From Brazil to Huntington Beach: How MMA Legend Rafael Cordeiro Built King's MMA

In Episode 11 of the ImmiGreat Podcast, Richard Wilner sits down with Master Rafael Cordeiro — founder of King's MMA in Huntington Beach, three-time Brazilian Muay Thai champion, black belt in both Muay Thai and Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, and the coach behind some of the biggest names in MMA, including Mike Tyson.

But this episode isn't just about fighting. It's about what it really takes to build a life in America the right way.

Rafael came to the United States on an O-1 visa, a classification reserved for individuals of extraordinary ability, and went on to complete one of the most demanding immigration pathways: the EB-1A Extraordinary Ability Green Card petition. Years later, he and his entire family became United States citizens.

In this conversation, Rafael and Richard discuss:

• Growing up in Curitiba, Brazil, and training at the legendary Chute Boxe gym 
• Traveling to Japan 52 times to compete in PRIDE FC 
• The moment he fell in love with Huntington Beach and decided to bet everything on America 
• How the O-1 visa works for athletes and coaches 
• Starting from zero in the U.S. — no credit, no social security, no students 
• Building King's MMA from the ground up during the 2008 financial crisis
• Training world champions, including Fabricio Werdum, Chris Cyborg, and Mike Tyson 
• What becoming a U.S. citizen meant to him and his family
•  His advice for anyone dreaming of building a life in America

Rafael's story is a powerful reminder that the American dream is still real, but it requires vision, discipline, and the courage to follow the process, even when it's hard.

🔗 Follow Rafael Cordeiro & King's MMA! 

Have immigration questions? Contact us! 

https://www.wilneroreilly.com/contact/ 

The ImmiGreat Podcast, hosted by Richard Wilner, provides practical, real-world insight into complex immigration topics affecting individuals, families, and employers. Each episode is designed to help listeners better understand their options and next steps.

Transcript

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SPEAKER_00 0:00

There are people you meet in life who you just know from the very conversation that they're gonna leave a mark on the world. Master Rafael Cordero is one of those people. I first crossed pat I first cross sorry. I first crossed paths with Rafael and his family about three days after they arrived in the United States. And I have to be honest. Even then, even before King's MMA existed, even before the UFC championship belts, Coach of the Year Awards, and coaching Mike Tyson, nearly a million Instagram followers, you could just feel it. You could feel the seriousness of his purpose, the discipline, the hunger of a man who had come here to build something that had never been built before. He did it. And today Rafael Cordero is recognized as one of the greatest MMA coaches on the planet. His gym, King's MMA in Huntington Beach, has produced a staggering list of world champions. He himself is a three-time Brazilian Muay Thai champion and a black belt in both Muay Thai and Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. And yes, he trained Mike Tyson. Mike Tyson. But here's what people uh most people don't know, and what today's conversation is really about. None of this was guaranteed. None of it was easy, and none of this happened without a journey that most Americans never see, never think about, and frankly never have to. Rafael came to this country and obtained an O1 visa, a classification reserved for individuals of extraordinary ability, and as a result, his family got O3s, which were tied directly to his status. He then pursued one of the most demanding immigration pathways in existence, the EB-1 Extraordinary Ability Green Card Petition. And then, after years of building, improving, and fighting, not in a cage, but in life, he and his family became United States citizens. That story, the courage it takes to uproot your family, to bet everything on a country that doesn't yet know your name, to navigate a system that's complicated even when you're doing everything right, that's what we're going to talk about today. Because here's what I think is remarkable about Rafael's journey. America gave him a stage, and he didn't just perform on it, he expanded it. His success here has made him more celebrated in Brazil than ever before. His name travels both directions across that border now, carrying with it proof that the American dream, that much-debated, much tested idea much-tested idea is still super real. It's possible. And when the right person gets the chance to pursue it, man, it's extraordinary. I've known Rafael for nearly 20 years now. I've watched him build King's MMA from nothing. I've watched his children grow up. I've watched him carry the weight of an immigrant's responsibility with elegance, grace, and fire. I can't think of a better guest to sit across from, a more important story to tell right now. Because in this moment in America, when questions about who belongs here and what this country means are louder than ever. So Rafael, Master Cordero, this is long overdue, my brother. It's it's an honor to appreciate it. To spend time with you and to have this conversation. So welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

What a great introduction.

SPEAKER_00 3:29

Let's uh let's let's jump right in. So let's talk a little bit about who you were before before you came here. People know you're from Brazil, but you're from uh from uh a town in Brazil, Curitiba. What and and while I want this conversation to not just be about fighting, it's impossible to talk about you without talking about fighting. So let's jump in. What what was the world of martial arts like for a young kid growing up in in Curitiba, Brazil?

