TraderDane

From Side Hustles to First Prop-Firm Payout: Ryan Fuss on Trading Mindset and Playing the Game

• TraderDane • Season 1 • Episode 10

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0:00 | 34:57

This time, I welcome Ryan to the TraderDane podcast, where we discuss Ryan’s path as a 21-year-old entrepreneur who left plumbing in favour of car detailing and couch flipping businesses. Ryan became drawn to trading to obtain financial freedom. Ryan describes starting with stock investing and then prop firms, initially failing multiple evals without a clear strategy, struggling with small winners and max-loss losers, and later finding clarity through his friend's introduction to a coaching community and a VWAP-based approach. A major turning point came from reading Tom Hougaard’s The Best Loser Wins, which improved his ability to let winners run and cut losers, leading to his first payout on a 25K account after months of grinding. He now trades a 50K account, emphasizes accountability via a trading community, and advises beginners to slow down, learn market psychology, treat trading like a business, and size up only after consistency.

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SPEAKER_01

Before we get started, I want to just say that anything you hear me or any of the guests on this podcast say is to be considered for educational and entertainment purposes only. I am not a financial advisor. You should do your own research before taking financial decisions. And with that, please enjoy the podcast. All right. Um, welcome to the Trainer Dane podcast, and welcome to Ryan.

SPEAKER_02

Actually, Ryan, we haven't we haven't spoken before, we've chatted a lot on Discord, we have our own little Discord, and right, and uh yeah, um, I always feel like that's you know different when you're just kind of talking on Discord and then you actually finally you know get to see see faces and uh you know you're the person you're speaking with and always talking at the long time.

SPEAKER_01

So that's cool. It's funny because we we we've I feel like I know you, right? We've we've been chatting so much, we've been sharing all our trades for what is it, four months, five months, something like that. Yeah, four. Yeah, yeah, it's super cool. Um, but let's get to know you a little bit better. So, what what this the target of my podcast, I've done about I think I've done nine episodes now, and I've I've had your buddy Griffin on. Um the target is really to to sort of address upcoming traders like you and me, people that are in the grind, struggling to get payouts, to to gain consistency and so on. So, so what I'd really like to hear is first a bit about yourself, your backstory, and then how you found yourself your way into trading.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, um, well, I'm I'm 21. Um I guess a little bit of my backstory was, you know, out of I've always kind of been like a pretty hard worker, um, just starting, you know, work pretty early and just trying to grind my way up and just make money from the beginning. Um I guess the real start to like the entrepreneurial like journey was um kind of out of uh high school, I'd actually joined plumbing and um immediately I did kind of like my started doing my own calls pretty quickly um with when I was into the into the job. And I I think I was there for six months and just realizing like every single day I just don't enjoy um going through these jobs and just struggling to like um just enjoy what I was doing, you know, in that way. And I remember just calling my buddy up. I'm like, you know, what's what's the chance we were um we so we were doing like uh car detailing on the side, and all of a sudden we both kind of where it worked out where he was kind of not liking what he was doing with college and I wasn't liking my job, and we were like, let's just go all in and start, you know, detailing cars. And I remember we just got this whole business flowing and going, and it just ended up being uh being a cool start to like something that we realized that like, hey, we can make the same amount of money doing this, and you know, actually kind of enjoy what we're doing, have fun with it, um, kind of create our own jobs, have our have our own schedule.

SPEAKER_01

Um that last thing you mentioned there, your own schedule, is that how how much of a factor is that to you? Because it seems like if you were if you're doing plumbing and you've got your own business, I'm assuming that's gonna be long days, right? Long hours.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, oh yeah, for sure. And uh well, the I guess the main part about that was when I was um working for this company, I would there'd be situations where like I was finally done for the day, I'm my way home, and I've already worked 12 hours, and they're like, Yeah, sorry, but we got another call that you have to go to, and just realizing I have no control over that, you know, and I'm just like, oh my, you know, just not looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_01

So you weren't your you weren't your own boss in that sense, you had someone sort of taking care of and coordinating and then sending you off to a to job. To a job, right?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah. And that was kind of like emergency calls and you know, situations like that.

