Canoe Expeditions in Scotland pt 2

In the 2nd part of this episode on Scottish Canoe Expeditions we explore some of the practicalities like travel and hire.  Also tents, sleeping and the usual juvenile toilet topics.

We talk about how to work your way up to a trip like this, what the kit might cost and who sits where in a Canoe.

https://snowgoosecentre.co.uk

https://www.rockhopperscotland.co.uk/

This episode is brought to you by Chiltern Walks who provide guided walks and walking holidays around the UK. You can find more details here:

Check out Chiltern Walks: guided walks and holidays https://www.meetup.com/chiltern-walks-meetup on Meetup

If you have a story to share or some feedback to give just contact us at contact.unraveltravel@gmail.com


Our theme music is Traveler's Blues by Jerzy Gorecki from Pixabay (with licence)

https://pixabay.com/users/jerzyg%C3%B3recki-2233926/

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:09

Welcome to Unravel Travel, where every journey has a story.

SPEAKER_00 0:17

Which makes things a little bit easier for the three days when you're there. I love to get up and have a coffee first thing in the morning when it's really still, just looking out over the ocean, looking out to rum and egg, the small isles out to the west. If you look to the north, you've got the the cool in a sky, and just having a coffee in that environment, there's nothing quite like it. I don't think there's a seascape like that anywhere in the world. It's amazing. Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_02 0:53

That's a good brand new holiday.

SPEAKER_00 0:55

What I would say is you've just used an interesting term there, Dave, because I'd never class it as a holiday, and people say, Oh, that looked like a great holiday. It's definitely an expedition. Expedition, fair point. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:13

Far have I travelled, and much have I seen. Dark distant mountains with valleys of green, past painted deserts, the sunset on fire, as he carries me home to the Mull of Kintire. Mull of Kintire, O mist rolling in from the sea. My desire is always to be here, O Mull of Kintire. Malcolm gave me this reading. I think it was just his way of getting me to uh to read Mul of Kintire out.

SPEAKER_01 1:42

That took nearly as long as it was at number one for, I think.

SPEAKER_02 1:49

Lovely, lovely song. God bless Paul McCartney.

SPEAKER_01 1:52

He's not dead yet. Not at the time of recording.

SPEAKER_02 1:59

I'm gonna feel real guilty.

SPEAKER_01 2:01

Yeah, you're gonna be like Liz Trustee killed the Queen.

SPEAKER_02 2:04

There'll only be Ringo left. Oh well. So this is a follow-on episode from uh episode one where we're talking to uh Mr. Stuart West, Malcolm's uh brother, about uh kayaking uh all over and canoeing, uh all over, but mostly in the uh the west of Scotland.

SPEAKER_01 2:23

How do you get up there, Stuart, to Scotland? Do you uh do you drive up with canoes on top? Do you hire them up there? I think you've probably done a mixture of those two things, haven't you?

SPEAKER_00 2:32

Yeah, yeah, really, really good question. So, number one, it's uh nine-hour drive on the road to where we go. Gen condition varies, it can be more than that, and with with stops, it's often more like ten to eleven. So, yeah, you've got to plan that a little bit. Increasingly, we used to do it in a wanna, up in a day and then back, but increasingly now we go up and stop somewhere around Glasgow area and then do the last kind of three to four hours, sometimes longer. If you're going all the way up to Kishore and Loch Torridon, you you know it it takes a good bit longer than that. In terms of taking a canoe, if I go with Sarah or with my lad, and it's just the two of us, we will just take the canoe, which is actually our other brother Graham's canoe. Shh, yeah, we will steal that and and take it. And I have kind of stole it for the last 10 years.

SPEAKER_01 3:28

Um he hasn't seen it for ages.

SPEAKER_00 3:30

Yeah, he hasn't seen it for a it was his 50th birthday present, wasn't it?

SPEAKER_01 3:34

And he hasn't no, he's 40 for 10. Or even 30.

SPEAKER_00 3:38

He only had it for about six months. Yeah, I think it might have even though it's a few.

SPEAKER_02 3:40

He doesn't listen to these anyway, does he?

SPEAKER_00 3:42

No, so what what he doesn't know won't hurt him. So, yeah, uh it is just two of us, we'll load the car up, we'll take the canoe, we'll go. When I go up with a group of four, sometimes five, so with Lee and Harry, sometimes a friend or relative of uh of Lee's will come as well. We will hire canoes up there. We use um, am I allowed to plug a company or not on this?

SPEAKER_02 4:06

Yeah, of course. Yeah, please do.