SPEAKER_01 3:58

Especially in Curitiba, Richard. Curitiba always was the capital of Muay Thai in Brazil. They call the Thailand in Brazil. You know, I was 11 years old. My first experience that I have was come to shoot box, the place that building a lot of champs, and see myself change my life. When I stop inside, when I stop by to see the trainer change, I see my life change. Um in all aspects. Uh I see I could have seen the father figure as my coach. I see brothers, sisters, people that I never had never had before. I'm single. I only son. At that time you were single. Yeah, that time I was. And for me, stepping slide, shoot the box make me change not just my life, but a lot of lives as well. Uh the fact that uh I always was crazy for martial arts, watching TV, watching Bruce Lee. As a kid and born in the 70s, Chuck Norris, Bruce Lee, all those guys, and seeing inside the gym uh truly potential for me, I said, man, this is what I want from me. Like with 11 years old, I knew it. This is what I want to do for the rest of my life. And when I started training shootbox, shoot the box already was a the gym with a lot of champs. Yeah, I was one more kid there, living my dream. Not to be like a professor or nothing, because there back in the days, we talk about 1987. 1987, there's no like okay, martial arts is gonna give you what a brilliant future. Just do this, you're gonna be uh rich, you're gonna be famous. No, we just want to go be a great, well, a good martial artist. And then shoot the box gave me all this this the tools to be here and talk with you today. The opportunity that I have one day to train there, to build my career, to build my career inside the gym. Everything that I have in life was because one day I stopped inside the gym and say, I want a side over here. Wow. So you started training at shootbox when you were 11 years old. 11 years old, and with Master Rujumar. Master Ujumar is one of the best martial arts leaders in the world. He created one army, one really, really tough army for generations. We talk about 50 years, five gen, five, five days.

SPEAKER_00 6:26

I'm trying to picture myself as an 11-year-old kid walking into a gym like shootbox, and whether it was at that time or years later, and and let's let's talk a little bit about that army. Shootbox is a world-famous gym. People in the fight world know what shootbox is. For for those that, for those that aren't necessarily so familiar with shootbox, can you can you talk about who the soldiers were in that army a little bit alongside you?

SPEAKER_01 6:50

For sure. Vandeley Silva, Mauricio Shogunhua, Anderson Silva, José Alande Pelé, Murilo Ninja, uh now, nowadays Charles Dubronx, and then we go. This is a really, really traditional school in Brazil. And I went there as a student, and with the time I became coach, with the time I become a general in the gym. So everything changed with the first start. So from there, a lot of champs came after me. So there's champs before, but my generation was the gold area.

SPEAKER_00 7:25

That's that's a lot of scary names in one uh one room. Yeah, yeah. Uh amazing. Um in your time at shoot box and sticking on the fight path for for a minute, could could you speak briefly about lessons you learned there? Like if you could describe it in words, what did that teach you in terms of not just from a technical training perspective, but more importantly about being a person, how to coach, how to lead people? Could you speak on that a little bit?

SPEAKER_01 7:55

The discipline. The discipline then we have still till today. My master, I call my master till today, he's the guy that introduced martial arts. He made me understand there's more life outside of the mat. He taught me things than I never could imagine, how to be a man, how to be a when talking about men, how to be responsible for everything. And this is something then with that philosophy, be the true, be the the guy, we create something special there. There's a generation before my generation shoot the box, but my generation changed the game. Changed the game because with my generation we step inside of MMA world. Before it was just a white eye gym, sure. With a lot of tournaments, please, best gym in Brazil. A lot of tournaments, we won all those tournaments, but now we have MMA to work on. And then this part of our journey, our journey changed. So now we have to understand what is this. This is the reason I say my generation changed the game because we have to start something from scratch. Let's learn jujitsu, let's see what we can do from here. Yeah, from that, a lot of word champs.

SPEAKER_00 9:14

That's a beautiful thing. And and it sounds like through that, through changing the game, through learning other disciplines outside of Muitai, with that and the fights, you would you would travel around Brazil. And then at some point, there would be international travel. I know how many times have you been to Japan? 52 times. 52 times, multiple fights in in Pride. Can you talk a little bit about how travel outside of Brazil sort of changed your perspective if it did on things?

SPEAKER_01 9:43

A lot, Richard. For example, a kid from Curitiba, it's a country city, really, really country city. So, and then we start becoming famous famous in Brazil, we start traveling, and we put Curitiba in a map. So now everybody knows about Curitiba because why? Because these guys, guys super technical, they are they are they are they have good connection between them, they are brothers. I think the most important thing then we have, then we create inside of shootbox was the brotherhood. The brotherhood that created that don't exist anymore, to be honest with you. I have my gym today, King's MMA, as you mentioned, but uh that feeling is different. It's different. Yeah, I don't want to say don't it don't exist anymore, it's different. And with that feeling to kill or die for your friend, to kill or die for your professor, for your friends. There's no money, there's no money involved. It's just the the be proud to do something for somebody, then help you to develop your techniques to better to help you develop who you are. My master developed not just our skills, but develop our personality. I like to say, I trained my dad from since 11 years old. My master holds meets for me just one time, and I respect him for everything they have done for me. He just one time he holds pads for me, and that's it. A lot of people today I have to have my coach hold pads every single day. My relationship with him was above way beyond pads. This is nothing compared to what he's doing for me. And I took an opportunity to step and I took an opportunity to come to the United States. Opportunities, we talk about opportunities.

SPEAKER_00 11:29

Did you, when you were traveling in the in the fight world as as a younger man, did the team ever travel to the United States to compete?

