Heating up to 50C

Meteorologists say summer temperatures in southern Europe could hit 50C, surpassing levels seen in recent years. This week’s episode looks at what this could mean for the continent’s power and gas systems in the face of more freak weather incidents such as cold snaps and heatwaves. And tune in to hear the latest forecasts for the weeks and months to come. 

Host: 

•  Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel

Guests: 

• Mark Stephens-Row, Meteorologist, IBM Weather
• Julian Telford, Head of Energy, MetDesk
• Fredrik Cronvall, Meteorologist, SMHI

Transcript

Anna Siwecka, freelance journalist/podcaster: 0:01

News drives markets, and every day Montel's experience reporters are on top of the stories that shape European market developments. Can you afford to miss out? Go to monte news.com for the latest price driving stories and a free trial.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 0:30

Hello listeners and welcome to the Montel Weekly podcast, bring Energy Matters in an informal setting. In today's POD listeners, we have the good fortune of being joined by several illustrious meteorologists, all experts in their field. With 2020, the warm is here on record and freak weather incidents such as the recent extreme cold weather in Texas. We will discuss the impact of these changes on your energy system. Can we expect the beast from the east to make a regular appearance? And what would be the impact of a Texas like Snowmageddon? On the continent and in Northern Europe also, what's the outlook for the coming weeks and the season ahead? So I'm Richard Sverrisson, and help me to discuss these issues. Mark Stephens-Row of IBM weather, a warm welcome back, Mark. I hope you're well.

Mark Stephens-Row, Meteorologist, IBM Weather: 1:17

I'm very well, thank you. And yes, thanks for inviting me. Looking forward to it.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 1:20

In addition, we have Julian Telford of Met Desks. Hello, Julian. A pleasure to have you on board. Finally, last but not least, we have Frederick Cromwell of SMHI. Welcome to you, Frederick. Let's get started and look at at the short term weather outlook and for those who might be able to travel, where will the good weather be over Easter? Mark the good weather for those going skiing, it might be snowy conditions and for those in more sunnier climbs than would be hot and dry.

Mark Stephens-Row, Meteorologist, IBM Weather: 1:43

Yeah. It's interesting actually because right now the cold weather is actually more persisting around the Alps. So what snow there is actually staying pretty much temperatures are. Anywhere between sort of three and five degrees below normal in, in quite a lot of the alpine countries and really focused on the Alps that, that does look like that's going to shift though a little bit. I think we are expecting things to start warming up as we head towards the sort of, the proper Easter period. But I think in the main, they've actually had some fairly good snow conditions and certainly there's not much side of that rapidly melting, at least in the immediate future. Yeah, I certainly miss it. I think the last time I went skiing actually was an Easter ski in the Alps, but about three years or so ago, and this, we were definitely planning on thinking about doing it this year, but yeah, not happening unfortunately.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 2:26

No not this year. How about you f Fredrik? What's your short term view?

Fredrik Cronvall, Meteorologist, SMHI: 2:29

Yes, we have, even for a cold spell actually next coming days we have a high pressure west of Britain giving northeast H winds, so bringing down the cold air of the continental Europe. Maybe down to 7, 8, 9 degrees below. Reference as a minimum towards the weekend over France and Germany. You said? We're up in for a milder period from late weekend, and that's a shift in the weather regime since now lows will come from the Atlantic on the west from quite tracks. This high down of the continent instead of west of the continent. So we get a westerly airflow, so starting mild in the north, but also clamming up. What's reference temperatures over the con continent next week?

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 3:17

What do you think here, Julian?

