The Legacy & Wealth Podcast

The Wellness Expert: Why Successful Men Secretly Burn Out

• Mitchel Clark — The Standard • Season 1 • Episode 20

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Andre Crabb is a software engineer, entrepreneur, and founder of Top Human, a wellness company focused on helping ambitious professionals manage stress and improve performance. After studying Computer Science at UC Berkeley and building software for companies including Apple, Amazon Music, and Pandora, he transitioned into remote consulting while launching multiple entrepreneurial ventures. His journey through Silicon Valley, world travel, startup building, and personal development has given him a unique perspective on entrepreneurship, emotional resilience, and designing a life on your own terms.

In this episode, we discuss:

• Why Andre walked away from a six-figure Silicon Valley career
• Lessons learned from working at Apple, Amazon Music, and Pandora
• Building a location-independent lifestyle as a digital nomad
• The realities of starting and scaling your first business
• Why stress quietly destroys high performance
• The difference between awareness and true emotional healing
• Transitioning from a stable career into entrepreneurship
• Building a life based on purpose instead of expectations

About the Podcast

The Legacy & Wealth Podcast, hosted by Mitchell Clark and presented by The Standard, features conversations with entrepreneurs, executives, investors, and high-performing men who are building wealth, leadership, and legacy. Each episode explores the decisions, disciplines, and lessons that help successful men create lasting impact in business, family, and life.

Timestamps

00:00 Why Andre left a six-figure career
01:00 Introduction
02:00 How Andre makes money today
02:48 Building Top Human
04:04 Growing up in Southern California
07:56 Why software engineering became his career
10:47 Working at Apple, Amazon Music, and Pandora
18:40 Becoming a digital nomad
25:47 Moving to Puerto Rico and starting a business
27:48 Building software for crypto traders
37:47 The health crisis that changed everything
41:32 Finding an alternative to traditional therapy
48:42 Stress, burnout, and high performance
55:03 Transitioning from W-2 employment to entrepreneurship
1:00:25 Why Andre joined The Standard
1:02:08 Defining legacy and leaving an impact

About The Standard

The Standard is a private, in-person membership community for six-figure men who want to grow in their wealth, health, and relationships by surrounding themselves with other high-performing men operating at their level or above. It is designed for men who have outgrown their current environment and need a structured system of proximity, personalized strategy, and accountability to continue growing across every area of life.

Learn more: https://thestandardmen.com

SPEAKER_01

Six figures right out of college and I just knew this wasn't what I wanted to do. I had a mentee, and he told me, I was like, Andre, don't let your dreams be dreams. Like I really took it to heart. Yeah, to be honest.

SPEAKER_00

New ways I've heard meditation describes me is uh there's like kind of the eastern view versus the western view. What do you think meditation is or some of the most effective means of that?

SPEAKER_01

What I have created as uh what I'm teaching people in my my coaching program is something that's an alternative to meditation. Our bodies naturally hold on to the stress and the negative stuff way more than the positive stuff. So what I found the secret to be is we need an effective way to let go and release what we're holding on to, release the stress, like a pressure valve. There was always that part of me that was searching for more in a community. And the standard was the first one that I found that it wasn't just a business community, it wasn't just a traveling community, it wasn't just any like that.

SPEAKER_00

It was Welcome to the Legacy and Wealth Podcast, a show for proven high-earning men who value character, wealth, and a lasting legacy, brought to you by the standard, a private community organism private membership community, I'll do the end. Welcome to the Legacy and Wealth Podcast, a show for proven high earning men who value character, wealth, and a lasting legacy, brought to you by the standard, a private membership community for high performers. My name is Mitchell Clark, and I am joined by fellow standard member Andre Crab. Thanks for having me. All right. How was the drive from uh the depths of Florida all the way up here to Texas?

SPEAKER_01

Not so bad. It was about two days, about 16 hours total. Okay. But I'm glad to make it out here.

SPEAKER_00

Are you enjoying your stay so far? Yeah. No, it's a cool spot. And this is the transitory part, right? You're going to California a little bit later on.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, and originally I intended to stay here in Dallas. And within the first couple weeks, I decided actually let me keep going west and go to back where I grew up, back to where my family is.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. Well, that'll kind of lead into our first question for the day is how do you currently make money?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, so currently I'm part-time a software developer contractor. Um, I started out as a W-2 in Silicon Valley. After about three years, I decided this wasn't the lifestyle that I wanted to live. So I went remote in 2017 and never went back to an office.

SPEAKER_02

Nice.

SPEAKER_01

After two years of that, I decided to take it a step further, quit my job, moved to Puerto Rico, and started contracting. And I've had the same client since. It's been about seven years, and that's given me a lot of flexibility to explore, you know, a business that I would really want to start to evolve my career in that way as well.

SPEAKER_00

So, because it's currently a part of what you're doing, what is the side project that you're working on right now?

SPEAKER_01

The side project is called Top Human. It's a wellness brand. Okay. And there's two aspects. The main aspect that I've had is coaching people in like a newer, more innovative way to do a meditation practice, which helps to de-stress, it really dissolves the stress, um, clears the mind, quiets the mind. That's what got me starting this in the first place. I had a very noisy, loud, uncontrollable mind. Sure. And I took my software developer mindset in solving that problem. And I think I did a pretty good job with it. So started looking for better ways to kind of implement that into my life and how I could teach this to other people. Okay. And now there's gonna be a second modality that I'm learning that kind of just takes that to the next level.

