Between Loss And Legacy

When hope feels impossible and the promise seems buried, what keeps you moving forward?

In this episode of Between the Prayer and the Promise, Laneice sits down with Debbie Simmons—legacy architect, bestselling author, and founder of Anchor Point—to talk about navigating grief, rebuilding faith, and discovering purpose in the in-between seasons of life.

Debbie shares her journey from infertility to a pregnancy with quadruplets, the heartbreaking loss of her sons, and the unexpected redemption that followed through adoption. Together, we explore practical ways to move forward when life doesn’t go as planned, including Debbie’s powerful “next best step” framework for rebuilding hope one step at a time.

This honest conversation will encourage anyone walking through loss, delayed dreams, or the long waiting season between prayer and promise.

Transcript

Introducing Debbie And Her Mission

SPEAKER_02 0:10

Welcome back to Between the Prayer and the Promise. This is a space where we learn to trust the author when we can't see the ending of our story. Today's episode isn't about surface healing. It's about the in-between season after deep loss. The season where grief is still present. The promise feels delayed. And you're learning how to trust God when a future looks nothing like what you imagined. Not the polished testimony where we share this year's later, not the victory lap after everything makes sense. But the raw, holy ground where grief and hope coexist. Where we learn to trust God when our promise didn't just delay it felt like it died. Romans 15 and 13 says, May the God of hope fill you with joy and peace as you trust in Him, so that you may overflow with hope by the power of the Holy Spirit. Now that verse it sounds so beautiful. But what happens when hope feels impossible?

unknown 1:30

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_02 1:30

When the very thing you pray for is the very thing you lost. Well, today's title is called Between Loss and Legacy, because sometimes God writes our greatest purpose through our deepest pain, and our guest knows all about that. I'm joined by Debbie Simmons, the legacy architect, a keynote speaker, a best-selling author, and founder of Anchor Point, a multimillion dollar nonprofit. After facing infertility, the loss of her quadruplate sons, health collapse, and leadership pressure that nearly broke her, Debbie turned her breakdown into a blueprint to help leaders rebuild so that they would not have to carry that alone. Hi Debbie, welcome to Promise. The Prayer and the Promise. I'm so happy and so excited to get you here. And it has been a roll to get you here, and I'm excited that I finally got you here. Hello, hello, hello. How are you?

SPEAKER_00 2:46

I'm good. It's gonna be a ton of fun. We're gonna have some fun.

Infertility And The Shock Of Quads

SPEAKER_02 2:50

Yes, yes. So we're gonna go right into this. So why don't you just take us back to the moment when your miracle became your greatest loss? What was it like to hold your babies in your belly and then in heaven? What was the first days of rebuilding like emotionally and spiritually?