SPEAKER_01

And 24-7, or would you also do night shifts and sick and stuff?

SPEAKER_02

Uh well, we kind of had like different um like weekend shifts where um everyone kind of took their turn for the weekend, and then you'd basically be working seven days straight, and then you're just on call all the time. Um and then especially the weekends, it always seemed like that's when people have the most time to just you know make it an emergency. Right. But right. But yeah, of course, um just struggled with you know finding, you know, that's kind of what I wanted to, I thought that's what I wanted to do, and then realizing like just didn't enjoy it as much as I thought I would. Um, you know, back to the and then when I started the detailing, I just found you know a passion for it, and um and then you know, with with detailing ended up being um, I'm sure great.

SPEAKER_01

What is that? Can you explain that to someone? I I'm I'm oh yeah, it's just not my so what does that mean?

SPEAKER_02

It's like just uh like cleaning cars, um paint correction, um, you know, exterior and interior work with the cars to kind of you know prep them or you know refurbish them. So in that sense, it you know it's kind of something I I knew I liked cars and ended up you know just kind of actually watching YouTube videos and just figuring out how um people you know grow businesses from just um learning from other people and you know realizing that you can just you know start a business and make money on your own and you know from the bottom up, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So so you were your own boss there, that was your thing.

SPEAKER_02

Yes, yep.

SPEAKER_01

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_02

Yep, and then um I'm sure uh I think I thought the title of uh when you interviewed Griffin, but I'm also a part of the the couch flipping the couch flipping space for sure. Yeah, um, we started doing that um with a mix of detailing, yeah. And right away we realized like with the amount of time and effort we have to put into just you know buying a couch and maybe cleaning it up a bit and um just finding a market where you know you can buy it for cheap and sell it for hire with such a quick return on investment and just a good use of our time where like we're like wow, we can it started with let's bring an extra hundred bucks a week from it. So yeah, you know, now we're making an extra 500 to a thousand a week just from nice and furniture.

SPEAKER_01

So how does that actually work? How do you find customers?

SPEAKER_02

Um, Facebook Marketplace is really the main thing. Um, we tried getting into some like liquidity uh situations where like uh stores would go on um on large sales where they just needed to get rid of you know furniture, but we just found most the most um reward or bing for our buck was uh just finding people that just need to get rid of them and willing to just you know give us a deal and ended up just keeping it going. We we just crossed over um 500 couches recently. Also, also we're just yeah, we're just keep flowing with it.

SPEAKER_01

Nice. And and I guess so so you're working with Griffin on that.

SPEAKER_02

Yes, yep.

SPEAKER_01

That's that and so you you've got your own full your own business there, you're you're registered, you have a company, everything, all the all the administrative stuff as well.

SPEAKER_02

Yep, yep. And um, I guess you know that's where like I kind of figured um I like the you know entrepreneurial kind of space in the sense I like working for myself, and um that's kind of how we uh got into trading in a way too. I would say like that's kind of how I wrapped my mind around, you know, liking it. Um I mean the first starts of like figuring out I'm really you know financially invested into like the markets and just learning um about what you know market conditions are, and uh I started with just investing um into the stock market. That's I remember just listening to podcasts all day and just trying to like wrap my brain around like this, you know, financial literacy. And I found that to be you know super intriguing, and I'm sure most people um just they don't have the time or energy to like right, you know, exactly you know, dive into learning that thing, but it's it's just so important. And I just I knew that right away, so I'm glad I started early.

SPEAKER_01

So so coming from obviously, so you have time also to do trading now, now that you have your own business and and that's kind of up and running. So trading is that extra kind of both you have the time, but it also it can also now that you're you've taken payouts, it can also generate an extra an extra buck every now and then, right?

SPEAKER_02

Yes, and not to you know skip ahead, but like trading is where I want to be in the future, for sure. Right.

