What REAL Trucking Litigation Looks Like at the Highest Level | Trial Lawyer View Ep. 87

How do you actually level the playing field in trucking cases when the defense has endless resources and a tested playbook? 

In this episode of Trial Lawyer View, host Jason Lazarus sits down with David W. Craig, managing partner of Craig Kelley & Faultless LLC, a board-certified trucking lawyer who believes real accountability in trucking cases comes from experience, preparation, and knowing how to truly level the playing field for injured families.

David explains why commercial vehicle cases are not just “big car wrecks” and how the best trucking lawyers find all responsible parties beyond the driver, from construction contractors to brokers and shippers. He talks through the biggest mistakes he sees lawyers make in these cases, including failing to send a rapid response team and losing critical electronic and scene evidence that can never be recovered.

Jason and David also dig into the business and operations side of running a serious trucking firm. David shares how his team uses rapid response investigations, focus groups, KPIs, dedicated pre-lit, litigation, and trial divisions, plus a fractional CFO and audited financials, so the firm can bankroll any size case without losing sleep over payroll. He walks through the systems that protect client experience, from assigning multiple lawyers to each file to using Kolbe and PRINT scores, client navigators, quarterly feedback, and even an in house social worker to support families through the toughest moments of their lives.

You will also hear how Craig Kelley & Faultless gives back by using fees to buy and distribute bike helmets after a child was killed, investing in distracted driving simulators, and teaching teens about semis, stopping distance, and blind spots at community safety events. David closes by reflecting on why he still loves trying cases, why he never plans to retire, and how being a trial lawyer lets him “make a difference” every single day.

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Trial Lawyer View features long-form conversations with experienced plaintiff trial lawyers, firm leaders, and industry experts. The show is built for legal professionals who want to lead stronger, more efficient personal injury firms by learning from peers who have built, managed, and evolved successful practices in the real world.

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It's kind of crazy in the trucking world. We're fighting the trucking industry, we're fighting the trucking companies, and most of them are good, responsible. But the bad seem to be getting worse and they seem to be fighting us more. That is David Craig, managing partner at Craig Kelly and Faultless LLC. He believes real accountability in trucking cases comes from experience, preparation and knowing how to truly level the playing field for injured families. Oftentimes, there's more people involved that caused this harm than just that one truck driver, the truck lawyer, the person who does this day in and day out. They would never settle for less.$750,008 million. He explains how deeper investigation uncovers additional responsibility, creating stronger leverage and better outcomes for clients. They don't invest in preserving the evidence. They don't do downloads. They don't go out. They don't preserve the evidence. And as a result, that evidence is lost today. He outlines what separates real trucking litigation from surface level lawyering, including how to preserve evidence fast and build a case that forces accountability. By the end of this conversation, you'll learn how top trucking trial lawyers spot hidden defendants, protect the evidence before disappears, and position cases for the right result. I'm Jason Lazarus, and this is trial lawyer view. You've written and lectured nationally on litigating against dangerous trucking companies. What separates firms that truly hold these defendants accountable from those that get out, resourced or outmaneuvered? Because I know you're you're fighting large corporate entities who, you know, view these cases as, ones that they've got to stand their ground on. And it's an important fight for people that have been injured. Unfortunately, due to some of the practices of the way these trucking companies operate. It is a battle. There's no question about it. I think, you know what separates the truck accident attorneys are the ones that are that do this for a living. Versus, you know, everybody else is that, is requires a certain level of expertise, knowledge, experience. And then the resources. What you mentioned is the trucking industry has and their insurance carriers have a lot of money. They can hire the best attorneys. They can hire the best experts. And so, you know, you're these ordinary folks that are in these horrible, horrible wrecks. They don't have a chance unless they can pick somebody who can help balance the playing field, who helps make things equal. And and ultimately, the jury trial is the great equalizer. It holds everybody accountable. It brings us in front of ordinary folks and lets them decide who's right and who's wrong. But the trucking company has stack the deck, with very experienced and good folks on the other side who are very powerful, very strong, very good. And the victim needs that as well. It's kind of crazy in the trucking world. We're fighting the trucking industry. We're fighting the trucking companies, and most of them