Room to Think

Renovate Smarter, Not Faster

• Lyssia Katan • Season 1 • Episode 6

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Renovation success isn’t about swinging hammers faster—it’s about slowing down where it counts. We sit with Danny Wang, Head of Growth Initiatives at Block Renovation, to unpack the real engine of a smooth project: planning, trust, and aligned expectations. From the first Pinterest save to the final walkthrough, we map the steps that keep your timeline, budget, and sanity intact.

Danny shares the upstream moves that prevent downstream chaos: define scope with precision, price against a real plan, order materials early, and lock permits before demo. We get specific on contractor selection—how to read detailed bids, why outlier prices are a trap, what milestone-based payments look like, and how a GC’s subs actually dictate finish quality. You’ll learn the red and green flags that matter, plus a simple test to gauge how a contractor handles friction and options when surprises pop up.

We also tackle the money decisions that change daily life. Invest in function and skilled labor; don’t let fragile materials or complex patterns outpace installer expertise. Choose plumbing systems you can trust, be honest about maintenance on stone and grout, and budget a 10–15% contingency for the unknown. For high impact on a lean budget, start with lighting, paint, and floors. If you’re eyeing resale, prioritize infrastructure—windows, roof, doors—and storage that shows beautifully; for long-term living, tailor the layout to your routines and keep finishes timeless.

By the end, you’ll know how to start early, avoid the “rush premium,” and use a designer strategically to catch issues invisible to the untrained eye—glare, task lighting, ergonomics, and code constraints. Renovation is change management for your home and your habits. Subscribe, share this episode with a friend planning a project, and leave a review with the one question you’re asking every contractor now.

Danny Wang:

Most people don't quite understand that the quality of material you're selecting will impact your labor cost.

Lyssia Katan:

What do contractors wish homeowners did better?

Danny Wang:

What makes a general contractor typically really great is the quality of the subs that they use to bring your project away. What about some red flags? If you are late and you don't give me a heads up, I think that is such a red flag.

Lyssia Katan:

At what point did you realize that renovations aren't really about construction?

Danny Wang:

Our contractor, he was like, I can start tomorrow. And I was like, oh, okay, we have no materials. That day, I think I drove to like so many different stores. I had at one point a bathtub in the back of my SUV.

Lyssia Katan:

Where do renovation projects most often go off the rails? If the idea of renovating your home already feels overwhelming, this episode is for you. Welcome to Room to Think. Today I'm sitting down with Danny Wang. She's the head of growth initiatives at Block Renovation, where she helps thousands of homeowners navigate one of the most stressful experiences homeowners go through in their homes. In this conversation, we unpack why renovations aren't really about construction. They're about managing stress, expectations, trust, and decision fatigue. Things like why rushing to get started often backfires, or how poor planning creates regret every time you walk into a room. Danny breaks down what actually makes a renovation succeed and helps you avoid the common pitfalls. This episode is packed with clear, practical guidance you can actually use. Things like what to do before you renovate, or how to choose the right contractor, or even where people overspend and cut the wrong corners. These decisions have the biggest impact on how a home feels day to day. So if you're thinking about renovating or even just starting to daydream about it, this is the episode you should listen to first. By the end, you'll understand why a home renovation isn't just a design project, it's an emotional, psychological, and long-term investment in how you live. Let's get into it. Danny Wang, I'm so excited to have you on the show. Thank you for coming on Room to Think. Danny and I work together professionally, so it's very nice to be able to chat on the podcast. But also, I'm excited to hear a lot of your background and your information from and all of your experience from renovations. For everyone listening, Danny Wang is the head of growth initiatives at Block Renovation, where she helps scale operations and improve the renovation experience for thousands of homeowners. Since joining Block in 2019, she has led teams across project operations, client experience, and growth, bringing clarity and structure to one of the most stressful processes people go through at home. Danny, welcome to the show.

Danny Wang:

Thanks. I'm super excited to be here. Um I'm excited about our conversation today.

Lyssia Katan:

Yeah. Yeah, I'm very excited. So for listeners who may be thinking about renovating, but feel overwhelmed before they even start. How do you usually explain what Block does and where you fit into that process?

Danny Wang:

Yeah. Well, I would just say if you are feeling overwhelmed embarking on a renovation, you are not alone. I think most people feel that overwhelmed feeling, um, no matter where you are in the process. You could be pinning things on a Pinterest board or you could be looking at contractors to hire. So feeling overwhelmed is totally normal. I think most people I speak to about renovating, whether or not it's at work or in my own personal life, it's a very overwhelming journey. Um, block is an amazing resource to kind of meet you where you are and help guide you through the process. But at the core, block is a platform to help you uh find and hire the right partners to bring your renovation to life.

Lyssia Katan:

Amazing. And you didn't start with block, you started with ClassPass, if I'm not mistaken, right? Can you tell us a little bit about that transition of where you went from ClassFast to Block?

Danny Wang:

Yeah, I worked at ClassFass for um, I want to say four years. It was such an amazing experience and such an amazing company to work for. Um I worked on the partner side of partnership side of the business. So think uh working with studios and gyms to open new markets. Um, I spent a lot of time in uh Calgary and across the UK opening new markets, um, as well as new verticals. So uh our foray into wellness, I uh helped the company launch and it was such a great place to work and people to work with that some folks that I worked with there ended up moving over to Block initially, and uh I followed suit. Um, but it was a really lovely company and they're doing amazing, amazing things.

Lyssia Katan:

Great. And what made you want to move over to Block?

Danny Wang:

Yeah, I think for me, um I am really passionate about the home space. I would say uh I myself own two homes and I've done a number of renovation projects there. So it was like a unique opportunity to marry kind of my own personal interests with my professional interests. Um and so the problem space of the business felt really exciting to me. Um, I think if anyone has ever done a renovation, they are painful at times. So really trying to bring clarity um and a better customer journey into renovating um felt very uh exciting from like a professional standpoint as well as a personal standpoint. Like I love um, I love everything about renovating. Some things are a little bit more painful than they should be. Um, but whether or not it is designing a space, getting inspired by spaces, helping homeowners navigate tricky situations with contractors, whatever it is, it's very um uh very exciting to me on a personal level.

Lyssia Katan:

Before we get into the juicy questions, this is a show about spaces and interior design. What's the space from your past or present that genuinely changed you?

