Running Toward the Fire: Los Angeles County Fire Department Captain Eric Eastlund

In this episode of Finding Your Voice, I sit down with Los Angeles County Fire Department Captain Eric Eastlund, a leader, a servant to his community, and a man who understands what it means to show up in the middle of chaos.

Eric shares what it’s like to live a life of constant response, running toward crisis when others are running away. From his experiences during the Altadena Fires to the everyday realities of being continuously exposed to trauma, he opens up about the emotional weight first responders carry and how they learn to keep going.

Eric speaks candidly about his own recovery journey, the lessons he’s learned about resilience, and how giving back has become a cornerstone of his life, both within the fire department and beyond it. Whether it’s supporting his fellow firefighters, engaging in peer support, or serving his community in meaningful ways, his story is one of purpose, humility, and strength.

Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration

https://www.samhsa.gov/substance-use/recovery

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hello, I'm Jason Carrasco and welcome to Finding Your Voice. I'm a licensed marriage family and child therapist and a lifelong student of human resilience. For years, I've sat with people and some of their hardest moments moments that have challenged their identity, their spirit, and sometimes their will to keep going. One thing I've learned is that human beings can survive the unthinkable. And with support, a person's pain can become great purpose. This podcast is a home for stories about mental health, human rights, and the courage it takes to move through darkness and toward healing. And these episodes you'll hear from survivors, clinicians, and everyday people who are brave enough to speak honestly and bold enough to use their voice. You deserve hope, you deserve healing, and you deserve to be heard. Welcome to Finding Your Voice. Let's get started. And thank you for being here and for taking the time out of your lives to listen to this episode. Today's guest is someone who truly means a lot to me, and I'm grateful to call him a close friend. I've had the privilege of knowing Eric Eastland for many years. And long before the title, long before the uniform, I remember when he first made the decision to become a firefighter. And I got to witness up close the level of determination, discipline, and heart that it took for him to turn that goal into reality. So today Eric serves as a captain within the Los Angeles County Fire Department, leading in some of the most critical moments that people will ever face. But what stands out to me the most isn't just what he does in his career, it's who he is when he's also outside of the uniform. He's a devoted husband, a father of three, and someone who shows up for his family with the same strength and presence that he brings to his work. He also gives back within the department by helping facilitate peer support groups, where he creates space for others to be seen, heard, and supported. And beyond that, Eric is deeply connected to the Native American community, where he participates in ceremony and service, continuing a commitment to healing, community, and something that's greater than himself. So once again, I'm very pleased to introduce you. Eric, how are you doing?

SPEAKER_02 2:32

Good, man. Thank you for having me. I'm excited. I'm glad you're doing this.

SPEAKER_00 2:37

Yeah, very much. Thank you for being here. When I was getting ready to start this podcast, you were one of the people that was definitely on that first top five people that I was hoping to have and I was hoping to be able to talk to because of how much I respect you as a person and how much I respect you as a man, how continuously impressed I've been with how you've grown within your career. So getting a little bit into that, are you willing to talk a little bit about some of the things that most impacted you while you were growing up? Who were you before you decided to make this career a reality for yourself?

SPEAKER_02 3:14

That's a good one because I was completely 100% different than I was growing up. Of course, we all change in now and then. The kid who I was growing up is not like your typical fire kid who, yeah, I want to do this, I want to get into explorers. I just didn't have that in me when I was younger. I was pretty, I was pretty aimless. And growing up in a household, I had a brother and sister older than me, a youngest of three. Mother and father were both nurses. And that was kind of my early example into service for others. But we were latchkey kids, man. They they worked their 12-hour shifts and we were pretty much off to the races on our own to do kind of whatever we wanted. With no cameras and no recording devices around, felt really kind of alien. Not myself, not connected to really anything. I found a group of misfits that I did feel connected with. Unfortunately, it led me down a long road of drug and alcohol abuse. And I stayed there for a long time. Luckily, I was able to get out of that with not too many scars and not too much baggage, although we all carry a lot of baggage. 21 years later, still going strong. Yeah, I was thinking back like when we met probably about 21 years ago doing our thing and just the changes we both have had in our growth and in our life and wife and households and all this stuff, dude. It's it's just crazy.

SPEAKER_00 4:43

Yeah, and thank you so much for being willing to share that for your transparency, for your vulnerability, and what a great example that is to people, you know what I mean, that are getting a later start in their career or may have a passion, something they're thinking about, something that they want to do, and maybe think, well, I'm I'm a step behind. I'm a little behind everybody else. And it kind of puts those doubts where you were able to, as you, as you grew older, like you said, as you got in recovery, you were able to decide that you wanted to do this and rush it, go towards it.

SPEAKER_02 5:21

Yeah, that was uh kind of the thing when I after I sobered up, I kind of like, what the hell am I gonna do with my life? I was in, I was always in school and I always had a job. So I was always like, I'm fine, but I was pretty dead inside morally and spiritually bankrupt. And once I did sober up and realizing I spent probably eight, nine years getting a bachelor's degree just like lollygagging through college, I was like, okay, let's get this done. Got it done, started working construction, and then I got on the ambulance. And by the time I got hired with LA County, I was already 36 years old. I was definitely, I think I was top four or five of the oldest guys in the in the recruit class of 48. They're all like mid-20s. So when you're starting something a little older, you do have to work a little harder to keep up. So I amazed myself and being able to do that. Getting with LA County is one of the biggest, best departments in the country. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:17

You and I, we've had similar paths because I was fortunate the way I met you was through recovery. I was really happy to meet you and to be able to start walking with you in that way. And then we both have similar paths where we we decided later in life what we knew we wanted to do in our career because it was the same with me becoming a therapist. It's really cool how our paths kind of went along the same trajectory in a sense.