SPEAKER_00

Well, and I appreciate you telling me that because I I think a big story that we're trying to tell the people here is we have a lot of people that are currently in their W-2 jobs doing something, but there's like a passion that they want to get out of and go into that full time. And that's gonna be part of your story. Because right now it seems like you're doing both kind of 50-50 at the moment. Yeah. In your bit of a transitory period. So really interested to hear that story. But let's go back to the beginning, or at least where did you grow up?

SPEAKER_01

I grew up in San Diego. Obviously, yeah, born in LA and grew up in San Diego. Right.

SPEAKER_00

You're going back to California where you grew up.

SPEAKER_01

Okay, awesome. How was that like? Growing up in SoCal? Yeah. Yeah, it was good, man. I mean, um, you know, my parents said we were like upper middle class growing up, and it was, at least in my family, in my house, like a little chaotic just because of uh my family situation. But other than that, you know, you're growing up, you don't know anything, not a care in the world, and you're trying to figure out what to do with the rest of your life.

SPEAKER_00

In sunny California, right? Yeah. What's going on what's going on in your family? Like, tell me about the family dynamics.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's been something that I've still been learning. Um, the more I do my own personal development and go on my growth journey. Um, took me a while to realize like uh I have an autistic older sister, and I mean I knew she was, but to realize how big of an impact that really had on my life and my development. So that just added more chaos and noise within the family. No wonder I had a chaotic and noisy mind, you know, entering adulthood, adulthood and trying to ease that, you know, after I started working professionally.

SPEAKER_00

So my uh my sister has a kid who's also autistic, which we found this out like maybe two or three years ago. And so I know there's definitely challenges to that that the mom has to absorb, but then the siblings also absorb some of that responsibility, some of that chaos. I mean, what was that like for you? I know you said that it kind of led to a chaotic mindset, but kind of go into that a little bit more.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Yeah, and it's a good question. I think a lot of entrepreneurs, people that want to push to build that lifestyle, there's a reason why. And there's a lot of what I find, some type of hardship earlier in life to drive the person to make that lifestyle choice. And in my case, it was a lack of you know, real affection and attention from my parents because of a very you know needy special needs oldest sister, and then I had a second sister as well, kind of um in between her and I. So I ended up just figuring things out on my own, spending a lot of time on my own.

SPEAKER_00

Right. Well, I've noticed a lot, um, because sometimes in the in a lot of families, like the older siblings the one that gets you know put into a lot of responsibility. But it sounds like in your case it was almost the opposite. Being the youngest, like a lot of the attention probably went to the to the oldest because she had those needs. And which to no fault of the parent, that's a really tough lifestyle, and I understand that's really tough to deal with, but there can be a byproduct of that. So, but um, other than that, it sounded like it was a relatively happy upbringing for the most part.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, for sure. And that's one thing that's really interesting, right? It kind of in my world created this dissonance that I didn't really realize until I was older that everything looks fine from the outside, right? And to whatever friends that we have, but then inside it's like a different story, right? We want to make sure we the family presented itself in a way that didn't really reflect the reality. Um, so it was kind of you know, unknowingly as a child, as a kid, as a teenager, whatever, balancing and doing that dance. But yeah, other than that, you know, things were more or less okay.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Are you still in touch with them to this day?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's part of why I'm moving back.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

You know, um, my dad passed away a few years ago. I'm sorry, but yeah, sorry, thanks though. Yeah. Um, but yeah, still talk with my mom and my sisters from time to time.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. Well, growing up, you know, going to because right now you're in your software engineering. What made you want to get into this world? Was it starting in high school or in a college, or what what kind of explain the route that got you into that world?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it was kind of a process of elimination uh and also what I had access to at the time. So I knew I didn't like English class, right? Or like political science and stuff like that. I don't want to write papers, yeah, but I was good at math and I was good at physics. I thought computers were cool, you know, they had flashy lights and stuff. And my dad was a QA manager for IBM. Oh, really? Okay. Yeah. And he connected with me with some of his his friends when I was, you know, getting closer to graduating high school to decide and see what I might want to do. And so being an engineer was the thing that was kind of handed to me. Yeah. You know? And um I loved playing the drums. And I remember I was sad when I chose to go into computer science. Not that I was an amazing drummer or anything like that, right? But like that was a passion I had. And so ever since I chose my career, I knew I didn't want it. Okay.

SPEAKER_00

It's funny, my wife's also an engineer. There's a little bit of that where like she knows she's good at it, but there's a little bit like, I don't know if that's like the thing I want to do for the rest of my life. I mean, it pays well, it does well, it's a great career field, but I understand that if you were a drummer, if you had gone to be a drummer, what's like your favorite kind of drumming style? Like any sort of musical genre you would like to drum for? Uh, I really liked listening to rock.

SPEAKER_01

Okay. Like, yeah, rock and roll.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. Not to get off too much tangent, but what's some of your favorite bands? Like, if you could be a drummer for any band headlining, what would it be like?

SPEAKER_01

Oh man. I would probably pick Shinedown. Nice.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, okay. That's a good one. Okay, okay. So back kind of like the 90s, like post-grunge era sort of stuff.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Something like that. Yeah, it's hard to describe in rock, right? There's a lot of subgenres.

