Welcome back to the Christianity and Business Podcast, an initiative of the RCW Dunham College of Business at Houston Baptist University. I'm your host, Darren Sheer, and this is the show that helps Christian business leaders to integrate biblical values into business. On this episode, we're joined by my friend Henry Kasener. Henry is the co-founder of Bandwidth and a managing principal in Sovereign's Capital, a venture capital management company that invests over $100 million in faith-driven entrepreneurs in Southeast Asia and the U.S. from its offices in Silicon Valley, Washington, DC, and Jakarta, Indonesia. And he's the host of the very popular Faith-Driven Entrepreneur podcast and co-author of the new book, Faith-Driven Entrepreneur: What It Takes to Step Into Your Purpose and Pursue Your God-given Call to Create. And that book is now at the time of this podcast, is going to be released by the time you all are hearing it. So head on over, get a copy of the book. FaithdrivenOntrepreneur.com is the website. We'll I'll remind you that again here shortly. Henry, welcome to the show.
SPEAKER_01Aaron, thank you for having me. It's a great joy to be with you. And I should mention, thank you for thank you for for plugging the book. That's awesome. Um, more relevant than me being on it, I think, is the fact that we've got a Ford by Lecrae, which my kids think makes me a little bit more culturally relevant. And then I've I'm just one of three co-authors. I've got JD Greer, who's president of the Southern Baptist Convention, and then um Chip Ingram are my other co-authors. And um just uh really excited to be able to write down some of the things that we've seen God do in the marketplace through entrepreneurs.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well, that's exciting. You know, knowing that um like such a large denomination is getting on board with what God is doing in the marketplace from the highest level. Um, you know, a lot of what I hear going on in the faith and work movement is people kind of pulling their teeth trying to get pastors on board. Um, but here's the president. Um, what what what's going on there? How did all that transpire?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's a great question. Well, JD, um, as so many uh pastors understands the role of a faith-driven entrepreneur in the marketplace and in God's uh God's kingdom. And uh I've known JD for I don't know, 12 or 13 or maybe more years now. And uh he's been a good friend and encouragement to me. And uh we uh had been talking for a while about the fact that we didn't know of a pastor who had done a sermon on fate-driven entrepreneurship, talking to business owners and faith-driven entrepreneurs. And we've been talking about having him do a sermon series on faith-driven entrepreneurship. And I came back and said, you know, actually, let's do this instead. Let's put together a eight-week series that explores the unifying values. We call them the marks of a faith-driven entrepreneur. And I'll provide some teaching on that and let's do that together. And that worked really well with something that's called an FDE group. At Faith Driven Entrepreneur, we have these groups that get together virtually or in person. It goes through, it's a video uh story, very well produced by the guys from Seattle Pacific. Faith and Company is the is the name they make all their stuff under. And it's a three-minute vignette of a faith-driven entrepreneur that's working out something, a challenge that they have with culture or with selling or finance or something like that. And then JD provides this Bible teaching, and that's been received super well all around the world, this eight-week class. And then we said, well, what does it look like for us to go ahead and put together a book out of that? And Chip Ingram, um, who's a pastor who's got some great distribution and a great following, great author, um, uh, has been my pastor and a great friend um uh uh out here. And and he's been a frequent guest on the Fate Driven Entrepreneur Podcast. So three of us got together and said, you know, what does it look like to work on a book together? And and uh that's how it came about.
SPEAKER_02Beautiful. So the book is on the the intersection of entrepreneurship really and the gospel. What does entrepreneurship have to do with the gospel?
