Pillow Talk MtG 8: The Path Back to Worlds with Elijah Herr

Welcome to Pillow Talk, the official competitive Magic the Gathering podcast of Team Pillow Fort! This week, Jonathan and Austin sit down with team member Elijah Herr to learn about his Magic backstory and how he qualified for the World Championship at RC Milwaukee. This isn't Elijah's first time playing Worlds or the Pro Tour, he's been on and off the grind for some time and has some solid insights to share about learning from your team and staying focused on what matters. Thank you as always for listening!

Team Pillow Fort's Twitter: https://x.com/TPillowFortMTG 

Elijah's RC Milwaukee Simic Rhythm Decklist: https://melee.gg/Decklist/View/2bc2d433-5292-45f2-b01d-b3f7015efbeb

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:16

Welcome to Pillow Talk, the official podcast of Team PillowFort MTG. I'm your host, Jonathan Johnson, aka Tanuki JJ, and with me as always, Austin Walker. Austin, we've got a special guest with us today. Fresh off a world's invite uh at RC Milwaukee. We have Elijah Hare. Elijah, welcome. Thank you guys. So you had uh you had quite the event here recently, uh pretty good weekend recent, hmm?

SPEAKER_01 0:43

I would say so. I was uh very happy if there was all.

SPEAKER_00 0:47

Good, good. We were super happy for you. Uh always exciting to watch a friend and a teammate do really well. And today we're just gonna help people in the magic community learn about your story and how you got to the point where you get to go to worlds and another PT. Alright, so let's start off with this. Uh, tell us a little bit about your journey in magic. How how did you get started?

SPEAKER_01 1:09

Yeah, so I started in Onslaught. Um, well, my brother started in an Onslaught, and uh I kind of couldn't really uh understand the cards too well. I knew like the art was cool and there was like cool monsters on it, and uh I knew Power and Toughness, and I'd watch them play. It wasn't until I'd say about Legion or Scourge that I physically had my own deck to play. Um and then uh I just played casually with my brothers um on and off for the next couple of years. Um they started playing competitively um around like Kamigawa era. Um I just got got into video games and just didn't pay attention to magic again for uh up until around Loran Block is when I started playing in Friday Night Magic um with my brothers. Um and then just kind of the competitive bug bit me and uh was playing up until about Kaladesh before I took a a pretty hefty break. Um and uh been back since Dominaria reunited, I believe, uh was the set I came back from. And probably not gonna take another break uh anytime soon.

SPEAKER_00 2:40

Let's dial that back a little bit. So you you started off um you these are your older brothers, right?

SPEAKER_01 2:46

Yes. Uh three I have three older brothers, um, all who uh play uh played competitively um you know for for a long time.

SPEAKER_00 2:59

So we ironically, we have two of your brothers that were on the team before you. So uh one of your brothers, when when we got you to join, said that we have assembled the hair brother Tron. So um it's pretty elite. People people don't understand, but they're going to. So you're watching your older brothers, and they've they're playing this cool game with creepy art. Uh what was the first card that you remember just resonating with you?

SPEAKER_01 3:26

Crozen a Crozen Cloud Thrusher, um, which I believe was in Legions. It was a 1313. Um, it had some insane casting cost, and uh it had like morph, I believe. Uh was like the whole gimmick was that you would morph it in like this big creature. Um but that was a card, like that was the level of of magic I was playing at that point, was just a a big creature is like that's how you win the game. Like it's it deals over half of your opponent's life total. Like, it has to be good.

SPEAKER_02 4:04

Those were the days. I remember I remember seeing my first card. Uh it was I I think Craw Worm, and just having having a creature that big just seemed unbeatable. How do you how do you beat uh six mana seven six? I think is the part in toughness.

SPEAKER_00 4:19

Yep, that crawworm was was uh one of my early ones. My my first set I opened was Ice Age, and uh Craw Worm was I just remember it looking really cool, the big green creature, and you're just playing super fair trying to get there, and uh it's not a great way to to qualify for the Pro Tour. I'm surprised you didn't play that card, Elijah. Okay, well, you know, you you get to play with your brothers. Uh at this point, when you when you get to Lorrow and block and you're playing more competitively at FM, are are they still kicking your butt? Or you when did you start to actually be able to beat them sometimes?