Julian Telford, Head of Energy, MetDesk: 3:18

Yeah. Pretty much what the other guys have been saying there. But yeah, this cold air is flooding across mainland Europe at the moment, so temperatures at about 1500 meters up across the Alps. They're gonna be around about minus seven degrees or so at this coming weekend. So the freezing level is very close to the surface. So there has been bits and pieces of more snow across the Alps through this week, drier over the weekend, but still are still very cold. But the actual snow depth anomalies at the moment across Switzerland are generally around about 120 to 140% of normal for this time of year. So that's at 2000 meters height. So we've got about two meters. Plus worth of snow depth. Still going on across the outset, that level at the moment. So very good skiing conditions. If we could get out skiing, and this cold setup has been very much well forecast over these last couple of weeks. Just gone. We could see this cold coming into place. Different reasons for that, maybe. Talk about that later on, perhaps. But looking at different teleconnections, you could see this pattern beginning to set up, but we also think that will start moving away as the other guys have said there, as Frederick and mark have said. So going through next week, we'll see pressure beginning to build across mainland Europe. Low pressure come in. Towards the uk. So that just allows a bit more of a southwesterly flow to develop. And so those temperatures will be coming up across those alpine regions next week. So by the end of next week, I think the freezing level will be somewhere between 1500 and 2000 meters. So that's a big rise in that freezing level. Not particularly mild for the time of year, but given a bit of sunshine coming through. We'll start to see melt again at those lower areas at those lower slopes, but still good skiing, I think in your mid to upper slopes. I think as we go into the Easter period and at that stage as we go into Easter, I think your highest pressure, the most settled conditions are probably gonna be across east and northeast Europe and actually into Scandinavia. It looks as though it could be fairly dry there with more unsettled conditions. Approaching the uk I, I suggest at this stage.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 5:39

All three of you have mentioned the snow conditions. What are the implications here for when the weather does turn mild? Certainly these higher altitudes and for snow melts and for the spring spring melting season.

Mark Stephens-Row, Meteorologist, IBM Weather: 5:49

Yeah, as Julian said, there's a fair bit there to come out of the Alp, so I would expect. The various rivers draining away from the Alps, Rhine, Danube, et cetera, to to start seeing some of that, that entering, probably as we go a little bit further into the first week of April or so, we are seeing that the NAO, the North Atlantic Oscillation Index, which is. Currently negative is likely to swing into a more positive direction and therefore, one would expect to see warmer conditions, as Julian was saying. And, combined with rain now starting to fall at the lower levels as well. We'll almost certainly start to see the, it'd start pouring off. I know, I think the Easter, oh gosh, was it three years or so ago? Maybe four years now that I actually went, the day we arrived in the Alps, even at about, I think it was just under 1800 meters, the temperature was 21 degrees. It was it was really quite phenomenal. And but yet there was still a fair amount of snow on the mountains, but below that level it was really flying off the slopes pretty rapidly. And certainly by the end of that week. Was a fair bit of bare rock starting to appear. I think at this stage it doesn't look like there's gonna be that much. I, I wouldn't have said there was gonna be a massive surge of water out, out of the mountains, but it might be worthwhile looking. Scandinavia, I know certainly some of the longer range outlooks are showing a lot of pink colors appearing now in, in that department over the next few weeks. You may well start to see some fairly rapid melting in the Nordic region, in the mountains there, so that could be a place to watch.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 7:10

I was gonna ask Frederick about this. You're maybe a little bit far from the slopes in Gothenburg Frederick, but what's it looking like in, in the Nordic region in terms of, snow reserves and the outlook for the snow melt once milder weather comes in maybe in, in mid to late April.

Fredrik Cronvall, Meteorologist, SMHI: 7:23

It's quite opposite from the previous year because then we have a, had a lot of snow in the western mountains where it normally should be. Since we had a mild winter in western winds this winter have quite the opposite. You have quite a lot of snow east of the mountain, but not that much in the most western parts. So it's actually not where it should be. So it's not that extreme amounts of snow in the Nordics, but as you mentioned mark I think we're in for some melting ahead and the monthly focus we got this Tuesday actually was quite mild, very much milder than the previous one. For example the first week of April. It's in general one to three degrees above reference in the northern continent. In the Scandinavian areas, quite mild, especially in the north. I think uncertainty is how mild will be on the continent near the center of the high. So the position of the high is very sensitive, but at it's more certain that, we'll, the over the Nordics, but for the continent some more uncertainty, but. Mild there too but how fast is a little uncertain.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 8:31

What does it mean for the hydrological balance in the Nordic region? What's your expectations here in the coming weeks? We know that the reservoirs are very full or have been very full. What's your outlook here, Frederic,

Fredrik Cronvall, Meteorologist, SMHI: 8:40

since we have, as you said, filled reservoirs and the at least normal amounts of snow, even if it's not in the western part where it normally is. So it's a good situation for the logical situation, I think. Think starting at least in the south and mountain areas, you could get some melt already here in the late early April.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 9:01

Let's turn to the sort of more longer term seasonal outlooks. If I can start with you, Julian, what's your view here for the second quarter out towards june?

