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Generations of Grace Podcast
A Christian podcast led by a mother and daughter, sharing faith-filled conversations across generations. Through biblical truth, personal stories, and real-life encouragement, we seek to glorify God and inspire listeners to grow deeper in their walk with Christ. There is more!
Generations of Grace Podcast
Lukewarm
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Welcome back to Generations of Grace Podcast. Today's episode we have Sonya & Chole talking about what it means to go all in for Christ. You cannot have one foot in the world and one foot following Christ. This episode is not just a teaching about what it means to be lukewarm, but it is also a warning to those who think they're saved but they're only deceived. These truths are said out of love as we don't want to see anyone perish, but rather have everlasting life. You don't have to live a terrible broken life here on earth just waiting and hoping to get to Heaven. You can choose to right now lay down your life and follow Jesus Christ.
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Music by Mikhail Smusev from Pixabay
Welcome back to Generations of Grace Podcast. I hope you guys have all had a blessed week, and we just really appreciate anyone that's tuning in today to listen, or anyone that's listened in the past, and we just hope you'll continue to listen. Um, Chloe and I are both just so still so very excited about doing this. Uh, we were still trying to figure out how we've been doing this. I was looking this morning. This is our fourth month. We started, we released our first episode in January. And so we was, I was looking this morning at that and I was like, it's been four months. You would think the nerves and the jitters would get gone by now, but it's still every time before an episode, we we have to pray and we, you know, just to not be nervous. But we was kind of going over some of our statistics. And when we first started this, you know, we were just two country gals that decided we wanted to do more for God and tell people about Jesus.
SPEAKER_00Yes, what he's done for us, what he can do for you.
SPEAKER_02But we didn't know. We didn't really know how to do it. You know, we didn't know who would listen. We didn't know if it would just be one person. We knew our family probably would, so we knew we'd have a little bit more than one, but we thought, is it just gonna be our family and our close friends? And Chloe was looking this morning. She has an app that shows her how many listeners that we have. And so we're just so excited because it showed that we've been listened to in 17 different countries and 71 cities. And that's just so exciting because that's 17 countries that Jesus is being spread and that word is going around. And so that that is just such a blessing to us to know that people are listening and that people are getting Jesus instilled in them and and that they're hopefully sharing with others, or it just helps them with something. So anyway, we were just super excited and just wanted to share that with our listeners.
SPEAKER_00And I thought it was cool too, because we were talking about it before we started. But as soon as we started, mom said we've been doing it about four months. And if you look, we have over 400 downloads in total through our nine-ish episodes. And so that's about a hundred downloads each month. And so I just think that's that's awesome. And that's just downloads.
SPEAKER_02That's not people that have just viewed it. Right. Because there's people that can listen without actually downloading our podcast. So there's 407 downloads. But um, anyway, we're just excited about that and praise the Lord. We just thank you. Thank you to Jesus for blessing it and to keep spreading, spreading the word. And we thank you guys as our listeners and for those that share it, and and so that other people, not not so that we can be praised, but so that that Jesus is getting out there. That is our main goal, is that He is getting out there. So, with all that being said, we'll jump into what we're going to discuss today. And today we're going to discuss um being lukewarm or are we really living a true Christian life? Right. And so I'm gonna let Chloe go ahead and start with that. And so I hope you guys enjoy.
SPEAKER_00Okay, so I kind of wanted to start with the verse. If you have read your Bible or familiar with it, I'm sure you've heard the verse in Revelation 3 where it talks about being lukewarm. So I'm just gonna go there. Revelation 3, 15. I have through 22, we'll just see how far I go. It says, I know your works, you're neither hot nor cold. Would that you were either hot or cold. So because you are lukewarm and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth. For you say I am rich, I have prospered, and I need nothing, not realizing that you are wretched, patiable, poor, blind, and naked. I counsel you to buy from me gold refined by fire, so that you may be rich, and white garments, so that you may clothe yourself, and the shame of your nakedness may not be seen, and salve to anoint your eyes, so that you may see. Those whom I love I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent. Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come into him and eat with him, and he with me. The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my father on his throne. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. And I say that because if you are wanting to seek the Lord and you're like, Well, I want to do I like I want to do this and I want to live my life for him, but I just don't even know how. It says right there, if you seek him, and the door will be open for you. And God opens doors that cannot be shut. And so if you are truly desiring him with your whole heart, soul, mind, and strength, willing to give up your wants, needs, and desires, he's there waiting for you with open arms. And I was looking up just the definition of lukewarm online. It says a liquid that is only slightly warmer rather than hot or cold. And m some of you may have heard before, and I have too, but about like coffee. Lots of people like iced coffee and lots of people like hot coffee. But if it's that lukewarm, that's gross. You go spit it out, and that's what the Bible says God's gonna do with you too. And then I also think of like running a bath, people do those ice baths, not me, I'm out, but I know that some people really enjoy those ice baths, and then you like hot water in your bath. But if you like turn the hot water on and just let your bath sit there where it's like cooling down, it's like, oh well now it's too cold. Oh, well, now it's yeah, so uh I just kind of think of that too. And then some other words, when I say these words, think about what a Christian lifestyle is, and if this sounds like what Christ is calling you to be. So some other words for lukewarm is unenthusiastic, indifferent, half-hearted, or mediocre. And if you don't know the promises of God, if you go into your Bible and read the promises of God, nothing about them are mediocre or half-hearted, it's just full faith and knowing what he has done for you with that. And so I just encourage you if you guys are feeling like this and just like half-hearted in your relationship with Christ, like, well, I really want to live for him, but I also like don't want to give up my friends. I like to party and do all this. Well, God's not gonna take your choice away. He's gonna have that choice there for you to make, but know that he is there waiting for you, standing at the door and knocking.
