The Doctors No More Podcast; Episode 8: Food, Faith, And The Fight To Heal

Food might be the most explosive topic we could pick and we go straight for the fuse. We start with a simple question, why do we eat and quickly uncover how stress, intention, and environment dictate whether any diet can actually heal. From hunters who ate with reverence and rest to modern meals grabbed under blue light, we map how the nervous system flips between fight or flight and rest and digest, and why that switch may matter more than macros.

We look at meat versus plants without the usual tribal noise, recognising that everything alive carries consciousness; animals, plants and even water. Blessing food, cooking with love, and eating with others sound quaint, yet they shift physiology in measurable ways. Alongside that, we dig into the microbiome as the bridge between science and spirit: the oral-gut-brain axis, the role of ancient bacterial strains, feast and pause rhythms, and why constant snacking keeps your inner ecosystem off-balance. Diversity, dirt, and time turn out to be underrated medicine.

You’ll hear why some thrive on carnivore or keto while others improve on plant heavy plates and why both can fail under chronic stress, EMF-heavy environments, poor light, or unresolved grief. We connect Chinese organ wisdom and chakra models to modern vagus nerve science, showing how identity and emotion live in the gut. The practical takeaway is clear: eat in safety, not in a sprint; personalise without ego; rebuild microbial diversity; and let purpose, relationships, and nature feed you as surely as your plate does.

If you’re ready to rethink “healthy eating” from the nervous system up and trade diet wars for deeper nourishment, press play. Then share your thoughts, subscribe for more, and leave a review with the one habit that most transformed your health.

Transcript

Tempo: 60.0

SPEAKER_00 1:22

You're muted.

SPEAKER_03 1:29

Well, now I've actually unmuted my microphone. Um we can start episode the magical episode eight that we've reached to of Doctors No More That's NO. If this is the first time you've caught us, please catch up with all the others. There's some kind of loose theme running through all of them. Um but but you know, we have set this whole podcast up with my my very good friend Doc Thomas to be able to go off in tangents and um to explore all you know all different areas of um discussion and perceived knowledge and wisdom to do with health and disease. And the the core and foundation really of this podcast is patterns and harmonics and bringing it into the real world in a sort of non-woo way with some bad humour here and there, if you've been watching or listening rather. Um you certainly have experienced some of that. But today, uh, my my wonderful Welsh friend, I want to bring up possibly the most controversial subject of all time. So controversial that um, you know, Barbara Red, the wonderful Barbara Redd, and you know, my second mentor, um, you know, once said to me, or the class or what have you, that you know, if you if you want to go bankrupt, try and change what people eat. And that's what I want to talk about today. Food. The controversial subject of food.

SPEAKER_00 2:53

That's interesting. I just realized that's uh one area where we have a mentor in common, isn't it? It is. I just realized that. Yeah, no, it's important because she she taught me for a year and I got some of her wisdom.

SPEAKER_03 3:10

I taught you for a year. Yeah. Not that you were listening, you were just giggling in the back with Nina.

SPEAKER_00 3:18

We were the best students there.

SPEAKER_03 3:20

Yes, of course you were. You you you you you keep in that um that dream that fantasy. No, you were fantastic. But no, seriously, um I I want to talk about I'm gonna say it's food, and people are, oh god, I keep it. You know, I I can't think of a more controversial subject. You know, when when I've done other podcasts um as a guest, and certainly in my private membership and to and my one-to-one consultations, you know, I'm I'm quite well known for saying, we're the only animal that doesn't know what to eat, right? And and um, you know, it's true, you know, you you don't see a cow, you know, wandering around a field going, you know, bugger me, that squirrel looks tasty, you know, and and equally you don't see a lion going, that grass over there looks a little bit greener, and uh, I think I'll go and have a munch, you know, other than when they want to cause themselves to vomit or something like dogs do, or get some bacteria or something. But we are the only animal that doesn't know what to eat. And and there's so many things I want to talk about with you. You know, from from where have we actually evolved to and what are we designed to eat to what is food? And equally, you know, the the different trends of eating from you know carnivore, which which I can't deny, I have seen so many people do tremendously well at the physical level and and the mental emotional actually, on carnivore to keto to frugivore, to you know, vegan to raw vegan to vegetarian. But you know, I I I want to explore far deeper into this because there isn't actually other people on the planet other than uh you know the Maasai and um the Inuits, which which uh um you know haven't got much options out there in the in the the cold tundra that they uh live and search for food upon. But you know, there aren't really carnivores, or for that matter, really you know, vegans and vegetarians around the world per se. Well, there are there is Indians, I'll correct myself on that. But I want to go into all those sort of aspects with you about what is food and what is the proper diet for a human being and what is a human being.

SPEAKER_00 5:52

I mean, I think you have to start with why why do we eat? That's a good question. Why do we eat? We eat so that we can um acquire energy to live, surely. That's one reason. It's a survival thing a lot of a lot of the time. If our ancestors didn't eat, we wouldn't be here. So we're born of the physical plane and we are physical matter. If we don't replenish that somehow, then our cells are constantly replicating, it needs energy to replicate. So we have to feed that process somehow. So the question is why do we eat? Do we eat purely to survive? Do we eat for enjoyment? Do we eat um because it's in our nature? Because it I always think it's interesting that I I um the one of the courses I I teach, I had a diet uh a dietary person on there, nutritionist, and they were talking about you know what's the right food, what are the right minerals, and I asked this question, I said, when did we turn into uh human beings that at you know breakfast, lunch, yeah, sometimes tea at dinner, supper. When did that uh you know, is that a natural cycle? Now if you look at you talking about uh Inuit people, yeah. They eat when they catch things. So their their cycle of eating is tied purely into survival. You know, I'm sure they they you know that when they go out, they okay, they might you know freeze stuff and store it for a certain period, but they are very much tuned into the natural world through their need to catch something and eat it to survive.

