Episode 14 Growing Native: Behind The Scenes of Native Propagation

Jasmin Callahan brings nearly two decades of hands-on experience in plant production, having worked in settings ranging from an organic vegetable and flower farm with a large annual plant sale to a wholesale nursery. These roles shaped her understanding of how propagation methods, scheduling decisions, and production timelines directly affect both plant quality and business viability.

In 2024, Jasmin founded Dragonfly Natives in response to a growing demand for locally grown native plants, with a focus on plug trays. Working with ecotypic seed and regionally adapted species, Dragonfly Natives aims to provide high-quality plants for landscapers, designers, and restoration projects. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:02

Welcome to Peace Love and Pollinators, the podcast that's anything but your typical gardening show. We're here to transform how you see your backyard, balcony, or local park by uncovering the powerful connections between you, your plants, and the planet. From pollinator-friendly gardening hacks to creating green spaces that fight climate change. We explore more than just what to plant. We dig into why it matters. You're listening to Peace, Love, and Pollinators. Hello, everybody, and welcome to Peace, Love and Pollinators. I am your host, Trevor Smith, and with me today is Jasmine Callahan of Dragonfly Natives. We are going to have an excellent conversation today. She is a friend of mine, and one of the things that uh one of the reasons I wanted to have her on is because she has been running a number of experiments of what it is to be growing natives and how to grow natives and really how kind of how to perfect the art. Growing natives is a lot different than just growing your standard ornamentals and exotics. And I really appreciate uh how she is willing to experiment and kind of perfect this craft. So, welcome, Jasmine. Thank you so much for being on the podcast.

SPEAKER_00 1:19

Hello, thank you for having me. This is a great opportunity. I'm very excited.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

I am so excited to have you here. So, one of the things I did not mention was that before heading into natives, your main focus was on uh vegetable farming and floral, correct?

SPEAKER_00 1:39

Yes, I've done a number of things in my life, but definitely the most important and longest lasting things I've done for careers has been farming. I was an organic uh farmer. I managed uh flour and vegetable production, including some herbs. And that was a very worthwhile experience in my life, and I compare everything to it.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

All right, excellent. All right, well, that that's just going to be relevant with some of the questions that I have prepared for you. So, what inspired you then to start Dragonfly Natives? Like, where did that come from? Here you are, you got you got your thing going, you're like, oh no, I'm just gonna throw caution to the wind and dive right in.

SPEAKER_00 2:23

Oh, that's such a great way to put it. Um, a little bit of both. So the long version, if you want that, is that I've always been that outdoorsy person. Like my earliest memories are crawling underneath shrubs and exploring and writing on rocks with poke berry berries, uh pokeweed berries. And I went, you know, I went to college to study environmental studies, and that was very depressing. Um, I was told by an instructor if I really wanted to make a difference in life, I should be a lawyer or get into politics, and it really wasn't what I was interested in. So I decided to make a difference. I didn't know what I wanted to do, but I needed to do something that was worthwhile and had a positive impact on the environment. Uh long story now short, bringing it right up to the future. A few years back, I had a casual conversation with someone who told me I should start a nursery. And I was like, no, not gonna do it. And um, and I'll get back to the middle part with the farming in a minute. But anyway, he told me to start a nursery. I should really do it. I was so passionate about native plants and everything involved with the ecosystem and the benefits to them. And I still was like affirm no. I did, however, agree to talk with him, and over the course of like eight weeks, we met once a week, and we just kept talking through all the components of it. I did market research, and that is how I hesitantly decided to start a nursery. What I failed to mention is the in-between part when I was farming. Um, farming was wonderful, but there was a few moments when I was in the field and so just so busy with not enough time to really explore what was on the outsides of the fields, the field edges. Um, I was on a property that was like 130 acres, and most of it was wooded with streams and brooks and wetlands and all these ephemerals, and I never had time to go enjoy. And I really just got to a moment where I was like, you know what, I want to switch focus, and um, while growing healthy organic vegetables is really important, I wanted to do something else, and that's what it was.

