Send Help: Needs No Help

This week on Slasher Bash, Maddi and Ben review the new Sam Raimi thriller Send Help.  Find out how this ranks among Raimi's other work. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:25

Let's do this, bitch. Hello, everybody. Welcome to Slash Your Bash the Podcast Podcast where two friends talk horror. That's me just copying your last week's intro. I like it.

SPEAKER_01 0:34

And who are those two friends?

SPEAKER_04 0:36

I don't know. Just some strangers on the internet.

SPEAKER_01 0:38

Named Benjamin and Madison.

SPEAKER_04 0:41

Yep, you're Benjamin. I'm Madison. Welcome, everybody.

SPEAKER_01 0:44

Nice to be here.

SPEAKER_04 0:46

I mean, uh, that could be a girl's name. Yeah. It's 2026.

SPEAKER_01 0:50

Benjamina.

SPEAKER_04 0:51

Yeah. Could be uh, yeah, I don't know. I don't have a joke. Um, happy Memorial Day weekend.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 0:58

How was your recording on Memorials Day? Memorial? Memorial Day.

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Memorial Day.

SPEAKER_04 1:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:04

My day was long and stressful. How was yours? Was it relaxing? Was your holiday weekend?

SPEAKER_04 1:10

I listen to a lot of music. Um it's one of those days. Sometimes I get in these modes where I like just put on some music and I like look at the like I listen to the lyrics and I just like vibe out to that for a long time.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

Read the liner notes and do I do.

SPEAKER_04 1:25

I look up who wrote this, who produced this, who uh what was the and then I if you sometimes you're lucky on Wikipedia you can click on the actual track too, and it has its own page, and it will break down like the idea for the song and like but what instruments were used and blah blah blah all that stuff. That's cool. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:41

Ben's a music guy if you haven't caught on.

SPEAKER_04 1:45

Um and also if you're listening to hip hop, there's a lot of like the sample breakdown, like what's what they use to sample it, like all that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:52

Do you know what I kind of been listening to like a little bit, not like in a lot, but um listening through the score of obsession a little bit, and I like kind of judged it harshly after seeing the movie. But going back and listening to it, I'm like, actually, it's like I think I judged it too harshly at first. I think it's better than I thought.

SPEAKER_04 2:10

Yeah. I didn't think it was bad, I just thought it was like not the right like on its own.

SPEAKER_01 2:16

I feel like there's weird moments where it was like the score did not fit what was happening or like help convey specific emotions.

SPEAKER_04 2:23

Yeah. Like I and and mostly more it was about like the actual songs that they were choosing to play at certain times. Where it's like, but the it's just like one long take. So it's like this I don't know. I I I don't want to get into the nuances in my criticism on that. I mean, I love the movie. We we all love the movie. So anyway, we're not here to talk about this shit. We you know what, we gotta start like talking like at the beginning. I I and I'm a failure because I never do this. Is like hey, we're slasher bash, and we're here to talk about what'd you say?

SPEAKER_01 2:57

I said thank you for admitting your faults.

SPEAKER_04 2:59

Yeah, of course. That's all I do. Um Welcome to Slasher Bass, and we're here to talk about send help. Or something like that. I don't know. We're figuring it out.

SPEAKER_01 3:09

I like that.

SPEAKER_04 3:10

Yeah, apparently we sound professional, but yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:15

Thanks for the shout-out, Liza.

SPEAKER_01 3:17

Bowling!

SPEAKER_04 3:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:19

Uh speaking of bowling, um, this guy that I both bartend with and bowl with, um I found out is like related to Mel Brooks, and I was like, shut the fuck up.

SPEAKER_04 3:32

Wow. I thought that was cool. Sometimes I'm like, wow, Mel Brooks is still alive. That guy's fucking old. He's seen like every era of Hollywood.

SPEAKER_01 3:42

And that's how I figured out he shortened his name. His actual name was Brookman.

SPEAKER_04 3:46

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 3:47

Uh and he shortened it to Brooks.

SPEAKER_04 3:50

Well, that's easier to say.

SPEAKER_01 3:51

It is.

SPEAKER_04 3:52

Mel Brooks man.

SPEAKER_01 3:55

Um but we're here for send help. Thank you. Send us help. We need help getting into this episode.

SPEAKER_04 4:03

This is gonna be a weird one because I my focus is everywhere right now. But this is send help. Also this movie, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

Well, oh yeah, do your rundown and then I'll and then I'll tell you what I was gonna tell you. Give your notes.

SPEAKER_04 4:14

This movie is directed by Sam Ramey and written by Mark Swift and Damian Shannon, who now, since we delayed this recording, I can't remember a note. I was like, I'll remember that. And then I forgot it, but they wrote something else of note. Hang on. I need like the Jeopardy music playing right now. Ah, yes, Freddie versus Jason.

SPEAKER_01 4:40

They wrote Freddie vs. Jason.

SPEAKER_04 4:42

Yup.

SPEAKER_01 4:42

That's hilarious. Yeah. I also like that you called it something of note. It is.

SPEAKER_04 4:49

We gotta review that movie at some point.

SPEAKER_01 4:51

I'm down.

SPEAKER_04 4:52

Um the budget for this movie, 40 million, which is different than last week's movie of 750,000.

SPEAKER_01 5:00

That wow. And it may It just goes to show that no matter how much money you have, you can spend a lot of money on a fine or not good movie and make a really good movie for nothing. Like it Yeah. Obsession needs to wake the fucking world up about how to make movies.

SPEAKER_04 5:17

Yeah, but I yes, but I think that with the higher price tag comes with like to in my opinion, more interesting camera work. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 5:30

I feel like half the time we've got to be a good one.

SPEAKER_04 5:32

Obsession is just a static camera just on a tripod for most of the movie. Whereas you got like Raimi fucking moving the camera like crazy in all these dope ass ways. And I'd rather see that.

SPEAKER_01 5:44

The CGI was so bad.

SPEAKER_04 5:46

The the pig was bad.

SPEAKER_01 5:47

Yeah, the pig was horrible. The pig was really bad. Like literally for a minute there, I was like, are we watching Anaconda?

SPEAKER_04 5:52

Well, hang on, we gotta get through. We're just jumping away ahead. Uh budget $40 million, made $94 at the box office.

SPEAKER_01 5:59

So not too bad. Made $94? $94. $34 million.

SPEAKER_04 6:06

I told you it's gonna be a weird one. Um I guess that's all I wrote. Metacritic score is $75. Is that higher than Blackphone? Uh it's around the same.

SPEAKER_02 6:17

Huh.

SPEAKER_04 6:18

It's around the same. So. All right. Send help. What overall thoughts before we jump into spoilers? What are your overall opinion of this movie?

SPEAKER_01 6:29

I don't know. I watched that and I was like, I don't know how to feel about what I just watched. It was entertaining as shit. I've never seen Rachel McAdams in a role like that before, which I enjoyed.

SPEAKER_04 6:42

She crushed it, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:43

Um, I mean, it had it had great moments. It had very Sam Raimi moments.

SPEAKER_04 6:49

Like it was so Dude, you are this is so funny. This is the reaction people have that are not like in love with Sam Raimi at every Sam Raimi movie. It's like some of this is weird. Like, some of this is like jarring and awkward, right?

SPEAKER_01 7:03

Well, when she means I had forgotten this, and tell me if I'm remembering this correctly now. But when Rachel McAdams is like vomiting on his face, I knew you were gonna bring this up. I was like, wait, did Joey bring this movie up when we were talking to him? And he was like, I made a vomit horror. He brought it up, right? And that's how we decided to do this. I don't remember. I literally think that's how it happened, and I think that got edited out of the episode, but I'm pretty sure when he started telling us that Woozy was a vomit horror, he was like, Well, have you seen Send Help?