SPEAKER_01 4:51

It's actually funny. So my brothers, um, at this point, uh all three of them were kind of like the ringers in the state, like they were like, you know, competing in the you know the the FM end bosses. They were you know every FM that they played in they would win. Um and they were kind of building a reputation for themselves um by the time I stepped in. And um, they were called the brothers, because obviously there's three of them um playing, which was not common at the time. And uh uh when I started playing, it was around when uh like the DCI rating was still existed, and all of my brothers had a rating of um higher than 1800, which um you start at 1600, and so that you know they were above average in that sense, and they they told me that it wasn't until um I got to at least 1700 rating that I would be like one of the brothers in that sense. Um obviously you know, it was it was harsh, but um it took me I I'm gonna say like four months before uh my rating was you know at their level. Um and yeah, I I tended to play decks that was good against my brother Drew. Drew played Black Green Elves, and like that was his deck, and I played uh Revel Art combo, like a blue-white control deck with a combo finish, which is just a nightmare for his deck. So um I had a better time against him, and then my oldest brother Sean, he played uh blue-black fairies, which was my worst matchup. So there was a little bit of like uh like a rock, paper, scissors kind of deal going on there.

SPEAKER_00 6:47

The old metagaming for your FM or your locals, except for it's your brothers, so you're just sneaking into their room, watching how they're setting up their sideboard and then switching your deck up, or how how did that work?

SPEAKER_01 6:58

Uh so I owned zero cards. Uh, so I played whatever was handed to me, which uh which you know ended up kind of manifesting um some I would say bad uh tournament decisions later on in my career, um of a tendency of like switching off of a good deck to play something new. But yeah, so I just played whatever deck that they had built that was extra. Um I also had a sister um who was also playing at this time, so you know that we had five plus people playing in an event. So it was really kind of just I got the leftovers, which was fine. Um, and then eventually it kind of progressed up to you know having a little bit more say in what I got to play in events.

SPEAKER_00 7:48

How many PTQs did all four of you top eight, or just all the hair brothers or or even the hair sister just uh taking up all the top eight spots? Did that happen? Not often, no.

SPEAKER_01 8:00

Uh yeah, so we I mean we would you know top eight here and there. Um I don't there was a couple times um I it was me and Josh who uh top aided and we had to play against each other. He beat me, unfortunately. Um but not too often did we have to to fight each other in the in the top eight.

SPEAKER_00 8:27

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SPEAKER_02 8:34

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SPEAKER_00 8:55

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SPEAKER_02 9:01

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SPEAKER_00 9:07

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SPEAKER_02 9:13

That's game night in Columbia, Tennessee, where the community actually shows up. Yeah, I was just gonna say, um, so if if you ask any of the other brothers right now, I think that they would say that you are now the leading brother. Uh, how long before that happened? So we we got to the point where you're able to like beat them once in a while, but at what point do you feel like you were now the brother? You were the end boss.

SPEAKER_01 9:41

I mean, it depended on uh I mean, I was 16, 17. Uh, if you asked me then, I would probably have said I was the best.

SPEAKER_02 9:49

Um as a 16 or 17-year-old would.

SPEAKER_01 9:52

Yes. Having retrospect, um, I I don't think that was the case. Um, I think it it wouldn't have been until pretty recently that I would say I'm, you know, I I would put myself, you know, as a favorite in a gauntlet of my siblings. Um, but back then I would have confidently been wrong. Um, we all kind of we all kind of had our like our strengths and our like tendencies. Like I said, I uh earlier I would very rarely play the same deck at the same event, like twice. Like I was always changing, even off of like the the perceived best deck, to just play like a wacky brew or ra wacky like random 5-0 daily list. Um where like someone like my brother Josh, he would just stick to green a green ramp deck, whatever was playable. If there was a rampant growth legal, he was casting it. Um so now I know that like that he got a lot of edge because of that, where um switching off of a deck to play like time sieve combo um was fun, but it was not did not necessarily make me any better at the game. Got it.

SPEAKER_00 11:20

Now uh people listening might not know any of your history, but this isn't your first run. So you start to play more competitively, you play at F and M. You had a pretty good run in your younger years, right? With some some PTs and and everything?

SPEAKER_01 11:38

It was uh around uh so I had a pretty deep run in uh Grand Prix Washington, DC of 2010. Um I was fifteen, I think, at the time. I might have been fourteen. Um and uh at this point, um again the DCI rating was still around, and that qualified you for certain events depending on your rating. So I already had a relatively high rating going into the events, um, from playing like local events, state championships, uh PTQs, whatnot. Um, but uh played in uh Grand Prix Washington and my record ended up being um after like the three-round buys um was 12-5-1. Um and looking back at the opponents they played, um I got a lot of points from them. I played against Tomo Asaito, Reed Duke, uh Conley Woods, um, a lot of like at that point, like the best of the best, and they had very high rating. Um, so that qualified me for the US Nationals. Um back when that was a thing. Uh did okay in nationals, and then um had a couple deep runs at other Grand Prix, um, specifically Grand Prix Providence of 2011. Um I was 12-5, and then the next uh Grand Prix was Grand Prix Pittsburgh. I lost my winning in um and then beat uh Osip in the last round to get ninth on breakers, but um that catapulted my rating high enough that um I was uh at that point I believe my rate uh my ranking for DCI uh rating was 54th in the world, um, which got you a qualification two worlds. Um at the same time they were transitioning to a different system. Um they transitioned away from DCI into a um system called Planeswalker Points, um, and that uh the grandfathered rating I had from DCI got me the next PT invite. So that was uh PT Dark Ascension. Um so I qualified for at the time it was the last world championship um after 2011 worlds uh they stopped doing worlds and changed uh changed how they did that event. So I played in the last world championship at the time, and then the uh the next pro tour after that.