SPEAKER_01 11:38

One time. One time Master came, Master Jimar came, but I could came. My professor came and was the first time, talking about 1990. My professor fought with Jimar Ciruelo dos Angeles, he came to the United States, he fought in Los Angeles, Muay Thai, he knocked the guy out, and then they bring to Brazil the victory, and then with that we saw something. Maybe we can be a champion one day. Because our professor traveled and he fought. Now he brings back the win. And so now we have a perspective to change the fight outside.

SPEAKER_00 12:11

Was that fight in America what made you first think about maybe there's a future here for my family and I? What what is it?

SPEAKER_01 12:19

Years later. Years later, with um the martial arts was just in Japan in the past. So we start competing in Brazil, we make our career in Brazil competing, winning some small shows in Brazil. And then the Japanese people start looking at Brazil as a potential fighter. They knew Hickson Grace, they knew Grace family. But let's see these guys from south. They're really good strikers. Let's see what we have there. And Kawasaki, uh Kazushi Kawasaki was a manager, our manager in Japan. He came to Brazil just to see what let's see what we have there. And then he saw our team fighting, competing, the union. See, man, these kids have a future. With that travel changed again because we have our first guy competing in Pride, First Vendele. Pride 7. Vanderlei fought and fought against an American wrestler. He won. And with that victory, opened the door for all our fighters. Because Vendele after the fight, you say, I have a like me, I have a bunch of guys in my gym that do maybe better than I do. And then open the door for our team. And with the time, this was Pride 7. With the time, you with the time, USA become number one. So Japan was always first. Okay, we have UFC before, yes. But Japan was the place that everybody wants to fight. Everybody asked somebody wanna fight Japan. Because the visibility and the money they paid. Sure. Like double in UFC back in the days was double the UFC. And but with the time, the time, pride started going down, down, and down. In 2007 was the last show. When finished the show, I say, what are we gonna do now? Because we have a lot of ties with Japan. So what are we gonna do now? There's no more pride, there's no more place to go. And then I say, maybe it's time for me to create something. It was one of the reasons I say maybe it's time to move to the United States.

SPEAKER_00 14:22

And you're you're married by this time. Yes. Yeah. What and so so take us through sort of a conversation that you would have with your with your wife about contemplating coming to America to check it out to see if there's opportunity.

SPEAKER_01 14:38

We talk about disciplining everything in Rightvish. So when I have an idea to move to the United States, was when Fab when Shogun fought his first fight in the FC against Farsi Griffin. The fight was in Anehai. And then I have an opportunity to come with him and say, okay, this is a beautiful place. Anah, beautiful place. Right front of Disneyland. And then my student was living here for a while. He said, I have a place in Huntington Beach. If you guys Gerson, one of my first black belts. He said, I have a place in Huntington Beach if you guys want to train there. Small place, but if you guys want, I say, Yeah, for sure. Better than training hotel. Let's train in Huntington Beach. Let's see. And then I went there in Huntington and then was love at first sign. I said, This is the place I want to live. And then we're back home after five, and then I spoke with Lou, my wife. I say, Lou, I saw one. I travel a lot, but now I think we have a place maybe to call home. There's a beach, there's good people around, there's safe safety area, and I think it's gonna be good for us. Take me one year, Vision, to put everything on paper, the discipline, then we talk. It's just about have a dream to come and do something. Yeah, but how can you make this dream come true? And then start to see what I have to do to live here, what I have to do, what I'm gonna how is how is gonna be my first steps? And here we are. We made everything by I feel the protocol. I follow the protocol to be here today.

SPEAKER_00 16:08

That you did. I mean, I I remember in meeting you and Lou and the girls, because you have two kids by this time already. Yes. So I remember within a couple days of your arriving in the United States, we had dinner and you were trying to figure out a a legal path to to accomplish your dreams. And um we figured out based on your qualifications that the 01 visa was was the right path for you. It's not for everyone because you have to be very qualified. You have to have extraordinary talent in something, whether it's the arts, athletics, science, et cetera, naturally. Um yours was athletics. What people don't realize is that um to do an 01 for an athlete, that category also covers coaches. So when we were designing your case, it wasn't for you to come here and fight, it was for you to come and coach. And we were able to do that based on your at your accomplishments, not only as a fighter, but the but equally, if not more importantly, the accomplishments of your students. Because the best measure of a coach is whether whether his students succeed or not. And obviously you had a number of very, very successful students. So you get here, we we figure out this this path. Take us through the mindset of where was there fear that it wasn't going to work? Did you did you always have faith in the in the process? Talk talk about faith a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 17:46