SPEAKER_03 8:09

Yeah, and it's a very real survival, you know. The the rigors of the environment that they uh enjoy, you know, you know, back to sort of 3D science is burning enormous amounts of calories to keep warm. And if they don't eat, they will wither away, you know, very quickly. And of course, their diet matches their environment. They they're eating a lot of blubber and a lot of fish and a lot of fat, um, you know, calorifically very high and able to consume more calories and burn more and what have you. So, you know, you can you can see that they're sort of matched to the environment. Not that I think that is the environment that they should have ever been in. I don't think we're naturally suited to that. So there's so many questions on this. I mean, I I speak about the Aborigines um frequently, you know, the ones that haven't really integrated with what they call the fake world and are still sort of out there in the tribes and in the bush. You know, and there's there's quite a lot of documents and photographs of of them in through generations. It's it's quite natural for them to hunt, because I do believe we're hunters and gatherers, catch something and then they gorge on it, and you there's these wonderful photographs of them with these almost pregnant bellies in the men, because they've just eaten enormous amounts of food. And then it is quite natural for them to go off, you know, for three, four, five days and and not eat again, right? You you bringing up breakfast, lunch, and dinner, you know.

SPEAKER_00 9:45

Yeah, I think also, I mean, if you if you're if you've gone out and you've hunted and you've caught um an animal that's gonna feed you and your family, I think your um your reverence for that creature is gonna be different as well. Yes. You know, completely different to when you whether you go into a supermarket and just buy it, and you don't see the whole process. So the the the whole process of of um feeding is right, we need to eat, I'm hungry. The the community gathers, whoever the hunters are go out, uh they look for something, if they find it, they kill it, they bring it back. So the whole process of food is very different, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 10:32

It's it's very different, and and you know, it this is this is exactly the tangents I want to go off on because um because it brings in spirituality and God and all kinds of things, because one could argue excuse me, what kind of God, what kind of creator would create a realm where to survive we have to go out and and end the life of a of another animal, albeit in the hunting sense at the moment, rather than an abattoir or anything controlled like that. Go out and end the life of another animal to get sustenance for us to carry forward. And this, of course, is where the arguments come in strongly from the vegan and the fruit fruitarians. And you know, I haven't brought in the Bretarians, so that's another conversation that is still relative, but um, we'll leave the Bretarians out for right now. But they come in and say, well, you know, you know, the fruits and the vegetables are you know provided. Certainly, I would argue fruits are designed to be eaten, whether they be designed to be eaten by humans, but they're only around in a seasonal sense. And if you're living in you know, Newcastle or you know, somewhere northerly in the winter, you know, good luck finding any vegetables or um fruits. So so the point being is you know, it it brings in all levels of conversation of why you you're right, why do we eat, you know, and what are we designed to eat? And is it spiritual? Because I know the Aborigines say a prayer or or thank the animal before they find it, because they know it's gonna yield itself, is life and death, which is what I've come to realize is just part of the cycle because there is no death, there's just transmutation into the other side. You know, what does it all mean? It's it you see how in-depth it gets. But I believe if we start this kind of conversation, we are more likely to get to the better answers. Because what's I'm sorry I'm rambling on here, but the other thing which is important to me in this conversation is, you know, have we evolved? Because the argument, you know, certainly in the new age camp, is, you know, to to to you know, um, what's the word? Um, I can't think of the word, uh, it's not evolve, but to um, I can't think of the word right now, but ascend, that's it. Thank you. Thank you forever put that in my brain. To ascend into the new spiritual world, you know, we we must abandon, you know, flesh, you know, eating flesh and what have you. And yet the argument that I'm seeing in real life of people becoming far more spiritual and happy and grounded are those that are eating meat. In fact, most vegans and frugivores I've eaten are very angry, unhappy people. And I know it's gonna upset people listening, but that's what I that's been my experience. So it's a deep conversation of but you know, where does where what what's spiritual? Yeah, why?

SPEAKER_00 13:41

I mean, if you if you if you want to take it into the the realm of spirituality and energy, everything has an energy behind it. It's created, right? So the the mineral kingdom has uh energies, spiritual energies that are behind or create the mineral kingdom. So do so do plants and flowers. You know, our ancestors would have called them like uh elementals, which are uh living energetic beings. So the idea that you don't affect anything when you eat plants, or you know, you do. Yeah, you know, there's an argument that plants are living beings and they have a living energy behind them. Everything does.

SPEAKER_03 14:27

Well, what was that author? I'm I can't remember his name. Um I think he did the secret life of plants and he put the lie detector um onto the leaves of plants. Do you know who I'm talking about? And then uh he would he would um sort of stress the plant, and the lie detector would just go, you know, bananas, and and interestingly, he would take a leaf into another room and do something to the leaf, and the plant would um uh the lie detector again would go off. He did all these experiments, you know, suggesting that there was a consciousness in plants, equally so um with trees, and he observed that uh, you know, the trees pulling their sap up during the winter from the branches and things, but he also observed that if you ask, if you're going to lock them and prune them or whatever the correct term is with trees, you know, if you you should ask them 24 hours beforehand, you know, and tell them what your intentions were. And they and he would observe, I don't know how it measured it, but he it would pull the sap uh you know out of those branches that were going to be um uh pruned or locked or what have you. And further, you know, they've reported plants screaming or what they put you know claim to be screaming. So, you know, back to you, it appears that all these things that we can define as living appear to have consciousness to the measure of what we can measure, you know, and so therefore, at this point in time of our evolution and understanding, it seems like everything that we choose to eat that can be defined as food, and we'll go on to what defined as food in a minute, perhaps, has consciousness and feelings and and it must die to nourish life.

