Episode 20: Doing Good vs. Feeling Good

When was the last time you used your voice for someone who had no voice? Who in your life needs an advocate today?

Proverbs 31 begins not with the virtuous woman, but with a mother's urgent counsel to her son about using his voice for justice. King Lemuel's mother commands him to speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves and defend the rights of the poor and needy. We often fail to speak up due to indifference or fear of social pressure, becoming blind to the needs around us. God consistently calls His people to be defenders of the defenseless, requiring not just religious activity but active justice. Speaking truth effectively requires wisdom, timing, and relationship-building, following the example of Nathan confronting King David. Our prayers should reflect God's heart for the oppressed, moving beyond personal comfort to seek His kingdom and justice first.

Watch/Listen to Sermon at this link: https://www.fbcdan.com/sermons/words-matter-speak-up

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Welcome to Build, a podcast from Danville First Baptist Church. Build is where Sunday's message becomes Monday's conversation. Each episode we dig deeper into what God is teaching us, talk about how it shows up in real life, and help you keep building your faith beyond the weekend. Let's get started. Welcome to Build, the podcast of FEC Danville, where we aim to build on Sunday's sermon and ultimately build on our relationship with Christ. And um this week was it was fun to start out because the inside joke with the the title theme that words matter. Daniel explains that in the very beginning of the sermon. So if you missed that, go back and listen to that and you'll understand a little bit about that. But it was interesting because I mean I agree words matter, that's for sure. And uh but the kind of twist was you preached Proverbs 31, but not at all like anyone would expect. If you said I'm doing a sermon on Proverbs 31, every single person, not not a single person would think that you were going anywhere but to what a Proverbs 31 woman is. You bet. Which is fantastic. Um I will I'll be honest, I'm thinking I I I'm sure that I've read over these, but I couldn't have if you had said go find where uh this dude's mom's talking to him, I'd like I have no idea what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 1:35

Yeah. It's like those first nine verses, you know, are just a warm-up to get to the part about the woman and the wife, and and those are phenomenal. I mean they're phenomenal, which is why the first verses get overshadowed. Those verses are awesome because we are all looking for and desiring, you know, a proverbs, a proverbs 31 woman. And and and I know, you know, many women in this church are and strive to be Proverbs 31 women. Um, but yeah, you get you get a couple little verses there at the beginning of it where it's it's not about that at all. Not at all.

SPEAKER_01 2:04

But isn't that isn't that what we do in scripture all the time? Like really, like John 3.16 is good, but John 3.16 is so much better when you read it with 17, 18, 19. And yeah, it's like we pick out what is maybe the highlight, right? And we make it like it's the only right, the only context of that. And I I think Proverbs 31, I'm just like you guys, like, oh, okay, we're gonna talk about the virtuous women here. Sure. And instead we're talking about, you know, words matter and and looking out for the oppressed. And uh so I love it. I love it when the Bible comes to life a little different.

SPEAKER_03 2:37

Yeah. Well, explain to us just a bit what what you were talking about.

SPEAKER_00 2:41

Yeah, so the series is words matter, and we'll we'll go different directions, wanting to just highlight the importance and the power of our words, of speaking up, of our voice. You know, Jesus is the word of God, you know, and and and so our first week was speaking up. Um Dusty was was preaching at at our uh our previous pastor's church this past Sunday. Um, or or I definitely, you know, he he might have been hooping and hollering because I'm this is the type of sermon that hits Dusty right where his his heart strings are, man. Loves it. So um as a as a as an eight, he likes to speak up for the for his people and defend his people. Um and and so that's really what it was. Um we're talking about speaking up for those who can't speak for themselves. And and not someone who doesn't have the physical ability to speak, but someone because we live in a broken, sinful world, they they don't have the ability to speak because they can't be heard because those who could actually do something for them aren't listening. Yeah. Or if they are listening, they're perverting justice. Um the idea of being kind of like sitting at the city gate, that was what was common back then. At the at the city gate, uh even in some cities, there was like kind of a stadium is not the right word, but kind of stadium style seating. And that's where you would have like like Bo like Boaz with Ruth when he brings the elders together and says, Hey, here's what's happening, like that happens at the city gate. And that's usually where these things are referenced in scripture, these speaking up for someone. Well, surprise, surprise, back then, just like it is now, you know, bribes took place, you know, paying somebody off took place. Um, you know, if you were wealthy and well-to-do, then people had cared a little bit more what you had to say than if you didn't. And and that was true then, and it and it's true now. And so just the idea of um, gosh, I was just reading all over scripture where God talks about this all the time, and the prophets are talking about it all the time that God is the defender of the defenseless, that he he is the father of the fatherless, that he cares for the orphan and for the widow, and that you should too. Uh and I mentioned it in the sermon, and I'll and I'll finish with this that he says in Ezekiel 38 and 39 to Jerusalem, to Judea, he says, You are worse than your sister Sodom because of how much you aren't paying attention to those that are being oppressed and how adulterous you are with idols. You're only concerned with worldly things, and there's people right around you that you're stomping on for those to gain those things, and I can't stand that. And I will wipe you off the earth if you don't change. Ezekiel 39 says.

SPEAKER_01 5:32

So that's is that is it also rend your rend your arts, not your garments? That's in that same is that same thing. Because God says, like because you've done these things, like uh wrath is coming, but it's not too late. Rend your hearts. Yeah, like stop being religious and start looking out for the people who need looked out for. Like it's not about giving more money, praying longer, dressing better. Break your heart, and then I'll have I'll have mercy on you. Yes. But as long as you're just doing all the things to look the part, then there's a definite wrath coming.

SPEAKER_00 6:16

The the simplest way you could possibly put it is do good.

SPEAKER_02 6:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:21

Like God is sitting there and he's going, I don't care about looking good. I want you to do good. And the Jesus follower is called to do good. And that's what those things, you know, to seek justice, to be merciful, you know, Micah 6, 8, all those things. And in that, like you're referencing there, Dusty, he says, like, you're I can't stand your gatherings right now. Like when you gather together and you do this fake, pretentious, religious bumbo jumbo, it makes me want to scream and throw things at you by translation.