I talk about faith because you gave me a lot of when I came here first time, you say bring your material. I remember I came in your office with uh a bag of a lot of magazines and CDs, all those things. We talk about 18 years ago, right? And then you say, I wanna prove, I wanna make your visa, I'm gonna don't worry about that. I wanna make this thing happen. It makes me feel so comfortable, Richard. After that, because most of the people come to the United States or come from different countries, they think I have special abilities and that's it. I wanna be there and I'm gonna do my way. It sometimes doesn't work like that. The protocol that you have to follow is the protocol can change your life, the family in your family's life as well. Um, we cannot think, okay, one of the United States, let's see what's gonna happen. A lot of people sell everything in Brazil, apartments, cars, and let's see what's gonna happen in the United States. And come here and then six months later have to come back because unfortunately, that's not the way they think, especially nowadays. 18 years ago, what I have, I have reputation, but reputation without organization is nothing. So we make a plan. Let's do first visa, second visa, green car, and there we are. Years later now I'm sitting, American citizen. Not just me, all my family. Uh it be a city in the United States, doing the right thing, make us so confident about everything. Be have my certificate, my passport. I can go all over the place. That's different when you come to the United States with the with the blue passport, it's totally different because they were saying this it is for me as a Brazilian. Brazil has a bad reputation to talk about organization. This is the reason there's a lot of Brazilians here living over here, like a run for ice, run for all over the place because they cannot stay at the same place. And at this point, we have to think before we go, how can you do the plan? How can you make the plan work? And it took me a lot of time, Richard, but I was I did nothing before my visa. I could have done nothing before my visa. I spent time in the United States by myself, my me and my wife in an apartment, see what is gonna happen because I have no visa to work. As soon as you approve my first visa, no, let's see what's gonna happen.

SPEAKER_00 20:03

So we we've had conversations over the years where people will look at what you've accomplished and say, oh, you're so lucky. They don't they don't realize the sacrifice uh that you, that your wife, and perhaps the girls, your your daughters have have made. Um life has a way of throwing us, you know, some ups and downs and some curveballs is as we say. Can you can you talk a little bit about some some bad experiences you had here and if if those experienced caused you to lose focus or or faith in in what you were trying to achieve? How did how did you overcome the downs?

SPEAKER_01 20:40

I think I truly believe my first uh the difficult that I have in the United States was the first of all the language we still work on, but uh was the fact that I I have no Social Security to start later. Um I have no record to rent a place. So I came here, I couldn't rent an apartment because I have no credit. And I have to wait for somebody to help me, students they put in their name in my apartment. And a couple months later I couldn't uh after my my approval, I couldn't rent my apartment. Cars, I couldn't buy cars, I couldn't rent cars, I couldn't do nothing because lease cars, because there's no paper for all. My the six first month was tough, but my fate was bigger than the problem that was what for me I was super happy to be here. Man, I'm in the United States, it's gonna be something. I wanna make I wanna make this dream come true, I wanna make this thing happen. I moved from Brazil when I trained a lot of world champs. And then okay, there's no more Brazil now. There's you and you. Starting over because in Japan, they knew me, they knew the team, but in the United States, they just know the fighter back in the days. They didn't know the coach. Talk about the fight. And I have to prove how good I am to you know building champs and stuff from scratch. You know, Matt was just my wife, my daughter, and one black belt. And this was my beginning in the United States. Small begin. Small begin. Why? Because I did everything right. Can I work right now? Let's work right now. I can't, I can't. I spent a lot of money in the beginning, a lot of money, because I couldn't work. So people think, oh, they are famous now. Like you say, they are look, but you remember what you did for me. I never forget. I never forget. Um soon as I got here, they somebody introduced Peter. I think Peter introduced me to you, Risha, and then we start our prepare our deal. And with two or three months, two or three months in relationship, friendship, um there's no students, so there's no money. And I remember I call you, you say, Risha, can you sponsor me with your brand? I can put inside the gym. I was paying you, you say, okay, I want to sponsor you. You don't have to pay more one part of the thing. I want to sponsor you by that. Things like that you never forget. And I never forget. I never forget. Why? Because our first steps outside of our country is the first step you never forget. And my first steps of here was really humble steps. It does, I think, make me who I am today. Because if I was the guy in Brazil, same guy in Brazil, living in the United States, maybe I'm not here today. Maybe it will be a little bit quicky. Why? Because I have a retain in Brazil. You know, here I have to work my humblest. I have to be humble and I start everything from again. And that's that's it. I think I accept my position, do start everything from zero again, and here we are.

SPEAKER_00 23:54

You are a very humble person, so let's let's try to not be humble for a second because what you've looking back, it may feel like a long time, but what you've accomplished with Kings MMA is truly remarkable. And when you open Kings and doing it the right way and from visa from one employer to another, ultimately you decided to open up your own gym. And that was, I mean, within a couple of years of getting to the United States. What was there was there a moment where you you said, now I'm gonna open my own, I'm gonna I'm gonna do my own thing. Can you can you talk a little bit about that mindset?

SPEAKER_01 24:31

I came from shoot box. I was here as a shoot box coach. My gym in the beginning was called shootbox, and with the time, I say maybe maybe it's time to build something different over here. So I want to be responsible for everything that happened inside my gym. And then we create King's MMA, where I have uh please don't get me wrong. I always have authority inside the shoot box. I was a leader, I was a captain of the team, but it was not my team, shoot the box, master with my team. So I have to create my own team where everything that happened that I'm gonna be able to fix or not fix, but it's my responsibility. And it was the first huge step forget everything in Brazil and start everything from zero. And it was from zero, because there's no okay, what am I gonna do now? Okay, let's start teaching. How long gonna take to build another champ? I didn't know. I didn't know. But what was great with me, send the right people to the gym. Yes, Fabricio Verdun, Babalu, Chris Cyborg. Chris Cyborg was my student in Brazil. She moved to Night States training with me. Chris and Fabricio. And Babalu was the first guy that I trained here, professional fight, then I trained over here. I with them, I said this is a sign of God. We are in the right place because people start showing up. And um here we are, Richard, working every single day for 18 years with downbreak. Um 2008 was a tough year for the United States, was one of the worst years for the United States. And I was here living the worst year in the history, and we are here doing things, and I never see the bad side of the history. I say, we're gonna do it, we're gonna make it. In Brazil, I had an apartment. My apartment in Brazil, Richard, was like something huge. And then we moved in the United States. I have a small apartment with two rooms. My daughter has to share my daughter's shared room, and but I couldn't see the bad thing. I said, We are here, you're in America, we can't make things happen over here. And I never looking back, oh my lord, what I did in Brazil. No, no, no. What I'm gonna do now. I was champ, I was name in Brazil. Over here, I have to style everything again.