SPEAKER_00

But it's a fun, it was a fun era for that. Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, I think so.

SPEAKER_00

Do you still drum to this day?

SPEAKER_01

I want to. Okay. I can't wait till I get back to like having a place I can, but I've kind of been traveling for so long. Yeah. Haven't had like a stable place where I live for long enough to like have a drum set and have that just be part of my routine.

SPEAKER_00

You know, it's funny. I have a similar kind of story with guitar. I used to be really into playing guitar in high school and in college. Um, but then moving around so much, I was in the military beforehand that I just completely dropped it off. And now I'm like, one of these days, like once I get fully into my my new gig at some point, it's like I'm gonna pick that up one day. Yeah. Um, I'm a big like 2000s metal core kind of guy when it comes to guitar. So like just the shredding and the links and all that stuff. So we'll start a band together. We'll go out and we'll we'll start up something in California. That's jam. I love it. Okay. So, all right, but unfortunately, you went to become a software engineer, which is is you know, isn't all sadness and we're gonna do it. Yeah, definitely. What degree did you get?

SPEAKER_01

Uh I got computer science degree from UC Berkeley.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So walk us through going out of college into your first job. Like let's just describe your career path a little bit and how that kind of looked.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Uh so I interned when I was in school, I interned at Apple and I interned at Amazon Music. Okay. And I didn't want to go back to either of those. You know, but that's what's kind of suggested, right? Go work for the biggest company you can. Um, I wanted to find some way to bring that passion back.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So when I graduated, I ended up choosing to work for Pandora Radio.

SPEAKER_00

That was Oh man, I remember Pandora Radio. Oh, that was good. You say that as if it doesn't exist anymore.

SPEAKER_01

It still does.

SPEAKER_00

But no one uses anything. But no one uses it anymore. Yeah, yeah, right. That's funny. That's funny. That's because you left.

SPEAKER_01

That's when it all went downhill. I know, right, right, right. Yeah. But no, it was good, man. I mean, I was making six figures right out of college, and I just knew this wasn't what I wanted to do. It wasn't what I wanted to stay doing.

SPEAKER_00

So I've heard a lot of people when it comes to career advice, is that in the beginning, you want to do the things you don't want to do just to kind of get your career, you know, launched off in the right direction so you can start making your autonomous decisions after that point. So starting with, because those are some big companies you got into. What was a day-to-day, week-to-week life working there? Like what did you do as a day-to-day?

SPEAKER_01

They just throw us right in. Okay. You know, even though we were new graduates, we just got thrown into the code base. I had a, I was working on a team of probably seven people. Um, you know, a few senior engineers, of course, a couple new people. Um, and just the typical software engineering cycle. You know, you find bugs, you build new things, and you get it out there.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, fair. So just product iteration. What kind of products were you working with on for those companies?

SPEAKER_01

So for Pandora, I was on the devices team. Okay. So I do mobile applications, that's what I do, iOS and Android. And we were the team that would integrate the Pandora application with your car, with your smart TV, with your smartwatch. Okay. All of those things. That was a separate team to handle all of the devices.

SPEAKER_00

But that's what you were focusing on? Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah. What um, I mean, what were some of the challenges going through? Like, not to get too technical in there, but what things were you working on specifically to make those a reality? Because I think like a lot of people think of these apps in really simple terms, like, yeah, you just hook it up to the com you to your car, whatever, like it's it's magic. It just doesn't really fught. But from a technical standpoint, it sounds like it's more complicated. Like you had a whole team figuring out how to make that happen.

SPEAKER_01

We build the magic. Yes. Yeah. So there's a whole underlying everything's built on abstractions. Okay. Right? You open your phone because all you need to know how to do is how to look at it and it turns on and you choose the app. You know how to start your car because the abstraction is you get in, you turn this thing to the right. Well, nowadays you just press a button, right? So there's these lower level communication things going on that the engineers built in order to make all of that seamlessly happen like magic. This is why Apple is so good at what they do. They make it super seamless whenever you're integrating with their hardware and software. Yeah. So it was just that at the Pandora application, right? With Ford head units, BMW head units, the Volvo, um, the Chromecast, the Apple TV, right? Whatever it was.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So a lot had to do with syncing with all the individual, not just one thing, but with your car, with this application, if this application. For so I'm a little bit familiar with kind of the agile process, like the iterative, you know, improvements and whatnot. Um, was teamwork a big part of that? Like, did you because I know, you know, working in a big corporation, doing this sort of stuff isn't the dream for everybody, but what did you learn about like leadership and teamwork and working in a team while you were in those companies?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's a good question. Um you need direction. Someone needs to be the leader, right? So like our manager was the leader, and there's always there's a hierarchy, right? Just like in any organization. And you need clear decisions. And I've been at some companies where there's not clear direction and clear decisions, right? So it's been interesting leaving Silicon Valley and seeing how Silicon Valley companies do things versus other companies, right? There's a lot more discipline, I would say. The the the not work ethic necessarily, but kind of. It's just different at the more elite level companies. And so everyone plays their role. Uh you just get done what you need to get done. You work for some type of leadership promotion if you want to, you know, and you just take on responsibilities and you're innovating, you're solving problems, right? Whether that's a team level problem that needs to be solved, or if it's the actual problem of the product that needs solving. So a lot of figuring, I mean, this was pre-AI.

