Living Faithfully in a Distracted World - what Daniel 3 reveals

You become what you worship. And the way transformation happens is not through information — it is through changing what you love. This episode opens Daniel chapter 3, traces the story of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego through the furnace, and builds a theology of worship for a generation being formed by everything except the presence of God.

In this episode:
• Every empire demands devotion — and Babylon is not coming, it is already here
• Music as formation — why Nebuchadnezzar repeated the instruments so many times and what that reveals
• The death of consumer Christianity — even if he does not, we will not bow
• Why worship is not a warmup but the war itself — the primary battleground for the soul
• James K.A. Smith on cultural liturgies and why what you repeat without thinking is shaping who you are becoming
• Angela's testimony of a hard season where worship was the first thing to go — and the last thing to come back
• Babylon gets redeemed not by escaping it but by worshiping faithfully inside it

SPONSOR
This series is brought to you with the support of Logos Bible Software — the tool all three of us use when studying Scripture. Whether you want to go deeper in a passage, explore word studies, or dive into commentaries, Logos puts everything in one place. You can try it free for 60 days through our partner link below.

📖 Try Logos free for 60 days: https://logos.com/biblestudypdcst

Hosted by:
• Pastor Darren Rouanzoin — https://www.instagram.com/darrenr
• Angela Halili — https://www.instagram.com/angelahalili
• Slav Romanov — https://www.instagram.com/slavromanov

#BibleStudy #Daniel #Worship #ChristianPodcast #Faith #Jesus #BibleStudyPodcast

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Yeah, yeah. Real presence. Real presence, of course. I mean it's second. So well, the music's going on, so they heard that. Now they're gonna be like, what did they say? Talk about that in future episodes. Welcome back to the Bible study podcast.

SPEAKER_01 0:15

Hey guys, I'm Manj.

SPEAKER_00 0:16

I'm Darren. I'm Slav.

SPEAKER_01 0:18

We have our guy Slav back for this week. We're gonna talk about Gen Z, but before we get into the episode, can I ask you guys a question?

SPEAKER_00 0:25

Yeah, I love how you already start. You're the pro, pro podcaster. Yeah. This is what she does.

SPEAKER_01 0:29

Who do you who would you guys say you're most like in the Bible?

SPEAKER_00 0:34

Oh man. The donkey.

SPEAKER_03 0:39

That's a good one.

SPEAKER_00 0:40

No, I think I would be the donkey. Yeah, the Balaam rides in the show.

SPEAKER_01 0:44

Like a Bible scholar theologian. Yeah, Balaam's donkey.

SPEAKER_00 0:47

Yeah. Like God spoke through a donkey. I feel like that's my most that's the closest character I can get to. Okay. If I'm lucky. The Lord let speak through me like a donkey. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:00

I uh I have a prophetic thing, I guess. Um my dad had a dream when I was when I was in my mother's womb.

SPEAKER_00 1:07

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 1:08

Very, yeah. Um he had a dream that I would be like Samuel, and that I would raise up in the house of the Lord and would fall in love with his house. And he didn't tell me this until I was 18. Wow.

SPEAKER_01 1:19

That is so.

SPEAKER_03 1:19

And it was so he just wanted to see it come true, and it really did. So I feel like me and Samuel would be buds.

SPEAKER_00 1:25

Well, and like he anoints the next generation. I mean, you're literally leading the next generation. Yes. And you're creating a generation that loves to worship and be in the presence.

SPEAKER_03 1:34

Yeah, verdict is still out if unlike Samuel. You're just like Samuel. I'm only 27, so I've got 60 years that I got. Yeah, you do.

SPEAKER_00 1:41

You got time. Even 20, you'll see some fruit, hopefully. Hopefully. Who who do you think?

SPEAKER_01 1:48

I feel like I'm like Peter.

SPEAKER_00 1:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:51

I why? Because I am bold. Yeah. I preach the word. Yeah. I love Jesus. A little impulsive. Yeah. A little crazy. Very true. Might cut someone's ear off and then feel bad about it.

SPEAKER_03 2:05

Did he feel bad about it? I don't know. I think that maybe that's just me.

SPEAKER_01 2:11

No. Who would you say I'm like?

SPEAKER_00 2:12

I think I'm like, I feel like I'm like the I think that's a good, that's a great, great. Yeah. Who do you think I'm like?

SPEAKER_01 2:20

Yeah, definitely not the donkey. Paul. Paul? Paul. Yeah. So why?

SPEAKER_03 2:24

Because you write like if you were writing letters to churches, they would it would go viral for sure.

SPEAKER_01 2:30

You would be the one writing letters to churches, and you are the one who I'm my typewriter. Yeah, yeah. No, you are the one with the authority to rebuke. For sure.

SPEAKER_03 2:38

Bishop Darren.

SPEAKER_00 2:40

Bishop Darren. So kind. Verdict's out. We'll know him when I'm dead. Yeah. Um, yeah, it's funny because that question you asked, I have a hard time because I feel like as Americans, we always make ourselves the hero. Yeah. But you know what is interesting? So true. If you read the Gospel of Mark, which is what Peter was orating to John Mark, the author, Peter was the disciple who told him the story, right? It's the first of the gospels written. And he writes himself as like the idiot disciple.

SPEAKER_03 3:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:15

Which I love. So yeah, like But John doesn't do that. John does not. He's the beloved. And Peter is like foot in the mouth, getting it right one moment, getting it wrong the next. Like, and I think so. Yeah, I love that.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

About are you saying I get it right in one moment?

SPEAKER_00 3:30

Sometimes let's go. We all are like that. But that's the point is like we should identify as that person. So who are you? Put it in the comments below.

SPEAKER_01 3:39

That was professional podcasting.

SPEAKER_00 3:42

I'm learning. This is number 20.

SPEAKER_03 3:44

Except challenge. Try not to make yourself the hero.

SPEAKER_00 3:46

Don't make yourself the hero. Be the donkey.

SPEAKER_03 3:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:50

Which is heroic. Yeah. Anyways. Okay. Well, we're we're on this subject, right? Hopefully you like the last one. I we we love the last one. Talking about Gen Z, talking about Generation Alpha, because I want to put them together because I do think that's what we see right now. We have a lot of alphas in our ministry.

