Wildly Intentional

9. Coaching - how to know when it's right for you and what to look for

• Season 1 • Episode 9

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0:00 | 40:08

In this episode we dig into the reality of business, fitness and life coaching. We chat about when it can be genuinely helpful, why many business owners reach a point where outside support makes a difference and how to know if you are actually ready for that step.

We also talk openly about the other side of the industry. Coaching can be incredibly valuable but it is important to choose the right person. We share some of the warning signs to watch out for so that you can make an informed decision and avoid investing in something that is not right for you or your business.

Whether you are feeling stuck, growing quickly or simply curious about how coaching works, this conversation will help you think more clearly about what kind of support might move your business forward.

Thinking about working with a coach but not sure if it is the right move for you? Let us know your experience with coaches and what you have found you need to look out for.

 Subscribe to Wildly Intentional for weekly bold conversations on business growth, mindset and building a business that actually works for you. 

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Don't forget to join us in our Facebook Group to continue the conversation and let us know your thoughts on this episode and if you have ever felt the same as we do here.

SPEAKER_01

Welcome to Wildly Intentional, the podcast of business owners who refuse to play small.

SPEAKER_00

This is where we'll have bold talks, honest conversations and dig into what it really takes to create big breakthroughs in business and in life.

SPEAKER_01

We're Verity and Flick, we're two business owners who have built, broken, rebuilt and grown businesses in our own ways.

SPEAKER_00

And we're here to share the lessons, the mindset shifts, and the unapologetic decisions that have really helped us to level up.

SPEAKER_01

So if you're ambitious, you're gross focused, and you're ready to do business on your own terms, you're in exactly the right place. So let's get wildly intentional. Morning.

SPEAKER_00

Hello and welcome. Welcome back to Wildly Intentional. Hopefully you're coming back. Hopefully you're coming back. Yeah, I'm good. I'm good. I'm very tired today. So I'm just exhausted. So last week, um, as many people know, the fact that I was in a show, so I was very much burning the candle at both ends. Um mornings getting up, going to the gym, trying to keep my regular routine, and then evenings being on stage, prancing around, getting changed very quickly, um, and performing, which is what I love to do. I love it. But I've got to the end of that week and I'm now like, ooh, the the world has stopped spinning and I'm able to sort of calm down and I'm kind of going like, oh, right, what do I need to do? Oh, yeah, I need to run a business. That's what I need to do.

SPEAKER_01

I don't know what you're moaning at. You never ever um you burn the back the candles at both ends week in, week out. Yeah, you haven't met anybody with so much energy. I really do.

SPEAKER_00

I do um I do an awful lot.

SPEAKER_01

Um while I'm there binge watching Netflix, you are out doing something or other, climbing mountains or tying knots or something.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

They have so many people say to me about, oh, have you seen such and such? I'm like, when would I have time to sit and watch a series or watch DVD?

SPEAKER_01

Your TV bill must be really cheap because you can't subscribe to anything.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's um yesterday. I mean, yesterday was a full day of I caught up with like three or four rugby games because I'm a massive Six Nations fan. I mean, not the fact that I hadn't I hadn't actually watched them this weekend um live, so I had to watch them all yesterday and record. And I got people messaging me and I was like, no, don't talk to me about rugby. Please don't talk to me about rugby. I've not watched them yet.

SPEAKER_01

Have you noticed how quiet I've been on social media the last few years when it comes to these stations?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I do, I I do, I do have certain people that I don't message because it's like I'm not I'm not that kind of person. I'm not a gloaty person when it comes to the rugby.