SPEAKER_00 16:13

Yeah, that I mean I think that that's that's why whatever uh food you eat, uh it always tastes better the fresher it is, because it has that more um immediate link to the energies that create it. So when you're eating food, you're not just physically ingesting something, you're taking in the energy of the food, the energy behind it. Now I I would take that further because I I'm qualified as a backflower therapist, which is a very good one, you are. And um that's that's in relation to the energies behind flowers and the essences and how they impact on our thoughts and emotions. So the fact that they impact on our thoughts and emotions suggests that they're very strongly linked to the thought and emotional plane of consciousness. So everything has this live consciousness, and I think I mean, I I thought back when we were talking about um ancestral uh tribes going out hunting. I remember um uh there was this is many years ago. I was uh I was watching a program about how ancestral our ancestors went out hunting, and what they would do, so they caught a deer, when they they use every single part of that animal, yeah, they would place the skull of the animal in the tree in the area where they caught it. And every hunter agreed to do that so that they would know if there was too many skulls in the tree not to hunt in that area. Oh, okay. Yeah. I was wondering why they do that. So they they if if you went then you saw all those, you go, right, this has been, you know, hunted, let's let the animals not be hunted here because we'll we'll have uh less next year. Sustainable hunting. Exactly, yeah. And if you look at you know any any form of um ancestral art, the reverence they have for animals is deep. So much so that you know that it's I don't think they see themselves as separate from it. They see themselves as part of of nature, and that you know themselves and animals have a relationship. Yeah. And it's there's a reverence to her, spirituality to her. And I mean the idea that you know plants don't have a consciousness is not right. Everything has consciousness, otherwise it wouldn't be alive.

SPEAKER_03 18:53

It's it's interesting, you know, that you bring in um really it's the intentions of those, if we're talking about hunters, um, so their intentions are not to to harm or or or to or to cause harm, uh, even though they are uh you know arguably going to harm and take the lives of the animal. Their intentions are to honor the animal and to feed their family and their spirit. And it's it's it's interesting this thing because if you look at I'm not sure if it was Masilamoto work or somebody else's. Again, this is the you know the great Barbara Wren mentioned this many, many years ago. But when you bless water, so you put an intention into it, yeah. I think it is a moto, Masonoto, but when you bless water, these what this is specifically the surface tension changes. Okay, and and sort of Masonamoto's work, which if the listeners haven't you know uh come across him, is fascinating, where what you know he he's showing that water has memory, and of course every living thing has water, and it's argued, particularly by people like Victor Schueberger, that that water is alive, it is the actual living it's living consciousness. Absolutely, but but Masura Motu showed that and he and he he he would freeze crystals when uh different words or different intentions are sort of put upon them, and you'd get either chaotic or these are beautifully you know geo geometric shapes and uh impossible things.

SPEAKER_00 20:26

Always hexagonal.

SPEAKER_03 20:29

I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_00 20:30

Oh, you've spoken to me about the not the one I so if you if you look at snow when it freezes, it's hexagonal shape.

SPEAKER_03 20:36

It freezes. Didn't you tell me that's the the the shape of the universe or something like that?

SPEAKER_00 20:40

Yeah, the un you if you look at um universal consciousness and you know when you you you look beyond the physical, um everything is contained with it within a hexagonal um energetic grid. In this realm, anyway. Okay. All right, so so that's that's fascinating, but I just water and water is hexagonal, the inner structure of it. Right, so it's like good crystal, basically. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 21:07

It is definitely a liquid crystal, and certainly I see it as the biological hard drive for holding the message in the memory. And then this very much resonates with Barkflower, Bark's discoveries and things. But anyway, you know, if you take that and the intentions and and what have you, um you you you come to realize because you know, I you know, my position is I do accept, but even if listeners are unhappy with this, that the most success I've seen from a nutritional point of view has been carnivore or keto genetic done properly. But I want the whole point of this conversation is to go out further than that because there are many people I've seen that have not done well on it. And and you know, you have to start asking yourself why, and that's where I want to go. So when you When you look at the intentions of things, someone who makes food that loves cooking. I'm one of those, you're one of those, but that makes food that loves cooking and puts that love that it just tastes better. I would argue um nutrition is down to the soul level. I I would argue that there's more than just nutrients in your ability to digest and break down and absorb it. There's frequences and there's intentions in that. Now, um where I wanted to uh go with that is I love talking about the pasta granes, which is a YouTube channel, right? And why do I love talking about the pasta granes? I think the youngest is 90 or 94 or something like that, and the oldest is 106. And these wonderful Italian women are, you know, making lasagnas from scratch, you know, literally from scratch. Huge lasagnas and god knows what other dishes, dancing around a kitchen, you know, pulling the stuff out of the garden, what have you, dancing with their great-grandchildren, and they are clearly full of life, and they are clearly um living and and and as far from death as anyone could could measure. And yet on paper, in the 3D world of paper, um, they're doing everything wrong. Uh they're eating oxalate-rich um vegetables as if it's going out of fashion. They're eating grains and wheat and inflammatory. And yeah, I've I've seen them. They've got some gnarled hands here and there. But if you were 96 years old cooking a lasagna from scratch and dancing around, literally dancing around the kitchen with your great-grandchild, you're doing something right. So my point is, I use them as this sort of metric. Of course, I can hear the cynics. Well, if they were carnival lasagna and carnival, they'd probably be 120 and dancing around without the null fingers. And you might be right. You might be right. But, you know, I to any modern metric, if you're into the mid-90s with that brain and that spirit, it's got to be more than just food. And also one can argue that the food they're eating is nutritious. What what say you, Doc Thomas?

SPEAKER_00 24:30

Well, I mean, I I've briefly seen and looked at some of their stuff, and you can tell they're they're they're they're joyous, aren't they? Totally. They're just like they're really happy with what they're doing, they're joyous, and um I think that that's sometimes where people get um food wrong, especially if they're doing it for a health side, um, it's a help, you know, improving their health. Um, and not to say that it doesn't improve your health if you you have certain diets. And I mean, I've I remember being on a pretty strict diet for a year when I w was with Barbara Wren. Yeah. Um, which was you know long-grained brown rice. Short grain brown rice, long-grained brown rice, water, and and very little meat. Um, and I it I you know, I got into cooking vegetables, and um after a year of it, I felt unwell. I did, I just didn't feel like I was enjoying life. I felt this this is actually more restrictive um and disciplined that you know, I'm I'm just not enjoying life here. And I think that, you know, the the issues that came up for me in my my own self-healing was that it healed the body to a certain degree, but I had to find something that brought meaning to life. And you know, you have to search then of you know, it's not just food, you have to find a purpose, you have to find meaning, and then you know, you your your spirit or your joy feeds you in a different way, you know. But I I I remember um trying you know, strict diet, and I think that you know, I've probably come to the conclusion that any strict um uh diet that focuses on one type of eating, uh you know, obviously not just eating like say you you just drunk beer and then sweets for donut kebab, yeah. Yeah, but lovely something that's like natural from the natural world, you will get some form of self-feeling benefit from it, I'm sure. Um, the other thing that we we were talking about earlier that is is also an essential food is water. Yes. That is an essential food. You have to have water, or you dehydrate.

