The West Midland RFCA Podcast

Armed Forces Day: Four Veteran Voices

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0:00 | 43:25

Happy Armed Forces Day!

To mark this special occasion, we have spoken to four veterans from across the West Midlands, each sharing their personal story of service and what Armed Forces Day means to them.

Armed Forces Day is an opportunity to recognise and celebrate the people who serve, have served, and the families, communities and organisations who support them.


Timestamps

0:45 – What is Armed Forces Day?


2:27 – Lieutenant Colonel John Tucker


13:07 – Major Darren Knight


23:18 – Lieutenant Colonel Gavin Hudson


31:17 – Stefan Northfield


41:44 – Outro


Links:

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https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-west-midland-rfca-podcast/id1870819622 


Hosted & produced by Tom Kwei

Music by Alex Cottrell 

SPEAKER_02

Hello everyone. Hello and welcome back to the West Midland RFCA podcast. As ever, I'm your host Tom Quee, Communications Officer here at West Midland Reserve Forces and Cadets Association. And just before we get into the episode proper today, if you're enjoying the show, please make sure you subscribe wherever you listen to never miss an episode. And do tell a friend if you're finding the show intriguing, useful, drop it in a group chat, and send it to someone in your life who is maybe interested in all the amazing things that are happening across our region. So for today's edition, we're marking Armed Forces Day by hearing directly from four veterans, each with their own story of service, leadership, transition, and continued commitment. And what is Armed Forces Day? I guess a fair question. Well, in brief, Armed Forces Day is an annual opportunity for people across the UK to show their support for the Armed Forces community. That being from current serving personnel and reservists to veterans, cadets, cadet force adult volunteers, and the families who support them. The event began life as Veterans Day in 2006, before becoming Armed Forces Day in 2009. And since then it has grown into a national moment of recognition with parades, family events, flag raising ceremonies, community gatherings, and local celebrations taking place all across the UK. And here in the West Midlands, we see that support reflected in towns, cities, workplaces, cadet units, reserve centres, and communities right across the region. And for this episode, I wanted to go a little beyond the banners and the bunting to ask a simple question. What does Armed Forces Day mean to the people who have served? So across these four conversations in today's episode, you'll hear about early inspiration, regular and reserve service, operational deployments, leadership, young people, family, opportunity, and the lifelong connection that many people feel to the Armed Forces community. So, no time like the present. Let's begin with my first guest, Lieutenant Colonel John Tucker. And John, as you're about to hear, has had an incredible journey. His journey began as an army cadet before he went on to regular service and later becoming a reservist. And his story is a powerful example of the long-term commitment that runs throughout the armed forces. And I particularly loved his reflections on the people that helped shape him early on. So here's my chat with Lieutenant Colonel John Tucker. So, John, welcome to the podcast. It's great to have you with us. To begin with, could you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about your current role?

SPEAKER_03

So, uh Lieutenant Colonel John Tucker. I am actually not from the West Midlands originally, from Dorset, and then moved to Norfolk and then ended up over here about uh 20 years ago. My wife decided to move over here, and um, yeah, so that's how I've ended up in the West Midlands. I have done 14 years regular service. I've been at an OTC, I've been an army cadet, and uh now I am a reservist, and now in my civilian capacity, I work for a defence uh engineering and manufacturing company called Rheymatal BA Systems Land, who are part of the wider Rhyme Matal UK organization. And my current reservist role, I've just finished having done two and a half years as a commanding officer of a REMI battalion. So the REMI is the Royal Electrical and Mechanical Engineers, which is my background when I was in the regular army as well.

SPEAKER_02

You've touched upon there all the time that you've spent in uniform from the Army Cadet Force to University Service, then as a regular and now reserve officer. What has kept, John, that sense of service and commitment alive for all those different chapters?

SPEAKER_03

Well, interestingly, uh my my sense of wanting to be in a uniform and a and uh sort of an organization that had purpose and values stems from beyond, you know, way, way before I started Army Cadets. Um my parents were really good at driving me forward into and trying to do other activities. And I did beavers all the way to scouts. It was when I moved to Norfolk uh that I moved to Army Cadets, and it was about 10 years old when I actually decided I wanted to join the army. So I was quite young. Now the route at which I joined the army was undecided at that point. I didn't know what the avenues were, I was young, but I always felt that being in a uniform, you know, gave you identity, gave you purpose, and you always felt part of a team. And um I always say this that my leadership journey started when I was six years old.

SPEAKER_02

So did you always imagine that your journey in uniform would keep evolving in the way that we just described, or were there key moments when a new chapter just opened up?

SPEAKER_03

I never really had a long-term plan uh physics. Yeah, from six. What I found throughout my journey was that I would always look ahead up at my my sort of those in front of me and go, I think I could go do that job. Or I could go and do X, Y, and Z. And so there was never really a long-term plan. Even though I joined the regular army, I was like, I want to be a career army officer, but you know, circumstances change, you know, children come along, and this day and age, you know, both parents have careers. And so, you know, the decision to leave the regular army was one that we decided together so that we could both pursue our careers. And I went to the reserves because I didn't want to leave service in its totality. You know, I still like serving.

