and being able to influence, I mean, to can you know it's I guess pejoratively referred to as controlling the narrative. And um, but it's we're still talking about story, right? I mean, that's the gospel itself is a story.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I was gonna say, let's take it, let's take it back to scripture. How much of scripture is narrative? How much of scripture is story? How did Jesus teach through parables? So yeah, it's I think it's one of the most powerful ways we have to shape ourselves and shape others and shape culture. And we see that in scripture and we see Jesus using it as well.
SPEAKER_00100%. Brett, when did you first realize God wanted to be involved in your work and business?
SPEAKER_01Well, I was blessed to grow up in a Christian home, a strong Christian home with parents who loved the Lord, uh, with parents who were very entrepreneurial. And my my father um started businesses, started organizations, was a pioneer in the Christian homeschooling movement, uh pastored, you know, founded and pastored a church. And so I was always seeing my parents and my dad uh doing things, starting their own things, building their own things. And so I would say I it was never, it was it was never a question of is God involved in business? You know, I always knew that he was, I always knew that he should be because that was modeled for me. And so, you know, for all of uh all of your listeners who in the various ways are involved in business and in trying to bring God into their into their careers, into their business ventures, and you have kids. Well, you're modeling that. And and for me, I I think I just grew up seeing that uh my whole life. I think, in terms of a real turning point with my own business uh in my late 20s, been in business for a few years, my wife and I read Randy Alcorn's book, Money, Possessions and Eternity, which you know, anyone and I would just recommend so highly to any Christian, if you want to understand how scripture and how being a Christian gets into the nitty-gritty of everyday life, which you know, there's not a lot in life that doesn't involve money or possessions. There's not a lot of big decisions we make that don't involve, you know, money and possessions. And so when you start to apply God's word to how you handle all of that, it's like this is real. Like this is a whole life commitment. This is this is a transformative to be a Christian in business, to be a Christian steward of my finances and my possessions. It's it's a whole thing, you know. And I remember reading that book together, we read it aloud, and it felt like you know, being born again, all over again, in the sense of wow, we're there's so much more to this Christian life than we thought. There's so much more excitement. And and so that that was probably, I'd say, one of the biggest turning points of recognizing I want my business to be a vehicle for stewardship. I want business to be a vehicle for us to be able to invest more of our income into God's kingdom. And yeah, and just re recognizing that having an internal perspective, thinking not just five years, 10 years, 100 years down the line, what's a smart decision, what's a wise investment, thinking a thousand, a million years down the line, what's a smart investment? It's a totally different time frame, a totally different decision matrix. And that was probably the biggest turning point for me.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. That book again is uh Randy Alcorn's Money, Possessions, and Eternity. Brett, what's one of the habits that helps you become more Christ-centered in your approach to business?
SPEAKER_01I think one of the most helpful things that I've done is to read pro read Proverbs uh every day. And Book of Proverbs, it's just it's wisdom. It's especially wisdom for young people, it says, but you know, we we all we all need wisdom even as we get older, and maybe we need it more. Uh, the more responsibility we have, the more other people's lives were we have some impact and influence on. And so the book of Proverbs is 31 chapters, which makes it perfect for reading a chapter a day, you know, every day of the month, and and just doing that on repeat. And I found that reading and meditating on Proverbs, which is filled with so much direct wisdom, many of which is very specific to money and business and and all of those sorts of things, leadership. Um, I would have those proverbs come to mind as I was facing a decision, as I was having to think about how to respond to this, how do I um deal with this situation, how do I engage with an employee or a student or or a partner. Um, I've just found that proverbs would come to mind. And I'm just so grateful for that. So that's a practice I always recommend and try to um, I don't, I'm not perfectly consistent with it, but it's probably been over the years, you know, four to six times that I've just started that daily, monthly routine. And every time it's it's just kind of impressed on me deeper.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Proverbs, 31, 31 days, 31 chapters. That's so good. And that's a habit that gets mentioned repeatedly, as you can imagine. So taking it beyond your personal habits, what's a habit that you really try to instill in your organization as a whole uh to help the culture and the operations of your company be more Christ-centered?