SPEAKER_02 27:01

Would you describe it as a food? I suppose you have to ingest it. So in that isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 27:05

All right. What is food? You know, well, you you're feeding yourself that water is essential for your life. What we call food is essential for your life. Having a purpose is essential for your life, having friendships is essential for your life, having community is essential. Do you see what I mean? Well, you're talking about nourishment. Yeah, we're co- we're constantly feeding ourselves, not just with food, we're feeding ourselves with what we take in from other people, their thoughts, their feelings, what we look at. We're constantly feeding ourselves, right? And we can feed ourselves things which are nurturing, or we can feed ourselves some things which aren't nurturing. And I think people get into this pattern where they think, okay, the answer is just food, and they get on a strict diet, and they get so far, and they forget that there's other aspects of life. You have to you have to you have to feed yourself with other things like higher higher ideals about yourself, maybe.

SPEAKER_03 28:14

See, I love this, and and as I I was hoping we'd get here because um in in I absolutely believe we are only ever dealing with dis ease. And and I'd break that word up and pause it, you know, when we're doing audio deliberately, and always write it with a dash between dis and ease, because that's what it is. And I have you know, the carnivores come to my group and come to me, you know, one-to-one that aren't doing well. And and and one of the cases, for example, that I had had been carnivore for two years with all manner of problems. I don't want to give way too much just in case you know they listen one day and go, that's me. But you know, um, all kinds of problems digestive that still um weren't resolving. Yes, um, you know, the argument is, you know, were you doing it properly? So the vegans always, oh, were you doing it properly? He was definitely doing it properly. But um he was um I've got to be careful how much I say or when it goes on a podcast, but his environment rather than his job, because it might give his environment that he worked in was a very stressful environment, full of EMF, full of artificial light, full of chemicals in the air, and you know, a very stressful job. The family life, um, they had quite a few children, and uh the reality financially was they probably couldn't afford one, and they had five. And the relationship at that time was I would say straight and not loving and supportive. And on top of that, there were um aspects of his life where he wanted to be more like his father. His father was quite accomplished in what his father was doing. Again, I'm deliberately keeping away from specific details, and he sort of yearned to be like his father, and I don't believe he was, I think he was sort of chasing you know his father's dream rather than his own. So there was all number of things in there, and this I am 100% certain was preventing him, even though two years he'd been strict carnivore. And I don't think strict vegan or strict frigivore, any any you know, mixture of those would have done it. Um, because we have to then revert or at least bring in the Chinese and and probably the Indian, but certainly the Chinese wisdom that the organs are not just physical. For example, the stomach, you know, is where you begin to digest things. And the amount of times I've had people with stomach issues that they'll actually use the word, oh, I just can't stomach that, you know, or or I watched my mother die of cancer, and uh, I'm thinking of one case specifically, and I just couldn't stomach it, you know, unless she had terrible stomach issues. The small intestine in Chinese medicine is where we digest information. And so we're in the we're in the age of inf well if we're called information because a lot of it's disinformation, misinformation, and just a lot of it's crap, but an information overload. So our small intestine is overburdened on trying to digest from the Chinese perspective information, what's good, and we absorb it into our water and you know, use it and what's shit. And I use that word specifically because you know the colon in Chinese medicine is you know, where the organ of grief. And that means not just letting go of, you know, someone has died and you're grieved. It's meant to let go of all that shit and that that doesn't serve you. And so when you bring those elements into it, and the case that I was just referring to, it's much easier to understand why he wasn't healing, quite the opposite, on a carnivore diet, because he's in the more etheric spiritual, emotional, mental, and actually you can bring science into this, because you know, there's two autonomic nervous states that people are more familiar with now. They've heard about the vagus nerve, vagus is Latin for wandering, the longest nerve in the body that that um you know controls your heart and your breathing and your digestion. Well, there's two states. Most have heard of fight and flight, which frankly, the Western world is permanently in fight or flight, whether they accept it or not. They're in a they call it stress or anxiety or worry or you know, or or they've built a career around it, they thrive on stress, you know, but nonetheless, they're in fight or flight. Now, in that autonomic state, the body physiologically does not want to be digesting food. It diverts blood away from the digestive tract to the muscles and the brain, ready to fight or flight. You know, and if you think about it, if you're sitting at home eating, you know, your favorite sandwich, you know, a bacon sandwich with a little bit of ketchup on it and lots of butter on, you know, not that I would consume anything like that, but I've heard it's good, right? But you're consuming, you know, the smells are wafting up, you've got a hot cup of tea. Oh, I love it. Anyway, imagine you're eating that and someone bursts the door open, kicks the door in, you know, and holding a machete and and and obviously it's not there to bring you good news. You you know, you don't go, oh, let me just finish my sandwich, you know, instantly, you know, the best sandwich in the world.

SPEAKER_00 33:36

Hang on. I thought you, I thought you were gonna say they burst in with a machete and you go, can you cut that in half, please?

