Gut Microbiome Basics: Prebiotics vs Probiotics with Rebecca Hermann

Gut Microbiome Basics: Prebiotics vs Probiotics, Cravings, and Smarter Grocery Shopping | Aesthetics Unscripted

Host Kim welcomes registered dietician nutritionist Rebecca Herman to discuss gut microbiome basics and how to navigate nutrition misinformation. Rebecca explains her work in K–12 nutrition education, clarifies the difference between a registered dietician and a nutritionist, and emphasizes continuing education. They define the gut microbiome and why it matters for digestion, immunity, memory, and overall wellness, then break down prebiotics (fiber from fruits, vegetables, oats, whole grains) versus probiotics (fermented foods like yogurt, pickles, sauerkraut, kimchi, kombucha), including why starting slowly can prevent stomach upset. They discuss how gut health can influence cravings, practical strategies for busy people (shopping small, prepping foods, shopping the store’s outer aisles), and label-reading red flags like long ingredient lists, low fiber, high added sugar, and high sodium.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:03

Welcome to Aesthetics Unscripted. I'm your host Kim. I'm your regenerative aesthetic and longevity expert. And I'm here today with the fabulous Rebecca Herman. She is a registered dietitian and nutritionist, and everybody's been hearing a lot about microbiome and the gut and the this and the that. But uh we're gonna talk about it because there's a lot to discuss here, and I would like you, Rebecca, to please introduce yourself and bright up on all of these many hats that you wear. Please let the viewers know who are you?

SPEAKER_00 0:37

Fantastic. Thank you so much. My name is Rebecca Herman, and I am a registered dietitian nutritionist, and I have been in the field of dietetics for longer than I would like to share here with everybody. Um, I have only been a dietitian and known that since I graduated from college. And I found my journey began in the world of uh healthcare, and I was a clinical dietitian for quite some time in my career, and then was able to sort of make the leap and jump into um education. So I did a lot of education and um support in healthcare, and then again, I have transitioned over to the education world where I get to work um with all ages, K through 12. Right now I am in the schools, um, but my background and and all of my journey, my personal journeys and things like that um have brought me to where I am today. And I'm just so excited to be able to share with you quick tips and tricks to kind of make yourself um better from the inside out.

SPEAKER_01 1:40

There's so much information we're constantly bombarded with, with every second that goes by, you know, from word of mouth, from your friends, your coworkers, your colleagues, you snippets you hear walking down the street on the subway, and then you get, God help us, we get on the internet, whether it's our laptops or our phones, and then there's more, and there's an avalanche of all this crazy information and this viral, you know, whatever, and a lot of times, I'm sorry, not sorry, a lot of times the viral trend is crap and maybe even harmful. And how, oh my god, how a person is to be able to figure out what's good for them and what's not and what makes sense and does it, you know, is this something we even need to care about? But I wanted to go back to your educating because I think especially for people in or persons, if you will, that are in my age demographic and older, you know, when you hear dietitian, you hear education, you think about like the lunch lady. Let's unpack that. Like Rebecca, what's the difference between you and maybe what people think you do?

SPEAKER_00 2:42

I am the individual who gets to sort of go, so I work in again the uh K through 12, and I get to go in and I do sort of education with students um in the front of the house in those schools. So I get to go into classrooms and I get to go into assemblies and I get to go in um and you know educate those students in the dining hall, sort of when they're in there getting their lunch. So I am responsible, or my position right now is responsible for making sure that those students sort of understand how that food ends up on their plate and in the dining hall. So I get to sort of educate that, you know, sustainability and I get to educate nutrition and I get to educate all of those things versus being that individual who is serving that food on the other end. Um, and I do want to mention, you know, you kind of mentioned all of the information that's out there, whether or not um it's, you know, social media or those types of things. One really important quick tip that I like to share with people is there is a huge difference between a registered registered dietitian nutritionist and a nutritionist. And so a registered dietitian can call themselves a nutritionist, but a nutritionist cannot call themselves a registered dietitian. I will try to make it a point that if somebody is getting nutrition education, whether or not it's from a friend or from a magazine or from the internet, it's very important to understand that information should be coming from a registered dietitian versus coming from a nutritionist. Because basically anybody out there who has had some education in nutrition can actually call themselves a nutritionist. Where registered dietitian has to uh go to college and get a degree, we have to take an exam, and then we have to continue education throughout our career to be called a registered dietitian. And so nutrition education and nutrition information is always changing. And so it's really important to understand a dietitian is educated and we continue our education as those trends sort of change through nutrition.