SPEAKER_04 7:30

No, I said, I said, like, I okay, I remember now. I was like, Do you mean like it's a vomit horror like Sam Raimi vomit horror? And then he was like, kind of. That's what that's what that happened in that. I remember now.

SPEAKER_01 7:41

Okay, well, Joey, shout out again. You subliminally put Send Help in our minds to do this week.

SPEAKER_04 7:47

Yeah. Um, so you have mixed feelings. This is this is so this is like typical Sam Raimi reaction, I feel like.

SPEAKER_01 7:53

I I really enjoyed it. It felt to me like um misery combined with what was that movie that came out? It was like an A24 movie or something that came out like two or three years ago where they're on the boat and the boat crashes and it's like a bunch of like Triangle of Sadness? Yes, it reminded me of misery and triangle of sadness combined together. Um and it I don't know if I would call it a horror film, to be completely honest.

SPEAKER_04 8:23

Like, okay. Have you seen so let me ask you I have a bunch of questions before I even dive into my opinion. Have you do you have you seen Sam Raimi movies before? Yes, I've seen Evil Dead.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

I fucking hate his Spider-Man movies, but I don't know that that's his fault. Everybody loves those movies. I hate Toby McGuire.

SPEAKER_04 8:38

I feel like let's not get into Spider-Man because that'll just let him furry. So Sam Raimi specifically. I can't judge. I've seen Evil Dead, but I've seen it too.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

Yes, and not the second movie.

SPEAKER_04 8:49

Okay. So you haven't really seen a Sam Raimi movie.

SPEAKER_01 8:53

I have definitely seen like The Devil Inside Me. I saw that.

SPEAKER_04 8:56

Drag Me to Hell, you mean or yes.

SPEAKER_01 8:58

What the fuck is The Devil Inside Me? It's been a long fucking day.

SPEAKER_04 9:02

Yeah, we I told you it's gonna be a weird one. It's all good. So you're so okay. I think that's a good Drag Me to Hell is pretty solid. That I feel like that is on par with this movie in a lot of ways. Um, I will say I really like this movie. It's funny when you're criticizing a movie like this for me, where it's like Sam Raimi is one of my favorite filmmakers of all time. Like, I love Sam Raimi.

SPEAKER_00 9:22

Um which of his films makes you love him first?

SPEAKER_04 9:25

I hang on. Okay, I tend to uh critique his movies based on his other movies in a way. Does that make sense? I think there's notable directors that you do that with, like Quentin Tarantino. You don't critique those against other movies other than the movies.

SPEAKER_01 9:38

Yeah, because nobody makes movies like him.

SPEAKER_04 9:40

He you you yeah, exactly. You critique his movies based on his other movies. Um to me, this is like looking at just Sam Raimi and not other horror movies, this would be like a solid B for me, this movie. I think it's super entertaining, it's funny, it's gross, it's a Sam Raimi movie to its soul and core. And I think your reaction to it is exactly what I mean to that. Because most people I think that are just not as into Sam Raimi have that reaction with him always. They're like, there's there's like there's like a reaction that's sort of like it's it's too it's it's Looney Tunes, sort of in a lot of ways. Like you can tell is and you should we should do Evil Dead 2 because that's one of my favorite movies.

SPEAKER_01 10:18

Well, I think we should do all the Evil Dead or a bunch of them before Evil Dead Burns comes out. I think reworking our schedule.

SPEAKER_04 10:25

Yeah, I'm down for that. But Evil Dead 2 is known as like it's a funny movie, like it's a it's Looney Tunes. It's like it's it's like if Looney Tunes made a horror movie, there's like eyeballs.

SPEAKER_01 10:35

Oh, when you say Looney Tunes, you're talking about the actual cartoon. You're not like talking like Looney Tunes the expression, you mean the cartoon.

SPEAKER_04 10:42

Yes, I mean that there is a Looney Tune aspect sort of to the way that he he depicts horror, and horror gives him the excuse to do weird gross things like vomiting like crazy. And if you remember Drag Me to Hell, there's a scene where But there's like a gypsy woman who like gets in her car and is attacking her and like throws up and stuff. It's like there's gross out, there's always a gross out moment in Sam Raymond movies, especially the horror ones, not Spider-Man.

SPEAKER_01 11:07

But it's funny because they always are they at least the ones I've seen look ridiculous, so I don't actually like get like sick. Like, I'm not like, oh my god, that's too much. Like I'm backing. I'm like, oh, what the fuck is happening? This is ridiculous. I mean, when she kept barfing on his face, I was fucking laughing.

SPEAKER_04 11:28

It was so funny. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:28

Chloe looked at me and was like, What the fuck is this? I was like, Sam Raimi directed, and she's like, Oh, got it. Okay. That's hilarious.

SPEAKER_04 11:37

That's funny that she didn't know that. I feel like that is like the reason you see this movie is because of that.

SPEAKER_01 11:42

She, it's actually funny that when I said Sam Raimi, she was like, Oh, that totally tracks. Because Chloe's not, doesn't know actors, doesn't know directors. Um, but there are like she immediately was like very familiar with like yeah, Evil Dead and like a lot of his shit. And so it's a price, like one time she was like describing a movie to somebody and she's like, you know, Caitlin Winstilts in it.

SPEAKER_04 12:06

And I was like, I don't even know who that is.

SPEAKER_01 12:08

Caitlin's let. Oh. I was like she told somebody that Glenn Close was in Scream 7. She meant Courtney Cox.

SPEAKER_04 12:20

Ah ah. So very similar actors.

SPEAKER_01 12:22

So the fact that she actually like straight up was like, Oh, Sam Raimi got it, and like clocked that reference. I was very proud of her.

SPEAKER_04 12:28

That's awesome. That's the power of Sam Raimi, you know?

SPEAKER_01 12:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 12:31

Um, so yeah, against those other movies, I would say this is a solid Sam Raimi movie, this is like a B, but against most movies that are made today. See, I have an appreciation for like this type of movie where it it's clearly intentional with the way with everything about the movie. What they're wearing, how they're acting, how it's shot, how it looks, like all of that. There's a vision here in this movie.

SPEAKER_01 12:55

Just so we're not misaligned, like I thought it was fucking ridiculous, but I thought it was good. Like the story was great, the writing was great, the way it was shot was great. Anytime something gory would happen, I was like, this is so fucking ridiculous.

SPEAKER_04 13:07

Yeah, but that's the point, right?

SPEAKER_01 13:08

It's so I hated the CGI. Like, I was like, just fucking do claymation again. That would be better than this fucking CGI boar shot we got.

SPEAKER_04 13:17

I mean, I I yeah, I mean, I I was very taken out of the movie when that CGI boar showed up. Thankfully, it's only one uh one scene in the whole movie, yeah what I mean.

SPEAKER_01 13:27

But it was distracting, it was very distracting from anotherwise.

SPEAKER_04 13:30

But then it like bleeds all over her, and then I'm like laughing again.

SPEAKER_01 13:33

Oh, it just keeps spraying in her face constantly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 13:37

Like I was imagining her filming that scene when that was happening.

SPEAKER_01 13:40

But honestly, even the CGI and the airplane crash was pretty ridiculous.

SPEAKER_04 13:43

Yeah, but that I so that airplane crash, so we're I guess full spoilers moving forward at this point.