The Hospital, Loss, And Saying Goodbye

Surrendering Why For How

SPEAKER_00 3:15

You won it all, girlfriend. Well, I have to tell you, um, in order to understand my story a little better, you know, you have to back up before then. In my mind as a young girl, I knew that I wanted to be a young grandma. I loved kids and I wanted to have grandkids. And I think that was because my um parents were the younger of large sibling groups. And so I didn't really have grandparents. They had passed on by the time I kind of came into the picture. And I just remember going, I want to be a young grandma. I want to be able to run around and play. And so, you know, I was a girl that could figure out how to get things done. And I found a guy, we got married, and the very thing that we ran into was infertility. And so, for a girl who can get things done, that caused kind of a shockwave to my little life. I had been a believer my whole life, and you know, here I was. I couldn't figure out how to solve this problem, and I felt like a failure as a wife and a future mom. And I just remember even just laying on the bed one time after not getting pregnant and going, I just wish I was dead. I mean, this is terrible. Um, and uh I continued to move forward out of that, but that was overwhelming and heavy. And at the very end, on some fertility medication, we did get pregnant and we were diagnosed with friends. And so I was super excited um about that because that it was like that dark season was over, right? And so I was like, okay, well, at least now I want four kids, so we'll do it two at a time and we'll figure out how to get this done. And we started working that out, and we were figuring that out as we went. And then around 13 weeks, I started bleeding everywhere, and I was like, oh, I can't even get out of the first trimester, uh, you know, and I was like, oh my gosh. So I ended up with a journey to the uh ER, and then we ended up in the high risk doctor's office, and lo and behold, they did an ultrasound, and they told me, well, the reason you were attempting to mix miscarry was because you were not pregnant with twins, you're pregnant with quads. And at that point, everything was like out of control. I mean, like it was way bigger than anything we could dream, right? You know, and I'm like, I don't know how we're doing this. And you know, because with twins, I had figured out how I was going to do this. So from that very moment of being diagnosed with four was when we realized, oh my gosh, we have to trust God every step of this journey. So it became a major faith journey to just do the next day and the next day and the next day, realizing it was a miracle to get these kids to the next day because carrying four is a lot of work and hard, and you know, there's no guarantees and everything. So our goal became to get them to 30 weeks and things were going okay. And then at 26 weeks, I found myself standing in water, realizing that one of the baby sacks had ruptured. So they put you in the hospital and they say, stay in the bed and let's see if we can still get you to 30 weeks. And the next morning, one of the babies said, I'm coming, and contractions came. And I looked at the doctor and I was like, uh, no, put that hand back in there. Let's pretend this ain't happening, and because it's too early. And I knew at that point that the technology was really not available to save those boys. So having this baby, I knew that he would not be here long. And she told me I had to deliver the baby. There's no way around it. And whether I wanted to or do it, my body was going to do it. And uh went into surgery, went back into the room and waited. And a little while later, little Zach came. And they placed Zach in my arms, and I held him and I rocked him and I loved him. Uh, and he was he was he had personality because he took his little hand and he wrapped it around my finger and squeezed as if to say, Mom, I'm here. And I just held him until he drifted off into eternity. And then, you know, you're kind of shocked by that, but then you go, Okay, let's see if I can carry the next three. And the doctor says, Okay, so we wait, and my body gets sicker and sicker and sicker, and the doctor eventually walks back in and she says, You have to induce. And um, I looked at her for some hope, and none came. And I was like, Okay, I gotta figure my way through this. And um, a little while later, Zach and then Josh and then Chris came. Um, Nate, Josh, and Chris, yeah. And uh they put them each in my arms and I rocked them and I loved them and I held them until they drifted into eternity. And then, you know, after all that excitement, you're left with empty arms and broken hearts. And um, you know, grief wasn't polite that day. It just rushed in and it dared me to breathe and it dared me to keep living. And, you know, I don't go to the hospital with this um plan to plan funerals when you're pregnant, right? And so I just remember sitting in that hospital and going, I don't know how to get through this, I don't know how to do this. This is too hard. I don't, I don't, I don't even know where to turn. And I I was playing through all these scenarios in my head, trying to figure out how am I gonna figure my way through this? And um I just was like, why did this happen to me? And because why is the first question we go to when we have a hard time, right? And so I'm like, why? Because if I knew the answer to why, I could figure my way. It at least had to understand. And um, the truth is, God was very gracious with me that night. He um he said, I need you to give me your why. And I was like, no, I'm not giving you my why. I said, because this is all I got left, right? And I'm like clinging to it because I'm like, if I could just have this answer, I could figure this out. And he was like, you have to give it to me. And I'm like, no. And so we we went in this back and forth for a while, and finally I was like, okay. And what I've learned over the years is that why is really a stuck question. So he was very gracious to ask me to give it up so early in the process. Um, but you know, if he would have stood by my bedside that night and told me the answer for why, one thing I've come to realize is that my very next question to him after I got the answer would be why? Because that answer ain't good enough, right? And I would have, and we keep asking why, because it's not solving the pain or the problem and everything. And so he's like, you just have to give me that. And finally, I was like, Okay, fine, I'll give you that. And so I surrendered my why, I laid it down, and I realized why is stuck. It keeps us inward focus, it keeps us isolated, um, and it can be a very dangerous path. And he taught me to ask a different question, and that question was, how do I survive? And so that's the question I began asking. And how is a question that leads to forward movement? Okay, and so I would ask that question, and he taught me, I need you to breathe. I'm like, okay, I can do that because breathing means you're alive, but it also makes sure you're in your prefrontal cortex where logical thinking happens. And then pick whatever your next best thing is that you can do the next best step and take it. And some days that was me simply getting up, brushing my teeth, walking around for five minutes and getting back in the bed. But every little step I took in obedience, I took a next step and God met me there and he shone the light at my feet so that I could take the next step and I could meet him. And this is how I worked my way through grief, but also how my faith muscle was developed. And at some point I realized I was getting better, and then the question became not how do I survive, but how do I thrive? Because God, you promised to redeem stories, and I want you to redeem mine because I still feel young. I want to live, I want to laugh, I want to um figure my way in the world, I want to make an impact. And so he began to create opportunities for me to begin to have a life of uh a lot more impact the more I surrendered to him.