SPEAKER_01 4:40

Oh, that's amazing. And I wish I had a green flag I could wave for you or a set of pom-poms because I am like such an advocate for continuing education, it's just nonstop. Like in our fields of aesthetics and nutrition, and I mean, in any field, technology, everything changes with every second that goes by, much less overnight. So if we're not, as practitioners, we're not doing ourselves the due diligence to stay educated, to respect ourselves and respect our patients, to continue our education on all avenues, on every front, when it's available, and then find it when it's not available and make things happen so we can keep learning. I don't think that we should be in practice if we become complacent and want to rest on our laurels.

SPEAKER_00 5:24

You know, there's a lot of changes happening all over. And so really keeping on top of education, um, it it really is important, you know, for the public to understand that that we do do that. I don't know that people understand that we have to continue that in order to keep our licenses. And um, you know, it's very, very important.

SPEAKER_01 5:41

I knew there was a registered dietitian level. I didn't know you actually had to and it's enforced to continue your education, so hurrah to that. Let's jump into the gut microbiome because I know it's it's very prevalent. However, there's a lot of the general public that this might be foreign language to still. So, what is the gut microbiome and why is it important?

SPEAKER_00 6:05

So the gut microbiome is what keeps your entire um body regulated and that exists in your gut. And so not only is it responsible for digestion, it's responsible for immunity, it's responsible for um, you know, memory and it's responsible for all of these things. And, you know, the microbiome is something that is fed by prebiotics and fueled by probiotics. And so a lot of times people don't understand the difference between a prebiotic and a probiotic in sort of what they do. And so um, you know, keeping the microbiome healthy, especially after taking a medication or if you've been ill, um, trying to keep that on point, it's very important that you get both prebiotics and probiotics in your diet. I know um, you know, you can supplement those two things, but again, it's really important to know the difference between what those two things are.

SPEAKER_01 6:58

I'm looking forward to your take on this because when probiotics became like such a huge thing here in the US, of course I jumped right in. Um, I'm embarrassed to admit that at the time, even though I'm like Miss Self-Education, you know, continuing educational girl, I didn't really look into it too far. Stopped into my local um uh vitamin shop and they were like, this is the one. And there was a whole wall full of them full of them, but he's like, This is the one, it's got the highest, blah, blah, blah. And it actually made my stomach upset. So explain that to me.

SPEAKER_00 7:30

Just like with fiber in the diet, you know, if you're not somebody who has a whole lot of fiber in your diet, you want to start very, very slowly because you can easily upset your gut very, very much. And so, again, so prime example, taking a very high dose of something that would be considered a prebiotic or probiotic can cause your gut to sort of wreak havoc. And again, you know, it's important to realize getting those pre and probiotics from food is really the best way to do that because it's sort of that fibrous material that comes from the fruits and vegetables that you eat that give your body that prebiotic. And then the probiotic is fed by those fermented uh vegetables and things like that. And so they each play a very specific role. And you know, I do know they offer supplements and things like that, but if you think about, let's say, a piece of asparagus or an onion or something along those lines, which would be considered a really great prebiotic, think about how stringy and fibrous that is. And when you eat that, that is what is sort of fertilizing the microbiome and fertilizing your gut. And so then when you have that, you're giving it the fertilizer to grow, and then it needs to sort of be fed, which is when you would feed your body those fermented foods like kimchi, um, sauerkraut, yogurt, yeah. So all of those fun uh fermented foods. So again, two different steps, but when you think about food itself versus the supplement, and I'm not saying a supplement isn't going to do the job, but when you think about those sort of fibrous materials of you know, the fruits and vegetables, and then the joy of eating those fermented foods, it's it gives your gut sort of the real um experience that it needs to build that gut flora. And again, healthy gut flora is what's going to connect to your immunity, to your glow, um, and it's gonna connect it to you know all of those things and keeping your gut feeling good too.

SPEAKER_01 9:19

What are some foods you can easily incorporate? Obviously, unless you have an allergy, keep that in mind, viewers. So, what are some prebiotics very easy, and some probiotics very easy that you can get naturally from your food?