are good, responsible but bad seem to be getting worse. And, they seem to be fighting us more. And then, on the other hand, we're also fighting in a world necessarily fighting. But you have to the victims have to be leery that they might pick the wrong attorney, because certainly not every attorney understands trucking law. They don't understand the federal court or federal member carrier safety regs, the CDL manual industry standards. They may not have the resources to fight these trucking companies. So sometimes people get victimized in the sense that they got in a wreck or an accident. But then, you know, everybody and their brother says they're a truck accident. Attorney. When in fact, there's only a handful of us that are actually board certified in truck accident law. So to keep pointed, it's relevant for what we do, too. And most lawyers and paralegals understand subrogation, but they don't understand lean resolution at the complex level that some of our several experts and myself who have studied this stuff and know the inside baseball that you have to understand in order to negotiate and resolve those and what you're talking about is such a critical point. I wanted to go back to these cases that you handle because commercial vehicle cases do bring a different level of complexity and risks that you've already talked about. And I'm curious, from your vantage point, what are the biggest strategic mistakes you see lawyers making when they're handling these types of cases? If they're not familiar with these nuances? I think one of the biggest challenges is knowing where to look for responsible parties. So if you don't do trucking, you may not understand that there may be more people involved in the process that causes harm. Cause this death causes catastrophic injury than just the bad trucker who hits them. I think some personal injury lawyers look at it and say, what does a big car crash case and how much limits does the insurance company have of the bad trucking or the negligent trucker? And so they settle for that, you know, the minimum of $750,000 and in most carriers would carry a million. But and the worst companies out there have either minimum or $750,000 worth of coverage. And so the reality is that oftentimes there's more people involved that caused this harm than just that one truck driver and the the truck lawyer, the person who does this day in and day out, they would never settle for at 750,000 or that million dollars without fully exhausting, and looking at every responsible party. And so that's where I see the most, I mean, construction. So every year I get hired by folks that are killed or severely injured in construction zone by semis or our large trucks. And sometimes it's the construction zone. Sometimes it's the contractors that are building the construction zone. Sometimes it's the trucking companies. It's the hiring the brokers, the shipper. It could be a variety of different people. And so what we have to do to help the family, help them try to recover, or at least financially recover. And we have to look at that and say, who else is responsible? And I think that's the biggest problem I see with lawyers who aren't prepared. And I guess the second thing is I constantly see lawyers that don't do this for day in and day out. There is a truck wreck and they don't invest in preserving the evidence. They don't do downloads. They don't go out. They don't send investigators out. They don't preserve the evidence. And as a result, that evidence is lost. Logs are deleted, evidence is especially hated. And you have harm to the victims that because the lawyer was trying to save $20,000 or $15,000, not sending a crew out to investigate because they thought it was a clear case. I have a rapid response team. As soon as I get hired, we send a team out and maybe there's not a case and I lose the money, but at least I preserve the evidence. I preserve the client's opportunity to be successful. So those are the two biggest mistakes I see is not looking for not seeing all the responsible parties and then not quickly moving to preserve the evidence. So you alluded to the fact that these types of cases in do involve sophisticated defense playbooks, wondering what strategy level decisions must influence whether a case settles for the right amount of money or winds up going to trial? I think that it's ultimately your client's choice. I think that the good trial lawyers, they don't force their clients to settle, but they also don't force them to go to trial. They lay that out to them and they show them. Here's the pros and cons. Now, I tend to use a lot of focus groups. And so we have a we have a feel for the strengths and weaknesses of a case. We have a feel for the value of a case. And so we will talk to our clients and say, hey look, here's the upside. Here's the downside. And here's the expenses of taking this. And, you know, we have some clients who are eager to go hold the trucking company responsible. And they want to, let's say I had a case down in Kentucky was a wrongful death case on I-65, where my client said, it's not the money, it's that we want them to change their policies. And if they don't change their policies, we'll go to trial. So in that case, I was able to hold out. And ultimately they changed their policy plus gave us the money. But it just it's just every client's different. And our job is to support them. And to give them the option to either settle or go try the case. We prepare every case as if