When Healing Goes Deeper: Understanding Trauma Beyond the Mind with Heather Cypel

When Healing Goes Deeper: Understanding Trauma Beyond the Mind with Heather Cypel

In this episode, we sit down with Heather Cypel, an intuitive psyche specialist, energy body specialist, and sacred union coach. Heather’s work focuses on the connection between the energy body, the psyche, and the physical experience, and how unresolved patterns can shape how we think, feel, and move through the world.

Heather’s journey into this work began through her own healing. After experiencing health challenges that traditional medicine couldn’t resolve, she turned to energy work and became deeply committed to understanding the relationship between human behavior, the psyche, and the energetic body.

With a background in history, anthropology, and a lifelong study of human behavioral patterns, Heather now helps others explore the deeper layers of their experiences and begin shifting patterns at the energetic level.

✨ About Her Work

Heather offers a range of services designed to support emotional, relational, and energetic healing. Her work centers on creating space for clients to understand their patterns, release what feels stuck, and reconnect with themselves in a more intentional way.

Her services include:

• Energy sessions focused on the energy body and stored patterns
• Exploration sessions and coaching around emotional and behavioral dynamics
• Relationship and sacred union coaching
• Classes and trainings on energetic and spiritual concepts
• Trauma-focused energy recordings to support release and integration

Her approach is rooted in the belief that healing happens when we begin to understand what we’ve been carrying… and allow it to move.

🔗 Connect with Heather

• Website: https://www.heathercypel.com/about-heather.html
  
  
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/heather.cypel/
  
  

🌿 What We Explore in This Episode

• The energy body as a blueprint for lived experience
• How trauma can become stored and show up as patterns
• The connection between the psyche, energy, and behavior
• What it looks like to begin releasing what’s been held

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

You're listening to the Beyond Mommy Daris podcast, where we talk about growing up with narcissistic moms, how it shapes your nervous system, your relationships, and your sense of self, and how to heal without shame. I'm your host, Nelani Pearl Hernandez. Today's episode is sponsored by Powered Body Care that actually works. Today I'm sitting down with Heather Sipel, an intuitive psychic and energy body specialist, to explore how our emotional patterns, our psyche, and even our physical experiences are shaped by a deeper energetic blueprint we carry. All right. Today I am here with my guest, Heather Sipel. I'm so excited to dig into her specialties. And I'm going to ask my first question, which is, you know, some of the things that you shared is that as a child you were really deeply interested in theology and spirituality and existentialism. So what do you think that younger version of you was already sensing and really searching for?

SPEAKER_02 1:02

Well, I guess when I was younger, I would have framed it via the lens of religion. I would have said that I had a heart for God and that I was just in search of that connection with spirit and deeper meaning. And I had my first spiritual awakening when I was four. And it it kind of opened up that connection with spirit. And I always had a natural curiosity. And of course, I went through the lens of theology. We went to church a lot. So it was really natural. And I was pondering and just very, very curious. And I remember that by the time I was in third grade, maybe nine years old, um, I no longer could ask those deeper theological or existential questions to any of the adults because the answers that they were giving were more rudimentary than where I was already. And so I just continued that way of education, right? Just correct direct connection with spirit. Um and it I'm every single question and pondering that I had was eventually answered. So I mean, it wasn't like a Google search in the world. Yeah. But over time, the biggest, deepest, most um, you know, curious or painful types of situations that I would put out there and really try to understand, it's like um my system would just automatically know over time what how things worked. And so I guess what I was searching for really was a way to navigate life and maybe to make it a little less painful.

SPEAKER_01 2:47

Yeah, and you know, a lot of the women or even people who are listening to this podcast have experienced a really severe trauma in that connection with um their foundation. And so I think, you know, one of the reasons why I wanted you to come on is because there are several different ways for you to connect. And several different ways for people to find what helps them on the path move forward. And yours is one of those ways. So I really wanted um, you know, not to make a pun of it, but that awakening to happen in them in a different kind of sense. And when did you really realize that you perceived the world differently than other people did?

SPEAKER_02 3:32

Um, I think probably in those early elementary ages. Um, I think I always kind of had a sense that uh one of these things is not like the other. Um, and I was born into a family where 90% of the people in my family have um the energy body archetype that's you know, namely considered like the strongest one. Um, but it also when people don't understand the energy body archetypes, they may not realize that that one particular system type has a lot of overlap with the expression of narcissist. Oh, really?

SPEAKER_01 4:09

Okay. Well, how about you explain it just a little bit, this archetype a little bit, so that people can tease out the two.