SPEAKER_01

And um do you know what though, right? Let's have a conversation about it. Like the England Wales match was devastated. It was just like Wales just didn't show up. Well, it was from your point of station, it was well, yeah. But actually, I would dispute that England didn't have to play particularly well either, because Wales just didn't turn up. It was like, hello, where are you? And then, yeah, you guys aren't having a great tournament either. And then this weekend, it was just this little bit of hope. And you know, you know how much you know I need Wales to beat Scotland more than I do England, because uh you know, the the X and all that. So it's like, you know, I really, really thrive when Wales speaks Scot beats Scotland, and I was there all through the match going, yes, we're gonna do it, we're gonna do it. And then he was like, Oh, really? Last minute, okay.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah. You kind of switched off in the last 10 minutes, and it was like, yeah, like, yeah, we've got this. So for for listeners who who haven't met me in Verity before, it's like, yes, I am an England rugby fan. Um, I am a Welsh rugby fan. Verity is a Welsh rugby fan. I've got my cousin is a Welsh rugby fan, and uh, her husband is an England rugby fan, so that's always fun to message them when the England Wales is game is going, of sort of going, like, you know, how's how's the marriage going at the moment? And it's like, well, it depends on the next 80 minutes as to what it is. And then I've got um some other really, really close friends, and she's a a Welsh fan and he's a Scottish fan, and it's like, oh, and I haven't messaged them yet after this weekend to sort of go, uh, so how is it in your household?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I mean, my husband tries not to gloat, bless him. But then, like I said, England haven't had a great tournament since, so it's um it's just a bit of a taboo topic in my house, right?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I've got a few uh friends who are Ireland fans, and uh the minute that their messages came through, I was like, ignore like muked their notifications. I was like, No, go away, because I can I can already tell what those messages are gonna be.

SPEAKER_01

I got pulled up on it. I was delivering a training course the Monday after the Wingland it the Wingland, well, the England Wales game, and I'd I'd taken these guys through a course previously, so I had a relationship with them, and the first thing one of them said was, So how are you feeling, Verity, about the rugby this weekend? And I was like, We're on an equality talk, let's not go there today. Thank you very much. In fact, I would rather you start talking about sheep than the rugby, if I'm honest.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, we we had um it was a few years ago now, and and I'm saying it was very few years ago, it was one of the six nations where it was if England uh it sort of became a three-way tie between England, Wales, and Ireland, and it depended on England's final game as to if we won by so many points, then we'd win it. But if we won but only by so many points, Wales would win it, or if if we lost, Ireland would win it. Sort of like I can't remember the exact details, but I went to Scouts on the Monday night after after the final of it, and there's me being an England uh rugby supporter. There was um Katrina, who used to be one of the scout leaders who was an Ireland rugby supporter, and there was Kinewen, who was a Welsh rugby supporter. It was a it was a tense meeting because of I can't even remember the results, but it was just the three of us because we were like, Yeah, it's fun, it's not fun, it's not fun. It is fun, and then you know it's it's all sporting rivalry fun, and and we understand in rugby of like, you know, yes, okay, our teams are doing how they're doing, but that doesn't affect our relationship or or the banter between us.

SPEAKER_01

So no, absolutely not. The unfortunate thing for us is that we're coinciding with the Six Nations. Paul and I are watching um the latest celebrity Master Chef and Alan Wynne Jones is on it. I won't tell you the result if nobody's seen it. I won't won't do a spoiler, but Alan Wynne Jones is. I mean this is gonna come out in like four weeks' time, you know that because we I know, but I don't know how far by I it was 2025, so I'm like it it it could be like me where they binge watch, you know, months after it releases. But watching him, it was just like it was just memories and just kind of you're really rubbing it in our face now of how good the Welsh team really were, and how the generations have completely changed, and I just feel like you know, we've lost all that huge talent we had. It's like they've got to be out there somewhere, they have to be, but yeah, no, you go through that, don't you?

SPEAKER_00

You get through that ebbs and flows with that with any rugby.

SPEAKER_01

I know, but the ebbs are a little bit, you know, a little bit long lasting at the minute.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Oh, should we bring it bring this back to business talk? Because we could say we could actually make this episode about rugby to be fair.

SPEAKER_01

Could I don't want to though?

SPEAKER_00

I was gonna say, I'm not particularly proud of England's performance recently, but you know.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, and you know, I definitely can't say I'm proud of Wales's poor. Although they did, to be fair, they did bring it this weekend, they did play better. It that's the team we need. We just needed them to keep going until the final minute, but you know, it is what it is. It was a better performance. Anyway, let's move on.

SPEAKER_00

What England did against Ireland, so you know, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

You can take that one, and I'll even hold my hands up and say that one.

SPEAKER_00

Like, I'm fine with it. I'm fine, I'm just dying inside, I'm just crying. It's fine, it's fine.

SPEAKER_01

The word shocking is being said a lot in my house at the minute. That's what I'll say for both teams. Shocking, that's shocking, shocking performance, yeah, yeah. Anyway, what are we talking about?