SPEAKER_01 13:48

But I feel like if you're listening to our podcast, it's always full spoilers.

SPEAKER_04 13:52

No, I know, but I want to give people the opportunity to stop listening.

SPEAKER_01 13:54

Okay, fair.

SPEAKER_04 13:55

And go watch the movie, come back. You know what I mean? Like so, like, should I watch this movie? Let me see what their initial thoughts are. Oh, they liked it. I should go watch it and then come back.

SPEAKER_01 14:03

The boar dies.

SPEAKER_04 14:05

The boar does die, one of the boars. But the uh the plane crash scene though, I thought was like is like a that's a Raimi scene through and through.

SPEAKER_01 14:13

The way that it's shown from her perspective, the way that the camera is, like, him hanging out the window with his tie stuck, and he's like slapping the wall, and then like the fucking jump scare that was like the Jaws jump scare.

SPEAKER_04 14:27

Yeah, totally. I just yeah, I mean that's what I'm hoping for when I watch this. I sit down and watch this movie, I'm like, this is Sam Raimi. This is what I'm I if it was just a generic crash, I would have been like, man, Sam Raimi, you're playing it safe these days. You're not so you got what you're doing your thing. This is exactly what I want from him. Like, especially you brought up the vomiting scene where she's like giving him CPR and then throwing up in his face every two seconds. Like, it's fucking hilarious. Anyway, where do you want to start on this?

SPEAKER_01 14:58

Uh, let's start with the opening. Um, I'm gonna just be completely honest with you. I um was at the same time working on another project for a friend, and I was like, I have to get this shit finished tonight. So I was on the computer like doing some social media stuff for her. And so I handed Chloe my little notebook that I always take all my notes in, and I was like, I need you to write notes until I'm done with this. And she was like, Well, what do you want me to write?

SPEAKER_04 15:24

And I was like, Oh, but that's such a bummer now.

SPEAKER_01 15:26

You like you're well, like like 20 minutes into the movie, I was like, I'm I'm gonna put the camp computer down and just watch this because I was in. Um, but Chloe took my opening notes, which she was like, What do you want me to write? And I was like, you know, when we're like watching these movies together and you lean over and you're like, that's gonna come back. Oh, did you catch that? Just write those things down. She was like, Great. So immediately, shout out to my wife. Her first note was um how the opening scene was shot to make women look small, like all of the the interactions are shot with men standing over women. Um, and then her last name obviously Little.

SPEAKER_04 16:06

So I didn't even catch that. That's good. Fuck.

SPEAKER_01 16:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 16:08

I missed it.

SPEAKER_01 16:09

Well, I called her Liddell, and Chloe goes, I think it's Little.

SPEAKER_04 16:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:13

And then it was.

SPEAKER_04 16:14

Yeah. She's like in that she first of all, they they make her look like she just, you know, rolled out of bed, slept in her clothes, rolled out of bed, and went to work.

SPEAKER_01 16:21

Um But yeah, all the shots are like they did a really good job of making her look cringe. And what's funny is it's not like you know, like it was like, oh, they just like take her makeup off and put her in a frumpy sweater and slap some tuna on her face, and now we're supposed to be like on her overalls and glasses, and then we're like, oh, Rachel McAdams is like but she clearly played that element well because it's like she wasn't wearing makeup, she still was like like she was not beautified throughout this movie, but then like as soon as she gets to the island, she's like hot.

SPEAKER_04 17:00

I know, right? Reminds me of Lost. I remember like watching Lost and be like, man, they really pick the the most attractive people that just like look good, sweaty and dirty with no makeup on. Yeah, so great catches on the BNA. Like, I really like the way that they and again, that's what I'm talking about when I'm talking about filmmaking, is like all of the things they're doing to make her seem like she's being taken advantage of at work, right? Like by her peers, by men. Um obviously they're overdoing it because like then she like walks to the meeting and he's clearly saying, I the one who came up with these ideas, like some like but that I think that adds to the sort of like it's okay to be that sort of obvious and on the nose in a movie like this because we're about to be just raining on an island where that dynamic of employee boss gets like mixed up, right? Yeah, and they also do a good job of like introduct introducing her to like she has this hobby of of being into like survival design.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

So this thing I actually like I think they leaned too hard into that. Like it was like You're gonna say that a lot this episode. She likes Survivor, and I was like, okay, cool, that's great. Like, she's watched the show, so she can like Oh, but she had all those books, like, right, exactly. So that was too much for me. Like, like, yeah, it would have made sense if it was just like, oh, she really likes Survivor. So she's remembering things from the show and she's using that, but instead, she's like this like insane, extreme survivalist. And I'm like, so by coincidence, the person who's trained for this their entire life has now ended up in this situation. So that took me out of it. Like, I wish it had just been more like she's a ridiculous fan, and she's remembering little things here and there that are helping her not. Like she's like fucking gills or grills or whatever the fuck his name is.

SPEAKER_04 18:41

That would diminish, though, her sort of like the power dynamic between the two of them. Like, right? If she wasn't an expert at this shit, like I don't think that he would feel like he needs to rely on her ever, right? Like, there's a there's a there's a pyramid dynamic that switches when they're on the island where like now he he there's even a montage where he's trying to survive on it. Yeah, but then remember he there's a whole montage where he's trying to do stuff on his own and he just he can't do it, and then he comes back and he's like, please help me. Like, yeah, when he eats that fucking bug. Yeah, yeah. Which uh it looks like he really did that. Good for him, man. Like so gross. He really ate that bug, like that's commitment right there. Um do you know what I mean? Like, I get what you're saying, but again, it's Raimi, like these things are played up because then it's it's the yeah, that's the payoff later, where it's like if it was if they both were kind of like sort of clueless on the island, then there wouldn't be that need of reliance on her on her.

SPEAKER_01 19:32

I get what you're saying, because it's like the thing is like everything was the most ridiculous version of what it could be. The douche in the office was the biggest douche he could be. Exactly. I mean, there's such cliches. Her extremism with survivalist shit is like, you know, like everything goes to that extreme to make like his ridiculous scenario what he wants it to be.

SPEAKER_04 19:51

Yeah, there's sort of there's no subtleness here. It's like we need to make this guy the biggest. And there's even moments in the movie throughout where you're kind of like, maybe this time, maybe like do you know what I mean? Like, maybe he's going to like have some sort of like I was wrong to treat you like this moment that just never comes, right?

SPEAKER_01 20:08

Like that actually, it was so funny because so like I kept being like, are they gonna bone or are they just going to like keep fucking each other over?

SPEAKER_04 20:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:26

And I love I actually like love that they never changed who they were.

SPEAKER_04 20:34

I yeah, I think that when they hint at her, sort of like I mean, clearly he's a handsome guy. Like, there's no I don't think there's any denying that if you're stuck on a uh remote island with somebody, you know, and they're as as attractive as that person is, like, you're gonna like some level attraction.

SPEAKER_01 20:58

And then they did it.

SPEAKER_04 20:59

And I was like Well, there's that show where he's like shower, he's like bathing in the ocean and she's like looking at him and stuff.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

Like, yeah, he's got a dump.

SPEAKER_04 21:04

I think I think I think they're like playing with that because you want them to lower their guard and think, oh, maybe they'll end up being friends after all this is over. You know what I mean? Like, like I never once thought that that would be where they went, but uh, there's like a little bit of like, oh, maybe they're playing with that idea.

SPEAKER_01 21:23

Like he it's so good the way that it's like, oh, he recognizes that he needs her, he softens or softens, he relies on her, but he can't stop being the piece of shit that he is.