SPEAKER_00 14:35

Did you ever get to play a pro tour with your brothers?

SPEAKER_01 14:38

Yes. So um Pro Tour Dark Ascension, um, which was in Honolulu, Hawaii, um, two of my brothers, um, my brother Josh and my oldest brother Sean both qualified from that new system. Um Josh had played in the first modern Pro Tour, uh PT Philly, I think. Um so that was able to catapult him with enough points to to qualify for that. So I was able to play in in Honolulu, Hawaii of all places, with uh two of my brothers, which was like the best experience.

SPEAKER_02 15:18

Yeah, it kind of uh kind of gives a whole new meaning to the testing house when it's just home.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

Yes, it's it's literally your kitchen table. Um yeah, it it's it's kind of funny when uh you know your family's so good at magic that uh Elijah, who's now qualified for Worlds for the second time, wasn't good enough to be considered a brother. Yeah. So at some point you stepped away from the game, right? You you said you took a pretty extensive break. You know, when when did that happen and uh what what was your what made you stop?

SPEAKER_01 15:53

Um so that happened about 20 2015, I think, um was like I I played in a couple events here and there, um, but uh I got just a a normal job. I went from, you know, I was still you know a teenager, um, and then I uh you know it became evident that magic was not gonna be something that could support myself financially. Um like I for a while I really thought that I was you know I could get into content creation and you know get on to like channel fireball and write articles and all that. Um but it was it was evident at that point uh in my life that you know I I I do need to enter the workforce, work a real job. Um and I I've had a real tough time with like you know, I I'm a person that goes all or nothing into something, like I couldn't stand, you know, just playing a little bit of magic um and not like competing, you know, uh as much. Um so I just kind of took uh quite a long time off. Um and then it wasn't until the new pretty much the the RCQ um system came out, um, which also brought two uh my two of my brothers, Josh and Drew, out of retirement and they started playing as well. Um and that's kind of what got me back into playing, was you know, I had my brothers were playing again, so it gave us another chance of just being able to compete and uh go to events together.

SPEAKER_00 17:39

You had to fulfill the destiny of uh assembling Heritron on Team Pillow for it.

SPEAKER_01 17:44

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

So what about so you get back into the game, you you start playing RCQs. Tell me about your experience in the RC system prior to Milwaukee, uh, about your qualifications, your your different results, and sort of maybe some close calls, or how did it go for you before this most recent one?

SPEAKER_01 18:04

Yeah, so uh early on I had zero expectations. Um, you know, I I was more or less just playing because I just wanted to hang out with my brothers. Um you know the system was relatively new. Um, I think the first season I jumped in like uh three quarters of the way in and uh uh didn't get the qualification. And then um my first uh regional championship um I actually got the qualification was um Dallas of 2024. Um OTJ like was the newest set I th set, I think.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

Okay, not the one where they put the metal detectors and block the bathrooms. Did they figure it out? No, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_01 18:54

Um no, this was uh uh whatever the convention was that was doing it for a while. That like uh DreamHack. DreamHack, yes. Um it was when DreamHack was still doing it. Um so that was cool. Um so I went to Dallas, I played Domain Control, um, and I really felt how rusty I'd become. Um I uh uh the Domain Control was a deck I played a fair amount. I I felt pretty good of my deck choice, um, but it took a lot long time to win. And uh I ended up getting a draw pretty early on. Um I was 2-0 and then I got a draw against um uh I really I it was a match I was gonna win. Uh my opponent played to the draw, which is you know is a strategy. Um and then I got a second draw uh in the domain mirror, and uh so I ended up m being 2-2-2. And uh, you know, I I own the you know, with m most draws, you know, there's something you could have prevented that from happening. Um, so I own that. Um so I was kind of disappointed, but you know, had a good time. It was uh the first time I've been to Texas, so had good barbecue. Um uh Josh, my brother Josh, he had qualified, so I went to fam. And then the next one was uh uh Washington, DC, which was Pioneer. I audible to a uh really bad Ractos Transmogify deck.

SPEAKER_00 20:42

This was the RC Walmart, right?