SPEAKER_00

Now you could have something else do the coding for you now. Yeah, it's pretty crazy. Um, so would you say Silicon Valley had the better structure in place? Or you or do you think it got better when you went to some of the other companies outside of it? Like, where would you see like the best examples of leadership and the worst?

SPEAKER_01

There's definitely good leadership in Silicon Valley. 100%. That's why they're there. Sure. Right? For sure. Um and the farther I got from Silicon Valley, the more I had I started like making suggestions of things that I saw that were not there anymore, if that makes sense. Just because like every company's different, every company's in a different state of their life cycle, too, of like where how long they've been around, how long the team has been working together. But I really tried to bring in like the knowledge that I had from Silicon Valley into, you know, these other companies as well.

SPEAKER_00

Would you say that was one pro just because you got to see how it worked at a like a high level, at a high functioning level, and you were able to bring some of those skills down to maybe people that hadn't quite figured out how to play on that level in game?

SPEAKER_01

A pro of like my career choice. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, totally. Yeah. No, having that as like my starting point. Yeah. You know, you can see what efficiency looks like. You can see what teamwork looks like. You can see what's required to build something that millions of people use every single day. Yeah. You know?

SPEAKER_00

I know from my uh from my personal example. So I'm I've been in Med Device for the past five years. My first company was a company called Intuitive Surgical, Robotic Surgery, and they are well known for having a really robust training pipeline for their sales reps. Now, I did not love working for that company by any stretch of the imagination. It was huge, and I don't really love the sales culture there, but their training pipeline was second to none. And so moving forward, even though I didn't like the experience, there were certain lessons I learned about like what's a different sales process, how like was a regimented and disciplined way of going about it rather than just kind of flinging ideas and pitches out there. So yeah, I there's definitely pros and cons. It's like it's not a place you might stay at forever, but there can be good things to learn from those companies moving forward.

SPEAKER_01

100%. And from a personal standpoint, too, it launched me into a career that gave me a lifestyle that I wanted to live, kind of like what you were saying earlier, right? It's like it's a good starting place. So you do whatever to get started. And then as you grow up and you decide what you actually want to do with your life, you can then make conscious pivots along the way.

SPEAKER_00

So, what were some of the first pivots outside of Silicon Valley?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, man, my first one was it was a big one for me at the time. I had to really pro and con, like on a whiteboard my way through, like, am I actually gonna do this? You know, and looking back, it's like it was simple. Sure. What I wanted to do was leave and be a digital nomad and travel the world. Sounds like a dream. It sounds right, and it was. And it's funny you say that actually. My mentee at the time, right? I had a mentee, and he told me, he's like, Andre, don't let your dreams be dreams. And I think he quoted Shiloh Beau. Right, Shia Boe. From that video. Yes, yes, yeah. Which I hadn't seen it.

SPEAKER_00

Oh my gosh, don't let your dreams be dreams. Make your dreams come true.

SPEAKER_01

Yes, that's great. Oh my gosh. And so that actually like I really took it to heart. Yeah. To be honest. And I was like, you know what? He's right. So I did whatever I needed to do to find a company that would let me work remote. And so I left Pandora. Okay. I joined company number two. And he, my boss, was like, yeah, you know, within a couple months, maybe you can go international and stuff. Because they were remote by default. Sure. And this was 2017. Yeah. This was before the pandemic. Before COVID. Yeah, before COVID. After a week, he was like, Andre, you're good to go. Like, nice, nice. So I jumped on a plane to Bolivia, and that was that.

SPEAKER_00

Let's talk about this because this is not an opportunity that a lot of people get. This is like a period of time where I feel like from COVID till like a few years afterwards, like the digital nomad was like the dream that everybody would want to do. Which it sounds like you were a few years ahead of that time before it even became popular. Describe what that was like. You went to Bolivia. Where else did you go?

SPEAKER_01

It was amazing. It was a lot of fun. Very influential in my life.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Uh, it's one of the first times I had met people that were living life on their terms. Okay. People that were living the lives that they wanted to live, not the lives that everyone else had told them to live. And that is what made me decide like, if I want to maintain this lifestyle, and I do, I cannot work for somebody else.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So you kind of got a picture of like what you wanted to do in the long term in in like a quick snapshot there in country. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And then how long did you stay there for?

SPEAKER_01

I think I was there for six weeks.

unknown

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

It's not super long.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

It was a month at a time in a different country. Oh, okay. Usually. Oh, so you made like you made an actual like nomadic journey around the area. Was that on purpose?

SPEAKER_01

So I joined a company called Wi-Fi Tribe as a as a member to go travel. It was one of the best things. And what they do is they organize where the group is going to be for what month. Okay. And then if you decide to go on that chapter, then you just pay them and you show up. Okay. You just need your backpack and your job, right? And your laptop, pretty much. And so there's 30 other people. Oh, okay. So cool, right? And then the next country is on the schedule. Okay. And not everyone's going to go to the next one, but you'll go to whichever one you want to. And so I did several in a row. I met tons of cool people. Um, it also gets kind of lonely, though, to be honest, because your friends change. Okay. Every month. So I did that and then I also just did some personal travel where I wanted to go and also had the flexibility to help caretake for my dad also. Okay. When he got sick.

SPEAKER_00

So did you fly back to California to help out with that? Did your family ever get a chance to fly out to Europe to see you?

SPEAKER_01

No, they never came to visit me on like one of my travels.