Danny Wang:

This is such a good one. Um in 2019, my husband and I were like doom scrolling Zillow one night, and quickly that turned into on a whim, almost purchasing a cabin on a lake in the Poconos. Um, we had lived in, we were living in New York at the time in a tiny one bedroom, and we had just adopted this dog that was supposed to be a small dog, turned into a huge dog. We're feeling like very cramped. Um, and so doom scrolling on Zillow turned into we should go see this cabin in the woods on a lake in the Poconos. And then the next weekend it turned into purchasing this cabin in the woods in the Poconos. Um, and that home um we purchased in November 2019. So within months, uh lockdown happened. So it turned into from like this weekend home, getaway, two hours outside of the city into like our primary residence um during kind of the COVID lockdown era. Um, and I think one of the things that it really taught me about the importance of home is that the importance of your home kind of molding to your your needs at the time. So, like at the time when we purchased it, it was a weekend getaway place, didn't have to be perfect. It was an old rundown cabin that needed a lot of work. Um, once we moved into it as our primary residence, um what we needed from it changed. And I think the beautiful thing about renovating is you can change your space to fit your needs. Um, since then, we have relocated to Chicago um and have had some kids and now it serves a much different purpose for our family. We use it much less frequently. Um, but some of it needed to be like totally childproofed in a way that we never would have imagined. And so I think that home and that space um has been just amazing how we've been able to like transition it from phases of our life and have it like still be this like core home moment uh can provide us with so many things, uh, but do so in slightly different ways. If that makes sense.

Lyssia Katan:

Yeah, it does. And most homes should have that. You're not staying in the same stage of life from the time you purchase the home to the time that your kids are graduating college or high school, and and having that flexibility and being able to renovate is what allows you to grow and grow with your home and your home to support you in every sense of the word.

Danny Wang:

One other thing I would just add there about like I mean, I love this home. I'll talk about it all day if that's what you want to talk about on this podcast. But but another thing that I uh I think learned from this space is it's a log house. Um, it's like a true cabin, which wasn't necessarily my aesthetic. If you were telling me to like build a home from scratch on a on a lake, I don't know that I would have chosen that. But I think when we were updating the spaces, we did uh the floors, the kitchen, all the bathrooms, pretty much the whole house at this point. Um, but staying true to like the DNA of the space too was also something um that was really fun to to to do with designers and contractors, etc. Um, how do you like keep the DNA of a log cabin, but like update it to to meet, you know, modern needs um was a really fun challenge. Um that was I don't I don't think I was expecting.

Lyssia Katan:

It's cool that you got to decide that challenge and you decided that you don't want to put modern furniture in a log cabin. There's this place in Philly, it's called Elfrith's Alley, if I'm not mistaken, and it's a row of these historical homes. And one time I had the opportunity to go into one and tour it, and I was just curious. You know, I'm in the renovation space. I was curious about how do you renovate this kitchen when you need to? And the woman who lived there actually told me there's so many rules and things that you can and can't do to maintain that home's historical look and feel that it's nice that they're able to honor that. You walk in and you feel like you walked into the 1800s, but when you can select, like you can willingly make that decision. Say, no, I want to stay true to the log cabin, I think it's really special because you're honoring that space and that home rather than making it modern and kind of out of place.

Danny Wang:

Yeah, I think um historical districts in Philly for sure, but also like in New York, I think are um can be some of the most challenging areas to renovate. Um, so if you are the homeowner in a historical district, or um you're looking to purchase a place and uh a historical building, et cetera, like do your due diligence, maybe talk to um some other owners, maybe the board, maybe management about the process, because it can be um it can be really one of the more painful processes to go through if you want to update your space. Lots of rules and regulations around what you can and can't do.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. And sometimes only certain contractors that you can work with, because they're familiar with the specifications. So you've worked across growth operations and project execution. At what point did you realize that renovations aren't really about construction, but they're more about managing stress and expectations and trust with the people you work with?

Danny Wang:

Yeah, I would say probably like week two on the job. Um, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um when I first came to Block, I was working on the project execution side of things. So I ran a team that was responsible for helping design like a customer journey for homeowners in the construction phase. And very quickly, um, I think it became apparent that uh what was happening in construction, any challenges that were coming up in construction were a result of something further upstream. Um and so I think as our business at block has evolved, we place this huge importance on getting the planning right. Um, because that is really what sets you up for success in construction. I think a lot of folks have this rush to get started. Um, I'm like, my sister's currently doing that in a home that they're renovating. Um, which I I get, like you just purchased this home. Maybe you have another place that you're renting, and there's all this pressure to get all of this work done um and to get started as quickly as possible. But it shouldn't be at the expense of doing like a proper planning process. Um working with a designer if you need to, an architect if you need to. Um I personally like to live in a home a little bit before I do a huge renovation of a space, specifically like a kitchen, to make sure um how I am imagining something works for the use of the space. Like I've never like truly used it before. I have a hard time making just like big decisions about the function of a space. Like, should we move this here? I'm not quite sure. How does our family use this space? Um so there's so many decisions that need to get made before you even enter construction. Um, and the folks who do a really good job and give the time and attention to the planning process itself um generally have a much smoother construction process. There's a plan um in place. There are contingencies set aside for things that might happen. You have, you know, chosen and purchased all of your materials ahead of time. And so you're not like delaying construction because of some vanity that you uh thought was going to get there that wasn't there, and you're scrambling to find something else. Um, so all of that planning part is really important to setting a project up for success downstream.

Lyssia Katan:

Your your note about living in a house before you actually do any renovation, I think that's incredibly important because you get to see the factors that are invisible, like the sound or the light that comes in at sunset. You know, how is that light coming in through the window? And if you have a reflective surface there, how is that gonna bother you when you're sitting on the couch and you have this like every day 5 p.m., you're getting this glare of light in your eye. So these little things are really important. And like you said, people do tend to rush and say, I need this, I want to get it done for the holidays, I want to get it done before the spring. But the planning makes a huge difference. We see it in tile, right? People are ordering tiles saying, I need this tomorrow. This is handmade tiles. Sometimes they may be right. Sometimes they're the same color lot may not be available. So if you miscalculated, it's just causing so many things that planning could have avoided.

Danny Wang:

And I mean, let's be real, like like renovations are expensive. And hopefully, this is uh one of the only times you're doing, if we're talking about like a major kitchen or bathroom model, hopefully this is the only time you're doing it in the home. And so you don't want to be forced to make like a design decision around tile, for example, about what is available today for you to get to hit a timeline versus what you truly want in the space. Um and I think that if you're able to devote enough time and effort and have like realistic expectations about how long things take to plan. And when I say plan, I'm talking about like design, procure your materials, do the permitting process, um, all the things that need to get done before you can actually start construction. Um that's what I mean. And I think uh it's always it always takes longer than folks think. Um, but if you come into the renovation knowing that with those expectations, I think you're gonna have a much better outcome.