SPEAKER_02

And were there other people, particular people early on that made a difference to you in this journey?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah. Actually, in cadets, there were three people in cadets who were huge and very instrumental. One was my detachment commander, a guy called Paul Lincoln, Abe Lincoln, was probably one of the most committed people I've ever seen. He had a passion for helping us grow and always, you know, he was always trying to bend the rules so we could go and do some fun stuff, you know, and and things like that. And his links to various different reserve or TA back then units, but also links into various regular units. He was a vehicle enthusiast. And uh, and you go out to his back garden, he had, you know, he he had one of the original pinkies from from the long-range debt group that he'd refurbished in his back garden, you know, all this sort of stuff. And then there's other two who um a lady called Samantha Wheeler and her husband Simon Wheeler, they were incredible as well, and they actually gave my first Saturday job. And that stemmed from being an army cadet. So, um, and they gave me my first Saturday job. What was that? Uh so I worked for Rohan Design, so they're their um adventure training and adventure sport clothing company, you know, and I'd been struggling to find a job because you know, my my CV, I was, you know, G Chesse's, I'd done well, I was sort of fairly sporty, and and and weirdly, like go to an agency and they were like, Well, yeah, not really sure we've got the right thing for you. Like, well, I just want a Saturday job, like, you know, and yeah, so they they gave me my first Saturday job, and that took me through all of my A-level years where I learned sort of sales techniques, I'd learnt sort of basic things about you know, health and safety and in the workplace and basic sort of uh accounting, you know, understanding targets and all this sort of stuff at the age of 16 to 18, which I thought was quite impressive.

SPEAKER_02

And this is an Armed Forces Day episode. And Armed Forces Day is a moment when the country pauses to recognise the people who serve. What does it mean to you personally?

SPEAKER_03

Well, I I'm clearly very biased within this. We sometimes fail to recognise that being a member of the Armed Force is of we are volunteers. So whilst we're whether you are a volunteer cadet instructor, whether you are an army reservist, we're whether you are a regular service personnel, we are all volunteers. We volunteer to do this. Yes. And and then the same could be said for the the the fire service, the police service, the ambulance service. We all volunteer to do it, you know, to do this sort of trouble and put ourselves there and and serve serve our country in various different ways. So for me, I think having that time to recognise that actually people want to step up and go that extra mile for the for the protecting our values, protecting us as a as a nation, I think that's really, really important.

SPEAKER_02

And why is it still important, in your opinion, to have a national moment that celebrates serving personnel reservist veterans, cadets?

SPEAKER_03

Well, so um I recently did a a a speech back at my school, Norwich School, on Remembrance Day last year, and it was around actually remembering those who come home. Yes. So the same can be said for us who are still absolutely fine, but it's about remembering those people who are still there, who are still out doing work operationally. And so, you know, I think it's important to have Armed Forces Day where everyone can turn up because your families are there, veterans are there, reservists are there, regular personnel there, and it's and it's about celebrating everyone who's part of that ecosystem.

SPEAKER_02

One interesting part of your story is the overlap between senior civilian leadership and military leadership. So, how have those two worlds shaped one another over the years?

SPEAKER_03

So I guess the the the the common that and I you'll probably hear this quite a lot, I should imagine, but the common sort of skill sets and traits that I can bring in across to both is the leadership piece. When I move from regular service, you know, having done UOTC, you know, I've done cadets, UOTC, and regular service, and then moving into Civilian Street was bringing in a sort of different form of structure. We have an ability, I think, uh to be able to take a very complex situation and try and simplify it to make it easy for us to be able to tackle. But also there's the ability to engage with a number of different people trying to understand people of you know different characters, what makes them tick, how do we motivate them, and then we bring that to the workplace itself. And then the other, you know, actually I've learned quite a lot from moving into a sort of full-time civilian job, and now applying that into my reserve space. So one of the things that I sort of took in my civilian work is understanding how to manage money. Uh so whilst I did a bit of that in the in the army in my last job, you weren't you weren't doing it in the same way when I was looking at industry, where actually, you know, business development and sales and business strategy is about how do we make sure our people are still employed? How do we bring those opportunities in, then how do we then shape our narrative and our offering to to our customer who happens to be? Uh, you know, it can be a number of people, UK MED, it could be exports or whatever.

SPEAKER_02

And just wrapping up now, I mean, it's it's fascinating how much experience you have. Like it really is inspiring. What would you say to a a young person who maybe is looking to get involved? What would you like to impart to them the value of this?