SPEAKER_01 4:37

So I absolutely one of the things that I regret about us being in this industry, or at least from my end, is that spring is one of my favorite times. And I always miss it because we're always so busy in spring. So I totally hear you on wanting to have that opportunity to get a little bit more involved uh, you know, in nature and actually being able to experience it. Uh because you were you know talking about you know all the ephemerals and and everything else that's happening. And spring is just one of those those times, it's it's amazing, but everything is just so subtle at that time that you know you if if you blink, you miss it. It's it's so fleeting. It's not like summertime flowers that are just there and you have plenty of time to look at them. Spring, all it takes is a rain or a warm day, and boom, everything just goes right through. So um you've kind of you just you've described yourself, and I'm uh basing basing this very much on an article that is about to come out uh that you wrote for the Ecological Landscape Alliance. And you describe yourself as a relatively new nursery owner, um, which you just you know you were just saying that you know that you are, but what what is the biggest difference, I guess, moving from farming in flowers to moving into natives? Like what is where where was that, was there a big learning curve change? You know, what what was happening there?

SPEAKER_00 6:03

There's a lot of similarities. There's a lot of aspects of farming that I love that also I employ with the nursery industry. There's spreadsheets and planning, propagation, efficiency, you know, there's the financial component of it, making sure everything is, you know, you can stay afloat, you're running a business. Um, there's also the challenges of soil in farming. And I think I didn't expect the nursery industry, at least with the native plants, I didn't really think about how challenging that aspect would be. Um, you know, when I was farming, we were so consumed with the health of the soil, fertility, uh, nutrient-dense, nutrient-rich, nutrient-dense vegetables, nutrients within the soil, microbial life. But when we grew plants in containers, we used one soil. We used Vermont compost, and it worked really well for everything. That was for plants we sold as a plant sale product, or plants that we were growing to put in the ground and to transplant to the fields. So it was fine, it was easy. Um, when it comes to growing native plants, there's so many diverse needs of these plants that it's really hard to find just one soil that works for everything. And that's really what I've been experimenting with in the last couple of years and continue to do so.

SPEAKER_01 7:28

Well, I mean, that's totally true. And this is one of the things that um I've often wondered, and again, it's why I wanted to have you on, because native plants, as I say in my talks, you know, one of the one of the biggest mistakes people make when they are um planting native plants is over-amending the soil. You know, native plants have evolved to really love our crappy New England soils. Um, you know, how do you balance with with your experiments and and from what you've had to do, like how do you balance you know, growing these vigorous plants in containers, but also prepping them to go into these lean soils? And and what have you found out? Because it's, you know, if I I say to everybody, you know, a native plant at a nursery is kind of like being on a cruise. Like it has all the food it wants, it has all the water it wants, even if it's a drought tolerant plant, and then you throw it in your garden and it's like cruises over. Now it has to find its own food, find its own water, pretty much. Um, you know, so there's a there's that transition into the landscape. What have you found in just you know propagation? And how do you balance kind of getting them ready to go into the real world?

SPEAKER_00 8:47

I do use some omri-listed uh slow release fertilizers, slow release in that they're like two weeks to a couple months, not like the um not like the little balls that you see in regular nursery products. And I always use on the low end of what is suggested. I never want to really boost that plant. I have on occasion had some issues with soil and nutrients and had to uh provide them with some more um like liquid fertilizer. I do like to use Neptunes at times and other things. Um, it is a challenge because some plants, if they're out in the rain and they're getting too much rain and the nitrogen is just leaching out from the soil, they're gonna need a boost, even though they're a native plant and they naturally could probably do with less than other horticultural varieties. They still need nitrogen. They still need some nutrients. And um unfortunately it's not, at least for me, at my stage where I am, it's not a one recipe for every plant. And that would make it very easy and much more efficient. But I am doing it species by species sometimes. Like I will see a crop that needs a little extra something, and I'll make sure they get um some Neptunes fertilizer or something like that. Does that answer your question?