Lyssia Katan:

Yeah. And with procurement, some things you can't even expect. Like if there are global shipping issues like we had with the containers a couple months ago, then you your material that was supposed to come in in 12 weeks might not be coming for another 18 weeks. Things happen in the world, especially if you're sourcing from abroad. So be prepared. Give yourself a lot of time.

Danny Wang:

Can I tell you a funny story about one of my first okay? So in this cabin that we were, you know, trying to renovate, we had an issue in one of the bathrooms. And so pretty quickly we needed to fix it. And instead of just fixing the issue, we're like, let's just redo the bathroom. Um and there was our contractor at the time, which was like a neighbor on this lake. Um, he was like, I can start tomorrow. And I was like, Oh, okay, we have no materials. Um, that's great. Uh and so that day, I think it was a Sunday, I think I drove to like so many different stores trying to get enough tile and overage of tile uh for them to start. I had at one point a bathtub in the back of my SUV that I was like driving. But it was, it was like truly insane, the last minute decisions that we were making to be able to start this project the next day. Um and to this day, I still regret a few of them. Um and that's probably the only time we're gonna do this bathroom in this lake house. We're certainly not ever gonna do it again. But if I had like the full like four weeks to plan things minimum, um, I think it would look much different and would have been a much better experience for myself. Not trying to like hoist a Kohler bathtub into the back of my car.

Lyssia Katan:

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, that stress, that crunch time makes you make decisions that you would never make otherwise. Like that's crazy. You're driving around looking for enough overage where you could have had it delivered at your front door with 20% overage if you had just planned it.

Danny Wang:

And these things are heavy. Uh tile, heavy. That's a heavy. You can imagine me like trying to take these, like, oh my God, it was terrible. Um, but but yeah, I will never, never do that experience again. I would always like, oh, we'll just get into your schedule and we can get into your schedule. It's not gonna, I'm not gonna try to move mountains to get this started tomorrow. Um, but it was, it was, it was an experience.

Lyssia Katan:

Well, renovation is stressful. That's something that should be taken into account. But you physically going around that only adds to the stress, and then you're not only mentally exhausted, but physically exhausted. And it's just at that point, you almost resent the renovation. You're like, why did I even get into this in the first place?

Danny Wang:

Oh, yeah. I think that um renovations, even the best ones, are stressful, right? Like at the core of renovating, you have people in your home tearing it apart and putting it back together. Um, and either you're living through it or you're displaced during your renovation. If you're living through it, you're dealing with people coming and going, a lot of dust, loud noises, um, like seeing the demolition happen and and you know, potentially days where no there's no one on the job site and you're getting frustrated about this not being done yet. It is it is tough. If you're displaced, you're like, what's going on? Why am I paying for an Airbnb while this is this is happening in my home? Um and I think the key to reducing some of the unnecessary stress on top of that obviously is good planning, but also finding the right partners to work with. Um, and especially the right partners who work well with your type of like your personality type. Um if you're a very type A, you're gonna want a contractor that can meet you where you're at and uh, you know, potentially give you like daily updates about what's going on on the job site, updates to the the timeline as things shift in a very like structured this is what I'm expecting every single day type of update. If you're more lax and you're on the job site and you're like, you know, like only let me know when things I need to decide or things that are gonna impact the budget or timeline. You want someone who can who can match your energy. Um and that is, I think, like really key in finding a partner in renovating, not just someone that you're hiring to do the job, but someone who's gonna work with you really well to navigate challenges that come up because it's construction at the end of the day. No one has x-ray vision, challenges arise. Um and if you find the right like partner for you who can do all of the other things too, like has experience in what you're you're doing, has a great track record, et cetera, but can can vibe with you on your level, I think you'll um be in a much better place.

Lyssia Katan:

Yeah. And often people don't think about that. They think about who's available right now or who's the cheapest. And sometimes picking the cheapest contractor actually ends up being the most expensive job because of so many issues, you might have to do it again.

Danny Wang:

Absolutely. I would uh just said maybe sound by ear, but I would never pick the cheapest bid on project. Um, I think that they're in construction, there's unfortunately this culture of bidding low and change ordering high. Um and that is something you do not want to get involved in. So get a lot of quotes. I usually get three or four. Um, I never, especially if it's much lower than anything else, I would never go with the lowest bid. Um, I would, you know, there's a lot of factors to consider when when choosing the right partner, but you should be never you should never make that decision alone on price.

Lyssia Katan:

Never. And also something that I find is so funny is sometimes. Sometimes clients are willing to buy this incredibly expensive material that's a couple hundred dollars a square foot, like a blue Bahia, for example, and then hire the cheapest contractor. And then you're you have this beautiful material that looks terrible, or you can't even use it. And you know, talk about stress. Every time you see it, you're like, wow, that cost me $500 a square foot and I still hate it. Like I don't even like the way it looks.

Danny Wang:

Yeah, that's such a good point. I think most people don't quite understand that the quality of material you're selecting will impact your labor cost and should impact your labor cost, right? Like it's more expensive to install um more premium materials in your space. Tile is a great example. Um, there was a time, I want to say, in like 2020, where everyone was obsessed with like herringbone everything. Like, let's install this herringbone, whatever. And it was 2x the price just for installation to install tiles, flowing, whatever in that pattern, plus the extra overages you would have to purchase for that. And so when people started like really understanding the cost of their design decisions, um, or even like slabs of marble versus just uh like a marble tile, it it becomes like really eye-opening to them. Um, and people, you know, start making different decisions because it's a it's a game of um, you know, what I want and what I can't afford within my budget without cutting corners.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. And often they don't realize something that looks really good on Pinterest might actually be so difficult. Like herringbone, most of the time it's not on a mosaic. You have to individually lay it down and and your contractor better know what he's doing, or you're not gonna have the herringbone that you're imagining on your Pinterest board. Yep. A lot of people are nervous about working with contractors, not without reason, right? We've all heard contractor horror stories. From your side of the table, what do contractors wish homeowners did better?