SPEAKER_00 4:07

Yeah, so Snow Goose in Fort William, we've used for open canoe hire, and we've also used recently Rock Hopper, Canoe, and Kayak Hire. They've been really good last year to us. And I'm actually taking a school group this summer of 16 students, sort of 14-15-year-old students, up for a three-day sea kayaking trip using Rock Hopper uh and using their guides, obviously, as well, and planning a little expedition, which is going to be great. So, take taking a school trip up there with the case.

SPEAKER_01 4:43

And that's in kayaks, then not in canoes.

SPEAKER_00 4:45

That is gonna be in sea because it's safer. Yeah, that's gonna be in sea kayaks.

SPEAKER_02 4:49

I've always used kayaks, that's why I keep getting it wrong, according to Malcolm.

SPEAKER_00 4:52

Yeah, and the trip, and the truth is Canadian canoes are really designed for rivers, not the open ocean, but we just find them really useful to get everything in.

SPEAKER_02 5:01

You can carry far more, can't you? We touched upon this in an earlier episode, but uh we we talked in sorry, the previous episode, we talked about uh the stuff for cooking and whatever, but you know, sleeping. Do you take uh is it hard the ground? Do you take big mats, camping beds, sleeping bags?

SPEAKER_00 5:19

Well, I mean, no, the ground the the the places where we choose choose to camp are really on what they call in Scotland or on the coast there, the Macair, which is like the grassland just immediately off the beach, right? And it's it's pretty perfect ground actually for nice and spongy.

SPEAKER_02 5:38

Imagine it being quite spongy.

SPEAKER_00 5:40

It's not spongy in the sense of swagnum moss, which is up on the hillsides. This is like a grass layer, but it's almost on a on on sand. Um, and it's actually quite a rare habitat, so you've got to be a bit careful. So when when we have fires, we never have the fires on the Mac Air. You always do that on the on the on the sand of the beach, just or where the rocks are, just off the Mac air, but you pitch your tents on the Mac Air, and it's perfect ground for pitching up tents on. In terms of sleeping, we would use mat just normal kind of self-inflating sleeping mats, uh, which can pack down pretty light because it's obviously about getting your kit down it relatively to a minimum, so you can take your luxuries like wine.

SPEAKER_02 6:29

I'm just gonna ask you, uh other than wine, what is what's the little luxury that you take?

SPEAKER_00 6:34

Seats. Ah, yeah, good idea. Seats, seats is the big one. We've only started doing that. We've got probably three, four years.

SPEAKER_01 6:42

That sort of thing.

SPEAKER_00 6:43

Well, we we we take jet boils, Matt. So jet boils uh uh uh allow us to first thing in the morning, and that's the other luxury, I guess, taking a cafetiere.

SPEAKER_02 6:54

Coffee, yeah, that would be my luxury, but I like seats. I I'm of an age now that I need a back to lean against. I can't just be sitting on a stool.

SPEAKER_00 7:01

Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, we take we we take those little bits and bobs, which which make things a little bit easier for the three days when you're there. I love to get up and have a coffee first thing in the morning when it's really still, just looking out over the ocean, looking out to rum and egg, the small aisles out to the west. If you look to the north, you've got the the cool in the sky, and just having a coffee in that environment, there's nothing quite like it. That I don't think there's a seascape like that anywhere in the world, it's amazing, it's absolutely breathtaking. It never fails to blow me away when we go up there, to be honest.

SPEAKER_01 7:41

And if you've done that beautiful scene in the morning and the coffee, I hope you remember to take a trowel with you. I was gonna say I will run with that. What's the next one? Do you want to just run us through the uh run be in the office?

SPEAKER_00 7:56

Yeah, I was gonna say depending on the amount of coffee. Yeah, that's interesting because the the students have launched this sea kiking trip, like I say, at school, and the first question, the mo the most common question straight away from all the students that I spoke to when they knew they were going. And and I was actually really pleased that there was a lot of people. Is this my alma mater Stu? It is, yeah. Summer Coach Academy. Yeah, that's right. And the the kids were so thrilled about the prospect of going and doing this. I was surprised. I kind of broached it with the with the students and thought, oh, there might be a few interested, I might be able to get a trip off the ground. But I was really keen to do something where they get to go and see some of the beauty of the UK because that it's very underrated.

SPEAKER_01 8:44

They do live at Donano, which is you know quite pretty much.

SPEAKER_00 8:47

It's a bit flat and featureless out there.