SPEAKER_03 4:07

Our youth is both right now.

SPEAKER_00 4:09

Yeah. And my kids are alpha generation. So I have old enough kids to say that. And um, you know, we were it's so funny. We were talking today. We went to this men's workout called Pursuit. It's part of our church, and we played Ultimate Frisbee, and my kids woke up early to play. So I took them. And on the way back, I was like, hey, I was praying, guys, like in the summer, because summer, you know, it's like a lot of free time. I was like, I want to do like a Taco Tuesday theology night with all your friends, like invite them over for talk.

SPEAKER_03 4:36

I was planning on doing something like that too.

SPEAKER_00 4:38

Just do it, bro. And then Amos goes, my eight-year-old goes, we should call it Taco Bout Jesus Tuesdays. Stop. And I'm like, that's genius. Taco about Jesus Tuesdays.

SPEAKER_03 4:49

I'm like, yeah, I was literally writing that my ministry plan.

SPEAKER_00 4:52

No way.

SPEAKER_03 4:53

Yeah. Like a like how the Lord speaks.

SPEAKER_00 4:55

So I was like, let's do it. We'll have any of your friends can come. They have to, they can have we'll we'll provide tacos and we'll hang out and we'll do something fun, but we'll have like a 20-minute Bible study on Jesus.

SPEAKER_03 5:04

So let's go. Let's do it.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Let's get after that generation. Someone's gonna do it. Taco about Jesus. Taco about Jesus.

SPEAKER_01 5:10

That's truly.

SPEAKER_00 5:11

Amos is my my little sweetheart. All right, we're gonna talk about redeeming culture. We're talking about the the characteristics that bring about redemption. And we looked at Daniel chapter one. Uh I'm hey, also side note, can I just speak? Yeah, I'm not a professional podcaster, so I I I get this. Like, people are like, you talk a lot, blah, blah, blah, blah.

SPEAKER_01 5:32

Who says that?

SPEAKER_00 5:33

I don't know. Maybe it's just what I feel.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

Yeah, I did say that.

SPEAKER_00 5:36

But I I do love the more engagement. So I want to do that. But I also, my framework, I was talking to my pastor. I was like, I don't know how to do this other than to like teach the Bible. And then so, so I'm doing my best to figure this out. So I just want to give you that. That's not insecurity, it's what we're it's more of like disclaimer for all y'all. Like, I this is not what I do for a living. I I I lead a church and I preach. So this is a side gig for you and I that we've been paying for. Yeah. And it's all good. So worth it. We're gonna go to Daniel 3, and I want to talk about the redeemed furnace. Oh, that was good, right? The redeemed furnace.

SPEAKER_03 6:11

That's a good sermon today.

SPEAKER_00 6:12

Worship that will not bow and will not burn.

unknown 6:16

Dang.

SPEAKER_00 6:16

I I want to talk about this this story that everyone knows, and it's familiar. And I just want to talk about uh I want to I want to look at what worship is. And in a few weeks, we have our friend coming on this podcast, Lindy, and we're gonna do a whole thing on worship, but I want to talk about this from this point. Will you read Daniel three? Yeah. Wait, let me pray. We're in. I need to pray. I want to pray again. Lord Jesus, we just thank you for the word of God. We thank you for your Holy Spirit. We thank you for the cross, Jesus. Father, we thank you for your love. I want to ask now that in the midst of what we're doing, that we would pause and hear from you that as we're driving to work, as we're sitting in our office, wherever we're listening to this podcast, Holy Spirit, you're with us. Jesus, would you reveal yourself in greater ways? I pray that you convict us and empower us and uh encourage us to live as a resilient disciples in the world. In Jesus' name. Amen.

SPEAKER_03 7:11

King Nebuchadnezzar made an image of gold, sixty cubits high and six cubits wide, and set it on the plain of Durah in the province of Babylon. He then summoned the satraps of the prefects, the governors, the advisors, treasurers, judges, magistrates, and all the other provincial officials to come to the dedication of the image he had set up. So the satraps, prefects, governors, advisors, treasurers, judges, magistrates, and all the other provincial officials assembled for the dedication of the image that King Nebuchadnezzar had set up. Then the herald loudly proclaimed, Nations and people of every language, this is what you are commanded to do. As soon as you hear the sound of the horn, flute, zyther, lyre, harp, pipe, and all kinds of music, you must fall down and worship the image of gold that King Nebuchadnezzar has set up. Whoever does not fall down and worship will immediately be thrown into a blazing furnace. Therefore, as soon as they heard the sound of the horn, flute, zyther, lyre, harp, and all kinds of music, all the nations and peoples of every language fell down and worship the image of gold that King Nebuchadnezzar had set up. At this time some astrologers came forward and denounced to Jews, they said to King Nebuchadnezzar, May the king live forever. Your majesty has issued a decree that everyone who hears the sound of the horn, flute, zyther, lyre, harp, pipe, and all kinds of music must fall down and worship the image of gold. And whoever does not fall down must and worship will be thrown into the blazing furnace. But there are some Jews whom you have set over the affairs of the province of Babylon, Shadrach, Meshach, and Nebedigo, who pay no attention to you, your majesty. They neither serve your gods nor worship the image of gold you have set up. And furious with rage, Nebuchadnezzar summoned Shadrach, Meshach, and Nebednego. So these men were brought before the king. And Nebuchadnezzar said to them, Is it true, Shadrach, Meshach, and Nebednego, that you do not serve my gods or worship the image I have set up? Now when you hear the sound of the horn, flute, zyther, lyre, harp, pipe, and all kinds of music, if you are ready to fall down and worship the image I made, very good. But if you do not worship it, you will be thrown immediately into a blazing furnace. Then what God will be able to rescue you from my hand? Shadrach, Meshach, and the Benedoge replied to him, King Nebuchadnezzar, we do not need to defend ourselves before you in this matter. If we are thrown into the blazing furnace, the God we serve is able to deliver us from it, and he will deliver us from your majesty's hand. But even if he does not, we want you to know, your majesty, that we will not serve your gods or worship the image of gold you have set up. Nebuchadnezzar was furious with Shadrach, Meshach, and Nebednego, and his attitude towards them changed. And he ordered the furnace to be heated seven times hotter than usual, and commanded the sum of the strongest soldiers in his army to tie up Shadrach, Meshach, and Nebednego and throw him into the blazing furnace. So these men, wearing their robes, trousers, turbans, and other clothes, were bound and thrown into the blazing furnace. The king's command was so urgent, and the furnace so hot that the flames of the fire killed the soldiers who took up Shadrach, Meshach, and Nebednego, and these three men firmly tied, fell into the blazing furnace. Then King Nebuchadnezzar leaped to his feet in amazement and asked his advisors, Weren't there three men that we tied up and threw in the fire? They replied, Certainly, your majesty. He said, Look, I see four men walking around in the fire, unbound, unharmed. And the fourth looks like a son of the gods. Nebuchadnezzar then approached the opening of the blazing furnace and shad shouted, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, servants of the most high God, come out, come here. So Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego came out of the fire, and the satraps, prefects, governors, and royal advisors crowded around them. They saw that the fire had not harmed their bodies, nor was a hair of their heads singed, their robes were not scorched, and there was no smell of fire on them. Then Nebuchadnezzar said, Praise be to the God Yahweh of Shadrach, Meshach, and Nebednego, who has sent his angel and rescued his servants. They trusted in him and defied the king's command, and were were willing to give up their lives rather than serve or worship any God except their own God. Therefore, I decree that the people of any nation or language who say anything against the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego be cut up into pieces, and their houses be turned into piles of rubble, for no other god can save in this way. Then the king promoted Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego in the province of Babylon. Yep.