SPEAKER_02 6:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:53

I think it's a good translation. God, God, he can't stand that. And and he is, you know, Jesus's harshest words were for the people who had all the ability, power, and opportunity to do good for people, but were only good, only worried about looking good for God. He couldn't, that that that was the thing that he was the harshest about. Um, so it's just a thing that God God doesn't like it.

SPEAKER_03 7:19

Yeah, and we give those guys a hard time all of the time, but we do the exact same thing.

SPEAKER_01 7:25

We're those guys. It's it's easy to be those guys, right? You know, I I and I think you said I think this is right in the vein. You you said it Sunday, you know, like you said do good. God wants us to do good, not feel good. Right. And I think it's the same thing. God wants us to do good, not look good. I think that's all the same idea. Like if there is no credit, still do the good thing. Yes, if if it uh makes you not feel good because it means you missed a meal, or it means you were late to work, or it means you uh had to sacrifice it. It doesn't feel good, but uh did I do good? Do good. And you know, we know that coming from the sports world, we talk about all the time like, hey, uh don't don't don't listen to your body. Uh you know, push. You you got another rep in you, go, go, go, you can do it. You know, when you're tired, push through. It's the same thing spiritually. Uh it may not always feel good to do good, but we're called to do good. And uh, I just thought that I thought that was a really good point because too often we think the goal of this life is to gain more, get more, uh be more, and really it's uh do more good. Can we do good and point the credit back to Jesus?

SPEAKER_00 8:45

Yeah, if you can't be good if you can't be okay without it, you'll never be good with it. For sure. You know, whatever that thing is that you think once I gain this, then you know I remember when I first started teaching and coaching, I had a number in my head. If I can just, if I can just take on enough side jobs, drive a bus, do all these things, if I can just get to that number, then we'll be comfortable. You know, and that number now uh is about where teachers start, you know. And it just, it just it just doesn't work. That the world's way doesn't work, but but the joy and the and the and the and the wonderful uh spiritual growth and things that happen when you actually do good, yeah, those do bring lasting joy and lasting effects into our lives. Yeah, and I was talking about that too, like you were just saying, in a political context. You know, I actually said the word politics in my sermon, which I'm not scared to talk about politics uh when it comes to moral issues. Uh it doesn't bother me at all. You know, it's like you shouldn't be political from the pulpit. It's like I'm not being political when I'm talking about morality. Right. If politics spills into morality, then I am called to talk about it, actually. Um, but one of the things that I that I one of the reasons I was saying that to kind of expand on that a little bit, because I didn't want to spend a lot of time there in the sermon, was you know, I've I've uh you know come a long way from what I used to think, what I used to believe, what I used to understand to be true, and all those things when it comes to politics. There are a lot of opportunities and a lot of things said by politicians that that sound good and on the surface make you feel good. Yeah. But when you dig into them, when you ask the Thomas Sowell question, and then what?

SPEAKER_02 10:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:34

Right? Everybody likes to throw out these grand plans, like we're gonna do this, and it's like, well, and then what?

SPEAKER_02 10:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:40

And nobody ever asked that question or or or asked that question two or three times. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, I I'll give an example. Like it feels good to say we're gonna give this stuff to someone, right? Right, or do this service for someone, that we're gonna have this top-down, huge bureaucratic federal bureaucracy, federal program that's gonna do this good thing for someone. And it's like that feels good, but is it actually going to do good? Like we're gonna do this, this giveaway program. Okay, and then what? Like, what's gonna be the repercussion of that? What's gonna come of that? Like it sounds good, feels good to say that we're gonna do this thing, but is that actually going to help? Is it actually gonna bring long-term prosperity? Is it actually going to lift someone out of the situation? Like, there's all these questions that come after that. So don't just settle on what feels good. Right. Think about what actually does.

SPEAKER_03 11:32

To give people stuff. Absolutely. But very seldom in the sense of meeting needs, does it does it have long-term effects. Right. It it meets the immediate need, and sometimes that you need to do that. Sure. Like I we meet a lot of people's immediate needs on a daily basis here at the church. Right. By by give providing some some amount of food. And that but it's really not enough. Like we're not set up to support feeding them forever. Right. And so you know is there a policy, some something we can do to help them actually. Right. But it couldn't but it but it I I think it's got to be both sometimes. And that's where that's where what you're saying it falls off. We throw something big at a problem without any really lasting effects. But it feels good, right? Sounds good. Right.

SPEAKER_01 12:31

Well, and that's hard in ministry. I mean, it's hard in ministry too, because like excuse me, dealing with dealing with students all the time, it's like, okay, let's have an event. And I I love having an event because we're gonna get kids here that aren't normally here. But then what? Like, do we really want to serve them one out of 365 days? Okay, so we need to have a plan to get them here, and then we need to have a plan to give them the gospel, because hopefully we're gonna make an eternal impact. Sure. And then we need to have a plan for trying to get them to come back and get them plugged in, and then we need to have a plan into how to utilize them to get others here. And it's hard, it's hard, but it sometimes it's easy to just throw an event together, do an event, and say, like, look what we did. Right. It feels good.

SPEAKER_00 13:17

Yeah. But there's a verse, I wish I had it in front of me. Um, oh gosh, it's in the Psalms, and and the message translation of it is it's talking about, you know, doing big things, but not really with much eternal impact. Yeah. Um, but it really is stuff that just makes you feel good. And it says, your your God-sized event where I'm not actually there makes me sick. And I was like, oh, that stings, you know, and it does, it's not because it's not the the size of the event that makes it spiritual or not. Right. Um, but it was just the idea of like it's made me ask questions when I'm evaluating what we're doing. I want, I want to make sure, okay, are we doing this so we can say, man, we did this event and had this many people here? Right. Or are we doing this so because our heart is, if we get that many people here, then that's that many people we have the opportunity to help, to love, to serve, to share Jesus with, to do all these things. Is it about so we can say, look how awesome Danville FBC is? Or is it so we can actually try to bring the gospel to people?

SPEAKER_03 14:29

You know, something useful that it kind of changed my perspective at my previous place of employment. You know, I've mentioned on here we've done, we did a lot of events and we were really good at them, but in somewhere we we lost focus, but but something that was that was encouraging that was said in a time when we were we were making some some some tracks is we're called to be obedient, but we're we're not in charge of attendance.

