Disability FAQs | The Disability Benefits Podcast #33

In this episode, we answer several questions from the comment section about getting your social security disability benefits.

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Disability Consulting, LLC

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Disclaimer: We are a non-attorney firm. Our company specializes in representation for Social Security disability claims and is not a law office. The information provided in this video is for general informational purposes only and does not constitute legal advice. For legal guidance specific to your situation, please consult a licensed attorney.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:01

Okay. Alright. Well, we're going to do another episode where we're just answering questions from the comment section. I have three of them. Two of them will be probably pretty brief. And then the third one will lead into a more elaborate answer. So the first one, and this is very similar to other questions that we've had answered. They asked if we would speak to their doctors, so the claimant's doctors, and basically just tell the doctor what we need, tell the doctor how to fill stuff out. And I told them, we're happy to coach the claimant on how to talk to your doctor, but we're not gonna we're not gonna call your doctor and then say, hey, we need you to do this and this and this. And then the response was if the clients are speaking to the doctors, why are they paying you other than getting the records and submitting them electronically? What do you actually do as a representative?

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Yeah, well, we get that a lot. Um first of all, one of the questions that you're going to get from Social Security Administration if you get an opinion form from your doctor or your therapist is were you there when they filled this out? Um and you basically if you sit, you know, sit on the examining table and they're like, okay, well, they want to know how much you can be on your feet. I can't be on my feet. Put down five minutes, five minutes. You know, well, what about as lifting and carrying? Can you I can't lift and carry anything. I can't even lift a gallon of milk. Put like three pounds. Three pounds. Um that's useless. In fact, um adjudicators are they're probably going to be really turned off with your claim because now it looks like you're just you're trying to game the system. Yeah. I'll tell my doctor what to say. The only thing worse than you telling your doctor what to say on a medical uh source statement, which is an opinion form, is for me to tell your doctor what to say on a medical source statement, opinion form. Um so the answer is no. I am never ever going to call your doctor and say, Well, I need you to say that, you know, Mr. Smith can't lift or carry more than five pounds. I need you to say, Mr. Smith can't be on his feet for more than a few minutes. I need you to say, nope. Um what should happen, and this is a very organic and natural kind of interaction, is you've been seeing a doctor long enough that they have an opinion on what you are able to do and what you are not able to do. And all we're asking them to do is just circle the box. They don't have to circle every every answer. They don't know, I don't really know if you have any problems, you know, reaching you know, above shoulder. I don't fill it out. Don't circle it. You don't have to. Um, and even better, I've said this in the earlier podcasts. I personally prefer a narrative. Just have them jot down something. They can write it in their scratch, chicken scratching, and you know, Social Security examiners and judges, they can usually decipher doctors chicken scratching because they're used to it. Um I'd rather have that, a narrative, than for them to fill out my form or fill out Social Security's form, which is basically you check a box or you circle an answer. Um, but it's a very organic process. Your provider should have some kind of opinion on what you're able to do and what you're not able to do. Um to the second part of the question, what are you paying me for? Let's get it out there again. You're not paying me at all unless I win your case. Yeah. Um I don't have a retainer, you don't pay me anything up front. If I lose your case after all the time I've spent on it, or my employees have spent on it, if we lose your case after two years and I've spent 40 hours, 40 work hours on your case, you know how much you owe me? Nothing. And you haven't paid me a dime. So as you can tell, I kind of bristle when people, what am I paying you for? Well, you're not paying me at all until I win the case. But let me tell you what you are paying me for. You're paying me for my expertise, you're paying me for my 35 years experience, and you're paying me for the arguments that I am going to make in your case. Um, if you feel qualified to go in front of Social Security and cite that, you know, well, you know, Social