SPEAKER_02 4:16

Absolutely. So, okay, the energy body archetypes kind of um, it's where how the energy sits in your energy body and how it controls and governs your expressions, the way that you perceive life, what you like, what you don't like, etc. Um, and there's one particular system type that is very strong. Their energy is kind of packed into the center of them, and it's different from a narcissist because a narcissist's energy body has a slight inversion, so it's gonna pull energy in. It's not really gonna exchange and have that circular motion, right? You know, where you're really perceiving others and interacting in a you know balanced and healthy kind of way, right? But this system type is different because their energy is simply like really densely packed. I call it the post. It's like a post-like, yeah, yeah. So you're not moving them, right? Okay, and so it can kind of feel tough. And also the reason that I parse it out, like if I'm working with someone who's like, you know, I've had interactions with someone who, you know, has narcissistic traits, I parse it out because of how you're gonna interact with the person can be different, and your healing journey can be different depending on what you're actually interacting with. But say, for example, something like consideration. Well, that's not something that a narcissist really has, you know. And for this particular system type, they don't have that as a predominant feature. It's one of the way back in the way they don't.

SPEAKER_01 5:59

They can be considerate, but it's just in the back, it's not a forward feature.

SPEAKER_02 6:04

Right. So where if you point out, like, hey, she doesn't like it like that, they'll say, Oh, really? Like they just didn't notice. Right, right. Or you could say, I want it this way, and they'll be like, Why? You know, like it just might have occurred to them.

SPEAKER_01 6:18

Right.

SPEAKER_02 6:19

But the challenge is that the four other system types don't really like we don't really notice a lot of the times on the front end, especially when we're little, that we have that latitude to say, hey, wait a minute, what about me? Um, and so it kind of almost like uh the experience of being railroaded, right? Is what it can feel like. So I parse it out for people that I work with because the the direction that we take in the repair and healing work is gonna be different. Because if somebody is dealing with a true narcissist, then they're gonna be needing to develop more, like I guess you would say, a thicker skin and a way of like resourcing themselves.

unknown 7:04

Right.

SPEAKER_02 7:04

Because that person is not gonna exchange resourcing with them. But if you're dealing with somebody who's like a post-archetype, and um then that way we know to develop and strengthen the parts of them that need to stand up and say, Hey, I'm here too, right?

SPEAKER_01 7:22

Well, and it sounds like to you the the biggest difference, and I heard it right at the beginning is with a narcissist, all of the energy seems to be focused inward on them. And I think for a lot of it right that happens with the post one too, right? Well, yeah, which can be confusing, but like you said, the consideration part, like a narcissist would be like, What? What's consideration? Yeah, what okay, whatever. Whereas it sounds like a post would be like, Oh, I didn't even think about that.

SPEAKER_02 7:53

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 7:54

And that probably is the key factor there, right? For people to be able to say, Okay, you're a post, you're not a narcissist, we can deal with that, right?

SPEAKER_02 8:06

Yeah, because the post has a lot of kind of narcissist overlap traits. Yeah, yeah, but yeah, it's more um easy to contend with, right? And it's not as toxic, even though that particular system type will require like that their own cup gets filled first before they start putting energy into anybody else's cup.

SPEAKER_01 8:28

Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense though. It's kind of like um, you know, with the DSM4, you have to have five characteristics in order to be a narcissist. Right. Um, whereas you can have narcissistic tendencies.

unknown 8:43

Right.

SPEAKER_01 8:43

And that's what it sounds like in regards to this energy type. This post is okay, I'm I gotta fill my cup first. But I also look at that as okay, we're in an emergency in an airplane, and the thing the air comes down, and of course you put on your air first, because the time that it takes for you to put air on somebody else, you might pass out, and that's not a good thing. It's like um if we all go down, if I go down, we all go down, type of thing. So that makes sense, but that's not narcissistic. That's it, narcissistic. Got it. Okay, go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 9:18

Yeah, and so what it can do is if a person is willing to heal from having dealt with that all the time, being railroaded, and then they can get to a point where they can see that they the this system type is actually teaching us right before other system types need a little bit more of that. Sometimes we we give you know on a very low running cub, right? And then we can end up with resentment and things like that, right? So the post doesn't generally have very much resentment, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:49

No, and I think that's good because I think that for a lot of people, at least in my experience, especially with having a foundational member, like my mother being a narcissist, I started catching up with that because of the sensitivity and the intuition, which will go in a little bit more in regards to energy and the psyche. But I started saying, Oh God, that person is the narcissist. And I started saying that everyone was a narcissist when there could be narcissistic tendencies, maybe that person was selfish, maybe they just didn't know. Right. And they weren't picking up on stuff. There could be a a hundred things that this person are the person is experiencing. And that main factor with a narcissist is they don't ever want to repair. That's like that that is like the key factor for I think for everyone, is there might be gaslighting, which you know, I I by no sense of the matter is saying, Yes, you should, you know, be down for that. But there's gaslighting, it's always they're always throwing it back on you where it sounds like this specific archetype might feel similar, but is not quite the same.