SPEAKER_02And and when you're when you're making that choice, some of the things that you might try doing, because you can't just do it on your own and you do have to seek the Lord, but some of the things that you may try to do is you need to immerse yourself in God's word. Get into the Bible, even if it's not interesting to you at first, even if you're like, I don't want to read the start doing it. And and and things will start filling you. And and another thing is start praying. Unite with other Christians, even whenever you don't feel like it. Right. Like surround yourself with people, because if you're surrounding yourself with people that are not Christ-like, that is that is what's going to flow into you.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_02If you're surrounding yourself with people that are Christ-like, and even though at first it's very hard to change from the old lifestyle to the new lifestyle, you you have to take the steps. You knock and the Lord's going to hear you, but you have to take the steps and make the choices to remove yourselves from the old situations and start getting in the word and prayer and and people that are are good Christian people.
SPEAKER_00Right. And that's so true too, because I used to think, like, well, God is a forgiving God. So if I just I can still have the friends that I have and still do the things that I do that is not according to his will, and I'll just say sorry, and then he'll forgive me. But that is such a lie from the enemy. God says to repent, not to say sorry.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00And repentance is changing your heart. It's not just, well, I know I'm going to sin, or I feel bad for sinning because like for me, it was like morally wrong to do the things I was doing. So I was emotionally upset because I was breaking my morals, but I wasn't repenting to God. And so it's just And I didn't used to realize that.
SPEAKER_02Right. I used to think repentance meant ask for forgiveness. Right. Well, we are to ask for forgiveness, but it's but then you are you are to repent, which means what you just said, turn away from you, you leave it. You don't just do the same thing over and over and ask for forgiveness. Yeah, you turn away from it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and that's just a great example of doing some self-evaluation because I was surrounded by people that wouldn't straight up tell me, like, hey, you're you're doing that wrong. Like, do you realize you're not actually living your life for Christ? Do you realize that that's not true repentance? And so just really evaluate what do you, what's your heart posture whenever you mess up?
SPEAKER_02One thing that I did want to point out before we go any further into this is we're not talking to people that that occasionally sin or that go through a a season of I just am not, I just don't want to read my Bible for a couple days or something like that. We're talking to people that are really one foot in the world, one foot in the church.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_02Or, you know, they're they they show up at church sometimes, they say they're a Christian, but outside of that Sunday school or that Wednesday night service, whatever they may go to, their life does not reflect that. We're not talking about people that all of us will fall short of the glory of God.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_02We all sin and mess up. We're talking about people that repeatedly they're living this way one day and this way the other day.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_02Do people know you know Jesus outside of church on Sunday?
SPEAKER_00Yes, and that's great because that's exactly how I used to live was well, I'll go to church whenever I go to church, when I find the right church, all these excuses and everything. But now it's like I completely live my life for Christ. Like I'm not straddling that fence anymore. I'm like diving in the deep end. And there was a scripture, where was it, where it's talking about not leading people astray. We talked about it the other day. I know we did. Oh, it's in Matthew 18 6. Okay, so Matthew 18 6 says, Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck and he were drowned in the depth of the sea. So if you're straddling that fence and you, like mom was saying, we're talking to those who are claiming to be Christians yet you don't know, like other people don't know you're a Christian outside of Sunday. It is awful to try to claim to be a Christian and then other people that are trying to learn things from God and trying to learn how to be saved and they see you doing all these sinful things, they're gonna think, Oh, well, they claim to be a Christian, so it's okay if I go party. It's okay if I go drink, it's okay if I go sleep around and do all these things, it's okay if I just drink alcohol to just take the edge off because I'm stressed out. Like people are gonna think that that's okay, but it's not. It's not okay. You can't claim to be a Christian and still doing these things and steering people in wrong directions.
SPEAKER_02And one thing that um I wanted to get a little bit into is I think some of our listeners probably know that if you're claiming to be a Christian and you're living this way at church and living this way outside of it, that yeah, you you're not living your true Christian walk. But what about the fact of if you're outside of the church when you're in just your daily life? What about the fact of not getting uncomfortable? What about the fact of living like you know in your heart you're convicted of doing certain things, but you go along with it anyway because you don't want to be mocked. You don't want to be made fun of, you don't want to, and one of the scriptures that I seen is 2 Timothy 3.12, and it says, indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ, Jesus will be persecuted. Okay, so that says there that if you are desiring to live a godly life in Christ Jesus, you will be persecuted. Right. And so are you willing to go through suffering and persecution for Jesus? Or are you one of those that's like, well, I know I believe and I know this isn't right, but I'm gonna go along with it anyway because I don't want to be made fun of. Right. And if you're doing that, that's being lukewarm. It is. That's not standing up for our Jesus, that's not standing up for your beliefs and what you believe in. And I know there's been situations in my husband's eyes' eyes' life that years ago, not proud of it, but we were partiers. We'd like to go to parties. We were the life of the party, we like to drink, we like to just go along with what everyone else did. Now, we were saying we were Christians this whole time. Now I know that um we were a long way from living that way, probably. But as our lives started to change, you know, we didn't just get on Facebook or get a big microphone and announce to the world, hey, we're Christians now. But things started changing in us. And there was things we were invited to in the very beginning that we were like, oh, should we? Well, we can just go, but we won't drink. We can just go, we won't do this. And at first that's what we would just slowly, you know, it got. But then I noticed when I was at those things, I wanted to drink. The desire and the temptation was there. Do not put yourself in tempting situations. Right. And so we finally had to exclude ourselves from those things. Whether it was great friends, whether it was family, whether it was whoever. And there was times, you know, we know we hurt people and it because they didn't understand why we didn't want to be with them anymore, but we just could not put ourselves in those situations. We got made fun of.