SPEAKER_02 13:00

Oh my goodness, I have so many questions. Um, let me go back. Um, you talked about being able to do so many things and wanting to have children and not being able to do that. So, did you tie that in any way to your womanhood or to your faith at all? And how did you, because you then you talked about surrendering, how did you surrender that, not being tied to that if you tied that to it?

Identity, Worth, And Adoption

SPEAKER_00 13:37

Well, you know, I think when I was struggling with infertility, that was the question of worth, right? Um, and uh I remember God kind of walking me through that and saying, that is not where your worth is. Your identity comes from me, and it's not in whether or not you have children. I also knew that if he put that deep desire in my heart that somehow he would work that out. I didn't know how or what that meant exactly, but I knew that somehow children would be in my life and that I could trust him with that. And I would just leave it to him to show me. And so um, you know, I never doubted that kids would be in there. I just never knew how exactly until it kind of unfolded. But I knew that my daddy, God loved me and I knew that he was writing a good story, and I knew he created this kind of desire in me and he would fulfill it because that's what good daddies do, you know, or they they mold you into his image, right? You know, and so I just trusted him that he would show me how I'd figured the children thing out at some point. Um, now when it was interesting because um years went by before we considered adoption, but uh God took me into seminary. I walked away from my engineering career, and I then he had me go work on a church staff and they hired me as a children's pastor, okay? And I was like, I went back to God and I said, okay, if I wasn't very clear back in the hospital that day, I was thinking like my own children, not like 300 other people's children. I love these kids and I love doing what I did, but I'm like, you know, if I wasn't very clear in my requests, so you say be specific. Let me just tell you I was thinking about my own kids. So I'm gonna need you to figure that out. And that's how he had us go down the journey of adoption. Um, and that has been a real joy, and we've adopted three times a sibling group of five, and then about eight years later, a sibling group of two, and then three years after that, a sibling group of two. And so um, you know, the first five came into my home uh on the day that my children were born, and I say that's the day God redeemed, seven years to the date. Um, and he gave us five instead of four, right? And so um, so that's kind of my job experience with that. But uh I I just knew he would just take care of it because that's what good things do.

SPEAKER_02 16:29

So uh you also talked about the um surrendering. So what did that practically look like for you? Like how, like people say surrender, and I know that might look different for everyone else, but if someone were to ask you, how do I surrender the why? How do I surrender, giving up my thought of what this could be? How do I do that? What advice would you give?