SPEAKER_02 11:01

That's correct. They do draw energy towards them, they are their predominant care and concern, first and foremost. Um, they are tough, they also have an a core intrinsic need of conflict, which makes which makes it harder for the four other system types um to contend with because they actually bond via conflict.

SPEAKER_01 11:30

That's really interesting. I am I can't wait to dig in more to this because it's it is really like the for people to understand this, I think is gonna be really good for them. And you know, yeah, it's kind of like a tutory board. You take what you like and leave what you don't. That's right. And that's totally fine. So, how do you now understand this sensitivity and intuition through the lens of energy and the psyche?

SPEAKER_02 11:58

Oh, yeah, definitely. So I'll just say one little piece about this, a kind of a little story to add in. So um, I remember when I was little, and like I said, 90% of my family members are this system type, right? And what I felt was like um they were tank, they were just little tanks, and they were just like bumper cars with one another. It was like this intensity, and I felt like a kitten on the field, and I'm like trying to run away. Yeah, and so like there was that sensitivity, and I mean, even you know, at two years old, which is my first memory, I remember that being a prevailing feeling when I was, you know, at family members' houses, I would go underneath the table because just like I needed to feel like a lot, yeah. Yeah, and even at two years old, I remember like that. Was my one of my first memories, and I remember that being just a very familiar experience. Like I had been doing that for well over a year. Thanks because people would walk in and they would say, Where's Heather? And they would say, Oh, she's under the table, you know. I create I created my own cave, you know. Um, fortunately, that was like at my grandma's house, you know, um extended family would come over in my own home. It was very peaceful and quiet.

SPEAKER_01 13:20

So what um energy? So you said most of your, you know, family or extended family are post, but what energy then are you like predominantly?

SPEAKER_02 13:31

Yeah, so I do like like I'm like the sprinkler, like I I over give.

SPEAKER_03 13:37

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 13:38

So it's not super, it's not a super great connection to have people who are like, let me fill my up first. Yeah. And I'm like, let me give first. Yeah. And then there's not really that reciprocation that comes.

SPEAKER_01 13:51

Yeah, that makes sense. Um, when you came into this work, it was through your own health challenges. So can you share kind of what that period of your life looked like? Definitely.

SPEAKER_02 14:03

So I had no idea that my daughter was a post. Oh daughters. Yeah. And when she hit those team years, um, I mean, it changed in like literally the snap of a finger, and my whole world fell apart. And I started having massive anxiety, I mean, panic attacks like crazy. It felt like my energy field fractured and then started to like pieces started to fall apart. And um, you know, went through the doctors and got medicine, did counseling, um, and none of it really worked well. I mean, I remember when they were like raising the dosage of the anxiety medicine, it would work for that first week. And then the two subsequent weeks that they had to wait, it was like I was taking a water pill, you know, it um it just didn't do anything. And then once we reached like full max for my body weight, um, it worked for a while and then it just stopped working. Like my anxiety was just crazy high. Um, I had no idea that my kid needed friction. And I had no idea that all throughout her life before then, I was not providing her with that need, right? Like her need wasn't getting met because I'm a very non-confrontational, I'm a resolver. Like, right, let's talk about it, let's figure it out. And um, she was ended up depleted and resourced, and so in one fell swoop, trying to get all of her conflicts in, you know, in a matter of months. So um it was kind of like bombs were blasting, you know, and the medicine, you know, just stopped working. The counseling was fine. I mean, I I enjoy counseling, talking with someone is is lovely, but it surely didn't do anything for my body. Um, and at some point I told the counselor, I was like, you know, I really do enjoy these sessions. However, it feels like there's electricity running underneath my skin. It's just like this constant intensity. And she referred me to her friend who was a counselor that had a sound therapy table.

SPEAKER_00 16:14

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:15

And so I laid on that thing, and it's like a hard reverberation and they create like healing music. Oh my gosh, I felt like all of the stress had been drained out of my body in one moment. I felt like a cloud. I was so like when getting up off.

SPEAKER_01 16:31

And then that's when you kind of made that connection. You were like, Okay, there's something here.