SPEAKER_01I love that question. I think that I what I love about it is that you're focused on habits, you know, because habits shape us, routines, ritual shapes us. And so the the habits that we instill within our companies, within our teams, you know, shapes us as people, but also shapes us as a as an organization. I I think that some of the things that we've tried to do, of course, is is prayer. Um we like to do student and employee headlines where we we honor um what is good and true and and beautiful in our student body, in our team, you know, shout out people for for what uh they're doing, um, ways they're being helpful, ways they're being exemplary. And then uh really emphasizing rest and and being healthy uh holistically. So modeling as leaders, modeling uh not a workaholism, not a productivity is next to godliness mentality, but being able to advocate for margin for rest. I love the book Essentialism by Greg McGowan. If you haven't read that book, everyone should get it. Makes a very compelling argument that uh less but better is a much better way to live and lead an organization than the the more is better uh paradigm that's so common here, especially in the United States. And so I think those are some of the big ones. I think the the cardinal virtue that I hope to uh model and and encourage in my team is humility. And that includes just always being open to feedback, being open to learn from anyone, even you know, someone at the bottom of the organization, even you know, learning from our students, listening genuinely listening to others. And so if we can be humble, if we can encourage one another and honor one another, if we can uh pray together, and if we can model a healthy, balanced way of life that allows us to be healthy in a holistic way and then bring our best to our work, I think that's that's the ideal. And of course, we are not perfect in that, but those are some of the things that are really important to me to try to cultivate in our company.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Well, one of the things you and I, Brett, have in common is that we both work with authors, um, albeit at very different stages of life. Um so you're discipling authors, and we get that sense too, as we're as we're working with authors, that you're helping them to craft their message. This is an aspect of discipleship and helping them to grow in their Christian walk and to learn how to communicate more effectively. Um, and and I assume that not all of the books that are being written by your students are necessarily um uh, you know, shall we say, Christian, Christian living books, you know, or they're they might even have some some edgy, edgy stuff in it. Like, how do you navigate that when you know this is this is uh uh you're trying to do this for the glory of God, but if you end up producing authors that are writing things that are uh even counter to uh to biblical values, like how how do you how do you handle that?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Well, I think I think there's the question of to what extent can you really control another person? And is it is it healthy to try to do that? Um we we do have guidelines of what we will work with within our programs with our students. And so we have we can have healthy boundaries and and try to have God honor and boundaries of what we will what we are equipped to work on with with students while they're in our program. And so I'm not saying anything goes, but at the same time to to try to you know, to try to control or to feel responsible for what someone might publish 20 years after they graduate from uh our program, I just I don't know if that's a burden I want to I want to carry or need to carry. I think it's it's similar to a parent, you know, to what extent are you responsible? And I mean, I'll just say this. This is something I've talked about with my own dad and uh we've experienced in our own family. You know, to what extent is a parent responsible for decisions that a grown child makes, you know, 20, 30 years after they left the home? And the answer is, you know, I don't think there's a lot of responsibility the parent needs to needs to carry for that. Obviously, you want to uh raise your children and guide them in the way they should go. We want to raise our our students and disciple them in the way that in a direction we believe is healthy and God honoring. But at the end of the day, yeah, there's there's going to be students who are trying to honor God and impact people for his glory and might attempt to do that in a way I wouldn't, I wouldn't personally do. Uh, they might include something in their story that I wouldn't include in a in a novel that I wrote. Or, you know, if they're writing nonfiction, they may, you know, have opinions that I don't have. And and that's okay. I I want any of my students who ever listen to this interview to know, you know, I support them and I believe in them. And if they are trying to glorify God and serve him and serve uh his people and and serve people outside the church through their writing, that um I'm praying for them and I'm proud of them if that's their heart. And even if they go about it in a way I wouldn't, um I still I'm still proud of them.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Yeah. And we have a bit of a different situation because we're a publishing company, and so our imprint is actually going on the things that we publish. Not that we have to necessarily agree with everything that's that's said in the book, but that that the redemptive value is there, you know, and and I guess one of the more And I think as a publisher, that's a that is a different relationship with with a with an author.
SPEAKER_01You know, if you are if you are publishing a book, that's a different relationship than if you are training someone in the skills to write a book, and then they later write and publish a book um that you might not have you know, yeah you might not have written or published.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Well, what might one of those conversations sound like though when you're trying to, you know, let's say you're working with a high school kid that is uh, you know, sort of drifting out into some dangerous territory, um, and they're you know, like how how do you how do you help that young person?