SPEAKER_02 6:41

And a lot of that I attribute to you and our our core group of friends who we do the Native American stuff with and the guys in the rooms that kind of showing me, like, hey, you you could get deep down, keep digging until you hit that bottom and you could claw your way out. Yeah. I went pretty deep down. There's always more. That's why I tell guys, you could keep digging, you're gonna end up somewhere, and it might not be good, and you might not be able to make it out. But if you make that decision to change your life and put in the work, then anything's possible.

SPEAKER_00 7:14

You're bringing up kind of a good question in the sense that I was gonna ask. I know that as a firefighter, as a captain, you also help serve within the department, I believe with other people that are in recovery or people that are wanting to get into recovery, people that are maybe asking for help with peer support groups. Are you willing to talk a little bit about that and and what that looks like for you?

SPEAKER_02 7:38

Absolutely. We've had a peer support program for a long time in LA County Fire. When I got on almost 15 years ago, it was still a pretty small thing to where you had bad calls. You just stuff it down, take care of it, and you go. And I always remember one of the first calls I went on, and mind you, I had been on the ambulance for about four years prior to, so I already had some witnessed some trauma coming in there, running the 911 calls and everything. But we had a really bad rounding uh of a child and got back to the station, the chief took us out of service, sat us down, and they had peer support come in. And at this time, it was probably like five, six guys who actually took care of the whole department. Department's huge. We got 3,000 plus employees. So we sat down and we talked, and it I really connected with it because of the rooms. Because I've had at that time, I was probably five, six years sober already, and just how much I appreciated that somebody coming in, checking in on us and seeing how it was. But like I said, it was it was years before we got to the program where the program is today. I joined about, I want to say eight years ago. You do some just kind of debriefing classes, some International Association of Firefighters classes that kind of just teach you those techniques of active listening. We're by no means a therapist, but just like the rooms, it's one firefighter talking to another. Because we know we know what we go through day to day. We know what we go through through the station, through calls, through fires at home, and everything. It was really big about three years in when I was on the peer support team. It's what, like five years ago, suicide was taking over the number one killer of firemen and policing. This is absolutely where I need to be. We got to make that change. We got to do something. Culture shift now is night and day. We we've pushed it a lot more, not pushed it down people's throats, just like no in the rooms. You can't make somebody get sober. They got to want to do it on their own. And you just plant that seed. That's all I tell my I'm right now. I'm a team lead for the A shift, and I have been for two years, which basically something goes down, bad call, somebody's injured, somebody's killed. They call me and then I set up the debrief, or I set up who's gonna go check on these guys. And I always tell my guys, you're gonna, you might get pushback, you might get guys who don't want to talk to you, but it plants that seed in their brain, like, oh wait, didn't that guy come out after that really bad call that one time? And I'm struggling with whatever X, Y, and Z at home or kids or wife or whatnot. Maybe I should give them a call. And it it works, it absolutely works. And it's been such a blessing to be a part of this program because being a captain now, that's why I tell my guys, and that's what my captain has told me. Pick something that you could give back to the department, whether it's fire behavior or you go urban search and rescue or hazmatters and just excel at it. Because being a fireman, we call us jack of all trades and and master of none, which is really you just got to have a big toolbox. But you could take one of those tools and sharpen them and give back, and especially being able to give back to the firefighters to my brothers and sisters on a job has been huge.

SPEAKER_00 11:04

Yeah, that's absolutely amazing. And even though you you said there's you know not clinicians or or therapists that are running these groups, that it's all peer-led, at the same time, that's that's just the power of community helping one another because you are a community of peers that are all doing this work together, that are experiencing these crises, that are experiencing these things that are very intense. You're seeing a lot of trauma, you're experiencing a lot of trauma. So to be able to be there, support one another, hear one another, and try to promote healthy coping skills, as opposed to when one of the last episodes, I was talking to a detective from LAPD that was talking about the alcohol and and the pills and and everything to cope with that trauma.

SPEAKER_02 11:53

So firemen do firemen do the same thing. Yeah, I'm very glad I was sober getting into this career because I see it a lot. You see, I mean, it's just like everybody else, stuff does not discriminate, doesn't matter what kind of job you have. Being there, being a sounding board, having guys reach out when they when I know they're hurting and say, hey, I got a problem. We're lucky enough we have, like I said, we have over 200 peers on the peer support team. I probably have 30, 30 on my shift, and there's always somebody hopefully available to go if it's an immediate need. But then we also have four clinicians that know our job that are culturally competent. They go through training, they go through training with fire and police because we do have a different set of stressors that we go through than the general public, where people see three or four traumatic events in their lifetime where we might do that before lunch and then we'll go and eat, and then we'll go to the next one kind of thing. So we have a huge amount of resources that if I can't help this guy just by talking to him, hey, why don't you talk to one of our clinicians? And they're awesome. They are they are so good at at taking care of us and getting they're that bridge between us and the insurance and then getting the person where they need to go, whether it's during the fall or yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:16

So then if it's determined that they need more long-term treatment, if it'll benefit them to see a therapist, it sounds like you make those make those connections for them, or those clinicians help make those connections for them to get linked and to be able to get consistent services, which is which is excellent.

SPEAKER_02 13:35

Yeah, we're we're more that just kind of frontline with each other. That hey, that front connection, that face, this guy, I know this guy. I mean, I've worked around the county, a bunch of different places, and just let everybody know here and there. I have a comfort dog too, so that's always a great icebreaker. I've had her for almost four years now. And she, I mean, having dogs in the station and brought to these debriefs where you'll get a bunch of alpha males in a room. You get 10, 15 alpha males in a room. Do you think anybody's gonna go, hey, I'm hurting right now? But you bring the dog in and it's night and day. People are more willing, more open. And I think again, like that culture shift from my generation on is starting to realize that we can't keep carrying on this way. We need to do something to be healthy and have that balance in our lives.

SPEAKER_00 14:27

Yeah, so happy to hear that. So, one thing I'm thinking about is transitioning a little bit, because I've something I'm really curious. People look at you as heroes, firefighters. I'm I'm curious in terms of you growing up, who modeled courage and sacrifice for you, if anybody? Who who would you identify as doing that?