SPEAKER_00

Uh, we're talking about business coaching because we've mentioned a few times about getting business coaches and coaches in general. Um, and obviously, you were a business coach and like they're they're so important for business owners. Um, and when you are first starting out, the amount of businesses that don't get a business coach, they go kind of go like, no, no, I'll I'll figure it out on my own. Which is just like, oh, I just if I could go back and and really look at myself as when I started the social dragon fly and go, do you know what? No, just get a business coach, just just just do it.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. It's a tricky one, this one. It's it's a bit of a kind of tailor two halves, I think. Because we've both been through it a lot with business coaches, both positive and negative. And I think it goes back, you know, as more established business owners, we understand now the um positive. What am I trying to say? It's morning again, isn't it? Beginning of the week. Um it it's we understand the necessity, not positive, the necessity of having a business coach early on. Whereas when you start out in business, you don't want to spend any money, you're not willing to invest in yourself. So it's an expense you think you can do without. However, on the flip side of it, if you've got a really good business coach, they can elevate you to new heights very quickly and far quicker than you will ever get there on your own. So there is that kind of, you know, if you I would say if you're going to invest in anything at the beginning, then invest in a business coach.

SPEAKER_00

But you need to invest in the right one for you.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, just gonna say there's a huge caveat there.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, but we I mean we've seen it where we've we've seen people or we've been ourselves and we've got we've hired the the wrong business coach. And that's not saying that that they're not a good business coach, they're just not the right one for us. And there is, you know, it's it's a there's a harbour for every ship, or there's a ship for every harbour, or whichever the I tried to make that an animal one, but I'm just not I was like, I'm sure, I'm sure there's an analogy that I can do today that will be it, but that will be an analogy, um, an animal analogy, but um yeah, you know, I'd never say the fact that the ones that were wrong for me weren't good business coaches, they were just not right for me.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, absolutely, and I agree. I think we have to be careful with with business coaches, and it's a really, I have to say, being in that industry for so long, it's a really unethical industry, and that's the unfortunate part of it because you don't have to have coaching qualifications, you don't have to um have prior experience, you can literally just go out and call yourself a coach, and that's when people spend a shed load of money on advice they don't need, and I think there are people out there that shouldn't be coaches, I will go out and say it. Um, there are people out there that are amazing business coaches, and then you've got the ones who just, like you said, aren't right for you. And I think I've had some really good experiences with coaches, but I've had some really bad experiences, and the bad experiences again were a tailor two halves because part of it was they just weren't the right coach for us, and part was they were actually really unethical coaches that shouldn't have been in the industry in the first place. Um I don't know if we should talk about this really, because I've got quite strong views on it.

SPEAKER_00

Well, no, I agree with what you're saying. I mean, I was reading a um a post from uh another um business coach, uh, friends of them on Facebook, and they literally put a post out this weekend that said, like, if your business coach isn't upsetting you, then they're not a business coach, they're a cheerleader, and you can just get that from AI. Like, if they're not pushing you out of that comfort zone, and we've talked about this before of like, you know, pushing you out, pushing yourselves out of your comfort zone is that's where the magic happens. Um, and a business coach should absolutely be pushing you to that, and it should feel a little bit, I don't want to say it's awkward, it's not awkward, it's it's that, you know, oh make your heart flutter kind of thing of going, uh, that's that's that's a big step for me. And it's like, well, we'll take it. You know, your business coach should be pushing you, not cheer, not just cheering you. It's like that was the point of the post, it's the fact that's if they're just cheering you and going like, whoa, go you, then that's not a coach, that's that's a cheerleader.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, but they need to have that cheerleading side as well, because you have to feel that your coach is behind you. And the idea of a business coach is to push you out of your comfort zone, it's to push you to places that you don't even know exist. And if they're not doing that, then they're not doing their job very well. But then you've got the flip side of it where you've got people who go out and say, you know, I made six figures in my business last month. Here's my blueprint, copy it. And that drives me insane. Yeah, yeah. And for anybody who does follow people that go out with statements like that, right? I'm just gonna say this. They have made six figures in their business in the last month. They're not lying. Um, those six figures, though, are business revenue, they're not profit. So they've probably made maybe four figures at a push in the business in terms of profit. So don't get kind of sucked into this six-figure mindset because it's never six figures profit. There is always a huge amount of work and and um expenses behind that. And you also need to bear in mind when you're following people like that, they're amazing at what they do. They didn't get there on their own. So if you are a small business owner on your own and you're looking to take those next steps, they did not get there on their own. They have a team behind them every single time. Maybe they're employed, maybe they're outsourced, but they have a team of people who support them in their business. They are not making six figures on their own. And the other thing to bear in mind is the programs they're selling worked brilliantly for them, but you are not them.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So what works for one rarely works for another, which is why their success rate on turning other people into millionaires is very low because you will have one or two people on every thousand-person program who will be successful in it because they're very similar to you, but they are not the same, they're not the same as you, and you end up demotivated, out of pocket, and feeling like you are the one at fault. And I hate that, I hate that mindset, hate it. Yeah, so be careful who you go to. My first coach was he's really successful now, he's doing really well, but he wasn't right for us. We got kind of sucked into this mutual benefit kind of relationship, and he wanted this is actually the coach that took me into the mastermind that made us cry. Um, and you know, for all the right reasons, they were right to do that. We couldn't see it at the time because we weren't ready. We absolutely weren't ready for that level. And he would never, he could never understand where we were and where we wanted to go. And he was always trying to push us in other directions. Like his priority was the Ferrari in the driveway. I couldn't care less about the Ferrari in the driveway. I was never motivated by by money. It was always motivated by my family, by experiences. I'm not um I'm not into possessions in any way, shape, or form. I'm never gonna be the person that buys the mansion if I make millions because it just means nothing to me. I live for experiences.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I think about with if buying a mansion is all like, oh, it's a cleaning.