Security, pursuant to Social Security Ruling 96-8P, I'm disabled because that ruling, and then you explain the ruling to Social Security, well, hey, go for it. You may not have that expertise. You know, well, you know, I I believe that I grid, you know, at my age and with my work history and with my education and with the limitations that the medical records all show that I have, um, I believe that I grid, and therefore you should find me disabled uh due to medical vocational rule 201.10. If you feel that you're confident and capable and you possess that kind of expertise, then my answer is nothing. You don't even need me. Go for it. Go for it on your own. You do not have to have a representative to argue your case. But one, the fact that you do enlist the help of an advocate or a representative, whether you like it or not, that gives a tremendous amount of credibility to your case right out of the gate. The fact that you are represented means that somebody has put eyes on your case and somebody has said, yeah, they're disabled, and I can prove it. That automatically the credibility of your case, boom, it doesn't rise, it shoots up because now you have an advocate. Same way in any kind of civil or uh or criminal uh uh proceeding. You have an advocate, your your credibility immediately shoots up. Somebody believes in you and somebody is is going to argue with you. So you're you will be paying me if I win your case for my expertise and for the arguments that I make and for the work that I do. I will be the one hounding um, especially at the hearing level, I'm the one who'll be hounding your doctors or your hospital medical records department or whatever. I'll be the one hounding them to get the records in. Um at the lower levels, the disability determination sections from the state um will get your medical records. So there's not a whole lot, you know. I kind of bristle when people say, Well, I did all the work. Well, what if you filled out the forms? I mean, that basically the amount of work a disability claimant has to do in their case is just to cooperate, which usually means filling out forms. And going to the doctor. Which yeah, and and staying in treatment. And then on many occasions, they will schedule you an exam in your area. They will pay for the exam. If you can't get there, um they will pay pay you mileage after the fact. Um it's it's about as easy a process as it can be for what you actually have to do, what what kind of energy you have to exert in a disability case. Now, I'm not saying it's easy because it's not, it's kind of grueling that that they want so much information from you and that they take forever. I get that. But yeah, I as you can tell, I kind of bristle when somebody says, Well, what am I paying you for? Well, again, at the at the beginning of your case, and up till I win the case, you're not paying me a dime. And if I don't win the case, you never pay me anything. Um, what are you paying me for if I win your case? Well, you're paying me for my expertise. You're paying me for I'm gonna make sure I'm gonna be your cheerleader, possibly your mom, and say, hey, you know, have you been going into treatment? I'm gonna check in with you every um periodically, usually every 45 to 60 days. I'm gonna check in with you. You know, we told you that you need to go to a doctor. Have you gone to a doctor? Well, no, why? Why haven't you gone to the doctor when I've told you that the way to win a disability case is to actually build a medical record? You can't build a medical record unless you're going to the doctor. I've told you that. Why haven't you gone? That's just tough love. I'm being your mom. That's what that's what you're paying me for, because I'm going to remind you, sometimes force uh forcefully, hey, you need to get in trouble. I I told you five months ago that we you haven't gone to see anybody. What do you expect? Well, I expect Social Security to just believe me, on my word, I'm disabled. Well, that kind of attitude, you wouldn't, you wouldn't expect that kind of um uh faith from somebody else in any other aspect of your life. You wouldn't expect somebody to just to take you at your word because I'm an honest person and I wouldn't lie about that. No, I haven't seen anybody in 18 months for my conditions, but my conditions are so bad that I can't work. And you never ever try to bridge that gap and basically fill in the question that heavily hangs over your case. If he's so bad, why isn't he in treatment? Which is a great question. It's a damaging question, and it's something that I can't argue against. That's a great that's a great question. We have to be able to argue that. But let's argue it by staying in treatment. So I'll be your cheerleader. Did you fill out those those forms Social Security sent you? They sent me copies too. Did you fill out those forms? No, no, I'm, you know, they should just believe me. You gotta fill out those forms.

SPEAKER_02 9:32

Yeah, I should I shouldn't have to fill out those.