SPEAKER_02 14:51

I would definitely say my parents. I was very lucky to have two very loving parents. I mean, they all had nobody's perfect, they all had their struggles and and issues. The kind of people they were, you just knew that they were they were loving and caring and opened their arms when we had friends who were struggling and needed a place to live. We were we were that house that uh my parents would take them in. And just my dad worked in the ER for 37 years. He was a Navy medic back in Vietnam. He's always been that person to be on the front line to take care of people. And my mom being a nurse, too. She did floor work and then she transitioned into kind of end-of-life care that a hospice towards the end of her career. They were always compassionate and loving people. And I think they instilled that in me, even though I didn't see it maybe as a younger kid or a teenager or anything like that growing up. I think they were my first examples of service, of being being part of something bigger than myself. And especially when they passed away, like when my mom passed away and we had the funeral for her, seeing how many people showed up to her funeral. It was it was amazing. Same thing with my dad when when he passed away. Luckily, he was around long enough to see me get on and and have this dream come true. It's just very lucky to have that example that I had from them.

SPEAKER_00 16:19

Yeah, yeah. Thank you for sharing that. And and your parents were amazing. I I had the opportunity to meet your mom. The opportunity to meet your mom, and then of course, your dad, I would see him because he would attend the the ceremonies. He would attend bear dance ceremonies, and he was he was a very, very sincere and genuine man. He was just really, really amazing. They made an impact for sure. What's something about this job that the public doesn't fully understand?

SPEAKER_02 16:48

I think it's the sacrifice. I think even a lot of people get on the department and not realizing how much of a sacrifice this is. And I'm not just talking being willing to run into a burning building, not willing to give your life for another person you don't even know. It's the sacrifice for that your families make too. The sacrifice you're gonna make with your mental health, your physical health. We retire earlier than everybody else. So everybody goes, Oh, you retire at 55, that's still good. Yeah, usually our our retirements are cut short, and we tend to live about 10 years shorter than everybody else, just because from the exposures. And missing holidays, missing events, planning birthdays and everything. It's a, you know, my wife's a nurse too, so Jen, it's a constant juggle of like, okay, who's gonna be there to get the kids for this? What day can we do this birthday party on? It is definitely not only stressful on the job running calls, but it's stressful at home and with your relationships. And I'd say that sacrifice is the biggest part that people who are interested in coming on this job need to understand. Because we're like I said, we're a huge organization and people get on, and and I don't think they fully grasp that sacrifice that you have to make with your family.

SPEAKER_00 18:10

I think it's great that you're sharing that for people who may be listening that are are maybe younger or thinking about doing this. That that's those are a lot of things to take into account and a lot of things to think about before pursuing this profession. Because, like some other professions, people may look at firefighters and the work they do and oh, this is this is cool. Like, this is a great job.

SPEAKER_02 18:33

Like I'm gonna hang out with your buds all day and eat food and goof off and go work out at the gym and go shopping. And I'm like, all that's included, man. We have we try to have the best. I always to my crew, always try to have the best time possible at work because you never know when it's gonna be a crappy call, or you never know they're gonna, you're gonna get dressed to go home in the morning, they're gonna say, Hey, you need to stay because we need a body. And that's the worst, getting that call right before you walk out the doors. Well, I'm not coming home, honey. I'll see you in another 24, and then maybe hopefully, or that might turn into a 72. You know, it might be an in-between day off. And just like with ceremony too, always looking forward to those things and trying to, you know, you always ask me, Hey, let's do sweat on Friday. And it's like, sorry, man, I can't. I got I gotta work and nobody's available to get out, and it's about sacrifice, it's very frustrating sometimes. It's a definite blessing, this job, and what I can do. And if I do get those days off, and the stretch of days I could get off, and the things I could show up for, and the time I could spend with the kids is is amazing sometimes.

SPEAKER_00 19:35

I'm gonna ask the question if you knew then what you know now about this job, time, sacrifice, all the things that you've talked about, would you still have pursued it?

SPEAKER_02 19:49

Yeah, absolutely. Like I said, I feel very blessed, especially where I came from and getting on later and getting to do what I do has opened up so many doors, so many avenues. I mean, it's amazing. Yes, I do get a retirement, I hopefully get a retire in about six years, and I could have a whole nother career after that, depending on how I take care of myself. Guys do hang on. I've learned early on that guys do hang on to this job way too long. They'll stay till they're 60, they'll stay on just to try to get a couple extra bucks in retirement, and it's really not worth it because those guys will go to 60, they'll have a two-year retirement and then they're gone. So I'm glad I'm learning these things early. Really, full full years of service is 25 years, and I'm gonna give 20. And I'm saying that's it because you know what? My kids, my wife, being around for those things and having a long retirement is what we all kind of shoot for.

SPEAKER_00 20:49

And I'm glad you already know yourself kind of what your limit is gonna be and and where you're gonna set your boundary in terms of what's gonna be the emotional toll that you can kind of carry and and where that should end at for you to be able to have a good retirement because you're gonna deserve that. 100% you're gonna deserve that. So we talked a little bit about the the peer support groups, and you were we were kind of touching upon this a little bit. For you in particular, what is the emotional cost of repeatedly walking into crisis and to walk into all these calls? Like you said, you could have days where you just have multiple calls and see a lot of trauma, see a lot of different things.

SPEAKER_02 21:31

Yeah, it's huge if you don't handle it. I'm very blessed that I have the knowledge of the rooms and not to take care of my own crap when when I'm wrong, but knowing when these things come up, because I could be a call at somebody's house at six in the morning, it was loved one just died, and we're trying to bring him back to life, and it doesn't work out, and the family's all sad, and people are screaming and crying. I get off duty, and then it's happened before where hey, I'm going to volunteer at the kids' school. So now In a classroom full of kids, and my kids there, and they're all happy and cheered. And it's like you really got to compartmentalize and make that mental shift. And it's very tough to do sometimes. That's another thing that people getting on the job or the general public doesn't really understand is we could come from that. We could come from a Farry car crash that just killed three people, and then I'm going to my kids' school and picking my kids up to drop them off.

