Forgiveness

Hi besties 🤍 today we are talking about forgiveness. We share our struggles with forgiveness and what we have learned from past experiences. While we are still learning ourselves, we wanted to create a space in this episode for you to feel seen, heard, and loved. We know this is a heavy topic and pray that after this episode you see how Jesus has forgiven you, and his strength that is available to  help you walk through this as well. We love you guys and hope you enjoy the episode.

Transcript

SPEAKER_06 0:00

Besties. My name is Jasmine. Tatiana. And welcome to Jesus in Vesties. Yay. Oh my goodness. We are so excited to talk about today's um episode. What is it, Tatiana? Forgiveness. Forgiveness can be a really difficult topic to talk about just because I feel like a lot of the times You know, it could be really, really hard to forgive people. Yeah. So we just wanted to talk about it. Do you want to open up in prayer? Um we usually don't start with prayer. We pray before the episode, but I think it may be just very important as we were talking previously, Tatiana, uh about starting with prayer, because you were saying it was a pretty heavy topic. So I think that is something that was a really good idea.

SPEAKER_01 0:49

Yeah. Okay. Okay, so Father God, we just come before you and we thank you, Lord, that you are gentle and merciful and gracious and kind and you are the source of all peace, Lord. I just pray for anybody listening, and even myself and Jasmine for our hearts and um the hearts of the listeners who see this as a very sensitive subject. Lord, we thank you that we are so safe with you, and we thank you that you have just displayed forgiveness in such a powerful way, Lord. And I just pray for anybody listening that they would see that and that they would enter that journey with you to start the process of forgiveness and the healing of forgiveness, Lord. Um, I pray for any relationships that um they need to receive forgiveness or they need to be forgiven. Um I just pray that they would see how you have forgiven them and just that comfort that you provide in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen.

SPEAKER_06 1:51

Thank you. All right, y'all. Let's go ahead and get started. Oh my gosh, what was that, Jasmine? I always do that. Let's get started. Um, so I wanted to start off by saying like forgiveness can be really, really difficult. A lot of the times we have relationships or friendships or just certain things that we go through with certain people, and it has caused us so many deep wounds. And um for us to be feeling you know betrayed. I feel like sometimes it's in our human nature to be like, we to hold grudges or to it's easier not to talk to this person or um just want them to feel what they once made us feel, I feel like, right? Like some kind of revenge, like, or we just want justice, right? To allow us to feel better um about them hurting us. And so it is such a hard topic to talk about, and it is not easy to forgive. It definitely is a process um to forgive because we have those wounds in our heart that it hurts so bad and we try to cover up, right? Yeah, but it's not really dealt with, right?

SPEAKER_01 3:09

I heard someone say that forgiveness, unforgiveness is drinking poison, expecting the other person to die. Yeah. Wow. So that is wow. I think after walking through it, I totally see it.

SPEAKER_06 3:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:25

Because it can just be such a weight and feel so heavy, but you think you're doing yourself a favor. Yeah, it can come across as like I'm protecting myself, I am giving that person what they deserve. And even the whole thing of like that wasn't fair.

SPEAKER_04 3:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:45

It wasn't fair. Um, but I think also too, it's so powerful the way the Lord talks about it and how he displayed it for us and gives it to us freely and is so generous with that every single day.

SPEAKER_06 3:57

So, yeah, I agree. Um, it's so easy to just kind of like, oh, I don't talk to that person anymore, but it's like technically a grudge, you know what I mean? Like when you it's an unresolved um issue or um wound that you have in your heart that you're just not you're avoiding, um, and it's not healthy. Yeah, like it's not healthy, it's definitely um important to talk about forgiveness and how we can do that, right? Yeah um, so that's what we wanted to talk to you guys about is basically sharing with you guys um how we are still learning, right? And how we're what we're doing to go about it um in our walk with Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 4:41

Yeah, we're we're not perfect, guys.

SPEAKER_06 4:43

Yeah, we're definitely not perfect.

SPEAKER_00 4:45

We've had our share of learning this the hard way too.

SPEAKER_06 4:48

Yeah, and I think there will be more, like we're always gonna, you know, when you're in relationships or community or you know, you have family, like you're bound to have fallouts of people. Um, but it's the way that we react and the way that we um go about it. Um and we have to go about it the right way, especially as Christians, like we have to uh forgive like the Lord forgave us.

SPEAKER_01 5:12

Yeah, especially being married. I've I mean you guys know we're not married, but I've heard people who are married say, Oh, you're gonna learn how to forgive real fast once you're married, and you have a spouse and you see all of them. So that's something we can practice for our waiting season until our husbands come.

SPEAKER_06 5:32

Literally, and it's you know, and the good thing is that um we can learn that with people around us and how we've been hurt in the past, um, and how we've taken steps to forgive that person, and it's not necessarily saying like going to that person to speak and say, Hey, this is for closure, and I forgive you. Like, you don't have to do that. You can simply say, like, Lord, I forgive this person and truly meaning, you know what I mean? Yeah, um, and and that's okay too, but it's the way that we we go about things, yeah, and also having boundaries with that person.

SPEAKER_01 6:07

I know there's you know some situations where someone was maybe they were raped or something like that. Forgiveness does not take away what they did or anything like that, and it doesn't it definitely doesn't mean to go and hang out with that person and be best friends with them or anything like that. Forgiveness is definitely for you, and I think after walking through it, I understand it.

SPEAKER_06 6:31

Yeah, like forgiveness, yeah. Yeah, for sure. Um we wanted to start off with this verse, um, which has we both were talking about it, and we're like, wait, this is a per the perfect verse to start with. Um, because we have a few like things that we wanna wanna say about it. Um this verse I feel like reminds me of um how like the Lord was speaking to Peter um when he was saying like how many times should we forgive people and his response, and that response to him is his response to us as well. Yeah. Okay, so yeah, if you want to read it, it's Matthew 18, 21. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 7:11

Then Peter came up to him and asked, Lord, how often should I forgive someone who sins against me? Seven times, no, not seven times, Jesus replied, but seventy times seven.