SPEAKER_00

Sorry, yeah, I go back to California. No, I understand. I understand. What was your favorite country that you visited? Italy. Italy? Okay. So why? Tell me all about Italy.

SPEAKER_01

Man, the food is just fantastic. Yeah. Right? Because so many of the problems we have here in America are because the quality of our food and what's in it that's not actually food. And out there, they still grow stuff and serve you what was grown. You know, it's like farmer's market, like farm to table. So just eating a pizza with three ingredients, like a margarita pizza or like a pasta with just a couple things, the experience is just like so different than something you're gonna get anywhere here.

SPEAKER_00

I've heard a lot from people that when they do go travel to places like that, they're like, I feel like I'm eating more, but I somehow lost weight on that trip. And they like they don't understand how. And then they come back to the US and they're like, oh, that's why there's just so much additional crap put in the food. So okay. Unfortunately. No, I get that. So was it so it was a group of people, but the group of people kind of changed depending upon like if people wanted to go or what have you. How long do you do that for?

SPEAKER_01

I was part of them for or traveled kind of on and off with them for about two years. Okay. Yeah. Um, I did three in a row, and then that's when my dad got sick, so I went back to Southern California, right? To to kind of move in and help out. Luckily, I had the flexibility of the remote job, right? And then I kind of did some other trips on and off. Um that's when I went to like Mexico and Italy and did Colombia a few times. Yeah. So yeah, just kind of bopped around before eventually settling down in Puerto Rico for a little bit.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So my wife is from Mexico. So I have to ask you, which part of Mexico did you go to?

SPEAKER_01

Uh for that trip specifically, I was in Mexico City.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, Mexico City. Okay. Yeah. I did a missions trip there from my church. That was like my only exposure to Mexico City specifically. All my other parts have either been in like Cancun, obviously, or on the West Coast. Uh it's actually a very underrated uh place to be because it's like there's beach, but there's a mountain range like right next to the beach area. So I've heard is that's where more of the European tourists go if they go to Mexico. Okay, the American tourists go to Cancun. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Puerto Vallarta is amazing. Yes. Right? On that west coast. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Beautiful, beautiful place. I agree. Okay. Well, all right, so you're living the dream, doing all that. Now, as far as working and all that, we went back to California. Um, you said you went to Puerto Rico after California?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's I know, it's a lot of dots to connect to it. Yeah, you're good, yeah. So I traveled, I was in South America for three months. Okay. And then back with my parents for four months. Somewhere after that, um, started traveling back to like South America a little bit. I thought I would live in Miami, so I went there for two or three months just to try it out. Didn't love it.

SPEAKER_00

Just curious about it, because there's a lot of like entrepreneurial types like the like Andrew Tate and like Justin Waller that like love Miami. What didn't you like about it?

SPEAKER_01

It's too like superficial and just kind of crazy party vibe. It's kind of like the Las Vegas of Florida, of the East Coast. Okay, gotcha. You know, and that's just not me. Sure. So didn't feel like a place I wanted to really stay and like build healthy community. Why Puerto Rico? That's a good question. So by this time I was learning about business, trying to start something. Okay. And my health was deteriorating for um a few different reasons. My mental health was deteriorating from a ton of stress from caretaking my dad and some other things too. And I was like, I'm trying to start this business thing, and it's really hard to do all of those when you live in a different city every month, and you have just two backpacks of all your stuff.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. You know? Sounds like fun, but I can definitely understand that being a little bit of a stress factor for sure. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, and just more overhead.

SPEAKER_00

What kind of business were you working on in Puerto Rico? What was I starting when I got there?

SPEAKER_01

I don't even remember. That was such a long time ago. But what happened was um I moved to Puerto Rico with a couple friends from a uh business community that I was part of at the time to like move in together because like it's cheaper cost of living. You don't need a visa because it's part of the United States. Right. So we just showed up. So I just bought a plane ticket. Two weeks later, Puerto Rico was home. You know, my buddies had already moved in and got the apartment. And I had quit my job right before that.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

So I didn't know what I was doing.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, really? Okay. I quit my job. So this wasn't a part of like your digital nomad journey in that respect. You had okay.

SPEAKER_01

That was me stopping the the travel, okay. Stopping the digital nomad. Okay. And like starting to settle down and slow down.

SPEAKER_00

Worse places to settle down than yes. That's that sounds great. Um, you know, it's funny when you say like I can't remember the first venture. I I only reason I remember is because I remember how much I failed. I started up an Etsy shop. So I'm a big um, like as a Christian, I'm a big C. S. Lewis fan. So I had this idea of creating like mugs and pictures with like C. S. Lewis quotes on it, which is just it went absolutely nowhere. I think I sold six mugs and they were all by my aunt or whatever. But yeah, hey, everyone's gotta start somewhere. It's gotta start somewhere.

SPEAKER_01

And so what I did was I started thinking, oh, I'll trade the stock market. Okay. Actually, it was crypto was popping off at the time. So I was like, oh, I'll trade crypto. Oh my goodness. Talk about mental stress. Right. And so me being a programmer, I'm like, oh, this is all just pattern recognition. Okay. Let me build some tools. And so I started trying to learn how to build software tools for recognizing the patterns. And that actually then led me into my first actual business venture with a guy that I met in Puerto Rico who was a successful trader.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

And so then we built some technical indicators that we could sell to his audience. And that was the first real business that got some traction. How did that work? What do you mean?