SPEAKER_00Yep.
SPEAKER_02Oh, y'all are those Jesus freaks now.
SPEAKER_00You're this and that and you're like, Or you think you're better than us, yes.
SPEAKER_02Yes, you think you're better than us. We never felt that way. Right. And we never were trying to judge those people. But what I'm saying is we had to remove ourselves from those situations. Although it would have been easier as far as not getting made fun of or not just to say, we'll go, we're just not gonna drink, but we'll still be a part of it. Well, what does that tell the kid I taught in Sunday school? Right. Or the people I was preaching to the day before that, whenever they find out, hey, Sonia was at this drunken party. Yeah. And regardless if I was drinking or not, the appearance of it looked evil.
SPEAKER_00Yes, it did.
SPEAKER_02And so I, for us personally, we had to remove ourselves from those situations and we had to give up people in our lives too. And I'm not saying we don't still love those people, they're just on a different path than us at this moment.
SPEAKER_00So And there's scripture too that talks about how, like you were saying, oh, well, I'll just go and hang out because like I don't want to hurt their feelings or anything. And I like they're my friends and I love them. But the it talks about how the bad behavior will corrupt the good behavior. If that's all you're surrounding yourself by, well corrupt the Bible also talks about it's important what you put in your eyes and your ears. So if all you're seeing and all you're hearing every day is partying with your friends and drinking, it will slowly desensitize you, even when you're trying to dive in your Bible and prayer. Like if that's all you're surrounded by, it's going to corrupt you. And because that's what you're filling yourself with.
SPEAKER_02And after some time, you really don't have to worry about it no more. Because when you stop being the fun person that they think that you need to be, they don't invite you anymore. So you don't really have to worry about it as much after a while.
SPEAKER_00But even in Revelation that I was reading earlier, it said that he wants to clothe you with his white garments, he wants to refine you like gold and fire. And a lot of people just read the lukewarm part of he's gonna spit you out if you're lukewarm, which is true, but they don't continue reading in that part. Like in the very beginning, when Adam and Eve sinned and they hid because of the shame of their nakedness. Well, they divulged in worldly desires and doubt in God, and so they had to hide themselves. But Christ wants to replace that shame of nakedness from your worldly ways and replace it with his white garments, he wants to clothe you in his righteousness.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, there's so much more to that verse. But one thing that people do need to realize about that verse, it does not say if you're lukewarm, we'll negotiate this. You can ask questions. It says, I will spit you out of my mouth. Therefore, if you're living a lukewarm life, and I know that there are people out there that love Jesus, but they I just I don't want to see anyone get spit out of his mouth when the time comes. And that's what he says will happen. So you have to decide are you with Jesus or are you with the world? And in Romans 12, too, it says, do not conform to the patterns of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. We cannot transform to how this world is living. We cannot transform to what is becoming the new normals and being okay with people. We cannot, I hear so many people say, Well, we're Chris, I'm a Christian, but we're not to judge them. We're not to do this, we're not to do that. But we cannot be okay with the sinful lifestyles and nature that people are living. Right. And that goes along with being lukewarm too. I feel like sometimes by not saying anything at all, you're held accountable. You're held accountable. And I'm not saying go out and just be argumentative to everybody or just try to stir up stuff. I'm saying if there is an open door, an open spot, a conversation is happening, or or somebody, let's just say, I don't even know what it would be, but let's say somebody comes and gives your child something that you don't agree with, you know it's against your beliefs or something, but you let your child take it in front of them because you don't want to be, well, that's just ridiculous. Why can't they have whatever it may be? And I can't think of a certain example of what it would be at this time, but but let's just say that instead of you being like, no, my child's not going to have this because I don't believe that is right. But a lot of us just keep our mouths shut because we don't want to be embarrassed or we don't want to, when we're keeping our mouths shut, we are not standing up for what we believe or what is right or what is true.
SPEAKER_00We're conforming to the world. Yes. And I have an example, not with the kid one, but I mean, there is, but that's not what I was thinking of. Is me and this friend, we were talking about COVID for some reason, and she came up and she was like, Well, I had plans to do this and this and this with my life, but then God had other plans and sent COVID here, and he just ruined my plans. Well, in that instance, I didn't say anything because I was just like thrown off. Like, what do you mean? Like, God ruined your plan. And so in that moment, rather than just sitting there and thinking all this and not saying anything, I should have been like, Hey, God doesn't send sicknesses upon us for that. So He allows them, but Satan starts them and strengthens us through the persecution, but God didn't just send sicknesses to wreck your life.