SPEAKER_00 9:31

So, prebiotics are found in any form of fruit and vegetable, uh, oats also as well. So, anything that contains a good source of fiber, you find different types of fiber in both fruits and vegetables versus um grains. And so, again, that fiber is what's gonna fertilize um your microbiome. And so eating that on a regular basis is gonna be very, very important. Five times a day for uh fruits and vegetables is is key. Um, and so then you know, whole grains throughout the day is also great. And so that's what's gonna be considered the prebiotic. And so, again, that's the fertilizer. And then the probiotic is very, very simple and very easy. So, again, you can find that in yogurt. Um, yogurt has lactobacillus and it has all of the um that in there, and so then you also would do a fermented food. So fermented foods like dill pickles, um, super easy, sauerkraut, kimchi, uh, kombucha, actually. And so kombucha is a great, great source of probiotics. And so just want to make mention though, choosing a kombucha that is a lower source of added sugar, because sometimes kombuchas out there can have a lot of added sugar in them. But those are five really easy things that you can incorporate on a regular basis. And again, you would want to start small. So if you haven't focused on probiotics, you know, prebiotics again just come from everyday foods, um, fruits and vegetables. But starting a probiotic, you would want to start very, very slowly and try um one serving a day and sort of see how you feel, and then gradually um increase that to maybe a cup twice a day, but again, over time.

SPEAKER_01 11:06

That's a great, great tip right there, because um, being Korean American and Italian and a you know, a whole bunch of other little things according to 23andMe obviously I was raised to eat things like kimchi along with American food, etc. But I know when I have friends that have never had it before, but they're very interested and they want to jump in, I say the same thing. I'm like, uh and not from an educational standpoint, but from a real life experience. Like, first of all, it's it can be an acquired taste. Second of all, you do not want to jump in and eat a ton of it and one sitting. You're going to regret it.

unknown 11:43

Correct.

SPEAKER_01 11:44

And then third, like, don't try to eat even a little bit every single day just because you saw it on a K-drama and they have it with breakfast every day. Because by day three or four of this sudden influx of kimchi, you're going to regret it. Most of the time.

unknown 11:59

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 12:00

And it's so it's it's exciting just to be able to, again, let somebody try something new and then they love it. And so, but again, don't go full force.

SPEAKER_01 12:10

That brings up a very um axe to grind issue with me. Like one of my biggest peeves and has been for years is yogurt. And only because we have our like our big box brand yogurt that's ladden with sometimes chemical additives, it's ladden with sugar. Yeah, it's not like I know it's sour, and again, it is an acquired taste. Even for me, being on like this big longevity health kick and getting into the blue zones and starting to turn my nutrition around about, I don't know, 10 or 12 years ago. I it was it took me a little bit to get used to Greek yogurt.

SPEAKER_00 12:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:48

So now I'm like between single-use plastics, microplastics, pollution for the planet, obviously, and the fact that I'm steering away from these sugary yogurts. Um, there are brands that make Greek yogurt in glass. You can buy them in glass jars. So, how do you feel about all of this?

SPEAKER_00 13:08

So it's very true. I mean, great question. You know, yogurt itself, you know, when I speak of yogurt only because of where I am, I'm speaking of the Greek plain yogurt only because that's kind of where, you know, you really should be um focusing on. And with anything else, um, less is more. And so if you are somebody who is looking to eat yogurt, um, again, looking at that label. So, you know, keeping those ingredients to five ingredients or less are going to be really, really important. And looking at that added sugar because um the added sugar in those yogurts, um, one four grams of added sugar is one teaspoon. And so when you're looking at a label in let's say the small served container of a yogurt, you can have up to three to four teaspoons in just a small container of yogurt. Again, you know, that and that added sugar is what's going to sort of offset the benefits of the um the yogurt itself in terms of talking about the microbiome and the probiotics. And so, again, less is more. And so keeping your eye on that added sugar line and making sure it has less than four grams is going to be really important. And then looking at those ingredients that, you know, five or less in just about anything, the less ingredients, um, the better the item could is should be for you. Let's say not is, but should be. And then, you know, the glass is is really, really important. And I'm hoping that we sort of start to see the shift to going more to glass versus in the in the plastic containers.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

So let me go back to the gut microbiome. I found this entire um part of my recent education on what is it and how does it function completely fascinating. Um from your expert standpoint, I've heard something that I was I was like like one of those moments with your brain, that the gut microbiome is actually what controls your cravings. It's not in your head, it's coming from your gut, and we can retrain that.