SPEAKER_04 21:38

Yeah, he's just the piece of shit at his core.

SPEAKER_01 21:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:41

It's it's almost unbelievable, right? Like it's almost so unbelievable that even at the very last moment where he's he's so I think that's what's interesting too. He's so good at it. He's so good at uh what you want to believe him, sort of, right? Like if you were on the island with him, you would want to be like, okay, I believe you this time. Even the last time he's been Like she's still like for a second, like maybe eventually it's over and see what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01 22:04

I was like, do they have some weird crazy love? I like I like they sell it so well. Like you believe their fucking lies, and then you're like, why did I believe their lies? They've completely shown you who they were this entire movie and never wavered from that. Yeah. Exactly.

SPEAKER_04 22:18

And then you feel stupid for like hoping.

SPEAKER_01 22:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:21

Um, do you okay? Let me ask you this. Let's let's change a little bit. Let me ask you this question. Do you think either of these characters are likable in the end?

SPEAKER_01 22:29

Yeah, I like her.

SPEAKER_04 22:31

Okay, but do you I mean I like her too, but do you think that their actions on both sides at the end by the end of this movie?

SPEAKER_01 22:39

I was actually thinking about this while we were watching it because we had just done obsession. And I was in the middle of like getting into conversations with people in our Instagram about whether or not Bear deserves empathy. And my whole thing that I was like talking about on Instagram when I was posting stuff was like, I have empathy for him because I don't think he realized the magnitude and the gravity of what he was doing. He very clearly did not realize that was gonna happen. Um but I don't think he's a good person. And then I was watching it in this, and I was like, I know that I should feel about Rachel McAdams the way that I feel about Bear. But because I'm a woman who's so fucking tired of being a woman in a man's world, I want her to win.

SPEAKER_04 23:29

Well, but take the winning aspect out of it. Like she she they could have got rescued. Who I don't know how long they were on that island. Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_01 23:36

She did she did a bear move and fucking took yeah, his yeah. But I didn't and I don't hold it against her in the same way.

SPEAKER_04 23:46

I mean, but maybe you maybe you do, or like on paper, you're saying that it's a morally wrong thing to do. Yes, I can look at it and be like, this is.

SPEAKER_01 24:03

Where it's like an obsession, like Nikki wasn't a piece of shit, and what was happening was like super fucked. But that like with this guy, and maybe that's the difference, is like I have no empathy for him. He's a piece of shit from start to finish. So, like when she's fucking him over, I'm not like boo-hoo poor you.

SPEAKER_04 24:21

Yeah, but do you believe that two wrongs make a right?

SPEAKER_01 24:24

No, but I just like when assholes get fucked over.

SPEAKER_04 24:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:29

I like karma.

SPEAKER_04 24:31

Yeah. No, I do too. I think by the end of the I I was having that discussion with myself where there was a point in the movie where I was like, at this point in the movie, she just murdered two innocent people.

SPEAKER_01 24:43

I like that when that happened, though, that she clearly was not just okay with being a murderer.

SPEAKER_04 24:50

No, I do too. I do too. But I think, you know, there's that line there now.

SPEAKER_01 24:57

Now it's But Sam Raimi also makes it so ridiculous that you can actually suspend your disbelief and and still root for her despite the things she's done.

SPEAKER_04 25:07

I don't know if I'm rooting for anyone at this point. At this point, I'm just like, I just want to know what happens at the end.

SPEAKER_01 25:11

So the last shot, yeah, uh, when she like gets in the car and is driving away from the golf tournament, she's got a ring on, and Chloe goes, Wait, was that the diamond ring? Did she shit it out and wear it? And we were round, reround, and unfortunately not. But we were like, God, that would have been such a boss fucking move if she had been wearing the diamond ring. Oh yeah. No, we it doesn't even have a diamond on it. It's just like a flock of gold. Okay. But we were like, fuck, that would have been such a boss move. She literally crapped that fucking ring out and then wore it.

SPEAKER_04 25:42

Yeah, that would have been really cool.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

But I guess it would have probably tied her then to the uh the death of Zuri? Was that her name?

SPEAKER_04 25:50

I mean, maybe. I mean, how often are you like, well, let me see that diamond ring? My friend had the exact same diamond ring on finger. But she went missing.

SPEAKER_01 25:57

Considering who it was coming from, how many people can afford a ring like that?

SPEAKER_04 26:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:03

But who knows?

SPEAKER_02 26:04

Who knows? I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 26:06

Um I forget though, is there is there any chance that that happened in her head? No, he finds her, he finds her hand in this in the in the sand. So she she clearly didn't.

SPEAKER_01 26:17

Which was hilarious, the hand just like sticking out of the sand with the ring on it.

SPEAKER_04 26:23

Exactly. Um let's just talk about, yeah. So for me, it's like at the by the end of it, I'm like, I don't know if I even care if any of them survive or make it out of the situation. Like, and I think that's what the film does. It's like showing you, like, it's giving you sympathy for one person, then sort of challenging your sympathy for that person, and then it just becomes a sort of movie of just like I mean, it's almost a cautionary tale, right?

SPEAKER_01 26:50

Oh, it's just villain against villain who's we're just gonna find out who wins or if they're gonna like off each other.

SPEAKER_04 26:56

Right, right. And there's a fight where they're rolling around, like pulling each other's hair out and stuff. That's pretty funny.

SPEAKER_01 27:01

That was so gross when the chunk of her fucking skin came with it. Yeah. That was the one thing that actually grossed me out, and then the gouging her eye.

SPEAKER_04 27:11

Oh, yes, that was good CGI, or whatever they did there. I'm assuming it was CGI.

SPEAKER_01 27:16

Once she had the eye gouged and like the blood and all this shit, she looked fucking psychotic. Like she looked insane and fucking sold it, and I was like, damn.

SPEAKER_04 27:31

Yeah. There was there was also like this sort of when they get to the island, he's obviously the one that survived with her off this plane crash. I love how she's like, that had to be you, of course. So it's you that's fucking survived or whatever. There's like this sort of weird, like she's it's almost reflective in the way that she's treated at the office, right? In the office, she's a woman and she's having to coddle all these men who are in charge by doing all the hard work and then not getting credit for it, right? Like now she's doing that on the island where she's you know dressing his wounds and feeding him and coddling him, like in the exact same way. And after, and then for him to have like the goal after all that to be like, like, fuck you, I don't need your help. Get off me. Like, stop doing that. Like, you know what I mean? Like, it's such a perfect reflection of like here we are in the real world where she's being treated this way, and now we're on this island, and she's still being treated this way by this guy, but then like the fear of him starting to slowly realize like he's fucked without her, and there's a power dynamic change. I forget what happened, but she she says to him, like, we're not in the real world anymore. Oh, she disappears for like two years.

SPEAKER_01 28:33

Yeah, she just like leaves him for 24 hours and he's yeah, he's like, Good, she's like, good luck. That was like such a great character development moment for him because I was like, Okay, I get that his leg is injured, but she's also said good news, it's not broken. And that bitch didn't even try to crawl or anything, he just fucking laid there for a fucking day, just I guess gonna just die because somebody wasn't taking care of him.