SPEAKER_01Wow, so that's a that's a that's a great question. Um uh maybe I'd even flip it around a little bit. You know, what does the gospel have to do with entrepreneurship? And I think that um part of it depends on our definition of the gospel. Um the gospel holistically, and maybe I'll take a bigger picture of it, which is um the good news that God's kingdom is advancing. Jesus came in to announce the year of the Lord's favor and the fact that God's kingdom was advancing. And of course, the the greatest news of all is there's a God who loves us and who sent his son to die for us to reconcile us to him. Um, entrepreneurship, uh, fate trade entrepreneurship touches on all aspects of that gospel message. Um, first, uh, business owners and entrepreneurs, and it's not just business owners and entrepreneurs, and yet that's the space that I feel called to, um, are called to create. They're called to create, they're called to redeem and restore all things. They're called to be really a participant in the work that God is doing as he brings about his kingdom on earth as it is in heaven, as we pray every day in the hour of Father. And um, we are oftentimes his instruments for that as we find problems in the marketplace, as we see things that are broken that might be redeemed and restored. Well, we're part of that. We can be the hands and feet, bringing light into the world through the giftings that we have as entrepreneurs and business owners, and really leaning into this call, if you will, to create. We're creating the image of his creative God. We know that he did his work in creation, but the gospel of John says that his work continues to this day. Okay, so that's much different than other gods of of other um of history and of other civilizations and other cultures. I mean, our is our working God. Um, and uh, and and then his and his work continues to this day. Well, we're participants in that. So uh the gospel has a lot to do with that. The other thing that happens um in the life of an entrepreneur is that the gospel part that includes the fact there's a God who loves us unconditionally and sent his son to die for us to bring us closer to him, is um really the source and the power for an entrepreneur. And uh I mentioned that because it's really important. Entrepreneurs, as so many Christ followers have, entrepreneurs, especially, I would submit, have an identity problem. And the identity is um is gosh, I'm a business owner and entrepreneur, and I'm growing at 20% month over month, or I'm shrinking at 20% month over month, or I'm responsible for this culture and I've got to make things happen under my own power. And the identity of an entrepreneur can get pretty wrapped up pretty quickly in what they do. And that's the case for so many different professions, but I know it especially with the fate driven entrepreneur. In addition to that, the fate driven entrepreneur, being the leader person responsible for vision and culture, is always selling something to somebody. They're selling something, of course, to customers, but they're selling things to, they're selling to vendors. They're selling the concept to people who might invest money, they're selling to employees that might join their team. Sometimes they're selling to employees to not leave the team. Then they get home from work and their spouse is there to welcome them and say, How to go to work today, honey? And and they they are tempted to say, it went great, right? Because their spouse thinks they never should have left that job at Nortel or at IBM or fill in the blanks. And so an entrepreneur journey can be really, really lonely. And you need to, if you find yourself kind of justifying your own existence through uh what you end up doing in your work. And that's the the big challenge where if we're not careful, um, the gospel might not permeate the life of a faith-troven entrepreneur. What we try to do as a ministry is to encourage faith-troven entrepreneurs to first and foremost to understand that their identity is in Christ. And that when God looks at us, he doesn't see this entrepreneur growing at 20% month over month. God took five loaves and two fish and fed 5,000. He doesn't need our business to succeed to advance his kingdom. He wants our business and what we do to be a mechanism that we are drawn closer to him and others are as well. And so we need to understand that um whether we're growing again at 20% month over month or we're shrinking, we are a beloved child of God. And when he sees us, he doesn't see that entrepreneur, he sees his son. And that's that's another way that the gospel really impacts, where the gospel and entrepreneurship can collide in a beautiful way. And all too often that doesn't happen as entrepreneurs compartmentalize what they do. Yeah, and that's why we that's why we exist.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And there are many titles out there for Christian entrepreneurs, Christ-centered entrepreneurs, kingdom entrepreneurs. I think uh the last time we talked about this, you you were, I don't think faith-driven entrepreneur had kind of come on the scene at that point. You were talking about um Christ-led entrepreneurs. And um how did you land on this term faith-driven entrepreneur and and and the nuance of it?