it's going to trial so that the client at least has that option. Super important. So I wanted to switch gears and ask you about the firm that you've built. Before I get into the nitty gritty of that one thing, when I was doing my research for the podcast, the jumped out at me and I know a fair bit of firms do this in particular, as near near my heart was giving out helmets. As someone who was struck by a car while cycling. You know that wearing a helmet was probably one of the the things that saved me from being, you know, a statistic was being killed instead of suffering some pretty serious injuries. But at least I'm still here to talk about it. What led to that decision about doing that and giving back to the community in that way? Early on, when we started this law firm, unfortunately a little boy got killed riding his bicycle. He did not have a helmet on. Now, truthfully, I wasn't sure whether the helmet would have made a difference or not. It certainly wouldn't hurt, obviously. But but still was very important to us, and and so we took the fee off that case, and we bought helmets and we gave the helmets away. And that started a trend, where we started doing that in the community because, I mean, my goal as a, as attorney is to make a positive difference in the lives of my clients, but it's also to make a positive difference in the lives and the of the folks in the community in which we practice. And so we did that and we started doing that. And I and I, you know, kids have always been important to me. I got three, I got three kids, I got six grandkids. My kids have always been part of my firm. My employees kids have been part of my firm. So it's just been real important to me to to work with kids. And that's one of the things we did. We also bought a, driver simulation machine. I had a client who got killed by a distracted driver. He was a firefighter. So we bought, distracted driving machines. Driving simulation machine. We gave one to the fire department that he used to work at. We gave one to our local fire department, and then we kept two of them. And we use those as well. And as community safety events, we show kids the dangers of, of doing that. And, this year we're going to start doing a, a safety event. One of the things that doing trucking, I found is that a lot of people, like kids, go through driver's ed, and they just spend very little time talking to them about the dangers of semis, stopping distance, blind spots or a lot. You know, what they allege are blind spots. And so, so I want to get motor carrier semi truck out and get kids inside of them. I want them get them around them mile and look in their mirrors. I want them to see that I want to educate them. And so one of the other things we're going to do, but again, is focused on kids. These are older kids, than some of the ones we were giving helmets away to. But again, it's designed to teach them safety, help them in the communities and try to make a difference in their lives. It's a phenomenal way of of giving back and at the same time raising awareness. So beautifully done. You lead a firm that's been around since 1999 has been successful. I'm wondering as you realized success and scale, where do you see personal injury? Firms most often lead time and money without even realizing it? Because you've been through it all and you're on the other side of it. So, either from your experience or things you've seen with others in terms of how their firms operate. Yeah, I think that, I'm, I'm fortunate I had a business degree as an undergrad and think that's helpful in my son, who's a partner here. He has a master's degree, in business and finance. So we were a little bit more aware, but I went. But even though I had that knowledge and background, I still struggled. I believed, like, a lot of personal injury firms, that if you hire the right people and you put them, in your firm, and they worked hard, that everything would take care of itself. And, and what I found was that wasn't true. You know, I certainly one of the years I had the best group of people I've ever had, I had the best cases. And yet my law firm made the least amount of money than it ever had. And so. And it wasn't because I and everybody here was working hard, but we just weren't working necessarily on the right things at the right time. And so, I joined an organization, crisp, out of Atlanta, Georgia, and I thought it was I was really busy. I was too busy to do these things. And I could join this group, and I saw a lot of busy lawyers who were very successful, who were still finding time to do things, and they were running a more like a business. And so it came. It became very natural means, like, well, let's implement KPIs or key performance indicators. Let's start putting people in the right place. Let's let's manage people. Not not because we want to we don't think they're working hard, but because they may not be working on the right case. You know, a personal energy firm. We know what it takes to move a case from me, from here to here and how to turn it into money. But how long is that file sitting on someone's desk? Is it being worked? Is it as depositions being sent or medical records being requested? Are we talking to the client frequently enough? Are we getting demands out, or are we trying to set mediations on how are we moving it to trial? Even though I had really experienced paralegals and really good lawyers, we were just all really busy and we weren't getting those things done and we're wanting it. So now we have people monitoring those, so that were working just as hard. If not, you know, we're working just as hard as ever. But we're a lot more successful because we're working on the right cases and we're working at doing the right things at the right time. Such a key point about law firms being a business, even though it is the practice of law, it is still has to operate as a business and without knowing what your KPIs are. Yeah, it's very difficult to run a business efficiently. I'm curious about your corporate structure. Did you guys implement a specific leadership team? I know you mentioned you've got someone on the team that got focuses just on technology. How are you guys set up in that regard? 