SPEAKER_04 28:58

Yeah, yeah, fucking bitch. Exactly. I gotta say though, I mean, Riz Rachel McLeod Adams was amazing in this movie, but he was too. Yeah, they both were brilliant. So good. And I kind of wish like hopefully he becomes like a bigger star, like based on this movie. Like I haven't really seen anything else he's in, but he was really good in this. Um but anyway, so that dynamics happen. Then they have this like sort of like moment where he's realizing he he needs her, right? And you as an audience member, you start to sort of believe or hope, even though you know what the movie is, and there's no way this is gonna happen, that maybe they have like a friendship. And there are some like light moments where they're maybe enjoying each other's companies, they're going on walks together, whatever. Um and then it like at every moment this guy's trying to fucking fuck her over, too. Right.

SPEAKER_00 29:45

But then she knows it too, though, and she's so well she eats the poison, which I knew was happening.

SPEAKER_04 29:50

I knew that that was gonna be the poison on the fucking.

SPEAKER_01 29:53

I love though that she always calculates his moves, that she never questions if he's still who he is.

SPEAKER_04 30:02

Yeah, 100%. I also just love when he like after he poisons her, then he's like, yes, he like runs and gets his like his raft, his shitty ass raft and tries to make it off the thing. Like, couldn't you just do that in the middle of the night? Why'd you have to poison her?

SPEAKER_01 30:15

I know. Why did you have to attempt to like kill her and escape without her, like yeah, but isn't so it I think one of the things that's most interesting is that despite how he clearly is never gonna change as a person, she's doing everything she can to keep him alive. And I'm like, is that because like, okay, you're living your dream, your survivor dream, but are you just like don't want to be alone? Like you'll do whatever to keep this like horrible fucking person alive so you have company in your little Maybe because like I don't believe that she like actually like falls in love with him or anything like that, even though at the end when she's like, Well, I uh I love you too, or whatever, like I don't I don't believe that.

SPEAKER_04 30:52

I think she just doesn't be stuck on an island with someone, I mean Yeah, you're gonna make it work with whoever's there, I guess, right?

SPEAKER_01 31:01

I don't know. Well, I thought he was gonna have like a like Stockholm syndrome thing.

SPEAKER_04 31:06

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:07

And that possibly was not the case.

SPEAKER_04 31:10

No, not at all. I mean, he he makes it seem that way. I mean, there's moments where he's like and I remember watching the movie being like, Again, it's all the it's funny, the stuff on the island to me is still very much like an office dynamic. It's still like the sort of like manipulation and the power struggle of like being in a corporate office with the two of them on the island. Like, I'm never once believing a hundred percent that he's being genuine. Every time he's being nice to her, I'm like, Are you are you up to something here? Like, what's going on?

SPEAKER_01 31:37

But I'm never fully believing her either. Like, yeah, as soon as she I can't remember what she said, but it was before she got drunk and said what happened. But I was like, Did she kill her husband? And then she tells the story later. And then she literally follows it up with like, I don't think we should ever leave here, and then like passes out or whatever and wakes up like hung over the next day on the beach. But what I totally thought was gonna happen was that once she was all fucked up and passed out, that he was gonna go to the place where she never told him to go. And see, there was like boats and help and like Yeah. I thought for sure that was gonna happen. I was surprised that never did.

SPEAKER_04 32:15

Yeah. Well, I mean, he does he does discover it just later in the movie.

SPEAKER_01 32:19

Yeah, but I thought it was like he was gonna like get her real fucked up then that night so that he could like venture off and like discover what she was hiding from him.

SPEAKER_04 32:26

But she he didn't even know about the alcohol. Remember, she was the one who was like, Do you want to get drunk? Like it was all her idea, sort of. Yeah, that was a fun scene. Well, that's that's like one of those moments where you're like, oh, maybe maybe they'll be friends after this.

SPEAKER_01 32:36

Watching, I watched a lot of their um media tour, what is it called? Is it a media tour? Yeah, yeah. And they have a great dynamic with each other. Um it just seemed it was very fun, like watching their interviews and stuff. And so then watching this, like it was like you kind of feel like you can tell that despite like whatever like horrible things they're playing and whatever ridiculous things are going on, that they seem like they are actually enjoying doing this together.

SPEAKER_04 33:10

Like, like there's still chemistry, even though the chemistry is supposed to be like we hate each other the whole time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:15

Like I like I was watching and I was like, I bet they actually had like a lot of fun filming this ridiculous fucking bullshit.

SPEAKER_04 33:20

Oh, I bet you it was a blast to make this fucking movie. So it's because it's like it's a small, like there's no one else really in this movie. I mean, at the beginning, maybe, but like it's just the two of them the whole time.

SPEAKER_01 33:28

Which is funny because sometimes when you only have like two people for like the vast majority of a movie, it can get so boring so fast. Yeah. Or just like that, it just seems like there are like fillers that just don't need to be there. And this I was like never bored.

SPEAKER_04 33:42

Yeah, I agree. I think the movie it's like it it's like constantly giving you something to be interested in. Like it's it is a it is a like again. I I gave it a solid B next to other Sam Rammy movies in this, but like that's not a negative. Like this movie is like worth watching. Like, this is a fun movie. Like, you're gonna sit down. I would even watch this movie again, you know?

SPEAKER_01 34:00

But I don't think it's a horror film. I think it is uh a psychological thriller about manipulation.

SPEAKER_04 34:04

Sure. But that's I mean, that's a fine line of I think what horror is. Like, yeah, there's plenty of horror, like Jennifer Body's a horror movie, but it's like you know, sort of.

SPEAKER_01 34:14

There's like demonic possession in that.

SPEAKER_04 34:16

Yeah, but there's like they're like gouging each other's eyes out and poisoning each other. Yeah, I guess I guess I see what you're what you're saying, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:21

Like there's no supernatural or like serial killer or like horrific element. There's horrific circumstantial survival film where two people are pieces of shit to each other. Yeah. And it gets violent.

SPEAKER_04 34:35

But you put Sam Raimi in there, and now you have like this crazy blood and this vomit every two seconds, and like people's getting their eyes gouged out or whatever.

SPEAKER_01 34:43

Yeah, that was disgusting. So gross.

SPEAKER_04 34:47

I was gonna say something earlier when you were talking because you've reminded me of something. Oh, it's gone.

SPEAKER_01 34:51

Did it have to do with the whole like, how far are you willing to go for me shit?

SPEAKER_04 34:57

What do you mean?

SPEAKER_01 34:59

Like how he she saw him saying that to that chick in the interview, and then on the island repeated it back to him, and he like starts pulling his pants down, and she's like, I'm kidding, I'm not like you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 35:11

No, that wasn't it, but I I I totally missed that's what he was doing in the interview.

SPEAKER_00 35:15

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 35:17

Where should we where should we pick up?

SPEAKER_00 35:19

Let's see what I got on my notes. Oh yeah, I have notes, I forgot.

SPEAKER_01 35:24

Oh, one note I have. Um I I really liked the like time passing scroll of the shots of him when he's just like waiting and how it's just like a swipe, a swipe, yeah, swipe. Typically, like there are some times when like I'm watching and I'm like, what is with all the fucking like final cut pro effects from 15 years ago? Yeah, and I think a swipe feels like that, but I actually didn't mind it in this.

SPEAKER_04 35:55

Yeah, I have a uh note here that says, even the bird rejects her. There's a moment at the very beginning where she's like trying to like lady in tramp with the bird or something, right? And the bird's like, nah, I ain't doing it with you. And I'm like, even the bird rejects her.

SPEAKER_01 36:12

The tuna was gross, man. The tuna on the face.