SPEAKER_01Uh that's a great question. Um, so I I remember where I was when it came to me. It came to me, I was getting ready for to go to a breakfast with a guy who became my co-host at Faith Driven Entrepreneur on our podcast, Rusty Roof. And uh, we're gonna be talking about what the name of the podcast would be. And I believe it was from God that um uh he'd wanted to name it something different. And I really felt a sense of conviction that needed to be faith-driven, and that um we do a lot of work in um Muslim majority countries. And uh I wanted to have uh language that was uh was inclusive and yet also unapologetically, as people kind of came into the movement to understand that we're driven by our Christian faith. Um, there are terms that are used in the kingdom of God, like kingdom, that can be misconstrued and are we know in our Christian circle, we know what it means, but it can be off-putting to others. Uh, I don't have any issue with the term kingdom entrepreneur. And yet some people from different cultures do. Um uh Christian-led, I think, is um is is great, but I think that there's also something that becomes almost seeker-friendly and inclusive about faith-driven, which means, am I driven by my faith? What does that mean for me? Well, what is my faith? It promotes the just by virtue of the title, I think that it promotes some level of a question about, well, what am I driven by? Am I driven by my faith? You know, Tim Keller is somebody that I that that I listen to probably more than anybody else. He talks about everybody has a faith system. Everybody has a belief system. Well, what is it that drives you? And um, as people investigate that and are drawn into it, I think that they very quickly they find out that we in our network and our community are driven by our Christian faith. And so belief that that God sent his son to die for us, and we have a this role to play again in advancing his kingdom on earth as it is in heaven. And it's that faith and that belief in this God who loves us that drives us. But um uh and some people come back and say, Well, we don't really like the word driven, right? Or driven by something. And maybe that's uh an issue. Um, but it's uh it's it's inclusive, it's welcoming in uh in in different cultures, it's not as offensive. Um, and yet uh we want to make sure that we're also unapologetically Christ-centered in all of our teaching. You can't spend more than a minute on anything that we do at Faith Driven Entrepreneurial and I don't understand what faith is that drives us. But there's something in it that I've always liked in terms of just adds it just promotes this question of like, well, what is my faith that drives me?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And and I'm glad you brought that up about uh other cultures, uh, because I think that that was one of the things that we talked about last time, how a lot of the investing that you're doing through Sovereign Capital is happening over in uh Indonesia, which is the largest Muslim country in the world. Um how how is the faith-driven entrepreneur message movement, how would you contrast that with what it kind of looks like in the United States, for example? Like, is there a is there a great hunger there, like in a in a Muslim, predominantly Muslim nation like Indonesia?
SPEAKER_01Oh, there's I think there's a great hunger in every culture and every civilization around the world to to find truth. And I think that um I think that Indonesia is no exception to that. I think that um when um I think that they're unique aspects to somebody who's driven by a Buddhist faith or by a Muslim faith or by a Christian faith. I think that there's something really special for an entrepreneur that is Christian in Indonesia, and so many are. Um, maybe the majority of businesses in Indonesia are are owned by Christians. Um uh that there's something unique about a uh a faith-driven entrepreneur who's driven by their Christian faith that gives them a sense of purpose and blessing that I would suggest is unique because uh it comes out of a place out of gratitude. You know, it's Jesus God humbled himself to become and uh to become human, to suffer incredible, incredible pain, to reconcile us to himself. And I think that the Christian faith is unique in that it allows the Christian entrepreneur to be able to respond out of gratitude for that incredible reality and that incredible gift by bringing all that they are to the altar, not out of a sense of obligation or a sense that you're gonna be beaten with many blows, but out of a sense of gratitude that that that begets joy. And that joy is really winsome in the marketplace. It's very helpful when you're um bringing on board customers or when you're bringing on employees. And so I think that um I think that the Christian entrepreneurial community in Indonesia welcomes that. And I think that for people that have other faiths in um in Indonesia, they'll come to a faith-driven entrepreneurial event and find out very, very quickly that's focused on the Christian faith. Um, but um hopefully it creates a uh question for them about well, am I driven by my faith? What is my faith and what does that look like? And um, but again, there's a there's a universal appeal, I think, to understanding that we shouldn't check our faith at the door. We should bring our whole selves to work and that um why we do what we do is uh more important than what we do or how we do it. You know, Simon Sinek has got that TED.com video, which is the second most watched TED.com video, I think, about the why of leadership. And when uh a