SPEAKER_00 15:04

So there's two different things that sort of come into play with the cravings, and one of them can be the gut microbiome. And so, you know, your gut, again, you feed it. Um, you feed it. I I don't want to use the wrong word, so you can feed it, you know, junk food. I I don't know the proper root garbage to use. Yeah, garbage.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

Mass garbage that tastes really good.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

Because as a dietitian, you know, anything and everything is adaptable in moderation. And so, but like if you're somebody who focuses on junk food, um, again, we'll just use that, or somebody who has a primary diet of junk food, high in added sugars, highly, you know, processed those types of foods, that is what your gut is going to tell your brain that it wants more of. So there is a direct connection of those two things between, you know, what you feed it and what it's going to ask your brain for. So that is absolutely retrainable. The second thing that also kind of contributes to cravings is sort of when we don't eat consistent meals the day prior. So when I say consistent meals, I mean eating throughout the day, eating the right portions of a carbohydrate, a protein, and a produce. So there's those kinds of things that come into play as well. But absolutely that microbiome, if you're eating junk, is gonna tell your brain to get more junk.

SPEAKER_01 16:18

Very uh that to me though is like we have little aliens inside of us that are controlling the ship. Yeah. I was like, wait, it's not in your head, it's literally not in your head. This is so crazy.

SPEAKER_00 16:28

Yeah, it really, really is. And so again, that tie between what you're feeding that is gonna really, that's what it's looking for. And so sort of making that shift, if you're not somebody who does those fresh fruits and vegetables on a regular basis, um, or not somebody who does, you know, fermented foods or whole foods, even, you know, let's just talk whole foods, not necessarily um but like ultra-processed foods and those kinds of things, trying to get back to those whole foods, that really your um microbiome in your gut are really going to start sort of retraining your brain to crave those things more than craving the junk once you start introducing that. And it's a crazy, crazy thing to to experience.

SPEAKER_01 17:08

The argument that comes back to me, and I'm sure you hear it all of the time, is like, but Rebecca, I'm busy. You don't understand I'm so busy. I've got kids, or I don't have kids, and I've got a job, I've got another job, I've got this, I've got that, I'm trying to make, you know, try also trying to do a startup or whatever it is. So the fast food and the frozen food and the this and the that, you know, this is just the way, this is the only choice I have. It's the way I have to exist. And my answer is always like, look, you can do, and I know you can't carve out the time right now in your mind, but if you could literally just put five minutes aside to look at these easy ways, you could shop not for a week, but you go and shop fresh. You pick up a day or two's worth of food on your way home. It works out into your day anyway, as opposed to the two hours on the Costco line or the three hours in Costco. You can shop like Europeans do, um, you know, just a little bit at a time. Now you have fresh food, and it's so easy to make really, really tasty, super fast food. It doesn't have to look like you're in a Michelin star restaurant. You're gonna eat it. Who cares what it looks like? But you can toss up really fast things and it's always fresh and it's always good for you. And like you said, before you know it, within days to weeks, your body's gonna stop craving like garbage.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

It's most important to realize when I talk to people about how to improve their shopping, shopping the outside of the grocery store is really the best place to shop. So when you walk into that grocery store and just do the square of the grocery store, so generally that's the produce aisle, that's the um, you know, the meat aisle, which again is on the outside, and then you kind of go over to um the dairy aisle. But again, shopping the outside of the store is where you're gonna find those foods that are not gonna be. I mean, you'll still find ultra-processed foods and things like that. But again, you'll find most of the whole foods and things that are gonna be better for you on those outside aisles. Again, making sure that you're shopping small and you and it can be a matter of making two meals at the same time with the same ingredients, but adding a different spice or adding a different topping. Doing that and having those meals available, you know, for quick grab. And again, a lot of times I like to say if you're somebody who likes fruit and you buy strawberries, you're more likely to eat those strawberries if you've washed them and cut them up and put them in your refrigerator when you got home than if it's not been prepared when you get there. So those little tips of what's gonna make it easier for you to reach into your refrigerator and grab, you know, a hard-boiled egg, if that's been if you've made those ahead of time, you know, those are really good for you. So so when you're doing that, things that belong in the refrigerator generally, um, you know, are going to be those foods that are gonna sort of feed your gut microbiome and you know keep you healthier from the inside out, versus shopping the middle aisles where you tend to find most of the processed and ultra-processed foods in the grocery store.