SPEAKER_01 9:56

It totally answers the question. And, you know, this is the like I said, this is what's interesting. So um which like let's why don't we just like go right in into some of those plants? I I know that Golden Alexander, Zizia, um, is is one that you've experimented with. Just tell us, you know, tell us of a couple of different plants, a couple of different scenarios where you found that by making some slight tweaks in the environment or in the soil condition, um, you know, what have you found? This is the experimenting and the fact that you are brave enough to experiment because this is your livelihood. So it is, it's, you know, you really need it's it's to be an entrepreneur takes guts. And then to be an experimental entrepreneur on top of that, um, I think really takes guts, and I it's commendable. So I just want to hear about like what you've learned and you know the the differences between plants, examples, et cetera.

SPEAKER_00 10:52

Oh my god. Well, first of all, I can't help it. Like, I am not the kind of person that's gonna go to work and do the same thing every day. Clearly, I own a nursery that is not something I'm in for. I don't think I could just go and plant a plant and not experiment, it's just not in me. Um, so I was trying to find, I've done a lot of work on experimenting with different soil components that make up blends. Um, I was trying to find a soil blend that most mimicked the native soils, at least that I could find. And I use that for a lot of plants, but um, I was noticing it didn't have good root growth, and I was like, okay, is this the time of year? Is it my fertilizer? Like, what's going on? So I used in this case, and this is since it was Zizia, and I used um just three different soils. I used a pretty standard blend. I used this blend I thought mimicked the native soils with a lot of wood components to it, and I used this other blend that had biochar in it. It was new to the market blend, and I was pretty excited about it. And it had a um, I can't remember the exact name, but an expanded wood pulp product in it. And I used it, I did a few different species, and it had mixed results, and it was odd to use, it wasn't efficient to use, it wasn't, it was kind of like play-doh-y, it was slow to um pot up a plant in. Um, and then when I was doing my testing of the results, when I had a moment, I popped out the zizia plant. And the plant, the soil that was most mimicking our native soils, the zizia had no roots. It was just kind of like it was very, very, it wasn't well rooted at all. Um the nursery blend, um, the standard nursery brand, it was fine. It was good, it was beautiful. And then this expanded wood pulp soil with the biochart was just striking. The difference, the amount that um, the amount of roots that it had and how it was holding, holding that blend together was just um striking. However, not every plant loved it. So it's not something I can just incorporate, or if I do, it's going to be a very limited number of plant species. And then I have to look at it from a business perspective. Is it worth it to buy a soil blend that works for a select number of species?

SPEAKER_01 13:05

Yeah. But those, I mean, those roots are everything. I mean, we spend, you know, the spring putting in plugs, thousands of plugs, you know, all spring long. And if if those plants aren't aren't rooted out, then it's you know, all it takes is that one little switch when you have those nice cool spring days, and then boom, it's 90. And if those plants aren't rooted out, it's it is definitely, definitely difficult. Um so of those, of the species that you grow, what has been the most challenging? And it's funny that I'm even asking you this question because I had another designer call me today and said, Is it worth getting Carrix Pennsylvanica seed and just trying to grow a lawn? I said, no, don't even think about trying it. You will fail. I know that that one's hard. Um, what are some of the other ones that have proven to be difficult?

SPEAKER_00 13:58

Oh my gosh. On scenario, and so this is where I would love to collaborate with other people. On scenario for me is one of my most challenging species that everybody wants. I cannot grow enough of it. When I I almost grow double, like if someone orders it, I would go twice grow twice the amount they order because I know I'm going to lose half of it, or approximately that. Um, I have probably tried 10 different soil mixes with that plant, different shapes. I have a um tray size that I know it likes, um, tray shape that it likes, uh, I know how I water it. So I'm getting better at it, but it's been my greatest challenge. Most definitely. Um, other ones, I think there's timing involved. There's other things. I'm gonna circle back to that whole like um putting a plant in the ground. And these are things that I would love to get feedback from the landscapers and the people who actually do the work and check back up on it. Like uh our nursery brands that we use most frequently are very light, but um, and they're helpful because I grow in trays. I grow 50 plants in one tray, 32 to 50, and they a heavy soil in there breaks that tray and is cumbersome to use. But at the same time, a heavy soil I think would go into the ground and probably thrive better because that plant is not gonna pop out, uh, it's not gonna frost heave out of the ground, come um if you plant it in the fall and we get our our cold winters come upon us. It's gonna stay in the ground. Hopefully the plant will be rooted and it'll be heavy enough. But um that that's kind of where I've been going with that. And you know, what is the balance? What is worthwhile? Is it okay to grow a plant in a heavy soil? If it takes longer to root out, if it's going to reduce um a plant that's gonna do better in the ground once it's transplanted. These are things that I debate and I experiment with, and I actually do need the people on the other end of this um to fill me in, I think, sometimes.