SPEAKER_02 14:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:00

And and because that becomes our focus. We we because we know you can go to uh m Monday we were at an evangelist conference, and I guarantee you if one person was asked in that conference, every single person was asked, so how many of y'all running on a Sunday morning? Like that, we always ask that question, and it's completely irrelevant. It makes no difference because you there's there'll be major things happening at a church of 50 and nothing happening at a church of 500.

SPEAKER_00 15:37

Or vice versa. Yeah, or major things happening at a church of 500.

SPEAKER_03 15:40

The number does not matter. Doesn't matter, so you know, but we put so much emphasis on numbers. But measurables, exactly. We want to know were we successful? Right. And coming like what does that even mean? Right. What standard, what measuring tape are we using to measure successful?

SPEAKER_00 15:56

Yeah, if we use that, if we if Jeremiah, you know, was a was a pastor or prophet today, you know, he would be fired and unsuccessful by by American church standards because I mean nobody listened to his message. Yeah, yeah. But God said you were faithful.

SPEAKER_02 16:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:10

I think he, I think he heard well done, my good and faithful servant, when he got there, even though there was zero worldly success to his ministry. I say zero, zero measurable numerical success to his ministry. Um, so yeah, yeah, yeah. I got a question for us. We we talked about um at the end of the sermon, we talked about um some of the things that keep us from speaking up. One of those being indifference or or a lack of awareness, um, different ways that we kind of said that, we prayed through that at prayer service. It was uh it I don't know, it it fired me up, but um so indifference or social pressure, uh, the idea of being ostracized or just, you know, or even literally persecuted, whatever the case may be. So um what do you what are your thoughts on on that? What holds us back from speaking up for those that need to? Um do you do either one of those hit you harder than the others, or or what's our what's our thoughts on that? You already smiling. I got a lot of thoughts on this.

SPEAKER_01 17:16

Because honestly, like when you you gave two examples. You said, you know, like when Nathan told David, you are that man, there was a there was a a chance of backlash. Right. I'm telling the king that he's a murderer and he's an adulterer and that God's not happy with him. And that's the one that I really wanted to focus on. Why because I I'd like to think I'd do that. Right. That one doesn't bother me. Right. So I'm like, okay, well, if that one doesn't bother me, that's probably not the one that I need to really spend the most time on. Right. So then you talk about the rich man Lazarus and how the rich man probably didn't uh hate Lazarus, he didn't want evil for Lazarus, he just didn't notice, like, okay, I've seen him there. Just a little too much. I probably I probably threw some crumbs down at some point and gave him some, but like he's been there for years. It's just the dude who sits at the just is what it is, it's that normal way of things.

SPEAKER_00 18:14

He's a little too busy, he's a little too important.

SPEAKER_01 18:17

Ouch. You know how many people in my life, even that at one point I tried and I didn't get them out of there, and then they just become oh well, a decoration. You know, like, oh I've tried, nothing I can do, right? Or or I've just never really noticed them because they're quiet and they sit off by themselves and they don't, and like that one hurt me because I I do feel like I'm passionate about the oppressed, and I do feel like I'm passionate about justice, but how many times do I not even recognize it because it's become so common a place to me, or even an annoyance? Like I'm doing everything I can do. Here's this dude again, right? I don't have the energy for this today, right? I'm tired, things aren't going well with this, like I just I I understand you got some issues, but I I don't have time today. Right, right.

SPEAKER_03 19:17

Man, we all got issues.

SPEAKER_01 19:18

Yeah. I mean, that one I didn't like it. So that's probably the one I needed to hear the most.

SPEAKER_00 19:25

Right. Yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, I I honestly think you in many, many cases, um, would be a Nathan. I think that I think that is a strength of yours, that you you do have a strong sense of justice. And I think you would um speak truth to power uh in a way that it would would cost you. But I I appreciate you sharing that. You know, I think that I think that is true of all of us in some form or fashion, that sometimes it's just a lack of awareness. I've told us before. The first mission trip I went on, like official church mission trip, we went to Clyde, New York, uh little sleepy town just off the Erie Canal, used to be hustling and bustling, you know, and now and then by the time we this was in 2011, I believe. Um we went there and a funny, funny part of that story is we went there to do one of the things we were gonna do was a was a VBS, and we get there, and on the flyer, it's the it's the week after that we're actually there. So the first thing we had to do was like lit literally go canvas the neighborhood and be like, hey, VBS is tomorrow, not next week. Yeah. And and so, but having to go door to door like that and just being on mission, being on a mission trip. Like I remember walking into the into the grocery, into the convenience store that was close to where we were staying at the church there. And I walked in and I was thinking, like, oh they're probably not safe. They probably don't go to church. I bet he could, you know, you just have these open eyes. And then it about halfway through the week, it clicked with me. And I went, I never do this at home. Yeah, I never, I never look at the world this way at home. Why, why don't I do this at home? Why, why am I looking for to serve and to meet needs and to have conversations about Jesus with anybody at home? And and I think we we we go through seasons of those types of things, and that's you know, we always talk about we're preaching from where we are. Like I I have I have gotten into a comfortable, mundane ministry routine. Yeah. And the Lord is is shocking me out of that in the last few weeks, and he is reminding me, hey, bud, there's a lot of things you're not paying attention to. Like the Sunday sermon is important, but it ain't all there is.

SPEAKER_02 21:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:42

You know, it ain't all there is to what you're called to. And and but aside from being to use Josh's term, a professional Christian, on some level, buddy, you're just a sheep that's supposed to be serving. So, you know, kudos on the professional Christian stuff. But how about you just go meet a need, you know? And you know, I think we think often when we think when I'm talking about these things, you know, the rich man the and the uh walking past Lazarus, I think we think of the person holding the sign at the red light. Right.

SPEAKER_02 22:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:15

Right. And and and that can be can be, you know, I I've definitely felt prompted by the Spirit of God to do something in those moments. But often at, you know, I either don't see them or I'm annoyed by them or whatever. Often, sure. Um, but I think it's way beyond that. It's way, it is that, but it's way beyond that. Like maybe it's the just the person at work that because of this event, that event, or this event in their life, they're they're being oppressed by the weight of a broken world. Yeah. And they need a spoken word. They need you to speak up and speak encouragement into them.