Danny Wang:

I think that contractors wished homeowners did the upfront work before getting bids from them. I think a lot of the times homeowners are going to a contractor with half-baked ideas and getting a quote and then being like surprised or like mad when they change their mind about something and that changes something like a key element on the project. Um, contractors can only be as accurate in their initial bid as the information that you're giving them. So if you're like, this is what I think I want to do, that's about how much fidelity the quote's gonna be. This is what I think you said that you wanted to do, and that's roughly gonna be this cost. But then as you start getting, think like more drilled down into what the full plan is, that's when you're able to get more of an accurate um bid from a contractor that they're able to stick with through the entire renovation without having all of these changes. One example of this for folks listening, maybe, is if you say you want, you know, a tub to shower conversion bathroom renovation, and then you then add on, oh, and I also want um an infinity drain, or I also want a curblish shower. Those are very significant scope changes that have very significant cost implications. Um, and you'll be hit with those change orders. That was not in the initial scope. You want this new thing, here's the cost to do so. And that experience as a homeowner who's never renovated before sucks, right? Like to be like, oh, well, I thought you and I were on the same page about what I wanted. And now you're telling me that all of this other stuff that I want wasn't included and it's gonna cost more. And I think contractors, if they could ask for one thing, it would be for homeowners to understand that when you come to them, have a plan that you are willing to stick with because that's what they're pricing against. Um, and if you constantly are changing the plan, uh that results in a pretty subpar experience for both you and the contractor.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. And that's when you get a lot of the horror stories of where it took so long and he charged me so much extra. If you change your mind three times, that's only expected. So it's not only on the contractor, it's not just their responsibility. Sometimes I think they get the short end of the stick where they're an easy target to blame when your renovation doesn't turn out the way you want it to. But what led to that?

Danny Wang:

Exactly. And I think some people like, yeah, it's hard to do like the looking inward of like how I potentially contributed to this. But like I've done it. I, you know, uh in one of my renovations, I uh felt very confident, it was like mid-COVID, that a vanity I was purchasing would be there in time and supply issues, it wasn't there in time. And so the team had to demobilize the day that they were supposed to be installing this. Um, so I had to pay a remobilization fee to get the crew back. I also like they just could not fulfill this vanity. So then I had to have my contractor locally make it custom additional costs to do so. And like I think from obviously I have a background in this, but I expected those costs and those changes to things. If I was new to this and wasn't like was expecting a contractor to, you know, empathize with my situation and not charge me for the extra work and the all of these other things, that'd be a really difficult experience for us all. And honestly, like a very um, just a wild expectation that a homeowner would have. Like these people are doing work and time and energy. Um, and they have real costs associated with things like a material you were responsible for purchasing not being there the day I need to install it. Um, and I have to pay my crew regardless. And I'm gonna have to pay them to come back to install it the day that it's there. Um, so I think like that fundamental understanding, I think contractors would love if homeowners had. It's always, I think, a little bit more um a little bit better to work with a homeowner who isn't a first-time renovator. Um, first-time renovators are often uh they're doing it for the first time. So they're learning as they go. And when you're a more seasoned renovator, I think you have these like more realistic expectations about your responsibility um and how to work really well with a contracting team.

Lyssia Katan:

Right, right. And and it goes down the line too. Once you've had this terrible experience in your master bath, are you feeling resent every time you walk into that master bathroom and say, oh, I wish this, you know, this vanity was a little higher, a little lower. Oh, I wish I didn't have to scramble at the last minute for the vanity I didn't even like. It just compounds down the line. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Down the line. And then you've had this whole terrible experience, and nothing's good because of some things that really could have been avoided with some expect management of your expectations.

Danny Wang:

Exactly. Like my friend um was just doing a personal project at a bathroom for her kids, and um was another one of those situations where it was like a rush to get started. Uh, and uh I would say very light design experience. And there was a huge element of the bathroom they didn't have a plan for, the lighting um in the scope wasn't in scope, it was like replaced existing sconce. Um, but instead she purchased three new sconces and she wanted to do some pretty significant electrical work to change uh one sconce to three lights across across the room. And the contractor was like, this is new, this is a change, this wasn't in the plan. So here's here's the change order and the timeline implication. And I remember she called me like freaking out, being like, is this normal? And I'm like, Yes, this is normal. Like, what do you what do you expect? Um, that's a ton of electrical work that was not in your initial quote. I like had her send all this stuff to me, and I'm like, this is unfortunately your your oversight. Um and I think that that's just, you know, the reality of getting the planning part right, getting it done right, so that you avoid these situations later.

Lyssia Katan:

So that's when it comes to the homeowner. What about some red flags that someone can look for when hiring a contractor, besides just price? Because we've spoken about that.

Danny Wang:

Yeah. So price for me is always a red flag, whether or not it's like any sort of outlier price, if it's really low, if it's really high, usually I just immediately red flag and get them out of my running. Um, other things I look at, um if they are running late to a job site, which hello traffic, like gonna happen. But if they're running late and they don't tell me that they're running late, like I don't care if you're running 15, 30 minutes late as long as you give me a heads up. Um, but if you are late and you don't give me a heads up, I think that is such a red flag for your communication during the project that I would immediately you're you're the running um for me. The other things are uh I would say like the level of detail in some like in the bid that you're getting back. Like if I spent an hour walking you through my space showing you plans for my architect, and I get, you know, a a quote back with a handful of line items without like you know, subcategory level pricing to like truly understand what's going on with with if I have to ask a lot of questions about the the bid that you're giving me, that's that's a red flag. Um, if something we talked about didn't make it into that bid, also red flag. Um I usually also this is like a pro tip. I always ask about something in the quote that could be I try to create an opportunity to see how they respond to like potential conflict resolution. Um if I'm like truly evaluating you as in like the short on the short list, I might ask something like it's like, do we really need to do that? Or like, have we thought about doing things this way? Or something that could show me how they would respond to me in a situation like that. Are they good at explaining things, showing potential other options? Um, because that is the reality of construction a lot of the time. Um, and seeing if you can kind of like recreate that a little bit and the the bid phase, I think is really helpful if I do that and someone starts like mansplaining to me, immediate red flag. Um, because you know, last thing you want is like day two of demolition, huge potential change order, and not having hired someone who can like clearly walk you through what's going on, what your options are and how to resolve the issue, but just you know, tries to steamroll you into whatever solution um, you know, will cost them the last, the least amount or the most if they're trying to bid low and change order high.

Lyssia Katan:

And flexibility too, because you don't want someone at the end of the day, it is your home. And if something really isn't working and needs to be changed, they have to be able to, like you said, meet you where you are and say, all right, we have to change this vanity height because we're taller people in this house than what we had, you know, considered previously. And and they have to be flexible because you're gonna be the one living in that house at the end of the day. And if you're hunching over or using something to your uh that's actually harming you physically or emotionally, yeah, that's that's something you're gonna be paying the price for for a really long time.

