The Doctors No More Podcast - Episode 7: From Welsh Beach Sting To Medical Awakening

A fish sting on a Welsh beach shouldn’t unravel the foundations of modern medicine—but our tongue‑in‑cheek Weaver Fish story does exactly that. We follow the joke to its serious core until eventually it becomes a mirror for how healthcare often prioritises products over people, protocols over presence, and licensing over listening.

From there, we peel back the layers that keep the system stuck. We talk about education shaped by the Industrial Revolution, training smart technicians who can pass exams without ever facing the deeper ethics of care. We examine the hospital as a “ship in dry dock,” a metaphor for the legal and cultural authority that inflates egos and silences patients. We revisit the Flexner report, the quackery label, and how consolidation sidelined diverse traditions. And we follow the money into the supermarket, where most aisles hold engineered “feed,” not food, and into our phones, where Pavlovian cues teach us to crave instead of choose.

But this isn’t a rant; it’s a blueprint. We outline a people‑first model that treats health as physical, emotional, social, and spiritual. Imagine care spaces bathed in natural light, alive with art, gardens, and animals; clinicians with time to be human; and a commons where herbalists, holistic dentists, osteopaths, rogue researchers, and citizen scientists sit alongside MDs to ask a simple question: what works, and why? Picture incentives that reward energy, function, and connection—not just billing codes. See sacred contracts between practitioner and patient that protect autonomy and nurture growth.

If you’re ready to rethink care from the language we use to the food we buy, from the laws we inherit to the tech we carry. This conversation offers practical clarity and hopeful direction. Subscribe, share with a friend who cares, and leave a review with one change you’d make to put people before profit. Your idea might shape our next episode.

Transcript

Tempo: 60.0

SPEAKER_02 1:23

Well, welcome back to Doctors No More NO for those who might be joining us for the first time. And this is episode seven. And, you know, I'm gonna launch straight into where we left off in episode six. And if you haven't caught episode six, you know, I mean, watch them or listen to them all, but do go back. But um Gareth and I somehow in our tangents of humour and trying to make a point, and ended up on a Welsh beach where Gareth got badly stung by a weaver fish. Excuse me. And from that, um, we somehow ended up with a remedy called Weaver Cetamol. Um, and Gareth had then branched out into a business. So in my in our minds, it was just like a pop-up, you know, tent on a beach with some hot water and this special potion, uh, weaver seetamal. And he was doing very good business. But, you know, off camera, off microphone, you know, and in the spirit of what we were trying to communicate and what we hope to do today, you know, we said, well, look, why stop there? This is a successful business. And so, you know, why not expand into you know the bays, you know, to the left and right of him and and and along the coastline? And and so, of course, immediately the problem arose of what if there isn't an you know any weaver fish? And so, you know, the logical thing to do, quietly, albeit, you know, is is to get into the weaver breeding program and and to accidentally, you know, um, of course it's accidentally uh you know, release some weaver fish into into into differing bays, you know. And I I can't think of anything funny, but maybe you'd call the the where you breed the weaver fish, I don't know, the Wuhan Weaver area.

SPEAKER_00 3:23

The reality is actually I when I was there, I um uh I asked where I was staying. I said I was staying in a different part of of the coastline. Yes. And I and I told someone there, the the person who owned the place where I was staying, I said, Oh, I was being stuck. They said, What? That doesn't happen here. So it must be just located in one area. So I the idea was that you know, to make a successful business along that coastline, you know, to you know to to keep me in the life that I should require.

SPEAKER_03 3:59

Yes. Of comfort and riches.

SPEAKER_00 4:01

As a a provider of of Weaver Seatamol. Yes. Um, I would go into the business of um, you know, maybe doing some uh experiments with the fish itself for the benefit of humanity, obviously. Obviously. Um which would mean breeding them and seeing what sort of strains I could get, whether I could, you know, create a a strain with a lesser sting or even greater sting.

SPEAKER_02 4:30

Yeah, but there's a problem with that straight from the get-go. And I know this because I know I know you've done it, at least in our heads. Um you you breeded with with differing uh fishes and and you know 18 times failed. And but but you know, weaver 19 was the most successful. It was it was definitely successful, and and somehow they got out into the bay. Yeah um and unfortunately, weaver seetamal didn't really cut it with this particular sting. Not that anyone had ever actually seen a Weaver 19, and to this day, I don't believe they've caught one and identified it. Well, that's that's the problem, right? But but but it yet again presented you, you being a businessman, I mean a doctor, it presented you with an opportunity, I mean uh research to to come up with a remedy. And and if I'm right in remembering how this went, um you were talking to on the beach that day with this particular problem, this mythical leaver 19 fish.

SPEAKER_00 5:47

Chance would have it that I came across a very old, sort of salty um sea, you know, one of those men of the sea. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:56

Um probably they have a wiseness just oozing out of their net mending fingers. Completely.

SPEAKER_00 6:04

Or wisdom is probably the better. Wisdom, yeah. And um I was expressing this problem to him, and he said, Well, he said, you know, this isn't this is not a new problem. Had he ever seen one or was it a myth to him to heard about it? His ideas were that the you know the the usual weaver fish obviously is yeah, you know, it's easily seen.

SPEAKER_02 6:28

But yeah, well you could you could apply you could apply you know um cox postulates to to to the weaver fish if it you know weaverfish bites you and then your toe swells and stings you, and you know, it's a so so you know they they'd applied Cox postulates to the weaver fish.

SPEAKER_00 6:44

So weaver seatamole was a was a recognized um oh well he'd recognized he said well weaver seatamole, everyone knows that. But as you know it's fisherman's friends. He says, Everyone knows weaver seat and all, he said, but he said other strains like the weaver 19. He said, Do you know something already exists? He said, No, yes, he said something already exists, something that's been around for a long, long time, and it's just not specific for the the weaver fish thing, it's used for some other uh sting, right? Or something completely different. And I said, Well, what what is this thing? Because I'm interested in it, because I'm interested in it.

