#14 Healing The Witch Wound With Hecate | Somatic Wisdom for Sensitive Nervous Systems | With April Lampert, MA, LPCC

Season 1, Episode 14: Healing The Witch Wound With Hecate | Somatic Wisdom for Sensitive Nervous Systems | With April Lampert, MA, LPCC

The fear of being “too much” has roots that run deeper than self-doubt. We trace the witch wound from European trials to modern life, where sensitive bodies still calculate the cost of visibility, and where power can feel dangerous to claim. With special guest, April Lampert (she/her), MA, LPCC and fellow somatic therapist and coven sister, we unpack how this inherited pattern shows up as hiding our gifts, shrinking our voices, and bracing for backlash, then map a pathway back to courage with Hecate’s torch lighting the way.

We ground the conversation in the body. Highly sensitive people process more, feel more, and get overwhelmed faster, which makes the witch wound louder in a hyperconnected world. We explore intergenerational trauma, chronic illness, and endometriosis as complex expressions of systems that carried too much for too long. Instead of chasing perfect regulation, we practice “regulated enough”: micro-pauses, breath breaks, sensory resets, titrated news, water rituals, and music that smooths the nervous system’s edges. April shares her cauldron metaphor as a living boundary, a vessel that holds what we can’t or shouldn’t carry alone.

History and myth both matter, but so does community. If the wound was seeded through isolation and betrayal, healing requires trusted witnesses who celebrate power instead of fearing it. We talk coven as a container for shared holding, and Hecate as guide at the crossroads where an old identity dies and the priestess steps forward. With Venus–Pluto and Sun–Pluto amplifying transformation, we ask: what part of you is ready to be seen, and what support will make it safe enough to emerge?

If this conversation stirs something true, come closer. Subscribe for more priestess wisdom, share this with a friend who needs the reminder, and leave a review so others can find the medicine. Then tell us: what small act of visibility are you claiming next?

Chapters

• 0:00 Setting The Sacred Frame
• 1:36 Naming The Witch Wound
• 2:56 Cosmic Weather And Hecate’s Crossroads
• 3:54 Why This Needs Witnessing
• 6:04 April’s Story And First Clicks
• 8:59 History Of Witch Hunts And Myths
• 11:18 Visibility, Power, And Patriarchy
• 13:08 Safety, Activism, And Nuance
• 16:46 Trauma In The Body And Lineage
• 18:18 Defining HSP And Deep Processing
• 21:05 Overstimulation And Tech Era Stress
• 23:56 Nervous System, Fascia, And Illness
• 26:34 Practices For Sensitive Bodies
• 30:15 The Cauldron As Boundary
• 32:43 Coven, Community, And Belonging
• 36:09 Hecate As Torchbearer Guide
• 39:11 Choosing Visibility Despite Fear
• 41:24 Maiden To Mother Spiral
• 44:02 Sisterhood As Antidote To Scarcity
• 46:33 Closing Invites And Resources

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:02

Welcome to Priestess Initiations, the Goddess Coven. I'm Casey Dunn, educator, priestess, and professional somatic therapist. In April 2025, I went through a Priestess Initiation of Old and launched the Priestess Initiations podcast six months later. Whatever brought you here today, I invite you to drop into the spiral with me. Let's begin. Welcome back to Priestess Initiations, the Goddess Coven. I'm Casey, this is episode 13, and today I'm in conversation with one of my Coven sisters, April, about the witch wound. Throughout season one, we've explored initiation, ISIS, and reassembly, the fall, what the body remembers, creative practice as priestess work, shadow work with Lilith, Medusa, and Persephone. But underneath all of this work is a deeper wound that many of us carry. The witch wound, and of course, how it connects to Hecate, Queen of Witches. If you haven't listened to her story yet, check out episode 8 and come back here when you're done. The witch wound is the ancestral, collective, personal fear of being too much, too powerful, too visible, too wild. The fear that if we claim our priestess power, we'll be punished for it. This wound shows up as hiding your gifts, playing small, even when you're capable of more, being terrified of visibility, and the voice that says, Who am I to teach this? Who am I to claim this? And this week, the cosmos is asking us to face it directly. This week has been building powerful transformation energy. You might have noticed if you're on our Patreon where members get the full list of this week's trends, it's posted every week, that on Monday night, Venus met Pluto in Aquarius. Love and feminine power descending into the underworld. This is witch wound territory, reclaiming the power that was suppressed, the wisdom that was called dangerous. If you felt relationships or values shifting, if old wounds around being too much or too powerful surfaced. That was Venus, Pluto, asking you to reclaim what's yours. And this Friday morning at 328 Mountain Time, the sun conjuncts Pluto and Aquarius. Your identity meets death and rebirth. This is the deepest transformation of the week. And Hecate stands at the crossroad asking, Who are you afraid to become? What power are you still keeping hidden to stay safe? Friday is the day to let an old version of yourself die so the priestess can fully emerge. So I called up one of my Coven sisters to talk about this with me because some wounds need to be witnessed, not just explained. April is a fellow somatic therapist specializing in highly sensitive people, and she's also my friend and Coven sister. We're going to explore this wound together. Not as me interviewing an expert, but as two women who are both working with this, learning from it, healing it. This is deeply personal for both of us. So let's dive in. So, welcoming April. You want to say hi? Hi. Hello. So, this is my friend April. And yeah, we're we're sitting here thinking about this episode and doing this episode and how, in a way, this is also a claiming of the witch wound, right? So, April, I wanted to start with when did you first recognize the witch wound in yourself? But also giving a giving space to this moment and what's arising.