Danny Wang:

Some of the like unsexy things that are just red flags are like do your due diligence and look at their license and uh and any sort of local DOB, you can search their license number and see what's going on with them, if they're active, inactive, what kind of open permits they have, whatever. Um, do that. Um if you live in a place like New York City and you're in a condo, a co-op, any sort of managed building, there's typically um a lot of rules and regulations about who you can and can't hire because of like administrative things, like what their insurance policy looks like and things like that. So if that uh looks like your building situation, there might be some red flags that come up if you need to also look at like what their insurance policy coverages are, et cetera. Um let's see. I always want to see a track record of my specific type of project. Like I don't want to be your first time doing a deck project. Like I want to see someone who has done this before and bonus points if you've done so before in my neighborhood or my home type or something that shows me you're like an expert in this. Um red flag for um, I would say like I love a contractor who has like a uh communication and like timeline management plan process, et cetera, who can walk me through like what to expect. This is how they work, whatever, like when I should expect updates um and how I should expect them. Some contractors use amazing technology to make this really easier. Um, some contractors are using tools like Builder Trend so that you can log in, you can get updates daily about what's going on. Other contractors um might email them to you, or if you live there, check in once a week, whatever. Just having like a plan for communication is huge. Um, payment terms, big red flag. You as a homeowner do not want to be paying for work that has not been completed yet. Um so I always I think like very fair payment terms are things like paying for any materials they're purchasing ahead of time, but everything else should be tied to like milestone progress on the project.

Lyssia Katan:

That's a great list. That was a lot. No, that's amazing. Sorry. It's amazing because these little tips can, especially if you're a first-time homeowner, can make a huge difference in your experience. So we have the red flags, there's a lot of them. But what about green flags? What separates a good contractor from a great one, besides for just craftsmanship? Because for sure we see even in tile installations, we can tell, I can tell if the contractor is good based off of just the way he lays the tile. But what about other elements that really make a difference?

Danny Wang:

Yeah. I think um, in terms of craftsmanship and quality, like one other thing I would just flag there is a general contractor is generally not the one doing any of the actual work. So I think what makes a general contractor typically really great is the quality of the subs that they use um to bring your product to life, the quality of the HVAC team or the plumber, the electricians that they have, um, the tile install installer that really um, you know, determines the quality of the end product. Um so that's huge, but it's not even the quality of them, it's the relationship with them because 90% of being a general contractor, in my opinion, is like relationship management between all of the moving parts to get your project, to get people at your home to get your project done, to get it done right, et cetera. Um, so I think that is huge. Also something it's kind of hard to gauge that at the you know bid process. It's something at Block we do a lot of work um upfront qualifying our contractor network and vetting for. Um, but their their sub-vendor uh relationships are huge to their their quality. Other things are vibe is a big one. Do they these are people that you're gonna be working with day in and day out for a very stressful period of time? Do you vibe with them? Are they gonna, you know, do you mind if they pop into your home unannounced to, you know, do construction or do something or get your opinion on something? Um, are they going to give you the updates you want the way you want them, etc.? So the vibe is a big piece. Um other green flags for me are they're willing to take the time to explain something to you in depth and to always give you multiple options um to achieve whatever end result. One example of this is we were doing a project here in our Chicago house, and day two of renovating, there was like a huge surprise um HVAC situation that we were not anticipating uh once demolition had begun. And our contractor, bless his soul, I love him. Um, but he we were looking at like a $4,000 change order for this HVAC situation. And we we looked at like three potential ways that we could do it in three different costs, three different timeline um implications. And he took the time to put all three options together and presented them to us. And then together we made the decision that made the most sense for the project. But a lot of contractors won't necessarily take you through that process. They'll just be like, you know, I know best and this is what we need to do. And um I think it's a little bit short-sighted in that approach because I think trust is such a huge uh important factor in any of these renovations going smoothly, and it's so easily won with taking the time to like really truly inform, like educate your clientele and um kind of get them to be an active part in the decision-making process. This is their home at the end of the day. Um and these are big decisions.

Lyssia Katan:

The I know best concept is so dangerous because when it comes to, I mean, I see it from our end. When we work, we have specialty tiles like cement tiles, for example. Not everyone is familiar with cement tiles. That's okay, but we try to educate the consumers and the contractors as best as possible. And often a contractor will say, Yep, I know best, install it. And we have a crying homeowner on our hands saying, But my contractor said he knew what to do. And actually, what he did was totally opposite to any of our directions. So definitely I agree with being open to communicating because I know best is not always the move.

Danny Wang:

Yeah. I think some of the best contractors out there are also really good at um like taking responsibility of things not going the right way, like whether or not it was a sub issue or whatever, being able to say, like, that's my bad, and here's what we're doing to uh rectify the situation is just such a green flag. Um hard to hard to test for that in the you know uh bidding phase and the hiring process. Um, but someone who is like open and not just going to, you know, try to steamroll you into decisions that are easier for them is tricky.

Lyssia Katan:

Yeah. Sometimes they it's easier for them to say, this is the material you should use because they're using it on every other project. And it's just more convenient for them. Meanwhile, you didn't really want that. Yeah.

Danny Wang:

Which I think another green flag that you should be looking for with a contractor is experience, um, and like demonstrated experience in what you are trying to do. So your actual scope, if you have a bathroom, a deck, a kitchen, whatever it is, but also materials that you're trying to put in your space. Um and, you know, you don't want to be anyone's guinea big. Um, and you don't want to be like strong armed into doing something because the contractor's more familiarity with it, with what you truly want. Um, but again, you can't actually hire for that if you don't know that ahead of hiring someone. So this goes to like making sure you you invest in the planning phase of your project because it will allow you to ultimately pick the right partners.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. And today with the internet, we can see their work, we can see their portfolio. You can easily search past projects and reviews they have from other customers and see if if that is someone you want to work with.

Danny Wang:

So a lot of these contractors will also give you references. So if you want to talk to a homeowner that's worked with them before, you can ask them like, how were they about change orders? How were they about, you know, challenges that came up? And you can help try to, you know, references always are going to paint them in the best light. Otherwise, they wouldn't give you a reference. But um, you can try to like pry and like really truly understand what their, you know, experience was and more complicated, tough situations.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. That's a great point. Calling those references and asking what their experience was like. From an operational standpoint, once you have picked your contractor, you're moving forward, you're creating the space of your dreams, where do renovation projects most often go off the rails? And what can homeowners do to prevent that?