SPEAKER_01 20:44

Yes. And uh I I think I played well you know reasonably well, but my deck was just awful. It was not a good deck for the event. Um 3-4, then I uh played in uh RC Portland, which was modern, and that was um the Underworld Breach uh format, and uh I registered Boris Energy, and uh that's probably all I need to say is uh I did not have a good record.

SPEAKER_00 21:21

You did not have Mark Sopel in your deck uh in Underworld.

SPEAKER_01 21:24

No, I uh I did beat every breach opponent I played against, um, and then I lost every other match, so that was weird. Um at that point again, I was just kind of I was disappointed. Um I I really hadn't been putting as much time and energy into these events as um as I really should have. Um, but it was at this point still kind of just more of a every couple months I go on a vacation with my brother. Others and I play some magic and I lose and I'm still, you know, having fun. Um, but it was at Portland that started to kind of irk me a little, and like I kind of like, okay, like if this is something I'm gonna spend this money on in this this time, you know, I don't like losing. You know, at the end of the day, I like you know, if I win-lose uh, you know, what have you, uh the day ends with me and my brothers having dinner and that's great. But like I still wanna win, and like so I started putting more time and energy um like personally into playing the game. Uh had uh RC Hartford is when I started, you know, having a little bit better results um consistently. Um I ended I started off um 6-0 and 1 and then had uh lost the last round of uh day one. Um I lost sorry run a run around day one, so I ended up um X2 and one, and then I got some sort of like overnight flu, and uh it was really like really affected how I played to the point where there was a I was playing omniscience combo and I had Omniscience, uh Brela's awakening, and two Meringue River Regents in my hand, and I just cast a coil and catch, and all I need to do is discard omniscience, and untap and cast awakening omniscience, but I was so out of it that I discarded like a random card. I'm pretty sure I shuffled my hand and just discarded a random card, and untapped and I died. Oh no, and uh so I was pretty frustrated at that. Like, you know, I it sort of the tournament started off so well, I thought like my preparation kind of you know was finally coming to fruition. Um and then the wheels ran off and I I died. Um and then uh that was the first of I I day to every RC I played in after that, um, but had nothing to show for it. Um usually I would, you know, if I was in contention for min cash, I just dropped before that just because I wanted to, you know, n not waste my time. Um which brought me to to Milwaukee where it was my Well before that before that though, you you joined Team Pillar for it.

SPEAKER_00 24:46

Yes, specifically before that event. How did that change your your preparation?

SPEAKER_01 24:51

So it before um almost all my testing, I had a little bit of like for um RC Las Vegas. I had two other people that were um sicko's and were deciding to play Boris Energy um with me, and uh so we just played games and communicated a little bit, and that was like my first um real forway into testing with people that are not related to myself, um, which was uh a lot, you know, some good, some bad, I'll I'll put it that way. Um and then uh at this point uh both of my brothers were already part of Team Pillar Fort. So um after Las Vegas, which was my third day two in a row uh without results, um I finally joined Team Pillar Fort. And uh it it definitely is night and day um when you have people that you are able to have conversations with and you know blur out every idea under the sun. And you know, some people might be like, Yeah, that's a great idea, you should totally play that card. And some people are like, Why would you ever play Bright Glass Gear Hulk? Um, that card does nothing. Uh and uh I I think the most important part, I think the the the biggest growth a lot of magic players can have is being able to explain their thought process and be able to explain why they make plays. Um that's not something you ever get to learn or flex like that muscle, unless if you put yourself in a position to do that, like unless if you're streaming and you have Twitch chat telling you that you're awful and you have to like defend yourself, or unless if you you know are inviting other people to like critique your play. Um so I think just on the the access alone of being able to have people like, hey, look well, why'd you make that play? You know, what is what's the thought process behind here? Um even besides like the the physically testing and like preparing for it, just that alone I think you know makes you a better magic player, you know by itself.

SPEAKER_02 27:22

Yeah, really interesting. Obviously, you know, you are you are are in a position where you're recognizing that like, hey, I need to put in the work, I need to, you know, level up my game. Uh what were some specific steps leading up to uh you joining, and then even after um that you took to ensure that you would make you know the PT or or uh achieve you know whatever goals you had, uh ultimately leading to the to the top eight that you got.