Julian Telford, Head of Energy, MetDesk: 9:09

I'll move on to that. It is very interesting. The comments which Frederick just made there. Sorry to just a step. Back slightly, Richard, because of that hydro situation across the Nordics where he talked about a bit less snow buildup on the west side of Norway there and more further east. And then last year was that completely different situation. And of course you could predict this quite early on as soon as we saw. The SSW that sudden stratospheric warming event occurring on January the fourth this year. So that broke up the vortex in the stratosphere, and that can lead to more negative ao, negative NAO situations. That means less westerly flow into these northern latitudes. Completely different to last year. So last year we had that very strong polar of vortex. Those westerly winds were crashing in and it was very mild across Europe, wasn't it last winter. But if you had your little webcam onto Fi on the kind of west side of Norway there, where I tend to do when I'm lacking snow in the UK and I just dream of snow, you could see it really piling up at Fi railway station that it was going up and up and up. So the west side of Norway did super well last winter for the amount of snow and of course that can then melt through the spring season and feed your reservoirs and rivers. Whereas this year, as Frederick said, because we've had the negative AO negative NAO situation, that the snow anomalies are in a different position and further to the east. So yeah, I just thought it's worth to just have a look that you can predict these things as the season evolves. You might not go for this SSW at the start of the winter season, but as soon as you can see that happening, you can then see implications further down the line, which then lead into the. Into this spring, on, on the hydro situation. But looking forward, Richard,'cause I know you asked me the question, you wanna move this topic onwards. A big thing which we look at MET desks, and there's a lot of discussion within the Met World and that is, the sea ice situation. We arctic sea ice situation and we think it even has implications into the spring and into the summer. Now this is the reduced coverage of Arctic Sea ice. Because of global warming. And we see the particularly low amounts of sea ice develop around the Barron's car Sea, that area is where we see some of the lowest anomalies. And coming into the end of the winter now and into the start of spring. Then we do see, if you were to refer to the National Snow and Ice Data Center, the N-S-I-D-C, you would see again we've got low levels of sea ice coverage. And if you then use that, because if you think globally, what's the big things, which can be tele connection drivers around the globe with different weather systems, how can it change the kind of long range weather waves and patterns? The Arctic is a big place and we've got big changes going on there, so we need to refer to that. We can think of Enzo and El Nino and Lenina and stuff, but it's just as big to be thinking about the Arctic sea ice and what we found in the what we call like the really low sea ice era, and we take a bit of a random point, 2007 year, 2007 onwards, what we found for April. So just leading forward to look through April we've seen that on many occasions that high pressure tends to build more across mainland Europe, particularly well large parts of mainland Europe, including across Germany and the, into the UK and France as well. We've seen many fine Aprils low winds, high solar temperatures above normal. Whereas if you go to the kind of era before that and looks at, say. 1993 to 2006, so a another 14 year period. You've got a completely different setup across Europe with low pressure widely across Europe and much more unsettled conditions. And we think that I mean there's gonna be ongoing research and looking at this and PhDs and so on, but we think that Arctic sea ice is having these effects right through the year, but with different lags and so on. But. We think that there is a good possibility of high pressure dominating European conditions through the month of April. So we are expecting like precipitation to be low, normal, solar to be on the high side, wind to be on the low side, and temperatures actually to average above normal. Of course, there'll be day to day-to-day variations and even week to week variations, but as an average for the month, we think is a high possibility of a pressure above normal across Europe. And we are beginning to see that in some of the medium range weather models the middle of this week. So looking at the latest kind of models on Wednesday, the pressure is generally beginning to build as we approach April. And also some of the longer term models like the EC 46 is hinted at pressure beginning to Rise. Across Europe as well. So that's our position for April. I'll let the other guys speak, otherwise I'm gonna talk forever. But going into a summer, you end up with a little bit of a different setup based on this low sea ice, where actually Northwest Europe can end up being a little bit more unsettled, again, using sea ice as a tele connection driver. So something for people to consider.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 14:30