SPEAKER_04 36:15

Yeah, but that's but that's what he does. Like, that's you're supposed to be grossed out. Yeah. Because you're supposed to, at this moment, I think you're supposed to be like, if you were the new boss and you walked in and someone was talking to you that you don't know, who's an employee who has a tuna all over their face, how are you gonna feel about that? You know what I mean? You're gonna be like, ugh. I don't have much more to say. Which is what?

SPEAKER_01 36:36

So we know that she's at some point seen a boat come and she's could wave it down and get them help and get them off the island. But that's all we know. And then when it actually comes to the climax, we find out the camera pans and there's some fucking billionaire's house. Like Chloe and I looked at each other and we were like, Shut the fuck up.

SPEAKER_00 36:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:58

And then she's like, you know, genius. So she's like, Oh yeah, I immediately hacked security and shut it down, and then just like comes back with one knife, but like it's not like high-tech security, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_04 37:09

Like, no, but they allude to this idea because when she says to him, Let's go for a walk, and then she's like, Do you see that area over there? Don't go over there. You're assuming it's because I thought at the time, oh, maybe a lot of boats are going by over there.

SPEAKER_01 37:20

That's what I thought too.

SPEAKER_04 37:21

Yeah, but it turns out there's an actual house over there, and she is like so in love with being in this her dream, right? And she's being a survivalist on this island with her boss that she gets the boss around or whatever, um, that she's like trying to hide that from him. And yeah, I agree. I love that moment. I love the moment too because there's so much subtext happening in this movie. Like, for as much as she loves being a survivalist, like the first thing she does is like open the fridge and there's like like cake in there and shit. She's just like, ah, yes, amenities, like, this is amazing. Like, what a luxury to have. And you gotta wonder how often did she go down there? Because there's that one point where he's like, Where have you been? And she's like, Oh, I was on a walk.

SPEAKER_01 37:58

I know. Well, there was one point before we knew what was there, and she came back in clothes. Like, why does she look like she took a shower? Yes. I was like, I guess she walked into the ocean and washed her blood off. She took an actual show.

SPEAKER_04 38:10

Yeah, she's using the laundry machine and stuff. Totally. Yeah, exactly. Like, I think that's once that reveal happens, you're kind of like, She's full of shit. Like, no wonder she wants to live here forever because, like, it's really not that hard. There's a fucking house over there that's the shower things go.

SPEAKER_00 38:24

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 38:26

And also having like a billionaire's house be there is sort of it was funny though, at one point when she came walking down the beach and I was like, What is that bathing suit? And Chloe was like, That's her underwear. I was like, ah, that's why it's pulled up so high.

SPEAKER_04 38:39

Yeah. Um, yeah, I like that reveal a lot. Because you don't get it until until he's there, right? Yeah. Then there's a flashback. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 38:49

I because then she's also like, Where'd you where'd you get that knife? And he's like, Oh, she's like, Oh, it just washed up on sure.

SPEAKER_01 38:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 38:55

Do you ever have sympathy for this dude at any point in this movie?

SPEAKER_01 39:00

Um, for a minute, for a brief, yes.

SPEAKER_04 39:04

For a very brief minute, I would agree with that. When he's talking about his dad.

SPEAKER_01 39:07

Yeah, his dad's never there, and his mom was like cruel, and you know, for a minute, yes. And then um and then he immediately shows that he's just full of shit, and then never again. Do you think what he was saying, well, do you think that was a lie about his parents, or do you think No, I don't, but I just think he is so who he is. And it's funny because then it's like when he finds his fiance and like is actually like acting devastated. I don't feel sorry for him at all. I feel sorry for her. I feel sorry for the guide that brought her there, but I don't feel bad for him one bit in that moment.

SPEAKER_04 39:48

Yeah. I think the moment that I start to get sympathy for him too is is sort of like there it becomes a moment in the movie where I feel like he's accepted that they're just stuck there forever and he's sort of like okay with that, and they're starting to not be like super friendly, but just be okay. And it's not until he goes like that that moment where now right when they're finally maybe they'll they'll be friends or whatever, he finds Zurich kills hand. I think it's after that. He she kills his fiance and stuff, and then you know like that's a smoking gun, like eventually he's gonna find out about that somehow and it'll ruin this whole thing. Um because I do think like at that like right before that moment, like right and it's so perfect for the the writers or whoever thought of this, like that's the perfect moment to put that scene, right? Because now right when you're like, Oh, maybe they'll be friends after all this, he finds that and it's uh it's all ruined.

SPEAKER_01 40:44

Yeah, I mean that that storm scene where they get it in the cave and he's like, Come here, body heat, right? Like you do for a minute go oh they're gonna bow.

SPEAKER_04 40:56

Yeah, but that doesn't mean anything.

SPEAKER_01 40:57

No, but it's like but there's there's a softness there. They soften. He softens. I don't think she's it so here's what's funny is like she steps into her power on this island, but is it believable that like she could be pushed around so much in the office, but be so is it just because she knows he needs her that she can just completely change her personality like that?

SPEAKER_04 41:27

Well, in an office you have to be beholden to the person who has power over your job. And I think that's what the movie's playing with. Like when you're in the office, it's sort of a a mini society office life. Like there's different rules in the office. There's you have to be like nice to the people above you. It's sort of like fascism in a way. You know what I mean? Like there's a weirdness.

SPEAKER_01 41:49

Bootlicking at its finest.

SPEAKER_04 41:50

It seriously, though, right? And like you have to put up with people in power, sort of like abusing it and using it to make their lives easier. I do think what the film does, it's sort of like there's the fun element of like, haha, now your power is gone and we're equals, right? Now you can't boss me around. I can we have to treat each other like human beings, like equal human beings, right? But then this film goes one step farther, and I think it it it literally is just the reversal. And I think they're on paper, and yes, I I agree, like it's fun to watch this guy suffer or whatever, but if you're writing this down on paper and really thinking about it, you realize like what she's doing is the exact same thing that he's doing. He she is threatening him with uh she holds the power. Same sort of dynamics. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 42:34

One of the most interesting pieces of relationship advice I was ever given by somebody, he said, um the power dynamics in a relationship are always changing. And it is your job, if you want a healthy relationship, to not abuse the power when you hold it. And I was like, I don't believe that. Like the relationship I was in at the time, like I felt like I was like the weaker party in the relationship. Yeah but I didn't realize how much that advice would actually like hold true, where like you would realize that like under different circumstances, who has the power in the relationship does always shift. So are you abusing it or are you not in the moment when you hold the power? And these are clearly like you just pointed out to people who like whoever's got the power is abusing it.

SPEAKER_04 43:22

And it you know, it's it's funny because like this is why I don't I'm done with society, guys. I'm done with humanity. Like, I don't even be part of this anymore because of this exact bullshit. Like, is there any time that anyone is granted power where they don't at some point, even in like microwaves, microwaves? Microwaves. Like even if it's a very small abuse of that power, whether it's like you're laughing at jokes, maybe you you don't really want to laugh at. You know what I mean? Like, does anyone not abuse it to some extent? And that's why I hate it so much. Like, I I well, this isn't a therapy session, but let's go.

SPEAKER_00 43:59

I'm in.

SPEAKER_04 44:00

I don't want to be in a relationship where that is a thing. I don't want to be doing it. I don't want to be abusing the power. And I don't want to be having to be beholden to someone else's abuse of that power. Yeah. Because then what's genuine? Like, what's the point? Well, I don't think that's any situation. I I mean, I I have to hope so.

SPEAKER_01 44:17

I think it's a lot of relationships. Yeah. Um. But I I think as soon as you get in a relationship. I mean, before my wife, like I I was never in a healthy relationship in my entire fucking life.