SPEAKER_01 27:51

Yeah, I mean I I think it it was all about how I was looking at like the games I was playing and processing the um information. I mean, truth be told, a lot of my success in Milwaukee was like just pure luck. Um I I I don't want to like you know come across as I I was able to, you know, like a rocky uh training montage and I you know was running up and downstairs constantly. Um but I I think it was just my approach of how I was you know consuming magic content, how I was um like you know looking back at you know my matches. I think a big part for me was uh I kind of habitually would, you know, if after work I would get on and I would jump on you know Magic Arena Moto and I would play games and it would be two hours would pass. I'm like, what am I doing? Like I'm I'm not like full focus, I'm not paying attention, like I'm just going through the motions, and during that time I'm like hoping that that's getting me better somehow. Like so I I would you know stopped I stopped playing as much magic, but I spent more time focusing on the matches I was playing. Um that I think is like was in insanely helpful uh for me, and especially like being able to, if I'm not playing as much magic, but I'm able to watch my teammates play and be able to you know provide input and you know uh advice in in that regard. I'm still killing that same time I would have killed after work anyways, um, but it's being used productively instead of just you know effectively doom scrolling on Magic Arena for two hours.

SPEAKER_02 29:49

Um that's something that we that we've talked about a lot, is that like not all matches are good matches, or not all testing is good testing. Um not all games that you play are going to provide you the the same amount of like leveling up experience. Um how do you how do you make sure that the games that you're playing are good practice for you?

SPEAKER_01 30:10

I mean ultimately it starts with you know what you do going into it. Like, like I said, uh if I don't if I'm not in the mind frame, if I had a bad day at work, it's probably not a good day to start testing on Arena, like, or testing on Magical Online. Like I'm gonna take the losses m maybe more negatively than um I should if I'm playing a deck I'm not too convinced on, all of a sudden that deck is you know trash before I even play a game. So I think it's the first is just your mindset going into it. The second is uh just spending as much time figuring out like what at what points um you know are relevant or like you know if you're playing in a on Magic Online and uh you're able to find your opponent's deck list, like if you're you know testing for an open deckless event, like pull it up, see if you can't, you know, gleam information from that, and like treating as closely as you would to the event you're you're testing for as possible. Um I think that just keeping an open mind and like if you get data that contradicts what you think reality should be. So um a point for me uh that kind of was slowly driving me insane going to Milwaukee was um I played a lot of uh Cub uh in you know local events, um and I it was just a deck I enjoyed playing. Um it had a very poor record of the Pro Tour, and uh everyone was saying the deck sucked. Everyone said that you know it has all these really bad matchups, you can't beat um Spellamentals, your lessons matchup's not good. Uh and I just never stopped winning with it. Like I at one point I was like 20 I think it was 23 matches that I won versus two matches I lost, and uh as as I'm very skeptical. Like if I if I see that I'm like okay, like I I won five matches against spell mentals, and people are telling me it's like a you know basically a 90% chance that spell mentals wins. So you have to kind of take that off a grain of sorrow of like, okay, I'm winning these games, but why am I winning these games? Is it because my opponent doesn't have the information what deck I'm on? Is it because my opponent is not playing the deck well? Um, or is it because you're doing something different than someone else? Like, if I'm playing four Ken Eye Curators, four Soul Guy Lanterns in my deck, like in my main deck, I'm probably gonna have a good matchup against Spell Mentals. Uh in spite of the matchup data saying I have bad a bad matchup against it, uh, that doesn't mean that I can take those cards out and say, oh, I have a great matchup against this deck. So I think just being realistic with the data um that you you have, and like if you know that like your opponent moles to five, maybe you you notate that on your however keeping track of your um your matches, like that that's not a statistically good result. Like you probably win most of your games with your opponents on the play on a mold of five versus your seven quad hand. Um so just being very skeptical, even when it's about something that you want. Like I wanted to play Badger Mole Cub in Milwaukee, and I was winning, and every thing in my body was telling me like, okay, something's wrong here. I'm doing something, you know, my my testing's not good, or uh, I'm just playing with bad people. Um instead of just saying, Oh, this deck's cracked, and I'm you know, I can't lose. Um, so I would just say be skeptical um and be in the right mind frame to test before you you know waste two hours and you walk away just be feeling frustrated.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

That's great advice. Yeah. I mean, just being honest with yourself is so hard to do. And I think that's one of the great things about having friends and and teammates that you trust. And we've talked about this with people who are, you know, wanting to join the team or just wondering what we're doing. And a lot of teams do things seasonally, they only test for a certain season and then the team disbands and comes back together as a different team. There's something to be said for sort of building a trust that you know if if Austin and Elijah are both telling me that I'm wrong, even if I think I'm right, I probably need to at least really start to question these things and you know, just be honest with myself. Am I actually wrong? Uh am I right? You know, are we missing something? And I I think that there's a lot to that mindset that you know, that's um that's that's a really interesting take, Elijah. I like that.

SPEAKER_02 35:43

So um you you've got you've got your prep done, you're feeling better about Milwaukee probably than some other events, uh, you're you're pretty locked into your deck. Give us a brief synopsis of what that tournament looked like for you. Obviously, we've we've got the spoiler that you top aided, uh, but uh just kind of walk us through briefly what happened between rounds one and fifteen to get you there.