SPEAKER_00 26:49

And uh and you you built it and and they came. And I I mean, I I remember those old days here before you had your own facility training at the affliction warehouse when affliction was around and guys from all over were coming and and traveling around. It it's really um it's really an amazing thing. Was it a learning process for you about trying to earn respect, if we could put it like that, from the American martial arts community here?

SPEAKER_01 27:20

Yes. Because you came from different kinds of train. Shoot the box in Brazil was a really tough train, like a military. Military. Master Buddha. And then I came with the same mentality to the United States. Let's do the right train, the tough train, the way we train Brazil. And I say, in the first month, I see people, why are you guys doing why you guys were so hard like that? I say, maybe we're gonna change. And then I change it.

SPEAKER_00 27:47

Tone it down a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 27:48

Yeah, like, oh hey, we don't have to go hard like that. I say, this is the way you train Brazil, but the Brazil, Brazil over here, over here. I was humble enough to understand, say, well, I have to change. And I changed. And I changed, please no, I don't change my personality, but I changed the way that um how can I push my best? How can I push my best? How can I push his best? How can I push they best? So this was all my question, and then I say maybe heart train. I never gonna get this guy with hard train. So let's know each other. This was something that I always did during my career. I never trained people as the same way. I always have to train them different ways because different conversations, different relationships. I cannot talk with Benny the way that I talk with Fabricio. I can talk with Fabricio the way I talk with Vanderlei, because it's different language, different personality, different personality. I have to create with all my fighters differently. Shoot the boxing back in the days was just one word. It was a word for all. Over here now. I have to talk, I have to understand how can it make things happen? This was one of the reasons I say I have to create my own thing because change. Because I'm still shooting boxed in my heart, but I have to change my way to see the training, things like that.

SPEAKER_00 29:06

Talking about differences in personalities, here you are, come from a fight background in one of the most famous, toughest, savages, savage gyms in the world. You're here in America, building a new life. You have your wife, two young girls, you're in the gym every day, training, training both male and female fighters. It's pretty, it's an it's an aggressive environment. You're you're you're coaching kids, you're trying to build, you're trying to build a business, you're traveling for fighting. And people don't realize the toll that that takes on relationships, toll it takes in in your health, being saying goodbye to your kids to go fight and changing environments, not to mention the heavy burden that the immigration piece puts on all of this. I know you had faith. Do you feel as though there was ever a time like talk about talk about Lou a little bit? Did the immigration piece put a put a stress on her? Was she worried about things?

SPEAKER_01 30:07

I think since the beginning, Richard, we came so focused to do the right thing that um we have seen nothing wrong when we apply. Was step by step everything going well. Now we're gonna do this. In two years we're gonna have this one, and then we're gonna apply for a green car. After this one, we're gonna apply for that kind of the the freedom when you don't have to. My lord, what's gonna happen? Because it was so organized, our thing was so organized. My wife knows never look at the the picture like uh we cannot make it. She always trusts the process. We trust the process, always have faith. But as a human, sometimes you feel doubt, doubt creeps in. This is the right decision. Should I stay over here? Have no students for now. It's the doubt comes. The doubt always gonna hit your door, and how how can you overcome? And then I overcome all of these problems, think of what we can do in the United States. I always was a guy of faith. More than anything, I have faith that we can make things happen. We can make things happen. And we make it by different culture, doing different things, but make people understand, especially my English, make people understand my passion, because martial arts is my passion. But they understood, man, this guy is fanatic for martial arts. So I want to train this guy. So I taught him the best way to understand martial arts and got in love with martial arts. I sent I showed them my passion. And for sure, the doubt I was gonna be there, the doubt I was gonna be there, but I prefer to work in moments like that and make things happen than see what is gonna happen now. As a lot of students, I have people that came and followed me without them. Probably was super hard to be here with you today. Fabricio, he was my first champ to train with me, like a pro nine month without fighting. You helped him to develop his first uh uh contract with Strike First, you negotiate his first contract with Strike First, you become his manager, you put him to fight against Federal Millennium. Was a lot of history behind. People don't know. There's a lot of history behind, and of course we have the right people behind, you know, Rishan. More than okay, I'm I'm luck guide, like they say. I'm like to say a bless to have right people behind in next my next meeting. So true. This is make a lot of different make you feel more comfortable too, right?

SPEAKER_00 32:44

Having a good team of people it's it's yes, so important.