SPEAKER_01

Cleaning, yeah, absolutely. You've got to afford the cleaner with it. Um, yeah, and exactly my first thought. It's like can't handle the house I've got.

SPEAKER_00

And look at things like you know, you see these beautiful uh, you know, Edwardian mansions or you know, Victorian mansions, and I'm like, the dust and the cupboards on that to get that off. Must be awful.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's lovely for somebody else, but I'm just I'm not materialistic. So when you've got a coach pushing you who is financially driven and not understanding how you work and how you think and how you feel, that's a recipe for disaster. So he could have pushed me out of my comfort zone. He absolutely could have taken us in the direction we needed to go in, but because he kept pushing the things that didn't mean anything to us, it wasn't motivating, it wasn't inspiring, and we just didn't do it. So you've got to find when it comes to coaches, you have got to find somebody you really gel with who really understands you, who will push you, but will also do it within your personality and your needs and what you want. The first question a coach should ask you is, What is it you want? Yeah, and if they're not asking you that, get rid.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And it this doesn't just go for business coaches as well, because I've, you know, I've had a personal coach. Um, so you know, we say on this podcast that it's you know, business and in life, and there is you know personal coaches out there. Um, and you know, you you'll find the ones that are, yeah, absolutely, because they'll push you personally, which which naturally has an impact on your business when they are pushing you, when they are the right ones for you. And yeah, you know, the there's finding the right ones of those is just like it's it's the breakthrough that we all need.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, absolutely. And again, you know, you can get people who are amazing and will inspire. I had a personal coach once, you know, he was never gonna be really successful with me, let's face it, because I just do not have the motivation to get up and exercise every day. I don't, um, I just can't find any joy in it. What I wish I could, but he was brilliant, right? He was the best personal. I would recommend him to everybody. Hi, Jack, if you're listening, you won't be listening because you're far bigger than I am now. But he is, you know, he was a young guy just starting out, and he had like this personal studio in his garden. He transformed like his outhouse into this personal um training space. And I remember going there and he made me feel so at ease, bearing in mind I was a woman in my late 30s at the time. He was a young lad, early 20s. So there was an intimidation there from the start. Yeah, me rocking up with my leggings and my overhand top. Um, but he made me feel so at ease and he listened, he asked me questions, listened to what I wanted to achieve, knew the issues that I had, and really kind of didn't push me to a point I felt really uncomfortable, but also showed me that I could go further than I thought. And even things like, you know, I remember our first session, and it's the same with business, it's you triggered it with personal training. Our first session, he stepped me on the treadmill. I'm not a fit person, I am not, I'm very aware. I was fitter in my late 30s, so I definitely couldn't do it now. But he said, 30 minutes, come on. And he every every kind of now and again he'd bump up the speed. He's like, Come on, let's get to a jog. And I'm like, You're gonna kill me, Jack. You are gonna kill me. And he's I remember him standing there going, I promise you, Verity, I am not gonna kill you. I'm not gonna kill you. I'm just gonna show you, you can just go a little bit further, just a tiny bit further. And by the end of that first session, I was up to a decent running speed, and I got off and I wasn't out of breath. I'd pulled my breath back in because he taught me through it the whole time, and he showed me that I could do it, but he listened to what I wanted and what I needed and what I was fearful of, and he was brilliant. And now he's going off and you know, making loads of money because he's brilliant at what he does. So, but another personal trainer wouldn't have done that for me. If I'd gone to the gym, they would have been the complete opposite.