SPEAKER_02 7:36

Yeah, well, if we could especially if it's old, it's probably good and dry, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:41

You know, but he said, he said, well, if I give you this, then obviously, you know, uh the other the other sort of procurers of weave a seat tomorrow aren't going to be happy, are they? Right? Because this is effective for all strains of it. And I said, Well, I I'd be surprised at what this says, and he says, Well, he said it's a simple name for it. He says, This weaver mecton, he said.

SPEAKER_02 8:09

So uh attempting to remain professional, yeah, so this weaver mectin, right? And his old and wise and experienced knowledge, yeah, um, even though he himself had not caught or or seen or identified the weaver 19 fish, um he he was confident and he said, Look, this is probably placebo, even he said.

SPEAKER_00 8:40

Well, this is probably even place. I said it worked. He said, Look, there's nothing fishy about this at all, he said.

SPEAKER_02 8:51

Now, the problem with it, and and he hopefully, you know, people listening understand why we're going here, right? And and and actually, I'm not promoting either Mectin or or oh my sorry, weaver Mectin. Weaver Mectin. Yes, and I'm certainly not promoting, you know, the escaped weaver fish. From weaver from Gareth's Weaver Weaver Aquarium, uh, either uh story. Um and that's that's conversations for another day. But but the whole point of this silliness, although you know what? I think we'd be if we were in the weaver seatamol and weaver mectam business on a on on Welsh beaches for the rest of our life, I think we'd be happy.

SPEAKER_03 9:27

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:28

You know, but anyway, the point is this um, you know, kicking off from last time and the future of medicine, is that um that stupid analogy, which has turned out to amuse the hell out of Gareth and I on and off Mike, um, is actually very poignant of the energies and harmonics and you know I'm not gonna say more importantly because it's the they're all entwined, but the the intentions of where something comes from. And you know, I we talk about evidence-based medicine, I always chuckle because I don't think um the evidence is very good, as I call it BS bad science, most of it. And however, the the evidence suggests that the inception and the energies and the structural energies that have been formed in medicine have very little to do with trying to work out what causes disease and what are the remedies. And that's not to say that those structures and those energies, because that's all they are, they're thought forms that have been sort of set on paper and you know, some would say stone for people to work in. You know, I am a doctor, this is a hospital, that kind of thing, right? It's just a building that we're calling hospital, that's my point. But but of course it's attracted people that have, with good intentions and good hearts and good souls, tried to discover the causes of man's um, you know, uh ailments and problems. But as soon as it either is potentially a money maker, or it has threatened an established money-making remedy or quote unquote treatment, um, the the the truth of the system for anyone, everybody knows it really, even if they don't want to bit it, that is sabotaged. And so in our stupid weaver fish, weaver seetamol, and weaver mectin analogy, you know, already the weaver seetamol people, you know, you know, franchisees would be upset because weaver mectin, which is way cheaper, by the way. You know, weaver seetamal was quite a quite a thing to produce, and you know, and then you know, and then of course the problem is um the port authorities start to hear how well you're doing, and you're not just some sort of little, you know, pop-up on a beach and you're actually an established business. They'd come in and ask for your license, you know, and then they'd say where your stud is, you know, and but and so you see where it is, and and so all this bureaucracy and all this stuff, whereas the old fisherman, you know, mending his nets with this sort, oh, I can see him, I like him already. I want to just sit and have a pint with him. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and you just know whatever you talk, there won't be many words that come out of his mouth, but everything that does is just gonna be, you know, wise and beautiful and and interesting. But but um oh for those days, Gareth. But anyway, I think everybody gets the point that that if we're gonna talk about you know the future of medicine, um, I think probably more importantly than anything other than the philosophy, which which what I'm about to say entwines with the philosophy, we have to be talking about people before profit. Would you agree?

SPEAKER_00 13:03

Yeah, I mean, look, we all need to make uh money in this world. It's a it's an energy that's exchanged for you know something that you do. But when you when you start to look at some of the aspects of human existence which are uh one is definitely health, uh it's what is what is the intent behind it? You know, is the intent um solely to make money? Does that come first? And then if it helps a little bit, it comes second, or is it to create health? Uh you know, and then you have to go into what what is health? From a from a reductionist point of view, health uh which most of the um conventional healthcare settings, you know, um uh are stuck in, uh, is physical health. Their idea of emotional mental health is limited. Um okay, there are some aspects which are now looking into you know uh lifestyle uh medicine to look at you know how people have in a um a fulfilled life, but the intent has to be there for the for the betterment of of a person on more than more than one level, really it needs to come from a spiritual level. And I it's not I'm not relating to religion, but I include that in some shape or form. But some some driving force that connects a person to something of greater meaning, maybe their soul, if you want to call it that, or they're light or harmonic.

SPEAKER_02 14:51

You you've actually hit on something very important. Um, and and it's certainly not a tangent, you know, in the in the 30 plus years I've been researching, you know, it it takes you into unexpected territories of information, which which I have established to my own mind, are correct. And you know, um what I'm what I'm going to share, and some people may know this, and some a lot of people probably don't, but when you talk about you know the intentions behind it, um you can't um separate the government and the systems and the and the legal uh they're all intertwined, you know, from tax to the government and regulations to laws to lawyers. And I think it's very important for people to understand where it sits within human, I don't think it is evolution, but we'll call it human evolution in the last hundred, two hundred years, um, i.e. the the industrial revolution, which we're moving out of now and into um the technological revolution, which is another subject for another day, because there's some very uh dark elements to that manipulation. But nonetheless, um as uh modern day education was spawned during the Industrial Revolution, the the basis of it was not, or the intentions of it was not really to educate and raise the masses understanding of knowledge. It was basically to introduce hierarchical systems of authority, i.e. a teacher, deputy head, which could be a boss, you know, deputy manager, whatever it is, right? It was to introduce that. It was to introduce the Monday to Friday with the weekend or weekend, as some people call it, philosophy, you know. Um, it was to um train people to be clever enough to follow instructions and do things at differing levels, i.e. be good workers, but not intelligent enough to work out they're being screwed. Now, I know that's a very cynical view, and many people have done well within the education system, but it's it's few and far between in my in fact, it's it's essential, excuse me, programming, I think, for the industrial revolution.