SPEAKER_03 33:43

Well, you know, because you've got a loving wife, presumably it's already cut in half, right? So that would just be wrong, right? But nonetheless, you know, in that analogy, you know, how did we get here, right? Yes, we are professionals. But anyway, in that analogy, you know, instantly your hunger goes, right? And you are like, I've got to fight this guy or or run or whatever, and you're in fight or flight. Now that's what people are in most of the time. And so I very strongly argue, and I I tried to communicate this to the the wonderful Chiffur Clemens who I lectured with some years ago in Spain, but I I don't think she was um quite ready or willing yet. Maybe, maybe she is now to listen to it. But but who's a blood, by the way, who's a blood scientist and a brilliant blood scientist, and you know, um, although she's upset a few people who hasn't in this profession, but she's she's she's bloody brilliant, huh? Oh, she is, absolutely, she is. And and she she has shown, you know, that that um the leaky gut syndrome, they basically work around that. That that when you put this protocol, it heals the gut, and they do these blood tests to show whether it's actually healed. And when the gut heals, all the other things start to heal. So she is brilliant, and I give her a lot of credit for it. But nonetheless, I tried to suggest that those people that weren't doing well on her protocols um and were following what they had advised, which which perhaps she argued they weren't, but that I've spoken to them and they were, they were in fight or flight and couldn't digest the food. This is where I'm going with this, right? Now, conversely, um, because just physiologically, your system is like, no, I am not digesting food right now because I'm in fight or flight. That's the point for to make it. Conversely, you have rest and digest. And this is, I believe, from you know, all the members and the you know, tens of thousands of people that I've helped, most people are not ever, other than using artificial means such as alcohol and drugs and other means, potentially, but most people are never or rarely getting into rest and digest. Think of how we eat Gareth nowadays. Most people are eating on the go, you know, in between getting to work or school or, you know, and of course they're not even eating food very often. But if you're not getting into rest and digest, I would argue you haven't got a hope in hell, even if you're eating, quote unquote, the human-specific diet, you know, of actually getting the true or full benefit from that. And that is what I see with the people that are doing everything right. Conversely, and I just sort of throw this in before I throw it back to you. And yes, there's other aspects microbiome that we need to talk about, and we might not get it in this episode. But those vegans, and and I had known vegans that have gotten well from being on a vegan diet. There's no doubt about it. They have healed this, that, and the other, right? I have encouraged them then to bring in meat and eggs and things, and some of them did, and some of them didn't, and those that didn't didn't do well. But anyway, again, what was um uh familiar to me of why they healed was it wasn't just their diet they changed. They worked very much on their mental, emotional, and so I'm at this point. I'm talking about the autonomic nervous system changed. They changed, they let shit go. And I think all in all, that is why we have, and it's not very it doesn't sit very well scientifically, I know. Some people healing on frugivore, some people healing on vegan, a lot of people healing on carnivore and keto. And I want to talk more, but what do you say about that and my experience? You probably had the same.

SPEAKER_00 37:40

Yeah, I mean, uh, it's it's interesting. You talk about the Chinese medicine side of things, that ties in with uh the Hindu um uh sort of philosophy about chakras. Right. So the the small intestine and um the pancreas, you know, the insulin production and gallbladder, all those things are tied in with the solar plexus, right? Which is uh your identity, you know, and also where you take in information, you process it, and give out what you think about something. Right. So it ties very much in with that, and I think that what what that makes me think of is that it's very strongly linked to your your identity, your ego. And unfortunately, food has become very egoic. You know, people people eat eat certain diets because it's their stance. I am this, I am that, and it sort of takes away the enjoyment of of the process of eating. And like you say, you know, we we're all eating in in a way that's yeah, uh one too quick, too focused on uh am I being um ethically right? Am I being you know fitting into a certain category? Do I defend this? But I I mean I I think that the the identity issue around food, you know, I'm a carnival, I'm a a vegan, I'm a veg. No, you're a human being that's eating. Yeah. It's just all food.

SPEAKER_03 39:20

Well, I I love that you said that because if you've been in any of the Facebook groups or or wherever these groups hang out, you would have experienced, you know, I always say in my membership, we're not the Catholic Church, you know, so people can sin and fall off the wagon. Very often they jump off the wagon and burn the wagon, and yeah, we don't want them to feel guilty and lose it. But in these groups, and not so much in the carnival, but I've certainly seen it, you know, I've seen in the carnival groups, you know, people admit they've eaten a potato and it's it's it's it's you know ridicule. At least most of it's funny. But in the vegan groups, if you not that there'd be many confessions, but if you dare say you've eaten an egg or salmon, I mean it is it is brutal.

SPEAKER_00 40:05

I think that what's really deeply overlooked, and I I always try and bring it back to my own experience. Like, why why did I decide one day to you know um go on to a very strict diet? What I mean by that, why did I decide to change my pattern of eating from I don't really worry or care about what I'm eating to I'm gonna focus on being specific about what I eat? Okay what drives that is I I want to care more for myself, right? So I think what's overlooked sometimes is the shift of conscious consciousness between I don't really care about myself to I'm gonna start to care about myself. Yeah, right. And that change in thought thought patterns change your energy field, which uh is probably more pro health. Yeah, irrespective of what you eat. Right. So if you have that, if if I bet you any money that you if you had uh two groups of people, one which was forced to eat a healthy diet, right, they didn't really want to, they didn't care either way. And you had a group that at the same healthy diet, but they were on a mission to get well because they had a thought process behind them that was pro-health, that diet would have a more profound effect on their healing.

SPEAKER_03 41:42

Yeah, it's fascinating, and I'm gonna take that to the extreme. Go on, because you know, because I've worked with so many people.

SPEAKER_00 41:48

Now, not I've always seen you, I've always known you're an extremist. I am, I am.

SPEAKER_03 41:53

Um just thinking as of the names, yeah. That'd be cool. But anyway, um bear bear with us while you listen to this extreme fascist, right wing, you know, yeah, conservative man, whatever you know. Anyway, um, I'm actually thinking she wasn't my auntie. The the extreme foodie. That's it. Um, and who's open to being wrong, but this is conversation, that's all we want to have. But this this wasn't actually a client of mine, you know, it was my auntie, she's not even my auntie, she's one of those like close family friends that oh, it's my auntie, you know. Loads of those. Yeah, yeah, they were good. Yeah, you didn't even think, well, is my are you my dad? He didn't, dad's brother or sister, you're my auntie. Yeah, and I I love this woman because um I would describe her as comfortable in her own skin. Yeah, and she was a chain smoker, and she lived to way past 90, right? And so, you know, one could definitely argue scientifically with evidence that smoking is bad for your health, yeah, right? And and you know, I I think even if you took some of the uh new research coming out that nicotine's good for you or not, blah, blah, blah, or if you snap the filter off, it's better, or blah, blah, blah, right? You know, I think no one would put a cigarette in a child's mouth. They just know it's wrong, right? Yeah. Now, but this woman, way into her 90s, chain smoker. And she was never shy to tell you what she thought about you, right? And it was rarely positive, right? So, you know, she uh she should be a character in the Harry Potter.