SPEAKER_01 12:06

That is shoot. No, no. We don't need to say anything. It preaches.

SPEAKER_00 12:12

Thanks be to God. I I I love this story. I remember like I had these like Jesus cartoon videos, like actual video cassettes. And this is one of them that I would watch over and over again because like the fire would come out and like the guards would fall. And I was just, I had this like burned into my head, the statue of Nebuchadnezzar. And and I think it's in the context of if you if you're thinking, okay, Daniel's written in a way to form Israel, to shape its imagination, to remind them of where they came from, what happened, what redemption Yahweh looks like. The image is, you know, an education system, an indoctrination system, Babylonian culture that conquered Jerusalem and like is now forming them, it's educating them, it's an uh economic system, but it's a worship system, and every empire demands devotion. That's what's so clear. That's what we read in Revelation. Like Daniel is so connected to Revelation in that way because there is apocalyptic nature to this later on, where these like images and this metaphors and these allegories are used to frame an imagination for what it looks like to be a resilient follower, right? For revelation, it's to be following the way of the Lamb. In this way, it's to be faithful, like the remnant. Like Daniel and these three guys are the remnant. You know, they're they're they're they're this is what it looks like to remain faithful in exile. This is what it looks like to remain faithful at the uh the workplace that is anti-Christian. You know what it looks like to remain faithful when your government is not, you know, pursuing the things of the kingdom of God. Right. What does faithfulness look like? This is what we draw from. And what we have is in like a very clear picture of Nebuchadnezzar, 90 foot statue, like worship, demands worship. How narcissistic, yeah, like crazy, right? Yeah, but we don't need this statue because we carry ours with us, right? Like the same worship's happening today. How now, yeah, we're like, how narcissistic. Let's take a selfie real quick. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:17

Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 14:19

What we do, right? So, but in this characteristic, last last episode, we talked about you know how Babylon was indoctrinating and changing the identity of these young boys, and how Daniel resolves to with withstand um and redeem culture. There's another characteristic here that I think is so apparent and so appropriate for us to develop to just go off on, and it's this idea of worship. That worship is is not a Christian thing or or a religious thing, it is a human thing. We all worship.

SPEAKER_03 14:52

David Foster Wallace.

SPEAKER_00 14:54

That's it. David Foster Wallace, he what did he he can you quote him?

SPEAKER_03 14:57

Yeah, uh, I don't have the quote exactly, but he he said something along the lines of it's not a matter if you worship, it's what you worship. Yeah. And he gave the illustration of fish swimming in the water and a big fish coming by and saying, Hey, how's the water? Yeah. And the other fish look at each other. What water?

SPEAKER_00 15:13

Yeah, what's water?

SPEAKER_03 15:14

Yeah, what's water? Yeah. And I think if we if we don't realize it, if we're not told the fact that we do worship, we'll never, we'll never know it.

SPEAKER_00 15:22

Yeah, that illustration is like the the most influential things in our lives are often things that we're unaware of.

SPEAKER_01 15:29

Wow, wow.

SPEAKER_00 15:30

Like a fish is oh, all of a sudden aware of water that he didn't know that existed. And for so many of us, we don't realize that we're living in a place that is demanding our worship. We just don't, we don't call it worship. And it is a form of worship. And and we we are giving our devotion, our time, our energy, our resource to things that are idols. And, you know, it's not as clear as like the plane of dura, uh, but we definitely have planes of dura in our lives that expect our devotion. Like we talked about like that Proverbs 31. I wonder if reflecting on that, there's a lot of women out there that are trying to curate this perfect image that is like the work is a form of absolute devotion, right? To this curated self. Like the self is something that we worship, we worship ourselves. We can list like what are the planes of dura, like success, money, finances, relationships. Like for a lot of people out there, like they're obsessed over being in the right relationship, thinking that the relationship's gonna somehow give them this meaning and significance and purpose. Yeah, and Timothy Keller talks about that. An idol is anything that gives you meaning, significance, and purpose outside of Jesus. Yeah. So what are your idols? Yeah, where are you drawing your meaning and significance and your purpose from? And do you have what James K. Smith will say a liturgy of devotion?

unknown 16:54

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 16:55

Explain that.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

Yeah, so like liturgy being like this a ritual of worship. We have these rituals that shape and form us in worship, right? So you wake up and what's the first thing you do? Check your phone.

SPEAKER_01 17:06

Check my phone.

SPEAKER_00 17:08

Okay, and then what yeah, so you go to emails, what do you go to?

SPEAKER_01 17:10

I just see who texted me in the night or in the morning.

SPEAKER_00 17:13

So you go to text message, right? And then what?

SPEAKER_01 17:16

The little Instagram. Let's go, Peter. Tell me about this.