SPEAKER_06 7:24

That verse itself, he's saying it right there. Like, forgiveness is not meant to be counted. Like, do you think the Lord is counting each of our like mistakes? And like, okay, like this is how much I've forgiven this person. Like, no, the Lord's like the His forgiveness is ultimate, like He ultimately forgives us, and um I think that's how we need to learn how to forgive others, yeah, is how He's telling us like forgiveness is like you don't have to count that, like that's not limited, like there's you have to continue to forgive and forgive and forgive.

SPEAKER_00 7:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 8:00

And it's like truly forgiving too, you know what I mean? Like God freely forgives us. And I think that's a beautiful thing to remember. When you're having a hard time forgiving, it's not just like about like, oh, well, I've already forgiven this person like six times. Just because you've forgiven them that amount of times, like you should it should be, you should not have to limit it. Um, you can change about like the boundaries. Like, yes, I forgive you, like I forgive this person, but at the end of the day, also it's like setting your boundaries of like, okay, you don't have to continue to give them access.

SPEAKER_01 8:36

Yeah, I think in some situations it's well, in all situations, it's it's a heart posture before the Lord. Like, this isn't gonna stand in between me and the Lord. This isn't because forgiveness can also be very distracting and it can just bring up a lot of stuff and hold us back from freedom. Um, but in certain situations, of course, there should be boundaries.

SPEAKER_06 9:01

Yeah, boundaries of like if it's a continuous thing, oh, where is that verse? I don't know if I have it, um, but I was thinking of it where it was um basically saying how um like you can you can speak to this person, like where you go and speak to the person um about the conflict directly, and if they do not listen, go and get like counsel and then have them speak to that person.

SPEAKER_01 9:31

I think so. Yeah, one of the gospels is something like that. It was really good. Like making like keeping peace with someone.

SPEAKER_06 9:37

Um, yeah, like if there is a conflict, like go in. I'll I'll try to look for it while we're talking, but um it was something like that, but um, I think that's like a good reminder too, is like um just kind of going about like he's telling us like how to go about the conflict as well. Like you can go and talk to your brother in Christ or sister in Christ, hey, this is how I feel. And it's like they're not really gonna listen either, you know what I mean? But um, yeah, I thought that was a good um verse to remember. I'll look for it here in a minute. Yeah. Um, why do you why do you think we need to um forgive?

SPEAKER_01 10:14

Um well the first thing that comes to my mind is it's it's a command from the Lord. Yes, but it's also something that is learned. It's not something that we can just do. I know when I first started like really walking with Jesus, I there's like one specific thing that I'm thinking of that I had to forgive this person, um, and I never got an apology. And I still had to forgive them. And I can remember this was just like an ongoing thing that was going on um with someone who was very close to me, and after this person was removed from my life and things like that, I had started going to therapy um because there were some traumatic things that had happened, and um I had thought I forgave this person, but I just wasn't getting triggered anymore. And I remember this one night I was laying on my bed, and I I just felt like the Lord was telling me to bless that person, and I couldn't. And the Lord knew I wasn't gonna be able to, but he was revealing in me what was still in my heart that I didn't forgive him. So after that, it was just the process of learning forgiveness, why it's important, but learning it. Yes, you can forgive with boundaries, and you can forgive without an apology. It may take some time, it may take some therapy depending on the situation. Again, it's not, you know, taking away what the person did. Um, but it's something that can hold us back, unforgiveness. Um so it's kind of like a key to freedom in a way.

SPEAKER_06 12:01

I did um, I was scrolling through um social media a couple days ago, and I saw someone say, like, if we can experience his forgiveness, we can extend it to others. And I felt like that is such a good reminder, the way to put it, too, is like if we can experience that forgiveness that he's given us and how good he has been to us and forgives us so easily, like why can't we extend that to another um person, like another child, you know what I mean? To the Lord, like ultimately that's what it is. Like, you know, he loves us all, and whether they follow Jesus or not, like we should still be able to reflect that. And I think it's like so much easier um said than done, and that goes for a lot of things. A lot of things are so much more easier said than done, but it's like really, really like taking it to the Lord, like, Lord, I'm having such a hard time just forgiving this person and being honest, like the Lord already knows what you're struggling with, and he already knows that how you feel about this person. Be honest with him, lay it at his feet and tell him, Lord, this is so hard for me. I am so angry, or I'm so sad, or I'm so hurt, you know, and just like really being honest, and um, I think like that's what the Lord also wants, and he will like reveal to you like, hey, like this is what you need to do and why. Yeah, you know, as like you do hand it over to the Lord, yeah. Um, and it's not easy, it's really hard to forgive people. Um for me, I feel like I'm still earning forgiveness because, like, honestly, like I don't really um, and I could be wrong, but I really don't truly don't feel like I've really ever hated anybody or like had a hard time forgiving, um, like with my like abusive partner. Um he like for him, like I always thought about it to myself too. This was like kind of what before my walk with Jesus, but I was like, wow, like I don't feel like I hate him. Like I'm like there's a reason why um everything happened and like usually I'd be so upset that he wasted five years of my life. Um, but I was not upset, I didn't hate him. I like ultimately like learned from it. Like I took it as a learning lesson, and I don't know why I did that. It was just a random, like, you know, maybe it just had gotten over it before we actually broke up. Um, and then like also um I have a relative that has like really hurt my family and like my parents or my mom. Um that like before I used to be like, I hate him, like I hate him, and I would say it guys with like my whole heart. Like, I hate him. And I remember like my recent ex was like, no, like you can't say that, like you know, and I would be like, I hate him, like when we were together at first, and I'm like, you know what? Like, that is so true. Now that like I it's taken me a while to like forgive him, but like I have forgiven him, and I can't say that I hate him because I don't, you know what I mean? And I and that has changed since um I've allowed the Lord to work in my life. Wow, and it doesn't necessarily always look like oh I need to like go and tell him that I've forgiven him, but it's me saying, like, Lord, like letting it go and not like letting the anxiety or the fear, like the um, yeah, the anxiety that he's given me um or her like overcome what the Lord has like put in my heart, which is like peace and joy, and it's really just letting that go, yeah, ultimately, you know.