SPEAKER_01: 4:10

Yeah, well, I'll speak more to when I first started recognizing the witch wound and starting to make those connections. But yeah, as we were sitting down and getting ready to start this, like I noticed the witch wound is activated in me right now because when Casey asked me to do this and she knows me so well, so she knew which parts would come up. And it was the part that was like really excited, like, heck yeah, like let's do it. And then the other part that's like, oh my gosh, you know, all the things that brings up fear of like, who am I, or do I have anything to say, or am I gonna be able to like access my wisdom in a moment or in a conversation, just all of these things, and so that's the beauty of this process, for better or worse, is that when you're working with something like the witch wound, you'll start to co-create opportunities where you can work through that. And so this was this is a really fun, sweet example of that. Um, because I'm so grateful to do this and so excited, and then noticing that witch wound come up, and then also being able to honor that part and you know, let that be witnessed by Casey and then y'all in this in this moment.

SPEAKER_00: 5:33

Yeah, I think we're we're so excited to have you here. I can only really speak for me, but I I'm excited. And I think what we're really speaking to in this moment, and what I'm hearing is the way that the witch wound is an ongoing process, right? Like we have both claimed witchiness and being spiritual women and being healers in most aspects of our lives, and yet there's always more.

SPEAKER_01: 6:02

Yeah, absolutely. There almost feels like there's like levels of growth and development and like new contexts that will um activate that or give us an opportunity to grow in that, and so this is a great example of that, and so yeah, maybe that leads into just when I first started to recognize or maybe use that terminology, and there was something cooking inside of me um through graduate school, and so I learned a lot, a little bit before grad school, but really throughout grad schools, learning about highly sensitive people, which we're gonna talk a little bit more about um the facets of that in a moment, but just being able to honor my sensitivity. And um we were, you know, as when you're starting to be a therapist, you're an internship and you're thinking about what kind of clients and what kind of folks you want to work with. And for me, it started to be really clear that I wanted to work with highly sensitive people because uh part of my witch wound and my like wounded healer was learning a lot through my own experience and really wanting to empower others because sensitivity is seen as you know, in greater societies, as less than. And while it's not the same as introversion, like ex like extroversion is really celebrated in our society. So I really I felt really called. I really wanted to sit with people and I wanted to help them understand how they oriented and their nervous systems. And when it was time for us to write our master's paper at the end of our three-year program, there must have been some alchemy, like even the word witch was coming through. And I was thinking about this idea of externalizing. So, like when we're healing, our sensitive folks can really internalize things and take on things. And how do we see it as just a part of us and not the whole of us? And so I was thinking about this way to externalize, and I was thinking about the witch's cauldron, and there's just something that clicked for me of like starting to that was one of the first, like this was a progressive thing, but this is one of the first clickings of like which, oh, I really resonate with that, like witch's cauldron, alchemy, and then that was like one of the first pieces, and then I remember when our friendship deepened, sort of towards the end of grad school and like after. And I remember us sitting on my couch, and Casey was teaching me about the goddesses, and I started really connecting with Hecate, but then we were like, we should start a coven, and that kind of felt like the next piece of like the witch wound and like sisterhood around it. So just to go back to this idea of like there's these like next levels of like being seen and you know, identifying with the word witch, and like, whoa, and what does that mean?

SPEAKER_00: 9:09

Yeah, I think there's so many levels, and I think the connection with highly sensitive people is really important, and also this connection with healers. Before we get into the weeds of HSPs, I want to go back to the history for a moment. The witch hunts, the burnings. Just for our listeners, between approximately 1427 and 1782, witch trials spread across Europe, with the peak occurring between 1580 and 1630. And historians estimate that around 40,000 to 60,000 people were executed out of roughly 110,000 trials. And the hunts were most severe in southwestern Germany, Switzerland, France, and northern Italy. But here's what's important to understand: while popular culture often says millions of women, healers, and midwives were targeted, the historical evidence actually shows something more complex. And it is showing that about 75 to 85% of those accused were women. And the women who were targeted were often accused by their own neighbors during times of social upheaval, religious warfare, and economic crisis. They were seen as threats. And it's not necessarily just because of specific skills that they had, but because they were perceived as different, difficult, or dangerous in some way. And to me, that just screams Lilith energy. So I guess, you know, what do you think it was about women, especially women who didn't conform, women who were visible, who had some kind of power or knowledge that made them such easy targets during collective times of fear?

SPEAKER_01: 10:52

I just think about the, I mean, power can be such a loaded word that I'm just thinking about how powerful women are and like how intuitive they are, how empathic they are, you know, even how connected they are to nature. Um, so if you're thinking about like, you know, in the witch hunts, it was like women who used herbs, you know, and then were called like witch doctors, you know, like they were doing some kind of weird voodoo, even though they were using the elements of nature and they were actually helping people heal. And so, yeah, there's something about that that I think to like the collective, um, like patriarchal, like the archetype of unhealed masculine energy that's encompassed in you know all of us and different generations and times and places and history has looked very different, but there's a lot of similar tenets. And I think there's something about not being able to honor that empowerment in women and being afraid of it.