SPEAKER_01 15:49

Yeah, absolutely. That field feedback and antenaria or pussy toes is just is I've received for some from you. It's it's excellent, wonderful ground cover for the full sun, you know, and once established, we'll you know, we'll take the beating and you know take it pretty, you know, pretty dry, pretty lean. So, but I can I can see where that would be a challenge. Who else is who else is a challenge for you?

SPEAKER_00 16:14

Oh my gosh, I feel unprepared for this question. I'm sorry. Um absolutely fine. Oh, fireweed, fireweed. That is one I have a lot of questions about. These are the things that make my brain just go wild. So I want to know, and this is something I think we'll talk about a little later, but I want to know if there's some uh microbial association with fireweed that'll help it be happier in a container. Um there, like that's something that I'm looking, I'm experimenting with right now. I personally find that when I grow fireweed, it I can start it just fine, I transplant it just fine. Um, in the smaller size containers, it tends to become unhappy very quickly. It spreads, spreads honestly. So I give it a wider container. Um still doesn't look great and it doesn't perform like it does on the ground. So these are the things that I'm looking to figure out.

SPEAKER_01 17:03

That's that's awesome. So you brought, I mean, you brought up the the microbes uh and the biologics, and I know that you are you know that you're heavily into them. So tell us about you know that whole excuse me journey, you know, using biologics, biologics in the nursery. I don't know if you use um if you use IPM, if you use, you know, insects within the greenhouses to help control pests. And I'd love to know you what you're doing soil-wise to experiment, you know, with the biologics. If you're working with like Korean natural farming and if you're going out and collecting microbes from the area, or are you have you experimented with stuff that's off the shelf? Tell me about it.

SPEAKER_00 17:46

I I don't know how much your audience knows about all this, and I am not an expert. I'm someone that dabbles in it and loves to learn more but doesn't have the time. Uh, you mentioned Korean natural farming. Um, I've definitely taken workshops as a person, a farmer in Connecticut, Brian O'Hare. He's been doing Korean natural farming for a long time, and he will go out to his field edges, the forest floor. He will take soil samples, and then on rice, he will grow on like a white rice. He will grow that um those those microbes, the fungus, there, and then he will inoculate his soils in his farm fields with them. Um, so most, I think it's I can't remember the numbers, but it's like maybe approximately 80% of all um herbaceous plants have some mycorrhizal associations. And these micro the microbes in the soil really help plants get nutrients. They make them bioavailable for them, and the mycorrhizae will actually go into the roots and help bring those nutrients directly into plant roots. So, in farming, that's important, obviously, for the health of a crop. And if you're really concerned about the health of your soil, you want to make sure that you are providing or creating soil that supports a healthy microbiome. Now, in a container, is that necessary? Like in that short life that that plant is going from seed to sale in my hands, is it important? These are the things that I wonder and I'm trying to figure out. Um, and then there's that question, like what Brian O'Hare is doing. Like, do I just go to the woods? And is that the right micro rhizal life that's gonna benefit my plants? Um, what I believe I understand is like what I've been told. Um, so I would love for people who know more to fill me in. But like plants have certain microbial relationships, and it's not the same relationship that another species will have. So they're gonna have their own relationships. So can you capture all of those microbes? Should you? Can you? How do you do this? How do you create healthy plants? Do I have to go find the individual microbes? Uh, not even the microbes, the fungus that um have an association with certain species, and then do it species by species or genre by genre, and um or do I just like blanket everything, or does it matter? That's what I'm doing. So right now, I am using go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 20:14