SPEAKER_01 16:06

Yeah, also sharing forgiveness is a reflection of Jesus, and you never know, like someone you know, when you have to forgive someone, like someone could be watching you, and that could be I think I don't know if we've said it on the podcast, but um there's this quote before anyone reads the Bible they'll read you, and you might be the only Bible they'll ever read or see. So forgiveness is a reflection of Jesus, and it could be really hard to like like other things, like being patient and things like that, but um, but um yeah, it's a reflection of Jesus, and it's hard, but like again, it's learned. So I agree.

SPEAKER_06 16:51

Um and it's so true. We always hear that too, it's like um you might be the only Bible someone will ever see or experience or open. Um, and it's so true, and you can do that by reflecting like your kindness, your patience, like and and it's not easy in telling you like the walk is so hard, yeah. Um, but it's just to be, you know, even if we can just be a little bit like Jesus, like that is a blessing too. Yeah. And you get to like share his love um to somebody else that maybe hasn't fully accepted him.

SPEAKER_00 17:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 17:29

Um, and then also like even thinking about how like the Lord has given his one and only son, you know, for us, and we didn't even deserve it. Like he wiped us clean, like he paid for everything. Like he paid for it all, you know, and and our sins were forgiven. You know, even that, just like remembering that like is so amazing. Like it's beautiful to if you really sit there and you really think about um how Jesus paid for it all.

SPEAKER_00 18:04

Yeah, that's right. You know, yeah, it really is.

SPEAKER_06 18:07

Yeah, and it's like wow, you know. Um, I also wanted to read um we see the parable. Oh yeah, let's read the parable and then we'll go on to another one that I had. Oh, I can read it. Sorry, there's something in my eye guys. Um, okay, I can read it. It's the parable of the unmerciful um servant. So it's gonna be chapter 18 as well, um, starting at 22. Therefore, the kingdom of heaven is like a king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. As he began the settlement, a man who owed him 10,000 bags of gold was brought to him. Since he was not able to pay, the master ordered that he and his wife and his children and all that he had be sold to repay the debt. At this the servant fell on his knees before him. Be patient with me, he begged, and I will pay back everything. The servant's master took pity on him, cancelled the debt, and let him go. But when the servant went out, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred silver coins. He grabbed him and began to choke him. Pay back what you owe me, he demanded. His fellow servant fell to his knees and begged him, Be patient with me, I will pay it back. But he refused. Instead, he went off and had the man thrown into prison until he could pay the debt. When the other servants saw what he had what had happened, they were outraged and went and told their master everything that had happened. Then the master called at the servant, uh the called the servant in. You wicked servant, he said, I cancelled all that debt of yours because you begged me to you begged me to. Shouldn't you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you? In anger his master handed him over to the jailers to be tortured until he should pay back all he owed. This is how my heavenly father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother or sister from your heart. Telling you guys sometimes it literally is all about like reading this, and then it'll really like sit in your heart, and you're like, wow.

SPEAKER_03 20:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 20:32

You know what I mean? Like just sitting there and saying, like, wow, the Lord this parable I think was like such a a good parable to help you understand, like, He has forgiven you. Why can't we go and forgive others and extend that forgiveness to them as well?

SPEAKER_01 20:51

Especially since that first slave was in the same position as his slave who owed him money, but the first slave owed a far greater amount of debt to that king. And then um knowing how this other servant felt, he didn't extend forgiveness.

SPEAKER_06 21:13

Yeah, and God repaid, I mean, God um forgave a debt we could never repay. Yeah. So we are called to forgive. Yeah. And I feel like sometimes it's so hard to understand, but sometimes it's just as easy like um to understand too. Like he's telling us like forgive. I feel like for me, sometimes like, yes, it could be difficult, but like when I hear when I read things like this, I'm like, wow, like it really just opens my eyes to like forgive. Yeah, the Lord has forgiven me, I should be able to extend that. Yeah, you know, um, and then it brings you so much peace, you know. You get to love one another.

SPEAKER_01 21:51

I think, yeah, it's definitely that peace that you can't comprehend, like how the Bible says it's hard, but and it's

SPEAKER_06 22:00

doesn't make sense but it does bring you peace and in my notes guys I actually read like God freely forgives us when we repent unforgiveness shows a heart that hasn't truly been uh hasn't truly received grace which I that like really stood out to me yeah sorry my legs my leg is falling asleep um so yeah but I did want to read like a couple of other version uh verses to you guys just Ephesians um 432 I don't do you have Ephesians I mean I know we all have we both have Ephesians in our Bibles guys 432 I just don't know why I asked yeah it's because my little like thingies were coming off on my thing so I can't even see the name oh it takes me forever but yeah can you read um Ephesians oh sorry one seven sorry Ephesians one yes um he is so rich in kindness and grace that he purchased our freedom with the blood of his son and forgave our sins um so like in my notes when I was like reading about this and I was like studying it I just put like through sacrifice um our sins are forgiven yeah you know what I mean through the sacrifice of Jesus and the Lord gave his one and only son to you know sacrifice and our sins were wiped clean ultimately forgiven and I feel like that a lot of the times we forget that we're so angry we're so wounded we're so like hurt and we just want that revenge for that other person but ultimately like sometimes we just have to sit back and think like the Lord like you know sacrificed his son for us wiped us clean and has forgiven our sins yeah this is something we cannot repay and that is something not to take lightly like that is important to remember and to really bring it into your brain because it's like that it wasn't an easy death it was a very painful and slow death that he had to go through for that to happen.