SPEAKER_00: 12:03

I think even today, it's really scary to be visible with our spiritual work in a world where the feminist movement and women's empowerment movements have really been demonized as these anti-man hating movements. And I've seen that as I talked about it a little bit in the Lilith episode. And I also think that I've seen a lot of really beautifully integrated Lilith energy. And I'm saying Lilith because she's who for me shows up when it's like this fight. Or Kali, too, like this fight for fight for justice, especially. Lilith's fight for equality between genders. And I think um, yeah, when I think about those women, I think about it's women who just refuse to fawn. Right. And with current events today, I know we were talking about, you know, a little bit before the podcast, just everything that's been happening in the world. Yeah, and how how it's hard sometimes to discern between an intuitive place of okay, now's really the time to maybe stay hidden or fawn versus when the witch wound is keeping us small versus when we actually have enough safety. And what is enough safety? You know, there's never gonna be such a thing as perfect safety. It's always taking a leap of faith to put yourself out there, to stand up for yourself, to speak up. And there also is a purpose to Fawn to the staying hidden. So, how do we start to balance both? But yeah, I'm I'm curious what what your thoughts are on that and also the witch wound in 2026.

SPEAKER_01: 14:08

Yeah, well, I feel like something that's relevant and a piece that I sort of left out when I was talking about how I was doing my master's paper and this witch wound um kind of clicked into place. And so it's like it it resonates. Like I, you know, I identify as female. Um, and so for me, like I do really connect like traditionally, like the word witch with women, and also there are a lot of other marginalized groups, like folks of color, you know, especially marginalization for um women of color. And so that feels really important because the witch wound also, not to take away the concentration and like of what we're talking about, but just all encompassing is that it's bigger groups of people have felt the witch wound because essentially it's like power over marginalization, fear of difference, fear of outspokenness, fear of empowerment, um, in whatever way that that looks. And so it's just to broaden that out, and then we're seeing a lot of that play out today, and in a in a lot of scary ways. And so, yeah, this conversation we were having, because it's like sometimes it is just a spiritual thing where you're sort of um, I wouldn't say in your way, but you're having the witch wound and it's blocking, and there's a way that you can kind of like pull through and see what's on the other side, and there might be uh repercussions of maybe somebody will doesn't like you, maybe you know, you lose friends, and not to like discredit that these aren't like important or painful things at the time, but it's just like as you get more in alignment with who you are, sometimes you'll naturally lose people, or there'll be consequences like this, or that you just might be in a bunch of discomfort because your somatic body is trying to catch up with like where your learning and growing is going. And so there's that piece, and then there's like some of these real, like you think about activism and a lot of protests going on, like there's like physical, actual physical safety to think about in how we're showing up for groups of people um and advocating for equity and just human decency and human rights for everyone and all types of folks.

SPEAKER_00: 16:34

I think that's so important. And thank you for bringing in that nuance. I think that's one of the my goals with this podcast is to always be holding some nuanced perspectives that we don't get to hear elsewhere. And and also circling back to the way that trauma lives in the body. Last episode I talked a little bit about intergenerational trauma, and that lives in everyone who's well, really it lives in everyone, period, but especially in all these marginalized groups, and this historical trauma, too, of women who are descended from witches or who had past lives if they believe in that. But that trauma really lives in us and in our tissues and in our bodies today. And that shows up in the way we respond to these situations. And so it's this complex dynamic of how do you advocate for yourself to have the right to exist for who you are? How do you advocate for that right for everyone? For everyone, regardless of their race, gender, sexual orientation, size, ethnicity, how do we how do we advocate that everyone should get to be themselves in this world? Yeah. And I think that's a big piece of the witch wound is this idea that it's okay to be yourself. Because the women who were persecuted, and the men, and there were probably non-binary folks at the time that I'm sure were persecuted, that we don't even have documentation of because it was probably written out. How do we how do we hold all of that? Knowing this historical trauma lives in our bodies and can so easily send us into fight, flight, freeze. And I get curious how much of that is showing up in the realm of chronic illness and in highly sensitive people. And last episode, I had talked about my own journey with chronic illness a lot and how some of that relates to the priestess wound for me a little bit. Just taking in so much information and having such a highly sensitive nervous system from this ancestral intergenerational patterns, plus the overstimulating world we live in.