Christ-following leader can get up in front of their staff and talk about their personal story about why they started this business, it is universally well received. Uh, what's not universally well received is when you suggest that that needs to be their faith story. But sharing our faith story and why we do what we do has been long proven to be very effective for people who would follow us. And it's, you know, the Simon Sinek video is through the lens of Apple and then of the Wright brothers. I think that that's really operative in the life of a faith-driven entrepreneur to be able to talk about the fact that they are driven by a faith, it's part of their origin story. Again, not suggesting it needs to be the story of the person that's listening to that story, but people want to be, especially with this newer generation, people want to be a part of something that's bigger than just the manufacture and distribution of widgets. And if we as Christ followers can't be articulate with why we do what we do, out of the sense, hopefully, of gratitude for the gift given us, we're at a disadvantage to some of the other great entrepreneurs that are out there that can talk with some level of fluency about wanting to redeem the wholesale food chain or wanting to create technology with beautiful form and function. If as Christians, we don't talk about um our faith and the why what we do out of the sense of gratitude with a sense of conviction and integrity and authenticity, then we're missing it. We're at a disadvantage almost automatically to those that can talk about the fact that their God is creation or their God is redeeming the wholesale food chain. And I think that that dissonance is picked up by our employees and those when we try to talk about why we do what we do without including the biggest part of why we do what we do, which again is hopefully out of the sense that we've been called to create, we've got this identity in Christ. We're able to come in grateful for that. If we can talk about that winsomely with gentleness and respect, as we see in First Peter, I think that that gives us, puts us back in the place where we're at an advantage to our secular counterparts. But if we don't include that and we leave that half of the story out that really motivates us and we leave that out of the equation, I think we're at a disadvantage.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And as as you share in the the video series and and I'm sure in the book as well, which I think is largely based on the video series, from what I can tell, um, the the actions, the deeds really flow out of your identity as a as a as a believer. Um so what are in practice, what are the distinguishing characteristics between a faith-driven entrepreneurial and all other types of entrepreneurs? Because you've you've really studied this firsthand in some pretty high-stakes um situations where you're you're investing in faith-driven entrepreneur and you you've you've seen uh a lot of the the behaviors. Um, what are the really the hallmarks that you look for to really assess the fruit on the tree? You know, is this somebody who is truly a faith-driven entrepreneur? Um, what what are some of those behaviors?
SPEAKER_01Well, a couple of ways to answer that. Um, one of them is of course, there's the fruit of the spirit. It's the things that just exude from a Christ follower's life that are winsome. It's things like it's patience and it's love and it's humility. Um, it's uh there's a uh there's a winsomeness about somebody who is driven by their faith. We're all sinners and falling way short of the glory of God. And yet there's something special about that. Um, and I think there's almost a Christian version of the level five leader that Jim Collins talks about in his book, Good to Great. Um, we'd like that we we believe that there are marks of a faith-driven entrepreneur that um entrepreneurs um can lean into, all within this kind of macro thing. You know, at sovereign's capital, we invest in faith-driven entrepreneurs and we do that in lower to middle market businesses. So we do some venture capital, but increasingly more in the lower to middle market space on the private equity side. And in each case, the man or woman that we invest in wants to run their business for the glory of God. And some of them have a great idea of exactly what that looks like. It's all written down, all their employees know it, and they're off to the races and they're looking for a capital partner that gets that. In other cases, they're like, I am a Christ follower, I'm driven by my Christian faith. I want to run my business to the glory of God, but I'm not even really sure how to do it. And I bet you that even half of my employees don't even know I'm a Christian. Um, all of those make up, but I have an intentionality to do that, right? All of those would make up what uh what we would look at if at sovereign's capital or other funds that are in the space. And a fate-driven investor would uh that's a movement and a ministry talking about building up the entire industry and the entire movement of fate-driven investments. And there are 30 or 40 different funds now that are like that. So it's just not about sovereigns. But my experience is most directly with sovereigns. Um the uh, but we do look for characteristics, shared characteristics, and we try to reinforce them both in our own lives and then also in the lives of those that we minister to through the ministry, which are now thousands of entrepreneurs all around the world. I think we have listeners in a hundred, well, this is my vanity metric, but