SPEAKER_04 44:32

But are relationships ever healthy, really? Until you make an active decision to make sure that you are purely enough.

SPEAKER_01 44:38

That's the thing. Nothing is ever people are imperfect. Like nothing, and and we're then two different people trying to make our different ideals work together. So no, it's never going to be perfect. So it's either like, am I with somebody who respects me enough to like commit to working through those differences? Or am I with somebody who's going to stomp all over me because of it?

SPEAKER_04 45:00

Yeah, it's like mutual respect. Yeah. That's what this movie does not have. There's never a moment where any one of these characters have mutual respect for each other. It's always one person enjoying the power that they have, or not realizing they even have it. Yeah. Over somebody else, whether it's Rachel McAdams or Dylan Dylan.

SPEAKER_01 45:16

As soon as the power shifts, she's so eager to grab it. There's like I think at first she's not.

SPEAKER_04 45:20

I think at first she's like, I fixed your leg. Like maybe she's thinking, like, I'll get a raise now. I don't know. But she's like, I I take that as like she's trying to survive in this shitty situation. She just saved this guy's life. And then he sort of makes it about, I'm still your boss.

SPEAKER_01 45:34

Oh yeah. As soon as he I actually I found that so shocking, but I found it such a great character moment when he literally is like clearly fucking helpless, helpless, and still is like, Well, you're fucking fired. And she's like, Are you kidding me? He's such a loser.

SPEAKER_04 45:54

Yeah. I think, but I think that's the point. I think it's such a reflection of like how a lot of people operate. A lot of privileged people that are entitled to things will always feel that way. There's never going to be a moment where now we're getting deep on this. Bless you.

SPEAKER_01 46:09

I mean, I literally looked at Chloe and I was like, he's so Don Jr.

SPEAKER_04 46:13

Yeah, totally. Like, but I think that's that's the point is like these privileged people, they're never going to judge or make decisions based on, you know, merit.

SPEAKER_01 46:24

It's always funny to me when people use like the term like they're out of touch with reality. Um like that's always like made me laugh ever so like my we'll not drop names, but you know, my first job in LA was a celebrity nanny, and constantly it was like they're so out of touch with reality, they're so out of touch with reality. But it's like, no, they just have a very different reality than I do.

SPEAKER_04 46:46

Yeah. Well, okay, that's true. But when I say they're out of touch with reality, I I say that as like you have an entitlement that's not tangible. Like I see him on this island, he still thinks he's like he's better than her. He he has a he is her boss, he he has more money, he had like like even in a situation where like that's gone, he still has that entitlement ingrained in him. And I think the movie is somewhat asking, like, can someone like that ever change? You know, change or realize what that is, even.

SPEAKER_01 47:22

I, you know, and I love that about this movie because I think any other movie I've ever seen that's like this is like, oh, like circumstantial dynamics, like we soften and we learn to like accept each other. And I love that this one's like, nope, like overboard. Piece of shit's always a piece of shit.

SPEAKER_04 47:41

Yeah. Well, I don't think that's what it's saying either.

SPEAKER_01 47:43

I just think like I think it is.

SPEAKER_04 47:44

In this movie, yes, he's he never changes, and I think that's the point, right? Because it's a joke. It's a joke, right? It's like even when he's like in a life and death situation where she's saving him in any corner, like at every moment, he's still going to like stab her in the back and then fuck himself, right? Because like it's like he can't survive on his own.

SPEAKER_01 48:02

It's so depressing because it's so accurate to what we're watching. Like, that's what I'm saying. Like, right now, where we're like exactly somebody will actually like eat themselves alive and not have any awareness about it.

SPEAKER_04 48:17

Mm-hmm. It's the same thing with like climate change or whatever. It's like we're sitting here destroying the planet, and eventually we won't be able to breathe. That's an exaggeration, obviously.

SPEAKER_00 48:26

But is it though?

SPEAKER_04 48:28

We're all gonna be like, How could this have happened?

SPEAKER_01 48:30

I'm hoping for alien invasions, man. Come get us.

SPEAKER_04 48:34

Anyway, yeah, I think that's what I think that's what the movie's talking about, you know.

SPEAKER_01 48:38

His storyline is the reverse of the saying lipstick on a pig, or like you can put lipstick on a turd and it's still a piece of shit. Like, yeah, but he's like the opposite because it's not like they're putting lipstick on it, it's the opposite where they're like stripping him down to like the core of what it is to be a human, but he still can't stop being a piece of shit.

SPEAKER_04 48:59

That's a fucking brilliant take.

SPEAKER_01 49:01

It took a long time for me to understand what you were talking about.

SPEAKER_04 49:04

But we got that is awesome. I love that. You're right. They what once because then it's just who you are. Maybe that's the point, right? Like at this point, these two people are existing, and now he's been stripped to who to all he has now is who he actually is on the inside, and it's terrible. Yeah, it's a terrible person, yeah. Yeah, yeah. What happens at the end? Does he die?

SPEAKER_01 49:28

Yeah, she hits him in the head with the golf club. He like confesses he like acts like he loves her, and then she sees the missing gold horn from the bull statue. That's right. I remember that part, and she just fucking is like didn't have a gun. I loved that, loved that callback though. Well, loved that the gun wasn't loaded. Love the callback where he like called her position the wrong thing, and she was like, Yes, strategy and planning or whatever, and then that callback where she's like strategy and planning, and then just beats the shit out of him with a golf club. Yeah, it was hilarious though, when he's like fake confessing his love and he's like, I love you so much.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

Sorry, I gouged the shit out of your eye. They were just laughing. That was fucking hilarious.

SPEAKER_04 50:12

Yeah, yeah. I do love the whole end. I love how the end took place in like this really nice, fancy mansion on a on a secluded island.

SPEAKER_01 50:20

The golf swing carry through into her like golf tournament.

SPEAKER_04 50:23

Like yes, and like golf is such a rich person sport. Well, and that's what he was like.

SPEAKER_01 50:27

I need somebody who plays golf, remember? Like it was all callbacks at the end.

SPEAKER_04 50:31

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 50:32

He was like, He got a big one.

SPEAKER_04 50:33

I love her like drive off in the distance. It's kind of like Gone Girl, sort of, but she uh she drives off the distance.

SPEAKER_01 50:38

But a horrible CGI bridge. The CGI was it? I didn't notice that. And really, like, way to miss that boss move, man. Like, have her shit that ring out and wear it.

SPEAKER_04 50:48

Yeah, that that would have been cool. Maybe they talked about that and then decided for whatever reason not to do it that way. I don't know. Yeah. Kind of forgot she swallowed that ring. That was anyway. Final thoughts. I got nothing else on this movie. I don't know. This we're going long.

SPEAKER_01 51:03

Oh, as soon as it finished, I was like, what what did I just watch? Like, like what the fuck? That was ridiculous. But like, but like when I like sit down and think about it and talk about it, I'm like, well written, well acted, well shot. Ridiculous? Yes, very much fun, yes. I enjoyed it. So, because it sounded like you, yeah, like when we started this, it sounded like you didn't like the movie, and now you're saying I I didn't want to like start and be like, I didn't like this movie, but I like literally watched it and was like, What the fuck did I just watch?

SPEAKER_04 51:32

Yeah. But that's but you know how many Raimi movies I've watched, people where they say that exact thing afterwards, they're always like, even Spider-Man. People are like, what the fuck was that?

SPEAKER_01 51:41

Like it's so only Spider-Man 3 when Venom version of Toby Maguire's doing that fucking church thing, dance in black.