SPEAKER_00

I feel like we're going off track a little bit and we're talking about personal training, but I mean you've you've gone you've gone more the the fitness coach, but like a personal coach. So um mine is you know, her her hi Rachel, I know you do listen to this one, but her entire slogan is live life by your design and not by accident. So, you know, yeah, um, when you are feeling like you know, I I often describe it as you're running downhill, and at some point, like you've you're just keeping your legs moving because otherwise you're gonna fall down, you're gonna fall on your face. Um, and actually taking the control back to actually I'm then in control of that. Oh, we've gone back into fitness, and I'm talking about running, and I'm definitely not a runner as much as I I do like going to the gym first in the morning.

SPEAKER_01

But are you talking more life coaching?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That sort of life and and um yeah, your personal, personal style, personal not style, but yeah, outside of business because you'll have a business coach who will drive your business forward, but I mean they they all should really link in together because they they it's what do you want from your life? Like you started a business to do what you want to do from your life, right? So having somebody there who's gonna focus on getting you there. Um, and I always come back to the the Mark Twain quote of whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right. Yeah, because absolutely you just said throw on the on the treadmill running for 30 minutes, and I'm like, my brain was already going, like, oh, I can't do that.

SPEAKER_01

Someone said that in a real life scenario last week, right? Let me try and think of how this came about because I literally internally laughed my head off. But it was somebody who's been quite negative about something. Oh, that was it. I well, I won't say where I was because it was a work thing, but I went to a work thing and um somebody was quite negative about around the conversation, and the guy just put in really like subtly, and he said, Well, you know, as they say, if you think you can, whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're absolutely right. And it would was put into the conversation so subtly that the person he was talking to didn't pick up on it, but everybody else in that circle was like, Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. It was just sorry, you just reminded me of something. I just had a giggle over it because I thought I've never heard somebody put such a sly comment into a conversation so subtly and so nicely. And it was, he just said, Well, you know, they do say, don't they, you if you think you can or you think you can't, you know, you're right. So it's like, hmm, hmm, okay, nicely done.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. To to bring it back to to business coaching and um coaches in general as well. Like I see a lot of people and they go about, oh, I speak to my coach once a month. Like, once a month.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. What's that doing? Coach.

SPEAKER_00

That's that's that's a that's a check-in with a friend. That's that's a cheerleader. Yeah. Like you your business coach should be, you know, checking in with you at least weekly, if not like every few days or something like that. Like, yeah, you know, I will pick up my phone and I'll just message mine and go, hey, I've just had this thought, but not really sure, you know, how to how to bring it to fruition, or I'm I'm not sure if this is right for my business, you know. What are your thoughts? And yeah, they go, okay, well, that needs to be thought out more, or you know, that's that's a great idea, or you know, so happy that you're expanding and and you're thinking of new things and blah blah blah. Like, but I I have that relationship with my business coach. If I can just pick up the phone and message them every I could probably message them every day and they wouldn't, you know, they wouldn't mind because that's their job. Their job is to, you know, when I am feeling those moments of lack of motivation as well, you know, when you're just in that, yeah, oh, what am I doing? Why am I doing this?

SPEAKER_01

I think though, just to kind of to counteract your point a little bit, you have to be careful on it coaches need personal boundaries as well. And it you have to be careful on the package that you're signing up to because coaches will have different packages. So some of them will be um, you know, you can WhatsApp message me daily, or we'll catch up for a one-to-one, a 10-minute chat every couple of days, or it'll just be a weekly session or whatever it is. Um, and again, you have to find one that fits with what you need and how you feel. So if you've got a coach saying it is a monthly check-in, but actually you need something a lot more um wow. I just I'm not there today, Flick. I'm just I'm not. Um needs what what's the word I'm looking for? Regular. Yeah, need a lot more. Then you know, go and find a coach that will do that for you.