26 years ago, because over 26 years ago now I was my it was three partners, you know, and my wife. So we did everything you can imagine. Now we have ten lawyers and around 50 employees. And so as you get bigger, you have to implement more steps, more procedures and more people. Litigation is we're a predominantly litigation firm. We do try cases. So we had to do things a little bit differently. I had to set up a pre-lit department. Have an attorney, that's running that. She's solely responsible. She has KPIs. She has to do certain things. But those cases go turn over quicker. But that's not a big focus. And so she's actually works in a different building, our whole staff. And then I have a litigation department, and I have a paralegal who's over the litigation department who just was one of my best paralegals, but who now monitors other paralegals, monitors KPIs, helps when people are on vacation. She knows the cases. She's included in cases. She's a good liaison between the lawyers and the paralegals. And so there was resistance. I think when you first do that, lawyers are like, wait, what? What do you want to take? One of your best paralegals and turning them to a non income producing position, like, well it's not a non income producing position. In fact we will generate a lot more income because we have somebody who's making sure these files we have you know there's 50 cases that can be done within the next six months. They're being monitored and worked on and they're not getting lost in the shuffle. As we all get busy. And so, and then I have a separate trial division. One of the things I realized was that you go to a case, and a case doesn't settle, and then all of a sudden know a lot of firms, that case then gets pushed on the back burner because it's not income producing case, and it's going to take a while before that turns into money. And so it's just natural tendency if a paralegal is trying to get certain of cases settled or whatever he or she will push it to the side. So we just said, now will the case doesn't settle a mediation. Then it goes straight to trial division, and that's a whole different group of people. And their job is only to get that case ready and go try it. And so by having a different division, the case is never said. It almost punishes the defense for not settling because instead of getting to catching their breath, we start gearing that case up for trial starts getting hot, scheduling doctors depots, doing all those type of things, to push the case. So those are some of the things we do. I have a summer department. I have a lit department. I have a, trial to trial division. And then I have a marketing division. I have an office manager. I have a chief operating officer, I have a CFO, and, I have marketing coach, and those are kind of the ways we kind of run it. At what point does a founder led firm like yours have to start doing these things to professionalize operations, to avoid chaos? Is there an inflection point where informality and systems not being developed just stop working when you get to a certain point, I think you just kind of kind of have to grow. I mean, I the first position that I hired that I think was not an income producing position was a CFO, fractional CFO. And so I needed financial statements. I needed somebody to do a relationship with the banks. I need someone to look after insurance. And so I think that was a critical. We did that early on, even probably when we couldn't afford it. Because the reality was I understood the finances, the relationships with the banks, all those type of things was extraordinarily important to the success of our firm. One of the things that my firm does that not all firms do is that I have audited financial statements. I run my firm like a business. I have a line of credit for all my client expenses through the bank. And the bank, you know, by having audited financial statements, they are happy to loan me money because we don't lose work very rarely. And then as soon as the case settles, they get paid back. They bankroll any size case I have. They're happy to have me, as their customer. And I can afford to fight anybody at any time. I don't have to worry about it. I don't have to ask for money. I don't have to beg for money. My clients are protected. I have the bankroll to fight anybody, any size. And right now, I've tried cases where I had a quarter of $1 million in it. And so the reality is, I think my building a financially secure firm. Then you have a lot more options. And I don't I think most people, all of the lawyers are still good. They're still going to try really hard no matter what the financial consequences are. But if you can't sleep at night because you can't make payroll, then it's tough to focus on