That's fascinating. So the reduced sea ice is then having that knock on effect boosting temperatures and in more continental I think that's a very interesting development, which you've highlighted very well there, Julian. But how about you, mark? What are you, is, are you seeing similar story for April and maybe you could talk a little bit about beyond April from what IBM weather, how you see it,

Mark Stephens-Row, Meteorologist, IBM Weather: 14:47

Totally agree with Julian. I've always been a long, long recognized that the sort of the. Dramatic change in Arctic CI since about 2007, has clearly, I think played a huge impact on changing patterns of weather over, over Northwest Europe. Unsurprisingly, we're when, we're not that far away, if you like, from the Arctic Ocean. I think some of our scientists we I think you've met Dr. Todd Crawford who produces many of our long range seasonal forecasts, and I think he often reflects that there are different seasons that are more greatly affected by the changes in the Arctic sea ice pattern as Julian was alluding to there. But he's certainly right. I think a April, we have seen this quite with quite systematic change. A April showers, there were many sayings in many northwestern European countries of a very similar nature around April. And we, when I was growing up and keeping weather records, then yes I remember that, the April hail storms and even snow and so on. That, that has become definitely much, much less frequent. In the last decade or so we've seen this run of rather warmer and better Aprils. But as you go into the summer, then you know that pattern definitely does change. And because the Arctic is one of the places in the world that's warmed up that much more rapidly than anywhere else. You've changed the dynamic in the atmosphere where the colder north and the warmer south, which is, the Climatologically normal pattern. The strength, if you like, of that difference in temperature has weakened people. Remember last year I think that the temperature of, above 38 degrees well north of Arctic circle in parts of Siberia and Russia. So you are seeing effectively the sort of the dynamic that really drives northern hemispheric weather weakening and that has, unfortunately for us in Northwest Europe, particularly uk in some reason, some has meant that, we've ended up having. Relatively speaking, fairly grim weather last summer, I think was a bit of an exception to that. I think July ended up being not particularly brilliant, whereas June and August, either side of that, were still actually pretty warm. But, when I look at our own maps, there's just no blue, there's very few places that end up seeing temperatures typically that much below normal, if you like. If you look at international respected forecasting organizations like the European Center, we, what we actually do at the weather company is to analyze their forecast and then actually try to take out some of the, biases that sit in some of these long range forecasts to give you a better idea, if you like of the true pattern. So they these days the long-term models very rarely seem to have that much blue in them. But when you do put this calibration on top of it, you can start to see, patterns shift a little bit. But certainly if we looking into the summer months, kind of August. Again, the chances of more normal, if you like, temperatures are higher. If you are looking at somewhere like the uk perhaps Northwest France, parts of Scandinavia. Whereas the countries that are most likely to see even above normal temperatures are tending to be further south and east into Europe. But generally speaking, it it's gonna be above. Normal, whatever that is, these days. Virtually everywhere, I think. But yeah. If we're allowed a summer holiday, I think the place that seems to be showing up, on, on our maps is one of the highest risk of well above normal temperatures is actually Turkey. Okay. And they're doing pretty well with the vaccinations I gather as well,

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 18:05

good. Good tip there. Mark, how do you view this, Fredrik? Do you agree with your colleagues here that it's gonna be above normal for the coming three months? And where are the risks in these forecasts?