SPEAKER_01 36:06

Yeah. Um so I a big part for me for any event is really like taking each match um one match at a time. So uh I played against pretty much every deck in standard, um, besides spell mentals um until the top eight. Uh I lost it was I won the first four rounds, um, lost against um my best matchup, which would be um Landfall, in a uh uh in a mana I just it was comical. I had to fight through um three Mossborne Hydras, and it I was able to answer all three temporarily and uh lost to a uh uh origin of metal bending on my unable to scream on a hydra and like got dealt a million damage in one turn. Um and uh picked up my second loss in round eight to um Is it Elementals? Uh played against like three shades of Bajemol Cub decks. Um and uh it was ended day one, seven, two. Um so I was feeling pretty good. Um but also that was that meant it was my fourth uh day two, and I was in a similar position as the uh the past three events, so I definitely was not celebrating. Uh I was celebrating that our teammate um Tyson was uh in uh he was 8-1, which was very exciting. Um and the fact that he was playing a deck that he uh audible to and enjoyed was even better.

SPEAKER_00 38:00

Spoiler alert for later.

SPEAKER_01 38:02

Yes. Uh and then uh day two is really when uh it kind of like my mentality of taking each round, you know, one at a time, uh kind of went it was it wasn't until I in round 13 when I beat my opponent and he asked me like, oh well you you know, he was a little bummed, but he was like, Oh, like did you still need your PT qualification? I'm like, oh yeah. He's like, well, congrats. I'm like, congrats. He's like, yeah, like I think even if I loss you should be qualified. Um it wasn't until then like it kind of said in like, oh shoot, I'm you did it. I'm st I'm still winning. I I I rattled off uh you know five in a row, I think at that point, and uh then got called into feature match area for uh round 14, and I see my opponent is playing Landfall. And you know, uh from early in the tournament, um, I know that that matchup, even though it's a very good matchup, is not um one that is unlosable. Um and uh yeah, I open my seven, and my seven is uh Lana Welfalph, Gene Pollinita, Gene Pollinita, or Boroid, or Boroid, and two lands. I'm like, okay. I could not have asked for a better hand. I'm on the place.

SPEAKER_02 39:35

I don't know what does.

SPEAKER_01 39:36

Yeah, I don't know either. Yeah. Uh spoiler, I died. Oh no. I uh I had just vomited my hand out, had two or boroids, and my opponent had an ice tail explorer, and then played a harmonizer and an escape tunnel that he had in play was enough to uh yeah to kill me. So at that point I was, you know, kind of accepting like okay, like fair's fair. Like I I I was feeling pretty good and just got my dreams crushed, but you know, I Tyson's still crushing it, and uh I was able to qualify for the PT at least. And then um game two wasn't really much of a game. Um I kind of uh had just the absolute you know best start possible, and he uh I think he I he he died before he could even untap of his badging all cub. And then game three he um went land go, uh forest go, promising van go, forest, and then he died. Um he he had a kept a hand that was risky, it was um multiple uh Mael Striders Resolve and Um like Ice Till and I think um a uh a harmonizer. Um it was just kind of banking on drawing a uh a creature early on, and or that I don't have you know the absolute best hand possible. Um so won that game and uh still kind of didn't set in until I was able to draw. It was a clean cut for the top eight, and uh I was able to draw with my teammate Tyson, um, which was even better.

SPEAKER_00 41:30

How did I not realize that you guys paired into each other in the last round?

SPEAKER_01 41:33

Yeah, and it was it was great because mentioned it to him before. I'm like, I yeah, I really hope that like you know we're able to play, and he was he he said like oh maybe I get the pair down I can scoop to you. I'm like, no, don't don't do that. Um uh but yeah, so yeah, we we got paired up against each other in uh the last round. It was a clean cut, so we were able to draw, and then uh I get paired up against my uh worst matchup, is it spell mentals in the the top eight? And uh again, kind of you know, not counting myself out, but I'm like, okay, you know, there's two of them in the top eight, and I I I knew based off of standings that I I was gonna have to play either one of them. Um even if my breakers went up, which they did, I was gonna have to play against one of them. And uh I was one of nine people over the weekend that beat that matchup, uh, which was crazy. I think the there was a it was like a 16% cub had a 16% win rate against uh Spellmentals, and uh my opponent got a little unlucky. Uh he had to mull again. Um I mowed to five on game two, and he mowed five on game three, um, but was able to to get there with Keen Eyed Curator, and then had to team kill Tyson in the top four, which was bittersweet playing um against the against a teammate, and especially with the stakes of Walds on the line, and uh I really wanted to go to Walds. Like I had uh the Walds from 2011 was like ended really poorly for me, and the fact that I had a match that I could like potentially redeem myself and go back to that was um you know I I took that very seriously, and uh it was bittersweet having to to beat him. And uh then my final against Will was even though I lost pretty decisively, um I think was uh great matches and uh Will's a great guy, so uh it definitely helped losing to someone that I respect both as a person and a player.