No, I'm just saying, like you said, like that's really tough because you only have a short amount of time to spend with the plant. So it's like I I love how you're geeking out on it, but it is it worth it, you know, to, you know, and and how deep does one um does one go? I get asked a lot about um inoculants, and I've seen a lot of them, you know, coming out. You know, I've I'll be talking to somebody about it and they're like, oh, I have this, and they either pulled something from a hydroponic store or they got something on Amazon. Um some of those things, you know, make make me leery about what's going on. I also know that um, you know, as far as like Korean natural farming and Brian O'Hare, like when it's your farm, like that's your space. Like you are growing and they're going somewhere else. Later, later this summer, I will be taking a number of your plants and taking them about, you know, 60 miles north of where you are. So where the microbial, you know, the microbial uh communities are totally different. So yeah, it's it's trying to figure that out. Um, you know, I I think I think is huge. But I mean I love the way you're geeking out on it because it's different than um the way the industry thinks. You know, every everything is, you know, uh just kind of a blanket answer, you know, blank you know, blanket fertilizers, blanket microbes, blanket, you know, so and I think the more you can dial in, and because native plants are so specific, I think the more you can dial in the better. Uh some of that I think is on your end, uh, but I really think the majority Of it is on the uh you know on the responsibility of the landscape community when you're putting in those native plants, because you have them for such a short time and we're setting them up for the rest of their life. So you just just again, I wanted you on here to talk about some of your experiments. You know, just talk about some of the things that you've experimented with, what you found, whether it be microbes, you know, or you know, or the like the mycorrhizal fungi. Um, have you had any success with like an endo, ecto, mycorrhizal fungi mix, which is the mycorrhizal fungi, the fungus roots that grow on a plant root and in a plant root, that is endo and ecto, just for everybody who's listening. Uh, and just wondering, like, at what point in time do you say maybe this experiment isn't worth it?

SPEAKER_00 22:52

I I have to limit myself. Um, and I'm really fortunate that a lot of my crew is also interested in this. Just um this last week we were doing some more soil experiments, and I have, you know, it was like people there, and everyone's doing a different phase of experimenting with different soil blends, with um specifically four species we chose, four blends of soil, one in each blend, and just hearing everybody's feedback and how they're thinking about it, and you know, what they're um they're reflecting on it, they're predicting, you know, everyone's looking at this. So everything's labeled, everything's, you know, we can follow up on it. And then on top of that, um, I have done, I do root shield, which is a product that is available that helps um kind of preempts it, like populates the soil in the plant so that it is less disease prone. In a greenhouse situation, that's really helpful because I don't know if anyone's ever like grown a lot of plants in one space. You get disease in there on one plant, everything's gonna get it, especially within a species. And I find that a lot of our native species are more disease prone, which is one of the reasons, one of the reasons why um cultivars and selections have been taken of our native plants because we're often looking for um nativars or cultivars that are less disease, um, prone, more disease resistance to certain things, um, like Jacob's Klein Minarda. Um, that's an example. So Root Shield is a product you can purchase. I I have used it, I do use it. Um you should be reapplying it at one point. I'm at that reapplication window right now, and so I'm experimenting once again. I've um purchased some uh micro microal, I can't say the word, I'm sorry, micro rhizal inoculant from Prairie Moon. And um, I will be applying that to certain species and um and I'll have my control with nothing, and I'll probably do some more root shield. So we'll see um root growth. I'm hoping the inoculated plants will have better root growth and just appear happier and healthier. That's my goal. Um, but yeah, can I create that um environment in a two-inch by five inch cell? We'll see.