SPEAKER_02: 18:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 19:00

Yeah. Well, that brings up like one of my favorite um neuroscience facts is that we have like 14 generations of our ancestors' DNA that lives inside of our bodies. So if you think about that, it's like that is a whole lot of not just trauma, there's resilience too. So we can look at both sides. But that's a lot like that that kind of makes my brain just kind of shut down. Because it's like most of us don't even know a lot, maybe one generation, like maybe we knew our grandparents, maybe we only know our parents. Some of us are lucky enough to know our great-grandparents, and maybe you know some of the stories or some of the things that they've gone through, but there's just so much that we don't know. And so this this chronic illness piece is you know, is really fascinating. And they've, you know, I'm not going to be able to regurgitate a lot of facts, but they they've done lots of studies, and like even people who have gone as far as like um had having famine, you know, like hundreds of years ago in like Irish. Descent. It's like a lot of people will deal with eating disorders. And so to your point, it's like they're they are actually doing research. And then there's like all the things that sometimes can't be diagnosed. And like, yeah, both of us have had a lot of um health things. I I'm 40 years old. I was finally diagnosed with endometriosis at the age of 37, you know, and had like chronic digestive issues around my cycle. And like the fact that that wasn't, I mean, that there's a whole tangent of like misogyny is alive well in our culture and especially in our in our medical system, especially for um women of color. But um yeah, it just does feel really relevant. And I think going back to like this excess, it's you know, it's kind of like an ongoing question of like how do we deal with this? Like, first of all, it's like knowing some of the history and the neuroscience and information around this, and hopefully that can help us have some compassion for ourselves and and hopefully for others, because you know, our bodies are even when they're struggling, they're super intelligent and they have a lot of wisdom. And that's a big part of the like witch moon, also, is like trusting the body and trusting the wisdom because our society also, when you have chronic health, will be like there's something wrong with you, and a lot of times it's just a sensitive body that's actually been really uh attuned and oversaturated, and there's a really brilliant and reasonable reason why it's struggling in the overstimulated society that we live in.

SPEAKER_00: 21:43

Yeah. I mean, last episode we were definitely circling around some similar, some similar themes and concepts. And this piece around endometriosis, I don't have research on this, but I know I have it, and you just disclosed you have it, um, which of course I knew, but our audience didn't. And I have a lot of women in my life who are increasingly being diagnosed. And I think in part it's just because it's more known now, and so more people are getting it diagnosed. And maybe that's credit to social media, honestly, even though I'm pretty anti-meta platforms myself. But um, but I think, you know, at the end of the day, there's something to that. And there are these correlations that I've noticed between chronic illness, autoimmune conditions, endometriosis, and of course, this trait of highly sensitive people and the witch wound. Yeah, so before we before we go farther, I do want to go more into highly sensitive people and this this theme that we're circling around of hypersensitivity and also that relationship to chronic illness, of course, and the witch wound. But I want to explain for the audience what we mean by HSP, what a highly sensitive person is. So, highly sensitive person was a term coined by the psychologist Dr. Elaine Aaron to describe people who have a more sensitive nervous system. And according to her, the estimates accounted that that was probably about 15 to 20 percent of the population. And HSP is not an official DSM disorder, right? It's a trait. It is a form of neurodivergence, and HSPs process information more deeply, picking up on subtleties others might miss are more affected by other people's emotions, and can become easily overwhelmed by intense stimuli. Personally, I really struggle with smell, which of course correlates to my human design sense, which I'm I'm curious what's happening with that. But um, historically, HSPs might have been the people sensing danger before others, noticing when someone was sick, picking up on emotional undercurrents, sensitivities that could be called intuition, knowing, or even magic. So is there something about being an HSP, and I know you and I both identify as such, that makes us more susceptible to carrying the witch wound? Like we literally feel more, sense more, pick up on collective trauma more easily. What do you think?

SPEAKER_01: 24:23

I I definitely think that there is a correlation. There's definitely a correlation there. And with you know, just thinking about our world and you know, our our ages, like we're in the age of like the technology technology boom, right? Like we still remember being a child and like you know, having little technology, and it's like really risen. And I think about that in particular as like as a form of overstimulation, just like how how and how in the world right now, like we have access like immediately to things that are going on all over in the world, and our bodies, I don't think we're meant to handle that, right? Like, you know, hundreds of years ago, it would take weeks for people to get information on the other side of the world, and there's pros and cons to this, right? But especially for us sensitive folks, it's just like taking in all of that input, and that's what's happening currently. You know, we already just talked about like the intergenerational wounds and and things like that, but um, yeah, I definitely think there's a correlation with the chronic illness and like what's being held in our bodies, and I think that's why it's so important to one, be able to to um, like you said, it's not diagnosed, but to be able to recognize simple symptomatically, like if it's something that you resonate with and be able to work with it because it goes back to that like how do you like work with it? It's not not necessarily that you're not gonna be sensitive because it's it's just an innate thing, right? It's a sensitivity. So I think that can be an additional disillusion at the beginning when you find that that you're highly sensitive. You know, there's this like, oh maybe I can make the sensitivity go away, but it's if you just learn to work with it, and a big part of that is honoring it and seeing the gifts, and there are some things that can feel really challenging, especially in this day and age, especially of because of the things that are celebrated in our culture, aren't necessarily those traits, and a lot of the sensitivity goes back to this. Um, not always like we all have feminine and masculine energy, but is connected to the witch moon and like femininity as well.