SPEAKER_01 24:14

Yeah and people don't think about that enough and also keeping in mind that like revenge belongs to the Lord he will deal with all of our persecutors all those who you know did us wrong we all have to get in front of the Lord and give an account you know so it's very important that we first and foremost repent of what we've done allow the Lord and just constantly ask him to search our hearts and forgive.

SPEAKER_06 24:45

And sometimes forgiveness might even be so like rooted that we like are putting like a little carpet over like it trying to hide it you know what I mean? And we don't really think about it. It's something that maybe we might not think that we need to forgive right um and that's when we we can just pray and ask the Lord like hey like Lord can if there's anything in my heart that's not supposed to be there like any unforgiveness anybody that you know I've hurt in the past like can you just bring it to the surface and clean and purify my heart.

SPEAKER_01 25:17

Yeah I've even heard of testimonies like even just like from our church of people who have had health like legit health conditions like physical health conditions they you know went through this process of forgiveness they repented and the medical conditions were gone. Wow and I think I I don't know where it's at but um I think I've heard of like from um just like sermons in church of studies that show unforgiveness could be the root of medical issues. Wow yeah so I wish I had them by the way but just from hearing next time we'll bring the stats yeah but just from hearing like in church I mean I'm sure you could Google it um this could the I'm not gonna lie this was kind of a motivation for me I'm like I don't want to be sick if this is something that the Lord can walk me through this was not overnight um yeah take it Lord I don't want to be sick you know so it's it's very again it's it's it's for you.

SPEAKER_06 26:21

Yeah we can choose the kindness we can choose compassion over hate you know what I mean we can choose forgiveness and it's not because they deserve it but it's because of the you know what Jesus did for us. Yeah and I think that's more than enough to just remember like hey like you know yeah when you catch yourself kind of drifting off and like hate this person I can't deal with this person. Like those are your like emotions and okay like you know process it but take it to the Lord. Yeah take it to the Lord have that time and a lot of people you know are like how am I gonna for me like at first I'm like wait I you mean talk to the Lord like how like is there there's no right way to talk to the Lord I feel like you can talk to the Lord in any ways that you want like sometimes it's me in the car. Sometimes it's me during you know in the shower sometimes it's before bed. And sometimes it literally sounds like Lord like do you do you know you know what I mean like do you know what he like that's literally my voice sometimes I'm like Lord do you know like you know how I am like you know what I mean so it's like a whole conversation there is no wrong or right way um to bring things to Jesus he knows your heart and just being honest with him is all he wants it doesn't have to be pretty just be honest. Yeah that's good so yeah um and then the other one I wanted to talk about the Ephesians oh my gosh I just like was like going through all of these this past week guys and I just kind of want to I mean I want to share them with you guys. But this is like just a verse that I want you guys to remember. Like next time you have a hard time forgiving like read this verse. I feel like it helps you just kind of understand this is really you know so do you want to read it? Or do you have it up or I can pull it up it's Ephesians 4 32 I'm I'm humming some waiting music while we get there.

SPEAKER_01 28:23

Instead be kind to each other tenderhearted forgiving one another just as God through Christ has forgiven you.

SPEAKER_06 28:29

Mm-hmm Yeah that's a good reminder guys like just being kind to each other tenderhearted like just forgiving one another sometimes it seems so much harder because it is like the wounds are so deep you've experienced so much hurt and so much loss or you know any anything that has been has wounded you like it's not easy you know yeah but at the end of the day sometimes it's really just forgiving one another what is that gonna like for me the way that I think about it and this is just me like personally guys like what is that gonna do to me if I'm holding a grudge against against this person what is that gonna do I feel like holding a grudge towards someone like they'll never know you're holding a grudge. And you're just yeah and you're just like and it's like tensing you up and it's making affecting you and it's getting you older I'm just kidding it's giving you wrinkles.

SPEAKER_01 29:22

Yeah it does more damage to you than to the other person.

SPEAKER_06 29:26

Just let it go like you know and and then get it it's hard some people go through the unimaginable you know what I mean that maybe we will never understand but it's it's something that you take to the Lord and you work with him allow him to walk with you in it. Don't do it alone. Yeah um I know like for me guys like I'm I'm telling you like this is so because this is not my best this was not my best self okay um but this was like when I was going through my breakup and I mentioned my breakup a lot guys like in a recent one because that is like the most recent um like change and challenge I had to overcome with the Lord. Like you know what I mean I've been through things like yeah it's fine but um this is like uh right in the middle of me like just really giving my life to the Lord um walking with him a hundred percent not just 50 40% of me you know um and so that's why I talk about it a lot um because I've learned a lot you know um but when we recently broke up um like I we were fine like we we to be honest as I'm being real with you guys we ended on a very like civil note it was fine um I was obviously hurt and it was really hard um but it doesn't it it wasn't like you know anything crazy um but either way um at one point like a little bit after like I was I felt like it was getting worse like my my feelings my hurt like was just like so much more like it was worse. Um I found myself really like going through it and I ended up like texting this person and like being mean and like saying like I hate you you know and as soon as I sent that I really felt the conviction and this was like what July and this was like November and like a few you know I was like gonna act good like I wasn't gonna be disrespectful I wasn't you know and it was fine but just I found something out that hurt me so much um and it really like hurt my um like shot down my confidence like it just hurt me you know what I mean and um I was so mad and I usually don't like to react when I like have certain emotions because and then I react out of anger or whatever and I say hurtful things. So usually I don't but this time I literally like was like I hate you like I was so upset and I remember like texting him that you know and like obviously this person didn't like say anything like he was he was not being disrespectful at all. I'll give it to him um but you know as soon as I sent that I really felt the Lord telling me like you don't don't do that like don't hate him you know and I was like wow the Lord like he hurt me you know the person he would tell me like Lord he said he was never gonna leave me and he left me you know what I mean like he said he promised forever and he didn't go through with that promise Lord and you know it that's what I felt and um it hurt me so much that I was just like reacting reacting and I was like you know what I sent that and I was like that was not my best self that was not my best self and that is not what the Lord wants me to do so obviously that is something that I'm like don't tell a lot of people guys because like a lot of the times you don't want to like mention like the bad things that you do you know what I mean but I mean I'm being real and we're on here to be real we're on here to be relatable we're on here to be honest like we never want to hide anything and that's hard for me to say on here guys because I don't want to share that side of me you know um which it's not all the time but like it got me and um for me to say I hate you literally Lord was like no like no absolutely not I forgave you're not going to hate him you're going to love him like I love you and so that is just like an example of me like having just a difficult time um like forgiving you know yeah and being okay with that I should have taken that to the Lord directly my feelings my emotions which I did most of the time but not I didn't have a little slip up just a little bit we all have our slip ups I mean I full blown thought I forgave my the family member that I you know but I just I was going to therapy yeah I just didn't have triggers anymore you know and then the Lord was like alright bless him let's see if you can put you know yeah and I couldn't so it's that was my little slip up but like Jasmine said we never want to come on here like we have it all together because we definitely don't yeah we don't don't think that we're ever perfect or anything like that. We are not and that is like a main part of like this podcast that we always want to keep is like just being honest and um like obviously things like this we don't want to share. It's not doesn't make you know but um we do it because um the this is our walk and this is our current walk with Lord you know and we just want to be honest.