SPEAKER_01 25:03

So if yes, that's that's definitely the hardest part. So let's just say um somebody were to hand you five million dollars to experiment with. Because here's the thing. I mean, like I said, it's it takes guts because you are you know essentially experimenting with your your livelihood. And these, you know, this is it's it's it's you know, some of it's kind of risky. I mean, I love how you set up the controls and I love how you do it. And if you do break through on something, you know, it's it's certainly going to be awesome. Um you know, these these you know, these blanket, like I said, these blanket products uh are tough. We use um we use inoculant in the root zone of all the plants that that we put in, you know, to into into the ground. Um they are not one of the things I was very uh focused on was not getting uh species that are not from, let's just say, North America, uh, because I know that there are plenty of species that are just kind of being snuck in, you know, uh that uh you know into the into these mixes that are not from say North America alone. I don't know what will happen if we introduce too many, we'll call them non-native species, you know, into our soil. Will it be a problem? Maybe, maybe not, you know. W it it's it's too nobody's looked at this enough, I don't think, um, at least from what I've read, heard, and talked to people about, nobody's looked into it enough uh to really know if it's going to be a problem. I just know what it is to bring all these plants that have become invasive uh over here, and that hasn't proven well. So I think getting strains from other continents probably isn't isn't the best the best scenario. Um are you able to kind of read through and and decide? Do you go through order olive?

SPEAKER_00 27:10

I've been leery. I cut you off. I'm sorry. I've been very leery of um those broad there's so many right now. Um beneficial microbes are very common right now in the marketplace for this industry, and I am leery about them. Um I have heard that fungi is our next invasive species that we'll be concerned about. So I have hesitations like when I say I'm gonna reapply root shield, I'm actually hesitant about that. It's done great things. I've from what I told it won't, you know, once it goes into a natural environment, it'll be out competed anything that's put on there. I um but I would prefer to find some inoculants, and I don't know of anyone that's making them, so it would have to be that $5 million grant. And I have an employee that would be all over it, send them around, and he would like, you know, go to wherever plants are found and he would dig out the soil and grow it from there. I have them, we're ready. Um but that would be my ideal situation, even if it's like western mass to you know, coming from eastern mass, that would be a lot better than coming from Minnesota. Um certainly would be a lot better than coming from another continent. And if it has that added benefit of being the exact match association with that plant, that's the most ideal situation. Um, and that brings me back, Trevor, to the idea. I know a lot of uh landscapers actually do drenches of with microbes before they install their plant community, I mean their plants, and because they're creating a community. Um and everyone has a different mixture and it's so interesting. And I'm once again, I would love the feedback. I want to interact with all of this on the other end and see if maybe some of us can do large experiments to see how things work, um, both from you know from my start experiments on forward.

SPEAKER_01 29:01

Well, that was and that's that my next question was really going to be, and you've alluded to this quite a bit, but how important are those collaborations, you know, with with other growers, with landscape professionals, with you know, the mycologists, ecologists, everybody like how important are those relationships and you know, what have you done to really tap into that?

SPEAKER_00 29:26

At this point, it's just the beginning stages. Uh, I've had a lot of conversations with people. Um we all, there's a there's a bunch of people, and every time you talk to them, we all get excited and we discuss things, but I have not been, it hasn't gone further than talk and experiments, but I would love to learn more. I would love to have input from people who have been studying this from a scientific perspective from a long uh you know for years, and then I just want real true knowledge and less hearsay.

SPEAKER_01 29:59

Yes, absolutely. But one of the great things I find um about the growing world, whether it be farming uh and and and even landscaping, is people are more apt to share information than other industries. You know, I learned much of what I know about soil just picking people's brains, you know, the the blends and things um that I've come up with, the drenches and the blends, you know, it was I'm thinking about using this, you know, talking to people and saying, what do you think about these ratios or what do you think about these ingredients and getting that honest feedback, you know, and what have you found out if you try this? And you know, people really do share freely. One of the things um that I say on Tuesdays with Trev quite uh quite often, you know, is the greatest thing about growing vegetables is at some point in time you will have too many vegetables and you will have to share them with somebody so they don't so they don't spoil. And it just promotes community, you know, which is just so wonderful how and if you're growing native plants or if you're growing a garden where you're going to have to divide them at some point in time, and that just then you give them away and it just promotes you know community. I've uh met a number of people who've started their pollinator gardens based on you know starts and either either winter so that was just abundant or just you know, when they were editing their garden, um, you know, that that that which is you know come about and they're just like here, take some of this, you know, just be just be careful with it. What's your favorite plant to grow?