Practical Surrender And Community

SPEAKER_00 16:56

Yeah, okay. That you know, it is taking your thoughts captive every day, every minute, all the time. You know what? I tell people, I go, okay, God, I give you my why, and then five minutes later I'm back to going, why this? You know, and then I'm like, okay, I'm gonna give that to you again, and I give it to him again, and I make it, oh, an hour. And then I'm like, why? You know, and but so this continual choosing to say, God, I give it to you, and I'm trusting that you are gonna show me the way. And, you know, I will, for me over the years, I write these things down and I read them to myself and I go, if they haven't changed on the paper, that's still what we're going for, right? But constantly turning it back over if I pick it up. So, you know, like if I had in my backpack and I took it out and I gave it away, but then I put it back in my backpack, I got to get it out again, give it away again. And you know what I found is that over time I got better at that. The time became longer. And even now, like today, I I'm not a why girl anymore. But the other day in the ministry, I got uh a lawsuit dropped off. Um, and you know what? The first thing that came out of me was, why? Right, why this? And I realized, oh my gosh, I can go down that direction, but I've been down that direction so many times that I know it's never ends well. Okay, or I can stop right here, give myself a two-minute pity party, whatever, stop, and I can change my question. And if I swap the question and I go, how do I survive? How do I figure my way through this? Then he can work with that, right? Because that is, I'm literally laying my Y at the altar and I'm going, How do I figure my way? And he promises to give us wisdom. So I would say it's a continual turnover process that it strengthens our faith muscle over time. And we get to be really, really great faith warriors in the end, if we've done that for years, right? And so I just go, don't be upset about it. Just give yourself a visual and go, I put it over there in the jar. It's right there. I haven't taken it back, right? Do whatever you need to do to remind yourself to give it back there. And and when we pick it up, just you know, this is grief. So pick it up and put it back over there. Um, but this is why you need safe, loving friends in your life that will remind you when you slip into that uh and encourage you. And that's why we because grief is not walkthrough alone, it's walkthrough and community.

SPEAKER_02 19:48

Yeah, this is so rich. Um, thank you. You you talked about the years of infertility and and that's that's just like that season, right? Of of the waiting, right? Before you were were pregnant. I want to talk a little bit about that for people when they're just in that season of waiting, right? The season of whatever it is that they're praying for and they're waiting for, not knowing you didn't know what the end was gonna be, you didn't know what was gonna happen, but just that season of I'm waiting for something, I'm waiting for this. What did that that season teach you about yourself and about God? And even when you got what you thought you were gonna get, and then it didn't work out the way you wanted it to work out. What did all of that waiting, then having to wait again? You know, how did that shape the woman we see and we're talking to right now?

Waiting Well And The Next Best Step

SPEAKER_00 20:50

I don't know how I I was trying to think back. Uh you know, I'm getting older, they say. So uh I'm not sure I know how exactly I figured it out, but what I figured out was that I couldn't handle looking too far in the future because I would pick up anxiety and worry, and I couldn't handle looking backwards where I would pick up guilt or shame. And you know, the Bible is very clear that God says for us to keep our eye on him because when we do, we stay here in the present with him, and this is the only place that we can do something about the future. You can't do anything about the past we can't do anything about, but in this space of this moment right now, I can choose right, and that is why the concept of the next best step was so powerful for me because it wasn't overwhelming, it was just the next best thing I could think of. Um, and so that was very helpful after losing the boys, and I will tell you that. Laying down the why, picking up those questions. I do that now. I've done that ever since then. And it is a way I figured my way through life. Um, you know, now with the question of infertility and self-worth and everything, I would just tell you that it seems like I always get to these places where it's just out of my control. And when it's out of my control and I've tried everything to control it, right? Okay, is when I realize that it's either gonna take me out or I'm gonna give it to him. It's going, it's going to take me out. It will literally kill me if I keep going down this way, trying to control everything and realizing that I have to trust God in this situation. And so um a lot of times I'll be slow in getting to that trust early on. Now I'm pretty good. Uh now I'll just go, yeah, God, you don't even have to tell me what we're doing today. Just let me know when it's time. Uh, you know, but that's taken a lot. That's why I love that idea of the next best step. When I do it in obedience, that's my faith muscle growing. And then he meets me and then he adjusts what I'm doing, and then he shows me, and I take the next one in faith and then stuff like that. And that's just how I've learned to live. And that is the journey of faith. And if we think that we have to have all the answers, the truth is, I don't know what tomorrow's gonna be like. It could be hard, right? I don't even want to know. I'm like, you said keep your eyes on you, I got it. And because here I can have joy, I can have peace, I can have patience, I can have kindness. I know he's got me. Um, so when I can stay with my eye on him, and it's interesting in scripture, it talks about your eye, not your eyes, okay? And the reason it does I is because it is about the singular focus that we need to have on him. Okay, because eyes, we can get distracted, right? But the eye, it's like, you know, when you squint and you look at son, you you can see it, right? And so I'm going, that's what I need to have. And that has been the most valuable lesson for me in trying to figure my way out. And I've walked with lots of people through grief over the years, and you know, it's not a linear journey. Uh, it looks different for all of us, but it always has in there a release, a surrender that we have to go through. And that's why you need loving people who can help you, you really know how to help you walk through that.