SPEAKER_03 22:55

They don't need anything except for you to see them.

SPEAKER_00 22:57

Yes. Sometimes just being seen makes all the difference in the world. And it's just that's the heart and passion behind, you know, that's the iceberg underneath the water behind the sermon. Like I'm telling I'm like, I have got to be more aware of what I the ministry needs around me.

SPEAKER_01 23:16

Well, and I think I think that goes, you know, to take it just a step further. They may have more than enough food. They may have more than enough money, they may have more than you do, but they're bankrupt spiritually. There you go. And no one's ever told them about Jesus because people assume they have everything. Right, yeah, but they don't have the most important thing. Right. And nobody's telling them. And they're oppressed in the worst kind of way because they don't even realize how oppressed.

SPEAKER_03 23:46

The poorest and most oppressed person is the lost person.

SPEAKER_01 23:50

Yes. Well, and when you talk about, you know, just seeing people, I I automatically go to a guy named Ronnie Johnson, and Ronnie Johnson's a pastor in Memphis, Tennessee. And you know, I've done some mission work with him. And um, man, I can remember being out on the streets and we're witnessing like crazy. And it it comes, it's time. We're in this break. We've got an event going on this tonight, and we're tired, and we've been walking, and we go eat at a fast food joint while we're just kind of in this downtime. And we're all standing in line, and you know, we've had the mission, we've had the mission mindset and mission work, and we're all talking, and and Ronnie Johnson's a he's a popular dude. Like everyone wants to pick Ronnie's brain. Ronnie, you know, has a quite a testimony, and and he's been saved from the streets, and now God's using him to save the streets. And so it's like, hey, where's brother Ronnie? Where's Brother Ronnie? Where's Brother Ronnie? And somebody just nonchalantly goes, back booth. And like, what? Like, back booth. And you look back there, and he's got three guys who aren't with us sitting in a booth sharing the gospel. And I'm like, But the mission was over there. Yeah, like we're not we're not on mission. We were on the mission, then we're going back to the mission. Right now, we're just eating, bro. We're just eating. Yeah. But he had eyes to see. These three dudes came there. He didn't buy their lunch, he didn't give them any worldly thing, but he said, like, I wonder if they've heard about Jesus. And he went and told them about Jesus. Like, Holly, brother Ronnie, I'm just we can't all be super saved, but I'm trying, man. I'm trying here. But I want us, I want to have eyes to see that.

SPEAKER_03 25:33

Yes. I mean, we've got a pretty good example of in in Jesus. He didn't give the woman at the well anything except for truth. Yep.

SPEAKER_01 25:42

Yeah. No, it's good.

SPEAKER_03 25:44

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

He told her, it's like I He told her the truth, but he didn't condemn her.

SPEAKER_03 25:48

No. And I can't give you uh nothing. I I can give you some bread, but you're gonna get hungry again. But I'll give you the living bread.

SPEAKER_00 25:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:58

So it's like we said he was on to something.

SPEAKER_00 26:00

It's both and it's both and because James says, if I have something that can help you and I don't share it with you, then what good does that do? Yeah. What actual Go be warmed and filled. Yeah. Oh thanks, bro. Yeah, thanks, buddy. Appreciate it, man. Thanks for the bite of that cheeseburger, you know what I'm saying? Like I I'm starving to death here. And so it's it's both and um it's not always the physically broke, poor, needy, destitute. Sometimes it's just the spiritual. Right. But it it sometimes it's both.

SPEAKER_03 26:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:30

Sometimes it's just just one.

SPEAKER_03 26:31

You know, I I I'm I definitely when when you talked about the the rich man thinking, eh. Because honestly, I tend to be indifferent to just most things. It's not that's not me looking down upon, and I'm not I'm not here like saying it's good. But I tend to just be indifferent to any anything. That's so I I have to actively war against overlooking everybody except for my immediate circle. Like that would be that's that's all I focus on, and I feel like I get I'll feel like that. That's all I'm responsible for. Right. I take care of mine and we're good. And so that's that's definitely a hard place to be. Um, but you brought when you brought up Nathan speaking to David, that's that's a conversation that we've had a lot at in our house. Um in in a slightly a slightly different context to that, that yes, David had Nathan speaking truth to him. And it and when David heard that it like snapped him back to reality and he and it broke him. Right. You know, now that's coming that David, we know from scripture that he was a man after God's own heart. So he obviously, for most of the time, he had a seemingly a right heart posture. Sure. But he had gotten off track. So that that truth brought him back to where he was. And he, you know, he we know he repented to God. We don't really have any detail of did he go around and make amends with all of we don't know. I'm you know, it wouldn't surprise me because he seemed like that he was that kind of guy.

SPEAKER_02 28:34

Right.

SPEAKER_03 28:35

But you brought up Nathan, you know, he's a prophet. He's Dan or David respected him knowing and hearing from God. And I think like sometimes we talk like Dusty said, he he identifies with that. And and I I know of lots of stories you talk about where you know you've kind of you've gone to bat for this group of people, or you spoke up when you thought this was and I and and I I here's where it's hard though. When it's one-on-one, yeah, when you're looking at that person in the face, somebody that you that you really love, so you want to tell them that you see that they're missing the mark, it's hard. And and and Kelly pointed this out. She said, Every every single one of us needs a Nathan, but none of us want one.

SPEAKER_01 29:34

That's that's good. That's real good. But I but I also think too, this is where being led by the Holy Spirit is so important because uh Nathan and David had a relationship, and David respected who Nathan was, and Nathan respected who David was. But I I think that it's uh spiritual wisdom, I think it's uh the Holy Spirit leading that he didn't walk into the room and say, uh David, what you've done is wrong, bro. Like you're God's God's mad. You're a jerk. How could you do that? He didn't say that. Instead, he tells the story of the poor man and the lamb and and still, and then he says, and when David is already in like, yeah, like of course that's wrong. That's obviously wrong. You can't do that, right? David, you're the man. Yeah. Well we we understand David as being a man after God's own heart. Nathan also knew David as a warrior, yeah, a mighty man of God who kills his enemies.