SPEAKER_00 17:24

Okay, so yeah, okay, so your liturgy, you look at your phone. Yeah, you go to emails, so work and you're number three. So the need to succeed, you want to make sure nothing got dropped while that was allowed. You're going to social, so your relationship. My wife's a seven. Yeah, yeah. Seven, you're avoiding pain at all costs. That's a seven. So that does sound like Peter.

SPEAKER_01 17:44

I know.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

I know. I, anyways. Um, someone's like, Enneagram's satanic, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Probably is. This is my voice for the this is how they type. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:54

Me, me, me, me, me.

SPEAKER_00 17:55

You're a heretic with my fingers. Yeah. I really am gonna be a heretic hunter. So I took Instagram off my phone, I took emails off my phone. Uh-huh. Um, I only do that on my computer now, and when I set time, because yeah, I had a liturgy of screen time, right? Totally. And screen time shapes you, it forms you. That's just one obvious, like non-neutral, like you have a liturgy of devotion.

SPEAKER_02 18:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:22

And so, like, for me, I wake up, check the time, and then I go to make coffee, and then I sit with scriptures, and I don't, I don't touch any of that stuff before I get into the word. I might get on my phone to put on uh soaking in his presence. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

Can we have him on? Like, I don't think he's not man.

SPEAKER_03 18:43

We're going to Brazil, so hopefully we'll meet him.

SPEAKER_00 18:45

You should meet him. He's a Brazilian, right? Yeah, he is. I he was my number one on Spotify, like the most amount of time on Spotify. I have like top zero.

SPEAKER_03 18:53

I know it's uh for me, it's all the baby music to uh our daughter.

SPEAKER_00 18:58

See, but this is good. Spot this is great.

SPEAKER_03 19:00

Spotify reveals well I was about to say I was about to point out can I can I just say as I was reading this, do you did you guys count how many times it said the the flute, the horn, the flute, the zyther, the lyre, the harp, the pipes, and all kinds of music. It's like yeah, what whoever wrote Daniel is like saying, pay attention. Yes, music has a way to form. Oh and I I just you look at the top songs right now, they're a picture into our culture. Yes, um, on Spotify. Like sometimes my wife will throw on the top songs and we're just like skip, skip, yeah, skip. Yeah, and in the beginning of the year, I was with our high school guys and I gave them a challenge for 30 days, only worship music. And they kicked and screamed. Yeah, like, no, I don't want, I'm like, I'm gonna pay for all your milkshakes at the end of it. Yeah, we're gonna have fun, but I'm challenging you 30 days. And every week they're like, This is the hardest thing I've ever done. This is more, this is so difficult. And but I was asking them more and more questions, they're like, But my conscience is clear, my mind is not thinking about what the music is talking about. I have more patience, I'm not as angry, I'm not as hurried. Yeah, it's just wild how it like completely reoriented their life just by the music they were listening to.

SPEAKER_00 20:15

So music forms your inner world more than I would say it's the most powerful form. Absolutely. So I always use this illustration, it's old for me, but you know, all you listeners, like I talk about being formed by culture, being formed by your phone, being you know, the power of formation. And I'm like, it's so easy. You go to the gym and you want to, you know, lift heavy or run fast. You're not putting on Adele's hello or William Augusta. Or William Augusta. Right? But if you want to work out, you're putting on like eight-mile soundtrack. You're putting on like Eminem and or Drake. What did you say? Kendrick. Kendrick, I was like, Drake. Well, no, no. Let's not have that controversial. But you're putting on music that like motivates you, and there is a massive difference between listening to like hello. Yeah. It's you know, like that will shape. You like want to grab your journal and cry about previous heartbreak.

SPEAKER_02 21:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:07

Like music sound writing has that capacity to influence you. Other songs will get you motivated to lift and run and go hard and like crush it. That that's the power of music. And it is interesting because I do have highlighted all of those. I didn't have time to do a word study. I wanted to find where those are mentioned in other places in the scripture. Yeah. Where like artifacts of culture, of music in particular, because I know in Genesis it talks about this. As we see the fall of humanity goes further, there are remnants of culture, like stonemasons are added. Music is part of that culture where you go all the way to Babylon, and now music is being used to direct people to devotion to a false God. Yep. The anti, because Babylon becomes this the archetype for the anti Jerusalem. It's the anti city of God. This is so where Babylon shares the word Babel. Remember the word Babel? So you have this tower being made. To displace the role of heaven and God and Yahweh. And then languages used to spread throughout the world, confusion, and languages used to divide the cultures. And then you get to Babylon. And Babylon is like the epitome of the anti-Yahweh city, which that theme is carried in Revelation. So that is the image that is carried on into the New Testament. So the people listening would be like, okay, this is one of those moments, and it's a defining moment. It's a defining moment for Israel because you have the person who conquered Yahweh's temple building an artifact to worship. Like so you can't get further away than Eden, than this moment. That's what's happening.

unknown 22:38

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 22:39

And then you have the three representatives who have been trained up in Babylonian culture, who are, by the way, 10 times smarter. What does it say? Like 10 times smarter than everyone else. And they don't worship. They refuse to participate in this moment. They refuse to participate, to participate in what culture is giving them at this moment. And the king's like, all right, throw them in, throw them in the furnace. Only turn it up, turn up the heat. And and I love this line. Like, if we are thrown into the blazing furnace, the God we serve is able to deliver us from it. And he will deliver us from your majesty's hand. But even if he does not, even if he doesn't, we want you to know, your majesty, that we will not serve your gods or worship the image of gold that you have set up. Like it's the death of prosperity. It's the death of self. It's the death of the curated image. It's the death of I worship a God who hashtag blesses my life.

SPEAKER_01 23:40

I I feel like just even that line is like the crux of the Christian faith. I know that he can and I know that he will. And if he doesn't, he's still who he says he is.