SPEAKER_04 51:53

That's Toby Maguire.

SPEAKER_01 51:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 51:55

Oh, I thought you said Topher Grace. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_01 51:57

I said Venom, and then I said Toby Magra. So I I understand why I confused you.

SPEAKER_04 52:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:02

Uh but yeah, that that yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:05

That seems like as a Raimi moment though, it tracks.

SPEAKER_01 52:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:12

For that movie, not the right call.

SPEAKER_01 52:14

What's your favorite Sam Raimi film?

SPEAKER_04 52:16

Evil Dead 2.

SPEAKER_01 52:17

Evil Dead 2 is not even just Is that the one where the covers the skull, but it's kind of like eye out the side and smiling a little bit?

SPEAKER_04 52:24

Mm-hmm. Okay. Army Darkness is great too. Honestly, like I would watch I love Drag Me to Hell. I love Spider-Man 2. Um like 2 as in number two.

SPEAKER_01 52:34

Yeah, everybody loves that goddamn movie. I I literally cannot watch Toby McGuire.

SPEAKER_04 52:40

I get it, I get it. I don't have a problem with that. Um I just love Sam. I think that that's what we're missing. Even, you know, Multiverse of Madness. This individual scenes that were clearly.

SPEAKER_01 52:55

Oh yeah, he took over Multiverse of Madness after What's His Nuts dropped out and did the horror movie that we reviewed.

SPEAKER_04 53:00

Yeah, so like there's that scene where it's like.

SPEAKER_01 53:03

Who dropped out? Wait, wait, wait. Connect this for me.

SPEAKER_04 53:06

It was Dickerson, whatever his name is. Right?

SPEAKER_01 53:09

Yes, he dropped out and did Ready or Not.

SPEAKER_04 53:12

Yeah.

unknown 53:13

Right?

SPEAKER_04 53:14

I think so. I don't know if that's why he dropped out. I think it was creative differences.

SPEAKER_01 53:18

Yeah, creative differences, and then what he did instead was Yeah. Was it Ready or Wait? I don't know exactly what no, it was Black Phone. Dickerson was black phone. Yeah, black phone, you're right. There we go. Sorry. I knew it all would come together.

SPEAKER_04 53:30

Yeah, we've reviewed a lot of horror movies.

SPEAKER_01 53:32

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 53:33

But yeah, he did that. There was like a couple really classic Raimi scenes in there with like him fighting that one-eyed giant squid looking thing at the beginning, and then everyone clowns on it, but the fight where he he's fighting with himself with like the musical notes and shit. I love that shit. I was like, this is awesome. People hate that movie though.

SPEAKER_01 53:51

I like that movie. I just hate that there's no justice for Wanda. I mean, not yet. Her character makes sense, but I just like God, she's just yeah, she needs her moment.

SPEAKER_04 54:04

I think if we didn't have to wait this long for the next whatever Scarlet Witch appearance is, we would feel differently about it. But because the pandemic, because everything got fucked up, everything got delayed, what's his name got fired, like um they just they've been in such a mess for so long, like it just fucked it, basically. You know what I mean? Like she should have.

SPEAKER_01 54:27

The session made me think about uh Marvel a lot because it was just like Robin's throwing so much money at movies and has just like not nailed it yet. And like even like Thunderbolts I've heard was like really, really good, but it's just like they just like they're missing it, and so it's just like I keep thinking about it with obsession being such a low budget film that everybody is talking about because it's so fucking good.

SPEAKER_04 54:58

Yeah, like a complete side note, and like maybe I'll cut this out. I feel like right now we live in a time back in like the mid-60s where like movies were like maybe I've said this before, but like Beach Party and like like all this like really soulless commercial genre crap Gidget and Moondoggy? Yeah, whatever. I don't know. Is that real?

SPEAKER_01 55:20

Yeah, Gidget. She was it was this the little girl learning to surf, it was like Sandra J or whatever. And then Moondoggy was like the big man, the big kahuna who taught her how to surf.

SPEAKER_04 55:30

And then I kind of want to watch that.

SPEAKER_01 55:32

I loved the Gidget movies.

SPEAKER_04 55:34

Okay, but anyway, my point being like, and then like uh Bonnie and Clyde came out, and and like The Godfather came out and like everything changed. I think maybe hopefully we're exiting the Marvel superhero era of like commercial corporate slop and entering like oh, people want to see obsession and sinners and like movies that are basically.

SPEAKER_01 55:57

Do you remember like three weeks ago when I was like, I really hope that they're with everything that's happening with like we constantly talk about like dumbing everything down for the audience on their phones and attention spans, whatever. And then like Curry Barker, like obviously is like, don't do that. Your audience is smarter than you realize, and blah blah blah. And then like I said, like I really hope that there is a resurgence of independent films. And I feel like he's the start of that.

SPEAKER_04 56:25

I hope so. And I what I but I what I hope us up beyond that is that it starts with independent and then studios finance until we get like $40 million horror movies that are actually fucking good and take risks. I guess my point is just like I want I want eventually the independent movies that are really original and doing well to get decent budgets to be even a little bit bigger without like ruining their vision, just adding to it.

SPEAKER_01 56:47

Yeah. You know, like it should be a stepping stone for remembering that um good stories make good movies, not just pandering and and throw money at those instead of putting 200 million into Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 57:05

Alright, yeah. Overall, I like the movie a lot. I'll probably watch it again at some point. It's not like my favorite Raimi movie, but in a in a sea of mediocracy, it is a great time. Let's wrap this shit up. Alright.

SPEAKER_01 57:18

Alright. So, overall, enjoyable film. Sam Raimi's ridiculous. You got exactly what you wanted.

SPEAKER_04 57:26

Yep, I did. The vomit was the was the was the I was like, yep. I the whole time I was like, I wonder what Maddie thinks about this. She's gonna be like, what the fuck is this?

SPEAKER_01 57:34

I was, and then Chloe was the one who connected the Sam Raimi shit for me. She needs to guess on this pod eventually because she is like 100. 50 50% of the things that come out of my mouth are from her.

SPEAKER_04 57:49

Okay. Oh, okay. I want to see the brain trust trust together.

SPEAKER_01 57:53

Yeah. Yeah. We'll get her on eventually. We just gotta get her on when we have like a babysitter and can go record at somebody else's house or in our basement, I guess.

SPEAKER_04 58:03

Yeah. So yeah. Your final thoughts. You liked it? Solid movie. It was fun.

SPEAKER_01 58:08

Uh Rachel McAdams, I've never seen her in a role like that. It was like fun to watch her play crazy. She did it really fucking well.

SPEAKER_04 58:17

Oh, I didn't bring this up. Fun fact they made on um that Doctor Strange movie where he felt she was underutilized, and that's why he wanted to cast her in this movie.

SPEAKER_01 58:26

Oh yeah. I like that.

unknown 58:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 58:32

I did read that he like centered the production around her. Like one. Yeah. So that makes sense now. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 58:39

So anyway. Yeah, same. I like the movie a lot. I would watch it again. To me, this is like not as good as Drag Me to Hell, but in the same vein, it's just like a nice little like fun movie if you're a Sam Raimi fan. Or if you're just like a fan of thrillers. Um yeah. Good movie.

SPEAKER_01 58:59

It's like six days, seven nights if Harrison Ford and Ann Hash weren't in it and everybody was horrible. It's better than that movie.

SPEAKER_04 59:09

That movie is like the complete opposite of that. That is like they crash and then they fall in love, right? Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:15

All right. Well, on that note, go get 'em, cuz. Go get him, cuz.