SPEAKER_03

Don't hold back. Yeah. So one of the things I did as a as a young John Tucker was I did everything. Yeah. Now, it meant that I was a jack of all, not a master of any. So I could never I was never able to become the you know the company sort of major of of my army cadet force because I played a lot of rugby, you know, so I've and I had assassin, I had all these different things ongoing. But I think I went after them all and I enjoyed them all. Yeah. And I think I was then able to learn from a myriad of experiences and that all helped shapes me to a higher who I am today.

SPEAKER_02

And finally, when you look at the next generation coming through cadets, university service, the reserves, what gives you optimism?

SPEAKER_03

Well, so I coach rugby. Yep. So I coach for a local rugby team uh Bourneville, of which one or two of them are now in the cadets. Oh, excellent. So uh one of them is in air cadets and he's absolutely loving it. Um of course I was a little bit disappointed he didn't join the Army cadet, but he he's absolutely loving the idea. And I see in the next generation, I think the passion, the the leadership, the the teamship of all of them, but also their values, their polite, their courteous, and they want to work and help each other. And I think I can see that, and that gives me a lot of a lot of optimism for the future. So yeah, that's that's what I see at the moment.

SPEAKER_02

John, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. That's all right. You're welcome. Thank you very much. Fantastic to hear from John there, especially on the impact that early encouragement and strong role models can have. And that theme comes through so often when speaking to people from the armed forces community. Just one conversation, one leader, one opportunity at the right time can make an enormous difference. And now for my next guest, I'm joined by Major Darren Knight. Now, Darren joined the Junior Leaders Regiment, Royal Corps of Transport, in 1985 at the age of 16. He then went on to complete 23 years of regular service in both the Royal Corps of Transport and the Royal Logistics Corps, rising from driver to warrant officer class one. He later commissioned into the Army Reserve as a captain, studied at the Army Staff College, and became a major in 2014. Today, Darren is also a colleague of mine here at West Midland RFCA, working as a defence relationship manager, helping employers understand, value, and support the Armed Forces community. So in this conversation, then we talk about what Armed Forces Day means to him, how his service has shaped his outlook, and why that connection continues in his work today. So here's my chat with Major Darren Knight. So could you introduce yourself, please? Explain your role as Defence Relationship Manager and what you do here at West Midlands RFCO.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, my name is Darren Knight. I'm the Defence Relationship Manager for West Midlands, one of three. Being a DRM is about um building that relationship between industry and defence. So you'll probably hear a lot of it during my conversation, but one of the first steps into having a relationship with defence is through what's called the Armed Forces Covenant. And so that's one of the areas I particularly work on. And the other major main area of a defence relationship manager is supporting employees who employ people from the Armed Forces community.

SPEAKER_02

And how long have you been in this role? I mean, we are colleagues. You were here before me. How long have you been here at the RFCA?

SPEAKER_01

Well, funnily enough, it's two years this week.

SPEAKER_02

Oh wow. Okay. And Armed Forces Day, this is an Armed Forces Day episode, and Armed Forces Day recognises the whole Armed Forces community. So with your personal background in the regular Army, the Army Reserve and employer engagement, what does the day mean to you personally?

SPEAKER_01

That's a brilliant question. So for me, it's about celebration. So we all know from an early age and as we get older that remembrance is all about remembering those who made the ultimate sacrifice in defending our country and in particular what we stand for. But the Armed Forces Day itself is more of a celebration. It's m uh making the public aware, having that awareness and appreciation for those, particularly those on active duty.

SPEAKER_02

And as I just mentioned, you served in the regular army for over 20 years. When you reflect on that part of your life, what does service mean to you now?

SPEAKER_01

So it's always a difficult question for me, um, for me. But when people say that, you know, I have to make a point that it's been an honour and a pride. I I was a cadet, I joined the boys' service at the age of age of 16. I did full colour service, I'm just short of 24 years. So for me, the whole period, including the 17 years as a reservist, it's with honour and pride. And for me, it's been an absolute privilege to have done that, and it's made me the person I am. And when people say what it has made you, I would say it's made me into somebody that's loyal, hardworking, dedicated, and more importantly, somebody with uh humility.

SPEAKER_02

And you've continued serving through the Army Reserve. You were kind enough actually to arrange an event for the first episode. So our International Women's Day episode got a chance to go out to the to the unit there. How does reserve service fit into the wider Armed Forces story that Armed Forces Day celebrates?

SPEAKER_01

Well, as I as I mentioned, uh the Armed Forces Day is all about raising the awareness and having that appreciation for those on active duty. And it's probably really important for me to say at this stage that a reservist is that that's many different types of reservists. So you could have somebody that's an ex-regular who has got reservist raw recall liability. But what we're celebrating on Armed Forces Day in particular, uh throughout the Armed Forces week, is celebrating that it was an active duty and the reservists take full part of that. We have got considerably quite small regular force, so having those active reserves to back up those regular regular service counterparts is really important because although we are part-time, we do the same training but on a part-time basis, but we do deploy or mobilize doing the same job as our regular counterparts on the same exercises and operations.