SPEAKER_00 23:51

This is like in our context, the death of consumer Christianity. Like, cause if you were to talk about the threat to Christianity right now, I don't think it's false gods being set up that we are going to worship and be forced to bow our knee to like the new world order of the future. Like, look, that that could be a thing. I'm not denying that. I think the the more real threat, the the current threat, is somehow Babylon is in our church experience where we're consumers of the benefits of Jesus without actually worshiping Jesus. Like we we want the kingdom of God and the benefits of the kingdom of justice and righteousness and purity and wholeness and forgiveness of sins and the presence of the Holy Spirit. We want and healing and we want all of that without the cross, without the sacrifice of the cross in our life. We want to follow Jesus when it's comfortable and convenient. And I always say, look, the the cross doesn't come with a charger for your iPhone outlet. It doesn't, it's not convenient. You can't plug it in, right? Like you're not so true. So this is a death sentence. And here's what I love they don't bargain, they don't negotiate. Yeah, they don't strategize. They don't run to God with like a probability, is like, is he worth saving our lives? Like, is it they're not doing any of that? They recognize like what's required is worship, and they cannot give the resource of worship to anyone else other than Yahweh. Yet every single day we give the resources of our worship to so many other things. Our time, our energy, our our desires, our we're all being formation. And I love it. They say, even if he doesn't, meaning that line right there, even if he doesn't, even if he doesn't deliver us, even if God doesn't give us the house, even if God doesn't give us the spouse, even if God doesn't give me the desires of my heart, a prosperous life of flourishing in the future, we'll still worship. That's the difference between worship and consumerism. Right there, that one line. A worshiper doesn't negotiate and strategize a worship, knows he's worthy, and at all cost will lay down his life, not lay down their life, not for a transaction, but because faithfulness requires it. That's covenant worship.

SPEAKER_03 26:09

And that's holy. Like what Shadrach and Meshach and Nebednego did was holy. Um, what what comes to mind when you think of fire that doesn't consume in the scripture in the narrative? Moses. Moses. Yeah. And he sees a fire that's burning but not burning up. Yeah. And what does Yahweh say? Take off your shoes, for this is holy ground. So good. And here we see another story of Shadrach, Meshach, and Nabednego in a fire, and they're not being consumed, and it's holy ground because of their worship to the Lord.

SPEAKER_01 26:38

Wow, praise.

SPEAKER_00 26:39

Wait, this is so good. Because what I think, what I'm trying to get at with these characteristics of redeeming culture, especially for the next generation, is they live in a world that demands their worship. They're being they're worshiping all the time. You go to a concert, that feeling of awe is there. You you're like, you know, the devotion to the series or the YouTube you've subscribed to or the Instagram accounts that you follow. There is a real sense of devotion that's taking place, a kind of giving away of yourself to these things. And I think what we need is a generation of, you know, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abendigo modeling this kind of worship where they they live with covenant faithfulness at all costs. Like they will not give in when they go to school, and school demands that they participate in these liturgies. They don't participate. They're they're not participating in those things. Like, and and it's real because it is. It's a way of thinking, it's a way of living that they're gonna have to choose to opt out of.

SPEAKER_01 27:41

Yeah. Yeah. Especially kids in California.

unknown 27:43

Am I right?

SPEAKER_00 27:44

Especially kids in Southern California. Eugene Peterson said that worship is not a way to escape from the world. Worship is the way we are equipped to live in the world. Oh and I think this is what, like, this is something that I see. I I also just want to highlight the fact that this has something to do with entering into the presence of God. That I think like the promise of the Christian life is not that the furnace will be removed, like suffering's gonna come, but that the it's the promise that God will walk with you in the fires. And that in that moment of fire, he will be with you. And I will just say that in the moment of suffering, that's oftentimes the most intimate times for worship. Yes, right? Where, like it says they're literally in the fire, and Nebuchadnezzar says, Look, I see four men walking around in the fire, unbound and unharmed. And the fourth looks like a son of the gods. That's what he says, right? Is that what you have in Daniel chapter three? Son of the gods. Son of the gods. He's using language to be like, there's the presence of God is with these people. It's just fascinating. Have you done any research on this text?

SPEAKER_03 28:54

Uh, I have a story behind it. Go, that's here. Yeah. I uh was living in South Africa when I was 19 for about uh four or five months. And there was a young family in the community that were instrumental to the church that we were I was helping to plant out there. And I remember I woke up that morning singing the song from Hillsong, Another in the Fire. It was a song. It's beautiful. Like there's another in the fire. I can't sing. I wish I could sing. Standing next to me. There you go. Angela will take it. Go, go. And I remember I woke up singing it. Like really very rarely do I wake up singing a song, and I don't sing well. So um, and probably five minutes after I woke up, I get a knock on the door that the husband of that family, that young family, had a probably 18-month-old, was in a fire accident. And he uh was paramotoring and his um motor caught fire and crash burned. And I just remember uh he was rushed to the hospital, and in the hospital, the only thing that we could do was worship. Like there was we could pray, I mean, we could talk about it, try to strategize, but really like his life was on the line. And um, he eventually passed away later on. But I just remember what marked that moment wasn't like a miracle or anything like that that came about it, but it was the worship that was so pure. Like, even despite like the healing that doesn't come through this, we'll still worship.

SPEAKER_00 30:26

Wow, that's so powerful.

unknown 30:28

So beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 30:28

I think, and I think this is so key because the danger, uh, like well, I mean, we have amazing worship in our church context. So we have great worship leaders that are writing original songs, songs are coming out right now, actually. Garden's releasing its first EP. And so shout out to our worship team, Pastor Faith and Mello, who've done that. But worship corporately is a real gift because it it draws us to uh truth, it draws us to Jesus. The point is to like really honor God for who he is. There's been worship movements and throughout history that have reshaped, like, you know, times in culture where worship is kind of redirected and songs are written by the generation. Like, I think of the Jesus movement, and like they move from hymns to I one of the things that marked the Jesus movement were songs that were like very like the the song sound of the moment in culture was taken on into church. And yeah, Keith Keith Green. Yeah, Keith Green and like Salt and Company, like all these movements came out of the Jesus movement, of like worship was redefined in a beautiful way, and it led to other things happening, and it's not all good, but which side note like the first major heresy of the church was hair uh Arius, Arianism, Arianism, and he was a worship leader, so it spread. Yeah, do you know this is Arianism?

SPEAKER_03 31:43

Is like the exaltation of God's of Jesus' uh spiritual being rather than his flesh.