SPEAKER_00: 26:52

Well, yeah, I mean, I think we've we've talked about it a lot, but we're really taught to reject the soft parts of ourselves, to reject the empathetic parts. And that comes in so many forms. I mean, at first it's like when you're socialized as a woman, it's considered to be a good trait, right? Like they want you to be empathetic as a child, but not too empathetic, or you're burdensome. And they want you to be empathetic in relationship, but again, not too empathetic. And then when you are, and there's backlash, it gets hurt. And every time it you get hurt, you shut that part of you deeper and deeper inside. And I I also really struggle with the constant, constant overwhelm and input of our news cycle and the world we live in. And that's one of the reasons I'm not on social media. I do have a LinkedIn, but I feel like LinkedIn has way less of an addictive quality than some other media platforms. But I think part of that is just this constant overwhelm of information takes a lot of capacity for me. Takes a lot of capacity, and it feels like you're deceptively resting when you're scrolling Instagram or something. But at the end of the day, I end up feeling more drained. And so I've I've kind of learned at this point this balance of I have, you know, email newsletter subscriptions I subscribe to. There are a few podcasters that I like for my own news. And that feels like I get a little bit more choice in how I engage with it, and it comes in in a titrated way, right? Rather than constantly being in my face. And still sometimes it's overwhelming. And I feel it in my body. It's like there's this kind of numbing buzz that happens when I'm taking in too much. And I kind of feel all these, all these walls coming up around me, and yet at the same time just pulling further and further inside myself, but in a way that doesn't feel good. It feels like I'm I'm going into like a dark energy. And there's something metallic. I don't know why I'm having this image of metal, but there's something like metallic about it for me. It's like that dark gray quality. And I'm so visual. But I I get curious if you think there's any specific ways that the witch wound lives in the body for HSPs. Do you think it's in the nervous system primarily? Is it in our fascia? I don't know. And I don't have answers to this, and I know you don't have exact answers either. I'm just curious to how that feels for you.

SPEAKER_01: 29:53

I think, yeah. I mean, I think from my lived experience, I would say nervous system for sure, fascia, uh yeah, just tissue in general. Because I'm even thinking about endometriosis. I'm like, you know, it's like an estrogen-dominant disease that's like creates excess tissue in and around the reproductive organs. Um, and so just even that, and that, you know, going back to this intergenerational, like that's highly um, like my mom had it also. So it's highly um it's the word that I'm looking for. Geneticenetic. Yeah. Yeah. Um and and then just thinking about um my brain is going in lots of different directions, but like thinking about the nervous system, like our nervous systems are created from our caregivers' nervous systems, and so you know, this isn't to make like any any caregivers or any parents wrong, you know, because parents are human and human is hard, like being a parent is hard, and it's like when you have a highly sensitive child, like they are going to pick up a lot, even pre-verbally, around their nervous system of their parent. And so that, you know, that could be circumstances outside of even a parent's control, just like chaos, or if you grew up in a like worn-torn, you know, country, you know, like your your little nervous system is gonna be so sensitive, and then it's almost like it can get caught and stuck in those places, and that's why it's so important to work with the somatic work, to work with the nervous system as well, because it's just this constant signal of sort of like where we are physically, emotionally, energetically.

SPEAKER_00: 31:48

I think that's a great segue into working with the witch wound and this idea of healing. And you kind of answered this question a little bit, but whether or not it's like ever healed or if it's an ongoing relationship.

SPEAKER_02: 32:03

Right.

SPEAKER_00: 32:04

And you answered this about HSPs and the witch wound. And I'm curious. And and in my own experience, it's kind of like as soon as I felt like I reached a good place with the witch wound, then I like hit the priestess wound, which is just another layer of the witch wound, really, at the end of the day. Yeah, you know, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 32:22

I mean, it's such a great question, and yeah, like technically the verdict's still out, but my sense is that it is it is ongoing. And that's been my experience too, like seasons, different challenges in life. Because we do, when you're working with the body, you can create more capacity. You're working with your nervous system, you can create more capacity for things. I think a lot of times if we're continuing to grow and evolve, we're continuing to hit the ceiling on that, you know, and then you add like specific trauma that we're trying to heal, and then we're trying to create safety in our bodies. It goes back to what we're saying of like, how do you um move forward and what is what is safe enough, but like how do you learn how to take care of yourself? Because I think the myth sometimes, too, is that like when we talk about nervous system regulation, is that we have to be regulated all the time, and the fact of the matter is like that's impossible. So it's like, how do you work with your system to re-regulate yourself? Because even when you're excited about something, that's can be dysregulation, right? And that's not necessarily negative, and that can be, you know, starting a new project or doing having a child or like really, you know, incredible things in life that are really exciting and joyful. But, you know, if they're uncertain, life is uncertain.

SPEAKER_00: 33:48

Totally. And I always say that for me, nervous system healing is more about not getting stuck in one state, it's more about having the ability to move freely through them, right? Like when you're safe, being able to come back into safety faster. And again, by safe, I mean safe enough, right? Um, but when you're home and you're with your dog on the couch and you just have a blanket and a cup of tea, like being able to come back and settle into that space relatively quickly, I think is a sign of a healed nervous system.

SPEAKER_02: 34:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 34:25

And then also a healed nervous system is responsive. It's responsive to the environment. Right. It's like, okay, I'm I'm driving and uh the light turns red and I know to break, right? Like I need to be able to respond to my environment, even if that is sending us a little bit into sympathetic. I personally feel like driving in and of itself is always a little sympathetic because you have to be so focused. And yeah, and also knowing that it's okay to shut down sometimes, especially when you're sick or when the world's totally overwhelming and your nervous system's like, I just can't. I I can't right now, and I need to I need to take a nap. So it is really about honoring it and allowing it to move freely between the different nervous system states without getting stuck in any one place for too long. When we're stuck, that's where you know chronic illness shows up. It shows up in the body. It's it's really just stuck energy at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_02: 35:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 35:37

And so I guess any practices that might help, or just in general, what's helped you work with this switch wound? And anything from your thesis, too, that you noticed came up.