SPEAKER_02

And in your current role right now, you work closely with employers across the region. Why are employers such an important part of the armed forces community?

SPEAKER_01

So, as I've already mentioned, we're talking about reservists. So reservists are part-time, so they need to work for a company on a full-time basis. So when you're talking about employees, we're talking about employers of reservists, but it could be anyone from the defence people. And when we're talking about defence people, that is people left the service, service levers, um veterans, reservists, as I've mentioned, whether active or the strategic reserve. But then we've got the families, yeah, and then more importantly, we've got Cadet Force Adult Volunteers who play a pivotal role in that force as a community. So when you're talking about employees, it's really important that we have supportive employees of all those uh defence people.

SPEAKER_02

And what does that support, what does good employer support actually look like for reservists, veterans, cadet force adult volunteers, military families, as you mentioned?

SPEAKER_01

So so what does good look like? It's having policies in place to support those individuals. So so at the bottom, at the bottom level, when you sign the armed force covenant, you're making a pledge to support. And you could make a pledge that you would look at offering leave to reservists. Um you would look at offering that flexibility to Cadet Force Adult Volunteers to enable them to do their volunteering. And then as you progress through what's called the employer recognition scheme, which is the defence way of recognising those companies that go above and beyond the Armed Force Covenant, this is when companies go out of their way to build on those pledges by offering up to 10 days paid leave for active reserves to enable them to do their annual camp or what it's called as annual continuous training throughout the year, and also supporting Cadet Force Adult Volunteers by offering that flexibility around their work commitments and such things like that.

SPEAKER_02

We just focus there on the support that employers can give the extra model that employer can give. But what are some of the strengths that armed forces people themselves actually bring into civilian workplaces that employers sometimes misunderstand?

SPEAKER_01

Well, it says for itself, you you're getting those highly disciplined people, strong leadership, uh, and um somebody that um left the regular 17 years ago, I didn't realise the importance of leadership in in the civilian employment. And I've had bosses, whilst I've been in Civilian Street, who have had no management leadership experience, they've just bit built up their experience. So, what those individuals bring from the military is those strong leadership qualities. But for me as well, the standout for me is those individuals that can work well to change, and and that's very much down to these individuals being accustomed to operating in the most complex environments, which makes them robust and working well to change. And I suppose the other one that stands out is that moral and physical courage that forces personnel bring to the civilian employment.

SPEAKER_02

And Armed Forces Day is partly about saying thank you, of course, but it's also about building understanding. So, how can businesses and organisations make that support meaningful beyond just one day of recognition?

SPEAKER_01

So, as I mentioned already, you know, the first step of having that relationship with defence is through the armed force covenant. But please see that as your way of supporting the military community in addition to celebrating Armed Forces Day. So by signing the Armed Forces Covenant is making a pledge to support that wider military community. And as already mentioned, you can then progress onto the Defence Employee Recognition Scheme, which is a scheme that recognizes those companies that go above and beyond. So not only do those companies get the recognition they deserve and get the kudos from having that logo on their website and through their social media, but it's all about those that those companies then advocating to others to do the same. So there's so much more industry can do in addition to celebrating Armed Forces Day.

SPEAKER_02

Now, we're one of 13 RFCAs across the UK. We're the West Midland RFC, obviously the most important one. And from your perspective, what does the West Midlands contribute to the Armed Forces community?

SPEAKER_01

I think the probably the best thing to do is to say is that Birmingham itself is the is the second state. Well, yeah. It's a second city. We've got the full diverse spectrum of support to the armed forces. So we've got accounts or businesses within the Midlands that are prime accounts, so directly support defence. But then we've got hundreds, if not a thousand businesses that support the armed force covenant through the armed forces covenant, through the employer recognition scheme. And it's an absolute pleasure to be a defence relationship manager within the West Midlands. And I suppose it'd be it's worth mentioning as well is that there's other things that are coming on all the time. So recently we've seen the launch of the West Midlands RDSE, a regional defence security cluster, which also gives another opportunity for industry in particular businesses in the West Midlands to really get involved in supporting defence.

SPEAKER_02

And finally, Darren, if you could leave employers and the wider public with one message, this Armed Forces Day, what would it be?

SPEAKER_01

So for me, it's please celebrate Armed Forces Day. Yes. Because remembrance, even though it's so important for the for people like me that that spent all my life really in the Armed Forces, the Armed Forces Day itself is part of the Armed Forces week, so please spend the whole week celebrating it. I know that Armed Forces Day is normally around the you know the last Saturday of June, but during that week on the Wednesday, we've got Reserves Day to celebrate that. So the point I'm making here is that please celebrate it. And even though Armed Forces people are quite be uh quite humble and they don't like to be thanked, please at every opportunity, you know, thank them for their service. But if you get stuck with something to say, Something like Happy Armed Forces Day. Happy Armed Forces Day. Because you know, the word happy isn't used too much nowadays, and particularly during Armed Forces Week, then I would encourage people to say hi, Happy Armed Forces Week. Darren, thank you so much for coming on the show. Thank you very much, Tom. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02