Grief Cycles And New Normal

SPEAKER_02 24:45

You talked um a lot about your framework and the um the next back step, and and I just love that. Um so and just really building this the the framework around trust, right? So how do you deal, how do you deal with that and how do you how do you do that? And how do you lay that first brick when when you're dealing with grief, how do you start rebuilding? How do you how do you trust again? I mean, even even God, how do you what what do you do? Well, I would tell you, I would tell you grief is still present, right? It's still there, it's still real, you're still dealing with it. It's not like it's it's back in the past. People, someone listening right now is like, that sounds great, but it hurts so bad.

SPEAKER_00 25:49

Yeah, I get it. Um, and you know what? I would tell people grief cycles after tragedy and loss and things like that, um, generally take at least a year, sometimes two years, to really get to where you feel like you might be normal again. And what we have to realize is that our normal is going to be different. And so the reason it takes that kind of cycle is because we have to go through all the seasons of the year and realize what our new normal looks like.

SPEAKER_01 26:23

Okay.

Authentic Faith Versus Performance

SPEAKER_00 26:24

And so that might be the first year through. The second year through is when I start to maybe get a rhythm, okay, of how to live in this new one. So, like when I lost the boys, it was April 1st. Um, the first thing that came after that was Mother's Day. Okay. Um, that was not an easy day. I was sitting in the church service and they're honoring moms and they're like, if you just recently had your baby, stand up. And I'm like, Do I stand up? And they go, Oh, when was yours born? Well, they were born and died on April 1st. I don't think that'd be cool anymore. Do you know what I'm saying? And so I looked at my husband because we were in my his grandparents' church and I said, Dude, I can't handle this. I gotta go outside because I wasn't ready to handle it. My body, my whole emotional state was not ready for that, right? And so I went and sat outside, and so I have to know, and this is why people are helpful, but I have to know how to take it easy on me. I don't want to stay stuck, but I also need to understand there's highs and lows in the grief journey, um, and that that's okay. Um, that that's okay. I'm 30 plus years since my boys were born, and I can tell you that my body knows when April 1st is close by. Wow. Even now, and that's okay. And so, you know, when my body kind of gets the funk, and I'm like, why do I feel funky? And I'm like, I look at the date and I'm like, oh, it's because April 1st is right here. And I'm like, okay, then what can I do even now, 32 years later? What can I do to um be grateful and to go, thank you, God, for bringing me through that. Thank you for giving me those boys. Thank you that I'll be with them in heaven. Thank you that this will be just a blink of an eye, you know, and that will help me work my way through it even now, right? And so I also have um created memories for me along the way. So pictures from the hospital or footprints on certificates or precious moments that have their names on them, or a mother's ring, uh, because they're a significant part of me, right? Um, and they have made me who I am today. And the way I honor them is by choosing to live my life with impact and to be very intentional and to live my legacy now. So it'll be here to leave when I um leave this earth. But their legacy continues on in my faithfulness, right? And so I think that those are some of the things. But I go in the heat of the battle, um, I go breathe. And you just have to choose to lean into him and you know, and go, I don't get it. I know I won't get the answer to why, but I want you to show me the way. And he promises to give us wisdom to do that, and then put yourself in relationships with people who have had the opportunity to walk through grief. There are people that are still that had lost children around the time that I did, and they're still stuck. And I wanted, I desperately wanted to live, and so I wanted to have joy and I wanted to have peace and I wanted to be an impact player, and I was just like, God, just teach me how to do this. I don't understand, but I will tell you this the God who was faithful in the Bible before is the same God that's faithful today, and he will be faithful tomorrow. And he has given us his love letters to tell us that he is faithful and we can trust that. And so we are so blessed, you know. Unlike the New Testament church, they didn't have these letters that we have right in front of us and the word of God and the Holy Spirit living in us. To we've got such great resources at our disposal that he's left for us so that we know that we're not alone. And I go, he's either gonna answer my question for children, or he's gonna give me a desire for something bigger and better, right? And so I can trust him in that, and you know, that's the hard part. Well, we do that because he gives us a choice to choose and we get to make that choice.