SPEAKER_01 32:48

But as a human, when you look at our daughters, like what is gonna be the future? What I can miss, I cannot mess with their future. I have to do the right thing, right thing, the right thing, right thing. We always put the family first. I always put my family first in everything. This is one of the reasons the fact that I travel all over the world for for a long, long time. I say I don't want to travel that much. And white United States become the place where everybody wants to fight them. I see, let's live in the United States. It was my best decision, Richard, because it took me uh years of my life inside airports, hotels, doing camps. And today, we came here. I saw a big bag in front. I was like, oh reminded you. Remind me. I saw man, I have a big bag like that, travel with me for all over the place. Nowadays, I don't like more to travel. I like to be, I like to be in the gym, I like to train people in the gym. But travel-wise is no more my thing. And uh this is the reason I say I want to move in the United States to travel less.

SPEAKER_00 33:54

And I made it awesome. Um focusing on the immigration piece, uh, again, a lot of people don't realize that what once you once you're able to obtain a green card, you depending upon how you got it, if you got it through employment, just like you did, self-petition is uh EB1A, um, you have to wait five years to apply for citizenship. And you have to you have to be a good person, you have to pay your taxes, you can't be outside the United States too long, and a number of other things. Ultimately, you become a citizen, and your whole family does at the same time, basically. When you became a citizen, can you can you talk about that moment in your in your family's life, how what that meant to you guys?

SPEAKER_01 34:40

I mean, everything, everything in the world. Like I say, everything that I done before I moved was beautiful. But when I moved to the United States, let's start everything again. And uh when you have like a like when somebody accepts you. The country accepts me to be here and do my thing. This is awesome. Can you imagine? The country accepts you. Okay, you can come. Do your thing over here. We will we will not provide because they don't have to provide, but we will support you. And I have support from all over the place. Why? Because people understand what we came here for. Um the immigration immigration side for me in my case was without them, for me it was impossible to be here and stay over here. There's a lot of things that we put in practice by house, buy car. Uh live the life than you you want to live by your work. I worked much more in the United States and Brazil. Sure. Much more. Today I did three classes in the morning, private, and then I came straight from the gym.

SPEAKER_00 35:46

People don't really you teach class every night, right?

SPEAKER_01 35:48

Every night. Every Monday to Friday, kids, champions, champions, black belts, white belt, martial arts. And I always put this one first, but to do what I love to do, immigration was the first step. And this is what I recommend the people, especially people who come from Brazil and come with ideas, especially Jiu-Jitsu guys that come to compete and stay here. This is not gonna help you in the future. So everything that I have came from the right way that I did. I don't step. I ski I don't skip steps. I did what we had to do to be here today. And uh my first thought was let's see our immigration side first, and then let's see what am I gonna teach. Let's see, let's find out later. You know, I think uh I did the right thing. We did.

SPEAKER_00 36:38

Along those lines, for for those who may listen to this uh conversation, people who are from other countries, whether they're still in their own country or whether they're here, anything you'd like to share with them? Any any any advice in that journey?

SPEAKER_01 36:56

Um okay, I want to move to the United States in somebody's mind. Okay, I want to move my states, I want to be there, I'm gonna build in my career, beautiful. In the paper, beautiful. But the reality is different. The reality is if I can give somebody advice, uh, make a game plan before you come. Put everything in paper. See what how can I live in the United States and take everything the United States wants to give you. United States wants to open a lot of doors for you. They open doors for me. They open doors, not because I know martial arts, no, because I was prepared to do that. My preparation, my discipline to have the right thing next to me make me go and United States today. And we create something. We create a brand in the United States. A guy from Curitiba moved to the United States and created a brand, and the brand became famous all over the world. And I'm glad to live here. To be honest with you, Richard, I'm 52 years old. I love to go to Brazil for one week, but it's not my place anymore. It's not my place. It's my place is over here. And the immigration side, the fact that I was right and ready to go, like you say, I spent four years over here without travel to Brazil because I was in process. My mom has cancer, had cancer in Brazil. I couldn't see her for a while. So thank God she she passed 10 years ago, but no, because of cancer, she she won the battle, but uh I couldn't see her for four years. I for sure I can travel to Brazil, but uh was too much in line. Even my mom's life. But I if I take this thing out, if I moved, if I back to Brazil not to see my mom, maybe I have to throw everything and I have to start everything again, and maybe it was not.

SPEAKER_00 38:45

It's a huge it's a huge sacrifice that a lot of people don't realize that if you have a green card application pending, you can't leave the United States until you get a travel document or a case approved, and that can be a year, two years more. Just depends upon what's going on.

SPEAKER_01 38:59

For me, it was fast. I think it was three or four, three or four, but was fast. But the thing was super fast. Yes. I remember you made like a the thing happen, and um that's it. You have responsibilities. As soon as I sign, okay, I want to move the United States. What I have to do, I have to do this. I want to follow the plan. I want to follow the plan. And if I followed you today, and um I recommend not just do the right thing, but in the end, the right thing, there's one more thing. It's the certificate, the passport, do it. Don't feel people cannot feel comfortable just with green car. They have to move forward with the thing. I was with green car for a while, five years, and now it's time to apply. Then apply, and everything goes well.

SPEAKER_00 39:46

Was could you uh the the kid from the 11-year-old kid from that walks into the gym in in Kurchiba, could could that kid looking back ever imagine that that brand, that fame, that that humility which underlies it all? Could that kid ever have imagined becoming Mike Tyson's coach?