SPEAKER_01 22:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:24

I always try to take that time if I have it, if it's been a bad shift. When I get home to take either or I'm leaving to take like a few minutes in the car just to breathe, you know, just to center myself, balance myself. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes I'll pray. Sometimes I got to do a little more work. The physical self self-care always helps getting a good workout in. We got a lot of good dudes on the job now who are realizing that mental, physical, spiritual connection that we all need. We have some guys who are at very busy stations. The one captain at 33s in Lancaster's busiest station in probably the nation are right up there, top, top 10. And he has this whole protocol that he goes through when he has a bad night and he has to show up for family of breathing and cold baths and getting something physical in and don't eat sugar before noon. And I've kind of adopted that and and do those little things to get my mind straight, get my body straight so I can show up because sometimes I don't have a choice. So like, hey, I need to go take a nap. And I tap out when I need to, let the wife know, or luckily the kids are older now to send them off to school. But you got to really listen to your body. And if I need to sleep, I need some rest, I need a couple hours, I need to pray, I need to go get a workout in, you really got to listen to that.

SPEAKER_00 23:47

Great that you listen to your body and that you also have your own toolbox of coping skills, of things that you do with breathing exercises. It sounds like you even kind of bring in, I don't know if you know it or not, but you're bringing in kind of some mindfulness techniques.

SPEAKER_01 24:01

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:02

You use your spirituality as well too. The physical, yes, trauma, as we know, lives in the body. So you're moving that energy by doing the physical exercise. Really happy to hear that you're doing excellent work with self-care.

SPEAKER_02 24:16

And I'm I'm by no means a guru in this. I do sit in it sometimes. I do carry it. Luckily, I realize it and I check in with a therapist when I need. I have a therapist. She's great. She's great at setting me straight and telling me to get my head out of my ass. You know, look at things. You sometimes you need that different perspective. And like Jen, so grateful for her because she understands the job because her being an ER nurse and I could come home and talk to her and say, hey, this we had a bad call with this kid. I'm lucky I have that sounding board, but I don't really share everything. Sometimes stuff's too heavy. A lot of guys don't have that. They'll have wives that stay at home or hold another career that they don't really understand those type of things that we carry.

SPEAKER_00 25:02

So I'm going to get into some statistics here. And then after I'm going to get into a new line of questioning with the arc. In January 2025, Los Angeles County experienced one of the most devastating wild events in history, impacting the communities of Altadena and Pacific Palisades. Together, these fires burned nearly 40,000 acres, and they were fueled by powerful Santa Ana winds and dry conditions that allowed flames to spread rapidly. More than 16,000 homes and structures were destroyed, with entire neighborhoods wiped out in a matter of days. In Altadena, specifically the Eaton Fire, over 9,000 structures were destroyed, making it one of the most destructive fires in California history. In Pacific Palisades, with the Palisades fire, more than 6,800 structures were destroyed. And there 23,000 acres burned. So across the region, over 200,000 people were forced to evacuate, and thousands of families were displaced during this time. Just a couple things on the financial impact because that is staggering as well. Total wildfire losses are estimated between $28 billion and $54 billion, making this one of the costliest wildfire disasters in U.S. history. So, but beyond these, you know, numbers and statistics, this fire not just homes, but there were generations of memories, cultural identities, and entire communities, including long-standing neighborhoods and Altadena, which has so much history that was completely wiped away. So for those that may not be as familiar with these fires, can you walk us through what happened with these Altadena fires?

SPEAKER_02 27:02

I could give you my perspective and and listening to the statistics, it's staggering because I don't think I really I never really dove deep into any of that, just being on the ground. And when you said 40,000 acres, it kind of blew my mind because I've been on huge fires, campaign fires, 200, 300, 500,000 acres, like up north, and it we go, we're part of a strike team for California to where we'll go to these huge fires. So 40,000 seems like really small, but then you get into the houses and the impact and the structures that were lost was that's just huge because up north you got a lot of little communities here and there, houses here and there spread out. You'll get structure loss, but nothing like we had. And this was definitely a generational fire. I was working in Dwarde that day. We knew the wind was coming. There's uh that's one of those things. There's nothing you could do about it. All you could do is pre-deploy, be prepared. We had teams in place, we had extra staffing in place, and we saw the palisades go out, and we're like, oh man, that's a big one. And see it start burning homes and run through there and just keeping an eye on that. But I mean, we were running that day. We were running on wires down and trees down, and evening came, we lost power at the station. So this station is called a card file. And what we do is we do staffing for the entire battalion. So when these events come up and we have to do extra staffing, we're calling people, we're telling, hey, you got to work tomorrow. Hey, you got to work two days later, hey, we're putting you on. So we started filling spots like three or four days out because we knew this was kind of just with the wind itself, is going to be ongoing red flag alerts that determines our staffing through the state of California and funds us through that. Juggling that on top of running calls, then we lose power, and then evening came and we were on the initial response all the way in Dwardy to Altadena to that fire because we were already spread thin. Palisades was uh was based in LA City, but we all have mutual agreements, and if people if neighboring agencies need help, we go. Let the all the higher-ups and everything worry about the cost and who's gonna pay this and that. That was a huge fire. They're already having huge losses. So we sent a bunch of teams over there, which spreads us thin. We kept our own staff and we had enough resources, but I don't think any amount of resources would have stopped anything that happened. And my chief seeing him on the news a couple days later, is like you could you could put probably three engines on every street and have all the water you want. There would have been no stopping that. We got on the initial dispatch and they actually canceled us. And so we ended up running from Dwardy to Altadena, from Dwardy to Rosemead, because we're starting to get so spread thin that it was probably one of the first times our 911 dispatch center had to triage like what's coming in. And after a while, I kept telling them stop giving me wires down because there's nothing really we could do about wires down or trees down. Yeah, there's a life safety risk there, but if there's an EMS, if somebody's having a heart attack right now, I'm not gonna go to this wires down, I'm gonna go to that kind of thing. Yeah, so and that was a lot on our dispatchers too, because they were trying to figure out what to prioritize, what to send us on. We got dragged in probably about seven o'clock at night. We got a structure fire just outside of the actual fire area. And on structure fires, what we get is usually four engines, squad, ladder truck, and a battalion chief. I'm on the way there, and we're we're driving from Dwarty to this house fire in Altadena, so that's a long distance. Usually our our response time is eight minutes or under, but that's how spread thin we were. Our engine and a truck. No chief, no nothing.