SPEAKER_00 17:26

Well, this is interesting because you uh I obviously um had to uh pass lots of exams to become a dentist, right? And I went through a system of learning dentistry, um, and then I um you know pass exams, do the practical side of it to a certain standard, and I'm considered a dentist. Right. So I can go out and I can practice dentistry now. Does that mean I'll go out and practice ethical dentistry? Well, that's a good question. So w uh does it mean that I I'll go out and I'll practice dentistry that's in line with uh what's ethically right for each individual person and give them all the options that they sh that you know they should know about, good and bad to what I do. So they've got a choice. They've got what's called informed consent.

SPEAKER_02 18:29

As opposed to my first dentist, which my mother loved because she loved camp men, uh, Dr. Wagner, a South African dentist, who I'm convinced was drilling for oil every time I went in there. And is he's a large part to do with why I had problems with my teeth and adults, he just drilled the whole bloody tooth away each time. And I don't believe there was cavities there, or or at least not big ones. This is the ethical.

SPEAKER_00 18:55

Yeah, I think this is the same across all professions, right? Just because you reach a standard to practice a certain um a certain vocation, it does not mean that you are ethically a decent person and that your intent is for uh an evolution of humanity. Yeah, right? And it's it should do, but it doesn't. It should do, and in fact, the systems that are in place do not allow that to a certain degree. So, you know, if I look at dentistry, there are there are what I would call the conventional dentists, and then you've got uh holistic dentistry, biological dentistry, and they those areas uh tend to be uh occupied by people who maybe are thinking, Well, am I doing the right thing? Yeah. But even with that, in within that, I'm sure that people are are doing it because it's a trend.

SPEAKER_02 20:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:09

And they can maybe earn more money from certain things. But that's the same through everything.

SPEAKER_02 20:14

It is. Well, Harry Hawes, my first mentor, the great osteopath from Hartley Paul, Harry Hawes, bless him. You know, he taught me it's it's a rare man, and of course he meant man or woman, but you know, in those days he just said mad. Not not, you know, have I offended your gender. But um, you know, so it's a rare man that that can make a decision for somebody else um and leave money out the equation. But you know, it it's some okay, I've I've I've got quite a lot to say on this subject. I want to just go back before I go forward on that, you know, I I brought in the educational side, but what what people may not fully understand is the the body of law that we are operating under, and this is relevant in the world of commerce, which which is basically where you know there's contracts and money exchanging hands at any level, is called maritime law. Now, many of our listeners probably go, oh, yeah, I know all this, but there'll be a lot that don't. But the maritime law is the law of contracts, it's it's it operates on the sea where all traditionally trade was exchanging on the sea and goods were moving. And you may, if you don't know this, you certainly would have probably watched you know, TV or movies where a criminal has been injured or shot and goes into hospital, and the detectives are very, very keen to interview them, but they have to get permission from the doctors. And the reason for that is the doctors have a superior jurisdiction and a superior rank over them in matters. Maritime law. Why is this relevant? It's extremely relevant because what people need to understand is that the system which has created a legal person. So you hear the word person all the time, but it's not a human being, no matter what anybody tries to tell you differently. But it's created a legal person, which is essentially your commercial vehicle that's attached to you, right? And I don't want to go too far down this rabbit hole, but it's all true. But basically, you are a commodity. That's why they have the word human resources, right? You are a commodity from the system's point of view. How much can we get out of you and how much can you put back in, and so on, so forth, right? And why is this relevant to doctors and hospitals? You know, um, you've all probably heard horror stories of particularly with children that have been, you know, in hospital and their parents disagree with the doctors' views or opinions, rightly or wrongly, and and yet they have no control, they lose all control um over what happens, and indeed um getting those children out of that hospital, again, rightly or wrongly, as the case may turn out to be. Um, it can be the same with adults, although it's a little bit different. But what people don't understand, and David Um Wynmiller taught me this, who I knew, and again, if people know David Wynne Miller is either write him off as a genius or a crackpot, but he was a genius in my view. But anyway, um, what a hospital is, in reality, in the legal world, you might not know this, Gareth, is a ship in dry dock. And, you know, when we were the reason in England, in fact, in all Canada, we still have them here, uh, we we see um peace officers. So it's actually got it on their cars, right? And all peace officers are constables, no matter what their rank, they're constables. And constables goes back to con start, which is French, con stable with stable, which is horse, when when the law officers used to ride on horses, and the horses ride on the land. So what yeah, I'm just doing a you know very brief thing here, but it's important. So so the original law and the uh law of the land was enforced by constables, and basically it was um, you know, keeping the peace. So you could do whatever you wanted as long as you didn't breach the peace. Okay, so whereas the law of the sea and the person and the legal slave stroke contract commodity um needs to be at sea for that jurisdiction to really kick in. And so hospitals were deemed in law as a ship in dry docks. So when you enter, it's actually the same as when you go into court. Um, and this is relevant, so please bear with me.

SPEAKER_00 25:01

It's making me think about something, but right.

SPEAKER_02 25:03

Well, I'll show you, okay, because it's very, very important again with the intentions and the energetics.