SPEAKER_01: 35:52

So I think one thing too for highly sensitive people is, and this can be hard because of societal expectations, and it's like everything's like blah, blah, blah. Let's do it. We gotta get it done. Capitalism, like we gotta work, work, work, is like being able to slow down. Take a break, and that might even look like a 30-second break while you're doing something, allowing yourself to take a breath. So it can be, you know, sometimes it's because of life and and situations and circumstances, it can be hard to take like a whole day off or this and that when we talk about self-care. But I think the thing that I find really helpful for myself and like to really empower my clients is to think about these micro ways of self-care and these like small things that we can do. And so, again, taking a pause, taking a breath, scheduling in downtime. And you know, as you mentioned earlier, like your sense of smell is a big part of your sensitivity. My digestion is a big part of my sensitivity, and so um, this is an ongoing process for me, but it's like, am I in a regulated space when I eat? Am I slowing down when I eat? Like, that's one thing. And it's more than just uh digesting food, it's also digesting life, right? It's like a part of our part of our digestive systems. But um kind of spoke to the social media. I find that highly sensitive folks, like we really more than others need to like monitor our our social media time because it can get very overstimulating, and we can um, even if we're lying down on the couch, we can get hooked into this like hyper um hyper arousal place. And because when you are so empathic, you can literally put yourself into a situation or scenario so deeply, and it can be so intense to be in other people's experiences constantly because you're also trying to manage your own, and it's feeling as if you're it's your own when you're in this deep empathic state, and so um that can cause a lot of fatigue. So, a big part of it too is like highly sensitive folks are often empathic. So it's like how you work with boundaries, right? Like, how do you show up and be loving and caring? And I think a lot of HSQs are just natural givers. So, like, how do you find the balance between giving to others and making sure you're nourishing yourself and filling up your own cup? And that's gonna look, you know, different for different folks, whether it's connected with nature, um, whether it's taking baths or just sitting and talking or spending time with people that you love. And I think the energy you brought this up earlier when you were talking about energy being stuck in the nervous system, but a lot of highly sensitive people are very energetic people, so like finding energetic practices that help. So, just a couple that come to mind that are really helpful. Water is really helpful for me. So I will often like take showers throughout the day, and it's not this big long process because I'm trying to clean myself. It's like I just need the water, you know, on my face and my body to just kind of shed the day or shed something that I'm dealing with. Um, and if I don't have time to take a shower, like I'll use just like rose water or something, like spritz it on my face, and sometimes that'll just help me feel like oh, like I can breathe, like I'm sludged off some kind of energy that maybe wasn't mine or that I was holding on to. Um and you know, energetic practices also can um lead into some physical practices, and if you're thinking about like we have many more than five senses, but if you can just think about the the five senses like. if there are certain scents that you enjoy like that can be clearing for you if there's soothing music that regulates your nervous system. Um yeah we're a big Enya household my partner and I I love I love all kinds of music but definite like ambient or like what is the like Hertz one that everyone always talks about is like 420 Hertz. Like oh the different frequencies yeah yeah so just there's a lot of different things and like I like to think about it as like a self-love or self-care recipe because you know we're all different and different things are going to help us but it's nice put like find your little recipe book and put in like what is what is helpful for me. And I feel really passionate. That was a huge piece of my journey is is getting clear on what I needed to support my sensitive body and it shifts and evolves right over time. But I feel really passionate about helping my clients do that too because it's so empowering and it helps you coming back to what you're talking about um the word malleable just kept coming up like your nervous system's more malleable yes yeah and that's like having practices is what helps helps that this is awesome and thinking back to your thesis one of the things that struck me was this idea of the cauldron the cauldron as metaphor and the cauldron as as a practice and just to speak to that um I really correlate that with the boundaries so I think of it in all of my relationships but when I was writing this I was thinking about it as a therapist like my boundary with the client right but as a sensitive person whether you're a therapist or not if you are highly sensitive like you are tuning deeply to the people around you and the people that you love. So this idea of the cauldron is like the cauldron also gets to hold some of it because I think as HSPs we sometimes feel it all right I'm gonna internalize it and that's what causes the nervous system dysregulation and the disease and it's like even this visualization practice is like can I let the cauldron hold some of this for me and the people I love me and my clients like I don't have to hold it all but I'm gonna I'm gonna hold space for it and we're gonna be with it together but I don't have to hold it I don't have to carry it and when I do this practice with clients it's not like they don't always resonate with the cauldron and of itself but it could be anything for you it can be any kind of object it could be a cloud it could be some musical instrument like it could be a tree anything in nature yeah anything that's just helping you to resource like I don't have to hold this all on my own. I can feel it I can move it through the body um you know even with some more physical like jumping shaking those are really great nervous system releases. Yeah so there's there's a lot there yeah cauldron is a great symbol and it's just yeah alchemy and this kind of feels full circle but it brings also into this peace and we kind of spoke towards it but it's having community you know whether you're a highly sensitive person whether you're specifically like identified as a witch you're thinking about the witch wound whether you have chronic health illness it's like it can be very isolating and roamy. So like being able to be in community has been one of the biggest gifts and the biggest nervous regulators the biggest like trauma supports because some days it's just hard like being human is hard and it's like the people around us that love us can actually see us. That can be one of the most the greatest gifts even if we're in pain that day still but it can help lighten our heart a little bit or help us feel less alone it definitely can.