SPEAKER_01 30:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:00

And I'm asking LA, I'm like, is this all we have? And like, yep, that's all you got. So I gotta make do. And mind you, this was I'm about four to five weeks out of the Captain's Academy. I've been on, I've been around, I've been doing doing my part to learn these things and learn this role to be thrust into something like that about four or five weeks out of the captain's academy. It was a little jarring.

SPEAKER_00 31:23

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 31:24

So we get to that one. Lucky we made a stop. It was the garage. We put that out, and it was right up lake, right to the end of lake there, which I knew the area. I grew up in that area. We went, we'd always go up to the haunted forest. When I was in college, I used to do art shows at this place called the End of the World Art Gallery, right there, Mariposa and Lake. I was really, I wasn't glad that was happening, but I'm glad I knew the area because a lot of times we'll go up north and we have no idea what road leads where. And my engineer, who used to be my old squad partner, which was really kind of cool because we had a good connection. We know we know each other, we know our little quirks and nuances. He had no clue of where to go. So it was good to be able, like, okay, make a right here and go down the street, and we'll make a left. We'll get out of it. When we made that stop, we made up a strike team. Uh, battalion chief showed up, and a strike team is consisted of five engines and a chief. And we were more of a reg tag task force because we had four engines and a ladder truck, and that's the big long trucks with the driver in the back. You know, Pasadena area, the streets are tight. It could be it could be kind of tough to drive through just in the engine itself, but throw a truck in that that was really tough for us too. Because we got in an area. This was before it started really making its push down through the community. We're up on the very northern part of lake, and we're trying to make a stop between these two houses. And I'm just looking the street to my right, I could see the whole street's on fire. Wow. And I have a house right on the corner that's still standing, and then we had two houses where behind that was totally on fire. So we're lobbing water over it, trying to do what we can to keep it at bay. I just told myself, if this big tree in the front of this house catches, we're gone. We got to get out of here. And I kind of relayed that to the chief and he agreed. So we did what we can. I think we were there. Felt like forever, but it was really probably 20, 30 minutes. And it's like we have to move because this the the wind's picking up, it's starting to really push back down on us, and we really gotta get this truck out facing the right way. Because if we're behind him and he gets pinned, we're all stuck. Yeah. So scary. Yeah, it was it was definite pucker moments here and there. Luckily, we had a good chief, and we kind of he kind of gave us an area that, okay, let's try to make a difference here. He's like giving out assignments, go down the street, you go down the street, then basically see what you could do. And our shift in in our culture also tactically, is the department really leans on the captains to now take initiative and do what they think is right. I might get an assignment, hey, go down the street over there and put that house out. But if I'm going down there and I see something I could make a difference that might make a stop, I might stop there and and do something. And I think since getting on and seeing that culture shift and more reliance on the captains to actually do their job and take initiative to do those things was great. So it's kind of like directionless direction.

SPEAKER_01 34:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:34

He was saying, Oh, go down this street and see what you could do. And I'm like, Chief, those whole streets on fire. And it's like, okay, bump down another street. And this it's like, uh, and we'd get down streets and you can't see anything. You it's smoke and fire everywhere, wind pushing everywhere. We get to the end of the street, there's a tree down in the road. We might have to back all the way out of it, which is really a bad situation. You don't want to back up in smoke because you never know. There might be another engine coming up. There might be police were everywhere, too. It really turned into a rescue situation. Okay, let's start knocking on doors. Because we, for a while there, we were getting in position, trying to make stops, getting in position, trying to make stops. And it's like, okay, let's just start beating on doors and making sure there's nobody here. Because we did have a couple reports. The PD was through the whole area, and they were bringing us reports hey, there's a person in this house. So one engine would break off and they'd go, and they'd either make sure there's nobody there or they'd rescue them and bring them back down, kind of thing. And it was really just demoralizing because it felt like we were doing absolutely nothing. I just remembered being on one street and feeling like I'm standing sideways because I'm leaning into the wind so bad, trying to put I'm on one side of the engine, my engineer's in the engine, and I got my fireman on the other side, and we're pumping and rolling what we call. We have just two light lines out, trying to put yards out before it catches a house. Get one, move, bump down, get another, bump down, get another, and then look back and it's back on fire. Yeah. So there was really absolutely nothing we were doing that night. It didn't really turn until probably about eight or nine the next morning. We'd already been working 12 hours and with little to no breaks. I think the only break we had was when we went, we had to go refuel because we're just running so much. And it was like, go get fuel, come immediately back, kind of thing. About eight or nine in the morning, the light's coming up, the wind's dying down a little. It's like, okay, got to a certain geographic area, and it's like, okay, now let's try to make stops. Pick the corner. Okay, this house is on fire, this house isn't. The one behind it, the whole street behind it's on fire. We could actually probably save this house and stop it from just that's all it did. It caught one house, it caught the next house, cut the next house, cut the next house. But the amount of resources we had, there was very little we could do. When we started feeling like we're actually gaining momentum, we made made a stop at one house, and we really didn't know until the day, day and a half later, when we actually got a break and got to come back and see everything. After that, we're just patrolling and picking the area and okay, let's try to make a stop here, let's try to make a stop here. And then the water went out because no water system is designed for that. I know a lot of people there's a lot of talk about that. And you know, I'm not an engineer, I'm not any kind of guru or that, but I'd probably say those people who install that water system didn't think, hey, how many gallons or how long can this thing keep up when the whole neighborhood's on fire? Nobody nobody really thinks that. Of course, they have a certain equation and formulas. They think, okay, I have this many houses, how much gallonage do I need? But when you got tons and tons of engines in the area, all just sucking off the system. We were trying to make a stop at a bungalow-style apartments, and my firefighter stretched line, he started flowing, and then he radios back, what's wrong with the water? And I go to my engineer and he's like, Yeah, this hydrant's dead. So go down the street, next hydrant's dead. We finally found one, and it was probably about a fifth, about a 15 to 20 minute turnaround to go from the area we were in to go fill up. And mind you, everybody's trying to get over there and fill up off the we're just kind of spreading out. Everybody had to go probably 20, 30 minutes away. We did have water tenders that could fill fill us up, but now that makes them go even further to fill up their tanks. They could maybe fill up four or five engines, depending on the size of the water tender. But it's even okay, now we got to take a 15, 20 minute break, which is good for us because physically we were done.