SPEAKER_00 25:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:08

But when you go into court, when you go into court, everybody has seen that little fence between the public gallery and and whatever it's called, the other side, right? And you know, for most people, they're like, well, it's not for security, you know, because anyone could jump over that. It's a little you know, it's not even two feet high in most cases, you know. But when you get called um to the um dock, which is an interesting word, isn't it? Because what else goes into docks? Ships, right? When you get called in a dock, it is a it is an IQ test of do you know who you are? Are you a man on the land or a person, a commodity leaving the land, going through that fence, which is like on a ship, and you're entering into maritime law. So, you know, for if this is new to people, it's going to be extraordinary and there's lots of things we can point you to. But it's a fact. When you enter a hospital, you leave the land, and you you are you are now in the jurisdiction where doctors who used to be on ships to make sure the cargo and the um, you know, if it was live cargo and the seamen were um so it's probably probably wrong without people could could go tangent here, you know. But but anyway, the the sailors, the sailors remain healthy because they were very important. And there was jurisdiction, and the doctor held, you know, if not the highest, certainly the second highest position of authority. And that remains to this day. Now, that energy, even if doctors don't know it, even if they don't know that body of knowledge, that energy, remember, I talked about the structures of resonance, and that energy has permeated into their consciousness because although I accept there's some very good intention doctors and nurses, and I don't want to keep saying that, the thing I hear most is the God complex. You know, the that those behaving with um power and and you know, do you know who I am? And how dare you question me? Have you got a doctor? You know, that sort of energy. So I just thought I'd bring that in because it it it as we transform in this time of Aquarius, those structures have to dissolve as well within these energies of change.

SPEAKER_00 27:33

Yeah. I mean, that that's an interesting uh point about uh the God complex, because if you look at a physician, um, as in the the ancient idea of a physician, uh they were connected to God, right? They were connected to a higher energy, yeah, spiritual energy. And unfortunately, what's happened is that there's been a disconnect. And so the physicians of today in in uh conventional medicine are very, very um um egocentric. And I'm not saying ego's bad, we all need ego, otherwise, we wouldn't be able to drive forward, do things. Yeah, uh we you know we we the idea of not having an ego, even from a spiritual sense, doesn't make sense because we all have identity, right? Exactly. But the problem is is that um there is this um uh environment that they grow in while they're being taught that that makes them believe that they are something incredibly special, right? That they are separate from uh society in a certain way, and they they are elevated in some way into something greater.

SPEAKER_02 28:51

Well, well, energetically, on what I've just explained, that that energy source that's tied into the legal and the education, it is there. They're feeding on that, and they are protected in that energy field to some degree.

SPEAKER_00 29:06

Yeah. So what happens is that the the personality starts to believe it more. And when you've got something like that, the I the other aspects of of healing, the healing arts, like empathy, compassion, understanding, um, coming from a point of view of what is actually really right for this person's um soul growth, right? That that can't that can't exist within that that that paradigm. And you talked earlier about um, you know, or I talked earlier a little bit about you know, you can learn a a trade of some sort, but it doesn't make you a good human being within that. And I'm not saying that the the field of medicine doesn't have good human beings in it, it does, you know, but it's difficult, and unless if you exist in a in a paradigm or a consciousness, let's say, for example, you you exist in a room, right, that has um green wallpaper, right? And you only exist in that room, green wallpaper. Somebody comes comes in and go, Oh, have you seen the blue wallpaper? I go, what do you mean? It's just green wallpaper, so that's all it is. Unless you expose yourself to a different sphere of thought, you cannot operate in a different way. So if you if you grow in a in a sphere that has one type of paradigm of consciousness, you're locked into it. And I find it interesting you're talking about um uh energies that lock conventional medicine into the way it is. I mean, you we talked a little bit about the Flexner report a few episodes back. Now what people don't understand is that um Rockefeller who star who instigated that report, his I think it was his father or grandfather, was actually called um Devil Bill, Devil Rockefeller, right? And his name was actually renamed himself Bill Livingston. The reason why he renamed himself because he'd raped someone and he was traveling around the country and he was selling snake oil. Yes, this is coming back. I'd forgotten this actually, right? Yeah, he was selling snake oil. Now, snake oil originated with the Chinese workers that went to America for the railways to help with the railways, and it was true, it was a true medicament that worked. But people like Devil Bill, they just added all the stuff that they wanted, and that's where the term quackery started. Yeah, which is derived from a Dutch word quacksalver, which means shouting about shouting about something that you you say is good for someone, right? Falsely. So it's interesting that modern medicine is deriving itself from something from a quack, selling snake oil, yeah. Selling snake oil. And you know he it that guy actually was pretty mean to his kids, and he he was he was quite open about it. So he trained them to be mean people, right? So it means that that intention is not coming from a uh a forward thinking uh spiritual direction, it's coming from a a reductionist profit-making mindset. And it's still in there.

SPEAKER_02 33:09

Well well, of course it's in there because um you know, depending on how far anyone wants to go, uh, but it's coming, it's it's gone, but it's not just still in there, sorry to interrupt you.

SPEAKER_00 33:20

Not all. It's uh it's become more obvious a problem. So if you look at how many disease-name diseases there were 50 years ago compared to now, what more do you need? Oh, we've got a new disease. All right, well, we'd better make a drug for that.

SPEAKER_02 33:41

Well, there's a weaveritis that came in this year, terrible condition. But unfortunately, there's two now two remedies.

SPEAKER_00 33:51

Just two. Well well, weavacetamol, and you know, if you if you Yeah, but I'm sure we probably need to we need to do some some other work on the gene the gene level. I'm sure we have to do that for this.

SPEAKER_02 34:04

Okay, but listen, let's keep along this as much as I want to go down that. Um excuse me for coughing today.

SPEAKER_00 34:12

Um so we we're constantly moving into materialism. Everything always gets reduction, reduced down into materialism, materialism. Well, it loses a spiritual nature.