SPEAKER_03 30:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:39

If I just walk in and be like David, God's mad at you and he may rip the kingdom away from you because what you've done David's reaction may have been very different. Right. Even though he was a good man, he still was not gonna take that well. And I think following the spirit's leadership, one, having relationships crucial to being able to be a Nathan. Number two, uh understanding timing and delivery matter. And I think that's the problem is sometimes we want people to be gentle with us when they correct us, but we want to go in and be like, bro, that come on, man. You're better than that, Daniel. You're better than that. And then expect them to say, Yeah, I mean, you're right, I'm better than that. Right. And not be like, bro, like last week you were struggling with this. Why are you coming at me?

SPEAKER_03 31:31

And that goes that the that social paria of of doing that, that you're going to be outcast, and maybe it's outcast of a relationship. Yeah. Like you start weighing, is me saying this going to end this relationship? Right. And if it it maybe it is, is it worth it?

SPEAKER_02 31:54

Right.

SPEAKER_03 31:54

Is me being truthfully and honest, at least speaking truth in love to this person. Would I be okay losing that relationship for their because I love them so much? Right.

SPEAKER_01 32:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:09

Yes. And I think Nathan, Nathan, he he was confident in that. Right.

SPEAKER_01 32:13

Yeah. Yeah. But I also think like that, and I agree with you a hundred percent, Josh. The hard thing is just like sometimes the message is always offensive. Right. But sometimes I've delivered it offensively. Oh, yeah. And so if I lose the relationship because I delivered it poorly, I think that I have to answer for that.

SPEAKER_03 32:36

Right.

SPEAKER_01 32:37

Even as God's man, given God's word and God's message, sure, I have a responsibility to give it in a way that is receivable. Right. And then if I give it in a way that's receivable and they walk away, that still hurts. Yeah. That still stings bad. But at least I can say, like, God, I I I was obedient. I told them what I needed to tell them, and I did it in a way that it was seasoned with grace and it was seasoned with the salt of your word. God, in your time, restore this. Yeah. Restore this. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:14

Doug, Doug, Doug Miller taught me that concept, and then it's extrapolated out to multiple different ways in my life that I've learned. But initially, he said the the right thing done the wrong way is still wrong.

SPEAKER_02 33:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:27

And but and then that's true when you keep going. The right thing said at the wrong time is wrong. The right thing said the wrong way is wrong. The right thing said, you know, you can keep doing that. And so it's not just, well, I know the truth and I share the truth. It's like that's called being a jerk. Right.

SPEAKER_03 33:48

Like you don't get it. Which which that's what's holds me up 99% of the time, is I I've been told that I don't speak gently. And I and that's even when I'm, I think that I am. I think I'm being pretty gentle. I'm and so I know that in in I I don't deliver well. I I'm very aggressive. And uh so I I shy away from I shy away from confrontation because I'm not because I'm scared of confrontation, but because I'm overly confrontational. I'm scared of winning this confrontation. Yeah. And and and and at what cost? And I'm not blessed with the gift of gab.

SPEAKER_00 34:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:42

So quickly.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

Direct might be the word to use for Josh. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:46

Josh is direct. Yeah. You know, I always tell people, I'll be glad to tell you my opinion, but I'm not gonna share it unless you ask.

SPEAKER_02 34:54

Yeah.

unknown 34:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:56

And and so, and some people never do, and that's fine. I don't find, I don't mind having I I'm okay knowing that I'm right without telling you that I'm right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:09

I think I think sometimes, though, that's the value of like like some people that is going to come more natural, and you know, you know that for you. Yeah, and I think you're able to use that and pick and choose. But like that was one of my favorite things as an assistant basketball coach was I would go down and have a lot of conversations with players, you know, after the coach just destroyed you know their heart. And then I go down there and be like, hey man, go be good cop. Really, here's what he meant. Like he meant, you know, make sure you look before you pass. Like that's it. That's all he was saying. Like, like, we know you're gonna turn the ball over once in a while, but three times in a row is is too much. That's all he was saying. I know, I know how he said it, I know how it came across. I know you're crying. But like we need you to go back in here a minute and be productive. So don't listen to what he's to how he said it. Listen to what we need from the world. This is what he said, but this is what he meant. And I feel like sometimes I wish I had someone, you know, a spiritualist. Grace translator that would come around behind me and say, like, here's what Dusty meant. You know, he meant like You definitely needed that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I needed that I knew that in coaching for sure, but I need it sometimes in in ministry too, because and and I'll I'll be honest with you, going back to the the point of the message, I don't usually have a problem with that with the person who comes in to our group with no relationship with Jesus or comes into our group openly living in sin. It's the ones like I find myself having a hard time not needing a translator to say it with grace and love to the one who I expect more of. Like I shouldn't have to sugarcoat this for you. I shouldn't have to baby you, you know better.

SPEAKER_03 36:53

I expect the lost to act like lost people.

SPEAKER_01 36:55

Yeah, yeah. Well, when we act like lost people, that's a problem. Right. And it should be a problem.

SPEAKER_00 37:00

Right. Well, let's bring that full circle to what we just talked about. Was David saved? Say so. I would say so, you know. And and you know, did Nathan bring the truth to him? He did, but did he do it in a way that David could receive it? Yes. Did he maybe have a conversation with himself when he was away from David's room and preparing for this? Where he's like, I can't believe you were doing this. How could you possibly do this after all God has done for you and all you've seen? Like I he probably had that conversation then and maybe had that heart posture, but I think he rolled in there full of the spirit and didn't deliver it that way, you know.

SPEAKER_01 37:38

And that's so authentic. I'm sure Nathan's prayer too was that was part of it, but he isn't probably God. Really? This is the guy that you've put in charge. Like, God, listen. Is there any other Was his spiritual advisor? He's a murderer and adulterer. And you want me to go say to get right with God? Like, God, come on, man. Come on. There's got to be someone better than that.

SPEAKER_00 38:02

I just mentioned if you remember the song, the Lord uh Saul kills his thousands and David kills his tens of thousands? Yeah. If I could not go in there and get my head chopped off, Dave, that'd be great.

SPEAKER_01 38:11

Sure. Let me go tell him that he's doing wrong.

SPEAKER_00 38:13

Yeah, yeah. For sure, man. No doubt. No doubt. That's funny. Old Nathan. Where are we at? Let's see. Where are we? We've chased a rabbit or two.