SPEAKER_01

That right and that that that's really cool. So and and you mentioned something, so you're you're attracted to entrepreneurship, you like having your own business. How do you see because sometimes you know when you're trading prop, you you you're kind of a customer, right? You're a prop firm customer who's who's paying for accounts. How do you see yourself turning that on its head and actually being like a business owner, treating your trading as a business? How does that work for you?

SPEAKER_02

So I like that you asked that question because for a while um I just kept hearing like you have to treat trading like a business. You you have to um it's not just about like you know, sending accounts or just the more accounts you buy, like it was just this whole like thing. I couldn't really like wrap my head around what that means, but um after being like a year of seriously trading, I start I started to figure out like there's a lot more that goes into it. Um and that's I think that's a big part that most like newer traders don't understand is if you don't treat trading like a business, it just turns into this like mental struggle where you're not seeing the um the actual um like future from it. You're just kind of seeing like, oh, I've just chased in the quick money. I just I see like oh if I buy an account from here, you know, that's how they advertise. Oh, you get the payout for this much. But it's really about the slow grind to learn your process, um, learn your strategy. And I'll say also like to play the prop firm game too is important as well. And that's the difference is like um obviously if you had a live account, you're you're kind of just risking your own capital, which I will say it's it can be definitely scary for someone just starting out, but prop firm allows you like this leverage where you almost have to play their game a little bit um in order to take payouts. So I think that's huge as well.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, exactly. It is a bit like a video game, but and I also like what you said. I mean, to me, um that the conventional sort of thinking around prop firms, it's a bit like a casino, right? You're gonna chase some some fast money, some um some some quick wins, but but you actually have to turn that whole mentality around and say, this is I'm in it for the long run. I'm building a business. What are your thoughts on so now you've taken you also? I mean, I said that before, but this time you have actually taken a payout. Now we're gonna dive into that a bit as well. Um what what do you plan on using the payouts for? Like, how are you gonna split it between more accounts, putting some savings aside, maybe start trading your own capital? What's the split that you see there? And is it like five years in the future or is it one year in the future?

SPEAKER_02

Well, I want to say that it's one year in the future where I can see myself starting to consistently take the payouts. Um, because if I kind of you know step back to when I first started um uh trading, I mean, where it first started was us just sending emails, not even knowing what's going on, just thinking that we had this friend of friend to tell us, hey, if you send this account, throw 20 cotton like 20 like minis on this account at news, you're gonna get this funded, then you just gotta do it. So that's that's where it all started. But once I started seriously looking into trading, um it just turned into like this um this grind where I would just uh I started buying evals on I think it was elite trader funding for the first set of accounts, and I couldn't even I couldn't pass one eval. I mean, I probably went through five to eight accounts. It's difficult, man. Yeah, it is for sure. But it was also difficult because I didn't have a set strategy figured out as well. Um I remember when I I started kind of in the ICT um space a little bit, looking just liquidity sweeps, um like volume analysis, and just like trying to learn the strategy just felt like it was like I remember this one program had just hour-long videos, and it just I could I just couldn't wrap my brain around what it what it was talking about.

SPEAKER_01

Was that the 2022 uh Ict mentorship, whatever it is, it's like 30 videos or something like that. It's crazy.

SPEAKER_02

No, I it might have been something similar. It was a YouTuber, um, but it just I don't know, it just didn't, you know, did it clip didn't click for me, and that you know, it does for some people. Um, and I remember Griffin was actually in um the ASFX community before I was, and he kept telling me, like, hey, you gotta try this out. Like, I know you're trying to do this thing, but I'm telling you, what I've what I've been learning is super simple. Um, the strategy works, and I started doing the you know, free three day streams um on ASFX, and immediately like it just clicked for me. Like um, these videos were quick and you know, super in like super in-depth, but also just like dumbed down too, where you can understand that the simple strategy would can work really well if you can just use your your your uh discretion a little bit, but also you know, above VWAP we're longing it, below VWAP we're shorting it. Exactly to adapt in that kind of sense. It's as simple as that behavior for sure.