SPEAKER_01 20:00

Right, exactly. And I did find from my own personal experience it was just a shift in a mindset, you know, because I realized once I became s a little bit more self-educated, and then also talked to professionals about it, that um it would take the same amount of time as it takes for me to go to a drive-thru to bring this back in the single-use plastics, to pollute the planet, and then pollute myself. Correct. And then feel like garbage when I go to sleep or wake up in the morning bloated, sluggish, brain fog. I mean, these are all real things, right? Everybody out there listening can attest to this. Um less. Or less. So, like literally, I can stand in the middle of the most decadent, and we're in New York City, as you know, with the most decadent pastries, go out to Nassau County, New Jersey, wherever you are. Uh, I could be in the most beautiful, extensive pastry shop, and maybe I'm buying something for you, uh, or whatever, and I'm not craving anything for myself. So well, I might buy a cannoli once every couple of years or once every couple of months because I feel like it. Um, but it's more like because I'm consciously thinking, you know, I love cannolis, and I haven't had one in a long time, so I'm gonna get one while I'm getting this other stuff for someone else for this gift. But I'm not actually physically craving it. Like to me, I'm like, whatever. Like I look at all the candy on the on the checkout aisle at the food store and I'm like, whatever, it doesn't bother me.

SPEAKER_00 21:32

I find the same thing, you know, years and years and years ago, I would have walked into that same pastry shop and thought, wow, what can I get? What do I want? And now I just don't even, it doesn't even cross my mind that I want that simply because my of how I'm gonna feel after, and my body sort of knows how I'm gonna feel after and the same with the fast food, you know. It's until you stop eating the fast food and you realize like that the the brain fog and how you don't how you feel after you've eaten that, you realize that it is really related. To those choices of, you know, the fast food and those ultra-processed foods. You really realize that. But it's a challenge. And I and I think people will feel better and you know, generally will get so much more out of, um, you have so much more energy, and you're so much clearer, and you just feel so much better. You know, you're just keeping that biome healthy.

SPEAKER_01 22:19

Absolutely. And for all the viewers out there that are tuning in because they want to, like their main prerogative is the aesthetic part, you know, and they're all they're worried about this. This is never going to be bouncy and youthful and glowy and glass skin. It's never, never, never gonna be that way. Even if you have the most blessed DNA throughout your life, if you don't take care of what's inside. Absolutely. That's it. You have to, once you open your eyes, you'll never be able to close them again. I'm telling you. Um, like Rebecca said, it's a step you have to consciously be willing to take. It's like quitting smoking or quitting any kind of bad habit like alcohol or whatever it is. If you decide you want to quit, you might try 10 million times to quit and never accomplish it. And then some one day you'll wake up in the morning and suddenly just be over it and just stop doing whatever that bad habit was. And food can be like that too.

SPEAKER_00 23:09

Yeah. And you know, I do like to make mention, you know, people are mostly successful with making changes when it is we're talking like baby steps, right? So we're talking like if you've never tried kimchi, just go to the store and take a bite. And if you don't like it the first time you take a bite, or you know, let it sit there and try it again. But any type of change that anybody wants to make in the world of, you know, nutrition or or in self-improvement, it's very important to realize, you know, setting the smaller goals. Like, hey, I'm gonna try and not put two pats of um peanut, uh, two pats of butter on my piece of toast. I'm just using it as an example. Piece of whole grain toast. Let's go there. Um, and so I'm gonna use one and a half. And so then, hey, you know, taste like we are talking millimeter changes, and those millimeter changes add up to sort of making the change. You and I didn't sort of, you know, make those changes overnight. And and again, with anything, just one small goal for the day, for the week, for the month. And then once you achieve that goal, that's how you build on making those, you know, changes in your nutrition and your health and your overall well-being.

SPEAKER_01 24:20

Yeah, I love that because I think when we get excited as human nature, it's like to get excited and then you jump in with both feet. And and you, Rebecca, are saying, you know, the easiest thing to do is like, whoa, to bump the brakes on that a little bit and take it one step at a time.