SPEAKER_01 38:25

We have, but you said something the other day that in the sermon that I was like, it hit me bad. Okay, so like I'm gonna bridge what I was gonna say with what I was gonna say earlier, and I I got sidetracked from this too. But like, so when we're talking about doing good and not being comfortable, not just to be comfortable. Um for us, for for me, it looks different. I won't say for us. I started to for me, like it's not about what I'm willing to do or give up. But it there are times it's like, man, I just I'm tired. Man, I just I know I should go to the nursing home and and see see somebody there, or go to the hospital and see somebody, or or go cheer on, you know, this sporting event because my kids are, you know, the students in our ministry are there, but man, I it's been a long week. I just want to go home. I want to be comfortable. I mean, now I'm not saying we shouldn't protect ourselves and burn ourselves out. I'm not saying that, but I'm saying there are times it's a hundred percent just like I'd kind of like just go home, eat supper, and be done for today. Sure. It's been a long day. Sure. Uh but I know God's called me to do something else. And when I choose that, it is the exact same thing as withholding from this needy person who's sitting at the gate. It's the same thing. I've chosen my comfort over what they really need. Yeah for some of these kids, it may be it maybe I make a contact at that sporting event that uh helps a kid see, like, hey, Cutch Wright loves us. Let's let's go try anchor out. Let's just go see what he's got to say. And and and maybe they get saved, but they didn't because I chose to be tired and I went home and put my feet up and uh dozed off and took a pre-bed nap. You know, like is it worth it? Is it worth it? I don't think it is. And then piggybacking off of that with what you said the other day was that we have more when we think of worldly possessions, that's that's thinking of our own comfort. But when we think of worldly possessions, we have more now than most kings had back in these Bible times or in the ancient world. That blows my mind because I still stress about money and things and objects and retirement and all of these things. Yeah. And the reality is You got it pretty good. Got it real good compared to people now, but I have it even better compared to people from the ancient world. And like, how spoiled am I? How comfortable and self-centered am I that I would sacrifice anything spiritual for anything more physical when I already have so stinking much.

SPEAKER_00 41:13

Right. Yeah. Gosh, this is one of those things that if you grew up with Mickey Morris, you had this drilled into your head. And I mean it in a good way. I'm saying it, I'm saying it not good, but it, you know, my dad is the king of appreciating the little things, you know, like Gus said on on Lonesome Dove, you know what I mean? Just appreciate the little things in life, like a glass of buttermilk, not the other stuff that he says. But um, you know, but there is, there's some, there's a lot of wisdom in that, you know, and he he used he'd say, son, are you do you ever just stop and and and and be thankful for that hot shower? Do you realize what a privilege it is to have a hot shower? Um, you know, or or you know, he's the the eternal optimist type of person that would say, you know, if we had to park far away in the parking lot, well, son, just be glad you got the ability to walk. You may not have that one day, you know, things like that all the time. And it's and I still hear that when I'm parking far away and walking through a parking lot. I'm like, I should just be thankful I can walk. And it's true. Yeah, I should. It is a tremendous blessing. Yeah, for sure. You know, but yeah, the clean water, adequate food, shelter, um, hot water, uh, electricity, yeah, all of these modern air conditioning, holy cow, all of these modern conveniences that we have. Literally, you had to be wealthy to have those things a hundred years ago. Yeah. Like wealthy, wealthy. Like by American standards, wealthy.

SPEAKER_02 42:43

Right.

SPEAKER_00 42:44

You know what I mean? And now it's just a normal, it's a normal thing. And, you know, count your blessings, man. Count your blessings. Count your blessings.

SPEAKER_03 42:52

The great Wayman side would say people talk about the good old days. I don't remember being so good. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:01

I miss Wayman. I wish Wayman was still here. I miss him so bad. Oh, he had some good ones. He did.

SPEAKER_03 43:07

He did. Uh, you know, something you're I I wouldn't encourage you. If I I definitely understand what you're saying. And there's definitely times that that I think that that we get called to do something. And sometimes we're not obedient to do that. And and and those are probably the times that are are harder to wrestle, you wrestle with more when you're sitting at home not doing the thing. I think it's fair to sometimes ask yourself, like, why, why do I feel like I need to do this? Am I it is does the Lord want me to be in this place right now? Or do I am I feeling some sort of personal obligation?

SPEAKER_00 43:49

Opering up guilt or shame or fear or something along those lines.

SPEAKER_03 43:52

Yes. Because because uh at any given time, either one of those can be true. And if and if if you're definitely being called. You're number you're number one, you're not gonna be able to shake it. Like you're gonna you're not gonna be comfortable when you get home. Yeah. But sometimes you do need to just go rest.

SPEAKER_00 44:08

You're right. Like there's and then another part of that too, I think, is just setting up a healthy rhythm of your life. You know, and I king not do that. So tell us how. Yeah. Exactly. Um, you know, when you build the the the term everybody uses nowadays, when you build margin into something, when there's margin in your in your schedule so that you're not burnt completely out all the time, then it's easier to say yes to those types of things. And so, but you you already prefaced it with that though. You said, I'm not saying there's not times to rest, there's not times to, you know, you don't you don't save the world and lose your family, you know, all those types of things. Your your family's your primary responsibility. But I think a lot of the times, um I'm gonna get I'm gonna meddle a little bit. Some of the problem is our our lack of attention just to our physical health, you know, because uh I mean I'm in the worst physical shape of my life right now. And that affects my energy and that affects my focus and that affects my want to, and all those types of things. Um, and you know, so it it there's a whole gamut of of things that go into why I'm too tired to go do the thing God wants me to do. And a whole lot of stewardship issues that that I'm not taking taking care of. And so, you know, sometimes the sometimes we need to eat a little better, sometimes we need to exercise a little bit, sometimes we need to not be as busy. I think that is one of the biggest issues that we face is our schedules are so full and so busy.

SPEAKER_01 45:46

Um but I need to sleep more. I need to go to go to sleep and quit scrolling. It's usually like, man, I I just got home and I want to relax before I go to sleep because when I'm asleep, I don't feel myself relaxing. I want to relax. Yeah, but there is something to be said about kicking back, and I I'm the same way.