Danny Wang:

I think that we see challenges, like patterns kind of emerge with challenges that come up. So um there are key moments in like a typical project where there could be like quality concerns. Um, a lot of them are not necessarily um uh let me let me let me take a step back. The the key quality concerns come up with things like tile installation things that you can easily see, being like, oh, this isn't what I wanted, or this isn't done to my standards. But actually, like a step prior to that, like all of the unsexy things that happen behind the wall are um like where the real quality like truly matters before walls are closed, et cetera. And and iterating on fixing things becomes more costly and and challenging. You would hate for there to be a plumbing issue or waterproofing issue that uh you don't notice until four years after your renovation um when the walls are closed to house arm, et cetera, and you have a leak somewhere. Um and so there are I think making sure that you're working with the right partners helps alleviate some of the like really truly quality related issues that are happening in construction that are super costly, huge headache to address later. Um, so making sure that you're doing that due diligence up front so that you're not dealing with that is huge. Um other things uh where I think I see homeowners go wrong are not planning for unforeseen conditions um financially. So I would say like not having a contingency budget for a construction project is just a huge risk. You should know that change orders are common on projects. Contractors don't have x-ray vision. The more complicated your project, the you know, more challenging your existing conditions are. I would encourage you to budget more to just, you know, have on the side should something come up, because you don't want to be in a situation where you've bitten off more you can chew more than you can chew in construction and there's a huge change order and you're trying to figure out whether or not you can afford it, or might have to cut corners in order to get the project done. And so generally I'd always recommend budgeting like 10 to 15% of the total budget for contingency, more if your home is older, you're like concerned about specific things, um, or more if your scope is really complicated. You're moving walls, you're moving fixtures around, et cetera. Um, but 10 to 15% is usually a pretty good comfort area. Um the next, so we're like walking through a project, I would say like the next big thing I notice is like homeowners often wait until the last minute to give all of their feedback to the contractor. Like punchless walkthrough, they're like, actually, this is wrong. And like, I don't like where this, how this tile is installed, and like all of these things, super valid feedback. Um, but at the point of you walking through a finished product, really hard to actually address any of those issues. So, like as a homeowner, you should feel confident in being an active member of the renovation throughout. If you see something, say something, because that's going to be the easiest time for the contractor to intervene and fix whatever issue you're flagging, not at the very end of a project where um you're like, can we change this very key element that would be really costly and timely to change?

Lyssia Katan:

Right. It's that confrontation issue we've all experienced when you go to the hairdresser and you ask for just an inch off, and then four inches are off, and like, I love it. And you go home and cry. But yeah, for sure, it that's many times people are afraid of that confrontation in the moment, which goes back to A, picking a contractor that you can have open communication with, but B, recognizing that maybe in that moment, if you said something, it would have been almost nothing to change. You can change it at a very almost no cost. But if you say down the line after the wall is up and everything's installed, that's gonna cost you so much more to undo and and fix. So many times it is getting past that discomfort.

Danny Wang:

And I think some of the best contractors will proactively confirm things with you that they anticipate might be an issue later. So, like things like accessory placement in in bathrooms, the best contractors will get your input as they're doing them because they're like, where do you want the towel bar? And where do you want the toilet paper? Because those things are often overlooked in things like design plans, et cetera, and like deeply personal in terms of where this can be placed for the best um, you know, use of your space. So a lot of the great contractors will get your input on things that they anticipate could be, you know, an issue later. Um, but feel like you are, you know, investing in your space. You're an active part of this renovation. You should be an active participant in it, um, not just swooping in at the at the last day and potentially flagging like a bunch of things that you want reworked. Um, because that'll just ultimately result in really challenging closeout process where it might be hard to get contractors back, like their subs back in their space to do one thing or two things, having to coordinate that across like multiple parties is really tricky. Um and so you might be left with like a drawn-out project closure where like technically your space is livable, but it's not to ex your like exact specifications. So get in there and get in there early and give your opinions.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. And remember that you're hiring them. So they at the end of the day, you should be happy with within reason, of course, but you should be happy. And it's important for you to say something when you need to.

Danny Wang:

Yeah, and contractors are used to confrontation. Yeah. Like, don't I would say like try not to feel scared to do it. And it doesn't have to come from a place. Like, I typically my approach is always like, hey, like, is this what this was supposed to look like? I was I thought it was going to be X, Y, and Z, like not coming from like an accusatory point of view initially. Um, to like start the conversation is sometimes like an easier way to approach it.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. And if you just redid your bathroom, you might want to redo your kitchen next. And having that good relationship with a good contractor is priceless.

Danny Wang:

Yeah. And I mean, like contractors are on the same page, right? They want to provide great customer experiences so that you'll refer them to your friends, family, neighbors. Um, that's how the majority of contractors grow their businesses is like delighting their customer base so that they don't have to invest in things like a marketing budget, et cetera. Um, and so I think knowing that you guys are both on the same page of I want this to go really well, and the contractor wants it to go really well so that you leave happy and give them a good review online and tell all of your friends about them so they can continue to grow their business. Um, so work with them as a partner. Um, give your feedback.

Lyssia Katan:

So when a homeowner wants to stay on budget, where should they be flexible and where should they absolutely not compromise?

Danny Wang:

Depends on the project type. If I'm talking about a bathroom versus a kitchen, I'd probably give you like different things. But I think overall, I would be firm on so like don't try to cut corners on things like the function of your space and the quality of the work you're hiring. You don't want to cut corners on, no, I think you gave this example earlier of these amazing expensive tiles, but then trying to save on budget by hiring a subpar installer to do that. You certainly don't want to be doing that. Um so I would say, like overall, I would invest my budget on the function of the space. So things like a kitchen, if the kitchen layout's not working for you, I would move everything around so that it did work for you. Um in a bathroom, the function of bathrooms are like pretty standard, but I would, you know, if I really wanted a shower versus a tub shower combination, I would invest in that. Um it's a pretty big investment when you look at, you know, all the line items on a bathroom, but I would make sure the function worked for my needs. Um and that the quality of the labor was really high. Other things I would do on the material side of things, there's some some materials I would always splurge on um or always invest in, I would say. Uh, and some that I like, you know, it's up to you. It's up to whether or not your budget can afford. I think there's so many awesome material solutions across the board. But like plumbing systems, always worth the investment on making sure you're you're purchasing a really high-quality plumbing system because it's not just fixtures outside the wall. It's the valves inside the wall and fixing those are costly. Um, so you want a reputable brand that has, you know, a great track record of providing beautiful fixtures, but also really functional valves. Um cabinets are a big one, whether or not it's your kitchen or it's a bathroom. Bathrooms are always up for a custom vanity. Once I had to do that once, it's my like new thing that I love. I think it really just finishes the space perfectly, more so than, you know, a vanity that you'd order online. Um I think that tile um is like a beautiful, can be like a really beautiful statement piece. It's also like a key element in spaces like a bathroom. A home that I purchased had like these beautiful natural tiles, but they're like all cracked and um really, really challenging to maintain long-term too. So that's like a thing that I would I would consider around tiles. Um not just the look, but also can you deal with the upkeep that they require? I think a lot of folks don't necessarily understand that depending on what material they're purchasing. Um I think there overall materials, I think there are so many great brands that are more cost effective and across all categories. So if you're like trying to uncover savings, that's a good area to do it. Um, knowing that you shouldn't make too many trade-offs with like some specific categories. Um other things. Um I think that might be it. If you're trying to be the most cost effective in a in a renovation, um, obviously if you leave fixtures where they are. So think like plumbing electrical fixtures where they are, you're gonna save the most amount of money um in terms of labor. So like leave your toilet tub vanities where they are and just update everything. Same thing in a kitchen. If you leave all your major fixtures where they are, it's gonna be most cost effective in terms of labor. Um, but it might not solve your problems about why you're renovating the space in the first place. So do that, I would say, like inner work to figure out what's like a need to have and what's a nice to have for you. Um, and then it makes it easier to figure out where you want to, you know, make your trade-offs.