SPEAKER_01

So so you actually picked up on ASFX uh from the stream via via Griffin?

SPEAKER_02

Yes, yep. He was in it probably almost a month before me, and once I switched over, I knew that's I'm like, I can figure this out now. Like I think I can start to learn. Um, and that's kind of when top one futures also, you know, got dropped. And then I just was like, you know what, I'm just gonna pay the extra money for the um instant funded accounts. So where I uh I ended up, you know, I was still in the beginning of this strategy that I'm learning. I ended up going through a decent amount of instant funded before I started like um like just keeping the capital. Like I remember just um finding like just losses after losses, and I would have, I think my biggest problem in the beginning was having um you know like 100 to 200 winners, but then my losers were always the max you know stop loss every time 300 to 400, and it would just take out all my profit for the week. And yeah, you know, just struggled in that sense. Um, but eventually I got to the point where um I had this uh it was the so I guess my payout then it was on the 25k account, and I and I remember because I was trying the 50Ks consistently and I was like, let me try this 25k, just maybe you know, seeing some different numbers can make me trade a little bit differently. Um, but all of a sudden something like clicked where um they talk about this like equity curve when you're when you're glowing as a trader, and you know, it just kind of started felt like I was just kind of staying flat, wasn't actually doing anything um productive in my trading, and all of a sudden I realized that like I'm not just dropping in an account anymore, I'm actually you know going up, back down, going up, back down, right? And I feel like that was the turning point where I'm like, okay, so I actually do see that I'm growing as as a trader, and now that I'm you know kind of staying consistent, I'm not just losing an account. Um I guess, yeah, and then I was waiting for myself to just build these accounts, and it still didn't happen until I want to say I read um The Best Loser Wins by Tom Bugard.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Um, and all of a sudden just it just changed my perspective on why I was I feel like I was just overcomplicating things and making my trading harder than it needed to be. And that's after that book, I started to see where I would I started growing in the accounts.

SPEAKER_01

So was that was that the push you needed to so the reason why you were you were having small winners was that were you cutting them early, like as soon as you're green, you cut the trade, or yes, was it was it something else? So Tom Hugart's book actually helped you mentally to stay in the trade, right?

SPEAKER_02

Because I mean, yeah, I first started just losing losing accounts, losing trades right away. Then it was like I'd have these small winners, big losses, small winners, big losses. Um and what I read from Tom Hugard's book was just like the key points of you know, let your winners run. When your trade is, I think the biggest point that I started like looking more into was when your trade is winning, it sounds so simple, but when your trade is winning, let it win. You know, don't don't try to just you know get the quick green. Um, and then the same thing for the downside when it's when it's losing, don't just hold on to hope and just hope that it you know can turn around for you because you it's telling you your trade is losing, so the probabilities immediately drop after it goes, you know, in the opposite direction. Yes. So that book was was big for me and my turning point as far as like, okay, if I kind of just let's just see how this works, where I kind of throw those thoughts in my brain while I'm trading and just mentally became way more stable in trades and was able to just allow my trades to like play out how I visioned them in the beginning.

SPEAKER_01

And I still think you also manage to cut your losers, like would you are you working with tighter stops now, or how does that work?

SPEAKER_02

Um, not necessarily tighter stops, it's more of a discretionary like pull and keep if I feel like it's going in the opposite direction. Right. Um I still like the same kind of stop structure that ASFX teaches. Yeah. Um, but there's times where like if we're you know underneath VWAP for longer than I want to be in this trade, and then I see, you know, start to kind of just sink a little bit lower, and I can save myself a couple hundred bucks by pulling it. Um, I I like to just get out and then look for, you know, possibly a re-entry if we do break back in the right direction. Um, but I found that to be like, you know, a bit of uh I found that to actually help me. Um, but I don't do it every time. It really depends on the trade, I would say.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. It depends on the structure as well. Something that I've noticed is often when you have you have a wide stop because trading ASFX, you often have that. Um I've I've tried to introduce sometimes uh stacker stops, like have an intermediate stop in in because there are there is often a bit of structure that you can use, like to partially invalidate your trade. So there's something to experiment on there. But I like the fact that you've you've turned your down sloping equity curve to a flat sloping equity curve to now an equity curve that actually generates payouts.