SPEAKER_01 9:34

I'll encourage you, and at at certain points I will hound you like I'm your mom, you know, telling you that you gotta clean your bedroom. Um that is what you're paying me for. And then when things get nitty-gritty in the hearing, um, if you think you can cross-examine a vocational witness, okay. Yeah, you know, I will cross-examine a vocational witness. I know the law, and when they start start spouting nonsense, which a lot of times they do, I'll call them on it. The judge is not gonna call them on it. The judge, the judge wants them to spout nonsense, you know, 90% of the time. Um, they're not gonna call them on it, but I will. Yeah, that's what you're paying me for. So again, you know, as you can tell, I kind of bristle um with that because I hear it pretty often, especially in a case at the lower levels where they're getting inundated by forms. Okay, well, I hired you. I I can't fill out forms for you. I can't basically put words in your mouth, or I can't say, well, you know, he can't. I don't think he, I don't think he could lift or carry this. I think he has this these kinds of problems with memory. I think I'm just making up stuff and and then I send it in. That's fraud. I mean, I I can't do that. I can't sign your name on that. Yeah. Now I can if you have some significant problems filling out a form, and there are people who do, if you have problems with literacy or you have problems with cognition, or you have some other problems, um, I get it, and yes, I will pay my staff to call you up and to go through the form with you. And in some instances, very rare, so don't expect it, but in some instances, I'll have them interview you with the form. Okay, well, the first form asks, you know, who do you live with? Well, I live with my mom. He lives with his mom. And they'll fill out the form, but then at the end of the form, they will put, you know, I am employee of disability consulting, my name is such and such. In a phone interview on March the 17th. I um I got all these answers from the claimant. Um, and they can do that, but you know, the the forms they make the forms about as easy um as they can be. They're just asking you about things that you're already going to know. You know how you know what kind of stuff you do during the day. Are you able to pay your bills? Are you able to feed your animals? Are you able to cook? Are you able to clean? Are you able to go to the grocery store? Are you able to drive? You know all these things. That's the questions they're asking. You just fill out the form. You know, they're asking you about the work you did in the last five years. You know about that. You know how much you lifted and carry at that job, you know how much you were on your feet at that job. Did you know how much you know reaching and handling that you did with your arms? Yeah, you know all that. You're the best person to fill out that form. So, but going back to um to the first part of the question, um, no, I will never call a doctor and tell him what to say. However, you will see if we send it to you. Sometimes we send it directly to the doctor, but sometimes if we send the form to you to give to your doctor, um the front page basically says why their import their opinion is important, what the Social Security law is and stuff like that. Um that's all I need to tell them. You know, your your opinion is really important, especially if you've been seeing this uh your patient for a long time. If you have a 20-year history with a patient, you should be able to fill out a opinion form in five minutes. Yeah. Our opinion form for physical cases is one and a half pages. It's not even two full pages, and it's just things that you circle. For our mental health form, it's three pages. Okay. And you have to check some boxes in that. Um but I mean it's it one of them's five minutes, the physical one, the other one's ten minutes. It's just not gonna take them that long. If they know it. Um but you know, if they haven't seen you for a long time, or they um they don't have much of a of a history with you. I've been seeing this this provider, you know, for two months. I've seen him twice. Probably not gonna be an opinion that's that valuable to Social Security. But if he's been seeing you for 20 years, yeah. Um so yeah, that's my long answer to your short question.

SPEAKER_02 13:48

Yeah, I can tell you're pretty pretty fired up about this.

SPEAKER_01 13:51

Yeah, I mean, because we we hear that a lot. What do you mean that you want me to take a form to my doctor? What am I paying you for? Yeah. Well, I can send it to your doctor, but let me tell you what happens is insurance companies, workers' comp companies, uh, long-term disability insurance companies, um, just spam companies, um, pharmacological uh companies are inundating doctors' offices with mail. However much you get from credit card companies, quadruple that. And that is what a doctor's office gets. And in the middle of that, there's a two-page form coming from disability consulting. It's gonna go where all the rest of their mail that they're not expecting goes in the trash. So that's why we ask our clients hey, you know, next time you go to your doctor, we're gonna send you this form, um, have your doctor fill it out, just leave it with them, and um, and then have them mail it back to us. Yeah. That's that's that's that by the way, that is kind of industry standard. I'm not saying that all firms do that, but you know, I I am not some kind of particular monster uh when it comes to that. I will send the form nine times out of ten to my client to give to their doctor instead of ta sending it directly to the doctor because the doctor is just gonna deep six it, it's gonna go in the trash.

SPEAKER_02 15:11

Yeah, I gotcha. Yeah, I mean the main the three main things that I tell a client when they're considering representation is number one, um, like you said, we don't have any fees until we win the case. So it's like before you start asking questions about like what am I paying you for, we don't have any fees. The second thing is the data just speaks for itself. Social security periodically releases data, and you're about three and a half times more likely to win your case if you have a representative versus not. Now that's the national average for if you have a representative. Our company wins more than the national average, so for us it's gonna be higher than that. So just in general, you're gonna you're gonna win, you have a higher likelihood of winning your case if you have a representative. And then the third thing, like you said, it's completely up to you. At the end of the day, you don't have to have a representative. Right. You know, if you're arguing about why do I need one, don't hire one. Right. You know, it's not like it's required from Social Security. I think they recommend it because it just makes it easier on their end, especially at the hearing level.