SPEAKER_00 44:00

Just a tough one. I mean, we were looking at it from you know the team side. Basically, we were guaranteed that one of our teammates was going to worlds. We really wanted it to be the other side of the bracket to where we could have two go to worlds would have been crazy. Um Will played really well. I know you talked a bit about he had a a better plan for that matchup than a lot of your other opponents did and played it, played it differently. I think um Yeah, he he obviously deserved to win, was very well prepared. Uh Tyson had a great run, just really awesome weekend overall. So after a great weekend and everything that you you got to go through in Milwaukee, what advice would you have to someone who is trying to maybe play in their first PT or get back to it like you did?

SPEAKER_01 44:48

Yeah, I mean I think that the the most important thing is um if you are able to surround yourself with players who are better than you. Um if you don't necessarily have that resource available to you if you're in a rural area, an area that just doesn't, you know, play too much magic, um magic online is the best place to play against people who are better than you. Um I always say that uh losing is you know you learn 10 times as much losing a game of magic than you do winning. Um winning a game, you kind of you know it's hard for you to be objective of like, okay, like where did you know how did things go right for me? Um, you know, losing a game, you can kind of pinpoint like, okay, well, I lost um against lessons because they had um three counter spells. So um that is I need to maybe configure my deck differently, or if that's the plan you know, lessons is gonna be on, then I need to you know play aggressively or play passively. Um but yeah, surround yourself with better people. Um, don't take losses too, you know, to heart. They're good, um, they're a good resource to kind of improve. Um and then you know test with a purpose. Um, you know, you should always be going into a session with a goal in mind, whether it's to get more reps to understand your deck, um, whether it's to understand a specific matchup, um, you always want to have something you're trying to work towards. Um, if you are just working on your general skill, um a great resource is is recording like a VOD of you playing, and then if you're able to sit down with someone who you trust and respect and you know have them watch that along with you, um you just get so much perspective and so much understanding um from it. Uh also don't be too like set on playing a deck if I want to play Badamor Cub, um you know, Simic Virtual, uh whatever. Uh I I'm gonna play that deck and then gonna play other decks against it so I can see you know the other side of things. Um yeah, the the biggest thing is surrounding yourself with plays better than you, and then asking questions, being humble about uh you know your results, um, being humble about like or realistic with um your testing as far as if you feel like you have a really good matchup against your deck's factual worst matchup. You need to be looking at you know what's going on there and the reason why you feel that way. Um and then you know magic online is uh it's almost a cliche because that's what everyone tells you is if you want to get better, play magic online. The client is like a dinosaur, and uh uh I understand that, but you will play against world champions, you'll play against um people who would be world champions if they ever decided to leave the house. Um But you will play against people better than you, and you will lose more than you've ever lost in any sort of event um even close to you.

SPEAKER_02 48:40

Yeah, I've always been a big fan of just talking through lines when we're testing and playing uh uh games within the team or or whatever it might be. Um I think that it provides, like Elijah said, it provides uh a really good reinforcement both for the person who is playing to be able to defend what they're doing, but also the people that are watching to, you know, just make sure that like things are being thought through, you know. Like if if I'm watching Elijah make a play, for example, as an observer, and and I think that it's a misplay, then me saying, Hey, uh why did you do that, and him reinforcing it is obviously going to put my mind at ease, but also um, you know, we get to see it kind of play out in real time why that decision mattered. Uh, or vice versa, you know, sometimes uh players as great as Elijah will make a misplay, you know, and me saying, Hey, why did you do that? Um, and he says, uh because I misplayed or I misclicked or whatever, you know, then then we can kind of boil down, okay. Well, I don't have to think about his reasoning for doing that. I can just chalk that up to it being a misplay, you know. So talking through lines I think is is really great, really important.

SPEAKER_00 49:52

As we kind of wind things down, Elijah, I think it's getting close to closing time, and it's time for some pillow talk. If you were heading to Richmond this weekend, what standard deck would you take with you? Who are you taking home? And if you were going to Hunter Burton next weekend, who are you taking home there?