Lovely to speak to Darren there. His story really showing how service can continue to shape a person's life long after their first role, first posting, or first deployment. It also speaks to something we see every day here at WMRFCA. The value that service leavers, reservists, and veterans bring into workplaces and communities. And now for the third guest on the podcast, Lieutenant Colonel Gavin Hudson. Gavin has had a varied army career spanning command, operations, personnel, and capability. And that breadth of experience gives him a really interesting perspective on service. Not just what it involves, but how it can develop people, build confidence, and open up opportunities. He now brings that experience into his current role as commanding officer of Birmingham University Officers Training Corps, where he speaks to young people about leadership, responsibility, challenge, and what a life connected to service can offer. So here's my conversation with Lieutenant Colonel Gavin Hudson. Could you introduce yourself, please, and explain your current role as commanding officer of Birmingham UOTC? Yeah, absolutely. So my name is Lieutenant Colonel Gavin Hudson. I am an infantry officer from the Royal Anglian Regiment. And my current role, as you say, is commanding Birmingham University Officer Training Corps. And we deliver leadership training through the Army University Leadership Development Programme to students from universities across the West Midlands. And this is an Armed Forces Day episode. An Armed Forces Day is a chance for the public to recognise the Armed Forces community. What does the day mean to you personally? Yeah, good question. So there are lots of moments throughout the year when people in the armed forces think about service. But this is a a relatively unique day in that it's when the armed armed forces and the public come together. Perhaps that's an armistice day. We are an integral part of the community, but there are increasingly few times when when the two do come together, whether generationally we have sort of fewer family links, and perhaps we're, although there's plenty of conflicts going on in the world, the armed our own armed forces perhaps aren't in the news as much as they might have been, perhaps, a decade ago. And when people hear armed forces, they might picture one type of service, one type of person. What do you think Armed Forces Day helps reveal about the wider community? Yeah, no, we're absolutely um sort of tribes of tribes, and yet, you know, parochially I could think of, you know, how how the infantry does its mission, which it can't do without, you know, engineers getting across obstacles, without communicators sending messages forward and you know, sending the intelligence picture that specialists have developed for us. And then more broadly, of course, there are you know, there's there's the three services. I can begin to tell you all the different things that they do, and then there's a civil service as well. So, like you say, there are we all might have an image of what an art member of the armed forces is, but there's far more to it than than all of us recognise. You're with the Birmingham UOTC, yeah, which is fascinating. And it sits in an interesting space between universities, young people, leadership development, and the army. How does it fit into the wider armed forces picture? In lots of ways, I guess for some it is a gateway to to further service. Yeah. And there's a, I don't have the number, but there's a significant proportion of officer cadets at Sandhurst who began their journey at a university officer training corps. We might be a gateway to Army Reserve Service, we might not be a gateway to further service, but we those alumni, once they go on to their own civilian careers, will always have uh an understanding of the armed forces from us. And I guess more broadly, UOTC sits within the Army Initial Training Command. So the initial training that we do is coordinated along with the initial training that that all elements of the Army do as they begin their service. And speaking of that alumni then, what kind of young people come through the B U OTC and what do you see them gain from the experience? So we recruit from over a dozen universities in in the West Midlands, and therefore a real real sort of range of people, whether they are local to the Birmingham and West Midlands area, or whether you know nationally, you know, from them to all corners of the UK and even the Commonwealth. So a real spread of people studying all sorts of degrees uh and all sorts of pursuits. Some have connections to the military, whether they're sons of Gurkhas that we've got, or you know, military connections, or whether, and you know, really satisfyingly, people who have just had their friends in the second year say, hey, you should come along and do this. It's really cool. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They've had no introduction to the armed forces, and that's what we provide. For students who've never considered the military before, what do you think surprises them when they get involved with you, you guys? So I I think the understanding somebody has of the preconceptions that someone might have of of any career when one tastes the reality are far broader. And you know, we can all watch a film about sort of soldiering or you know, you know, my idea of medicine is uh is limited to what I see on casualty. Oh, but there's far more to it. Um speaking about yourself now, you've had a varied army career across command operations, personnel and capability roles. How has that shaped the way you talk to young people about service today? That's a good question. So I think the attraction to the military is through the opportunities for operations, for adventure, for for leading and working with people. But there are also opportunities in parallel to that to help the sort of the organization run, running the business. Yes. Uh and whether that's in a capability role, helping work on the army's equipment programme, or whether it's um helping a more sort of personnel, human resources, you know, all these things are necessary functions and require a deep understanding of the military to enable them from within. An Armed Forces Day is partly, of course, about saying thank you, but it's also about building understanding. What do you wish more civilians understood about service life? I think it is really important to know that there is a lot to being in the armed forces that is not as dramatic as we we see on the television or I heard on a podcast recently, bad leaders uh make great movies because you know it's already dramatic, something's gone wrong, and yeah, and that is high energy. But a lot of the time it's about quietly getting on and the team delivering against its mission and against its tasks and and sort of achieving progress for for the defence. We're a very local podcast here. We're all about the West Midlands. From your perspective, what does the West Midlands contribute to defence and the armed forces community? So um I mean loads. Uh I mean the I cut I lost count of the times that you know Land Rovers have have got me out of trouble, right? You know, across the world. My first military experience in Birmingham was uh visiting soldiers in the Queen Elizabeth Hospital um a couple of decades ago. You know, there's a whole range of industry that contributes to defence. The medical and university links, the footprint of defence medicine in the West Midlands is huge, and science and technology contributions through universities into defence is is massive, splenty. We want to talk again about the BUOTC. For anyone who is curious about that, or you know, what would you say to them if they're interested in maybe taking part? If you're curious but don't know much about it, come and give it a try. Yeah, I didn't know anything about the army before I joined Cadets. Um and if it hadn't been for cadets, I I wouldn't have been a soldier. So someone you've all got to start somewhere. Yes. And if it's something you love but not it's not going to be your career, that's that's absolutely fine. We're not uh no one's committing anything by by joining us. We love cadets here as well. We've just done a whole cadet special episode too. Talk to it. What was your where were you part of? So I was in a CCF at my school. Oh right, okay, great. I didn't come from a military family, no, but it uh opened my eyes to how much fun I could have and have a career in it, yes, uh, at the same time, which was which was a you know delight to learn. And we're increasingly trying to work with cadets at the UATC. One of the initiatives that we're starting is to deliver a Jew C of Edinburgh Gold Award. And many of those who are doing that for their volunteering are working with their own either previous cadet forces or local cadet forces. Excellent. And finally, if you could leave listeners with one message this Armed Forces Day, what would it be? So, probably given my assumption is that your listeners have a connection to the armed forces. And so it's it's thank you, thank you for the support. We mentioned the the range of different types of people and communities that are part of that wider armed forces family, and all of those different actors are necessary to make it work. Um so for whatever your contribution is, thank you for it. And also, of course, Birmingham UATC is recruiting. Yeah, whether whether whether cadets or staff and you're in the Army Reserve, we want to hear from you. On that theme of thank you, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. Pleasure. Thanks for having me. Great to hear from Gavin there, particularly on the importance of speaking to young people in a way that feels honest, relevant, and grounded in real experience. As Armed Forces Day is of course about recognition, but it's also a chance to help more people understand the breadth of the Armed Forces community and the different routes into it. And finally, I'm joined by Stefan Norfield, a former Royal Marine who is now general manager at Black Onyx, a veteran-led organisation. We speak about his journey, the importance of veterans in the workplace, and his own reflections on Armed Forces Day. So here's my chat with Stefan. You joined the Royal Marines at 18, is that right? I did, that was great. So what do you remember about that version of yourself and what you were you hoping the military would give you at that point in your life?