Fredrik Cronvall, Meteorologist, SMHI: 18:14

Yes, in general, that, that's the best guess for me too. Actually looking at the latest easy seasonal forecast. It has the same development as we see now with more westerly conditions over the Nordics and the more high pressure over the central southern parts of Europe as you get temperatures above reference and you get quite wet in Western nor but Norway, but dry on the continent. And as you mentioned mark heatwave in Turkey, but possibly also Spain in June, according to the latest DC forecast. But I would also like to mention that uncertainty is quite large in this scale compared to the monthly focus, for example. As you mentioned Julian, about the southern stratospheric warming, that's a very strong connector for the monthly timescale. We had decreasing polar VOR in January giving us some cold weeks in February especially. And so that's a quite strong connection and also have some other circulations. Mad and Julian oscillation. It's a tropical waves around the crater also feeding back towards. For Northern Europe, but on the seasonal scale, it's, you don't have that strong connections. El Nino is the main feeding component for the seasonal forecast, and unfortunately, Europe is the forest away from that region, so the connection is weak. And you have, as we also mentioned, the sea ice conditions and the polar optic. And that's maybe the most important thing. And I agree about melting ices and that will feed back towards mild conditions for Europe. But some interesting thing is for example, 2018 where quite cold February, March with lot of sea ice in the Nordics and a lot of snow late in the season. So we expected that to feedback. It's cold spring since the ice and snow should melt. But then we got the mildest warmest May ever 2018, and also the whole summer was extremely warm. So that just explains that I think the uncertainty is very much higher on the seasonal scale than in the monthly forecast, for example.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 20:41

Absolutely. That the uncertainty there is very clear with a, anything beyond 10 days, really the uncertainty rises. But if I can stick with you, Frederick, we talked a little bit about an introduction about. Extreme weather conditions. In February we saw extreme weather very cold conditions, which affected the energy system in Texas to a very large extent, not just the energy system, but the whole state. There was a, there was quite dramatic pictures. So I want to start off by asking you, Frederick, how likely is a similar extreme weather situation in Europe? We've been talking about, the warming climate, but here in terms of colder weather and what would the effect be, say if it struck in Northwest Europe.

Fredrik Cronvall, Meteorologist, SMHI: 21:22

I think the probability is less for Europe because North America is North America. You have a lot of extremes coming together. You have the Mexican Gulf with extreme mild conditions, and you have Alaska arctic conditions, and you have mountains from the west to east blocking. You have north southerly. Mountains so the cold can reach very far south there and the mile can also come up very far north. You don't have that extreme over Europe because you have the, is blocking the most extreme events for Europe. 20 degrees below reference is not, is very unlikely of the European continent I think. But of course you can have a cold spell, but I think. Even more realistic is extreme heat waves in the summertime. As we've seen some years already where you can have up to 40, 45 degrees up of a central Europe. So I think that's a more high probability for that extreme events for Europe than you get 20 below reference in wind time.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 22:30

Absolutely. Would you agree here, Julian?

Julian Telford, Head of Energy, MetDesk: 22:32

Yeah, just looking back at Texas, the peak or the absolute trough part of the cold, so where it was, it is most cold was February the 16th, where we had a temperature of minus eight as a whole averaged out across Texas as a 24 hour average. So minus eight, that's 22 degrees. Below normal for that time of year. So that is really extreme. So if we put that across to Germany and took that same anomaly, we'd need Germany to have an average temperature of minus 20, and we'd need France to have an average temperature of minus 16. Now we saw that this the first half of February this year. Based on that SSW and the negative NAO. We had some pretty cold conditions, but just remember to be the same equivalent to Texas. We need minus 20 for Germany on this occasion. We had minus seven on the 10th of February, so it was still 13 degrees short of that anomaly, so it was nowhere near as extreme in a pretty cold situation. So it really would be. Hard work to get those temperatures as low as that. Now to be honest, I haven't seen, I don't know the record low or recent record lows for Germany, but my mind takes me back to different occasions. You've got the February into March, 2013. That was again, another SSW that was very very cold there. February, March, 2018, we talked about that briefly. Again, that was an SSW. But if we go back to February, 2012. Now this brings me back to my skiing memories mark here because I think it was something like the 8th of February, or was it the 12th of February? I can't remember exact date that I disappeared down to the Alps and went skiing and it was super cold. It was really cold. I think I. Minus 20 or lower in flame on the French ski resort there. When I arrived, it got slightly less cold during the week I was there, but that first half of February was super cold. Can't tell you exactly where those temperatures were, but you guys might know better than me. But I think there was a really big spike in, in energy price during that time, somewhere in February, 2012 because it got so cold and we ran out of wind. As, so we had that double whammy of reduced supply and a really big demand going on and yeah, that caused problems. Do I think we are gonna see similar problems? We might. When ss ws happen, we can still get severe cold. If we get the winds from the northeast out of Russia, then we can get severe code. But to get that. Low, I think is highly unlikely. And I'm actually agree with Frederick, even though we see in summer months based on the low sea ice, as we've seen before, actually Northwest Europe getting a little bit more unsettled. There are occasions of extreme heat go back to summer 19. Summer 2019 then was it 47 degrees we saw in France something ridiculously high. We'll still get these. I think the higher extremes are more likely than the lower extremes. And yeah, that can cause problems in different ways'cause of cooling demand and then problems with nukes and river levels and things like that. With Frederick on this,