SPEAKER_02Right. And so she was talking directly to you. You wasn't interfering in someone else's conversation, but you chose not to say anything. And I was right and and because why did you choose not to say anything?
SPEAKER_00Because I was like, oh, well, I was so nervous. What is she gonna think when I say this? And then how is that conversation gonna lead to and all this? But what was corrected out of it is that was put on me so bad. And you know that feeling like when you're in the instance of the partying and you feel so uncomfortable because you're like, I know I need to get out of this and everything. Well, you feel that on the opposite side when you are full in for Christ, and it's called conviction. So you're like very uncomfortable and very like, I know I need to do this and I don't know what to do. Well, it's it's Holy Spirit convicting you, so just be obedient to him in that. And but what was corrected out of it later on was it was Holy Spirit was still convicting me of this, and so I the next day messaged her later on and was like, Hey, our conversation the other day, and it was like just a teeny tiny part of our conversation, but that's what stood out to me and was to explain like hey, God doesn't put that on us, but things things change and things do happen that God strengthens us through, and just explaining that with her and it went great, right? And so most of the time when Holy Spirit is leading you to say something, like even if they react badly, they can still receive it later on too. Yeah, but and when we were talking about you can't be in the world and of Christ in Matthew 6 24, it says, No one can serve two masters, for he for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon. And so that that right there is very self-explanatory. You can't be of the world and choose your friends and all of that and serve God, even if you think, well, I can still have both. That right there says otherwise. Right. Like you there will be situations where you have to make the choice. Is it gonna be God or is it gonna be what you want? Right.
SPEAKER_02And right, that is that's exactly right. And uh still talking about because I was trying to think of other examples of it, right? Because I know there's so many things that we all do. A lot of people think, well, I'm not out cussing and I'm not out drinking. And yes, we we shouldn't be doing those things either. But what about what about if you go to somebody's house and they're like, let's watch a movie?
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_02What if they put a movie on and the movie is filled with nothing but filth?
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Are you gonna sit there and watch it?
SPEAKER_00That's good.
SPEAKER_02Are you gonna get up and say, I'm I'm sorry, not be rude about it, but just I'm sorry, but I don't watch stuff like this because this is not what I want to fill my my mind with anymore.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_02I mean, what it's it's all the way down to things as simple as that. That we all know the big things, but are you doing things? Are you listening to things? Are you watching things? Are you doing things gossiping? Or are you going along with things that are not right just constantly?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And like I said, I'm not saying a slip-up that you mess up once or twice. I'm talking about is this your lifestyle?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, constant lifestyle of, well, what do I do? What choice am I gonna make? Like, I know I need to be better, but I just really don't want to give this up yet. And that's really good, especially the movie thing. And there's different people in my life that when I did start learning more and I did start fully going in for Christ instead of being that lukewarm person, I would start saying things like, Well, we're not gonna allow all these things in my home. So, for example, like I learned that like dream catchers, well, that power source isn't coming from. God to take away the dreams. I'm relying on that object to take away my dreams. Right. And so I'm like, please don't buy those for my kids. Like, it's not welcome here. Um, and like, like I think mom was touching base with this earlier. Don't go to them and be like, hey, you're going straight to hell because you're doing all this stuff. Like, that is not the way to approach that at all. How does God approach us when we're sinning or unknowingly doing things? Like it will slowly be revealed. And you don't just have to cram it in their face. And after time, when I've asked people not to buy me or my kids certain things or we don't watch certain things, they slowly start to respect that. Yes. And it's either they will either walk out of your life or they will respect it. And that is a choice that you have to make beforehand. You can't wait for the moment because if you wait for the moment and you don't already have your heart set on Christ, then you're not going to make the right decision.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00But there will be opportunity next time if you're wanting to go fully in with God. And this isn't like if you're not saved and you're th you're hearing this and you're like, well, why would I want to serve that God? Like that doesn't even make any sense to me why he's just gonna spit me out because I do the things that I like to do. Well, you live in a fallen sinful world and your flesh likes to do sinful things. So what you're doing may feel good temporarily. But then later on, anxiety is gonna come in and depression is gonna come in and anger, whatever it is you're struggling with, it will come in. And Christ is like, I already I wore that on me on the cross. So you don't have to deal with any of that. And it may be hard in the beginning, but if you just trust in me and have faith in me and walk with me, like I'm gonna take all that from you if you just let me, because I've already done it. And so that's just something I remember like even whenever me and my husband started to change and learn more and stuff, there were several people that called us all kinds of names and we were called a cult and different things. And so if you remain true to God, He'll remain true to you. That's right. That is right. I think that kind of goes into more of well, before I go into like faith and works and stuff.