SPEAKER_00 43:36

She got everything off her chest, did she?

SPEAKER_03 43:38

Well, you know what? I hadn't considered that now, but but she was comfortable in pointing out that you were a fuckwit. Right? Let's put it that way, right? And and particularly her Cypriot husband, who who I think she only married him because she wanted to talk to someone verbally. Um, for the rest of his life, right? Although he did manage to s to to outlive her and and get some of the inheritance.

SPEAKER_00 44:07

But Jody Mundy he undershed at the bottom of the garden, didn't he?

SPEAKER_03 44:10

Oh, I'm I'm sure. Yeah, he he was he was an interesting character too. But anyway, you know, I use her as an example, right? Because, you know, she I don't know what she passed on, I can't remember, right? Way into her 90s, and I would argue she had a really good life, even though I can't remember a positive word coming out of her mouth. And yes, we could argue the rights and wrongs of that, but she was uh resonating with who she was, and who she was was a force to be reckoned with, you know, and but but you we're laughing, but you understand it right, as opposed to listen, this is very interesting.

SPEAKER_00 44:49

It it mirrors something that uh, you know, I uh I had a real auntie, not one of these seconds of you know, secondhand aunties. Um be it some of them are better than your auntie. They've already got a secondhand auntie, be it some some of the secondhand aunties can be better than your own aunties sometimes, right? But my auntie, she she died in uh, I think in her late 70s. She chain smoked, yeah, and she she died of non-smoking related illness. And I found her to be somebody who was very forthright, yes, um, was somebody who enjoyed life. So that there you go again. It's this idea of is the is the physical nurturing of something just enough to get well or ill.

SPEAKER_03 45:41

Well, you know, the research that was being done, and and I think I'm gonna pronounce this right, because I don't know if it's telemires or telymores, but there was some fascinating research done on the length of these telemores or telemares. I can't forgive me if I can't remember the correct spelling and exactly how it's pronounced, but that they're essentially these sort of tails attached to your DNA or there or thereabouts. And their length of them determines whether you know you're going to die or that cell's going to die or what have you. And so the shorter they are, the closer it is to death. And um, or there or thereabouts. So forgive me if I've got it 100% right for those who know what they're talking about. But this woman did this research and she found that the the she she chose uh battered women in in in in you know, you know, gone to refuge in these um you know halfway houses or what have you. And all of them had lived an incredibly stressful life, obviously. And their telemores or telemires were you know non-existent or super sure. So again, you know, if if they would have been on, I doubt their diet would have been fantastic, but I think it starts to bring enormous credence to once more stress, which I you know, when I look at people uh that I've helped and you know, other people with problems and what have you, you know, from from those doing things technically right to technically wrong, um, because we can show stories from both sides, like my auntie, the chain smoker, arguably doing it wrong, right? Um, to those who are doing it right, who who are very ill and pass you know, sooner than they should do, it's stress. Yeah. And and you know, when you guys who stress people think about worry and hardship and blah, blah. But it's more than that. It's it's electromagnetic frequency stress. It is thought of geopathic as well. It's geopathic to, you know, again, the great bar. This episode must be dedicated to the great Barbara Wren. But Barbara Wren, you know, spoke, and I've seen it, you know, about geopathic stress, in that some people are living in the wrong place and they need to move. Um, it's written in many uh older books that that you know, there's some places just you're in the wrong place. Um, if you've got cancer, these old books. I'm talking about Moontime, uh a European hand-me-down knowledge fantastic book, Moontime. Um, you know, they talk about that if you have cancer, you are sleeping in the wrong place, and there's probably water running out, you know. So it's fascinating. And and what I want to bring into this conversation, as I get animated with my hands, and this is audio, so you can't see it, but you know, is that you know, we are still even there's some great work being done by some, you know, um quite social media prevalent docs and people like that, even there's some great work, it's still reductionist, right? We're still in that reductionist age of you know what you eat and how much, you know, I I have clients going how much protein and fat should I eat? And I say, well, eat till you're satiated, you know, and trust that. But nonetheless, the point I'm getting to is, you know, because there are people that have gotten sick eating the right food, and because there's people that have healed eating the wrong food or not gotten, you know, so on and so forth, there must be a binding, there must be other factors, and far as I can tell, it's stress. Conversely, which we would say was not harmonic, you are not in a harmonious flow. Conversely, the pasta grannies they seem absolutely harmoniously happy with what they're doing. Would you agree?

SPEAKER_00 49:34

Yeah, but I would imagine I don't know much about the pasta grannies in terms of their own lives, and but I imagine that they grew up in families that did the same. Yeah?

SPEAKER_03 49:44

Yes. Certainly I've seen the the key to longevity is uh usually the food that was culturally right for you, it's local, seasonal, you have purpose and you have good relationships.

SPEAKER_00 49:58

But what I what I'm trying to feed into there is you talk about stress, that these patterns are learnt very early on. So yeah, it's like uh sometimes I get um clients and they say, Oh, my my child is having difficulty with sleeping because they're stressed, they're grinding their teeth, right? Yeah, and nine out of ten times the the parent is stressed, and they're they're projecting their stress onto their children. Yeah, I see this a lot, you know, and so these patterns then are built up in the unconscious, they're not they're not learned consciously, you know, because no one goes, oh, I'm gonna react to this because I know it's good, it's just an unconscious thing. And what happens is patterns of stress are built up, built up, built up. And unfortunately, we've we've been in a pattern of of social stress, the way that we're living, for a few generations now, I'd say. And so uh it's building up these patterns that are then passed on to other the next generation to the next generation, and I wonder whether that that does have a quite a serious impact on the ability to self-heal.