SPEAKER_01 35:02

Yeah these are real topics and real things that people deal with every day.

SPEAKER_06 35:05

And struggling and like being um able to just go on here and we don't know what other people are going through and it might be much worse you know but just to encourage you guys that like even as small as like the I hate you to my ex-boyfriend like that is still like little things like that too like you can take it to the Lord and you know as if it's a big deal if it's a small little thing if it's a you know whatever it is take it to the Lord yeah yeah he will help you forgive he's way bigger than yeah he's way bigger than he's got a lot of experience forgiving us forgiving us and he's he knows a thing or two it's amazing um but yeah and we I know we've talked about like a time we've struggled and stuff like that. Um I have a question that just have you ever had to forgive yourself I have that's a good question had to forgive myself um I would say yes yeah um with my like abusive relationship of like why were you so like I would always be like why are you so dumb and like why did you stay so long? Yeah like why in the beginning like you knew like guys let me be honest real quick also um like I I think I mentioned actually like my other but when I first started dating my longest relationship was like five years when I first started dating him and he was like abusive um I my gosh I get so angry thinking about it. Okay so I would um like I really like this guy like honestly I have never felt like how I did with this guy and I don't know why because he treated me like complete trash like he when we first met we started dating and um he would like we would go on dates right and he would be like okay like yeah like we'll go on a date but like never did he pick me up like never did he ever like come to me and go local or because we were kind of like an like 40 minutes away. And he would always cancel like 20 minutes before we had to like meet. And I would be like oh like and I would just be like like totally upset but like still so in love with him like I was so in love with him where I was like wow like I feel like things are going so so good that something bad is gonna happen. Like that's how I felt I felt like wow things are just way too good like you know what I mean it's so hard to believe like what I remember being like if they're so good like I feel like I'm gonna die or something. Like it was the weirdest thing ever like I was so happy with this guy and like I really loved him. You know what I mean? I've never felt like that ever like again and I I think it has to do with him like loving so hard that I'm just kind of scared to love so hard again. But I know like I love I love I love Jesus really really hard so um so I can love like that again but um so that is like kind of like an like a time where I was like wow you were so blinded like he had to treat you like this and this like for you to just walk away like Jasmine you literally like made like 19 year old or like a 15 year old me would totally be so disappointed in me but yeah I did have to forgive myself for that you know for put like allowing myself to stoop down so low and settle for that like you know and um God bless him like I don't want to talk any bad about him but like truly he's hurt me so bad. Even though I never hated him or had a hard time forgiving him like it was a hard time forgiving myself for allowing someone to treat me like that and for allowing someone to think it's okay to disrespect me. Which a lot of the times like I really do feel like the Lord that's why he plays my other boyfriend, you know what I mean? Like my recent one because like hey like you can be loved like this right it's just he's not the one but um you can and it's okay like you're okay like you don't you learned and you move on and you get up and you and you um change for the better. You don't remain toxic because I was a little toxic too. Wow you know so it's just forgiving myself for just allowing that behavior to be acceptable in my life and giving him access for that. Yeah no same especially with the with the family member that I'm thinking of I would reminisce all the time like you should have said this you should have done this you like just not being very hard on myself and then once I started like and I do believe the Lord like worked through my therapists and stuff but like just going through that looking back I'm like that's how it was supposed to go you just need to extend yourself grace you've never been through something like that so how are you supposed to know what to do um but yeah that's kind of reminded me of what my mentor was saying yesterday like stop being so hard on yourself you have to um sometimes we have to like go through things to where like um for the next time around like we're like oh like now we know you know what I mean and it's just like giving ourselves the the grace um because that's okay too and I feel like sometimes both of us struggle with that.

SPEAKER_00 40:42

Yeah it's a tricky one.

SPEAKER_06 40:44

It is a tricky one yeah but that is a that's a really good question.