SPEAKER_00 31:50

Yeah, not it's like Gnosticism in some ways. And I'm not an expert at this, but I do know that it spread throughout the church through worship songs. My one of my mentors, he passed away, Don Williams, he was a theologian, but he said every church sings its theology, so make sure you have good theology because he talked about this like what you sing shapes you in the church. So, which gets me back to my point, which is you're talking about suffering, and you know, here's a moment of incredible suffering in the community parents are worshiping. Yep. Like I have a story where uh years ago I was a youth pastor. I I did I was discipling like uh seventh grade kids, boys at the time, and there was a man in my life who's a father and an elder of the church. I was a part of Rock Harbor. There's a church that planted us out, and his name's Doug Root, and Doug died suddenly from a heart issue. And he was young, 40-something, and he he became like a father figure at that time in my life. He was walking with me, he was so amazing. And uh, I remember that first Sunday, his son JD, who's still in my life, he shows up to church with his mom and his brother, and the song, like bless the Lord, oh my soul, comes on. And this seventh grader who just lost his kid, his dad, is hands out singing that song at the top of his lungs. Yeah, like you give and take away, but blessed be your name. And like that's frozen in my memory when I think about what worship looks like. Like we need, like we talked about Daniel having these resolve to like these to live out these characteristics. I think we need to allow worship to be a daily habit in our life that shapes us. And I mean singing. Yes, I mean singing out loud, yes, in the car, in your quiet time, you know, in your in your prayer closet, like bringing worship to the Lord. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:40

So I this is a really interesting conversation. I walked through something recently or a few months ago where I went through a really difficult time, and probably the most difficult time that I faced since being saved. And when I went through this difficult time, that made me just numb to loving Jesus, numb to the presence of Jesus, the first thing that went was my worship.

SPEAKER_03 34:07

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 34:08

The first thing and the only thing really, I could pray and I could read the word. I could not sing.

SPEAKER_03 34:14

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 34:14

I couldn't worship. And so during this time where I was aware of how like vulnerable I was, my number one goal was just stay faithful to the Lord, even when I don't feel for him like I once did. Because that's when you get vulnerable and and so many people's obedience is reliant on how they feel. Yeah. They love him enough, they'll stay obedient. And so that was my number one goal was just stay faithful, you know, stay, do the things that I know to do and don't do the things that I know not to do. Um, but I remember as I was walking through this difficult time, I was like, the day I start worshiping again, like it'll come back to me. I'll feel again, I'll love again. Like, but I just couldn't get myself to worship. It was the hardest thing. I was listening to a lot of Christian rap because I still wasn't listening to secular music, but I couldn't put on the worship that I loved until finally, because I couldn't, I didn't feel it. I wasn't feeling it, and we so go based off of what we're feeling.

SPEAKER_00 35:16

So good. We do everything on our feelings. And if you read the Psalms, bless the Lord, oh my soul. Yes, praise the Lord, oh my soul. We're we're talking about the you are a soul. David is saying you you don't have to feel it. Exactly. He's telling his soul what to do, yeah. He's commanding his mind, his body, his emotions, his spirit, his relational facilities to direct its worship, which is to ascribe worth, it's to give honor to God in the right way.

SPEAKER_01 35:49

My heart was so hard, like it was so hard. I couldn't let Jesus sit. I couldn't feel. And because of that, I wouldn't worship. And I just stayed in the word, I stayed where I was comfortable. And then finally, when I started forcing myself to worship, my heart tenderized, like he truly replaced a heart of stone with a heart of flesh, and I felt again, and all of it came back, but it began with me choosing to worship. It did the feeling didn't come first. The worship came first.

SPEAKER_00 36:21

That's interesting. So I think about this a lot when I think about what brings about change or breakthrough, what enables people to move from a place of feeling stuck or like absence to connection with God. And I do think the gift of spiritual disciplines in that is like you read the Bible even when you don't feel like it. Uh, you you pray even when you don't feel like it, and you worship even when you don't feel like it. I tell our team all the time, or people who are asking my opinion that are leaders. Like I we have five services, and I don't get to sit in all of the services because I'm bouncing around now. But when I am there, the Lord said to me a long time ago, I want you to get low as a discipline in your worship because you have to stand on a stage. And if I stand on a stage, like it may sound strange, but like the the physical posturing of my body to get on my knees, we not if I'm I'm not in a mood where I'm like, oh, I'm in a place where I'm gonna kneel because I feel surrendered. No, this is a a chosen discipline that shapes my my physical body, which will shape my heart and my mind and my spirit. And so I, you know, I tell people all the time, you may not feel like it, raise your hands. Like you'll you'll raise your hands, you know, at a concert, you know, like when someone's going off, you'll, or like throw your hands up when someone makes a good play, when you're watching your favorite sports team. Like position yourself to give honor and glory to God that He deserves, to Jesus. And and even when you don't feel like it, especially when you don't feel like it.

SPEAKER_01 37:49

Especially when you don't feel like it.

SPEAKER_00 37:51

And develop a reservoir of history of worship.

SPEAKER_03 37:53

Yeah.

unknown 37:54

So good.

SPEAKER_03 37:55

Absolutely. I uh I there's so many disclaimers that people put on worship. Like, worship's not just the music, it's everything else, your life laid down for. And I hate that.

SPEAKER_00 38:04

I know.

SPEAKER_03 38:04

I get the yeah, I get it, but there's something about music that the Lord does that just it it uh it goes uh past all your your mind, it goes past what you're feeling, and it goes straight into your soul.

SPEAKER_02 38:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:19

And um, like I love like worship has been such a deep, profound source of life for me for a long, long time. And there, there are seasons as you'll notice, like, why do I love this specific song in this season? It's because the Lord's teaching me this song. And then after a few months, you're like, ah, this song no longer resonates anymore. Like you kind of put it in the back burner. And you're like, oh, like the Lord really imprinted something in my heart through that song. I remember there was um the song King of My Heart, um, was when I was in high school, that was like my song. And I remember junior and senior year, every morning when I would drive to high school, um, I would, I I I lived like 20 minutes away, so I had to get some good time to worship in the car. And I would blast that song so loud. Um, and I would just put it on repeat. And I uh remember a couple years ago, I went through a really hard time in life, and we were my wife and I were attending Upper Room Dallas, and they started singing that song, and I didn't want to.

SPEAKER_00 39:22

Couldn't help it.