SPEAKER_01I mean it's it would depend so much on the on the situation and the student and what's behind that for them and and why. So I wouldn't give any sort of one size fits all. Here's how a conversation would go. Um, in terms of just general from a teaching and coaching perspective, you know, our our our philosophy is that before you go off and try to compose a Bach concerto, you need to play Twinkle Twinkle Little Star and Make Me Cry. You know, so we are a we are a fundamentals first program. We want to, we want our students to know how to tell a sound structure, you know, structurally sound, powerful story. And a lot of the kind of more complex elements, the more complicated and nuanced uh thematic elements, these are things that it's it's not just that they could be morally problematic, um, but from our from a teaching perspective, it's like it's like trying to, you know, if you're a ballet dancer, it's like trying to go up on point, you know, go up on your on your point shoes uh before you've established the proper placement and strength in your legs and hips to avoid injury. Um or if you're an athlete, it's like, you know, I want to be Steph Curry and the NBA, and I'm gonna start shooting, you know, shots from half court instead of learning proper form and fundamentals of, you know, first, you know, so that I can then safely and accurately shoot from further and further away from the basketball hoop. So, you know, we take the approach of let's let's learn how to do the fundamentals first. You never outgrow the fundamentals. You know, the greatest people in every field are always practicing and going back to the fundamentals and they they have that sort of mentality. So a lot of these things, especially when we're working with a student, we're simply we would simply advise them hey, you don't start there. You know, we're we're We're helping you towards being able to tackle these more difficult topics, these heavier themes. But let's not start there because that's not the best way to learn. It's biting off more than you can chew in most cases. It's it's like trying to learn how to drive for the first time, merging onto the freeway instead of in a big empty parking lot. You know, like there's steps between where you where you where you start from and where you want to go eventually. And for us as teachers, we want to help our students step by step build the strength, build and stack the skills while also they're growing in wisdom, they're growing in maturity, godliness, et cetera, uh, to then be able to handle some of these more um sensitive things well. But we we would say we would say in most cases, hey, let's let's build towards that. And again, I just think that's the way good teaching happens in any any area, whether it's dance, whether it's athletics, whether it's law or medicine or any industry, any field, you know, there's prerequisites. You have to know this first before you can do this. You don't get to go straight to doing brain surgery, you know. Um, so let's let's work towards it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. And, you know, so much of discipleship isn't about telling them, hey, you know, you shouldn't be writing about this, hey, you should be writing about this, or and like kind of bossing them around. But like Paul said, imitate me as I imitate Christ. So this is a common theme on this show as it relates to making disciples in a workplace environment where it's not you're not standing behind a pulpit where people are expecting you to tell them what to do and what not to do and all that. Uh, but the the coaches and the instructors that you appoint, I mean, the you know, the scriptural principle is when a student is fully trained, he will become like his teacher. And so as they see what their coach and instructor, you know, how they communicate, how they uh how they seem to behave, how they seem to talk, um, I mean, that is I mean, that's the most powerful influence right there, right? Wouldn't would you agree with that?
SPEAKER_01Absolutely, absolutely, because I I love the there's a principle or truism that we're constantly becoming the average of the five people we're closest to.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I just I think that when we surround ourselves with people who are wiser, godlier, um, more humble, more loving, I mean, just all of these things than we are, uh, it shapes us. Uh, and and so we're trying to create an environment in our programs where our students through the, you know, through the instructors and coaches, but also through the student body, the other people they're you know engaging with, uh, that they are they are being drawn upwards, right? They're being drawn further up and further in towards um towards godliness and and holiness. I, you know, we we like to to say our our goal is not first uh foremost that you're going to be a best-selling author, though many of our students will will do that, and several of them already have achieved that even in a few years. But our ultimate goal is that they would become stronger, healthier, happier, more confident versions of themselves. And and from that healthier place, you know, of course, there's going to be impact, there's going to be fruit that that grows from it. But it starts with just, you know, it starts with just being formed and discipleship is the word we would use for it. So many of our, so what I can't tell you how many times we're interviewing someone for a new position or we're talking to existing, you know, current employees about what they love about their job, and that that word comes up. It's discipleship. We all we all love that we're getting to be part of our students' lives and hopefully by the grace of God, you know, with his help, that we can be a positive example that is helping them to follow Christ. You know, uh, I definitely don't don't feel like we can be on that level with St. Paul of uh follow me as I follow Christ, but absolutely, um, absolutely want to be to be an example.