SPEAKER_02 34:25

Let's look at that, you know, more more seriously, because you know, the the as you well know and I well know, which is how we operate, um, because we understand this as a as a fundamental law. Your intentions are very, very important. You know, when you begin so I I when I when I work with clients, I talk about energetic contracts that most of them are in, and so I'm showing them uh these sort of tentacles of energy connected to them and whatever they're they're um contracted with. Not that they understood it as a contract until we start looking at it, but you know, it's it's unsaid agreements or whatever, even jobs, they're energetic contracts. And so a lot of the time I'm helping people to literally disconnect from those and and become very conscious of what decisions they make going forward, because they're setting up an energetic contract. And when we look at the energetic contracts of um quote unquote modern medicine, from at least from the Flexner report days, the intentions were clearly a business model. And it it has been, and this is really good, right? Because when your intentions are not honorable, eventually it's going to the the the weight of its deception, if you like, are going to implode upon it, which is what I clearly see are happening in medicine, and therefore they're going to have to evolve whether they like it or not. Well, define that, Jeremy. What do you mean? Well, the intentions was a business model. So if it's a business model, it needs clients to buy their products, which are whatever drug or treatment that have been created or developed or in the works. So, how do you make human beings sick? Well, I've said this over and again in all my years of broadcasting. You educate them stupid, right? And so there's been a very concerted um effort over the last hundred years to flip all that wonderful knowledge that we had on, you know, who are we, how do we, how are we meant to live, what are we meant to eat, and so on and so forth. It's all been flipped so that we're doing the opposite. So we're in dis-ase. We don't, we're the only animal that doesn't know what to eat. 90% of people in the Western world hardly ever go outside. They're in front of electronics constantly. They're not eating even food, they're eating feed. Um, their uh emotional uh well-being is absolutely shot, and it's stimulated by dopamine shots on Facebook and Instagram and TikTok and God knows what else. So everything's been turned upside down, and so what you get are very sick people, and then you label those um lots of different names and syndromes and conditions, and now you've got a growing business. Now, where we're at, particularly since we the night, I mean con COVID 19 um you know, times, is they've been so successful, those behind, you know, um holding up this energy, you know, because I accept many of the doctors, even the egotistical ones, don't know what they're in, but they've been so successful at creating sick human beings, you know, very, very sick human beings, that the system literally cannot cope. And the doctors and nurses aren't coping, they're leaving. It's called quiet quitting, right? There's lots of good doctors and nurses, and and I would argue, very questionable, morally at least, um, doctors and nurses coming in where it is just a job. And I've heard too many times the bad treatments from bad nurses that are now coming in. They're not like the old nurses. And I'm sure many of my listeners go will be nodding their head going, thank God, someone's saying it, but they're just not. So they're at implosion. When we talked about that business model in one of the episodes, if you look at it from that, they are oversaturated with clients and they cannot service them. They certainly cannot service them well. And so it can only implode and and um dissolve what confidence is still remaining. And that's why I think it's a very good time we're in. And it's even though there's so much suffering, and it's a real opportunity that these kind of podcasts reach more and more people. Because if you're a doctor, a nurse, or a pharmacist, or even you know, I've had administrative people in hospitals work with me, and they're the same. That it's changed, it's it's darker, they don't like what it is and what it's becoming. This is the opportunity to connect with these kind of energies that Gareth and I are talking about, because you know, the future of medicine for me pumps my nets. You know, it's not just getting people well, and we've got a huge problem because how do you take, how do you walk into a modern hospital now with all the disease that is caused by living upside down and wrong and turn that with it's a huge task. I'm not stupid. But what pumps my gats is the university and the conferences and the learning and the conversations that have now really escalated those energies of potential. I can't wait for you and I, and it will happen. We're a conference with tribal people, with rogue scientists, with citizen scientists, with mothers that have worked out what autism was and made huge inroads in the I want all of those people, as well as doctors bringing what we call their baby, the good, the good things, the naturopaths, the herbalists, and bring it all together in a spirit, spirit that is well, what's works and why. That pounds my ass.

SPEAKER_00 40:33

Yeah, I mean, uh that I to me that's uh um such an obvious way to go. I mean, but you know, like like yourself, we've we've obviously um got a driving force in us that uh pushes us in a direction that is you know do no harm. How do you how do you um uh get somebody to change something in their life or in their diet or in their behavior, thinking whatever that that propels them to having a better life, right? Um the difficulty I think um apart from the people who leave in the system and looking for that more is that there's a there's a there's a lack of education. There's a there's I remember as a kid growing up, I was educated at school about certain things, be it uh whether the the healthcare incentives are good or not, somebody came and educated, right? You don't get any education about health anymore when you're young. In fact, you're pushed into an unhealthy state constantly. I mean, I I I I always find it amazing when I go into a massive um uh superstore, you know, you go shop food shopping or whatever, and I look at it and I think, wow, a massive warehouse like this with all its food in, I could probably condense all the decent food into two aisles.

SPEAKER_02 42:12

Exactly. It's certainly not a supermarket, right? It's it's a super psychology manipulation market.

SPEAKER_00 42:19

Yeah, so that whole let's say 100% of the stuff in there that you can consume, five percent of it is actually not gonna poison you. Yeah. That intent has to completely change. Yeah. And the problem is that we've built systems up dependent now on the sh the shit food.

SPEAKER_02 42:42

Yeah. Right? Well, but that's why in the red pill food revolution we didn't call it food, but we defined food and feed, it's feed.

SPEAKER_00 42:49

Yeah, but the the issue is this you've got people have their jobs tied up in it, right? Insurance companies have their stuff tied up in it. Or so I I always I always have this thought, right? You know, when um uh people become so fixed within their own reality that they don't they don't consider things. So for example, this pen, right? And for viewers, yeah, Gareth is holding a pen. I'm holding the pen, right?

SPEAKER_02 43:22

Yeah, we're on we're on we're on audio, we're on podcast, mate. Just remember that, Smashy. So this pen. Pen tabular, mate.