SPEAKER_02 16:35

So I was just enjoying that for a while. And then after about two months, I saw the an ad for someone doing energy work, and it was like energy rebalancing. And I was like, I don't know what that is, but my I need my energy rebalanced. So I started going to my first healer and started learning about energy work, and I guess that's what you call a conscious mind awakening, where I was naturally already interacting with spirit. I had some very energetic interactions in previous romantic relationships that were just like, what is this? No one ever talks about these kinds of things, you know. Um, but my mind didn't really know, I didn't have a framework or a verbiage for it. And so when I found energy work, it really rounded out all of the theology that I had learned when I was young. And I was like, oh my goodness, this is the practical application of spirituality. This kind of stuff is how Jesus did all of the things that he did. And I think at some point I got disappointed with religion because I realized in hindsight that when I was little in church, and you know, they're teaching that Jesus said you can do all of these things that I have done and more. And I'm like, yes, let's learn this. And then I like never taught it, you know. Right, right. Um it just didn't really occur to me that, like, no, I want to do that. Like, I actually want to learn.

SPEAKER_01 18:05

How do I do it? Yeah, how do I do it? And you know, I think that's really it's an important thing, I think, uh, for a I have found a lot of women um who are going through this in the group um are definitely religious, and um they find um that religion is really helpful to them up to a certain point because what they found too is that it's also being used against them as they're trying to heal from a narcissist. So then they say, okay, you know, God is all knowing, there is this energy, he loves us, but then there's also, you know, I have to honor my parents and uh honor my mother and my father. So they have this real conflict. So if they're able to kind of tease out this energy part to understand, okay, this is what I'm gonna do. And theology and religion is still really important to me, and I'm gonna hold it here, and I'm gonna hold this energy here. They can do both. And I think that's that's one of the things I wanted people to understand is again, chiccuter board, choose what you want from it. You know, some people might want the cheese, some people might not, and that's totally fair. Um, how did self-healing turn into a profession for you?

SPEAKER_02 19:26

I think it was about after I had my fifth certification. Um, I think it was my mom who was like, Well, you're you actually ever gonna use those certifications.

SPEAKER_01 19:35

Thanks, mom.

SPEAKER_02 19:36

I was like, Oh, it didn't even occur to me. I was going through these trainings for my own knowledge and for my own health and my own curiosity. Um, and when she mentioned that, I was like, Oh, I I don't, I mean, I can offer it. I don't know if people would want this, you know.

SPEAKER_01 19:55

That's really cool, you know, and for listeners new to it, like I am, to energy work, how can you describe the energy body? And you kind of did a little bit, but in really like simple terms, like this and that, like how you describe the post, but just the energy body as a whole.

SPEAKER_02 20:14

So the part of the energy body, I mean, the part of the energy field that I focus on is the energy body. And so if you imagine your body itself as sort of like a hologram, you know, or at like a general outline, um, every little piece of that, every little tea tiny piece of it is it has a matrix of sorts, right? It has programming and it builds the physical body. So what you're seeing is the physical expression of your energy body. Right, right, right. The energy body is sort of like the blueprint, but then between the energy body and the physical body, then you create the mental body or the psyche, right? So we can create like the the energy body creates all the programs, it creates those neural pathways through the brain and the heart processes and everything, right? And then from those three, we build off the emotions, right? Because of course the emotions need the the endocrine system and all your little hormones, excretions, but that's coming from the programs that are in the energy body.

SPEAKER_01 21:21

Okay, that makes sense. And it makes sense to me why you think of things like unprocessed trauma and how they show up in the energy body, but then how can you know two different people from two different families, two different locations, two different parts of the world have a very similar reaction to that? So tell me how does like this unprocessed trauma show up in the energy body for you that you see?

SPEAKER_02 21:51

So I did not learn this until like about five years ago. I didn't learn this in class. I was actually in my energy body. Um, I had some, they call it a download when you get like a sudden realization of a particular energy tool. And at that point, my energy tools I had kind of hit a glass ceiling with, which means they weren't really working for me properly anymore. And I still believe in energy work. I saw the results for years before.

SPEAKER_03 22:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:21

Um, but I put a message out to spirit and I was like, actually, I want tools that will work faster and more consistently. So I just got the awareness to do this particular type of energy work. So I started doing it on my system. And after a little while, I started realizing, wait a minute, this is melting. Like this is like what's happening is my energy body is having things melted off of it. And I started to realize the framework that trauma is frozen energy on the energy body. Yeah, yeah. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And it creates that looping pattern, it creates all the intensities that you know feel like salt in a wound, right? When you have that salt in a wound feeling like something additional happens that is patterned from events that happened before, what's happening is it's creating more frozen energy. And so the more frozen energy on an energy body, the less range of motion in life they have, right? That their options become a little bit more limited, their perspectives become a little like more pigeonholed. And it's almost like resource yourself first. Like you can only handle your primary like needs if you just went through a major trauma, you know.