SPEAKER_01 38:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:53

Like physically, mentally, we were done. And then light coming up, just making sure people, making sure people are getting evacuated because we still don't know. The winds are dying down, but it could come back. The prediction was it's gonna make another push. Being where I was and looking to the south of me and kind of knowing where the fire started and knowing the area and looking south of me and seeing things on fire down south of me, I was like, man, this thing pushed deep, deep into Altadena. It was just it, it really, I really we went home. It was about two o'clock, and our reliefs were coming. And Chief said, you know, go to Rose Bowl, that where that's where base was. Go to Rose Bowl, try to find some food, and then we'll we'll get you back out here. I hear reliefs coming, but I don't know when they'll be here. And physically I couldn't stop shaking. Like my my body was so spent, I was just soaked, I was wet, been breathing this crap all night. My body could not stop shaking. We had we had MREs and snacks on the on the engine. There's only so much fuel you could put in you to keep up with being awake. I want to say we probably worked 18 hours straight before we got that break. And then being able to go and go bed down at home was huge. Yeah. Because it was like we got off the line, we dropped off the engine. I told my guys, be safe going home because we're all we're all just spent.

SPEAKER_01 40:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:24

And as soon as I hit the couch and Jen fed me a meal, I was out.

SPEAKER_00 40:29

Oh, I bet.

SPEAKER_02 40:30

And it was get up the next morning and go back to it. And that's when we really got to see the destruction, was the second morning after is just seeing how far it blew down. We started driving through the areas where we tried to make stops, and just seeing that first initial house that we had that had caught fire, we made a stop. The tree fell on it, fell on top of the house. But I think the tree saved it because all the other houses burned on that block. All the other houses. So it's like, well, we saved one thing and then get to another area where we were to try to make a stop. And the homeowner was there, and he was so grateful. He got me, man. That's like he was he was like, it's still dusty out here. My eyes are all watery. I'm so grateful. And we felt so bad though. We felt so bad because it was really nothing we could control. And that's the firemen have a very big control issues. Yeah. We we want to do good at our jobs and make stops and do these things, but there's only so much you could do. And that was and I was not a part of the Palisade, so I can't really speak to that. But it was a lot of the same of the guys I talked to is just feeling super helpless because everybody's looking to us to to put this out, but feeling so helpless that, like I said, no amount of resources would have made a difference.

SPEAKER_00 42:02

Yeah, and it makes sense that like you described, your your body was shaking. I mean, because your your nervous system from all of that is jacked from everything that's going on. So, one the devastation of this fire, the chaos. Not only is this one of the most devastating fires, but you're acclimating to a brand new position. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:23

As as being captain at that was the biggest part is I just remember Chief gave us an order, we went down the street to try to do something, and my my engineer, my fireman turned to me and was like, Okay, what do you want to do? And that's when it like really hit me because I was just kind of flying by the seat of my pants there for a while, and and trying to organize thoughts and what do we need to do first, thing flying through your head. But when he asked me that, that's when the weight of it really hit me. Is like, these, and that's what they kind of tell you in the academy, these guys are your responsibility. You feed them, you pay them, you get them home safe the next day, right? That's that's the biggest thing I was I was amazed at is nobody got seriously hurt on the department fighting that fire. Because I I was while we're in the middle of it, that's all I could think of is like we are losing lives tonight. I mean, yeah, that's how bad it was. We got in some pretty bad spots, and and you know, you just do what you can to keep moving forward.

SPEAKER_00 43:21

Yeah, well, I just absolutely want to thank you for your service. Thank all of the other firefighters for their service, for their commitment, for their dedication, for their willingness to face something with so much adversity and something so challenging. But we can't give enough just praise or gratitude for for the work that was done. I know that you said there was a lot of feelings of hopelessness because you felt like couldn't you couldn't do anything. In reality, I'm sure that there were a lot of things that you were doing. You were able to knock on those doors, you were able to try to see if there was anybody there, you were letting your presence be known. Which that in itself sometimes can give people something, some, some kind of hope that maybe something's gonna get better or that everything's gonna be okay. I think you really gave a lot of people who were outside of it just a glimpse of your your courage and the courage that that all of you have that we know, wow, these people, they're really willing to go into whatever they need to go into to try to to try to be of service and to try to help.

SPEAKER_02 44:28

Yeah, I I always kind of liking it. Like I don't know if it's courage or stupidity or or something that's in us that makes us want to run into burning buildings and put ourselves in in really bad spots sometimes. And that whole hero thing, it always kind of bothers me because we really didn't feel like heroes some of the time. I know we made stops and we made a huge difference, and but that whole hero thing, it it gets a little weird for me hearing that and being told that it's like, well, I wish it's it's one of those things, like a lot of us we wish we could have done more, you know.

SPEAKER_00 45:03

Yeah. One one more question in terms of with with relationship to the fires, what did you what did you witness in the in the people affected by those fires? Some of the people that you came in contact with or you spoke with, what did you what did you witness in them? What did you see?