SPEAKER_00

Or frequent, I think, rather than regular. Because if it's every month, then yeah, that is a regular.

SPEAKER_01

Yes, all right, yeah. So frequently. Um and I think when you're starting out, you do need a frequent contact contact with your coach. Absolutely. You need that kind of you need the reliability, you need that somebody to bounce ideas off. Um, I was really kind of unsure. You know that I toyed with the idea of calling myself a coach for a long time because I'd had negative kind of um experiences with them. But then I had some really positive experiences as well. And actually, I mean, cost doesn't come into it really because you've got coaches out there who are really lovely priced points. They're they're price points that we should be able to afford. Um, and then you've got coaches who are off the charts expensive, which you know, hopefully the ones that are off the charts expensive as in the stripes, so you know, they're that price for a reason. But you can get some really good coaches at a reasonable price, and I think I went kind of middle of the range, so I did invest a lot in coaching probably about two years ago, and I spent a small fortune, but oh my god, did it turn my business around? It was the one of the best investments I've made. She was amazing, and she was very, she was my biggest, she actually she still is my biggest cheerleader, she's amazing, but she was also really directing to the point, and she would push me and she'd say, No, you're capable of more than this, you can do more than this. This is the direction you need to go in. Why won't you do that? Why won't you do this? And she would question every decision I made, which is what I needed. Um, and coaching is about questioning, it is about drawing the ideas out of you. It's not about telling you what to do, it's about getting you to understand that yourself. And she would challenge me constantly, and that's what a good coach does, somebody who challenges you. Because if you're just left to your own devices, you're just left to make your own decisions, of course you're gonna stay in your comfort zone because that's what feels nice. Yeah, you need somebody who's gonna challenge you and push you out of that comfort zone because that's where the magic happens. I'm really sorry, I know we said it before, but you know, it is you're not gonna make a million or whatever your your motive is, you're not gonna make it by staying in your comfort zone. You're not, you've got to get out of it.

SPEAKER_00

You've got to step out of it, and yeah, and and like I say, I have that relationship with my business coach and the fact that they know that I'll drop them a message, you know, WhatsApp, when an idea sparks in my head. Um, but I know the fact that he'll get back to me when he's when he's working, when you know, so he'll he he sets very clear boundaries of the fact that like his WhatsApp is always open for messages, but his response is is within his boundaries. So yeah, absolutely, you know, working within their boundaries and what's right for you. Um I forget where I was going with that thought. That I I took an um breath. That was the end of it, and I stopped and I stopped the thought and it was like, oh no, that's gone off the that's gone off the train tracks. Yeah, it's yeah, he challenges, he does question me. He just, you know, it's like, okay, so why are you doing this? So, you know, again, for starting the podcast, um, you know, it was something that we we we've both individually said that we were thinking for about for a long time. Um, and it was after we'd sort of decided that we were doing it, and I was like, Oh, do I tell do I tell my business coach or not? Do I want to and I was like, no, you absolutely should tell your business coach that you're thinking of doing a podcast because it's going to be, you know, you are going to be talking about business, you're going to be talking about marketing, you're going to be. Um, and his first question was, okay, why are you doing that? Because if it's a nice to have, then he'd have gone, yeah, but you could have spent that time better investing in something else, you know, what what is why do you want to do a podcast? And it was like, well, because I I because I want to expand on the fact that I teach and and the fact that I impart knowledge and you know, I want to get my message further out there. And he went, right, okay, that's fine. You know, what what's your thought process behind what you're going to talk about? Well, you know, he questioned everything so that I was absolutely cemented in my mind of the fact that this was what I wanted to do with a podcast and that it was right for my business. And you know, I can excuse myself out of business hours in in commerce because you know this is this is part of my business now, but I can excuse myself out of the business hours to record a podcast because it's it's still work.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's really funny because we're at different ends of the spectrum there, because this is just a nice to have for me now. So it's I do this because it's fun and I enjoy it. But you know, the motive originally was a business motive, absolutely. Um, we might need to turn it around to you a little bit more though. For future reference. So, I mean, I think personally, you know, when it comes back to cost again, I think the biggest barrier with coaches and the reason people won't go and get a coach is because they cost a lot of money. But I think what you have to work out is how quickly are you gonna get to where you want to be without one? And if investing that money initially is gonna get you there a lot quicker, then financially it's a really sensible decision. And I think we need to kind of knock that barrier down and think, can we get there on our own? Do we really understand business? Because I didn't have a clue what business meant when I first started it. I just walked up and did something I loved and then realized that oh my god, I've got to wear 15 different hats and I don't know how to do these. Um, which, you know, we've spoken to enough people to know that that's what that's what happens. We go into business thinking it's all going to be lovely.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, tomorrow I will be the financial director of this company.