your clients, I think. And so we built financial security first, and then grew the firm accordingly. That makes sense. Yeah. And it's foundational. Businesses need that sort of discipline at the outset. And that's incredible advice. I think for anyone that has not done that is that that is foundational and such an important piece of making sure that you've got your business properly positioned to be successful. Because if you're not looking at that data and don't know what you're looking at, it's not organized where it can. It can really be a problem when you get yourself into a bad spot. But to your point to you about bankrolling these cases, because I know they're expensive. You know, I've worked on the product liability side, and those cases are huge investments, just like these and minimal cases. I mean, you can have a lot of money on the line here, and you're fighting the, defendant who's got a lot of resources that you've got to match that. So it's such a great point. I wanted to ask you about operational decisions that you guys make and that impacting client outcomes. Meaning you know what? What do you guys do and what systems have you created to protect the client experience and the firm's reputation in terms of all of the things around your your ultimate outcomes for your clients? I don't believe one lawyer is good at everything. So I don't have a philosophy. Let's have a lawyer over 100 files. And that lawyer has 100 files, and they do everything. And the client is dependent upon that one particular lawyer. I think that there's certain things I'm good at, and there's certain things I'm really bad at. And my partner, Scott follows, who's been with me since he was in law school, over 30 years ago. He is really smart and knows case law, and he can. He writes briefs. He does a lot of amicus briefs for the Indiana trial lawyers Association. He fights for a law chain, and so he knows the law really well. And so when him and I try cases, you know, he hands me briefs, I get up and I, I talk, and he argues, to the judges and the judges respect him on, if I win a verdict. He goes on, keeps it on appeal. So he's very smart, very good at writing. I think I'm better at standing up talking to folks. And so. And I every lawyers like that, I mean, so maybe they're really strong in writing. Maybe they're really strong and void or maybe they're strong. It cross-examination or taking truck drivers depots. And so one of the things we do is interesting is we we have Colby scores and print scores for every employee. We look and see what are their strengths and what are their weaknesses. It doesn't make it good or bad. It's just. Okay. What what job should you be put in? What role should you be put in? And so we try to put people in the right position and then we work together as a team. So we'll have 2 or 3 lawyers on every case. We'll have a paralegal plus the managing paralegal that I mentioned. And so that we and then we do zooms with our clients. We have a client relations person, client navigator. So soon as the case comes in, they're immediately reaching out to them, talking to them. If you have any issues, they we do a questionnaire to plan questionnaire or. How are we doing? Is anonymous. You can let us know. Tell us you know and we do that every I think every quarter. And so we have a lot of things in place because the client experience is extraordinarily important. Sometimes that gets lost on people. But that's why we're here. We're not here just to get a money. I mean, we're here to help them to a tough time. I have a social worker. Again, if you would have asked me 40 years ago, are you going to hire a social worker? Just not to be a file manager, but just to be a social worker to help people? I would have said probably not. But we have a social worker, somebody who we brought in, who who helps clients through the toughest times, helps them find resources, helps them find support groups. And so I think the client experience is extraordinarily important to my firm and to me. And we have a whole bunch of different steps along the way from the very beginning. When we onboard them, to the very end, when we hand them a check or we sit through a trial with them. Not your life, but to some extent, feature referrals, your Google reviews, all of those types of things. When you're focusing on that client experience, it's vital in terms of your making sure the the flywheel on your intake side is spinning at full speed. If your goal is as an attorney is to make money, then I'm not sure if you're going to be happy at the end of the day. If your job is to make a difference in these people's lives, then client satisfaction is extraordinarily important. And, and so I take that role, and it's nothing like when you're an attorney and you finish a trial before the verdict comes back, having a client hug you with tears in their eyes. So I think that's extraordinarily important as a business. That's one of the things, foundationally, I built was this focus on who we serve. And celebrating when we're able to you get a lean, completely waived or huge reduction for a family that needs those dollars to take care of themselves into the future. So it gives your team purpose to share in your purpose of helping people and understanding the importance of the work. So there's a I mean, there's a ton of wonderful reasons why tying all that together. That makes sense. We start every morning at the 10:00 zoom. We have a zoom with the whole firm at 10:00.