SPEAKER_00

Like, I not I guess not technically, because I'm not technically competent, but like how well did that work? Like you're building an algorithm. Did it have some success and actually predicting trades? The algorithm itself? Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So we weren't necessarily building an algorithm. So he had traded the stock market or the crypto market for years and had success. There's tax benefits in Puerto Rico if you live there, which is why there's a lot of people that trade and stuff there. Okay. And so really it was like, hey, I'll build your strategy into a nice, pretty visual app that you can use as you're looking at the chart for your audience. Okay. Sell it to them for a subscription because it saves them time. It makes decisions faster.

SPEAKER_00

So it's more like not predicting trades, but just taking a snapshot of the strategy of where you should be focusing on the trades.

SPEAKER_01

Is that it depends on the strategy. Okay. And if you ask a hundred different traders how they trade, you'll probably get like two to five hundred different strategies. There's so many. So it just depends. But my background in software development, right, which I was still no, I wasn't working at at that time, was I? Because I'd quit. But my background in app development, I was good at making things user-friendly, look good, sure. And simplifying things that were complex, such as the stock market.

SPEAKER_02

Sure.

SPEAKER_01

Right. Okay. So if we know how to look at it, we can code it in a way that matches that so that you can just see it visually on the chart rather than having to manually draw lines and do math.

SPEAKER_00

If you want to connect with high performers like today's and previous guests, I want to invite you to apply to join the standard. We are a private membership community that improves the health, wealth, and relationships for six-figure earners who perform at the highest level physically, emotionally, spiritually, socially, and financially. What we offer is simple. We will give you a vetted local brotherhood of men on your level or above. We will give you a customized plan to build true generational wealth. We will give you a personal liaison to achieve all of your goals. If you are tired of being the most successful person in your circle, frustrated with always pouring into others and not having anyone to pour into you, or you want to have conversations like the ones you're hearing today in person, on a weekly basis with fellow high performers, go to thestandardmen.com to apply. That's thestandardmen.com. Hit the link in the description below. Now back to the episode. How was that um how was that app received by the people that were using it? Was it a good experience for them?

SPEAKER_01

Oh yeah, they loved it. Okay. Yeah, we had people that would buy a lifetime subscription for like a big upfront fee, or some people stayed on like their monthly. But the whole deal was like, look, man, this is your brain child. Like you sell it, I'll build it. Okay. You market it, you sell it, it's your audience, but I'll be the theory.

SPEAKER_00

So you're more the back end support from it, not necessarily like the salesperson for it, necessarily.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, because he had an existing community. So it was very simple. I just had to learn how to build these things for the platform that he was using. And then he would just sell it to his membership. Because he also had a membership community. That's a good deal. So it was add-ons for him. We would split the profits 50-50, and then we just added more products from there.

SPEAKER_00

So if I was one of the traders in Puerto Rico using this, like what would my experience kind of be like? Is it something I get to choose? Like what am I like clicking on if I'm going onto this platform?

SPEAKER_01

So there was a, I mean, there is um it was newer back then, but there's a platform called TradingView.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

And TradingView is it took the chart viewing aspect of trading and brought it to the web.

unknown

Right.

SPEAKER_01

Okay. When before all the big ones were on your desktop, Windows machine or something like that. You know, Windows platform.

SPEAKER_00

So basically nowadays, if I like just Googled on it and tried looking at all like whatever Google or whatever platform would show to me is kind of what you're presenting. It's commonplace now, but it wasn't commonplace back then.

SPEAKER_01

Not as much. And not one that was super feature rich for people that were, you know, day traders. Right. Right? That do a ton of different types of technical and fundamental analysis. So what these applications do where you can view charts, they let you build apps on them. Okay. Like they have a coding language, kind of like your iPhone, right? Okay. You can build an app for the iPhone or Shopify. You can build apps for Shopify and sell them to people who use Shopify. Okay. Same thing here. I was building an app for, it's not even called an app, it's called a like a script or an indicator. Okay. So I would learn how to build these indicators on the TradingView platform, and then we would offer that to his community. Okay. How how old did you offer that? We got up to, I mean, it wasn't much, obviously, in the grand scheme of things. I think we got up to around 4K a month recurring.

SPEAKER_00

For for you specifically, or is that something you had to split with the guy?

SPEAKER_01

Oh, that was what we split. Okay. Yeah, we split that. But that was less than a year. Yeah. That's actually not bad. Yeah. Not at all. It was a pretty good, like quick first win for me in the world of business.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I would also imagine, you know, in Puerto Rico, where the cost of living is probably a lot cheaper than it would be in like Miami, for instance. Yeah, it's enough to kind of, you know, coast on by, but you code you didn't stay there forever. Did you want to stay in there forever? Or what was the reason that you didn't want to stay in that?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

In that business? Yeah, in that business.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. And I was working again as a contractor, a software developer too. Okay. By that time. So I had multiple streams. Okay, gotcha. Um so there were two things that got me out of that. I left that business partnership. Um, he bought me out eventually. Okay. Because what we were building was under his brand. And what I had learned in my naive days of learning business and entrepreneurship was well, you want to have your own brand.

unknown

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01

Right. And have some autonomy and some control over the business. I basically had zero control over the business and I couldn't work with others. Okay. He kind of had locked locked me up. Gotcha. You didn't have autonomy with the okay. Right. So that was my mistake.