SPEAKER_02Well, I would do want to say one thing, and it's not just us sitting here telling our listeners this, like we're giving you scripture. This is what the Bible says. Do not conform to the patterns of the world. You will be persecuted in my name. Like these are things that the Bible says. Yeah. So if you believe the Bible and you claim to believe the Bible, you have to believe this stuff.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you can't. Yeah, that's good. Um, more on like the if you're wanting to live in the world or submit to God. I was reading James 4, and I'm not gonna read it all, but just to summarize and everything, it was saying, like, why do you think you're arguing or having jealousy and coveting from one another, and maybe your prayers aren't being answered? So I want to ask you, because I used to pray like this too. I we touched base on it in our motherhood podcast with Mona too, and everything was how are your prayers being framed? And like if you're asking for things from God, but it's for your own personal will and your own personal gain, then those prayers aren't gonna be answered. Yeah because that's not for the glory of God. And so if you're praying selfishly, that's and this isn't like the one answer fix-all to your prayers not being answered. This is specifically from James 4. And don't get this misconstrued of oh well God doesn't want me to have anything nice, God doesn't, because that is not true at all. God says that He wants to prosper you and give you a good life. So it's okay to ask for good things. For example, like you can ask for God to provide for either finances or like a new car. But if you're going to use that car to show off or brag, be like, look what I finally got for myself and stuff like that. Well, that's not glorifying the Lord. Now, if you use that to travel and like show, like Lord, I'm gonna do this for you, then that's obviously according to his will. He wants you to have nice things. Right.
SPEAKER_02And and one thing that goes along with that is are you thinking about life's luxuries and material things on our earth and your own happiness more than you are about pleasing Jesus?
SPEAKER_00That's good.
SPEAKER_02I mean, like Chloe said, there is nothing wrong with us having nice things. But are you wanting those nice things to impress others? Are you wanting those nice nice things to say, I have the newest thing that's around? Or like me, for instance, I want a nice car because I I don't want to break down. Like I've told my husband several times, I'm just gonna go buy me a, you know, a $2,000 car and this and all, because so it's paid for and and all this. But I do get nervous about breaking down because I'm not a mechanic. I don't want to be on the side of the road. But it's not about now. There was a time in my life I did want the newest, nicest thing. But now, truthfully, I I want something that runs good and that is nice and taken care of. That's why I prefer something newer. But I do not care if it's the newest. I actually call my car now my granny car. And most people are like, this isn't a granny car, but I call it that because I just, but it runs good and it's you know, it keeps me safe and I'm I'm good with that. But but it's it's all the intent of your heart whenever you get something. There's nothing wrong with having nice things, but what's your intent behind it? Are you doing it to impress others?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and that's so true because God has God wants you to have a pleasureful life according to his will. And so, for example, like his creation, when he created us, obviously he created I don't know if you know where I'm going with this, but like he created sex to be a good thing, he created it according to his will within the marriage. But if you do that before marriage, that is not according to his will, right? And that it may feel like feel like pleasureful to your flesh because your flesh likes the fallen sinful world. But outside of marriage, that is not according to his will. If you wait until marriage, that is according to his will, and it is a great thing. So that's just an example. That's a good example.
SPEAKER_02It's something that's good but can be used as bad. Right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, like he created it for you to have pleasure, but like if you use it for your own ways, it's not gonna be according to his will. That's for your own selfish ways. Right. And in Matthew 16, 24, it talks about how you are to deny yourself, pick up your cross and follow him.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_00And if you think about it, I know for me, I can't say for all you guys, but for me, I would use different excuses for as to why I couldn't go to the deep end with God and give up the worldly ways. I would use so many different excuses. But when I think about it and I look on Jesus' life when he was here, it's like, what excuses did he give? He had every right to give the most excuses and he didn't give one. He was even silent in times that like could you be silent in the times that Jesus was silent in? And so it's just reflecting on that and seeing truly what he did for you.
SPEAKER_02And and we're not trying to say changing your ways and truly, truly living a true Christian life instead of being on the on the fence and lukewarm. We're not trying to say it's easy.
SPEAKER_00Is it simple?
SPEAKER_02Yes, you make a choice, but it's not easy. Yeah, simple, but and we have both had to struggle with this ourselves of getting out of that, you know, one foot in the world, one foot in the church. We we had to it's it's hard. It's it's it's not e an easy thing to do.
SPEAKER_00Right. It takes complete faith to jump off the bridge in the deep end of the river with Christ. Like you have to know that he's there willing to catch you, and he is. If you go into your word and read it, like he is there ready for you, just waiting for you, knocking on the door and waiting for you to open it, and he's ready to receive you with open arms. There's something else I was gonna say, and I don't forgot. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I just, I just have a really and in a way, you know, it talks about the hypocrites in the Bible. Right. And in a way, I feel like that's exactly what people are being whenever they claim to be a Christian, but then they go out and live however they want it. They don't feel like there are any sacrifices, in other words. And the Bible says that we have sacrifices to make. And Jesus sacrificed, he sacrificed it all for us. But we don't want to sacrifice one little thing. We want to have our cake and eat it too. And that's not the way that it works. And I, the reason I want to get this message across to so many people, even if it's just one person, is because I truly believe there are a lot of people out there living this way that think they're going to heaven. Yep. And I'm sorry, but they're not. Right. That's you cannot live a lukewarm life and think God's not going to spit you out. You cannot do it. You have to choose.
SPEAKER_00That's so true. Because even where was it? I wrote it down. Okay, so in James 2, 14 through 26, it's talking all about faith and your works. And if you're just so confused, like, well, I've been striving to do the right things and stuff, but I'm still living in that worldly lifestyle. Well, stop striving to do the things, strive to have a relationship with Jesus Christ.