SPEAKER_01

We we just don't anticipate what running a business actually means. And that is why there is a huge difference between hobby businesses and actual businesses. And a lot of people start off thinking they're in business, and the reality is they've got a hobby, it's not a business because they're not treating it like a business. And you know, we can have major discussions about lots of different things. I see loads coming up at the minute. I must be on a group about network marketing. We've had loads of conversations about network marketing. I was in net more network marketing marketing for years. I will never knock it. It's a really good um kind of business process, if you like, as long as you follow it like a business process. And the biggest downfall for network marketers is it's sold as business. In your spare time, in your spare time, yeah, around the kids. So it's sold to memes. You are not attracting business brains, you're not attracting people who will see it as a business opportunity. No, and that's the biggest mistake we make when we first go into business, is we don't see it as a business, we see it as something we like to do, and ultimately that is a hobby. So you've got to get into that business mindset. And when you get into the business mindset, you realize actually, I don't know how to do all these things. So a coach or a mentor, which is something different, but a coach or a mentor is the right way to go, and that's what you should invest in. Before you invest in anything else, I think you should invest in some form of help or advice.

SPEAKER_00

And and please, for for the love of all that is holy and and everything in the universe. Um, I had a conversation with somebody recently who was just starting out, and I said, Oh, you know, uh who have you got in your support group? You know, who have you got coaching you and anything like that? They're like, Oh no, I just run all my ideas through Chat GPT. I was like, you can't use AI as a coach, you really can't. Please, please don't think so.

SPEAKER_01

Do you know what though people are? And I tried it, right? I did it because somebody said the same thing to me, and I thought, right, okay, I'm gonna see how much ChatGTP would give me. And Chat GTP is the cheerleader, yeah. So it supported me and it gave me really great feedback and it motivated me and it inspired me. And it was, you know, I've got somebody here on my computer every day. If I need a pick me up that will tell me, yes, Verity, you're amazing. This hits really great. You know, it's just this is brilliant. Do you want me to improve on this?

unknown

No, please.

SPEAKER_01

It is not a coach, it is not, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

It it's uh it was just that moment of like I had to sort of do that very polite of like, okay, well, that's that's that's one way to do it. Can I offer you some friendly advice as somebody who's been in business for a number of years to not do it that way? Like, you know, if you want a cheerleader, you know, you can find a cheerleader that's actually a human.

SPEAKER_01

And it goes back to what we just said about finding the right coach for you. So coach who asks the right questions, who understands where you're going, what you want to achieve, who you are as a person. Now, as much as you can put that information into a computer, it cannot possibly understand who you are as a person. It doesn't understand those deep down motives. We've talked before about understanding your purpose in your business and really understanding your business as a person. And a computer can't do that, it cannot bring the emotional side out of it. A coach can by asking the right questions. AI will never ever give you what you need as a business coach. It will give you advice, but that advice is pulled off the internet. That advice is not guaranteed, it is pulled off the internet for somebody else it worked for. It's not pulled off the internet for you personally.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Ever.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Please don't do it.

SPEAKER_01

Please, please, if you're listening to this, do not like um, let's put it in perspective, right? You might shoot me for this comment. When I used to run the blogging courses, I used to say to people, Do you read blogs? And they say, No. And I go, When was the last time you Googled? And they go, about half an hour ago. So you do read blogs. And they're like, What do you mean? And I said, you know, 98% of things that come up on Google are people's blogs. And so, what you have to bear in mind is behind those blogs, you read those blogs and you think, wow, that's really interesting, that's factual, that's really correct, that's you know, everything because it's on Google. What you're not actually realizing is somebody has sat behind a computer to write that blog. And that person could be Joe Blogs down the road, who knows nothing about the topic, but is actually quite interested. So writes a blog, he gets the keywords right, it appears on page one of Google, and you've just taken that advice as gospel.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

That's what AI does. It goes and looks at all those blogs and that information in Google and all the other search engines. There are other search engines out there, just for you know. But it takes the information, doesn't actually fact check it, and it gives you advice based on something that's worked for somebody else. It's the same scenario.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. That's the well, yeah. No, it is absolutely. It's it's uh yeah. They might be well now if you if you do Google or use any other search engine, um the first thing that comes up comes up with AI first, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's it's um that AI has gone and read a load of blogs to get you that information in the first place.