SPEAKER_01 40:05

No, no. And the fact that I was prepared for that helped me a lot. More than train a lot of fighters, I was prepared to train a champ. Train fighters is one thing, but train the champ is a different thing. All the fighter champs that I trained prepared me to train Mike Tyson. And my connection with him was since the day one, the best connection. So he for sure he developed, he helped to develop my career in the United States. A lot of people knew me before because of MMA, and then I became Mike Tyson coach. It's two different two two different um world communities. Totally. Box award, old, box award is really old. We came from martial arts, MMA, something new. So I have to fight against old people to say, who's this guy? Different culture. Yes, definitely come from martial arts. He wants to train two times or champ. Who is the guy to do this? And Mike, he always pushed me there. Like this is the guy that wants to train me. And the fact that I have my background with the fighters helped me to understand the champ and training him for more than five years.

SPEAKER_00 41:17

Could you speak briefly on how your relationship with Mike as coaching Mike, that is? You spoke how it's changed sort of, or well, touch on how it changed your life here a little bit, but more importantly, how if at all did it change your life in Brazil?

SPEAKER_01 41:33

A lot. We're a friend. What the heck? We're a friend. There's no oh now same, same person. I think the way I treat Tyson make me. I never treat Tyson different than people that I trained in the gym. Because before I have to learn who is Mike Tyson before. Who is this guy? Everybody knows his history, but who is this guy? From day one, the way I was wrapping his hands, I was looking at his eyes, the way he was, you know, coming for training. His mind, he was preparing himself to train. Say, man, this guy is different. I was wrapping his hands, he was like the way he was focused, say, man, we're gonna start something new over here. It's gonna be great. Because I see something that I have said before in Brazil with my champs. But I was Tyson. And what's Tyson? Tyson is uh is the our zero one, he's the he's the guy, zero one, he's a zero one, the guy then uh everybody look up. The kid then one day started to shoot the box days before I was watching Tyson fight on TV. He knocked somebody out in less than 30 seconds. So I was watching and say, hey, this is what I want to do my life. And years later, I was trained the guy. Can you imagine? Amazing.

SPEAKER_00 42:56

Speaking of years later, if you could fast forward and look through the crystal ball, 10 years, 15 years, where do you where do you see King's MMA? Where do you where do you see yourself? 15 years in the future.

SPEAKER_01 43:11

With a lot of champs, we a lot with a lot of with a lot of gyms all over the world. But uh all those gyms, what I want for this gym is somebody that comes from my background. I don't want to just make franchise because make franchises is easy. But put somebody there then really represent your name. People want to journey with you, on the road with you, cry with you, smile with you. This kind of the guy then I want to open gyms because nowadays it's really hard to trust in people inside martial arts, be sure, because today if you put somebody to teach in your gym, in a few months, few years, he wants to open his own gym. It's not wrong. But you support people inside your gym, they've got To be your rival at some point in the future. So knowing who you're going to put in the gym as your black belt helps a lot. So I have a lot of black belts. And my future, and I truly believe in the future, you're going to have a lot of kings and may all over the world with the same mentality, with the same legacy. Then I learned shootbooks.

SPEAKER_00 44:17

Yeah, that's what I was just going to say. It sounds like the future is exactly where you you came from. And you're and you're looking for to create that environment that gave you all the opportunities that it did.

SPEAKER_01 44:29

Because just uh just we know how hard it was. And I know the nights that I have no sleep was like uh what I'm gonna do tomorrow, what I'm gonna do tomorrow. Okay, have a fate. Okay, have a faith. But what I'm gonna do, please God, show me, show me the way, show me the way. And till today. We have to ask God till today. Nothing changed, to be honest with you. We're still running, still doing our thing, still try, do our best every single day. For sure, Tyson opened the doors for me for the gym. So now see Tyson's picture. But the the journey that we have behind that, to have that picture on the wall, this is what I like to just say what I like to tell to people. Trust in yourself, right, Krishna? Trust in yourself. As a coach, it's easy for me to say that because this is what I do with my fighters. Trust in yourself. But trusting yourself means we trust. I trust, you have to trust in you. And I always have people behind support me and say, let's go, let's do this because we can and let's make this thing happen. I from for a long, long time I was the guy to bring positive things for we use, like you. You at some point in your position, you're the guy that uh people come to you to ask, What should I do? For years was just Raphael say, Well, you have to do this, you have to do that. Have somebody next to you say, if you do this, it's gonna be better too. It's this kind of connection the martial arts gave me with the people that I really trust. It's really hard. I have a problem. I do therapy. Uh well, for three years do therapy, and I have some things that I have to fix, and one of those things is like uh trust. Because in everything that I do, I put my heart. Everything I do put my heart. Is my mistake? I don't know if my if a mistake not, but this is my way. Some people don't deserve all the the energy that I put on. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 46:29

But you know no other way than to invest 110%.