SPEAKER_01 8:49

Yeah, it's quite special though, in the right weather conditions. I I you know you don't know.

SPEAKER_00 8:53

Oh, yeah, for sure. Uh, but the the the commonest question I got in the first few days was Sir, what do we do about like if we want a number two? And actually, we don't we don't take a trowel is the answer, and uh but I won't go into too much detail, but but essentially there are some rocky areas well away from where we camp, which require a little bit of a scramble across to get to, and that I find is the best place to lay a deposit.

SPEAKER_02 9:23

As long as it's not in the middle of the night.

SPEAKER_00 9:25

No, that would be not good, but it's important to do that well above the water line so that it only gets caught in the winter storms. You don't want to be doing it in between the tidal zone because if you do it in the intertidal zone and then you go snorkeling later that day, you may bump into something you don't want to bump into.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

This is like David snorkeling off the back of the boat, isn't it, David?

SPEAKER_04 9:48

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:49

Which I didn't I'd just like to say, which I didn't do. So uh, do you have you done any snorkeling on these? I I know I asked in the previous episode whether you'd done it off the boat, but if you from the shore, do you go snorkeling?

SPEAKER_00 10:00

Lots and lots, Dave. Yeah, it's the the sea life there is incredible. So where the small isles are, which is just offshore from the Moydart area, there is uh it's a marine protected area where we snorkel the the islands just off. I won't say exactly where we go, but the islands just off from where we camp. You're talking about seagrass meadows and then the whole range of uh dugons and no, no, not so many dugongs, Matt, but the odd the odd seal you know floating around. Never snork.

SPEAKER_02 10:35

I'd love to go snorking and there's a seal there.

SPEAKER_00 10:37

That'd be brilliant. They're very they're actually quite inquisitive. Um and and they often come right up to the canoe and surprise you with a massive splash immediately behind the canoe, which scares the wits out of you.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

We went swimming off the coast of Cornwall once, sorry, and uh and uh and a seal was sort of messing about. You sort of swim towards it and it ducks down and it comes up ten yards on the other side of you, and it's they're just so playful that ducks down and brilliant.

SPEAKER_00 11:03

But no, some of the snorkeling and and the kelp forest there, it it's just unbelievable. There's all sorts of different layers of ecosystem down there. Some of the sea life, wow. Uh, I mean, I I remember several times where we've uh snorkeled with a huge soul shoal of sand eels, and it's it's the water is so clear, it's it's gin clear. You know, I remember you David bit of drinking.

SPEAKER_02 11:30

It's a lot of pickle than you imagine the I was gonna say the olives, but you beat me to it. I I remember snorkeling with you David rather than a martini, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:38

Yeah, me too, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:39

That's the first time I ever snorkeled, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:42

And and actually, I'd say, and and I've snorkeled quite a bit in Asia and in other parts of the world and in the med and stuff, and the water off the northwest of Scotland is ten times clearer. It's because it's cold, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 11:56

Is that not the reason why?

SPEAKER_00 11:57

Warm weather, well, it's a bit cold, it's a bit cold. But if you if you put a wetsuit on, we we we we generally always wear wetsuits, and you you can go in the sea and you can be in for half an hour, an hour, and not really notice the cold. You notice when you first get in, obviously, but it it even Sarah last summer, and Sarah is notorious for not tolerating cold water, she's now bought into it and she absolutely loved it last summer, snorkeling.

SPEAKER_01 12:25

I wasn't meaning cold, I was just thinking that cold water maybe has a better clarity to it than warm water. That's what I was meaning. I think you get better visibility in cold water, don't you? Just generally speaking.

SPEAKER_00 12:36

Yeah, I think that's possibly true. I I don't know the physics of it, but it's probably what are the beaches?

SPEAKER_02 12:42

Are they sandy, shingle?

SPEAKER_00 12:43

They're white sand beaches where we go. And when I say white sand, I mean Caribbean white sand, it's almost like power, it's like and apologies, I don't expect you to answer, but I'm gonna ask the question just in case.

SPEAKER_02 12:56

That suggests to me that at some point in the past uh it would have been some sort of tropical with coral.

SPEAKER_00 13:02

My understanding is formed from something called mile beds, M-A-E-R-L. Yeah, and I think those marl beds are like a cold, they're similar to a cold water coral.