SPEAKER_01 16:12

Yeah. And there are cases, we talked about this before, there are about 40 or 50 cases a year, um, which doesn't maybe sound like a whole lot, or maybe it depends on which what you think how many of you think I I um I represent a year, which is, you know, hundreds and hundreds. Substantial, yeah. But um but forty to fifty cases a year um we don't get any money on, and and there are even more than that that we don't take. Um and they're great cases. They are absolute that you are going to win your case. And they're kind of slam dunk cases, they're sad cases because a lot of them are terminal. Whereas, you know, they'll call me up and they're like, you know, I just got a horrible diagnosis. I've got I got a lung cancer that's metastasized, which is spread to the brain. Like a client, client calls me up and tells me that he's got metastatic cancer. He's he's talked to his doctor and things are bad. Um so what I will normally do is you don't need me. You don't need me. You you need the path report, the pathology report that shows that you have uh cancer that is metastatic, it's spread to someplace, and Social Security will take care of everything else. Um if you can't do that, if you can't do it on your own, um we will definitely take your case. And we're gonna win that case so quickly because there's a five-month waiting period. We'll probably win it within the five months. There won't be any back pay. And if there's no back pay, I don't get a fee. And do I have a problem with that? No, I do not. I absolutely will take those cases. Um, like a lot of them, if I believe that you're capable of doing everything on your own, I'll give you the keys to the kingdom. This is what you need to do, this is what you need to get from your doctor, this is what you do, this is the address that you send it to, and then you should be good. Or, I no, no, Mr. Groves, I can't do any of that. You know, can you just take my case? Yeah, I'll take the case, and then I'll do all that. And, you know, three, four months later, you you get approved. Um, you know, we'll get we'll get a letter, you know. There is we we're not approving any fee in this case because the case was won in the waiting period and there is no back pay. Um and I again I don't have a problem doing that because it's the right thing to do. Um and we do we we take about 40 or 50 of those a year that we don't make any money on, and then there's uh you know several more that just talking to you on the phone, I will tell you, you know, if you've got this condition, um do you have a pathology report? Yeah, yeah. You you could do this on your own or have your wife do it. Um, you know, you're you don't you don't need me.

SPEAKER_02 18:45

Yeah. I mean the way that the contingency fee works, which is just that we don't make any money unless we win the case, that really does align all of the incentives for what we do. Like if I talk to a a a lead that is about to become a client and I tell them, hey, it sounds like you have a great case. If we want to represent you, is that something you want to move forward with? That's basically me saying, like, I'm confident that it'll be worth it for us to work for free for several months or over a year. Right. Right. Because I I'm pretty sure we can win your case. We're not going to take a case we're not confident we can win.

SPEAKER_01 19:17

Nope. I can't afford to do that. Yeah. Yeah. I can't I can't roll the dice. And I will tell you that if you've heard any bad things about Social Security representatives or Social Security attorneys, if you've ever heard any bad things about them, and I'm sure you have, it is the ones who'll just roll the dice. I'll take your case. Yeah. And I'm just gonna roll the dice.

SPEAKER_02 19:40

And then you never hear from them. Well, you can't. They roll the dice and then you don't hear from them.