SPEAKER_03

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Um, so so you you mentioned that to me. That's actually what triggered me um putting you, getting you on the podcast here is you had you had us one account, is that true for seven months?

SPEAKER_02

Yes.

SPEAKER_01

I um that's that's extraordinary patience. I want to hear more about that story.

SPEAKER_02

Um, so I I so when I bought that 25k, um like I like I was talking about how it just didn't it didn't grow immediately. Um, but I started realizing that I'm not just loot, I'm not just losing in the account. I'd you know, get it up 500 bucks, then lose 200, lose 200, like just kind of you know, kept that that that boat. And I will say almost immediately after I read that book, um, I started just incorporate those values that it teaches. And within it's hard because I've had I had the account um for like five or six months, and then all of a sudden I ended up growing the account in about I would say less than a month, 20 days. It's crazy, right? But I get a payout just like that. And I was just yeah, it wasn't just like a hot streak either. It was just kind of incorporating different um trading strategies, like mentally, and immediately just finding success from that just was was a big like um big step in the right direction for sure.

SPEAKER_01

And something one word you mentioned before, you said just hold on to your winners, uh just uh cut your your your losers. I it's I think it's funny we use these words, right? Because it's it's not easy, right? It's actually quite complicated to change to change to shift your mind like that, right? So it's I think what you've been able to do there is is huge in terms of of your mentality, right?

SPEAKER_02

Yes, and I I will say like um when when you say those things, the difference between a gambler and you know a profitable trader are incorporating those into your trading. Because I mean that is the truth, is like just hoping that you know, if you start losing that hoping that you can win it back, that can burn you really quick. And the same thing where you try to get the quick wins when you know the market's telling you you're right, it can just, you know, it can just slow down your process overall for sure.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. And and and I guess you're also at a stage now where if you have a winner, you're you the data aligns. Your confluence, whatever you use, aligns everything is looking right. You also have the confidence to step a little bit on the gas. Would would that be fair to say?

SPEAKER_02

Yes.

SPEAKER_01

Like maybe size up or maybe hold on to it a bit longer.

SPEAKER_02

Yes. Um, I guess the the size, I would say the size thing was also an issue for me in the beginning. Um, I started realizing going back to like playing the prop firm game, um I I was just I was size too small after you know learning the strategy for four or five months. Um, I I don't think that period should have changed. It should have been after I feel like I have the strategy down. I need to size up and I need to start showing that like if I um if I can get close to the consistency target, you know, in these instant funds, it's gonna give me a much better chance to actually push towards that payout or you know, restart and just play this game again because you get stuck in like like like um like my first payout, I got stuck in the account for so long. And I was still in the I realized though I was still in the beginning phase of trying to you know learn my mentally, you know, being stable in trades, and there was a lot that was you know against me in that sense. But um once I realized that I can you know build up these accounts, I'm real I'm starting to incorporate that now into my into my 50k instant funded and also evals as well, is like you have to play the game a bit, and that actually does mean you have to size up once once you figure it out, once you can get past like learning, you know, just you know, the learning steps when you're first learning how to walk, then sizing up is very important if you're gonna be a prop firm trader.