SPEAKER_03 51:18

Yeah, it certainly has um an ability to seek food, which is one of the most common things I see as a drug or a suppressant. You know, the the the quote-unquote emotional eating, you know, most people that I've worked with um with uh weight as one of their specific um goals that they want to reduce. When they start to reach a certain level of weight loss, the emotional trauma comes up or or or aspects tied to their belief about themselves or sexuality or whatever it happens to be at a certain weight loss period, and the pattern of self-sabotage using food to suppress that kicks in, and they, you know, this is this classic yo-yo diet. And so the only way I know to succeed through that is that that's when we that's why I do one-to-ones, although we try and do it in the in the group membership as well. But you know, you start now releasing those patterns. Where did they come from? And and equally important is where do you feel it? And most often people go in my gut. You know, I feel it in my gut, you know, any problem or worry or issue.

SPEAKER_00 52:33

Fear and and and worry tightens your gut up, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_03 52:37

It does, it does.

SPEAKER_00 52:39

You know, um, I mean the the the common places are shoulders, back, lower back, you know, um, because you carry in all that stress, then your gut tightens up. Um, and you know, you wonder why you can't digest things, or what you wonder why there's there's acid refluxing out of your mouth. Yeah, you know. Um I think that stress is a really, really, really big problem. But I mean, I I'd say it's interesting you're talking about um you know, yo-yoing diets are going, you know, eating obsessively, so people eat obsessively, and then they they they diet obsessively. Yeah. So people are stuck in this obsessive pattern. Yeah, you know, if you look at it, look at it, if if you want to call it addiction, I mean I prefer the word obsessive use of something to to feed something that's either not naturally there or it's a a a process of trying to comfort you in some way.

SPEAKER_03 53:42

Yeah. It's very well that that definitely starts from shock. When you're upset, you know, you know, you go down the biscuit tin or your mum gives you a sweet or something like that, or candy in America, you know. It was very well that birthday parties, you know. It's a celebratory day. Let's stuff ourselves with all the wrong sugar.

SPEAKER_00 53:59

And then that's a pattern that gets built up. And then right. So your body, when it gets stressed, already is kicking out, you know, its sugar stores. Your your glycogen's being broken down with your liver. So there's a message going to your brain, eat to to replenish it. Now, if you put on top of that a pattern which is going, oh well, I'll have sugar every time I'm stressed, you get into that, it's quite it's really difficult to break down, isn't it? Yeah. And I'm I'm always of the mind every time you eat, I mean, um, I don't want to be purists and say don't eat sugar at all, um, because I don't think that's real, because it's in the world, right? But every time you eat something, you f you seed your gut. Because you change the bacteria in your mouth, in your gut. So every time you ingest something, you you have a change in your biome. You know?

SPEAKER_03 54:55

Well, we've got to the the the great microbiome, which is something I'm looking more and more into. And and and in fact, I'm you know, it might be launched by time. This is this is published because we're recording this in advance, but I'm I'm gonna launch the Bravo Probotic, which I think is the most superior uh probiotic in the world for many different reasons. The Bravo Probiotic Gut Brain Protocol, and there'll be a Facebook group and a book and so on and so forth. But you know, we're having some you and I are having some fascination, fascinating conversations in private around about the microbiome and the oral microbiome. And you know, Dr. Aguerrios, you know, will also say that there's a microbiome in the brain, which Harvard says it's sterile, but I believe he's correct. And I actually believe it uses the vagus nerve probably to seed itself. But this microbiome in the reductionist 3D world, rather than the spirit and a mental emotional, although it is certainly interconnected, is becoming more and more fascinating because there's wonderful research showing that um overgrowth of certain cultures, and this was this was it very much aimed at autistic people, children and adults, they they found that certain overgrowth of bacterial colonies, you know, um gave different patterns of behavior. And when you when you change that and reduced it and put in other bacterial colonies, that behavior changed. And when I was talking to you privately, you know, and you you you did three months of Bravo Probotics, you know, you talked about the consciousness of it. And I think this is fascinating in what we've just been talking about, because I've seen, you know, um people that have been carnival for eight or ten years, and and certainly they've healed a lot of things, but you know, they'd have one sausage with a little bit of rust in it, and and many symptoms would flare back up. And that just doesn't sit right with me for some little stressor, really brought back into. And so I'm I'm I'm thinking, and I don't know yet, but I'm thinking it must be microbiome connected along with all the other things, perhaps that we're mentioning. But how much do you think by the way, there's this there's this woman girl, I forget her name. She's a very sort of attractive thing to be on a a podcast talking about the oral microbiome, but I kind of half laugh because the microbiome is constantly changing, you know, uh uh unless you're feeding it right.

SPEAKER_00 57:29

I mean, I I think that like any environment, it needs time to to stabilize. So if you think about, we go, I'm gonna go back to our ancestors, they would have eaten when they caught food. Yep. They would have gorged, the microbiome would have responded to it. And it would have been very unsanitary as well. Oh, yeah. So they would have been in modern standards they they would have had bacteria from the outside. So the the relationship between inner and outer bacteria would have been more harmonious.

SPEAKER_03 58:03

Yeah. Right? I think this is very important.

SPEAKER_00 58:06

Yeah. I mean, so then that gives the immune system the the signal that hey, it's okay, there's no need to be afraid. This is actually part of what you are, but it's on the outside, but it's really on the inside, too. Yeah. So when people eat and they gorge, the microbiome changes in the mouth and the gut, and then it's given time to settle, right? So that that consciousness behind it is given time to settle, and that consciousness of the gut bacteria, my own uh work into that, I notice that it links you to the consciousness of the environment around you, especially the natural world. Now, if you're ingesting things from the outside of yourself that you take in and it has an effect on your your biome that's trying to tune it in more to the natural world, and you've got time between each meal for that to happen, it makes sense that it's more harmony. But if you're ingesting, you know, breakfast, oh I'll have something in between breakfast and lunch, then is lunch, and then your microbiome is constantly trying to find uh uh uh harmony. And I wonder how how often does it find harmony? Um, and I imagine that we were talking about you know certain types of diet, if you are eating one type of food, it's giving the microbiome a chance to find some sort of harmony.