SPEAKER_00

It's not like you could take it and then like sell it to other people. It was like exclusive to this guy.

SPEAKER_01

Well, I could even build somebody else's strategy for them, kind of like an agency. Gotcha. Right? I was only allowed to work with him according to the contract that we had signed. Oh, partnership. Yeah, yeah, it makes sense. So that was the first thing. I was like, man, I can build this stuff. I can build maybe not my own strategy, because I definitely didn't have one. Yeah. But I could build generic tools to recognize generic patterns that are common among traders and just have my own products that I sell. So that's what I did. So I I left the partnership, started building just generic indicators that people wanted. And that was what I did for a little bit. How long did you do that for? I still have that, but I've I'm letting it die. Okay. Because it's not something I want to keep. Okay. Um, but I had that for years for sure.

SPEAKER_00

How long? Like when so when all this happened, when you're in this partnership when it dissolved, what year was it? Was this prior or after uh COVID? It was in the middle of it.

SPEAKER_01

Oh really? Okay. Yeah. So so COVID was well, I was spent in Puerto Rico. You know, so everyone was like locked up, cooped up, and I was walking on the beach. Also cooped up, but taking breaks too.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you figure out the cheat for the icon, man. Get enough. I had I had a decent setup for sure. I was in the military when time COVID hit, so I was locked up, locked down, and I had to follow the rules to a T. I mean, no one followed it more than the Army did back in those days. But I can imagine. Yeah. I mean, I don't I think I had to wear a mask to the office for like well, then I went to medical device sales, and you're wearing the master regarding it. Yeah, so you're masked in the OR anyway, so it didn't even really matter.

SPEAKER_01

But okay. Yeah, so that would have been around 2021. Okay. 2020, 2021 is when I think I it was maybe about a year after. Okay.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So you did that, but then you did kind of like building these apps and stuff from then until now, basically. So so as far as the work you've been doing up to this point, it's been the contracting work. You said it's with a client. Was that client with you prior to this, or did you pick them up and then continue to work with them after this app development?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I picked them up in 2019. Okay. Um, I got very lucky. They were the first company that reached out to me, and I just have been with them ever since. Okay. Been very fortunate. Um, and so I got started on the side business back then, which was the trading stuff, sold it to my partner, started my own, and then really battled and went back and forth with like, is this what I want to do? Is this not what I want to do? Because there's a piece of it that just felt soul sucking to me because most people just lose money trading. And I didn't feel good about selling tools to people, telling them, like, hey, my product's great, you should buy it. Sure. And they're just losing money trading, even if they bought somebody else's tools. Sure.

SPEAKER_00

You know, so I really most people just lose money anyway. It's yeah, you only hear the success stories, not like the hundreds of losers that washed out again. Exactly. Yeah. 100%. Okay. So working with them, so what what kind of led you into this wellness journey that you've been going into? Let's talk into that a little bit.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Uh where to start. So when I was moving to Puerto Rico, like I said, right, physical health, mental health were kind of deteriorating. Um I think the short version of that story is a ton of stress. Plus, I just take in some antibiotics, which destroyed my gut, which makes it even worse when you have a ton of stress. Um, plus already having that kind of noisy, chaotic mind, like we talked about at the beginning.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And so just a handful of perfect storms. Um so when I got to Puerto Rico, I was trying to do the business thing. I was trying to still have income. And at the same time, I was spending a lot of time trying to figure out my own health situation. So when I started contracting, I was part-time, about 20 hours uh a week rather than 40. And I ended up spending a lot of time trying to figure out some way to like ease this feeling that I had in my chest, which came from a lot of the stress from my dad's uh situation. My dad had brain cancer.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

So caretaking him, all the stress I had, I just had this gnawing feeling inside that I knew no doctor was gonna be like, oh yeah, that's this. We know what it is. There's nothing physical there. So I had to figure out something. And I did a lot of and I I went to therapists, I went to doctors, right? I tried all the conventional things that you're supposed to do. Wasn't making much of a dent for me.

SPEAKER_00

Well, before we go into what did work, because I think a lot of guys, you know, in the standard we talk about the emotional pillar quite a bit, which is an often very um tossed-away kind of pillar. It's like, yeah, yeah, let's get to the finance part. But um, why didn't therapy in these doctors work? Because that is kind of it's a it's a big trend right now. Everyone's into it. For me personally, I've never had really great success in that field specifically, but from your perspective, why did therapy fail you ultimately?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's a good question. Um, everyone's different. In my case, I was too much in my head. I could talk my way around them. It was a very cognitive experience. Okay. Therapy can really help you learn about what happened to you, why it happened to you, what it's caused you to think, feel, and behave like nowadays. Um what I wanted from my therapists, which I didn't really get, was to help dig into me, whatever that meant, to find whatever needed to be released or let go of in some way that would actually cause a change at a level below the cognitive change of like, oh, now I understand. Okay. Because just understanding something gives you the awareness, but it doesn't necessarily make change actually happen.

SPEAKER_00

I think one way someone described it to me is there's a difference between understanding something and comprehending something. Like you can kind of understand the general concept of it, but it doesn't really hit you until something changes in the heart, essentially. Is that a good way of describing it?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, basically is you mentioned when the heart changes, right? Sure. There's aspects of the body that holds on to a lot of our experiences in the past. And there's a lot of research and books about this. And that's a layer that a lot of professionals don't dive into.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

And so you're not going to get that deeper level change.