SPEAKER_00 43:31

Because I sorry, sorry, fact it means it the pen. Obviously, um when I use it to write, right? Now, this pen, I've gone out to get it, obviously, and from I bought it from a shop. I had to get on a on a a train when I was in London. That train had to be driven by someone. That person driving that had to be fed by someone. That person who fed the do you see what I mean? It's so it's you've got this constant in. We're all dependent on each other. And the problem is that we have these systems that are unhealthy. They are so locked into the our finance and our behavioral systems that somebody has to start to change it and just progressively change it. Otherwise, what's going to happen is it's not it's not sustainable from a health point of view, and it will just collapse at some point. So people have to then say, right, well, how do we do that? Well, for one, you have to be less less greedy. You say to yourself, right, how do I change this into something that is less dependent on all of this?

SPEAKER_02 44:46

Are you suggesting less is more? I am. Then surely more is more. Sorry, that's from Fraser.

SPEAKER_00 44:56

This is the problem we have though, is that everything is so entwined within the the fun the idea of our financial survival, right? But we have we've got solutions.

SPEAKER_02 45:09

Of course we do, yeah. Yeah, but it is so logical. Um okay, let's let's let's you know jump off of that. So you you talk about education, which which obviously you know goes straight back to what I was saying. It isn't an it's arguably not an education. You know, my number one fan's grandchild, you know, recently, you know, took it to task over you know viruses where where I'm very happy to see that um it may not be on your social media, but the the um proper conversation of whether viral science is science and concluded and whether viruses exist, hence why I said the Weaver 19, no one's ever seen it or caught it, you know, you know, is is now gaining momentum. But but in school, of course, viruses, it's it's settled science. Um meat is to be, you know, shunned upon, lots of just one second, lots of vegetables are to be, you know, blah, blah. And it sounds like a lot of good sense. Why? Because of TV, the telelive vision. Now, why do I bring that in? I watch Frasier the entire season, you know, um, every year and laugh like it's the first time I've ever watched it. Now, this year, right? So this year, and Natalie will watch it with me and laugh, but she's normally doing something else at the same time, right? But she still laughs. But I just can't, you know, every year I think I'll watch it the rest of my life. But this year, I decided to watch the background rather than as an because I know TV has been subliminally manipulating people beyond most people's cover. Anyway, I decided to watch the background and and pin my ear more to what they're saying. And the two things, uh, Frasier was what, 1985, it first started, ran to about 95, so you know, 20 odd years, I think, right, ago. So I'm watching the background, and in particular when they're when they're in um the coffee shop that they always visit, if you don't know, Frasier, just about every other episode, there are transvest transvestites, obviously transvestites in the background that you wouldn't usually pick up on. Which is kind of interesting if you think about the last 20 years of or 10 years of how quickly woke came in. The second thing is, um, particularly with comment, probably every other episode, they will make a derogatory comment about meat and fat and and then talk about high brand. You know, it would always be, oh, you know, I'll call the doctor because you're gonna, you know, anyway, there's some reference to heart attack or it's bad for your health. Now, people go, okay, well, yeah, and it's really, really significant because you talk about education, right? Most people think school or what this stuff. No, your head has been constantly, and I'm gonna do one more thing before I hand back to you, constantly being programmed without your conscious knowledge for as long as you've lived. So most of your thoughts are probably not even yours. And I'll give you one more example, right? And this is this is particularly important. Um, you do you know about Pavlov's dogs? You you may or may not remember. For those who don't, Pavlov was a Russian scientist, I believe. He wanted to know if he could manipulate the autonomic nervous system, i.e., your subconscious, the uh what's running your your bodily functions without thought. And he wanted to know if he could manipulate them. And so if he took these German shepherds, and every time he fed them, he rang a bell. Right? Big deal. But after a very short period of time, I think it was eight weeks, something like that, if he rang the bell, the the German shepherds would start salivating. And this is proof that he has manipulated an autonomic nervous response. Okay. Big deal, people might be thinking, but listen to this. Oh, Big Mac. Exactly. You know, and and and if anybody is listening that hasn't thought of McDonald's, and it doesn't, even if you go, oh, but I don't like McDonald's, I'm not gonna eat McDonald's, the point is this it's triggered and in your mind or consciousness. And that's just one example, right? So when we talk about education and the ego and and people fighting in you know, conversations like this rather than engaging in a in a positive, you know, non-combatant way to find the truth and find a way, most of us don't realize that our behavior from eating to thinking to what have you has been very well crafted by others.

SPEAKER_00 50:16

Yeah, I mean, I I would take that a little bit further. And if I look uh if I look at it from my own um uh life, right? My future depends on how I think now. Right? So the the decisions I make now develop my future. The thoughts that I have now are influenced by how I've been influenced in the past, either through family, society, nation, TV, radio, whatever you're exposed to through thought and imagery affects how you think. So it's not difficult to engineer people to think a certain way. And if you engineer it enough, you put those patterns deep in the unconscious mind. When those people have children, the children's unconscious minds are connected to the the parents' unconscious mind, so they automatically take on some of those patterns before they're even born. They start to do that. So if you are of the mind that you want to continue feeding off humanity in a certain way, it's not difficult to program the majority of people to behave in a certain way that keeps you in the life you want it to be. And you're right. Lots of people walk around, they assume they're having their own thoughts and they're not. There actually are people around that don't realise they think or what that is. Right? So they think that life is just a chance thing, there's no meaning to it, that all there is is a physical reality of going, eating food, getting work, getting money, getting material things, right? But you know as well as I do that comfort, unless you're born of that type of character where material stuff nurtures you in some way, right? And some people it does. Um it's not enough for people. Yeah. And I think what happens is that um, especially now with with the advent of, you know, I go when I go to work and I'm one of them myself, while I'm on the train, everyone's looking at their phone. Yeah, they're they're not they're not in the reality that's going on around them, they're in an altered reality constantly. And unbeknown to them, or be known, some people are aware of it, their thoughts are getting manipulated, and that's impacting on the unconscious. Now, there's a great book called The Power of the Unconscious Mind, written by um I think he's a priest actually, Father Joseph Murphy, right? And he outlines how whatever you impact on the unconscious mind, if you want to create the reality, you have to change your thoughts so your unconscious then takes it on, and then that shapes the reality around you. So if you're aware of all that, you can say to yourself, right, all those people over there are unaware, let's feed this thought down the phone, and then they'll want to buy this, or they'll want to buy that, or they'll want to act against this type of person or that type of person. If we want to create um division, we can do that, and all all they need is a a medium to feed that through people, and now they have that. And when I say they, what the people I mean are not everyone in the tech world, or not everyone with lots of money and power, but there are people who have lots of influence and power who are completely aware of what they're doing. Yeah, right. Now, I'm gonna call that for what it is, right? It's evil.