SPEAKER_01

Do you think because that's something I struggle with personally as well, is there will be the account blowouts, there will be the blown accounts along the way. That's I mean, a lot of people will say it's a business expense. Personally, I find it very hard to to to keep going if I'm deep in drawdown. How do you feel about that? Is it are you also more indifferent to to the the account itself now?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, um, I'd say it was kind of a bit of an attachment issue too. After you know, losing I know five accounts in a row, I'm like, I don't want to lose another account, I don't want to lose another account. So I started just getting attached to it, and you know, that would affect my day-to-day trading where I'm not sizing appropriately, I'm pulling my winners early, um, and just realizing that I'm just stuck in account and then like thinking of something's got to change, you know. Yeah, and I I keep going back to the book because it was a game changer for me. It really was, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

But it it is same for me.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, it was it was huge. And that's where I you know I recommend for for newer traders is also don't don't rush the process, right? But at the same time, if if you're gonna be a prop from trader, it it's it's a bit of play in the game, and you have to understand that like there the return on investment for these accounts is is so insane compared to how everyone else makes money, you know what I mean? Like with especially your time spent. So it's it's it's about playing the game.

SPEAKER_01

Especially if once once it clicks, so to speak, you know, if maybe you can take um take a payout every two or three months to begin with. Um that one or two or three hundred dollars every now and then for an account, because I go instant funded as well. I I I can't be bothered with evals. Um that that's a very small expense compared to what the potential is, right?

SPEAKER_02

Right. And I will say, like, after um after taking that first payout, it was definitely like a big mindset shift where I'm like, you know, I I can do this. And you're part of the 1% or whatever it is. It's such a grind to get that first payout, but I'm telling you, once you once you realize that like it's possible, you realize you didn't just get lucky. You you really you put in the effort, you put in the time, and now it's paying off. And I think that was a big you know shift as well.

SPEAKER_01

So so where are you now, Ryan? With uh you have some 50k accounts. How are you how are you treating those? What's the status?

SPEAKER_02

So right now I'm just on one 50k account. Okay, so I've also had that account from about the same time I had the 25k, but I just wasn't trading it at all. I was just you know doing uh 10 second trades to keep the account active, keeping it alive, right? Yeah, yeah, and just uh throw that out there. I it it is a rule because I ended up blowing two of the SimPro accounts just because I didn't keep them active. And like I just totally I don't know why, but I forgot, told myself I wouldn't forget. Who hasn't yeah? Big big mistake, but that's where I'm at right now where um I I'm trading that account and recently just got super close to getting a payout and then got really burned on a um on a good setup. Um about I was about 600 bucks from a payout. So I was just I think I was just over the consistency and then ended up taking a a whole an entire um full stop loss, which just set my account back. Then the next day um ended up taking a day where I lost or I had lost two trades in a row, so gotta grind it back, but we're we're still holding on.

SPEAKER_01

Of course, yeah, yeah. And it is about keeping your win your winners bigger than the uses, I guess, right? I mean, you've you've probably heard also in if as effects the risk reward doesn't matter, right? But there is a mentality, there is an impact on your mentality when you take these big hits. But I think something that both you and Griffin have been doing very well is coming back, bouncing back from those losses, right? Um Griffin also took his payout here uh recently, right?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, he um he's been, I mean, a big part of like us just like we're always always trying to keep each other accountable, and yeah um I think that's that's big too. And I like how we started the the trading community, uh you know, with the little Discord that we have, just yeah, it can get um almost lonely in a sense where like if you're not if you're struggling on the day, it's really it's really hard to to keep yourself you know not attached to how the day's going from trading. And I think you know that's a big part of it as well.

SPEAKER_01

100%. I think for me also, I mean once I turn away from the screen, pretty much no one in my sort of my close environment here knows anything about trading, so that's where the discord comes into play, right? We have each other, yeah, we know what we're going through, wins and losses. Um I think the community part of it is super, super helpful.

SPEAKER_02

Yes, yep. But um, yeah, I'll say, you know, from just being my biggest like turning point was just being um able to see the the vision now. Um I there was a lot of days in the beginning where I didn't know if I could do it. Like just losing accounts and like, is this really you know worth my time? Like, you know, if you if you start talking to people that don't understand trading, they will start to see it as like you're kind of gambling, you're not using your money, you know, in the right way.