SPEAKER_01 46:32

It's not gonna be myself if I don't do this. Uh the coach is always gonna give his best. All the students that I have, they have my best. There's nothing more on there, nothing less. Everything they have is my best. And when you put everything on the table like that, I put my life on the table when I moved to the United States. I want to be a coach. I remember, I remember today a guy from Brazil, Marcelo Alonso, one of the famous reporters in Brazil. He was the first guy that I called me by next step back in the day was on radio. Can we do a meeting? Sure we can. Interview, sure you can. My first interview in 2010. Um he asked me, How's the life? Say, no, we're doing well. We start right now, we create something nice to be here. And then he asked me, What do you ask? What is your dream for the future? And then I say, I want to be coach of the year. Because what I know, they have an Oscar now, coach of the year. And when they want to be coach of the year over here, he left. I was like, Wow, okay. Two years later, I become coach of the year. So steps that I make, steps, the vision that I have, I say, I want to be, I want to be, and become. Yeah, we turn. We want, you become, and I never forget he left. I love him. But his the way he left makes me feel like uh now I want to make it.

SPEAKER_00 47:53

Yeah, now I'm gonna do it.

SPEAKER_01 47:54

Yeah, you know, years later, I gave another interview, and then I say, remember when you laugh? Now you're great. I say, no, just to remind, I never forget. And we talk about trust. This is my trust, Richard. When I always put my my best in everything that I do, there's no uh true, Raphael. Oh, this guy is gonna say something. I want to say something for you, no, no. I was gonna say the same thing for everybody. Uh, why I have this thing about true. For 43 years, this is something really personal. For 43 years, uh I asked my mom, who's my father? Who's my father? My mom was a single mom, and I asked, Who's my father? For 43 years, she never said she tells me a crazy history, and okay, for 43 years. All the time when I try something deep, she was peace, and we got in arguments and always become fight after all. One month before she passed, one month before she passed, I asked her more time, Mom, who's my father? And she said, I want to tell you who's her father. I was in shock because I tried for 43 years. And then she said, Your father was the one of the first uh chemic chemical engineer from the same university that she came, same college, was the first black guy, one of the first black guys to become a chemical engineer. They met my mom then, and for any reason the thing don't don't work, doesn't work, it didn't work, and then they split, and this was my history. 43 years later. So for 43 years, I asked about the truth. True, true, true. Tell me the truth, tell me the truth. And the fact that I ask, I have to give you my truth. Sure. With my daughters, it doesn't matter what you want to do, tell me the truth. I always want to be by your side. Just tell me the truth. So the truth always something uh was it is is something then I always ask for. Because it's starting with my mom. So this makes me who I am today. And doing therapy, I saw, man, it's really hard in my position as a coach, as a professor, to not believe in people, especially when you put your best, but it's not their fault. The fault is because my best for always ask about the truth. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 50:22

Yeah. Okay, last question. And might be the toughest one, maybe it's the easiest one to answer. And I I ask this sincerely as as someone who's seen your journey from almost the moment that you got here. Looking back and looking forward, what what do the United States, what does the United States of America mean to you?

SPEAKER_01 50:48

Wow, this is a really good question. This is my home. This is my home. Brazil was the place that um I was raised, but this is the place that opened the door for me. This is the place I want to spend the rest of my life. This is the place I want to see my grandsons. I got in love with American culture before I leave the United States. I was the guy in Brazil using jacket, Chicago Bulls jacket. I was the guy to see, wow, I'm Jordan and walk like American, black American, black kid, black Brazilian American, and live in the black culture, especially. I love the black culture, music, the way they dress, the way they talk. It's for me, it's like a I can live this something than I was watching TV. Now I live over here. This is one side. Another side, my family, they are safe over here, Richard. I live a place where my daughters can walk in the street at night, nothing's gonna happen. My daughters can go to work, nothing's gonna happen. There's time to go home. There's time to okay, now by day, I don't have to be by a side. You have to go home. They know there's responsibilities over here. American make, if you live in different countries, move to the United States, you're gonna learn how to be respectful, understand the rules, is really important for you to understand rules. Living here, you understand there's everything there are rules. You cannot do what you want to do. No, no, no, not up here. And it's really important for us. If you want to grow as a human, you have to have rules. And learn the rules the way they you can be successful following the rules. Is this the way I see myself in the United States? And I recommend it's the best place in the world to live because the United States is gonna give you what you do. 100%. Beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 52:41

If someone wants to find you, if someone wants to come and maybe not train in that shootbox environment, but maybe uh some little bits of of shoot box at Kings. How do they find you? Is it the website, Instagram?

SPEAKER_01 52:54

Kings MMA underline H B. You're gonna see Rafael Cordero there, and that's the Instagram Instagram.

SPEAKER_00 53:02

Kings MMA underscore HB.

SPEAKER_01 53:05

And we have a gym in Huntington Beach, Anaheim, Texas, Austin, and in Brazil we have two gyms too as well, in Campinas and Brasilia. We work on different places, but this is where we're at. This is the our philosophy, and when any place that have my student, they're gonna turn like turn with me. Same same way.

unknown 53:26

Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 53:28

It's been an honor. I've known you for a long time. I've learned more today as well. Um, I look forward to seeing the all everything continue to to to result in blessings to you and your and your family, and and awesome. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01 53:46

I thank you for everything. I'm really thankful to have you in my life, my brother, my habi, the guy that I love to be with. And why do you recommend people, Vision? This is the country that can change our life, but do the right thing. Awesome.