SPEAKER_00: 44:14

And for me it's also this counterbalance toward putting all my needs in one cup we are often projected on as empathic healer women as someone who can meet every need for another person. And um my my partner and I laugh about this but Matt will joke that I meet somehow 95% of his needs which is probably too high. And right it's it's this idea of well where are you getting that other five percent rather than asking more from your from your partner or your primary caregiver. Even one parent can't meet every aspect of a child's need and they don't need to to be a good enough parent and and that that's a psychology term good enough parent but having this diversity of places that you can go with the full range of your emotional experience. And so many people either don't have that at all in their life or they only have it in partnership or they only have it in one close one-on-one friendship. And so the idea of having community of having you know and we have our mini coven um and April's part of the goddess coven but when we're talking about our coven we're talking about a group of kind of five somatic therapist witches of us there's this idea of like okay we have this container that we've set and the the container in a way could be symbolized by a cauldron and all of our stuff gets to exist in that room because we trust that each of us can hold our own and that every other person in that room is helping hold it. So no one person is fully burdening another and you can kind of in that way get rid of this idea of burdening right and that's such a great space for me especially in partnership when my partner's underresourced right because you know in partnership you tend to be each other's primary support but it's like okay we also need other places as as women I think it's really important to create community. And I think it's important to create community across gender as well which is why even though we're doing goddess work here and we're talking about women a lot and witches and the witch wound I want the goddess coven as a whole to have spaces that are completely inclusive. And so our Heal the Earth mission is a part of that which I'm really excited about. Also goddesses as archetypes can be worked with by anyone and so can this this idea of when you feel overwhelmed asking something else to help you hold it. And I often ask the earth to help me hold things too and that's why I'm bringing in Hail the earth and the symbol of a tree was really resonating with me. Because for me the earth can hold anything she's somehow holding all of us like we're just tiny little specks of glitter essentially you know every emotion we ever have is a is a speck of glitter to her glitter dust really. And so it's it's so lovely to have so many different places that you can resource and I think that that really matters for healing the witch wound and also just having places where it's safe to talk about what's coming up spiritually in your life. And so that was one of the intentions of building the goddess coven is to have this eventual community and we're still building it it's not built yet but to build this community where people can show up as their authentic selves and practice what that looks like practice what healing the witch wound looks like. And one of the best guides for this is of course Hecate because she's queen of witches we talked about Hecate in episode eight and I I know you work with Hecate as our guide but I want to deepen her exploration in this episode as well since she's the Queen of Witches, she's made in Mother Crone. So from your perspective how does Hecate help you stand at the crossroads of who I was and who I'm becoming especially with this week's Sun Pluto transit and also help us reclaim power that was taken. What does she teach us about that? I know that's a big question.

SPEAKER_01: 49:01

Take your time Yeah well Hecate's as Casey knows is very special to me because that was the first goddess that I ever worked with and met her in of course very transitional time in my life yeah so this idea of having this external support like this is this is a little it's a little it's a little existential to answer a little meta but it feels like having that as an external resource to just be like I don't have to go through this alone because transitions are so you know even if we're like ready for them even if we want them they can be so uncomfortable and they can be fraught with a lot of fear maybe some excitement too can be it can be a lot there can be a lot of conflicting emotions that come up a lot around it. And so using um Hekate's wisdom as as an anchor is really helpful for me and just again this external resourcing this like I am not alone and when I think and feel into this energy of not feeling like I have to do it all on my own like that does help me reclaim the power because it's like I am a part of something that is bigger than myself. It's not just like me and my you know while I'm I'm you know while I'm a wise like strong person like I'm not belittling like some of my strengths it's like but I'm also not from this like egoic place that like I have to like do it all and I have to be a martyr you know and I have to like hold it all it's like yes I can have a lot of great a attributes and I can I can work with things and be resilient but also like I don't have to do it alone and so the physical community but this but Hecate is also such a spiritual entity it's like yes I am I am not alone in this and then there's a lot of um there's a lot of ways like in meditation um I love visualizations with Hecate. I think it really yeah it just really has it really helps me sit in the uncertainty in a way that I don't feel like I was able to quite do in the same way before she was introduced into my life.

SPEAKER_00: 51:30

Do you feel like working with her makes the visibility piece easier?

SPEAKER_01: 51:35

Well I guess I would say that I think she helped me realize that I wanted to be more visible so there was that like oh yes like I I this is what I want and this is like I want to work with the witch woman I want to be more visible I don't want to feel this like all the suppression from this lifetime and my intergenerational traumas and lap past lives like I don't want that to like damper down what I came here to do what my Prada karma was my curriculum in this lifetime and I think the actual like actually working with so for example like today there was this like oh this is like I've proclaimed to friends I'm a part of a coven there's lots of ways that I'm like identifying as a witch but today being on this podcast with UKC was like oh this is like I don't know who's gonna see this or who's gonna hear this. This feels like a big visibility reach. And so while Hekate was very supportive with that it didn't stop the very human emotions and the fear that came up of like oh my God you know the like fast heartbeat like the limit the nervous energy of like oh my gosh and like all the you know the blocks that I had come up or all the things that I had come up. So it's kind of feels like a big both hand.