SPEAKER_02 54:44

It is. Which interestingly is to live backwards, the word live backwards.

SPEAKER_00 54:48

And I don't want to give it too much, you know, and people might say, oh, well, what is that? All right, let's describe it to you. Rather than you see in, you know, the the battle between heaven and hell, maybe see it as an involuted, non-evolving energy that wants to hold humanity back from being free of most of its suffering, and it actually wants humanity to suffer so it can feed on that. Right? I agree. That's an involution, an involutary energy. And unfortunately, because human beings, I believe most human beings are of a decent nature, I really believe that. I do, and and I believe most human beings are are wanting to help, and wanting to believe that most all humanity is okay, but it's not the case, you know, and it's like well, I come back to what I was talking about earlier. It doesn't matter what industry you're in, whether it's medicine, finance, law, you will always get some characters who want to involute humanity.

SPEAKER_02 55:57

Yeah, uh we actually I couldn't agree with you more, and and so do many of the ancient philosophy cultures, you know, the agnostics spoke about a parasitical energy that was here that feeds off negativity and suffering and the like. Um but I I think this also why I say evil is the word live backwards, because you say involuted. When when you and we talk about evidence, when you stand back and and potentially you know put your ego to one side if it's preventing you from looking at things this way, and you do look at um mankind, we have been involuted, we have been manipulated. Um, there is extreme efforts to control how we think and how we move and what we believe. And you know, pretty much everything that you look at that's put out on the telele vision from the climate hoax, which I I saw today, and it's what October 21st. Something like 1,400 scientists, I think it's in Norway, had a conference, you know, and they put out either a declaration or a statement of the real science. And and and you know, that there is no climate uh crisis, not not in the way that people have been told. But pick any subject that's out there in the news and normally flip it, and and the opposite is close to the truth. But you know, that is a prime example of trying to control um the thought and uh influence people's behavior and where we go. And you know, I am extremely confident, you know, because of the time of Aquarius, because there's more light, because this great awakening that's spoken about that I see with my own eyes. And what is the great awakening after all? All it really is, is light being shed on things you previously couldn't see, you know, or or wouldn't see. And now you're seeing them and having conversations. Well, what are what are words? Words are just thoughts, you know, put into a you know more denser vibration. Thought is arguably a more subtle vibration. And so no matter which way you look at it, if you listen to this going, well, a couple of whack uncracked crackheads, right? You know, you know, excuse me. Talking about we in the fish and shit. Anyway, but it if you're if you're listening to it like that, when you start considering the the the knowledge that no art no army can defeat a thought that's come its time, not only is the thought form here, and I would argue it's come from out there through us, not not from us, but we're picking up on that energy. Um, the conversations are happening, the podcasts that are happening, the conversations that are happening, the Facebook posts that are happening is extraordinary. And so that energy uh is is growing because it's it's cyclical. People are connecting with it, you know, looking at it, you know, it's resonating. This is the harmonic side, and it's growing, you know. And so what why that why is that important? It's not about we're right, you're wrong. No, no, no, no, no. It's not that, right? It's about you know accepting these cycles. And and anything, I believe, anything that was not light. So I never say to people you've done the right thing. I say you've done the light thing, right? Anything that's not of the light going forward into this time, it just is going to require so much energy to hold it up, and it will fail. So it is wiser to be open to consider that it's not right. And I'm not saying it's all wrong, whatever subject we're talking about, but that we need to be connecting to these higher realms, these deeper thought vibrations and patterns, so that, you know, as Gareth has shown, the physical manifestations, I mean, my view of a hospital in Gareth is, I mean, so different to what you walk into now. You wouldn't want to leave it. It's so beautiful, and beautiful work is being done. But it's a very exciting time. Um, and I hope you're you're very much enjoying as we come to wrap up this episode uh of today's conversation.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:28

Was he I mean, wasn't it wasn't the doesn't hospital relate to hospitality?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:33

Yeah, exactly. It actually stems I I'll have to reject my history, but I think it stems back um to uh one of the wars um uh and and all the homeless, something like that. I have to go reject my history.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:48

Hospital is or something like that, isn't it?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:50