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And you are, you are, you guys are doing it. Uh, I mean, and there's no more significant area and life skill to disciple somebody in um than storytelling. I mean, I'm a I'm a firm believer in that. Authorconservatory.com is the website. Uh, Brett, what do you want to say to people about how they can learn more about what you're doing and who might be a fit for um coming into one of your programs?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, thank you so much. Um, Authorconservatory.com has has a lot of the information you're gonna need, including a few a full syllabus uh tuition guide. We've got a detailed breakdown of just our approach and the model of how we teach. And the easiest way to find out more and explore it is to fill out a short five-minute application and schedule an admissions call. We have a wonderful admissions team. Several members are students and graduates of the program, so they can speak to it directly from their own experience and their own love for the experience that they had. And you just get to ask questions, you get to find out more, and that's just an opportunity for us to talk, talk, you know, for you to talk directly with someone, a real person, um, about your goals, you know, or if you're a parent, your student's goals, and then you know, we can go from there. We really do work with serious writers who want to pursue this as a career. And we are looking for students who have demonstrated a self-motivation and a consistency in their writing before we would invite them to enroll. We're currently accepting one out of four applicants and in terms of offering enrollment. And so, you know, three out of four, we're being told you're not quite ready yet. But even if that's the answer, we're gonna tell you here's what you can be working on, here's the areas we see that you could shore up and put yourself in a better position either to reapply and potentially get accepted in the future, or just to keep moving forward and making better progress in your on your writing on your own. Um, and so that would be the easiest way to learn more and kind of explore the conservatory, would be through uh uh an application and admissions call. For those who are not yet career focused, but who do love writing and want more mentorship, community support, um, our Young Writers Workshop program, which you can find at theyoungwriter.com, uh, is a great place to start. Um, and is we have free resources available on theyoungwriter.com, a writer score quiz that students can take, a parents guide to giving feedback on your child's writing that you can download. And then we have our workshop program, which opens for enrollment a few times a year, and we have scholarships and a lot of um ways that we can try to make it uh financially uh viable for families in all sorts of situations. We love to give scholarships to missionary families or families who are living on some ministry support, who are dealing with unemployment, underemployment, medical bills. Um, and so the Young Writers Workshop can be a great entry place, and you get a lot of the kind of teaching and support. Um, but the conservatory is our real um highest end, most career focused, where you're getting the mentorship from award-winning authors, professional editors, and you're learning entrepreneurship and the business skills from successful uh entrepreneurs who've built their own companies and now want to invest in the next generation. So that's that's the high-end program, and uh that's the application-only, invitation-only program.
SPEAKER_00Well, Brett, I just commend you and celebrate the work that you're doing through the Author Conservatory and the uh the Young Writers Workshop. It's it's so critically important for uh for God's people and for any any culture uh to be able to grow in this this valuable skill. Um and you're not stopping at the writing, but also the business aspect. Um, I mean, I majored in English in college, and I mean, you're gonna end up just writing papers anyway, um, with pretty little focus, more focus on the literature than the actual writing. Um, so what I mean, it it sounds like it would be uh I would have benefited more from just really concentrating on the writing and the business of writing, which of course the business of anything, you can transfer that into maybe writing ends up not really being uh your thing as a primary profession, but you're gonna be writing in any profession. It just sounds like uh such a such a valuable program. Uh love what you're doing, Brett. And really thank you so much for sharing with our listeners today. Um, this has been a valuable, valuable piece of content for our listeners. Authorconservatory.com is the website. Um, Brett, thank you so much for your time today.
SPEAKER_01Oh, thank thank you, Darren. This was a real fun conversation to have. And again, thank you, everyone, for listening. May the Lord bless you as you continue to uh serve him, serve his people, serve your team and your organization. And yeah, I would love to uh connect with any of you if you have a young person in your life who loves writing and would like to get support and mentorship in pursuing it.
SPEAKER_00We hope you've enjoyed this episode. And if so, we would greatly appreciate it if you'd leave us a quick rating and review for the Christianity and Business podcast on iTunes. You can get more information about HCU's Center for Christianity and Business and sign up to receive free access to all issues of the Christian Business Review Journal by visiting our website at Christianityandbusiness.com. Thanks for listening, and remember to keep integrating biblical values into your business.