SPEAKER_01 40:50

Um let me see what was the other one um ooh this one's good you you thought of this one I think what did forgiveness mean to you before your walk with Christ oh my gosh this one I'm like I just got done saying this you gotta give yourself grace I would I thought forgiveness was like okay forgive them and no boundaries like you're still allowing access or what yes like there was no boundaries whatsoever like this a lot of this stuff um this was like maybe for the most part I was 25 and we would me and this person we would have conversations where we kind of fixed it I look back and I'm like not really but isn't that crazy yeah and I'm like you really thought you was fixed no but um we put tape on there I would yeah I was just it's not even like duct tape it's like scotch tape like the weakest tape that you can like but um I was just so like I just wanted everything to go back to normal I didn't want any tension I didn't want it to be weird so and there was like a little bit of influence from this person to like let's just go back to normal da da da da da da but then that's that's a whole other that's a whole other thing but um I just wanted everything to be normal I wanted everybody to just get along and some situations yes they can go back to normal the other situations they can't be like that and that's when you need to ask the Lord like hey nothing's changing what do I do do I need to forgive with boundaries or am I doing something is this something that I you know so I lacked boundaries until this whole like relationship um with this family member ended in like I think it was January 2022 it was around that time like that November December of 2021 and then January of 2022 when I started to finally put down finally after like a year and a half finally put down boundaries um so before you know my walk with Jesus or before this all happened that's what I thought it was I was like well I'm forgiving them and it's like okay but you're like you're hurt and you're just letting this person do it again and it's really difficult because there's no boundaries. So um and then also I thought forgiving was totally excusing what that person did which meant in my mind like my feelings didn't matter. Forgiving someone is for yourself and the Lord does see your feelings and he acknowledges them and he is very sensitive about them. But forgiving someone doesn't mean okay, screw your feelings just forgive them because that's what the Lord says you know it's like there is depending on the situation there is a healing process. I would get triggered so much after this situation was like said and done. Um And it took me some time to process those things before I could really forgive them and bless. Like now I can think of this person, just bless them like nothing. And it doesn't bother me or anything like that. Praise God. Um, but yeah, no boundaries, and my feelings didn't matter. It's just oh it just happened, and I made excuses, and it's yeah.

SPEAKER_06 44:24

Wow. Me too. That's literally me. I didn't but then again, like for me, I didn't really think about it. I didn't think about forgiveness. Well, I just like was like eh, like whatever. It's because I think I'm a lot like my dad. My dad has always been like the peacekeeper of everything and everyone. And so for me, like I've I've always been taught to like by my dad, like to not really like just hold grudges about anything. Like, even when like my family, like maybe we have you know, Hispanic families, we have big families. When we argue, or like anybody, like my uncles or whatever, like they all go to my dad because he he's just like the peacekeeper. Oh wow like yeah, and so I learned that from my dad is to not like my mom is more of like a grudge holder, um, but my my I'm not like my mom at all. And like my dad, he's taught me a lot of that, praise God, because I feel like if I was not like that, I it would be worse. But yeah, I have gone through like um like certain things, but I've never let like any of that really take away from from me, you know what I mean? Um, where like as I've gotten older, yes, I'm like, man, more aware of it. And I'm like, man, like you know, I struggled forgiving some people. Um, but overall, like I try not to do that because it really like when something really bugs me, it really bugs me. I'm very sensitive to like just certain things. Um and before, like, yeah, like you know, I would hold a grudge here or there, but like never long. Never long. But um, you know, when I did have to go through, you know, like hurt or um and somebody hurting me, then like yeah, I would like not have any boundaries, like at all. And if I did have boundaries, I wouldn't really go through with them. I wasn't standing firm on them. Um, and so before, like I just never really thought about that. I either like talked to you and we got you know had a fallout and just never talked again, or not, you know? Like, but that doesn't mean like if I don't talk to you, it doesn't mean that I don't I hate you or I'm like, you know, I'm not forgiving you of like our fallout that we had in like junior year, you know what I mean? But um I I I can say like I never really thought about it. Either we just kind of got an argument or whatever, and that's it. Like, you know? I've never been, you know, my my dad always taught me like don't take it too serious on certain things. Yeah, like my like one of my siblings, like he can like go years without talking to you. I am not like that, it's so different, and so I'm like, wait, like, why? What's the whole point of that? Like, to me, that's how I think about it. Like, what's the whole point of that? You're just stressing yourself out. Well, so um, praise God. Like, that's just kind of how my dad is, that's how I am. Um, we're not perfect, but um, you know, I'm thankful that that's kind of how I've been looking at it because now that I am walking with Christ, like I see it and I'm like, oh, okay, Lord, like you know, yeah, you want me to forgive this person? Yeah, it's a little difficult, but okay.

SPEAKER_01 47:33

Yeah. So yeah. I feel like now I vent like, well, yeah, that's a fine vent to the Lord. No, like, especially if my feelings are hurt, like this is because before it was just like especially from going to like forgiveness meet when I well, what I thought it was just meaning like, okay, my feelings don't matter. It's like they do matter. Let's process it with the Lord, and now there's a little more room to forgive that person. Let me see if I can try to walk me through that.

SPEAKER_06 48:01

Um, there was like there's one that keeps Oh, it's when um have you guys oh well you guys aren't gonna be able to respond to me now, but I'm like, have you guys read um it kind of like reminds me because you're saying like how your feelings don't matter, like the Lord, it's not really like towards forgiveness, but I just read this. It was like when um the Lord, um hold on, guys. When the Lord uh rose Lazarus from from the dead, hold on. Okay, so Jesus raises Lazarus from the dead. Um oh my goodness. Okay, wait. Oh, right here. Okay, oh my gosh, this one got me emotional too because I'm like, wait, he does care about our feelings. And that's like any feelings, guys. Like whether we're sad, we're you know, like he deeply cares about that. So when he was um it's I don't even know what chapter this is. Hold on, guys. Let me just go that way I can tell you. It's chapter 11, John 11, and it is going to be um verse I'm gonna start at 32. It says, When Mary reached the place where Jesus was and saw him, she fell at his feet and said, Lord, if you had been here, my brother would not have died. When Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who had come along with her also weeping, he was deeply moved in spirit and troubled. Where have you laid him? He asked. Come and see, Lord, they replied. And Jesus wept. Then the Jews said, See how he loved him. But some of them said, Could not Could not He who opened the eyes of the blind man have kept this man from dying? So, um, in my notes I had wrote, like, Jesus is compassionate, like he cares about our feeling, like Jesus feels pain. And um, well, not not literally, okay, but like, do you know what I mean? Like he he feels our well he felt that at one point, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:06

He felt it when he was here. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you're right.