Yeah, well, they'd separate them. You'd you'd have I again I have to go recheck it, so I'm gonna get this wrong, so forgive me. But it's something like there were two separations, right? There was the hospital hospitable ward, and ward is illegal. When you go into a ward, you're you know, ward of the government or ward of somebody else, right? It's a very interesting word, ward. That's why you don't want to be in one if you can avoid it. But you had like the surgery side of it, or as brutal as it may or may not have been, and then you had the sort of hospital, hospitality where you're recuperating and were brought off the streets, but it's been and it, you know, most of the hospitals in America have been built either by the Catholic Church or by the Seventh-day Adventists. Um, I think that's correct. You know, so religion is is ironically very much behind um the building of hospitals and and modern day um the horrors that they I think those places. I'm look, I told you last time, in go and walk into any hospital right now, forget the patients for now, just look at the stuff, right? Just look at them properly, right? If you can, I had to walk into one in a day because Ryan had to go and register so he could get some paperwork done. And we walked into this reception, and everybody looks dead behind the eyes. Yeah, there's no joy, yeah. No, and you know, apart from the electronic nightmare and artificial light, you know, I had to walk straight out, right? But you know, it you know, I wrote um uh a paper, a project manual called the Naturally Better World Health Project, which I need to update about 10 years ago, and the hospitals of the future will be beautiful, but not only will they be beautiful, you know, there'll be animals and all kinds of things that you can interact with, you know, almost like five-star hotel, right? We'll pay people who are just naturally inclined to want to sit with people and talk with them and listen, right? But in as this unfolds and plays out, what we're what we're involved with is it's gonna be generations to change that thought into reality where we're once again back on track and following, honoring, I would use, rather than following the natural laws. There are natural laws. You know, cows can't eat animal products or they get sick, right? Or they might eat the occasional mouse or bird running by, but basically they're meant to eat grass, right? You know, lions are meant to eat meat, right? And if you defer from that, they get sick. If you take them, very interesting study, and I don't want to go on because it's getting the end of our hour, very interesting study in Russia. Russians do a lot of great stuff. Um, that that they uh measured the calcium in the eggshells of chickens that were in uh uh artificial light and natural light, right? Yeah, and and the calcium was was very significant in sorry, without feeding them any calcium. That's very important. And so people, oh, it's taking it from their bones. No, they measured their bone density very accurately as well. It wasn't. They were at the the chickens in the light, and and Barbara Wren, you know, God bless her, was actually talking about this 30 years ago, right? They were transmuting, they were all right, they were doing it at an atomic level, they were seemingly, this is the what they're proposing, the theory, that the the calcium didn't come from the bones, it wasn't in the diet of the outdoor chickens, i.e., exposed to natural light. They somehow transmuted what they had to collect and attached to this to make calcium. But the chickens in artificial light couldn't and significantly lower, right? So when you extrapolate that to modern man, which is why when I do in public, I'll go, get your ass outside. When I do any of my little mini vlogs, get your ass outside is my catchphrase, right? We we are so offended, natural laws, because we were manipulated there, that when that changes, everything will change. And we, you know what? If parliament still exists, and parliament's the French word, parlay, parler vous pensez, you know, parlay to speak, mot is the verb to lie. So parliament literally means to speak lights, but of course that's nonsense. Everybody knows politicians speak nothing but the truth, the whole truth. So help me say, I mean God, right? But you know, if parliament still exists, you know, people that the the uh um politicians, whatever they are, members of parliament, will stand up, the health secretary, which is a joke right now, but the health secretary will stand up and say how few people we've treated this year. And there'll be a round of applause. Now, I'm gonna finish here, and I've got one other thing to say before you close, and I've got one other thing to say. How do you make money from that? Well, just for argument's sake, if we're spending a trillion pounds or dollars a year, which is much more than that on healthcare, and we reduce even by 20%. I reckon we can reduce by 80% over a certain period of time. The the amount of people who are actually sick and need help, you've got all this remaining money to pay those people that work in it who practice properly. Broccoli, a fortune. And guess what, Gareth? They won't work 60, 80, 100 hours a week. They'll work 20 or 30 and have time off to explore their music. By the way, Gareth's a wonderful musician. I love it when he plays the guitar. But they can explore other things of their humanity. Now, you see, you're grinning because we're, you know, we're on radio, smashy, you know, or podcast, mate. You know, and so you can't see him grinning, but we're both grinning. Because bottom line, and close here before my final outage, we are not human doings. We're human beings. And we have been forced and manipulated and coerced and educated into being human doings. And that is the balance. I want to do things, you want to do things. But that energy is very different from I have to go to work, I have to earn money, I have to get on this frickin' train and go into Londonian. Right? Over to you, Smashy.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:00

Yeah, I mean, I for me, because I I you know I I I really do value the uh the relationship that you have with another person when when you when you're attempting to help them find a way through what they're going through. Yeah. Um that that is a sacred you talk about contracts, that's a sacred contract. It is. You know. They are there are different sort of types of contracts that human beings have with each other. Uh some of them can be karmic ones that can be both positive and negative. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:35

I was gonna say that they don't always mostly then well, but not always.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:39

It's not always, no. I mean, they usually end up with massive lessons, you know? Yeah. But there's definitely there are definitely um sacred contracts that should be between um a practitioner of any health forward, you know, um discipline and the person that they're they're um assisting in finding a way through whatever they're going through, you know. Yeah. And it should be a learning process for both all concerned, really.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:08

Well, a human interaction. Yeah. Yeah. As opposed to a chap standing behind a computer typing in the street.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:15

Because I I mean up uh not so much in in dental side, you know, side of the work I do, but definitely in the healing side of things, you draw to you the the people that need you know you need to learn. They teach you, huh?

SPEAKER_02 1:08:30

Well, you know, especially, you know, and by the way, Gareth is just a wonderful dentist, and I've had dental conversations with you in the chair, and they go something like this. You say, you know, how are you doing?

SPEAKER_01 1:08:42

And I go, is that hurt? Well so these are the dental conversations because my mouth's wide open, and why dentists talk to you? They all do it, right? You know, you're right there.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:54

How do you the but I got you're the only patient that I go to the pub with after that?

unknown 1:08:59

Shh. Shh.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:00

Oh, we we have a local that we can't divulge, but it's one of the oldest pubs in London. And we love it. I'm gonna I'm gonna close that here. We love it because when we go in there um for the two-point buzz, although, you know, truth be told, we've got the four regularly. Um then we go and have a collie or something like that. But um, we can feel the peace, the the spirits that have come you know, conversed and conspired in this pub, you know. Um, we can just imagine that we certainly energetically fit right into it, you know. Uh, and in fact, we do have an idea for a podcast called Yell Black Sheep, uh, which hopefully will will manifest. But anyway, it's a fantastic pub. But anyway, we're gonna I thank you for this conversation. We're gonna close out here. But before we go, and I'll closing, we do have a message from our sponsor.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:56

Oh yeah, go on.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:57

We do. Okay, so our sponsor hang on, hang on. This episode today has been sponsored by Weaver Cetimal. Weaver you be in pain, weaver you be inflamed, weaver the answer. Doctors know more.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:21

See you next week.