SPEAKER_02 31:05

Yes, that's beautiful. You um share with me before about um faith without performing, a little bit, and so and I think that is something really powerful. How does one continue to pray when they don't feel strong? What is the difference between like authentic faith and performative faith? And and I guess I'm asking that because like when you're dealing with grief and all that, sometimes I can all I can do is just recite. I I don't know if I really feel it. I'm I'm just performing, okay.

SPEAKER_00 31:50

Sure. Yeah, so my thoughts, my thoughts on that are God wants us to desire. Okay, so in any situation, we should always know that God loves us and we can trust him and we need to run toward him. Okay, we need to lean in, all right. And if you and I will be willing to do this, like if we're mad and we're blaming God, then you're gonna have a hard time leaning in.

SPEAKER_01 32:20

All right.

Hearing God, Disruptions, And Trust

SPEAKER_00 32:21

But at the same time, I would say he's not afraid if you tell him that, Lord, I'm mad and I'm mad at you, but you're still see at that point your posture is I'm leaning in and I'm trying to get there, God. I'm trying to get to the surrender and the humility and stuff like that. And he can work with that. And so the question is, will you and I lean in or will we turn away? All right. Turning away will isolate us, it will send us into depression, it'll send us into all kinds of bad choices, and then that allows Satan to get in and take us out. Okay. My confusion or my frustration or my struggle, if I am sitting here leaning in, then I am telling God, this is think about it. What if you could tell God, what is your biggest fear? My biggest fear is I'll never have children. Right? If I can list that, then he can begin to work with that.

unknown 33:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:21

If I say my biggest fear is that I I'm not good enough because I can't have children. My biggest fear is that I'll be a failure or I'll be a disappointment to my husband because I can't have children. Then when I speak truthfully what's rolling around in my head already, then now I've given him permission to work with it and to teach me. And God helped me figure my way. That's why, you know, what's the next best step? Help me figure. And he says he will give us wisdom. He promises that in James. And so we can trust that. And it might not feel like I got a big breakthrough that day, but you know what? I can hold on to that verse that I did because it was all I had the strength to do. And I can say, God, I don't believe this right now. Help me figure out how to believe this. And I this is one question that I would love. I always love to ask God this question. I'm like, what does it look like if I'm living out that verse? I might not get the answer to that one, but I'll ask him that one first because that sounds positive, right? Okay. I'm like, what does it look like to live out that? Then if I can't get, if I don't get really good feedback on that, then I will say, okay, God, what does it look like if I'm not living out that verse very well? I always get information there. And I'm like, oh, that's what it is, because I'm a very concrete girl. I'm like, give me an example of where I didn't live that well. And he'll show me. And I'm like, oh, I see what I did. Okay. So if I was doing this well, if I had love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, general, self-control, this would have looked differently. And this is what it would look like. Oh, okay. And so I know, like for me, I know that I am generally in the very sweet spot with God when I walk around most of the day with a song on my lips.

SPEAKER_01 35:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 35:30

And when I stop singing, whatever it is, when I stop singing and I get distracted in a different thing, then I find that my day might get off a little bit. And I'm like, why am I not singing? And you know, and so I know I'm centered when I'm singing or humming, you know, from that perspective. But that's just something I've learned about me. For you, it will be different. Um, and so it's a matter of learning to walk that with him and find those rhythms. But he loves our daily guy, loves and smiles when you and I lean in and run to him and not from him in everything.