SPEAKER_01 13:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

And and the the the herring up in the northwest of Scotland, the herring stocks are bouncing back now, and they actually use these marlbeds to um to lay their eggs in. And and there's been some huge, huge deposits in the last few years indicating that the the herring are bouncing back, which is great. And actually, Lee Lee, you know, they're they're kind of they're not quite bottom of the food chain, but you know, they're they're halfway up that food chain and absolutely critical for the the bigger animals that that we see when we're out there, minky whales, which we've seen when we've been out there canoeing.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

If we put aside the fact that you steal number two brothers canoe all the time, how how how much does it cost to run a trip like this? I mean, firstly, if you've got all the gear, and then secondly, what does it cost to buy canoes, life jackets, wetsuits, dry bags, all that stuff? I mean, I'm assuming people have got a tent and some roll mats and sleeping and general camping stuff. You know, I mean, I've got general camping stuff, Dave's got it, Stu's got it, but it's the extra stuff that you need to go.

SPEAKER_00 14:25

I think the extra stuff you really need, obviously, the canoe or or sea cares. You you're talking for a Canadian canoe for two people, obviously, you you'd be talking about a thousand pounds. You get a second hand one for a thousand pounds. Your buoyancy aids and getting a half decent one is really important, by the way.£50 to 60 pounds, and then the dry bags are really important, actually.

SPEAKER_01 14:48

People use barrels as well, don't they?

SPEAKER_00 14:51

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 14:51

Well, we've been rafting in check, we use barrels.

SPEAKER_00 14:56

We also use barrels because you can sit on them as well.

SPEAKER_01 14:59

Come back to the side.

SPEAKER_00 15:00

You can sit on them, they're good for seats. Although the the rim can be quite uncomfortable if you pardon the expression.

SPEAKER_01 15:06

You turn it upside down, Stuart. Have you not tried that?

SPEAKER_00 15:08

Yeah, but the problem is the problem is those barrels are the things you keep your food in, so you don't want to be turning them upside down. You you put them in the right way.

SPEAKER_01 15:17

I wasn't meaning on the boat, I was meaning I was meaning when you get to land and you want to see.

SPEAKER_00 15:21

Yeah, I know, but you still keep your food in those barrels because it's the only they're the only really if you're there for several days, you can have they're the only really airtight and and animal proof things you've got because you know even the places where we go, you know, we we we're not some we sometimes camp on an island, but generally where we camp is kind of spit coming off the mainland, and there's foxes and things like that at night, there's certainly otters. Lots of times we've had otter tracks past the tent when we wake up in the morning. So it's best not to kind of have food just avail easily available, shall we say? Okay. That could ruin the that could ruin the the whole trip.

SPEAKER_02 16:00

You've been listening to Unravel Travel on Scottish Canoe Expeditions. This episode of Unravel Travel is brought to you by Chiltern Walks, guided walks and holidays. Whether you're a seasoned rambler or just ready for a weekend reset, we'll take care of the routes, the days, and the little details so you can simply enjoy the journey. Chiltern Walks, walk further, breathe deeper, feel better. You can find a link to our website in the episode notes.

SPEAKER_01 16:35

And if you were to rent your canoe instead from the reputable outlets that were earlier discussed, what does that cost there? So that Graham knows what to charge you for the loan of the canoe.

SPEAKER_00 16:59

Something like that. I may be wrong, but I think that's about right.

SPEAKER_01 17:02

And they don't mind whether you use it in freshwater or salt water?

SPEAKER_00 17:05

No, but if you are going to do not tell them. No, we know you do because it's really important to explain where you're going. And reputable providers like Snow Goose and Rock Hopper in Fort William, they will quite rightly ask you detailed questions about where you're going, what the plan is, what's the contingency plans, you know, contact details, all that, all that kind of thing. Yeah, they're very much on the ball with that kind of thing. And that yeah, they they're used to dealing with people in those circumstances, though. I mean, often in Fort William, they will hire to people who are doing the Caledonian Canal. So they're doing the the cross Scotland canoe, which is a classic paddle from west coast to east coast, from Fort William to Inverness, yeah, cross Loch Ness, is it Loch Long, Loch Ness, and then and then back to behave Ave.

SPEAKER_02 17:53

Sorry, in family joke. Actually, what hiring is a good point because if if you're going up with your own canoe, I mean, hopefully you you lodge with somebody when you're going, when you're going to be back, and all that. But at least if you're if you're hiring and you haven't brought the canoe back, they're probably going to be quite quickly getting onto the emergency services and uh you know launching the helicopters and the lifeboats to try and find you. So you know it's a it's another level of safety aspect.