SPEAKER_03 39:23

I couldn't do it because it like what like this the chorus said, you are good. You are good, you're never gonna let me down. And in that moment, I felt, God, you're not good. Yeah, and you you've let me down. Yeah, but the Lord brought me back to remember in high school, you were you were playing the song over and over and over again. You know that I'm good. Remember it like you did back then. So good. And so I had to force myself. And you know, the scripture talks all about building monuments and altars for the Lord. And when you are engaged in that kind of worship, those are just symbols of worship to to Yahweh in the in the in the scriptures. In the same way, we have these songs that memorialize what God is doing in our life, yeah, and they're as like a picture into like his character in our lives throughout our whole existence with him. Yeah. And so in that moment, I remember telling Mencer, I don't want to sing it. It's like you have to, because you have to remember.

SPEAKER_00 40:17

That's right. It's interesting because like even in Spotify playlists of worship mixes that I have that mark the season. You know, you look at 2020 during COVID, everything's locked down. There were some songs that went viral. One of them was an upper room. Um, you prefer Fight My Battles. Fight My Battles, the Blessing. And then um uh there was a Bethel one, um, I forget what it was. Egypt. Something no, which one? You take me out of Egypt. I don't remember. I I just remember I remember being locked in and my kids taking shirts and like swinging them around on the couch. This is how I fight my battle. Wow, and I remember it's funny because I I was you're talking uh I I went to like this last year when my younger son was dealing with some real like traumatic like anxiety and having sleep issues. Like he was waking up 10 times a night because he was terrified. He was having like he'd wake up, he would have um night terrors, and and it was like four months of like really hard, challenging season. And when he was in the car with me, I played one song, and it was Jesus Tremble, Jesus, Jesus, you you make the darkness tremble. Because that was a C that was also a song that we sang a lot, and he would just sing it. And and I, you know, I get emotional because like there was a battle he fought. My my my eight-year-old had to fight this this battle, and he's so different now. And he talks about you were with you were like during that season, he would sit in meetings with us, like because he couldn't be away from us. Yeah, my wife and I. And and I remember like I look at it now, and he this is how he talks about it. He's like, he he said the other day, like, I have a superpower, I've learned how to overcome things. Wow, and I'm like, Yeah, because you having he had anxiety, he had fear, and like it paralyzed him for not doing stuff, going to church, going to school, going, um, you know, going to friends' houses, going grandma. And he learned that like fear will keep him from things that are good, right? And like, because the the lie was like, I'm unsafe, something bad's gonna happen. He learned that fear can happen, but it's not always true.

SPEAKER_02 42:21

Yes, right.

SPEAKER_00 42:22

And he learned how to overcome. Um, and and um, you know, and what what's shaped that are the worship songs we put in our homes during those times. Like, and what's I I'm we're we're all emotional right now, so because it's real tender, like there is a power in being shaped by rich theological worship music. So I just want to say thank you to all the amazing worship leaders and songwriters out there that are shaping generations. Like we need songs that don't just like slant, like they don't just they're not just good songs, they're theologically rich with deep meaning. I pray that there's new worship leaders that come out that write, like in the power of the Holy Spirit, rich, theologically dense songs that go viral, yes, that shape the imagination of Gen Z and Gen Alpha so that they know the counterfeits, yeah, they know the other gods are alive. Like I'm I'm listening to that 2019 song Christ Alone, like it's a 20-minute song, and it's like a war cry. But that's exactly it. I have here worship is war, war, yes, like worship is where you go to remember whose you are before the empire tells you whose you are. Yeah, if you do not worship Jesus on Sunday, the algorithm will worship for you on Monday, and you'll spend the next six days bowing to whatever shape the music is being played in your headphones. And I just think it's not a warm up, it is the war that we engage in. It is the battle. So, what you're listening to, that doesn't mean like just listen to like Christian music, but recognize everything influences you and and the songs that you're playing, the the the Things that you're allowing into your imagination shape who you become for sure. Without question.

SPEAKER_03 44:04

100%. Yeah, we we do extra long worship at youth, and our youth don't like it. Doesn't matter what we're doing. It doesn't matter because what we're, you know, worship is just um an expression of love to Jesus. And if we can, like I've always said in at youth, is like if we can just get you to fall in love with Jesus, we're good. We're golden. You're good. That's it. Just fall in love with him. Yes. And the primary place where that has been formed in my life has been in worship. Yeah. I just remember when I first moved out when I was 18 to Redlands, California. Lord bless them. Um so dreary out there, but Lord bless him. Redlands let's go represent. Yeah, yeah. Um, I didn't know a single soul. And this was the first time where I ever felt like true depression and loneliness, like my body physically reacted with cold sores and everything. And I just remember the sweetest moments I had with the Lord was in worship. Just like in the quiet place, driving and weeping and weeping and weeping in worship. Yeah. That was the only thing that sustained me.

SPEAKER_00 45:07

We we are talking about singing, and I just want to stay here because what you said is interesting. Like, there's like an emphasis on like, you know, the presence of God is everywhere. He'll meet you, you know, in your solitude, in the, you know, in the desert place. He'll meet you in your serving. But he also manifests in the church. He manifests in the gathering of the Lord's people in corporate worship environment. That's where, I mean, lives are transformed there. That's for so let's not deny that. And I want to say, be a part of a worshiping community, be a part of a liturgy of the week where you're gathering with God's people to worship. It doesn't matter if they sing hymns without instruments or there's a rock band and there's lights, if it's an hour long or 10 minutes long. Like get into a liturgy where your worship is corporate, but also develop a liturgy within your own life where you worship. Like I sing all the time. My wife's like, Are you talking to yourself? Sorry, Baal, I'm singing. And it because I grew up in a household where my mom sang all the time. My mom is a Tabitha. We talked about that last episode. Like, she is a faithful woman of God. And she would, you know, she she suffered a lot and she has suffered, and she's been, she's got the most generous heart, but she has the most joyful spirit. And I think there's there's a connection between worship, generosity, and and joy. And I don't have enough theology to make that make sense right now, but I do know that if you become a person who regularly engages your soul in the singing and worshiping of God, and you're you it will be a defense mechanism because Babylon is going to get you every direction you go. And this is one of those those practices that you can you can embody naturally in your daily life that will shape you. I think Babylon promises you the world and it exchanges the world for your soul. And this generation has more access to losing its soul than any other generation in history. I believe that. Gen Z and Alpha, they have the most access to the things that will destroy them, like never before. So if you're a parent, just be aware of what your kids like are feasting on. Like I want to say, I say this to parents all the time like you're giving them a diet with what they get to watch, what they get to participate. Like, I don't think you should have a phone unless you're older than 15. That's my belief system.