you know, listening to more than I guess 145 or so countries around the world, Christian entrepreneurs listening to this, which is, I think, super cool. Here are the marks. Um, one is a call to create, the fact that God is calling us to advance his kingdom and we get a chance to participate in it and commune with the living God as he's redeeming and restoring all things. That's that's that's it, that's a formative mark. The next one is we talked about his identity in Christ. Uh, we talk a lot about um, which we've already talked about, uh the some of the things we haven't yet talked about are the concept of endeavoring to be faithful versus willful. Entrepreneurs are famous for being willful. The majority of mistakes that I've made in my entrepreneurial life come back from seasons in which I was willful rather than faithful, trying to make things happen under my own power. I was reading Oswald Chambers last night with my boys, and he talked about this concept about um praying and talking about common sense versus supernatural sense. And effectively, It's the supernatural sense in praying and making decisions comes from just understanding that Christ resides in us. And as we as we uh ask the Father for direction on things, Christ is interceding on behalf of us for those things. And that's that's a really important concept. And another way to look at that from scripture is 2 Chronicles. He talks about in the second part of 2 Chronicles is looking at the good kings and the bad kings of Judah. Okay, so it's pretty easy. Don't do the things the bad kings did. But also don't do the things that each of the good kings did. Every one of them made a mistake, which was not seeking God out at a critical juncture in their life. For some of them, it was a trade deal. For some of them, it was going off into war. But they were working off of this concept of common sense. So these weren't bad people. They were all kings after God's heart, just like their father David, right? They're not bad people. And so somebody would come around and say, Well, we're thinking about doing this major trade deal with the Babylonians or something like that. And you know, they're common sense, they're good people. Yeah, we should go ahead with it. But they didn't stop and really pray about it and allow just, you know, have the supernatural sense. And so that's what Oswald Chambers was talking about in this devotion I read last night. And I think it really resonates with the life of an entrepreneur under this mark of faithfulness versus willfulness. So, how do we know whether we're being faithful or willful? Well, if we're not asking God before we make decisions, and I can think of mistakes I made just yesterday, where I made decisions and I didn't stop and say, Heavenly Father, help me to understand whether this is what the direction you'd have me go in. Open doors that need to be open, closed doors that need to be closed. It doesn't need to be just, you know, going and locking yourself in your prayer room for an hour. It just means real time communing with the living God who actually cares about what you're doing, seeking his will. Um, uh, next thing, biblical message of generosity. Uh, money is so wrapped up in the life of an entrepreneur. Um, the amount of money we make is a scorecard on how we're doing. Um, and even for entrepreneurs that are driven by money, money comes in as just it's the currency of the trade. And it's different than if you're uh in in in other professions. And and and the listeners here to this podcast will understand that. It's this love-hate relationship with money. It's it's it's wanting to get the type of achievement. Um, and uh, and yet at the same time, it can become an idol, right? You can work God can you can't worship mammon. Um, and yet we know this tempting and we know this this draw to the world and the worries of the world and the deceitfulness of riches and just the additional additional things that we might be able to buy. And gosh, won't it be great if we can just move out of this house? Because you know, we've got these neighbors that are, you know, there's just 10 feet away, and we'll really finally be happy if we can buy a bigger house. And then you get that house, and then you think, gosh, if we could only have like the second, you know, a second home, someplace where we could get away for it all, maybe a water view. It doesn't need to be really nice. We don't even need to have a boat, but if we could have a second home and then you're in the beach home for a while, and then you're thinking, gosh, those guys, they've got jet skis. Jet skis are awesome and jet skis are awesome. I'm not telling you jet skis aren't great, but in an entrepreneur's mind, maybe more than anybody else's, it goes towards money and being able to understand the the biblical gift of generosity that we have this opportunity to give because God gave. And being able to have a financial finish line in mind, I think about the heroes of this. I know that that you've spent a lot of time in the Smoky Mountains. Alan Barnhart over in Knoxville, you know, the the biggest, probably the biggest crane company in the world, Barnhart Crane is gargantuan. He and his wife decided we're gonna have a financial finish line because we're not gonna get into this rat race as so many of our peers have, about getting more and more money and what that might have. And we understand that that, you know, it can be a challenge and it can be a barrier between us and really knowing God. So before we even start this business, we're gonna go ahead and say we're gonna pay each other what