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 25:46

France is particularly sensitive to these weather events, we saw in February, 2012, we saw prices in France go up to almost 400 euros a megawatt hour. If I can round off with you here, mark, are the summer sort of drought, heat waves, low river levels, warmer temperatures, which cause cooling problems at nuclear and also thermal plants, are they more likely than the kind of extreme freezing. Conditions that we saw in Texas.

Mark Stephens-Row, Meteorologist, IBM Weather: 26:10

Yeah I certainly agree with both my colleagues. The extreme heat events definitely, are becoming that much more frequent than extreme cold events. Having said all that, of course, we not talked about or even mentioned per old Spain back in January, I minus 34.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 26:24

Yeah.

Mark Stephens-Row, Meteorologist, IBM Weather: 26:25

Unbelievable really, and certainly some of my IBM colleagues in Madrid, we were corresponding with them at the time, meters of snow building up outside their windows in, in, in the middle of Madrid. The reality is that even in this. Warmed world. We are still going to see some cold extremes, but it's much more likely that the heat extremes are, are gonna be that much more frequent, fortunately, or unfortunately. And certainly in places like Spain and France and probably, Greece and as well. I think it's almost inevitable that we are gonna hit 50 degrees Celsius somewhere, in the next sort of 20 or so years. I think the some of those places down there will probably get that un unfortunate record broken. But yeah, we'll still see some cold weather. It's worth bearing in mind, even in the UK in that cold spell we just had in February. Temperatures in, in Central Scotland actually fell to the lowest level in February since 1956. So we were still breaking some very long-term records, albeit briefly, but I think, yeah, yet again, probably during this summer. There will be at least one fairly substantial heat wave. I suspect when, we will be talking about records being broken again, but it's probably more likely in southern parts of Europe this summer than it perhaps was in, in northern and central parts of Europe in a couple of the more recent summers. But yeah with us all being potentially still confined to our own countries, I'm sure. Whether it's UK or Scandinavia, a few days in the high twenties and low thirties would be much appreciated.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 27:50

Absolutely. I can concur there. But a final thing that I've been alerted to in the past few weeks is that during the pandemic, commercial flights have been drastically reduced. They make a contribution to, to weather forecasting, don't they? Fredrik does this create some problems from you in in, in the short term? Forecasting.

Fredrik Cronvall, Meteorologist, SMHI: 28:10

Yes, of course. Observations you mean from the aircraft are crucial for the weather focused models. There's some effect about that. Then we have, of course the satellites giving a lot of data, but that affects course.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 28:26

Does it make them less accurate, would you say?

Fredrik Cronvall, Meteorologist, SMHI: 28:28

Yes. I don't have any numbers of that, but that effects at least.

Richard Sverrisson, Editor-in-Chief Europe, Montel: 28:32

Perfect. Guys, thanks ever so much. I, we could talk probably for hours and hours but hopefully we can we can return to these topics at or similar topics at a later date. And I'd like to thank you very much for, always it's a pleasure to talk about the SSW, the polar vortex and the n NAOs. You are extending my vocabulary quite considerably, thank you very much, Frederick. Thank you all so listeners, you can now follow the podcast on our own Twitter account, aply named the Montel Weekly podcast. Please direct message. Any suggestions, questions, or let us know if you think you have a good idea for a guest on the show, you can also send us an email to podcast@montelnews.com. Lastly, remember to keep up to date with all that's happening in energy markets on Montel News. You can subscribe on Apple Podcasts and Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts from. Thank you and goodbye. I.