SPEAKER_01

There's very little support, right?

SPEAKER_02

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So what so so if you if we go back to some one of those days, maybe a year ago, you've taken a big loss or you've blown an account. What what kept you in it? Like what pulled you back to what kind of mind mindset or thoughts went through your head when you when you get yourself back in the game?

SPEAKER_02

Um, I I would say I started with watching the live streams on ASFX and just seeing how like uh those, I mean, when Austin would, for example, Austin would take a loss and Evan would take a loss, they wouldn't it wouldn't bother them at all. And just remembering how it always bothered me, and I was like, what am I doing wrong? Just trying to get it right. Um, but once I started to like kind of shift my mindset, like I gotta play this as a business, it's not just about um each trade individually. It started to like shape my mind and like this is possible, and yeah, and I guess to your question, I do want to be financially free, I don't want to work a normal job. I mean, right, that's the truth. And just seeing the vision that like this is an actual business that most people can't, you know, actually do, but some people can train their mind and can you know become super profitable out of this, and it's super attractive in the sense that like this would be an awesome job to have.

SPEAKER_01

And and I think you will agree to you and I can say that to anyone who hasn't taken a payout yet, once you have that, you've proven to yourself that I mean you you can get it from zero to a payout using the process that you have, and and and from there the sky's the limit, right? Because you could you could essentially just scale, of course. There's some psychology involved in scaling, but you can scale that to as much as you want.

SPEAKER_02

Where you're you know you can be capped at a normal job, and just that was also the the point of trading that made me you know super appeal to it, was there there is no ceiling. And yeah if you can if you can stay focused and stay you know locked in every single day and just start to really learn your process and stick to it, all it takes is to spend more money to make more money, and a bit like you know, playing the game a little differently, and it's it's super scalable.

SPEAKER_01

And yeah, that's and the return, the return on investment is exponential, right? So you you will spend more money, but you will also see more profits. Um cool. Yeah, you know what, Brian? Uh it's been a great conversation, and I think uh you you fit right into the category of what I would I'd love to have on this podcast because it's it's upcoming traders, it's not you know, it's not uh millions of millions of dollars in payouts yet. Um but but I like the fact that you're in the grind, you can tell the story of how you made it through to a payout because I think a lot of people will it will resonate with a lot of listeners that that are sitting in it because most honestly, most traders are in that phase. Um, so any from from your perspective, uh I'm putting you on the spot right now, just a little bit. Uh any advice that you would give to people who are struggling to to to reach their first payout?

SPEAKER_02

Don't think that that you're different from from everyone else. When I when I first started, it's so tempting to put your mindset that you're gonna be you're gonna take a payout quicker than most people. Um you're gonna spend on one account and you're gonna get the return on investment right away because it's just it's just not true. When I first started, I I of course you're gonna have those thoughts where it's like I'm gonna be different, I'm gonna immediately, you know, gonna just buy this account and you know, win immediately and get paid. And if you have that mindset, if you pick that if you have that mindset, it it'll burn you quicker than you realize. And just understand that like I do think for for very beginners, take things slow, um, you know, spend on evals and just get the feel for being in the market conditions because you can go from from paper trading to actually spending money on an account, and you all of a sudden when you're in a trade, your your uh mental stability just changes immediately. And you can realize how certain candles doing certain things just train change uh like changes your mind, trains your brain to make decisions that like that you might just not be prepared for. So definitely take things slow, um, get the feel for the markets, and then once you realize that like you're you're figuring out how to make smart decisions in the market and you understand your strategy, trust the process and and you know, pedal to the floor because it's a bit of playing the game as well.

SPEAKER_01

It is, it is awesome advice. Cool, thank you very much, Ryan. It's been a great conversation.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, thank you. Thank you for having me. It's uh it's great to finally meet you and and uh chat. And I just want to thank you. You did you did really well on Austin's podcast. I loved it. That was that was great.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you so much, and I'm sure we'll do a part two at some point once we've taken more payouts.