SPEAKER_03 46:08

If I get home at well, last night we hit we drove to Arkadelphia, saw Michaelina perform, and um then drove right back. And you know, it was I think I got woken up by a tornado. It was about midnight. By the time you kind of decompress everything, it's 1, 1.30, and then an hour later the tornado sirens are going off, and I gotta go drive fire trucks.

SPEAKER_00 46:34

I was saying Super Josh has got to go be a volunteer for our department.

SPEAKER_01 46:38

Dude, I'm gonna tell you right now, my our stuff went off, and my wife, she's and I said, Yeah, wake me up if we if we blow away. Like, I'm I'm gonna back asleep. She told me that at the C A already. She was so mad at me. Not at kids, I mean she she stayed over.

SPEAKER_00 46:53

She said she was under the covers like so you wouldn't see her screen and stuff.

SPEAKER_01 46:56

Roll over about an hour later. Like, I've been I've been back dead asleep. And I've for something she moved or something, I rolled over. I'm like, what are you doing? She's like, I'm watching the storm. I'm like, why? What are you gonna do? Like, yeah, all right, do you when I've rolled back over?

SPEAKER_03 47:12

I was like, that's always been been our house. And uh like last night, I I'm I'm kind of you know, you kind of you woke up and you're uh and then I'm like, oh, I'm supposed to go to the fire station. So I get there and then I kind of know what's going on. So I text Kelly, I'm like, well, there was a tornado spotted and it's moving this direction. You know, there we like there's a bunker at the fire station for our families during that time, which is great. And then we have the safe room. I like you might I never heard from her. Never heard from her. And I get home about an hour later after everything's all good. She's asleep.

SPEAKER_01 47:45

Dude, I'm not gonna lie, that was one of the best nights' sleep I've got. You know, and it's I would love to sit here and be like, you know, super Christian. Right. I just knew I was in God's hand. Like, no, it's like the rain on the tin roof, bro. I'm out. We'll roll with thunder. I'm gonna go, I'm gonna go, but I'm gonna I'd rather go in my sleep than and wake. So I'm just I slept good.

SPEAKER_03 48:07

So our early on when we were married, um, I had a buddy that he needed the place to stay for a little while. So he was it, I said, I've never storms have never I've usually I sleep through them. Yeah, and one night there was a and he he's knocking on the door, and I'm like, uh he said, uh I was gonna let you know there's a there's there's a tornado watch going on and I'm like okay. Thanks. I I I just thought you might want to know. Thank you. Honestly, I never considered it before that.

SPEAKER_01 48:42

So so we didn't know this was gonna turn into marriage counseling. But I'm just gonna say, like, these are conversations you need to have before you get married, right? Because when Mand and I first got married, we live in a house that was built the year before Arkansas became a state. Like this thing's been standing for. You're not exaggerating. I'm not exaggerating. It's it's the Peter Gap cabin. You can look it up online. That's where we lived. And I'm like, look, God can knock this house down, but anything outside of God is not going to knock this house down. It's been standing a long time. We're fine. And she's like, Well, we need to go to the basement. And so, like, I can remember being young in our marriage, be like, listen, I will move to the to the bottom story of the house, and that's as low as I'm going. And like, I I love you, and you can go to the basement, and I won't make fun of you. But I'm going to sleep. Like, I had no idea that we were, you know, option into the spectrum of that. You know, a little bit of nature nurture. Like, she grew up in a trailer house where when there was a storm, they went to a solid structure. And, you know, like I didn't understand that. I didn't understand how important it was, but but I'm just afraid something's gonna happen. Like, listen, I it it may or it may not, but I'm not going to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_00 49:59

As usual with a story like this, I hear Dusty's a jerk.

SPEAKER_01 50:02

Yeah, that's how she felt. But but 25 years in, and she got under the covers and scrolled. She didn't go to the bathroom, she didn't go get in the closet, she got under the covers and scrolled. So I've made progress. I've made progress with her.

SPEAKER_00 50:22

Is that what you would call that? You would call it progress. I don't know either. But it is true. Like that these are the conversations that need to take place.

SPEAKER_01 50:30

Need to talk about that before you get married.

SPEAKER_00 50:31

There's a lot of things like that.

SPEAKER_01 50:33

Otherwise, you're gonna end up in a bunker. Right. You don't want to be in.

SPEAKER_03 50:37

So I we're we're pushing up against time, but you you did ask a really uh good question. You challenged us to examine our prayers. And yeah, asking if how many uh of the oppressed would benefit if all of our prayers were answered. That's very telling.

SPEAKER_00 51:03

Here's the thing I've learned about prayer in general and and and that question in any spiritual context. You know, you talk about like the whole thing, like you want to shoe, see what you really care about, show me your calendar and show me your checking account. Yeah. The other thing I've learned is show me your prayers.

unknown 51:24

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 51:25

Show me your prayers. You can put that question on anything in context, and you can figure out what you value and what you're paying attention to. And and I said from the pulpit Sunday, like, there wouldn't be a single person or a single thing that would hardly that would that that that would change someone's life. You know, not that you don't pray for people's needs and those types of stuff, but I'm talking about like how okay, uh I'm I'm on the board for ABCFM, right? Arkansas Baptist Children and Family Ministries, um, the leading private foster care and adoption agency in the state. And and just came back from a board meeting yesterday where all these incredible numbers, you know, of all the great things that we have done in the last quarter and the last year and all that. Like it is a phenomenal ministry, dude. And then I'm sitting there and I and I have a reminder on my phone that reminds me to pray for them every Monday that we have a prayer for 2026 for ABCFM, and I'm at least praying for that weekly. So I guess maybe some good would but I'm talking about like how many kids would be out of foster care? How many kids would be adopted, right? What would happen to human traffickers? You know, like all these types of big issues, you know. I'm you know, I'm praying about X, Y, whatever the heck. And and I'm and I'm not, and I and and it's not a guilt trip. I'm not trying to do it as a guilt trip. It's I'm trying to do it as a wake-up call to myself, right? And and to anyone that can that has the heart to hear it and the the ears to hear it. Like there's so much more that can be done in our prayer life than we realize. I heard, I heard, this is your boy, I know, but I heard uh John Piper say the other day, and this was this was on the money. He said, the problem with most Christians is they pray like unbelievers.