SPEAKER_00: 52:54

Yeah I agree what gets me over that hub often is this calling to be visible as teacher as torchbearer if we're using Hakate terms, right? As the one who guides. And it's like okay like I cannot guide others through the witch wound if they don't know that I'm available to do so. And so Hakate carries the torch in the dark that's that's what she is. And I think what we're really hitting on is what it means to be a torchbearer when the witch wound says stay hidden to do the scary thing anyways. And that's what motivates me.

SPEAKER_01: 53:41

Yeah that's a great point that's a good way to tie it all together because it's again like it makes it bigger than myself. So it's not about me and my ego and like I have to do this because I want to feel important or I want people to think I'm cool because I identify as a witch you know it's like that's really cool of you witch. But it's like I'm doing this because I really want to help other people and so part of that is going through your own initiation and being able to work for a bit that whole wounded healer like that's how we help others is through working through our own things and actually you know we kind of coming again full circle like we talked about this at the beginning where it's like a lot of times the things that you're working on like you'll be asked you'll be asked again and again to like keep doing those things as a practice and then you can when you can be that torch bearer like sit in that flame it's like then you have a little bit more like you're you're a better you can be a better guide or spaceholder for people because you know what it's like to sit in that fire for yourself.

SPEAKER_00: 54:47

This is what I've been framing like the whole season and online is the made into mother spiral right and I think crone is part of that too. I just haven't been speaking to crone um because I'm not there yet though I got my couple grays in um but I think this piece of okay we're gonna turn inward and see what's my work and I'm gonna focus on me and my personal journey and my personal growth path like that's evolved maiden. That's the evolved light piece of the maiden spiral and then going into mother is okay I'm gonna go out into the world and I'm gonna I'm gonna show these lessons and I'm gonna teach these lessons and I'm going to lead from that place whatever that looks like in your life and this is a huge piece of that for sure yeah that is huge and that's really important.

SPEAKER_01: 55:46

And I I think that's it's just so wonderful that you're doing this like this whole podcast because it's just it's so you have so much wisdom and it's been so much fun for me to have a personal relationship with you and then also like to see you like thriving and like sharing your wisdom and like stepping into that teacher mother role it's just it's cool.

SPEAKER_00: 56:14

Well I think yeah I mean I I think there's something really beautiful in being witnessed by people that you know are going to support you and this idea of what can what can happen when powerful women witness each other's power instead of fearing it. And how that's a piece of healing the witch wound.

SPEAKER_01: 56:37

Absolutely I mean that's yeah I mean that's a real huge one because a lot of women have fears around friendship with other women or there's a lot of comparison um and that particular witch wound like runs deep you know I think you even mentioned it earlier when you were like you know in the like witch hunts oh yeah how um historically a lot of people were turning by their neighbors yes exactly and so like that in itself is huge it would be like women who practiced earth magic together and then they would be there would be fear or intimidation by outside forces and then they would like give up their neighbor their sister their like coven member um and that can be an example of intergenerational witch wound and it's it's really intense so it's yeah it's been one of the biggest joys to be able to um be witnessed like female female friendship is just so vital I think it's vital to a lot of women but I think there's this Ruby Carr quote that I love but I'm not gonna and I'm not gonna say it verbatim as she does but it's essentially like it's like I can't I can live without romantic love but I can't survive without female friendship is essentially and so it's this idea of just like being seen so deeply um because of course we can be seen by men and your partners who are men or brothers friends you know but there's like something particular about somebody who's who's going through your your journey and has similar identities like that can be very very resourceful and very supportive.

SPEAKER_00: 58:34

Thank you April it's been so nice to have you on thank you so much for having me it can be so supportive and yeah it's been so nice to have someone that I know so well and who knows me so well um on for the first interview. Yeah I haven't done an interview before so this is it this is our first interview episode and I mean here's here's what I'm sitting with from this and our audience will get to take away what they want but I think some of the big pieces are that healing the witch wound doesn't mean that the fear goes away it means we learn to recognize it and act anyways and every time I release a podcast episode the witch wound whispers like who are you to teach this and I release it anyway. And also we can't heal this wound alone. We need coven we need sisterhood we need to witness each other's power and say yes you are the witch you are the priestess I see you and if you recognize the witch wound in yourself or our listeners know you're not alone and if you're afraid to claim your power that fear makes sense. Your ancestors were punished for theirs but you don't have to carry that fear anymore. This is your invitation to claim what's yours. If this work is serving you And you want to support the podcast, have a Patreon where you can become one of the Goddess Coven's founding members and have a hand in shaping our new community. The link is in the episode bio to join. And as always, everything we explore here lives in practice. There's a link in the episode description for our free website resources where you'll find our ritual grimoire with basic rituals and spells you can start using right away to reclaim your inner witch. Subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss an episode. Trust the spiral. This podcast offers spiritual and psychological education and priestess wisdom. This is not therapy, counseling, or mental health treatment. If you need mental health support, please contact a licensed provider and in a mental health emergency in the U.S., call 988.