Lyssia Katan:

Yeah. And I think that's something that shouldn't be overlooked is the long-term cost that happens after the renovation. So if you're doing a mud room and you choose a really beautiful marble or limestone and kids are running in and out, dogs, pets with dirt on their shoes, good luck keeping that marble clean. And it's gonna cost you not only financially, but also emotionally, so much stress every time you walk in, you pick this beautiful marble, but there are paw prints and shoe prints everywhere. So, also to add to your point about function, who's using that space?

Danny Wang:

Exactly. And I think, like, if you can live in your space before you renovate it, you'll know these things before you um before you embark on a big investment to your space. Um the floor tile in this house that I didn't put in, but if I was a previous owner's, I would never have put in. Um, very difficult to maintain. Um, and I'm sure my cleaner uh hates me because of it. Um, but those things are really important. Um it, the the function of your space and materials that you're putting in there really do impact your your daily life.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. And this is something we hear all the time, but installing certain types of tile in a children's bathroom and then getting urine as it happens while kids are potty training, that's the one thing that's gonna etch through any sealer, anything that you put on your tile to protect. If that tile is soft, you're gonna have etching and it's gonna damage your beautiful tile and you're gonna be frustrated every time you go to clean it and it actually doesn't come out. So things to consider.

Danny Wang:

I would throw in countertops, also being one of the things that you should be like, you know, gut checking whether or not you have it in you to maintain materials because there's some beautiful natural stone of stones available for countertops. Um, they're hard to maintain. Um, and I could never because day two they would be ruined um by my family. So just know what you can set your expectations for yourself about what you can clean and maintain before you splurge for some of those beautiful natural stones.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. And sometimes things happen within a matter of seconds. If you get some lemon juice on a natural stone countertop, good luck. If you're not cleaning that up within two seconds, there goes your countertop. So knowing yourself too, if you're a messy cooker, yeah. Yeah, a messy chef. So it takes a little bit of self-awareness, but it's gonna definitely save you down the long, down the long run. So you've seen renovations at every scale. What are some small upgrade or choices, upgrades or choices that tend to have the biggest impact on how people feel about their home once the project is done?

Danny Wang:

Lighting. Always, always lighting. It is, um, I would say often overlooked by folks, uh, unless you're like really working with a designer. It's often an element that's overlooked but has a huge impact. And like the ROI on like updating your lighting, like it's not a huge investment in terms of dollar amount, too, can have a huge impact on uh the space overall, um, as well as like the function of the space. Um, do you have task sites? Do you have like it's it unless you're like honestly a well-versed designer, it can be a little bit confusing all of the elements that go into like designing lighting for um uh like a well-functioning, beautiful space. Um, but it can really change, it can change your your home if that's all you're doing. Um another thing is like if you had like a small budget to update paint is a huge one, but like um there are so you can really transform a space with just paint alone, depending on what you're going for. Um always worth it in my opinion to invest in in paint. Um as well, like quite honestly, like flooring, um it takes up so much like visual space of your of your floor um of your home that uh it is, I think, always a a good investment. Always it's also like a good investment if you're thinking about resale in a short period of time. Um flooring is one of the the things that has like a highest ROI that any sort of uh you know broker will will tell you to invest in before selling your home. Um let's see. Do you have any that you uh think are well?

Lyssia Katan:

It's funny that you say lighting and paint because we've had some neuroscientists on the show. And consistently they've said the quality of the light in your home can make a huge difference in your mood. Is it super bright light in your bedroom that's actually cold and is having a negative impact on you, or in your kitchen, you you can't see what you're doing because the light is too low. It makes a huge difference in your physiology, not being able to see your be or being too bright. So these are the things that I think make a huge difference, not only aesthetically, but internally for us, emotionally and mentally. And I think I think those are some of the biggest things. I I also um my personal thing that I would add is furnishings, things like pillows that, let's say you're doing a couch, pillows that don't scratch you. You know, they might be a really beautiful pattern, but if if that fabric is making you itch every time you touch it, you're gonna be really frustrated every time you're going to lay down on the couch. So things like uh easy things, furnishings and and lighting, paint, these are things that are not very expensive and make a really big difference.

Danny Wang:

For sure. I think it's tough in the renovating space because renovating any space is always more costly than you think it is. I feel like you watch like one episode of anything on HGTV, and then all of a sudden you get this expectation that things are gonna cost like $5,000. And um, then you have a shock when you get quotes back for a bathroom and it's like $25,000. Um these spaces that we deal with most like day in and day out are investments. So I would say like if you are trying to update your space, I probably on like a budget, like refresh almost. There's some amazing things you can do, but a full renovation is going to be expensive. So um doing your research upfront about like what you want to do, what you can't afford is all sometimes really helpful to figure out whether or not it's worth doing some um like facelift type things to your space while you save for that big renovation that you want to really understand the cost. Like um kitchen costs can also be jarring for folks, like seeing $200,000 for a kitchen renovation. Um, but at the same time, really informative, right? Like, okay, that might not be in budget right now, but what could I do today to solve the pain points I have in my kitchen? Is it like repainting my cabinets? Is it getting a new countertop and backsplash? That alone is a fraction of that cost and could have like a big impact on my kitchen. Is it updating the hardware, the like the fixtures, those smaller investments that you could make today that could like drastically change your space in your life without necessarily taking on, you know, a hundred, two hundred thousand dollar renovation.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. Sometimes it is the those little things like a piece of hardware that catches on to your shirt every time you're cooking. Small little things. You make a small change, it'll be a weekend project, and suddenly you have a whole new space. Yeah.

Danny Wang:

I think my favorite thing in kitchens for people to do are like certainly not like a small weekend thing, and you'll definitely need to hire some professionals, but changing out your countertop and your backsplash can like really change your change your space. Um, don't do that though, if you ever you're planning in the near term to switch out your cabinets because you'll never you won't wanna, you won't wanna, you won't be able to keep your your countertop if you do that. Um, but that in and of itself, think like depending on the size of your kitchen, less than $10,000, to have like a really big impact um could be a a good compromise, um good like middle ground.