SPEAKER_03 53:14

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 53:15

And he said, if you could. Yeah. And and and not just that, but like what they're praying about, you know. Help me find my keys and give me, give me, give me, give me. Like most of the prayers are about my needs and God doing something for me and being the Santa Claus in the sky and and all those types of things, like, you know, and it just that I hope that question is bothering everyone because it's bothering the heck out of me and and making me come to a reckoning of man, your heart is not focused on as often and as much as the things of God as that should be.

SPEAKER_01 53:52

Yeah. Yeah. So so that stood out to me too. But the question's not I don't think that we completely revamp and like I don't I don't think we're gonna just snap our fingers and suddenly we're gonna have the right heart. But what if we just we we also think we don't have time? Well, what if the time that we spent complaining about things that aren't right in the world? Come on. We spent praying that God would make them right. There you go. Yeah, or or you know, this is something that I shared with with First Baptist Maud this week, you know, like this is just conviction for me, but like I pray for my children. We all pray for our children. But what do I pray for my children? Well, I pray God keep them safe. Yeah, God watch over them, God help them be successful, God help them help them find a spouse that's gonna help their walk with you. God help them, help them do this, help them do that. What if I just scrapped 98.5% of that? And I just pray, God, use my babies, use them for your glory. Yes, I trust you with them. Yes. And if that means heartache, if that means, you know, we see that the mother of Jesus when when they're being when she's being told like this child's gonna you're gonna be pierced through with grief. Yes. But it's for the salvation of humanity. Yes. What did I say, God? Just I don't I don't want to pray. Look, it's a scary we should pray scary prayers. Yes, yeah. And it's a scary prayer to say, God, you know, use my use my babies, whatever that means. And I'll give you an example of a way that I failed this and I'm convicted of it. And at the same time, I'm like, I stand by it. I know it's not right and it's hard. So Addie comes to me five years ago and says, Dad, I want to be a missionary and I want to open an orphanage in Africa. I'm like, well, I'm I'm halfway on board, okay? So like missionary, awesome. Orphanage, awesome. Really? That's two out of three. But we have kids in Danville who need a good place to live and who need somebody to care about. Like, Africa? Really? Like, I don't know, I don't know about that. I didn't pray like, Lord, if that's where you want her, open up the doors for her to go to Africa. Why not? Because I want her to live in my backyard. I'll build you a house in my backyard because I love you. But if I love you, I should want you to be used by God however he sees fit. I I feel like I'm bold in my faith, and I I don't even want like it makes me physically nervous and ill to say that out loud and know that I don't in my heart don't want I do want that. I just want that as long as it isn't inconvenient to me, right, uncomfortable to me. I don't miss out on spending time with my kids or with their kids or whatever. Like God, I want you to use them. But even when I pray that, most of the time I'm praying, God just bless them. I don't really want you to use them. I want you to bless them. Yeah, and I want you to bless me through them because that's why you gave them to me, right? Yeah. That that that's not it, yeah, but that's how I feel about it. And so when we go talking about these prayers, it's not that I need to completely add another hour of prayer for God to do these things. It's that I need to reframe my heart. I need to be transformed by the renewing of my mind that these children, these materials, these gifts, these finances, this job, they are all for one purpose, and that's to make Jesus known. God, give me that heart symptom. Yes. That's why you gave it to me. Instead of bless me with more, help me use what you bless me with.

SPEAKER_03 57:47

And however you want to you know, I it's it's I think a good way for us to look at at our children is the fact that well, and again, Kelly taught me this uh before Michael was even born. You you get a little scare of something that could be could be wrong, and and you start panicking and you're praying for fix this. Yeah, you know, and worry, worry, worry, worry during during a short a short period of time, thankfully. But during that, Kelly came and she's expressing and revealing like she's not mine. She's his. We're just entrusted with this life temporarily. Temporarily, you know, so I like you're you're right, like use them. Like I I I've I hope I've done my best to make them usable for you. So use them. That's that's that's good. That's a good prayer. Uh before we go, I want to say like some of these things I can now, I can say that that this week I've prayed for some of these things, but it's because uh of being guided in it at prayer service. So this is like this is kind of a plug that if you've not come to prayer service, you should, not for you, but for what what what he's doing. And um, you know, you can you can still learn stuff, he can still teach us things, but but we but we have to be be doing it, and and sometimes it takes a little guidance outside of our regular church routine. Because I I can at this point and I might be meddling again, I don't know, but Wednesdays have gotten unroutine. And and and I understand it, and but there's he's still doing really good things.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:14

Amen.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:14

And and we're seeing it by being present in his presence. Like you asked tonight, because we're doing this on Wednesday night after prayer service, and you asked tonight, why did you come? Did you come to be in his presence? And hopefully there, I mean, I I'm there's probably a hundred different there was at least 25 different answers. But I hope by the end of that that that was what they got by coming. I know for me that's that's every Wednesday, that's that's where I I leave here. No matter what's happened leading up to six o'clock, by seven, I know that I've been in the presence of God. So that was kind of a shameless plug, but I'm just in it's uh I'm trying to encourage you. Like there's there's he's there's still more out there.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:13

Yeah, so it's a good reminder because I think sometimes we don't want to come to prayer service because I can't pray average, mundane, everyday prayers. Right. I'm gonna have to actually do business with God, and it's uncomfortable, but it's also good. Yeah, it's also good.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:32

Yep. Thank you, Lord. Well, we've we've blown through an hour, and uh so as always, I want to encourage you to uh go to fbcdan.com. You can find previous episodes of build, you can find uh previous messages, and so if you're just getting in on this, that's how you can get caught up. And we we do encourage you to do that. That also shows you uh opportunities, gives you opportunities of where you can get connected with our church locally. As always, if you're not local, I encourage you to be involved with the church if you're not. And and and I say involved, I mean get involved and serve there. Yes, because that's what we're called to do. So let's let's let's be about his business at all times. Um, we'll see you next week.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:28

Love you, peace. Deuces.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:31

Well, that's it for this week's episode of Build. Remember, what we build with our hands fades, but what we build on Christ lasts forever. If today's episode encouraged you, share it and keep the conversation going. You can find past messages, upcoming events, and ways to connect at fbcdan.com. Let's keep building our faith one brick at a time. We'll see you next time.