SPEAKER_01 23:37

And that makes sense because if you think about it, right, from a sense of okay, there's a traumatic experience, and like so what you just said, I'll transfer it to like the work that uh the way that I vocalize it and the work that we do. Um, we can say, okay, you experience a trauma. Of course, you're gonna be hyper-vigilant.

SPEAKER_03 23:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

And of course you're gonna feel a certain way, or of course you're gonna have to create that pattern when that you feel this, or you're gonna freeze, or whatever it is. So it's just like an um, like in addition, like I my son has these little toys. Well, he had, he's 14 now. So he had these little toys where there were little shells on them, like little robots. So it's like an extra added shell for people to understand. Okay, why do I still feel this way if I'm healing from this trauma? Oh, there might be a little bit more.

SPEAKER_02 24:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Let me dig into it. That makes sense. That's really interesting.

SPEAKER_02 24:38

Trauma's expression is is different for different people, or it's different for different situations, right? Sometimes you want to talk about it, you know, like you have to call this friend and say it over and again, and then you have to call this friend and say the same thing over again. It's like it feels like it needs to be heard. That's frozen energy. If you feel like you cannot talk about it at all, likewise, it's just you know, frozen energy.

SPEAKER_01 25:02

That doesn't make sense, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:05

And one of the ways that I like frame it is that like the painful emotions are actually different. Like, if you think of like say it snowed a lot outside and then it kind of congealed into one big old blob, in there you might have sticks and leaves and maybe little critters and whatnot. So those little things are the painful emotions that got stuck. The white frozen energy is our own energy. So over time, more and more trauma ends up making us feel exhausted and like we have less bandwidth, our brain doesn't process quite as much. Um, so when you begin defrosting, you get your own energy back. And then those little pieces, as those fragments come out of that frozen part, it just shluffs off naturally. And you can you just don't have that emotion there anymore, which is downright startling because I had a trauma in my teen years that was so graphic and so complex PTSD that you I would have never believed that that pain could go away and that my brain wouldn't process things the way that it did, you know. And I I repressed consciously and actively for over 25 years um all of that jazz, right? So I couldn't think about it even for one split second, otherwise the nightmares would start coming back, my body would flush hot, I would like do everything I can to get away, right? And so when I started defrosting for that, and those actual emotions were just gone, gone. It I almost couldn't believe it that it can work on something that extreme, you know.

SPEAKER_01 26:51

And you know, I think that for a lot of people, um, you know, I was having this conversation with my husband where I said a lot of my childhood I don't remember. Like you mentioned, oh, I remember being under, you know, at two under the table. And there are like pictures of me like playing under the table or coming out like playing peek-aboo, but I don't remember any of that. And it's really it's really, really interesting to me that that occurs, but uh and of course it does because your body, your brain try to protect you from those complex traumas that you have and you experience. So I I I really appreciate the fact that this kind of work, again, charcuterie board, this kind of work could could really help some women that that have experienced some really horrible things at the hands of their mother. Absolutely. You know, why is gentleness such a critical part of healing, especially when it comes to survivors of narcissism or of emotionally unsafe parenting?

SPEAKER_02 28:00

Well, I know for me, I again I'm not a system type that enjoys conflict or pain or suffering, right? Yeah. So since we've already experienced the pain or suffering, we don't want more of that. And sometimes even talking about an old situation to kind of map it out and process it is painful, right? So we can be kind of as gentle as we can, but you know how sometimes, like if you have the flu or something, even the slightest touch of your skin can feel yeah, so it's like I I personally look for the most gentle processes because that's how I want it. I want it super gentle, right?

SPEAKER_01 28:42

Many daughters of narcissistic mothers grow up in a really hyper-aware, hyper-vigilant state, and especially when it comes to others' emotions. So, how do you distinguish between that intuition and the trauma-based hypervigilance when you're looking and working with people?

SPEAKER_02 29:00

So, a lot of the time what happens is that there's something called the narcissist empath dynamic, right? And okay, so the formation of you know, we can say frame it this way, this is one angle to look at it. So when someone is in a state of trauma, they will, on some degree, either become a narcissist or an empath. It's just a response of the energy body. So the empath will spread out like a net around it, its energy body to get little reads and feels. And what it can do is perceive sort of in advance, give them a little bit of an indicator and a time to process how to approach this. So an empath can feel into different people, different situations, and know what to do in order to keep themselves safe. Whereas a narcissist, instead of spreading out, it pulls in and creates that like slight little inversion and basically demands its needs getting met all the time. And is basically, but both systems are basically in a state of I don't get my needs met.

SPEAKER_01 30:16

Right. And they look the same, but they're not the same.