SPEAKER_06 50:09

You're right, you're right. I'm thinking of him.

SPEAKER_01 50:11

Oh, you're saying, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I get what you're saying.

SPEAKER_06 50:13

Like not now, but like, you know, at this time, yeah. But like he's compassionate, like he feels like um he he understands our feelings and stuff like that. And um, and so he really like he felt really um moved. Did you guys know also that this is the shortest verse in the Bible? I never knew that. Jesus wept, yeah, yeah. I looked it up and I was like, okay, we're but yeah, it it really just kind of brought me back to that like uh how much he cares about um about our feelings, and it's not just like us feeling it and he doesn't care. He tr like when I think of like Jesus like thinking of our feelings and like just really being sad, well not sad, but like compassionate about our feelings. Um like I feel like I just I don't know, I picture him and I picture him sad. You know what I mean? Like even though like I just picture him like you know, and he he doesn't want us to you know have all of these sad feelings, but yeah, being called to forgive does not excuse your feelings.

SPEAKER_01 51:21

It you know, there is times where we do have to put our pride aside. Um like me a few years ago, I that's that's what I thought. Like, oh my feelings don't matter, like I still have to forgive. And it was like, no, this specific situation, like many others, you know, you have to there's a processing and a healing that has to happen, but don't stay there.

SPEAKER_06 51:42

I feel like pride is one of like the biggest things that it's just so hard. It it will like keep you from forgiving. Yeah, this person doesn't want to talk to me, so I'm not gonna talk to them. Like a woman's me. Yeah, and it's just like I you know what I mean, like ugh guys. I know. Just I know, I know, I know. Sometimes I don't even realize, and sometimes I'm like, wait, I'm being a little prideful.

SPEAKER_00 52:10

Me too, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 52:12

I'm being a little prideful over here. Um, but yeah. So um, anything else before?

SPEAKER_01 52:22

I don't know. Do we have any more questions, or is there anything else that is on your heart?

SPEAKER_06 52:27

Um, on my heart is just being able to like encourage you guys. Like, as you're listening to this podcast, it's just encouraging you to spread love and peace. And I know people are like, oh, peace, like this world's gone crazy, but it's like we need more of that. This world needs more of that and needs more of Jesus' um people to spread that, yeah, you know, and and show that and reflect that. And um it could be really hard to forgive, but really talking to the Lord, and if you're having a hard time forgiving someone for what they've done, for how they've hurt you, for you know, it could be anything, you know, you were abused, you were hurt, someone broke up with you, or deeper than that, you know, someone um really betrayed you and you don't know how to forgive them. Like just lay it at his feet, take it to Jesus and talk to him and truly, truly listen to what he wants you to do. And and we know, and you know what he wants you to do is forgive that person so you can live a good and peaceful life too. You know, you don't need that extra stress or you know, um any any stress in your life right now. It's being um able to live a happy, joyful life, and once you do that, you will feel as if a weight has been lifted from your shoulders. Yeah, and you know, giving it to the Lord. The Lord is going to carry what you can't. And um, a lot of the times we try to carry that, we try to carry all of that, all of that um hate, all of that unforgiveness, all that pain on our shoulders, and it's just weighing us down, weighing us down, weighing us down, and we can easily give that to the Lord. Not maybe not easily, because sometimes it's harder than that. But it's really being intentional with talking to the Lord and giving it to him. What about you?

SPEAKER_01 54:40

Um I think unforgiveness can be something very uh powerful that could be in between you and the Lord and keep you from intimacy with him and freedom that only he can give. And if you're someone who is struggling to forgive someone and you genuinely want to, you might need to see a therapist if something like legit happened. Um maybe something was taken from you. I know for me there was a time where I felt like joy and trust in people, and just like my spark was just taken from me, and it did take therapy and um you know, just more intention with my walk with Jesus. Um but he can do it. It may take some time, um, there may need to be some healing that may need to happen, some processing. Um but once you get to a place where you can look and forgive that person, even if you don't get an apology, um like Jasmine said, it is the biggest weight lifted off your shoulders. Um, and forgiveness is not an excuse for what that person did. There are boundaries in some situations, maybe that means forgiving, and I I just I can't talk to this person, but and it's not excusing like you know, even though you're hurt and all this stuff and you're traumatized, it doesn't matter. You need to forgive that is not the heart of Jesus. Um but yeah, it could it could um be a huge weightlift off your shoulders. Agreed, yeah, and even getting in community and talking with someone, don't don't isolate yourself in this because that could be a whole other a whole other thing too. That could bring so much more pain and despair from the enemy. Um get in community, get with maybe a leader at your church that you trust. Um, they'll point you in the right direction. And yeah.

SPEAKER_06 56:51

Yeah, we encourage community. Yeah, already know um, it helps, you know. Lord speaks through them too. Um but yeah, we encourage it, guys, and we believe that you can do it, you know. All of it, everything is possible with the Lord by your side. Don't try to do it alone. This is not for you to do alone, it's for you to do with the Lord and um take that walk with him and allow him in and allow him in to your heart. Yeah, be honest.

SPEAKER_01 57:23

Oh I was gonna say, just be honest with him. He's not offended by yeah, like even if it's like I don't want to forgive this person because X-Y to the Lord.

SPEAKER_06 57:31

Yeah, exactly. That's literally how I sound sometimes. Oh god, like you know, I'm all like dragging with like you know I mean, like you know how I feel. So I don't know why I do that, but I've been literally just having like conversations with him, like he's my best friend. I don't think that there's just a right or wrong way to pray or talk to the Lord, like just give it to him, doesn't have to be pretty, you're you're good. Trust me, because uh mine's messy 99.9% of the time. He's probably like, oh my gosh, he's one of my crazies. But you know, the Lord loves me, and I know that, but um, you know, that's literally how I sound. I'm like, but but like you know, and like I say that a lot with him, like you know, like you know what I mean. You know how I feel, like you know what's going on in my head, like you know what's like a like like uh a tornado up here. It's so funny, but sometimes I'm laughing with him and I'm just like I don't know, people probably think I'm crazy, but I'm not. I just love like once you like really like have a relationship with the Lord, you will hear like um like him talking to him, like you, you know, and you'll be like uh it'll be funny, like he's funny. We serve a very humorous God, um, and it's so cool.