SPEAKER_00

Well, that's one of the things that I you know I love doing is the fact checking the researching. So it's like you know, I see something and it's like, oh, but you know, cute curiosity peaks in my brain and I I go and and fact check and research. Um we've gone off topic now. We've really gone off topic because we were talking business coaches and I were talking AI and business.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we could talk all day about AI and I use AI, I love AI, I've really loving it, but it's not its purpose and it shouldn't go beyond its purpose.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. I I think uh I went to um bear with Larry's just walked out to go and deal with the dogs. Um but for those of you who still listen, I went to a uh a digital marketing world forum last year, and I think the the big one of the key takeaways that I had from that was somebody explained AI was it was the torch to see the path. Or the yeah, the torch to see the path, it wasn't the path, or something like that. They they likened it to that kind of analogy of like, yes, okay, it helps you see the next step you need to take, yeah, but it's not actually gonna take it for you. It's not actually gonna it's a tool to use, not a I don't know what that I don't know what the rest of that sentence is.

SPEAKER_01

I get it. Yeah hopefully the listeners get it because we never know, hopefully.

SPEAKER_00

We never know. Yeah. Business coaches, life coaches, personal coaches, you know, fitness coaches. The the I mean, how many fitness coaches are there? You know, how many business coaches, how many life coaches are there? That the you know, there's a reason why there's so many. It's not just because there is no such thing as a saturation market, as we've said before on this podcast. Um, it is because everyone is different and everyone is unique and they they require unique things. Um and I've been in talks with you know people who are business coaches or or speaker coaches or or things like that. Um, and they they sell you the you know the mood on the string and kind of going like, you know, I can get you here, there, and everywhere. And then actually I'm like, right, okay, so what's your what's your process? Like, how how do you actually work? And I go, well, that that wouldn't work for me. That's that's not that's not how I operate, that's not how my brain functions or how I want my business to end up with. So, you know, doing your due diligence before you hire a business coach is important, but yeah, it is absolutely, you know, if you want to go far with your business, you need a coach.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I agree. And I think the key there, and that would probably be the words of wisdom, is all about doing your due diligence due diligence. We can't say it, but we know what we mean. Yeah. Um understanding, you know, when somebody is right for you and when they're not. And even with the kind of online six-figure coaches, you know, they might be right for you. That's fine, but just do your research first, understand what it is they're offering and whether that fits with your ethics, your values, your personality, and everything else. And I think that that would really be my words of wisdom. Make sure your business coach really fits with your values and your ethics, because if they don't, and I think that's where I've gone wrong in the past, they don't fit with my values, they don't fit with my ethics. And that really, if you're not comfortable with your coach, it's never gonna work. So you've got to do your due diligence first and understand what they're about and what they've achieved and how they can help you. And then when you click to the right one, it's amazing. It's really amazing, it'll turn your business around.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, completely well. It's just completely transformative to to have that. But yeah, do you do do your due diligence? Oh my goodness, put my teeth in. We're saying that that that's our uh wild words of wisdom for Wednesday.

SPEAKER_01

Yes, yes, get a coach, but do your due diligence. Did it? Wednesday wild words of wisdom. There you go, I could do that, no problem.

SPEAKER_00

We might have to do that one, but do due diligence is uh the phrase we've done. That'll be the one we work on for the next few weeks in the background. All right then, and of course when this goes out, we'll know who's won the Six Nations as well.

SPEAKER_01

We will, yeah. I'm pretty sure I know who's not gonna win the Six Nations, but there you are.

SPEAKER_00

I was gonna say, I don't think either of us will be celebrating this. No, can't see it.

SPEAKER_01

It's always next year. Yeah, yeah. All right then.

SPEAKER_00

All right, folks. Yeah, and we'll see you next time.

SPEAKER_01

See you next time. Thanks for spending this time with us on Wildly Intentional. If this podcast sparks something for you, take it with you and act on it. Don't forget to subscribe, share, and come and say hello online.

SPEAKER_00

And remember, bold talk leads to big breakthroughs with no apologies.