SPEAKER_02 45:20

Just just overall, the whole community coming together was amazing. You know, you see all the benefits and driving around the days after. All the I mean, there was food trucks and people bringing so much food by the station and trying to take care of us to where we were at the point of like, do not bring any more food, do not bring any more supplies here. We have more than enough. We're taking care of. We need to get this to the people. Just seeing parking lots full of like people donating clothes and and the community come by, get your basics. I mean, you think about it, your whole house goes, yeah, there's memories, there's TVs and and like me, surfboards and stuff like that. Those are that's all my stuff. I miss it, but you got to think about your necessities. You got your clothes, you got your toothbrush, you got your deodorant, you got your soap, you got your towels, that that you don't really grasp until everything's probably gone. It's like, what am I gonna do now? kind of thing. And seeing that, seeing the community come together, seeing all the support, seeing just the devastation and the shell shock in some people was really tough to see, too. And then even while we were in it, like that next morning, people hanging around and trying to help us. And at first, I was like, you need to get out of here. What are you doing here? And it's like, you know what? I'll keep an eye on him. I'm gonna keep this guy safe because there was a guy who's just trying to squirt a hose on the house next to him to keep it from catching his house on fire. And if he's not gonna leave, I probably would have done the same thing. I probably would have stayed and done what I can. And like, well, if he's not gonna leave, I'm gonna make sure I take care of him. It's that whole and just even the time after it, that whole sense of community. And that's what we do in disasters, right? We come together and take care of each other.

SPEAKER_00 47:04

Yeah.

unknown 47:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:05

If there's one good thing that comes out of disasters, it is it is that seeing the people come together, seeing the unity that that can happen and the fight that we all have for each other, I think. So we're we have about, let's see, four more questions to go. What has this job taught you about who you really are?

SPEAKER_02 47:24

I think it's just the I still pinch myself when I go to work and get into the job I get to do. I still I think just growing up and always having that self-doubt in in my head and like, am I doing the right thing? And that's always still kind of there, but knowing I could push past that, knowing I could achieve great things. I mean, like you said, you see me, I was working Tower Records when I met you, trying to get on the ambulance, and I got on the ambulance and having that dream, hey, I need to try the I need to try to get a career here, and doing all those steps, putting in the work that if I was 10 years younger, I would have never tried. Or I would have tried once and I failed, and I would have been like, yeah, whatever. Because it did take me seven, almost seven, eight years to get on the department. So, like when I really started getting serious about it, about seven years. And then once I got on, it's just moving up the ranks and going through, promoting, getting my medic license and going through that and then promoting within the organization to engineer and doing that for five years and then going to captain. From engineer, I had to take the probably we have a practical hands-on test. I had to take that twice, man. I failed the first time. The captain's test I had to take three times. You never feel ready because there's so much to learn about this job. And it's still, like I said, I still pinch myself that I get to go work and with these great guys and and girls and get to do what I get to do.

SPEAKER_00 48:59

Yeah. And I just want to say, again, from what I remember seeing of you, is you really also too went after it, man, in terms of this profession and this job. Once you made this decision, you made sure to make all the connections that you needed to make. You made sure to introduce yourself to the people that would be able to mentor you, to be able to help you. I saw you really, really take a lot of healthy risks to be able to reach to reach your goal.

SPEAKER_02 49:29

Yeah, and I don't know if it was fate, right place, right time, the work I put in. It all has a say in that how that goes. And it's those opportunities that a lot of times we either see them or we don't, or we let them go by, or we have that self-doubt that no, I can't do that. And you're not gonna know unless you try. No, you're not gonna know unless you fail. And that's why I try to tell my kids is like you're gonna fail at this life. You're gonna fail at a lot of things before you succeed. That's the thing that teaches us the most, right? So if I just had everything handed to me, I'm not learning anything. If I fail at it and I keep trying and I learn and I progress and I get better at it, then I'm gonna be a lot better, well-rounded person in whatever job I do.

SPEAKER_00 50:12

Yeah, I agree wholeheartedly. Question about the brotherhood and team connection. Talk a little bit about that, if you're willing to. I know that's a huge part, right?

SPEAKER_02 50:24

Yeah, that's a that's a big question for you all.

SPEAKER_00 50:27

Like just, you know, kind of describe what it's like, what it gives you. The PG 13 version.

SPEAKER_02 50:34

PG 13, yeah. I mean, we have a lot of dark humor. We get through a lot of stuff. Like I said, with the peer support being more and more guys being more and more open to talk and helping each other out like that, whether it is this guy's going through a divorce and or this guy's having some drug and alcohol issues, or got a kid at home that's giving him a problem. Part of peer support and part of me being on that team lead portion is I get you somebody connected who's going through that same exact thing and helping each other. And we have our kitchen table, that's what we call it at the station. And that's where we do, we celebrate, we solve the world's problems, we grieve, we do it all there. That's where we check in with each other. That's where it the that's what usually our morning is set. We go and we check everything out, we make sure the equipment's good. I go in the office, do my thing, and then we all sit at the table and talk about how the day's going and what's going on, man. What's going on in life? Whether it's my kid has a baseball game and I want to try to go keep up with it, or you know, whatever. Hey, my daughter's having a quintineta, or you know, I just lost my mom, dude, the other day. And it's that sense of community, and we take a lot of pride in that. And like I said, we're huge organizations, and there's all different kinds of personalities on this organization, and you just got to find where you fit best. Because I've been at stations when I was out in the desert in Palmdale, really loved the crew, really loved the station, really loved running all day and night. It was insanity. Great calls, great learning. But I didn't really fit with a crew because being sober guy, they were all younger, they're all like, let's go to the river and party. And then Yeah, I don't really do that. And I don't really tell a lot of people on the job. I think more now. I'm a little more open about it. But at first I really didn't tell, like, there was only maybe two or three guys who know my actual whole story. You just gotta find where you fit. And I could work with people I don't maybe personally like, but I know they're performers and I know they could do the job. I know it could go and go anywhere to any scene, any fire, anything. And I know we're gonna take care of each other no matter what our our differences may be. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 52:51

What do you wish the public understood about how to res how to support first responders?