SPEAKER_02 30:19

They're not the same. And the energy body does something, you know, very different. And we teach we do, you know, take a different healing approach to to each, though people who are narcissists don't generally because I was talking to someone and um and I try not to roll my eyes because I've been no contact for my from my mom for about 10 years now.

SPEAKER_01 30:43

But I always laugh when someone says, Oh, my mom um said that she'll go to therapy now. I was like, Okay, like I did because I remember what it triggers in me is you know, being in high school, expressing to the therapist there, uh the counselor there, my mom is crazy because I didn't have the verbiage for it. My mom's crazy, she's doing this, she makes me think different things. Like, I'll say something, and then she makes me question it. And the counselor was like, Let's have your mom come in, it'll be fine. I was like, Okay, this is not normal teenager stuff, but all right, if that's what you want to try. And she came in, and my mom was like, Oh, sweetie, I love you. I don't know what you're talking about. I was like, E psychopath, like, oh my gosh. And so for me, that's a real trigger, and I find it really interesting. And um, I'm gonna ask you a question while I look for this one quote that I found that explains things really interestingly. But tell me what are some signs that someone's intuitive abilities were shaped by survival?

SPEAKER_02 31:52

So, intuition in like a you know, pure sense, we call it in energy space a clear channel, right? If you're getting a clear ping or a clear, clear read, it does not have emotion attached to it. So if you're having an emotion, it's there, it's not that you're not getting data. You are getting data, it's just that it's hitting up on your own wounding, right? And so whenever we operate, feel, and then react out of our own wounds, it creates further distortion, right? Um, personally, I prefer to just like keep my mouth shut and ponder and like process internally. But then again, if you're dealing with a post, they're gonna want to fight immediately.

SPEAKER_01 32:39

You know, it's so interesting. Like I'm thinking back and I'm like, oh my gosh, who in my life for posts? And like I just I think that that's such an interesting way to think about it. Like you mentioned, like they're dug in the ground, it's uh their way or no way, in a very pop, like not in a sense of like they're being jerks, but like they know what they like, and that's what they like. They like what they like, and that's and they want what they want, yeah, and they want what they want, and I totally get that because it makes me think of okay, um well, I and I guess this is a question then can what can a is a person born into their energy body, or is it shaped by others or by trauma? And can energy bodies change?

SPEAKER_02 33:27

So your your energy body is the operating system, so you are born with that, but certainly the wounds um and who else you're around can shape your expressions of that, right? So um, I mean, I do believe a lot of narcissists were sort of born that way, you know. Um I because I believe a lot happens before we incarnate. So we have like our own ways of handling things, and and I call that that's a soul issue, you know, like that's an overarching thing that's gonna be there for them for their whole life, you know. Um, and so is the case oftenly with empaths, right? So you're probably slated for a good amount of wounding, and I do believe we choose our wounding, and I do believe that there's um a time where a lot of people can come to a point where they're like, okay, I'm ready to resolve this, right? And then your soul motivates you to hear certain things and learn about certain things and be interested in certain things. Um, but yeah, so the archetype itself is the operating system. So that's how it was. Got it.

SPEAKER_01 34:33

Okay, I got it. Okay. Yeah. Um tell me, how can survivors be begin to rebuild their own trust? Now, like once they know what their um what their energy sources or their energy field, make sure, correct me if I'm saying it wrong. Um once they know what that what their inner being is, how can they start to rebuild their trust to know where they need to go? Because I know for survivors, trust is a really hard thing, even their own self-trust.

SPEAKER_02 35:06

Yeah, for sure. So that's gonna be hard to do with a lot of frozen energy on your system. So I just recommend defrosting first. And I do have a free offer on my website for a little mini energy transmission. You just put it on repeat, put the volume down, and let it play all night long while you're sleeping. It's like the super easiest way. And um, I actually still do that for myself each night. Um, and then I have like a selection on my website. So, you know, like the trauma of um abuse, the trauma of neglect, the trauma of heartbreak, um, you know, betrayal, a lot of the different ones that were if you know that you have that pattern, I would defrost for that for sure. Um and then it starts to melt away. You get your own energy back so you have more clarity about how to approach things. Um, more options will present for you, like the very correct person for you to work with potentially could land in your life, or you could start following a channel that has all kinds of um posts that are just teaching you exactly the things that you need. Um, yeah, I highly recommend defrosting first and foremost.

SPEAKER_01 36:20

That's really helpful. Um I think that, you know, you're really talking about creating a safe space or container where clients can really be themselves. Yeah. So what does this actually look like in practice? So we've kind of talked a little bit about it, but um maybe give us a taste so that people know um what they might be expecting if they do some work with you.