SPEAKER_00

So I joined them, well, I joined the military after um being a bit of a tear away at school, to be honest. Um I was forever in trouble, always in detentions, and that led to me there wasn't enough days in the week for the detentions I was getting. So they ended up giving me detentions at the weekend. Oh boy, okay. Control my discipline, shall we say? So which worked to an extent. But the group of friends that I was friends in commons that I was surrounded by uh turned out not to be my friends. So I was playing rugby, I had a very bad injury, I ended up in hospital, and my so-crute, so-called group of friends didn't come to see me in hospital, but the only people that did were members of the first team of the club I was playing for, and one of those turned out to be a Royal Marie. Ah. And he came and sat down next to me, and we were talking about what does he do? And he was like, I said, I feel a bit betrayed by my friends, etc. And he said, Well, if you're looking for that brotherhood and that unity, he said joining the military would be the way to go. So for me, it was looking for not only I'm instilling that additional bit of discipline, but forming a brotherhood around me of people that I could trust, belong to, and I can honestly say that it's it's made me exactly the person I am today. Like I said, if I hadn't have followed that route, I probably would have gone down a very different path. Um, my brother, who's two years my senior, he was very similar to me. He did go down a different path. He ended up following organised crime, going into prison. I chose the military and we went both separate ways. Fortunately enough, we're bound back together and we both are are seeing you know a different path that we now lead. Um, so for me, it's given me given me direction, it's given me discipline, and it's given me a brotherhood and unity, knowing that there are other people out there that can wad you back, uh, which is you know absolutely um vital.

SPEAKER_02

And when we you know we talk about transferable skills here and people being in the military, and that cannot sound a bit corporate sometimes, transferable skills. So, from your own experience, what are some real skills that service gave you that you genuinely have carried across?