SPEAKER_02That things will come.
SPEAKER_00Right. And that things will come, those will flow out of you because that's how I live. I think a lot of the lukewarm people are people that have been raised in a Christian home. And, you know, my finger quotes. So, and that's a lot of it is like, well, here's how the world lives, and here is like I like to do all these things and everything, but I'm just gonna bring my Jesus along with me, he'll save me, he'll forgive me, and I'll say sorry, problem solved. No, like that's how I used to live, and I truly believe that he was gonna spit me out. Like looking back on all this, even when I shared when I was a kid and I thought I got saved, like I really don't I did not live my lit life for him at those moments until honestly when I saw a really big change was only three years ago. Yeah. When I really started to dive in and be like, crap, like I've really gotta, I gotta change something. I can't continue to just do all these things that I want and just hope that he comes with me. I you have to take the action in running towards him. He's already done his part in running towards you and dying for you. You have to take the part in running towards him.
SPEAKER_02And I think I think if you're living this way and you don't feel bad about it, you have no like you're not feeling anything, then something's truly wrong. Right. If you're claiming to be a Christian and you can go out and get drunk or gossip about someone, because I'm not saying you won't ever sin or do these things. I'm saying if you can do these things daily and repeatedly and you have no conviction about it, something's wrong. You need to rethink your relationship with Jesus. Yeah. Now, if you're doing these things and you're getting convicted, God's working on you. Right. And you're coming. You're you're coming along. Just keep letting him work because you won't, life doesn't just change overnight when you come to know Jesus. So it's you're you're slowly going to get there, but it's good if you're feeling the conviction because but but give into it. Don't don't fight it. Right. Don't fight it.
SPEAKER_00And you were talking about being a hypocrite earlier, and that's exactly what the Pharisees were doing. They were claiming to know God, but when his very son was here on earth, they persecuted him and had him crucified. And so they were claiming to be these high men of God, yeah, and to really know him and do all the things. Well, they were doing his works, and not only his works and the things that he said, but they were taking his laws and changing them to what they wanted them to be because they were so terrified of breaking the law that they set up all these fence laws to not even get near that. And if you're doing that, that is an exhausting lifestyle. Yes. Do not try to, well, God says I need love, so I just need to love and that will fix everything. And if you're doing all those things by trying to keep the laws, well, the laws are only a guideline for you to show you where you're falling short. Don't strive for laws, strive for Christ. Yeah, strive for what he says about who you are, who he is, the relationship you guys are to have, and the calling he has on your life. Go out into the world, focus on that, and you'll slowly start to see those things flow out of your life. And I know for me, I would say, Oh, I believe in God. But I also know that there is, I should have dove into it beforehand. I studied it before, but I forgot now. But when you look into the different words believe, whenever you say, Oh, I believe in God, but there's certain beliefs in the Bible where it talks about when you when they said I believe in him, it means to completely live your life for him and like completely follow him. Like you would follow a rabbi teacher. So in that time, they would completely walk with him and talk with him and do everything that their rabbi would do and start to conform to their image as we are to do with Christ. He is our rabbi. We are to conform to his image and do exactly as he did. But if you just say, Oh, I believe in him as in a I know him and I've heard of him, but you don't truly know God if you just hear of the things of him and know of who he is. You have to conform to the lifestyle of Jesus Christ by having a relationship with him. It's not religion, it's relationship. Because I used to follow him religiously, and I was exhausted and beat it down and broken and had all these terrible things going on in my life, and I didn't really know who he was. Right. Because even if you have read your Bible, you've probably heard it, but if you haven't, even the demons believe in God. Yeah. Because why would they submit to someone that they don't believe in? Like demons have to obey the word of God. And so they believe in him and know who he is, but they are not willing to conform to his image, they are not willing to lay themselves down and follow him. So where do you stand? Right. I'm not calling you a demon, right? Okay. But I am saying But that's good because they they do know of who he is.
SPEAKER_02Right. But they're not going to sacrifice anything for him. True. They're not willing to give anything up, and we don't want to be like that.
SPEAKER_00Right. And the Bible talks about whenever you're saved, that you are born again. So your old ways are gone. Behold, all things are made brand new in him. And so if all those things are gone, then why does your own like why does your opinion matter on certain things? And I'm not like trying to belittle you, but I'm really saying if you are made new in Christ, if you're proclaiming to be a Christian, you are a completely different person than who you were to be before. That's right. And so you need to continue on that path and be like, for me, I used to identify with certain things before I was a Christian and think, well, if I give those things up in my life, then who am I?
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00And I know a lot of people do that. And praise the Lord that He's brought me out of that. And I know for me, I can speak on behalf of softball, as we all know. And a lot of the girls that I grew up with and everything, like, I don't know if even if you guys are listening, but if you are, like if you struggle with you're at that point in life where your softball career is coming to an end, like you don't get to play softball forever. And you're like, Well, I've known it for let's see, I'm 23, so I've known it for like 20 years. I don't know what else there is. I don't know who I am. And this could be for anything. You could have some sort of job that you love that you've done for so many years, but you don't know who you are outside of that job. Well, Christ says who you are in his word. So go find it. Go find who he is, who what he says about who you are, and that'll fix it all. You'll figure out who you are.