SPEAKER_01 19:43

Yeah, it's the telltale sign of that kind of representative is if you lose the hearing, okay, you get you get denied at the hearing and they drop you like a hot potato. Yep. Yeah, we have taken it as far as I can go. Um good luck to you. It's like, well, there's another level within Social Security, and then there's the federal courts, and I've always been of the opinion if I thought the case was strong enough to argue it before a judge, and then the judge disagrees and denies the case, what why is it that all of a sudden the case is not that strong to me anymore? Yeah. That doesn't make any sense to me. Now there are some uh circumstances that happen in the hearing. Yeah, like if they just lie to you. Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, I had um a couple hearings uh in February where my client basically told the judge, well, you know, if I really, really pushed myself, I could work, but I mean you don't you just don't know what this pain is like, Your Honor. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Did you just tell the judge if you really pushed yourself you could work? And and when uh the other guy said something else, you know. Um anyway, there were there were two of them in in February, and they both said that they could work. The interesting thing is the judge knew that you know one of them was absolutely wrong, and I've already got the approval on that one. And the other one, she denied it. I mean the judge denied the case. Why? Well, he said he could work. Yeah, that's um so in those cases after the hearing, and and I review it and I'm like, can I make an argument that you know my client wasn't being honest when he said he could work? It's so backwards. I don't know if I can make that argument to the next level, which is the appeals counsel. Um but the vast, vast, vast majority of cases that we come across, if I can't convince the judge in a hearing, my attitude is all right, well, I'll convince the appeals counsel that I was right, and I will appeal it. Um if I thought it was strong enough to take in front of a judge, unless uh there's something happened in the hearing that just makes it weird, that almost unappealable, I'm gonna appeal it to the appeals counsel. Yeah. And again, telltale signed that you have a representative who's just rolling the dice is I don't take cases. To the appeals council. I'll argue them at the hearing level, but if we lose it at the hearing level, I'm done. Wow. Okay. Not really sure that you can feel good about being an advocate, but okay. That's a telltale sign. And my goodness, they're out there in drugs. Tons of them.

SPEAKER_02 22:16

Yeah, and I mean a lot of a lot of claimants when they get the denial at the hearing level, they're just absolutely confused about, I can't believe the judge denied me, I have a good case, and they're just they don't know what to do. For us, we see a really bad uh decision by an ALJ, by a judge, and we say, Yep, that's another really bad decision by Social Security. We see these all the time. Let's take it to the next level. Yeah. You know, it's it it can be surprising, but it's not like there's a process, you know, there's a procedure for what to do next.

SPEAKER_01 22:47

Yeah. Had a case yesterday, and this we're kind of getting off topic, but I think this is pertinent to what we're talking about. Had a case yesterday that I appealed to the appeals counsel. Uh the hearing was in January, and um I begged the judge, please, please, please buy a consultative exam in this case. He hasn't been to um his mental health provider in like eight months. But, you know, in the hearing he was just scatterbrained. He was all over the place. And that's one of, you know, one of his disabilities, is that he just couldn't focus on something. All I was always redirecting him in the hearing. The judge was always, you know, Mr. So-and-so, I asked you this, but you're giving me this. You know, I need you to stay on topic. So she's giving him uh, you know, some redirection. I'm giving him redirection when I cross-examined him. And then I begged her, I said, you know, if we could just get a mental status exam, find out what's going on with him. And she agreed. And we got it, and the exam was absolutely, I mean, this this guy's got really bad problems. His his insight and judgment are poor. He's markedly limited in his ability to handle simple instructions, he's markedly limited in this, he's markedly limited in that. And I'm like, all right, well, we got what we needed. She denied the case and said basically, well, that was a you know, just a snapshot of of his impairment, and it wasn't uh indicative of what he was like, you know, consistently. And I'm like, hmm. What do you mean? There are no consistent records, which is why I asked you to buy the exam, and why you approved the exam. And the exam itself stands on its own. And so I yeah, I I I sent that to the appeals counsel yesterday. I'll get a remand on that. Yeah. And, you know, it it is what it is. But again, I mean that's that's the thing, you know. I'm not gonna take your case if I don't think I can win it. If I have spent hours and hours and hours and hours on your case arguing it to Social Security, losing at the lower levels, and then taking you in front of a judge, losing it at the judge level, unless something went down in the hearing that is just I wow, you something happened that there's no way I can appeal this. I can't argue with what the judge said. Unless that happens, and that's very rare, um, I'm appealing it to the appeals counsel because I'm an advocate. Yeah. I'm not gonna roll the dice with your case if I believe I can win it at the beginning. I should believe that I should have won it in every level since then, and I'm gonna keep on going. I've you know, I've said this in podcasts before. You know, when I first started, I got a not a bad reputation, but I got a reputation from within Social Security that I was a bulldog. And I'm like, I'll own that. I'll own that, and my whole philosophy was I don't see a denial as a no. I see a denial as I just haven't convinced Social Security yet, and I'm gonna keep trying.

SPEAKER_02 25:57

Well, let's uh let's end this episode here and then I'll roll the next couple of questions into uh the next episode. Groovy. Cool. If you have a question about your disability case, drop it in the comment section below, and we will do our best to answer it in the next episode.