SPEAKER_00

I mean, it may sound corporate, it also sounds a little bit cringy. Yeah, but but it's true. Yeah, it is true, you know. I mean, the basics of teamwork, understanding that working together as a team, communication, and as I said, discipline, but having resilience, resilience built into you absolutely for me. I mean, I've been through, I'm not gonna go into all the details, yeah, yeah. But I've been through a whirlwind of ups, downs in my life, as most people have. And it only is because of the training and the people that I've had surrounded with me that have ensured I've continued on and become the sort of successful person that I believe I have been. Resilience is absolutely key, and I think you know, working on some of the projects that we do, building that into the community and into young people is absolutely crucial in order to see them develop and have the opportunities that unfortunately some of them don't have.

SPEAKER_02

And you've spoken a lot about the challenges of integrating from service into civilian life. How was that for you in general?

SPEAKER_00

So I left the military end of 2005. Right. I went straight into the private security industry, so I went over to the Middle East, Iraq, Afghanistan, worked over there for 10 years, um, managing large-scale projects. Um, I then tame my hand, did a bit of maritime security, so I was out on the ships um pursuing anti anti-piracy. So, in a way, that transition didn't transition me into civilian life because I was always surrounded by other armed forces members and veterans, so it was a very similar lifestyle. Yeah, I then decided I'd had enough of that and I wanted to try and live a normal life, which I came back to the UK, I had bought a house, yeah, I lasted two months. And it was it was absolutely terrible. It was the worst part. I was like, I cannot handle this. Right. So I sold my house after two months, after two months, after everybody telling me don't do it, don't do it. You know, this is the worst thing you can do. It's like look, I know what I'm doing, I'm fine, leave me with it. Um and I went to go travelling and I got stuck in Thailand. I say stuck in Thailand, it was a voluntary. It was a voluntary decision. Who cared was that? I went to Thailand, I was very into my training at the time. I've I'd already become competed at a European level at CrossFit Games, so yeah. I saw you were ranked like 45th, I think, in 2011 or something. It was like I had a had a had a bit of a spout of fitness and coaching became a passion of mine and again helping other people. Yeah. I was surrounded by similar people, people that had passion and drive over in Thailand, but it wasn't quite the same. Yeah. Um, and then things kind of spiraled out of control mentally. Yeah, I it things didn't quite go to plan in Thailand. Okay. I hit rot bottom. I lost a lot of money that I'd invested in in so again, so-called friends. And I ended up coming back to the UK uh to sort of see my family and got locked down for COVID. Ah, of course, yeah. Really when it hit me really hard, and I was in a really bad place. Like I said, ups and downs throughout my life. But having that resilience and being surrounded by other people is what got me through it, and that's really where Black Onyx came into my life, and I got introduced to Black Onyx, started working for them, and that's where that family unity, brotherhood, and bond came back into it, and I've sort of pulled me out of a really dark hole, shall we say? Yeah, and I I want to talk about Black Onyx.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Your strategic lead, is that right? For the academy, is that your role? That is correct, yes. I also am strategic partnership lead for the wider group. So Black Onyx forms three pillars. I see. So Black Onyx concepts, which is security and risk management, black onyx academy, um, education and training, and black onyx facilities, which is asset and property management. So it all started in 2017. Former Royal Marine Lee Sheldon set the business up with a view to creating a working environment for veterans to feel comfortable but also find meaningful employment. And that was hit, that was always his goal, that was always his ambition. And he did very well in the early days. He had a contract on um network rail infrastructure projects, which was targeted by um organized crime units stealing cable, basically. Um million pounds worth of cable went went missing. Oh boy. Uh Lee and his team of veterans, um, over and covertly operated mobile response teams and working alongside the police, managed to retrieve all that cable get arrest made at the ports, which resulted in a letter of recommendation. Wow. Um, so fast forward three years from 2017 to 2020, that was the initial phase of Black Onyx being started. 2020 is when I joined, and obviously, as you remember, and COVID, everyone was long down. Protesters were all over the HS2 project, upping trees, down in tunnels, causing absolute mayhem. And Black Onyx got the opportunity to provide services to deal with those protesters. And I was part of that initial team. So on the 8th of July 2020, we formed up with a team of seven on days and a team of seven on nights. Uh, the client was sort of overwhelmed by the professional skills that were being rigged. Right. And at the time it was all veterans, so everyone in our network that was working over in the Middle East. If you were sent if you were on leave where the COVID happened, you couldn't go back to work. So we had a vast network of veterans, and then the client was like, Have you got any more teams? Have you got any more teams? Everyone was sitting in wood lines texting their maids, join some work, join some work. Well, yeah. Before you know it, we had over 200 people on the ground, and that was in six months. And from there, for me, I mean, that's where that's where the Black Onyx family came from. Lee is all about making the company looking after each other, everyone looks after it at everyone's backs. And in the early days, it was a full veteran company. That we we were all veterans. Yeah, we've diversified now, we've let a few civilians in, a few normies in cut. Only a couple, but it works really well. And over time, Lee's reinvested into the business, which is where the academy came in. So in 2022, the academy was set up in order to ensure that all of the security staff were trained to the right standard, but also by credible instructors, and then back on its facilities. Although that only started on its own entity the beginning of last year, 2025, it was originally the logistics arm to the concepts business in the beginning. Okay. So on the HS2 project, as well as providing staffing, we were arranging and organizing hotels, transport to inform the hotels and all welfare and logistics for the urban sites. So that now was separated from that and become its own entity back on its facilities. Interesting. So that's the three pillars of the company. Yeah. We rely on our sort of um our motto of trust integrity assurance. Uh, and the company is ever growing and ever evolving. We've got over 170 staff on the ground, 60% of veterans, um, 90% of our senior leadership team of veterans, um, and we all look after each other and it is one big, one big family.