SPEAKER_02And you talking about being born again and you become a completely different person. You know, I think it's awesome. Yes, it's great for us to tell people we're Christians and that we believe in Jesus. But what about when people see such a change in us, they know something had to happen. Yeah, that's good. And I can I can talk about this person because he knows I love him and what, but my husband, I think is just a huge example of that.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_02Um, he what he's an amazing man and he always has been amazing, but he used to be super prideful. Yeah, he liked to party, he liked to fight, he liked to start arguments, and he just wasn't the person that he is now. And then he found Jesus, and I mean, truly found Jesus. And he didn't go down there on the construction sites at work and go, he we run an excavation company and go wherever and say, Hey, I found Jesus today. Now I'm sure he told some people that because he was super excited. But there were so many people that I know that didn't used to care for him much because of his arrogance and his pride that started coming to me and they're like, What is going on with your husband? And I was like, What do you mean? And they're like, he is different. Like, he is, we really, really like him, and he's just different. I'm like, he found Jesus. But without him even telling them, so they they start looking for it. They knew right, they knew something was different. That he was my sister, even told me one time after he changed. She said, Boy, Sonia, not that it ever would, but if something ever happened between you and Charlie, I think I may have to choose him. Because he just became, he truly was born again. It was like that old personality was gone, all that stuff was gone. It was just awesome. I'm not saying it don't try to creep in sometimes that Satan doesn't try to tempt him with, of course, you know, the way that he would, but it he was just such an example to so many because you could see a true change. And it wasn't for a few days, it wasn't for um a few weeks, right? It's been, I can't remember exactly for sure, but I want to say it was about eight years ago that this true change, you know, happened in him. And it's been amazing. And he is not ashamed to tell people about Jesus. And but before that, he was just living this lukewarm lifestyle.
SPEAKER_00I feel like dad growing up was like that stereotypical American man. He goes out, provides for his family, and then just kind of comes home and just does what he wants. And but I love thinking back on memory of whenever he started to change. We call him uh go meet Jesus on the mountain, the man on the mountain, because that's where he had his encounter with the Lord and really started. And when he came back, I had my son at the time, and they were it was shortly after Christmas or a birthday or something because Liam had a lot of presents and everything. And I remember looking down at the end of the hallway, and my dad is in the floor, like laying down in the floor with him, playing with him and all these new toys. And I'm like, what did this?
SPEAKER_02Which he did not, you guys have to understand, he did not do that, used to. Like he went to work that he provided for the family, and then he did what he wanted to do. It wasn't take time to and that that's all in the past. I'm not holding that against him, but yes, so seeing him.
SPEAKER_00There was a dramatic change, like such a drastic change that he was born again, and praise the Lord that he's continuing to walk in that. And like mom said, not just with him, but with all of us, like the the previous things in your life, they'll try to come back. But it's like, why are you trying to attack me? Because that man's dead, so that's not gonna work anymore. And but you have to recognize that you have to be a warrior and being still like standing guard, ready for those things to come, but not expecting those things to come. Just the more that you because if you're always expecting something bad to happen, you're gonna be worried and anxious and all this stuff. It's not what I'm saying. I'm saying you seek the Lord Christ, know that persecution will come, but when you stand with him, nothing will remain.
SPEAKER_02But my my whole point of that story was really the fact that people noticed without even knowing. They're like, something is different in him. Right. And I'm telling y'all, the man couldn't have done it on his own. It's because he've truly found Jesus. So true. And it was just, it was just amazing. And I know many lives that have been changed, just you know, God uses there's people that they're like, if Charlie can change, then surely we, if he can get rid of his pride and his arrogance and his, you know, whatever, we can too. So it's been such an example to other people. But like you talking about leading people astray, if Charlie didn't stick with that, if he if he started telling people he had found Jesus and doing all this, but was still living the same lifestyle he did before, you know, not many people are gonna be like, Oh, yeah, we want some of this Jesus because it really changed him. But but he didn't do that.
SPEAKER_00When he changed, he truly changed, you know. And so it was completely denying himself and willing to have see that faith in God and knowing that he's gonna catch me when I when I give up myself. And the same thing happened with my husband. Several different people came up and said, Chloe, I don't know what you did, but when he met you, something really changed for the better. And I would say, Well, it wasn't me, it was Jesus Christ. He learned like who he is and now he's saved. Yeah, and so that's all it is, and so also that too. Like, don't don't take credit when it's it's God's yes, God's glory.
SPEAKER_02Yep.
SPEAKER_00And so that that's great. And I just want to like encourage everyone, if you're so confused, like you don't know which way to go or anything, just go to him. Yep, and it it's really so simple. It will not be easy, but it is so simple if you're willing to completely give up everything and the conviction conviction, conviction from Holy Spirit will begin to come, like mom said, if you feel it, continue to push into it.