SPEAKER_00 18:19

Yeah, so what they will do is if we hire, we drive to Fort William, they will then drive us and the canoes to drop-off point. We arrange a meetup point, sometimes also a reserve meetup point in a different location, depending on if the wind changes direction or whatever, so that you know they absolutely know if you're if you're not there bang on the on the money, then there's a problem.

SPEAKER_02 18:41

Yeah, that's all included in the 60 quid a day.

SPEAKER_00 18:44

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, but uh no, it isn't actually the additional transport cost for ferrying to and from.

SPEAKER_02 18:50

60 quid. So is it isn't that much when you you know you're not having to pay for your your night's accommodation, are you? So you know you're you're thinking about oh, we've got to pay 60 quid. But these days, 100 quid a night plus for two people staying in a B and B. Yeah, I think that's a good value holiday.

SPEAKER_00 19:06

What I would say is you've just used an interesting term there, Dave. So I'd never class it as a holiday, and people say, Oh, that looked like a great holiday. It's definitely an expedition. Expedition, fair point. Yeah, and then maybe I'm being snobbish about that, but it's no, no, no, I think that's probably fair.

SPEAKER_02 19:20

I think I think it's important. It's a frame of mind. I think it's a frame of mind. If you're in the right frame of mind, then you're far more likely to be safe.

SPEAKER_00 19:27

Yes, absolutely. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:29

And I guess if you're hiring up there and they're helping you transport them, you can fly up there in the car much more easily than the slow drive with a couple of canoes tied to the roof and a load of gear in the car, which is which is much slower. But you mentioned in the last episode of now you sort of drive up to Glasgow, stay somewhere there, and then do the last bit of drive in the morning. I guess that sort of format means that you can have the canoes in the water at lunchtime and get to your night stop on the first day. Probably quite a good planning routine.

SPEAKER_00 20:03

You've you've absolutely nailed it, and that's that's what we do. That's the importance of having that overnight stop. It allows you a bit of flexibility in terms of getting onto the water, getting to your place, getting set up for the night, because what you don't really want to be doing is paddling anywhere near dusk, you know, and if the conditions turn against you and things like that. So it's really important to be there and set up well before dark, and that that allows that, obviously.

SPEAKER_01 20:28

Good, interesting. You were saying earlier about your uh formative canoeing on the Louth Navigation Canal and the various rivers around the Humber estuary. I know it's not quite the same thing, but Ollie, friend of the show, and I, when we lived in Oxford, had kayaks at the back of the house. I choose my terminology carefully. And we used to kayak day in the rivers or anything out there in the rivers around Oxford. David, in fact, has been and done that with me a couple of times, probably. I capsized once. Capsized once, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:01

And while while I was underneath the water, I was desperately thinking, what did he say you had to do at this point?

SPEAKER_03 21:09

Literally underneath go. I think he said kick, something about kick, something about blind panic. Yeah. Well, I didn't that was a good thing. I didn't panic.

SPEAKER_01 21:16

Uh we took our ropey old, probably like school-made, you know, rough fibreglass jobs, uh, and we took them on the on the roof. We got we had a roof rack on the roof of a car up to Charlbury and the Cotswolds just around the corner from where I live now, and canoed back to Oxford. And we well we did various routes in the edge of the Cotswolds, day trips, and then we did a weekend trip where we camped overnight without without booking it with any farmer. We must have gone through probably five expensive fishing owned Lencer River with lots of shaking of fists from fishermen. I mean you can just imagine, can't you? You can just imagine. Uh and uh we camped at at the lower banks of Coombe near Woodstock and uh and just walked up to the pub, had some food, walked up to the pub, had drinks, you know, because in in those sort of canoes you can just about get a tent, a couple of sleeping bags, a bit of food in the back of them. And that's a perfectly decent way of ec of doing something not quite the same, but just getting out into the countryside. I'm not a great believer in in trespass. What I mean is I am a great believer in trespass and going where you feel you can get away with rather than the strict letter of the law. I've done that and wild camped at various places in the UK as well. Canoeing isn't a totally unachievable thing without going all the way to the north of Scotland. Again on the Oxford Navigation Canal you can rent canoes because we've done that. Brother Graham brought his canoe down when you weren't using it. We hired one and the whole lot of us went out on them. So those things are all possible and probably a good way of getting sort of started, trying it out, seeing how you feel about it because you've got to build up the right muscles and some decent paddling technique before you get out on the root on the sea, haven't you? You don't want to be learning out there.