SPEAKER_02 36:46

Sure. Yeah, so quite frankly, uh the the little uh energy transmissions are like my lowest price offer, but it's gonna be the most effective. Um coming into session with me and having talk sessions, um, it can help get the conscious mind on board and get some clarity and some direction. But the audio transmissions is what's gonna do the actual shifting. And so I usually don't even recommend packages if somebody wants to work with me, like you know, more than one once a time here and there. I'll be happy to create, you know, packages or whatever. Um, but I would say just buy one session and um come share your heart, and I will offer insight, guidance, education, and um and definitely recommend uh an energy transmission or two.

SPEAKER_01 37:41

That's fantastic. Why do you believe that fix it model of modern and definitely Western healing often causes more harm than good?

SPEAKER_02 37:52

Mainly because they don't know what they're trying to fix it to. Yes, they have an incorrect perception of what fixing it looks like. Right. Um, and I prefer the concept of like homeostasis, right? Bringing your system back to the way it naturally operates is the objective. Um, so fixing it, I think, is sort of like I mean, in a more rudimentary or basic way of thinking about that. Somebody would say, I just want this fixed because I don't want to feel bad anymore. And in that instance, we can make that happen for sure. Um but we're not trying to fix you, we're just trying to bring you back to your original.

SPEAKER_01 38:36

That that really makes sense. And you know, I said I was looking for something because we were talking briefly about, you know, usually narcissists don't come to get fixed or healed, very different from what you're talking about in regards to a post. And what I I saw something, um, somebody had posted that not all um narcissists are sociopaths. That's correct, but all sociopaths are narcissists. And I thought that yeah, and I thought that was really interesting because it kind of helps tease out what that actually is. If you got five of the, you know, five or plus of what's in the DSM five, you're freaking narcissists in my book. Like that's insurance, you know. So um, so tell me what. So you talked a little bit about your offering online, the audio part. Um, how can someone tell when they're really pushing themselves versus moving into that alignment?

SPEAKER_02 39:41

Um, I would say if your emotions get heightened, if there's a sense of urgency or a sense of failure, um, then you might be being a little too hard on yourself and pushing. And what I would say to that is I know when painful situations are very active and something is hurting, you want it to feel better sooner. Um, but when we push like that and it kind of feels like we we need this now, or you know, like we're kind of um almost screaming energetically, you know. Um, I feel like we miss the very thing. We could miss the very thing that's right in front of us. So like taking a moment, taking a breath, um, trying to come to just like a little pause and like clearly state what you do want, you know, like um, I guess you would call it prayer at this point, right? It's like or setting an intention out into the universe or whatever it is. Right. Um, I would say pray for clarity. Um if and every time I've done this, it has come through, right? It's like the easiest prayer for the universe to answer.

SPEAKER_03 40:54

Right.

SPEAKER_02 40:55

It comes through if you pray for clarity rather than a resolution or a specific end result. Sometimes the end result's gonna look different than what we think that it is now. So if you pray for clarity, you can get the next step. You know, another thing that I would pray for before I knew you know how to do energy work was an open door. If an opportunity was like just not presenting itself and I needed an open door, I would pray for it. And sometimes it would come only in the nick of time, and that was frustrating.

SPEAKER_01 41:31

Yes, I will tell you, you know, uh the the prayers that I've sent out in the world. Uh, you know, I have this wonderful, wonderful. So we're Catholic and I have this wonderful um uh priest that I deal with, and he's like, you just gotta keep at it. That's what it's out. And I wanted to pick up on something that you said in regards to, you know, before you're reincarnated and you come back, I always tease my husband that um we finally found each other in this lifetime, and it took a little while, yeah. Right, we were um, I mean, it's not like we were old, we were in our 30s, and we found each other. And although his kids and my kids aren't biologically connected, they might as well be. They're just so similar and they look alike, and so it's really interesting. Excuse me. Oh my goodness, I'll cut that up. Excuse me. Um, I find it really interesting because I look at pictures of them when they were little, and especially my oldest and um his middle daughter, they like look and they have very similar understandings. And I shared, I think, um, with one of these last on one of these last episodes, um, where I knew that my husband and I were gonna be well, I knew right away, but he's crazy handsome and tall and all that stuff. But but I really knew because, you know, as you bring when you bring children into it that are from other relationships. Um, we were at my grandmother-in-law's, and it was the first time my daughter was meeting everyone, and she was very upset. She was having really big feelings about it. And I was like, You gotta get it together, woman. Like, get it together, we're going in. Like, this is like you got you really gotta stop crying. I wasn't very sensitive to her being upset, but that's a whole nother story, and we can visit that when she's on the podcast. But I remember her meeting his grandmother for the first time, and she said to her in Spanish, Oh my gosh, you look like so much like your mom. And she saw, You're home, you're home. And she gave her a hug. And I just saw my daughter just melt right into her. And I was like, Oh my gosh, all that stuff that I was like, Oh, this is hokey. I don't believe that, you know. There are any of those things, I was like, yes, this is the energy, this is the way that it's gonna be. So I appreciate it. This this is really interesting. And I I find that energy creates or energy attracts other energy. And it it's a really it's a beautiful thing. Can you tell me what is joyful healing look like in real life?