we'd otherwise make at InterVarsity. And if you've worked at Intervarsity for 20, 25, 30 years, as as Alan and Catherine have at Barn Hart Crane, you can make a decent living. You know, you can go out to dinner, you can go on family vacations, right? But um, they give away everything else. So there have been years in which they've given away more than $100 million. And um, and they make the money that they would have otherwise made at Intervarsity. And he says, you know, we still go out to dinner. I mean, we don't we don't order sodas, but you're thinking, oh my goodness, I mean, you could you can have a fleet of yachts, and that's what the temptation is. So biblical message generosity, another mark that we look at. We look at ministry in word, we look at ministry in deed. Um, those are the things we focus on in the small group study that we do. It's things we focus on in the group, and then the things that I try to focus on and just in my life. And I maybe we started this ministry just to minister to me and my needs. But those are the things I need to constantly work through in my own life.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, beautiful. Henry, what's a story that you could share with us that really would encapsulate what the faith, faith-driven entrepreneur is and what you're trying to accomplish, where you look at that that testimony and say, that's that's what we're that's what we're after. Is there a story that comes to mind like that?
SPEAKER_01Oh, there's so there's so many. There's so many. Um, you know, you can look at Anthony Tan at Grab, um, which effectively bought Uber in Southeast Asia and his passion to be able to redeem uh the ride sharing space and the fact that people can get safe rides afternight in in Southeast Asia. Now it's I don't know, he's raised $30, $40 billion for his business. So you think about Victor Ho, who wanted to redeem the relationship between a shop owner and their customer. Um John Beekman, who started Man Crates, who wanted to help men to do a better job of giving because he he feels that we're fully alive again when we give. Um, maybe my favorite story is the first investment we ever made in sovereigns, and it's uh Cloud Factory, a guy like Mark Sears, who comes out at Sun Microsystem, who's brilliant at what he does. He says, you know, God made me a great programmer. How might I use that skill set to honor him? And uh just also a feeling for the nation. So he and his wife get up and they go to Qatar and they minister to refugees and start training them on coding, and finds out that a lot of the refugees that are or a lot of the workers that are in Qatar are from Nepal. Like, let's go back to Nepal. Let's let's train some of these people up on Ruby on Rails. Finding a business uh opportunity with Cloud Factory that now employs thousands and thousands of people in Nepal and in Kenya. You know, one of the things that uh that they've been able to do that I think is so impressive is um maybe six or seven years ago at bandwidth, we had an initiative, bandwidth cares, and we continue to have it's corporate social responsibility. We do things in Raleigh and Denver and the different places we have offices to give back to the community. And we use we it's employee-led, and there's there's a lot of good that can happen from that. Um six or seven years ago, we probably did eight or nine of those activities over the course of the year. That same year we did eight or nine, Cloud Factory did 1,000. Everybody does corporate social responsibility in Raleigh and in Denver and places like that. Nobody does it in Kathmandu, and and and probably not very many people in Nairobi. And so the cultural influence, the ability for Cloud Factory to love its community well, really served them because the next year the big earthquake in Nepal happened and they were the first responders. And you have people from a Christian faith, a minority faith, getting out there with a proven track record of having loved on the community for years by then. And the what they were able to do to minister to people at a time of great need was really astounding. It was really a beautiful thing. And so Mark's story at Cloud Factory is one of somebody who has uh been given great business giftings and great skills. He wants to use it for the glory of God. He feels drawn to the nations. He goes ahead and comes up with a business idea. He's frequently, you spend time with Mark Sears, he's always in prayer. He and David Morgan, my partner bandwidth are the two guys I know that are just very, very intentional about praying all the time. David Morkin will tell you, he's always praying, like maybe like hundreds of times a day. And he doesn't wear this on his sleeve. You have to get it out of him. I, you know, he's my best friend. I've known him for more than 20 years, but he's always praying, God please, or God thank you, or God please forgive me. I mean, all the time to try to stay in line with God's will for his life and his leadership and bandwidth. Mark Sears, same thing. And so I love that because you know, a lot of missionaries have tried to get into Nepal and really make a dent and really make an impact to love on the people in a way that brought truth and life in. And Mark's been able to do it in a way that's really has been done at scale with love and um and staying power and become a great partner um with so many different organizations, Christian and non-Christian. But in each case, when uh Mark lives out first Peter three, you know, talking about the reason for the hope he has with gentleness and respect in relationship.