SPEAKER_01 50:12

Uh I think Landfall is uh is the deck that uh one gets the most from um Ninja Turtles. Uh is also just like an insanely powerful deck. Uh I think that's my favorite to win. Um I think the deck that is going to uh perform the um least well uh would be Prowess. I know uh a lot of a lot of people really high on that deck. Uh I think that deck is gonna get crushed. Umfortunate it's a cool deck, but I think that deck is gonna absolutely just get destroyed. Um and then the other event, is that modern? I'm sorry. Oh, it's modern. It's modern, yeah. I would play Boris Energy. That that's that's that's my baby. That's Elijah's deck, y'all. If you didn't know. That's my modern deck. I have played Mono Blue Tron. Um, that was a deck I played in uh Oh geez um, Houston. A day two to fit in Houston, the point of calamity. Um that deck's really fun. Uh but yeah, I'd I'd be playing Boss Energy. Uh you might be able to convince me to play Affinity. That that that deck got a lot of cool tools, but uh there's also probably a lot of people would be playing Wrath of the Skies, so I want to be the person casting Wrath of the Skies.

SPEAKER_00 51:42

Seems reasonable. Austin, Pillotok, who are you taking home?

SPEAKER_02 51:46

So for Richmond, I think I'm gonna pick the uh mono white drum deck that's been popping up over the last week or so. I think that deck looks really cool. Um I'm excited to see how it does in Richmond. Uh of course, by the time this episode is out and released, we'll have that data. It will be probably about a week and a half away. Um, so we'll we'll be able to see how close we were with our takes, but I think that that deck will perform pretty well this weekend. Uh for Hunter Burton, I think I would probably play um one of the guys on our team was streaming a Grixis uh Necrodominance cool but rude deck, and I think that that deck looked really, really sweet. So I would probably try to jam something like that just for the just for the fun of it.

SPEAKER_00 52:30

Yeah, that does seem like it's uh a pretty pretty fun deck. Um so since I can't pick Prowess now, because Elijah said it's gonna get crushed. I'm kidding, I wasn't gonna pick it anyway. I also, as standard, uh I think I would play the mono white drum deck. Um it's kind of uh uh an interesting offshoot, has some similarities to our Jess Guy Pixie deck that we played in Portland. I think has some interesting uh matchups, a lot of cool lines that uh I I think the deck is likely pretty strong. So I would play that this weekend. And if I was going to Hunter Burton, I know I've been saying affinity for a minute, I would stick with that because I think Krang Mastermind is going to be pretty decent. That's a new Turtles card where if you have less than four cards in your hand, you draw the difference and it has affinity for artifacts. So the hope is that you cast it for blue, blue, and then you know, draw three or something. Uh I think that I don't know if it fixes any of the issues that the deck has had, but I I do think it's a powerful effect, and uh I would I would run affinity, I think.

SPEAKER_02 53:35

Surprise, surprise.

SPEAKER_00 53:36

Alright. Well, Elijah, uh, you've been awesome. We really appreciate your time and and sharing all these things with us. Thank you for coming to our Pillow Talk.

SPEAKER_01 53:44

Of course, thank you guys.

SPEAKER_00 53:46

Alright, Austin. That was a great conversation.

SPEAKER_02 53:49

Yeah, uh Elijah is somebody that I've known for a long time. Um, he was uh, as he said, he was one of the the FM end bosses when I was playing in Maine. And um, so yeah, I've I've had a lot of respect for Elijah. I've been able to see him uh play at high levels for for a long time. So really glad that we were able to see him do very well in Milwaukee and then also get a chance to talk to him here.

SPEAKER_00 54:14

Absolutely. And you know, he really made me think a couple of times just kind of about what his level up moments were. So to me, explaining your lines, I never really saw that as a benefit. Sometimes I wonder if we're being annoying by asking these questions and explaining the lines when you know he's he's making the right play. I'm like, well, just leave him alone. He's he's he's playing the match. But if that actually does reinforce and makes you sort of justify what you're doing and think it through more critically, it's not really something that that we're doing absent somebody asking us a question. Um, maybe we're wrong, maybe we're right, but I I think the exercise of actually thinking through it was was something that stood out to me in that conversation as well. A lot of people may not know Elijah. Those of us who are on the team and have spent time with him, we were not surprised to see him do really well at this event. He's a very smart player, uh, he's very conscientious of sort of what he does and why he's methodical and really creative. So when the casters were talking about some of the card selections and things of that nature, I know that he used a guide, I think, from Simon Nielsen for a lot of those decisions. And I it just I love seeing some of the stuff that he talked about be reinforced by other good players and then see that sort of play out in the way that it did. But not surprised to see Elijah do well, but just very happy for him and uh excited to see him crush the PT and worlds.

SPEAKER_02 55:40

Yeah, I I honestly think that the biggest surprise is that it took him, you know, the four or five RCs, the four or five day twos for him to make top eight to begin with, you know. Uh he's just such a great player that uh I'm I'm surprised that it didn't happen sooner.

SPEAKER_00 55:56

Agreed. Happy to see it, and I'm sure the first of many. But to everyone out there, thank you for coming to our Pillow Talk.