SPEAKER_01 58:53

I love it because he's very funny. Yeah. And if you're practicing forgiveness and you struggle, I would say also remember how Jesus forgave you. I think, especially with Easter coming up, it's in three weeks. You know, we're about to celebrate something that changed the entire trajectory of history. Um remember how the Lord has forgiven you and think of those things like those secret things that you do, and the Lord sees all things and he has forgiven you. Yeah, he had you in mind when he was on the cross that you might forget that you might believe, and he he forgives you too.

SPEAKER_06 59:36

So one time I had uh freedom prayer. Uh like can you explain freedom prayer real quick?

SPEAKER_01 59:44

Like, freedom prayer is um a ministry at our church. Um think of like therapy and prayer all in one. A session is about two hours, and there's a lot of forgiveness that happens in there. Um there's uh two people in there who are one person is interceding, the other is kind of guiding you through, kind of like a therapist, like guiding you through um like they'll interview you, like what's going on, why did you, you know, want to do this? Super confidential. So um if you're in the well, I mean they have Zoom sessions too, so if you you know yeah, so I had one um well, I've had two so far.

SPEAKER_06 1:00:22

It was one like just to have like because I've never had one just you know to help me out, and then the second one after my recent break breakup, and I think it was like the second one where um she was saying, like, there is a song that I feel the Lord is wanting me to have you listen to, and it was the you're worthy of it all that one, and it's called Worthy of It All. And she was like, just picture the Lord, like picture Jesus on the cross, and you're very close to him looking up at him, and she was like, and just I just picture him, and I feel like that is what he's saying. He's he's singing that song to you, like you're worthy of it all, and I feel like it's not just me, but it's like all of his children, like just picturing him up on the cross, like you know, like doing like sacrificing his life, you know what I mean, and going through a painful, painful um time and suffering, and and you're just looking up at him, and and you're like his little child, his little child, and he's just singing like you're worthy of it all, like you're worthy of everything that's that's happening right now, and I'm paying the price for this because I love you and I want a relationship with you. And um, yeah, I just wanted to kind of like tell you guys because it's not just me, like it's all of us, like he loves us, whether you're walking with Jesus or not, he's gonna chase you and he's gonna continue to chase you um until you you know you give he fights for his kids, yeah. And um, and I love that we have such a loving, loving God, um, and just know that he loves you.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:08

Yeah, amen.

SPEAKER_06 1:02:12

All right, guys. Well, um, thank you guys so much for listening today. And I know today was pretty a pretty heavy topic. I know it's but it's actually a pretty heavy topic to talk about it, even with me and Tatiana. We're like, ooh, this is gonna be a heavy topic. But um, we did it and it was really good. So yeah, um, we're gonna be ending in prayer, and then we'll see you next episode. All right, um, Heavenly Father, thank you so much for this day. Thank you for allowing us to wake up, go to church, connect with our community, um, worship you, Lord. Um, thank you so much for just all of your blessings overall, Lord. The way that you love us, the way that you've um just sent your one and only son to just pay it all for us, Lord. Um, thank you for all of that. I just want to lift up every single one of our listeners, Lord. May you just continue to bless them. And if they're having a hard time forgiving, Lord, may you just walk them through that. May you just hold their hand down this narrow path that you're walking to eternal life, Lord. And may you just continue to walk them through this forgiveness step by step, Lord. May they just continue to um heal their, you know, may you just continue to heal their hearts and restore any pain or any open wounds that they have, Lord. Maybe any wounds are just so down in the root that they just don't even know that they have, Lord. May you just purify and cleanse their heart and bring it out to the surface, Lord, and work on that on it with them together. Um, may you just continue to remind them, Lord, of the forgiveness that you've given us, Lord. And it was just at free cost, Lord. Everything that that Jesus did for us, Lord, we just uh wanna wanna get that reminder. Even when we're having a hard time forgiving, um, every time we're we're having trouble showing kindness to our neighbors, to our to our family, or you know, when we're just catching ourselves with grudges to towards others, Lord, may you just remind us to continue to love one another like you have loved us and our neighbors and our uh friends, Jesus. Um, I just pray over everybody's households, finances, um, and their family, Lord, and their life and their kids in Jesus' name, amen.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:36

Amen, Lord. Thank you so, so much for sending your son. Thank you for um just your generous forgiveness that you give us every day, Lord. I believe you are the Son of God and the Savior of the world. Thank you for taking my sins on the cross for me and paying that price. Come into my heart and fill me with your Holy Spirit. I believe you are um Lord and I make you my savior in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen.

SPEAKER_06 1:05:04

Amen. All right, guys. Thank you guys so much for listening. We appreciate every everybody listening. Yeah. Um it just means a lot. So if you have anybody that you think might need to listen to this episode, we encourage you guys to share it um or even like it if it's on YouTube or just you know, leave a rating. Um, we want to also um just go ahead and thank everybody who has taken the time to even just listen to the full episode, even parts of it. Um, we appreciate it all. Uh, if you guys need prayer, please click on our Instagram bio. There is a prayer request in prayer topic or uh topic uh for our podcast like information uh link if you guys want to just drop down any ideas. And if you need prayer, just please list your prayers. They are confidential. Only me and Taltiana will see them, and we'll be more than happy to. Pray for you guys. Anything else?

SPEAKER_04 1:06:05

I think that's it.

SPEAKER_07 1:06:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:07

We hope you have a very good Wednesday night. It's Sunday today, by the way, though. My ugly love. Okay, well, we love you so much, and um Jesus also loves you. Remember that. So bye.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:24

Bye.