SPEAKER_02Wow, it's powerful. So faithdriven entrepreneur.com is the website. Um take it. Um and so that's the website. What do you want to tell us about some of the initiatives going on right now? Um, certainly we want people to get the book. Um, but how do you want to answer that?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, any way you think we can serve you. I I I don't this is our first time I've ever done a book. Uh, I've I I don't want to just overly sell people on the book. I think the book is great. I think that Chip and JD do a great job, and I get a chance to share some of the stories we're talking about. Um, uh going to the website and just understanding some of the different things you'll find there and how you might want to dive in. I think you're great. But a quick rundown, we've got a daily blog. Uh, we've had thousands of them now. We have uh more than 180, I think, released uh of the Fate Driven Entrepreneur podcasts. Yes, we do have a book. We have an annual conference that happens at the beginning of September every year. Uh this year we'll have Phil Vischer and we'll have um Tori Hunter and we've got uh Dude Perfect and uh just a great rundown of just awesome Fate-Driven Entrepreneurs. We have this eight-week Faith-driven entrepreneur study that you can sign up for. And as you go through one, maybe you're called to lead one. Um, then we have those same small groups, and many of them will continue with uh partnership we have with right now media to look at uh five dysfunctions of a team and a whole bunch of different um uh teachings that we have that you can do in a group with faith-driven entrepreneurs. Um, and then we also have a coordinator of next steps to help people understand about how they can get plugged into ministries like C12 and Praxis and um how they can think about um being involved in generous givings ministry. They there's a journey of generosity. So, what are the different steps? What are the next things you might do in community or individually to be able to draw closer to knowing God um through your journey as a faith trade entrepreneur? So it's all on the website, but those are some of the things to look at.
SPEAKER_02Thank you for sharing that. Um, Henry, last question here. What do you want, aside from the book, getting signed up into the community? Um, what action do you want people to take in light of what they've heard today?
SPEAKER_01To get down on the knees and pray, just to understand and to know the God that loves them and that the God that loves them and redeem them to himself, to himself, um, takes great joy in what they're doing and and wherever he has them in the marketplace, wherever he has them in life, but in particular for business owners and entrepreneurs who otherwise might be on a very lonely journey, that theirs is a very holy work, that theirs is a pure play on knowing the God who works six out of seven days and his work continues to this day. And to be able to understand that amidst entrepreneurial triumphs and tragedies, that God is right there with them and that he loves them. And that as they lean into that, they have are going to be in a great position to be able to model that father's love out to their employees, their vendors, their customers, their partners, employees, all of that.
SPEAKER_02Beautiful. Henry, thank you so much. Um, I I know you use having listened to your podcast a lot, you use the term winsome, and you're a very winsome man of God. And I appreciate the example that you set um for us entrepreneurs out there trying to uh follow the Lord and and what we're doing in business. And uh thank you for the wisdom that you share with us today. I know we're better for it.
SPEAKER_01Darren, thank you. It's a great honor to be with you. Great blessing. Uh, yes, you have blessed me today. Thank you.
SPEAKER_00We hope you've enjoyed this episode, and if so, we would greatly appreciate it if you would leave us a quick rating and review for the Christianity and Business Podcast on iTunes. You can get more information about HBU Center for Christianity and Business at Christianityandbusiness.com. Thanks for listening, and remember to keep integrating biblical values into your business.