Lyssia Katan:

Right. Even something like a backsplash you mentioned, like a pop of color, if especially if you don't have anything right now, putting the tiles up without having to take down something that's already there, really not that expensive.

Danny Wang:

No, it's not. And I I mean, I know my own talents, so I would never even try to do that myself. But like if you're if you are more talented than I am in the DIY category, it's also something you could try doing yourself. Um, with like, you know, low risk. If you can't do it, you can easily hire someone to come fix fix what you've done. Um, but even hiring a professional, like, you know, it's a single trade type thing. You can find an amazing Tyler and hire them directly could could make a big impact.

Lyssia Katan:

So if someone is renovating with resale in mind, what or should I say, how should their priorities differ from someone who's renovating their home for a long-term living?

Danny Wang:

Yeah. I think for long-term living, you are renovating your space for your use case, how you use the space, um, how you know maybe investing in something brings joy to your life and it's worth the investment. Um, you're renovating for you and whoever else is using your home alongside with you. Um, when you are renovating for like with resale in mind, and typically we see this if people are purchasing a place, they want it to be good, but they only really plan on living there for like five years and then they're gonna sell it. Um we generally see folks invest in like a few things. Like we don't typically see them do kitchen or bathroom remodels because those are quite costly or full remodels. You don't want to like invest in a full custom kitchen that you're only gonna live in for five years, and then someone is gonna have a different style aesthetic, and then you're not gonna recoup that when you sell it. Um, so we'll see things like lighter renovations in those spaces, but not these like full-on custom uh projects that we would typically see if you're renovating for your, like this is my you know, forever home. Um things we do see is like obviously painting, flooring is a big one, investing like the infrastructure. So key things like the roof, the decks, et cetera, like the windows, the doors, those like infrastructure things that are not the most exciting to do, but generally um, you know, really hold their value when you go to resell things. Um, you know, going to be a home that has like a newly replaced roof is like the best thing ever when you're you're going to purchase a home. Um, but not always the most exciting thing when you're when you're you know investing in it. Um and then besides that, um generally we see like just like uh storage being a big uh thing that you can invest in in the near term that can make your life better as you're living there, but also be one of those amazing um elements that show really well when you're going to sell your home. I think it's often like an element that's overlooked, but like very appreciated when you're in it. And then also um selling.

Lyssia Katan:

That's a really good point. That's uh and and also things that don't, for example, like if you live in Florida, hurricane windows are not the sexiest thing, but when you have them. During a storm, you can't imagine your life without them. So these little things that uh change the practical uh aspect of a home, but not aesthetic. And the homeowner oftentimes, the new buyer will update things to their own taste. But when it comes to practical things like the roof and the windows, there's not really much you can change. Exactly.

Danny Wang:

I think like the biggest thing is like when you're going to purchase a home, you don't want to have to do repairs of that home. So you want to make like sure the core functions like function really well when you're thinking about investing in things. Um and then like the design element that is so deeply personal that even when you are, let's say, investing in like a big renovation, we even see people make different design decisions with resale in mind versus their dream home in mind. So they're like a little bit less, you know, um, using more neutrals and trying to be like middle of the ground in terms of um like design elements so that people can layer on their, you know, personal design decisions later versus having to like rip it out and redo the whole thing. Um and so I think those are all key elements and also like having an idea of who your potential buyer could be. Like, are you in a, you know, one-bedroom condo where you don't have to worry about like families coming to purchase your space. So if you're trying to decide whether or not you should convert from a tub to shower, you don't have to worry about, you know, the use case of a family needing a tub and your one bedroom, one bathroom apartment. Um, so I think a lot of those, you know, uh having a good understanding of what like who your ideal buyer is based off your neighborhood, et cetera, could be helpful in making those trade-offs as well.

Lyssia Katan:

If someone listening is about to start renovating in the next six months, what is the single most important thing that you'd want them to do before they begin? And if they get nothing out of listening to this episode, this is what you would like them to do or you would urge them to do.

Danny Wang:

I would start today. I think if people think that six months away is in the future, it's not, it's not too early to start everything that you need to do today. So I would say um, right now at Block, like we are seeing contractors have like firm schedules, like people, projects ready to go for the next six to 12 months. And so get started on your project sooner rather than later. You don't want to be up against a clock having to make decisions that you wouldn't have made otherwise. You also don't want to be paying a premium for labor because you didn't do your planning up front and you're trying to get some contractor to mobilize really quickly and try to put you in their schedule, and you're gonna have to pay a premium to do so. So it's never too early to start. And I think um you'll be glad that you did. And depending on your project, work with a designer. Um, designers are amazing um resources. They are like a wealth of knowledge that'll point things out like lighting that you would probably have overlooked that could have a big impact on your space. They're a great sounding board for um investment trade-offs. Like, hey, I'm trying to like stay in this overall budget. How can I do that in the space is what I'm trying to achieve. Um, and they're generally not as um, it's not as big as an investment as I think some people think it is to work with a designer. There's so many ways you can work with a designer, whether or not it's hourly or if it's on like, you know, a like specific custom um like project basis, et cetera. But you have to make a lot of decisions with any renovation. So many decisions. And I don't know, if you're anything like me, a lot of those decisions fall on me without any sort of like sounding board if I'm not working with the designer about whether or not I should do X, Y, or Z. And so I'd I'd recommend doing it if you're on the fence. Um, if you are investing in something like a bathroom or kitchen, I would absolutely recommend um working with the designer. You want to renovate these spaces once in your time owning this home. Um, and you know, you don't want to be in a situation where you design a stark white kitchen that is no longer style in like five years. Um you wanna you wanna be making decisions that work with your own aesthetic, but then also, you know, what's um, you know, hopefully timeless and and classic in some capacity. So get started now, because six months is not not long enough. And then if you can, if it's in your budget, work with the designer. They're really great resources.

Lyssia Katan:

Agreed. Agreed. Danny, your advice has been so helpful. And I so very much appreciate you getting on the podcast and really giving people the behind the scenes and the practical tips on having a great renovation. Uh, Block does an incredible job of making this process very seamless, and we're so grateful to be able to wait and work with you guys uh with Lily Tile. And also, I'm so grateful for your time on the show. Thank you so much. We will link everything in the show notes, but thank you for your time and for your expertise.

Danny Wang:

Yeah. Thanks for having me. This was really great.

Lyssia Katan:

Thank you so much for spending this time with me on Room2Think. If you enjoyed this episode, feel free to follow the show, subscribe, leave a review, and share it with someone who you think would really appreciate a more thoughtful approach to their space. You can find more Design Meets Psychology insights on social, in our community, and definitely in upcoming episodes so you can build a better life by design. Thanks again for listening. I'll see you next time.