SPEAKER_03 47:29

I say 16.

SPEAKER_00 47:30

Yeah, I like we have a rule, like because you're giving them access to a world that you that you lose influence to there. We should do a whole conversation on parenting, iPhone, and because I think you know, you wake up and get on your email, you wake up and get on your text. That's a liturgy that needs to be broken, you know, like and and we we play about it, but we know it's shaping you. It shapes you towards people pleasing and performance and all these things, addiction. And we need to break those things. But for this generation that really has it, you know, is now a generation of AI, a generation of attachment to algorithms and AI systems, it's gonna do something that we've never seen.

SPEAKER_03 48:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:12

So we have to have a counterformation for that kind of influence.

SPEAKER_03 48:17

Well, it's crazy. See even the stories that have been recently coming out of people falling in love with their AI agent, chatbot. So crazy. It's wild. It is crazy. Everything will vie for your love. You know, this is what James K. Smith says, you become what you worship, but yes, more importantly, the way that you um the way that you transform isn't through information, it's by what you love. Yes. It's by changing your loves.

SPEAKER_01 48:41

And it's not information, it's what you love. That's wild.

SPEAKER_03 48:45

This is why I can read every Dallas Willard book, every Eugene Peterson book. I can get my master's in theology, but I'm not a person who loves Jesus more because of it. Um, and you can ask my wife. I, you know, I have a long way to go to Christ-likeness. Um, and the only way that that's achieved is by changing what you love.

SPEAKER_00 49:06

I have the quote from here. Let's go. Um James K. Smith, amazing author. Um, he wrote, You are what you love. He says, um, he calls what's happening, what we're talking about, he calls it formation and he calls them cultural liturgies. So he uses that phrase. He says we are formed by the rhythms and rituals we repeat without thinking. And what we love is uh shaped long before we decide what we believe. And and so what I wrote down here is the empire is coming for your loves. So Babylon doesn't need to argue you out of believing in Jesus. Babylon only needs to feed, keep feeding you a plate that slowly trains your loves to chase something else. The mall is a liturgy, the social media feed is a liturgy, the endless scroll is a liturgy, and every liturgy part uh you participate in is shaping the kind of person you're going to be in 20 years. Andy Crouch wrote writes this. He says, um, he talks about this in his book. He says, Christians have been talking about culture the last 20 years, and he says, we've spent so much time being anti-culture or pro-culture or copying culture that we forgot the option Jesus actually gave us, which is to make culture. Wow, to make new things that are so good and so true and so beautiful that they create their own gravity.

SPEAKER_02 50:29

So good.

SPEAKER_00 50:30

Which is exactly what happens in the story in Daniel, because this is the moment that cracks open the hard stone heart of Babylon. Because they're like, hey, this is the God that saves. Yes. And that that opens the door for what will become the redemption of Babylon over the years.

SPEAKER_03 50:49

Which, yeah, so oh my gosh, that's so good. I yeah, I think about in that way, you know, this becomes like a catalyst for Babylon to see the reformation. Like, wait, hold on. You're saying that the statue that was built, like even Nebuchadnezzar is naming it, he is this the probably the image that was inscribed on this golden statue. Wait, hold on. He is not the most powerful one, it's the it's the Yahweh, Yahweh God, who is the most powerful one who can save, which is a foreshadow of what Jesus' name is the God who saves.

SPEAKER_00 51:18

The God Yahweh, Yahweh, Jeshua, I mean. Uh he uh like the king's decree at the end of the chapter, he issues a public law that anyone who says anything against God, the the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego will be cut to pieces. Wow. And I just think that's so fascinating. So he makes it a law, like this pagan ruler, the most powerful person on the planet at this point in history, right, puts on public record that in his own language, right, he's going to defend Israel's God, right? Through force. And here's my point it doesn't happen through a Hebrew Hebrew lobbying group.

SPEAKER_03 51:55

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 51:56

It's not by a political party that, you know, takes a minority position in the Babylonian court or a protest, but through three teenagers who choose not to bow down to that music and they worship faithfully in the middle of the public square, the Hebrew God. And here's what one scholar says he says, um, exile is one of the primary places God uses to expand the knowledge of his name to the nations. And if you study, you know, the Bible, Genesis 12 says to the to Abraham, you will be a blessing to the nations, a light, right? And it talks about like the Israelites being a light to the to the nations, to the Gentiles. And what is formed in the private space of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego becomes the tool God uses to reach the Gentiles and the nations.

unknown 52:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 52:46

Come on.

SPEAKER_03 52:47

Yeah, they didn't do it like it wasn't like, oh, this is our moment now.

SPEAKER_00 52:50

No.

SPEAKER_03 52:51

We've been, yeah, waiting for our moment to prove that Yahweh is real. It was something that was done in the quiet for a long period of time where they fell in love with Yahweh more than what they could gain from the Babylonian system.

SPEAKER_00 53:03

So good.

SPEAKER_01 53:04

Let's go.

SPEAKER_00 53:05

Let's go. All right. So this is how Babylon gets redeemed, just to close. Not by leaving Babylon.

SPEAKER_01 53:11

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 53:12

Right? Not by escaping Babylon, not by burning Babylon down, but by worshiping the King of Kings inside of Babylon, in front of Babylon, with such commitment and steadiness that the outside, the outsiders looking in are transformed. So I just want you to think about that. Like where God has you. You're listening and you're like, man, I just wish I was around more Christians. Well, maybe God has you to be the redemptive presence in that workplace as the Christian. And you don't need to recruit a bunch of Christians, you know, into the position. What if you just live so robust, so faithful, so worshipful that there's a transformation that takes place? And I would start there. Start with not cranking up the music louder. Um, crank up the music louder in your own life, in your private time, and let that music be worshipful. Right? Thank you, Lord. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 54:05

Thank you, Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 54:06

Thanks for listening today.

SPEAKER_01 54:08

Thanks, guys. Thanks for hanging out. Thanks, love.

SPEAKER_00 54:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 54:11

We love you guys. God bless you. See you later.