SPEAKER_02 22:59

I I've uh kayak around Oxford quite a bit but I usually sort of last time I do it is around October and then the first time I do it in the next year is about April May and I can manage about 20 minutes before I'm knackered. It is a different set of muscles because you might be fit from walking or whatever but kayaking's another set of muscles entirely.

SPEAKER_00 23:16

Yeah it certainly is but I tend to find that when you go out there and you you need to get from A to B and you're on a time schedule it's surprising how you forget the pain in the muscles. You've got to be there. You just plow through it.

SPEAKER_01 23:30

Fair enough but that's I I guess you you pair off in these boats don't you have a if you've got a an amateur with you they go with the strongest paddler. Or if you've got kids you don't have two kids in a canoe together that sort of thing.

SPEAKER_00 23:42

Only when you're messing around I mean I I I was I was always a big fan actually when I take the boys Satch and Harry when I go with Lee big fan of getting the two boys out in the canoe on their own and learning by mistakes only when you've offloaded all the gear on the beach and then yeah yeah absolutely once we're all set up and you know then let them go and have a play and work it out for themselves. But it's a really good point. When you're canoeing and you're doing a a a decent distance particularly when you you've got a fully laden canoe it's ever so important to have the experienced paddler at the back in terms of doing the actual steering because when you're in a two person canoe the steering has to come from the from the back of the canoe. And then really the the muscle is from the front when I go with Sarah and with Satch when he was younger I mean they're both really good paddlers but we like to take a lot of photos particularly when I go with Sarah she likes to do a lot of photography. So she's at the front often taking photos I'm steering and also doing doing the paddling work but I don't mind because I ri I absolutely love that side of it. Yeah it's generally the person at the front who would be just paddling engine. Yeah the person at the back is paddling and steering. So there's a stroke you can do called a J stroke which is difficult to explain other than showing it visually which allows you to paddle and steer at the same time.

SPEAKER_01 25:05

No it we did we've done some rafting in Czech as well and I think David's probably done some rafting haven't you as well and it's the same sort of thing you know I always went from the back because I was generally steering but it's the same you use the same sort of strokes. I've done whitewater rafting but that tends to the river's doing all the work. Well and they have somebody who knows what they're doing steering those don't they? Yes generally yeah not so much in Kyrgyzstan. We're getting towards the end of this session again I think which has been very interesting on canoeing in Scotland. Let's just have a minute or two because we'll probably have Stuart back on again as he's not disgraced himself too badly this time to talk about some of the other things I was thinking about firing you Malcolm and just doing it with Stuart going forward. Oh yeah yeah very funny obviously you lived in Sri Lanka for two years Stu and I came out and visited you so we've all been to Sri Lanka well yeah um definitely brilliant we're gonna do a Sri Lanka episode Dave and I had already had that planned if we get you on for that then we can just go and sit in the pub and leave you to it probably happy to do that yeah really happy to do that and also we'll probably do when we get round to the Himalayas we shall probably probably do some episodes David about about Nepal and then we'll get round to your Nepaling experience.

SPEAKER_00 26:20

Well it was the Caracorum actually using the pun. Oh very good Nepaling experience I did have a Nepaling experience you did indeed so we'll just tease that and then come back to it later so yeah we'll definitely have you back on to talk about some of those things.

SPEAKER_01 26:39

David uh we had to do this today because David is heading off tomorrow where are you off David?

SPEAKER_02 26:44

I am going to Bali and then after about a week on Bali going to the Guinea Islands to do a little bit of diving teach Izzy how to snorkel and generally have a nice Easter break and Stu I believe you're going skiing.

SPEAKER_00 26:56

Yeah I'm taking a group of 60 people from my local town Louth Mount's local town as well out to Lavigno in Italy which is where they've just had the Winter Olympics and we've got a week out there snow conditions are looking amazing absolutely incredible so yeah it's gonna be hopefully a fantastic week have a great time and I'm by the time some of these come out actually I'll be winging my way to New York I was going to say you must be going to America at any point soon.

SPEAKER_01 27:27

Yeah so start spreading the news Malk we'll we're all traveling in the near future which is always a good way to be and I I've done a bit of New York as well so maybe we'll have an episode on New York as we might have a couple of your recent experiences anyway thank you very much everybody thank you Stu an absolute pleasure no worries lovely to talk to you anytime gent great thanks Stu thank you David have safe travels both of you Stu if anybody dares you to race down the mountain don't take the bet.

SPEAKER_00 27:59

I know why you've said that broken leg.

SPEAKER_03 28:01

Thanks Malc no problem anytime only happen once thanks everybody thanks guys speak soon