SPEAKER_03 59:43

Well, this is fascinating because you know, um one of one of the things um that people may know or not not about is these fecal implants, which is horrible horrible if you think about it, right? But most of these fecal implants are taken from you know either uh you know very old uh men who've lived a sort of more tribal life, or tribal, you know, um uh fecal um stools, because the bacterial content, the microbiome, is absolutely superior, particularly with ancient strains. That's that's what's in Bravo Probotics, is 300 over 300 strains, many of them very ancient, that are just not found. Yeah, nowhere near the diversity of strains are found in city or suburban life. And when you go back and when you look at that, and these fecal implants, they literally put up your bottom, and they've had some very good results and some very bad results as well. But but when you when you look at that and you look at the microbiome connecting the outside with the inside and your ability to digest, and I'm talking about every level, you know, it it gives credence back to when I was a kid, when we were outside playing in mucky and dirty, and you know, and if you think about working dogs, for example, you know, they they don't wash their paws, they they lick orifices that they probably shouldn't be licking. And, you know, um, if you give them a bone, they go and bury it for a week until it's rank. And, you know, the animal, the natural world, has no fear over these germs and these bacteria. In fact, now we're paying to put them up our bottom, you know. So I actually think, in the context of this conversation, that the bacteria that from outside and and settling inside is again from the consciousness level, because you said it was drawing you to nature, it's drawing us back to our roots and and what is how, let me rephrase that, how we're designed to live. And certainly since CONVID and all these people washing their hands and you know, these bloody gels that you see people putting on their hands and things. I mean, we have swung so far the wrong way with our understanding of bacteria and the germ theory. And now that consciousness is being brought into it, you could see that you know, if it was deliberate to reduce consciousness, you know, it's been very effective. And literally, people can't digest anything.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:19

Yeah. I mean, I I find um Edward Bach was was um way ahead of his time before he he developed the flower MDs, he worked on gut bacteria. I didn't know that. Yeah, he was clever. I mean, he he he noticed that certain people who had certain diseases had certain gut biome, gut bacteria. How interesting, right? And so what he did was he found the healthy um microbiome and he created bacterial nozodes, which were like homeopathic, um he called them homeopathic vaccines for a word, and he'd introduce that into the unhealthy person and they would get well. Right? So the idea is that uh he started with um bacteria, which has a consciousness, yeah, and then he moved on to plants and flowers, which has a consciousness. So it's it seems that you know we are living consciousness and whatever we put in our bodies, whether it's food, water, plant, whatever, meat, plant, it has a consciousness. And it's that interrelationship between what we put in and our link to the natural world. How can we harmonize that as much as possible? Now, I'm not saying that people shouldn't be living in in you know, in cities. I've had friends who prefer to live in cities, right? But it's like it's like anything, it's trying to find what is the best way that I can harmonize my body with a natural form of energy. And let's say um the worst scenario that you know everything did collapse and all our Western ways and everything rotted down into the earth, you'd still have the natural world there. It just would continue. So it's this it is a foundational energy of everything. And reconnecting to that, whether it's through food or whichever way you do it, is it's gotta be a positive. You know.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:34

Well, you know, you know, as we're wrapping up on this hour, I think there's many more conversations to take this. And you know, hopefully what people have heard today is is not, you know, um in any way degrading one diet or the other, although I still put my flag in the carnivore and true keto diet for healing or help healing sick people. Um, but I would never uh take away someone who wants to do a raw vegan diet as long as they're doing the other stuff and um and we'll see where we get to. Um with that, I've just you know sharing what I've seen the most success with. But it's fascinating, you know, if people want to bring science into it, you know, it's fascinating if you know, truly scientific. You know, if it was just carnival that would heal everybody and everything, that's all you do. Go and eat meat and water and salt and come back and tell me when you're ready to give me a testimonial. But that's not been what I've seen, in spite of you know, the tremendous healing results I've seen, you know, people not working with me uh seemingly achieve. So, you know, I hope we continue with this conversation because I think it even goes deeper into you know, where did we truly evolve from? You know, you know, why is it we're the only animal that doesn't know what to eat? What? Why is why has the tremendous cuisine around the world developed? And who would want to give up? You know, I I don't it just doesn't feel like it's wrong, this love of cooking and this joy of cooking, because I do cook and I see the pleasure and the the nourishment of the soul. You know, you and I, we did uh two two conferences that we set up in Ambleside, you know, weekend longs. And people to this day are not talking about the lectures, right? They're talking about the food they ate, which was exceptional, and and and the joy that they shared. Yeah, and the lectures, the lectures were not great, is no I listened, I listened to yours, and I I haven't slept that well in a long time. No, no, we're doing your braps is brilliant, it was great. But but you that you know this is the point. You know, I there is a there is a a path and a balance to find, and I'm not discounting the subtraction method and and in modern times that that that I I see and the evidence that digesting meat and fat is the easiest thing for our bodies to digest and least challenging. But that's a conversation for another day. But you know, um I've often said to people, in fact, John has has has produced a sort of cartoon for me where you know Superman um uh was was very, very big, you know, the Christopher Reeves Superman for me. And I'm like taught, you know, people say, you know, the tran is, you know, like I'm I'm a man trapped in a woman's body or whatever it is, right? You know, I'm a chef trapped in a dog's body, and I'm trying I'm trying to bring the two together to find the path, you know, for humanity, and I'm determined to achieve it, you know. But let's keep this conversation rolling because it does go back to who are we, where did we come from. And I don't think we came from monkeys. Um, you know, controversial as that may be. I just don't think this history and this evolution holds holds water, to be honest. But lots of different conversations to explore on. Do write to us, um, you know, and let us know and comments and what have you, you know, what you want us to talk about and explore more. I hope you're enjoying this ongoing series of Doctors No More. But for now, it's goodbye from me.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:22

And it's goodbye from me.