SPEAKER_02Don't feel, don't feel shame and guilt. Don't listen to this podcast and think, well, I can't, I can't be that way. I can't give up this or I can't give up that. And there's still things in my life that I'm struggling with, but I know that I've strived so far and I know I'm feeling conviction and I'm getting there with with with still with giving up, you know, completely everything. But then sometimes new things come along that you're like, oh, I didn't even know I had this problem. Now I've got to deal with that, you know? And so don't don't feel shame and conviction out of this because you're doing something wrong. We're trying to say, get yourself in the word, pray, ask the Lord to help you, to give you strength, to give up whatever it is, or and don't truly go all like, like just go all in, don't go to church. Please. Just just try to go, you know, all in one step at a time. Give up one little thing at a time, but don't keep living both ways.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I've heard different people come to me and say, Well, I can't come to your church, or I I can't live for God because I drink or I cuss or I do this. Okay, that's the whole get there. Right. That's the whole reason Jesus died, is because he wants you to come to him just as you are. It's not your job to fix yourself. You can't fix yourself. Yep.
SPEAKER_02And I will tell you, if you're going to a church and they're judged, or you've been to a church and they judged you because you drank or you smoked or you did drugs, whatever, you whatever you may have done, if they're judging you over that, then you need to find a new church. Right. Because they need to be, they're there to help you and encourage you not to be doing those things anymore. But if they're condemning you and making you feel awful, or even don't welcome you because of it. Or there may be listeners out there, even I know people get judged over what they've wore to church or what they don't let that keep you. That's not Jesus. Right. That's people just wanting to be people.
SPEAKER_00People, I think, I think sometimes people try to fix it themselves. Yes. And they think if I can make you look good, then that makes you look saved.
SPEAKER_02Yep.
SPEAKER_00Without even realizing it. But no, like we're here to help lead you to Christ. He will do the fixing. He will do the cleansing.
SPEAKER_02There we have nothing that And we have to you have to be spoken truth to, right? Like Christians are held liable to speak truth to people on what the truth is. So if someone comes in in and they're saying an alcoholic, we can't tell them, oh, that's okay. Right? Don't enable them. It's not okay. Yeah. We're not condoning, we're not, we're not doing that. But to make you feel like you are being condemned or you're not welcome at a church, that's not right.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, to make if to make them feel like, well, why would you walk in here when you know that you're doing that job? Yes. Like that is not like Jesus, look at the people that he picked to follow him. Look at his disciples. Like he wants to come. There's nothing that I can do to fix you. I can point you to the one who can. I can speak truth to you. I can pray for you, but it's ultimately up to him. And that's what we're trying to do. And we may sound angry, but we're just very passionate. Yeah. Because we don't want to see you spit out of his mouth when you think you're saved. Yes. Because we've been there.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_00And so. Anything else you got? No, I think. Oh, wait, one more thing. On that last topic was, and I talk with my children about this too. You're going to make mistakes. Do not try to be perfect. Try to walk as Christ's walk. But whenever you try to lie, I've screwed up again, so I can't do it. Like that's what Satan's gonna lie to you about. Well, I thought that thought again today. Well, I picked up that drink today. I picked up that cigarette today. Like I'm I have covetousness. Like, well, too bad, so sad. I'm a I'm a lost cause. No, no, no, no. Please continue to strive for the heart of God and He will cleanse you of those and this is something that I myself struggle with sometimes.
SPEAKER_02And Chloe has to remind me of. I will, I will feel like I have messed up or I've done something, you know, and she will have to remind me, mom. It's okay. Yeah. You just need to ask forgiveness, repent, and you know, but but yes, yeah. Don't feel like you've ever screwed up so much that God can't continue seeking him.
SPEAKER_00And like that conviction will continue to draw. If you're still feeling it, push into him and he'll strengthen that for you to turn away one day. And for me personally, it's nothing like drinking or anything, but it's snapping on my kids when I get overwhelmed. So if like you're a mom listening or you watch kids for a living, like whatever it is, if you snap because of overstimulation or stuff, like there's a lot of commotion going on and you lose it, like my thing I do is I escape to my room and I take it to the Lord. But now I'm going to be explaining to them. Kids, we know we live in a fall and simple world and our emotions go haywire sometimes. So I need you kids to know this is what's happening with mommy, and I need to take that time with the Lord and I'm gonna give it to him so that they know when they feel overstimulated or things are happening in their life that they don't know how to handle, they know they can go to their private, secret place and take it to the Lord.
SPEAKER_02Yes. So I think that that about wraps it up for today, and we will see you guys back in a couple of weeks, I guess. And Claude, do you want to close this in prayer?
SPEAKER_00Yep. Lord God, I thank you for this blessed morning that we're able to come together and learn what you have for us, God. I pray every word spoken is received that you have for them, Holy Spirit. Um, as you are convicting them and strengthening them, making them feel worthy as a worthy child of God, as a mighty warrior of God. Lord, speak to them on who they are, Lord. Speak to them on who you are so that they know truly who you are and not of the things of the world. That the desire for you, the hunger for you, the thirst for you is so much stronger than the situation that they're in, that they can jump in faith and see who you are and fall into your arms as you knock at the door. Lord, I thank you as you draw people in these times, that your Holy Spirit outpouring is so strengthened within each individual life, and that people are done with the old ways and they're going to walk in the new, and that you will not be spitting people out that are fully in for you and have completely denied themselves and are picking up their cross and walking just as you walk, Jesus Christ, to strive to see who you are, to strive to walk just as you walk and not feel that shame or that condemnation. And when it tries to come, they know exactly how to get rid of that, Lord, and just strengthen the desire to have a fire lit inside of them. Fan the flames of drawing them to you in Jesus' name.