SPEAKER_02 44:25

Oh man, so I actually um I say that when you really get it and when it really clicks, sometimes it's just kind of matter of fact. It's just like, yeah, I did that and it happened, you know, like it's not quite as like, I don't know, exciting and bouncing. It really feels more like peace and steadiness and maturity.

SPEAKER_01 44:53

I love that. I love that. Um can you tell me what do you wish more people understood about sensitivity and intuition?

SPEAKER_02 45:02

Oh, everything. I do, I'm grateful that we have a world that's talking about this more, um, for sure. And um I I wish I wish more sensitives could know at an earlier age um that it's okay and that to set your sights on what you want, um, ensure your own resourcing and don't just tolerate other people's stuff, you know. Um but as far as what other people would, you know, what I would want them to know is that if your child is shy, they feel terror. Like it's not a pleasant experience. Don't push them, they're already in a heightened state of anxiety.

SPEAKER_03 45:49

Right.

SPEAKER_02 45:50

And medicine may not be the first thing to grab. Um, you know, tools, teaching them tools at a younger age is definitely ideal. And I I cannot wait for the education system to finally pick up and start implementing some really good things for our kids.

SPEAKER_01 46:10

You know, I I definitely, you know, in a perfect world, we would move away from the industrial revolution when it comes to school. Yeah, you know, bells ringing, we have to be there at a certain time. I understood why they did it back then, but you know, one of the best classes I ever took at university at I went to Santa Clara University was we talked about this and how education is affected by that. And so when I really got into education and education advocacy, I talked about we got to feed our kids, we got to give them all a baseline for them to be able to do what they feel is best for them. You know, I'm gonna close with this question because I think it's a question that's on a lot of narcissistic daughters' minds. Um, what would you want a daughter who feels too much to hear to hear? Like she's been told she's too much nonstop by her mother and by others around her, other flying monkeys. What would you want her to hear?

SPEAKER_02 47:19

I would say that always remember that when you're out in the world and you're on your own and you can create your group of friends to be what you want them to be. And I wish I had been told this, you know, more, but to be choiceful, to interview and vet your friends and cultivate high-quality friends because there are people who really want all of you. And I had a friend recently, a couple years ago, we were having this conversation where somebody in her family kind of expressed that she was like a little too much for them. And I told her, You're never too much for me. I never, never, never feel that, no matter what your experience is. And it felt I, you know, I could feel how healing that was for her. So I would just want people to know that there are people who can be with you in all of the ways that you could ever potentially be, and and be able to handle that. And so look at the people who can't, you know, who complain as their lack of capacity. They don't have the full capacity to handle all of you.

SPEAKER_01 48:42

You know, I really love that because you know, if we think of people as energy, there are, like you said, specific energies that mesh really well together.

SPEAKER_03 48:54

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 48:54

So when they don't mesh well, like we can talk about a post, the post, we can say that that's too much for me. But for me, when you know, someone is we can say set in their ways or they like what they like and that's what it is. I don't see that as a negative. I see that as someone who's very firm in the way that they like things. And that's okay. And that's okay. Absolutely, as long as they're not causing harm, I'm good with that, right? That's right.

SPEAKER_02 49:22

I concur.

SPEAKER_01 49:23

Yes. Um, I I love that this conversation. This is so I loved it. And I, you know, I would love to have you back on so we could like dig deeper into stuff. And Heather, I'm so glad that our paths cross each other in a very unique and organic way. Um, you have been delightful, and I really just I enjoyed our conversation. So thank you.

SPEAKER_02 49:50

Me too. Thank you so much for having me. Um, I it's just always a pleasure to speak about these topics. They're close to my heart, and all things energy work is my jam. So I love it.

SPEAKER_01 50:05

I'm glad I can help you with your jam. So great, thank you. And then in our show notes, just for everyone, we'll have offerings and more information about Heather's so you can get in contact with her. Great, thank you. If this conversation opens something up for you, just notice that your healing isn't just in your mind, it lives in your body too, and it deserves space to move. Thank you for listening to the Beyond Mommy Daris podcast. You're not broken, you adapted. Healing from a narcissistic mother is real, possible, and you never have to do it with shame. I'm your host, Nelani Pearl Hernandez, and until next time, take gentle care of yourself.

SPEAKER_00 50:43

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