SPEAKER_00 31:35

Oh jeez. Oh come on now.

SPEAKER_01 31:37

Um favorite child.

SPEAKER_00 31:41

It just for a lack of it might be Zizia. It's such a fairly common plant, but it's so happy. And even after the flowers pass, it's happy. Um yeah, there you go. That that's today, that's this moment.

SPEAKER_01 31:54

Um today, today, at this moment, we will document that. It's Zizia. It might change tomorrow, but that's what it is today. So um really just uh you know, kind of wrapping up, but before we wrap up, I just what is your what is your goal? What is your what is your what is your dream for dragonfly natives?

SPEAKER_00 32:18

Like you know what, I just I love what I'm doing. I there's so many times just smiling. Um I just want to just carry on and honestly a little more free time to enjoy the ephemerals. Um, but yes, to have a healthy, happy, thriving nursery that is contributing. I love the community like you're talking about. Everyone is into native plants for a great reason, and hearing all of that from everybody is wonderful. Hearing why people do what they do and um learning more from them and having conversations. So I guess my goal is to carry on.

SPEAKER_01 32:57

Do you see yourself um you know staying relatively small and specialized, or do you, you know, do you is world domination on your that's an interesting question.

SPEAKER_00 33:14

I am not a world domination person. Um I we do have a wholesale nursery. It is wholesale for a reason um because I enjoy the production aspect of it. So I am always trying to scale up production. Um right now we're working on doubling our heated greenhouse space that we have because we realize we have already maxed that out with our spring uh production and even space to you know slowly warm up and wake up um over wintered material. We're doing that as well. So yeah, I'm expanding, we're growing. Um employees um have increased in numbers, it's great, but um world domination, no.

SPEAKER_01 33:53

No, not not world domination. Well, that's that's okay. But it's interesting, you know, entrepreneurs just you know fascinate me uh just with with what motivates them and where they see where they see it going. And some people want to keep it, you know, small and specialized, and other people really want to grow and expand, and some are you know definitely driven by money, and some are driven by craft and passion, and that is sounds like it is very much you. So just um is there anything that you wish I would have asked you or that that you wanted to talk about that we didn't?

SPEAKER_00 34:38

Oh no. No, um, I if you've when we end this conversation, you know uh I will come up with that.

SPEAKER_01 34:46

You will come up with something, and and that's absolutely fine. I just didn't want to leave anything on the table because this has been you know just an excellent conversation. Uh why don't you tell everybody how they can find you, where they can find you, and you know, put yourself out there, dragonfly natives, you know, and be looking for the article to be released in the Ecological Landscape Alliance newsletter. Uh it's a I've seen the rough draft, it's absolutely excellent. Uh much of this conversation was designed around that. As I mentioned, Jasmine is she's just very brave. Um, and she's putting it all out there. So I I really respect that. I'm excited about that. And Jasmine, just let everybody know where to find you.

SPEAKER_00 35:36

All right, so we're at Dragonfly Natives. We're in South Dartmouth. We are a wholesale nursery, so it's uh not open to the public. We also have a website, dragonflynatives.com, and you can reach us um via email, info at dragonflynatives.com, or the phone number is 508-443-8717. We are not open to the public on a regular basis. Please, appointment only. We're very busy trying to do um poll orders and do what we do. So appointments are readily available, but um, please contact before stopping by.

SPEAKER_01 36:12

Thank you so much, Jasmine. This has been great. Thank you for making the time during this busy season to jump on. I'm sure all your greenhouse full of children are missing you right now. So I appreciate you staying away for this long. Um, and I look forward to seeing you and seeing these wonderful plants that you will be growing out for us uh for our meadow project in the fall. So thanks again for joining us, and we'll be seeing you soon. That does it for this episode of Peace, Love, and Pollinators. Another great conversation.