SPEAKER_02 52:56

I think we do get a lot of support. It's funny because always we go in like the store or something, or go walking down the street or at the gym or we're in uniform and stuff, and kids might say, Oh, look at police. I'm like, No, we're firefighters, people like us. But we love we love our brothers and sisters in the police department too. And we always have a good time. And I think we do get a lot of support from the communities just to understand we're people too. Pretty crazy dangerous jobs sometimes, but we we carry their losses with us too, you know, whether it's that father who just died or that fire that just took their house or car, or you know, they had a traumatic injury. However, we carry a lot of that too. And you do what you can, but it's always there. So you learn how to carry it in a good way. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 53:44

And last question what have fires taught you about what truly matters in life?

SPEAKER_02 53:49

That life could be really short sometimes. It's very precious, it's very fleeting. Us as humans, we think we own this world and think we get just now, nowadays we got so much information coming at us where we get blinded by it. Like Uncle used to say, we don't get to see beyond our own nose sometimes. Because we have so much coming at us, man. And you never know when you're gonna have to start over. I I heard something on the Instagrams or whatever the other day that this guy made perfect sense. It's like you will have to start over at some point in your life, no matter what, that version of yourself is gonna be forever gone. And that grief we carry of a loved one that passes away, it's it's a new version of living. Like when my mom passed, that was a that was a new version of living. When my dad passed, that was a new version of living. When I got this job and I got married and we started having kids, it's it's just a new version of yourself to get through that. But you you gotta realize when life is so precious, you never know when that last time you're gonna tell somebody you love them, or their last words might be in anger. Because we do, we're people, we're emotional beings, and I always try to correct that, especially with my kids or my friends and family. And when I get short or something like that, I always decide to say, you know what, I'm wrong. You know, I love you, just human, because I might wipe out that door tomorrow. I gotta go to work tomorrow.

SPEAKER_00 55:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 55:19

The whole plan is to come home, but it it I've seen it enough to where things happen and that might not happen. So love your loved ones, man.

SPEAKER_00 55:30

Yeah, loving your loved ones and and accountability with what you're talking about, being able to make those apologies or make those amends when we need to, try to try to do the best we can to always make things right with our family and loved ones, the best, the best we know how, anyways. And then also what you said too, it we have our our story, whatever that is, but then we have all these different chapters. You talked about that each chapter is going to be a new, a new kind of version, right? Or something something different than than the previous one, how our how our life will look.

SPEAKER_02 56:02

Yeah, I think a lot of people fear change, and a lot of people in the department fear change because it's the saying that's how it's always been done. And it's that was a saying for a very long time, and especially with the mental health part, but even with tactics and doing things, people fear change. It's not comfortable, it's not supposed to be. You know, if it's comfortable, it would be too easy. So that's how you learn and grow.

SPEAKER_00 56:28

Yeah, I used to, I know it sounds kind of silly, but when I was in junior college, I was taking a drama class actually. So fun, man. But I was taking a couple of things. That's why you're so dramatic. That's why I'm so dramatic. Thanks, man. And uh so yeah, I was taking this drama class, and I remember the teacher said, if you want comfortable, go sit on the couch. Yep. And then what you're gonna do is you're gonna sit on the couch and watch everybody else walk by and you're gonna see life just pass you, and you're just gonna be sitting there on that couch instead of getting up and being uncomfortable. Yeah. So I think it's a there's so much truth to that. All right. So I have on every episode I end it with the same four questions. So with these questions, with some of them you've actually answered already, to tell you the truth, just a one one sentence or two sentence response for each one. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 57:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 57:24

If someone listening feels powerless right now, powerless with their life, with their circumstances, with what they're going through, what would you say to them?

SPEAKER_02 57:34

Pick up that phone and reach out. There's always a hand willing to grab.

SPEAKER_00 57:39

Nice. Nice. Pick up the phone, reach out. There's always somebody there you can talk to. What's one thing an everyday person can do to make a real impact?

SPEAKER_02 57:51

Spread love. There's a lot of that that could get pretty big, but you know, I think basically is what my therapist told me is suck the happiness out of somebody. When I'm having a bad day and I want to be happy, I gotta whoever's trying to be nice to me or something, I need to suck the happiness out of them.

SPEAKER_00 58:13

Yeah, kind. Nice. Get you some happy. Okay, who did you become because some of the pain that you lived through?

SPEAKER_02 58:25

I feel like I've become stronger and hopefully the center of calmness that people could lean on during hard times.

SPEAKER_00 58:36

All right, and last one, what do you want your legacy to be? And not your career, but your soul's legacy. Your soul's work.

SPEAKER_02 58:48

I think making an impact for good and having my children see that and know them knowing they could achieve great things by putting in the work. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:04

Well, Eric, I want to say thank you. It has been really, really amazing to be here with you. You know, it's it's interesting because you're somebody that is a dear friend of mine, somebody that I'm close with, right? We do a lot of things with each other. We spent a lot of time together, especially with ceremony and things like that. It's interesting when you sit down in kind of a more formal way with somebody and go through questions, you learn a lot of new stuff about somebody that's even your own friend.

SPEAKER_02 59:36

Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah, this has been awesome, man. I I really appreciate the time. It's an honor to talk to you like this, buddy. Get down to the nitty-gritty because we like to joke around, have fun a lot of times. But I know you're one of those guys I've always had that connection with, where when it gets real, we get real, man, and really appreciate what you do and for the people, for me and family. And I love you, man.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:01

Yeah, well, it goes both ways. I can't tell you how much I love you, man. I'm sure we'll we'll talk soon. And for everybody else, thank you very much for listening to another episode of Finding Your Voice.