We have another one at 4: 26:44

00 and 10:00. I read, if a client sends us a letter or sends us a note, or a review, I read it for the entire team, because that's why. That's why we do what we do there. We do something similar, our monthly audience. We do mission moments where we just talk about different cases that we've been hired to assist with and what that translates into. So people understand the human element of what that is. It's not a name on a paper. It's not a dollar figure. It's a human who's been through something horrific, generally speaking. And you know, what we do makes a difference in terms of the dollars that they put into their pocket. Like you guys were actually delivering that form of justice. And it's the only way we we have it. And I know just personally from my own experience how impactful it all is because I went through it from A to Z. And so I've got a pretty, pretty darn good handle on the, you know, how personal it really is. Because when they say it's personal injury is and when you're the one laying it up in the ICU, it's you and yourself. So it is a very, very difficult point in your life, right? To get past it and having a good trial lawyer who and their firm helping you in the ways that you've described is it makes a difference for everybody that's involved in that. Yeah. And it's very rewarding. It's a great way to make a living. The systems or workflows that you've developed and, you know, others rely on to maintain control of their practices as volume increases. I'm curious what sets it apart so that the firm is operating optimally and not in, you know, putting out fires mode all the time because as you scale and grow, things can really break. Well, I think that if you have the right people in the right positions, monitoring and managing, and you put people in charge of reviewing files, like I said, we have a little litigation paralegal, and we're not a huge volume firm, and we focus on certain types of cases. But, but certainly we have volume. And so all the attorneys here were either a legal intern or, or a law clerk of mine. So they came up from a way that I'm not saying I was the best way or the only way just happens to be my way, where clients are extraordinarily important. And so I get to know people and law students and some maybe smarter, but they're not a good fit. Some may be hard workers, but they're not a good fit. Because they don't put clients first. And so I think that if you pick quality people and I've been I mean, I'm blessed in that, my lawyer, like I said, my lawyers have been with me now, Scott was a law clerk over 30 years ago. I have laws that there are 20 years. My daughter's a lawyer here. My son's a lawyer here. They were law clerks and runners before me, before they were law clerks. And so, my staff has been here with me for 20 plus years. I mean, so I've been really lucky. I think having that continuity. You set a tone, you say what's what, what's important. The. And then you back it up and this is a certain quality, certain experience. We expect certain quality product we expect. And then you hire people and they stay with you. I mean, I see so many law firms have a high turnover rate in attorneys or in staff. And I think that's when you have problems, when you have volume. Plus you got new people coming in and out. You don't have a consistent message. But if your message has been consistently that is the clients first, and we are going to produce quality work and we're not going to look at the dollars, if I take a case, I'll lose. I mean, if I have to write it off, I don't care. If I go send a rapid response team, I send experts out to a scene and we find out there's no case, I don't care, I could care less. The reality is that we do the right thing. We do it the right way, and that takes care of itself. But if you don't keep the same people in place and you're not adding new people like them, then I think you're going to run into some problems. Well, you've been very generous with your time today. One final question I always ask. It's very open ended. So you can answer however you want as, a lawyer who handles these complex trucking cases and very experienced trial lawyer, and someone who's been very successful in building a firm. What's your view as a trial lawyer? I'm blessed, to be able to do what I do. I really am very fortunate. If I look at myself as a little kid and you could tell me I get to do this every day. I love what I do. I don't have any trouble getting up in the mornings. I work six, seven days a week. I do get to bring my dog in the office. I have, my wife runs my practice. I have two kids that are lawyers in my office. I have a videographer who does my summer videos with my son. And so I'm very, very fortunate and blessed. And I think it is so rewarding to fight for people, when the odds are against them, when the challenges are high, when the stakes are high, there's no better feeling than getting in the trenches and fighting for these clients. And and I just can't imagine doing anything else. I don't have, you know, I see lawyers retire. They want to go off. I don't understand that because the goal for me wasn't a certain amount of income. It was just making a difference. And every day I have that opportunity. It may be a little thing, but it may be a big thing. But every day we have that opportunity to make a difference in somebody's lives. And there's no better way to do that than be a trial lawyer, not be afraid to go in and fight. Not to be afraid to go in the trial. You know, do the best you can. You can learn so much from others. And there's so many great trial lawyers far better than me that I can learn from. And just being humble enough and willing to learn I am. It can make you extraordinarily successful, lawyer as well as human being. Thanks for that. And you talked a bit about your practice, but I wanted to give you a second if in case any of our listeners have a trucking case or commercial vehicle type of case, they want to refer you, can you just give people a brief overview of the firm and then how to best get in touch with you if they need to, refer a case to you or, or work together with you on a case. Sure. So my law firm is Craig Kelly and Foley's. We're headquartered in Indianapolis, Indiana. I have lawyers license in Kentucky, Tennessee, Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Missouri and Iowa. We do trucking cases and, you can find is KF law.com, or you can type in David Craig and you'll, you'll find us and, but, and we have, you know, offices throughout into Indiana as well. David, thank you for joining me today on Trial Law Review. And we'll see everybody on the next episode. Thank you for having me. If today's episode gave you a new perspective on how your firm operates or sparked a useful idea, consider sharing it with a colleague and be sure to follow the show so you don't miss future conversations with leaders across the personal injury. Space Trial Law Review is brought to you by synergy, a strategic operations partner helping personal injury law firms resolve healthcare lines more efficiently. If you're looking to accelerate case flow and allow your team to focus on high level legal work that moves cases faster, consider partnering with synergy. I'm Jason Lazarus and I'll see you in the next episode.