SPEAKER_00 24:34

Yeah, yeah. With any, yeah, with anything related to, you know, if you drink two cups of coffee and you want to drink one, then I would do one, you know, one half cup of decaf and add it, you know, and sort of one half cup of decaf to your one and a half regular to cut back on caffeine. It's really about all of those tiny, tiny things. And then, you know, it it's like old hat. It becomes old hat.

SPEAKER_01 24:58

So we hear Trader Joe's, we hear Whole Foods, we think healthy. What are a couple of like really quick red flags when you go into those big stores? Because I already know there's a lot of things in those stores that are unhealthy. You have to turn the labels around. So, what's your take on this?

SPEAKER_00 25:13

I've used the word sort of ultra-process a few times um in this conversation. And even though it's in a Whole Foods, if it's, you know, there are still processed and ultra-processed foods that you can find in a Whole Foods in a Trader Joe's. And so it is very important to take the time to turn the label over. Now, the food label, I mean, I have to be honest, is very intimidating for somebody who might not really know what they're looking at. And so, you know, I sort of like to give three key points, three or four key points, as to what to look at to make sure what you're purchasing is, you know, j actually a really good healthy choice versus something that's been processed too much. And so the first place I would start would be where it says ingredients. And so under the ingredient, which is under the um nutrition food label, you want to look at that, and if that item has more, again, than a handful of ingredients. Now, I should say if the ingredients are potato, carrot, um, you know, corn, those types of things, then that is a great, if we're talking about, let's say, a soup or something, that is a great label if all of the ingredients are whole and natural foods. But if you get a label and there is one thing on there that you cannot read, it's really indicating, you know, that that's something that has been processed and there's something that's been added to it that is not a whole food. And then the second line, um, you know, calories are calories. I don't generally focus on calories themselves because, you know, you can get um, you know, you need all those macros um in your diet. So the next line I recommend looking at is the fiber line. And if something has three grams of fiber or more, it generally means that that's a great complex carbohydrate choice. And so I look at that, and then I recommend not looking at the total sugar lines because under total sugars is where sugars from fruit would show up, and those are are generally good for you considering, you know, longevity and and long-term um disease developing over time. It's the added sugars. And so if something has more than four grams of added sugars, which equals one teaspoon, that makes it a poor choice as well.

SPEAKER_01 27:20

What about the sodium line? Because I get a little fixated on that myself.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

Under 2,000 milligrams is something you know would be recommended for the population. So you definitely want to make sure when you're looking at that sodium level, the less the better. You don't want to have anything uh that has more than 5% of your total um sodium for the day.

SPEAKER_01 27:39

Great tips. Everything, I mean, again, I say this to pretty much every one of our guests that I could listen to you speak all day long. And it's not smoke in mirrors. I'm not just saying that to, you know, like make the audience think they should be more engaged with us. I literally so far with all our guests can listen to you all day long. So um Rebecca, I would love to have you back on because I want to. This is a whole segment in itself. I want to revisit um the the shopping. And I want to talk about one of my most horrific nutritional subjects, which is Bill Gates and Impossible Foods.

SPEAKER_00 28:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:19

Yeah. I mean, this out I we can definitely make a whole series of.

SPEAKER_00 28:28

I have had such a great time. I I am so happy any time that I have the opportunity to get to meet somebody new and and um share information and and gain information as well. It's been amazing.

SPEAKER_01 28:42

So please subscribe to Aesthetics Unscripted and drop your comments because we want to hear your comments, we want to hear your questions. These are endless subjects when it comes to nutrition, especially when you have someone of the caliber of Rebecca Herman, a registered dietitian and nutritionist. And um also you could follow our social media. We have new social coming for the podcast soon, but at ITX SkinMagic and at Soma Cell Skin. Rebecca, where can we find you?

SPEAKER_00 29:11

You can find me on LinkedIn at Rebeccaherman.com.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

Excellent, fantastic. Thank you so much for being here today. I applaud you in your great work. Um, you know, and and it's humbling and it's also very heartwarming because I love to meet people like yourself that keep giving back.

SPEAKER_00 29:28

Yeah, amazing. I had such a great time. It's been so great. Um, and thank you so much for for having me on as a guest. It's it's so exciting, and I I can't wait to come back and and talk again.