SPEAKER_02

Now, there's there's a powerful thread I've noticed in your story from Royal Marine to security specialists helping young people make safer decisions. Does this all feel like a continuation of service in a different form?

SPEAKER_00

100%. Yeah, yeah, without a shadow of a doubt. I had this conversation with somebody I had a meeting with yesterday, and it's and it is it's almost like because I think it's it's a continuation of service, but it's a continuation of understanding that we've been given so much in the military of that community feeling of looking after each other. And when you look outside and go, I can see that what we have will solve these problems. So it's a case of if everyone just looked after each other, I mean the bunny bunny system, for example, you're looking after your opponent first, therefore you know you're always gonna collect after. If that's impregnated across communities, we're gonna be better, aren't we? So yeah, as much as giving back, it's like we can see that this works, we know it works, it's worked for us. Yeah. So it's a continuation of delivering back what we've already been given as training, I suppose, yeah. Well said.

SPEAKER_02

Finally, if Armed Forces Week is all about recognition, what would you like people to recognise about the men and women who serve and continue to serve in different ways after leaving?

SPEAKER_00

Um, the fact that it's selfless. Everything they do is selfless. Yeah. Uh, and they continue to do so. So even though the uniform is off and there's a veteran there, they are still part of the armed forces. It matters not whether the uniform is on or off. You know, it stays. I mean, we have a uh uh saying once a war marine, always a war marine. But it's the same for all military. Once you've been in the armed forces, you are you still are. And and that's it. And and I think for us, like I said, being able to support Armed Forces Week and Armed Forces Day, you know, I'm I'm going out with buckets and collecting money at Testerho led in Longton over the next couple of weeks to help fund the Stowe Council so they can run the event. Um and I think that's what it's all about collaboration and community-led initiatives, helping everyone help each other. And finally, where do people go, Stefan?

SPEAKER_02

How do people find out more about all your work here? We'll put the links down below, but we'll put the links.

SPEAKER_00

Uh so Black Onice Academy website, yeah, uh www.blackhoniesacademy.com. There is also our Blackon His Academy LinkedIn page. Yes. Um, and on there you can find all of the stuff that we're up to. Um, like I said, we are very, very active with regards to what we can do in the community. If anyone wants help, come and ask us and we're there to support. And that goes across all service levers as well. You know, we are very, very much in the process of going to careers fairs, showing veterans how they can get into the security industry. We can give them that one-to-one tutorial service, give them the training, and then we offer them employment into the concept side. So for any youths looking for engagement, any veterans looking for support or even just someone to talk to, just give us a shout. Stefan, thank you so much for coming on the podcast.

SPEAKER_02

No worries, thank you for having me. Much appreciated. Brilliant to chat to Stefan there and a really fitting way to close the episode. And across all four conversations, what stands out is that Armed Forces Day means different things to different people. For some, it's about pride. For others, it is about remembrance, gratitude, visibility, family opportunity, or simply feeling that service is understood and recognized by the wider public. Here at West Midland RFCA, we are proud to support the Armed Forces community across the region. And we encourage you to feel the same way. So whether you are attending a local event, sharing a message of support, speaking to someone who has served, or learning about the Armed Forces community in your area, Armed Forces Day is a chance to come together and say thank you. And also a huge thank you, of course, to all of my guests today Lieutenant Colonel John Tucker, Major Darren Knight, Lieutenant Colonel Gavin Hudson, and Stefan Norfield. Depending on when you're listening to this, if Armed Forces Day is just upcoming, we're posting a lot about it on our socials. So if you want an overview of all the events that are happening across the West Midlands, just search West Midland Dollar FCA, give us a follow, and you'll find lots of carousels to click through there. So yes, this has been another fantastic episode. Once again, huge thanks to all my guests, huge thanks to everyone that's listening to the podcast as well. If you've enjoyed this episode and found it valuable, please share it with people. That is how we grow and grow, is that more and more people listen, more and more people are engaged, and the stats have been great lately. So we're definitely trending in an upward direction. So please help us continue that way. Anyway, I've been your host, Tom Kui, as always, communications officer here at West Midland Reserve Forces and Cadets Association. Thank you for listening to the podcast. Happy Armed Forces Day, and we'll see you on the next one.