SPEAKER_02 36:12

And so is that kind of how you learned how he kind of will confirm and speak to you, just kind of spending time and then, you know, even with the song, that's kind of how you learn. Like I'm in tune and and things of that nature.

Final Encouragements And Resources

SPEAKER_00 36:26

Yeah, and then I also every day I go, okay, God, this is my plans, this is what I think for the day. And I got a lot of things to do or whatever, but you know what? I'm gonna give all that to you because you are a better handler of my schedule than me. And then what I know is that when I have an interruption in my schedule, because remember, I'm a do-it girl, and when I have an interruption, I'm like, I can then go, okay, God, what are we doing? What should I be looking for here? Because you've allowed this. I wasn't expecting it, you've allowed it, so there must be something I need to be paying attention to. So, what is it? And so when I go into situations that are disruptive like that, and I'm looking for what he's trying to show me or teach me through this, then my attitude is totally different and open to where he needs me to grow or how he needs me to serve at the time, or whatever he needs me to do.

SPEAKER_02 37:27

I cannot believe how fast this time went. This has been so good. Is there any other question that I know you you have such a wealth of knowledge and so much experience and everything? I do have one final question before we get to this, but is there any other question or anything else before we get to you sharing about how people can reach you and things of that nature that you feel is maybe a good question that you would like to share or um to answer for everyone listening today?

SPEAKER_00 37:59

Sure. I would think, you know, if your listeners are struggling, um, and you're listening and you're struggling today, I mean, my heartbeat would be that you know that your daddy God looks at you and he smiles. He is not surprised by the situation in which you send. And he deeply desires you to lean in. And so I love the concept of the next best step because it's it's so easy. It might not be easy to do, but it's so simple that you and I can begin to do that by trusting him with those small things, and you don't have to like have this big formula, and so um do know that no matter what today has been like, that tomorrow the sun is going to come up again. And it's it's a journey, and that's what we're here for. It's a journey for all of us to help each other through, and um, I'm happy to do that however I can.

SPEAKER_02 39:01

Thank you, Debbie. I really, really, really appreciate you. I appreciate the time that you have spent with us today, sharing your story, sharing your wisdom, just encouraging your just your whole aura, your spirit is just beautiful. Um, and I know that people will definitely get something out of listening today. And so if they want to find out more about you and how to connect to your work and what you're doing, how can they connect with you?

Prayer And Closing Blessing

SPEAKER_00 39:33

Sure. The best place to learn more about me is at thedebi simmons.com. And that is my uh personal, that's my webpage that talks about the different coaching and the teaching and speaking that I do. And then as a gift to your listeners, and this is wonderful if you are in a brief journey. Um, we have my book for you free. And it is called The Heart of Legacy, and you can get it at theheartoflegacy.com. And it is a wonderful book to help you know how to walk through this journey. Uh, it's based on my journey and how God led me to start Anchor Point. And in the very center, it's full of nothing but um ways for you to be focused, faithful, and fearless. And that is the journey that we're on together. So that's my gift to your audience, and I'd love for them to pick it up or to reach out to me on any of my uh different uh social media accounts that they give me.

SPEAKER_02 40:32

Thank you so much. Thank you again. I appreciate you being here and I appreciate you sharing your story. Yeah. And I want to thank you all again for listening and join joining us again for between the prayer and the promise. And we are going to close out with a prayer. Father, we just thank you for being present between loss and the legacy. And for the listener who is grieving, who is waiting, who is questioning, remind them that you're still writing beautiful stories, even with our broken pieces. We thank you that grief doesn't disqualify us from hope. We thank you that even when the promise feels buried, you're still writing legacy. For every listener who feels shattered, rebuild them. For every heart that feels unsafe, teach them how to trust again, lay the first brick, strengthen their obedience, and fill them with hope by the power of your Holy Spirit. In Jesus' name we pray. And for those listening, when you're between the prayer and the promise, remember the middle is not empty, it's constructing, and God is right in. Thank you, thank you for joining us until next time.