SPEAKER_00

So how did you achieve that deeper level change?

SPEAKER_01

A lot of trial and error.

unknown

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Fair enough. Yeah, a lot of because so going back to what you were asking, right, about childhood figuring things out on my own, spending a lot of time on my own, software developer mindset. Right? We want root level fixes. We don't want to just put a band-aid over a solution, right? And so I just said, all right, I'll keep trying things until I find something that works. And I kind of was learning from a lot of the gurus at the time on YouTube, and I read all these books and all this stuff, and I started to hear like some different techniques that were unique, that were different, that seemed like they were actually influencing change in the person. I started to kind of weave those together in my own, it was a meditation practice at the time, you could say. But little by little, or or one day what happened was I felt a little piece of that emotional toxic sludge, I call it that sensation that I'd carried. I felt a little bit of that dissolve.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

And I was like, I don't know what I did, but I did something. Fair enough. And so I went back the next day and did it again. And I went back the next day and did it again. And so it was repeatable. Okay. And after I don't know, a month, I didn't feel it again for a day.

SPEAKER_00

What was that thing? What was what was that thing you did that let go of that piece of toxic sludge?

SPEAKER_01

It was really connecting with what I was holding on to. Okay. You know, it's hard to describe, it's hard to put words to for sure. Um what the wellness business I'm building now is to teach people how to do this, and I do it over the span of like 10 weeks. Okay. Because there's a learning curve. There's a disconnection that we have with our hearts, with our bodies, because we are rewarded for being intelligent. We are so much in our heads. Everything is cognitive in society for the most part. A lot of things are. And so what it comes down to is building your mind-body connection to actually reconnect and feel and sense what's going on in your body. It's called somatic interoception, so that you can actually help your body heal in the way it's naturally designed to.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So let me ask you this for a lot of the people that are listening, um, just let's get them to even get a buy in. What are what do you think are the consequences of Um, of not resolving some of these emotional issues you have and what are the pros of resolving it? Because I think for a lot of the guys in our group and you know, you know, across the world, especially for like high performing people, I think a lot of them don't care until performance gets impacted. And I think the emotional pillar does impact performance, even if you don't realize it. Oh, yeah. So, how would you describe, you know, how performance gets impacted if you do deal with it versus if you don't deal with it?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, great question. Yeah. Um the two big words that come to mind are stress and burnout. Okay. Um, what also happens is like mental fog, brain fog, or a lack of clarity in making decisions. Because what happens, because the body keeps the score, that's the name of a famous book, because the body holds on to this stuff physically, it builds up over time. And if you're, let's just call it your stress bucket, right? As your stress bucket fills over time, it's going to influence the system, you, the human being, right, that's carrying it. And so it's going to degrade your performance mentally, cognitively. Um, all those things I just mentioned, your clarity. It also affects your nervous system. And high performers and the ambitious ones of us and the achievers, we push, push, push. We really push our bodies to the max, to the limit. And there's two parts of your nervous system. And one of them is that fight or flight stress mode, we're always on. But then there's another part which needs to come on as well to help you rest and digest. And so if you're doing both of these at the same time, you literally have your foot on the gas and your body's trying to press the brake at the same time. So it's literally like biological burnout.

SPEAKER_00

So I'm gonna use you as my personal therapist then first. Okay, despite the fact that we said therapy didn't work. Um, no.

SPEAKER_01

Um because I'm I'm not a professional therapist. No, it's all good. It's all good.

SPEAKER_00

But I do um I do want your take on this. Because like for me, for instance, the last like nine months or so, I've been really pushing hard in my current job to get um like accolades, presence club, and rep the year, which I did get.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

But it which is good, but I've I've found recently, in particular in the last like couple of months, like on a day by day, I'm going through so much stuff where I'm really busy and I'm doing a bunch of stuff. And then at a point in the day, I feel a little lost in everything I'm doing. So we talk about this brain fog and this clarity where I'm like, I'm doing a bunch of stuff, but I don't know if I'm actually accomplishing anything. And it's hard for me to like kind of like recenter myself in all the chaos to be like, okay, wait, what is like, what is like the thing that I'm actually trying to accomplish here? And why do I feel so stressed out even though I'm doing all this stuff? Like, I should be accomplishing a lot of things. I am accomplishing a lot of things. So why am I still stressed out right now? So what what would your take be on that?

SPEAKER_01

So let's go with what the traditional conventional wisdom would probably say. Like, oh, make a to-do list. Okay. Right? Fix like day.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Right. But you've already done it.

SPEAKER_00

Yes. Right? So the Which does help to some degree because I can look back and be like, I did stuff, they're done, or at least most of it, and now I know like there's a part of the journal like journaling aspect, I guess another way you could call it, where it's like putting your thoughts and things down on paper does help to some degree. Yeah. But clearly it doesn't solve all the issues.

SPEAKER_01

No, it doesn't. So the productivity hacks. Again, those are at the cognitive layer. Sure. Right. And so what happens to us as humans is we hold on to all the stress that we accumulate. Right? Think about the last time you had a very happy, joyous experience. Right? And I'm not saying like tell me when and how long ago or whenever it was.

SPEAKER_00

Because I'm actually genuinely trying to think of going back. I'm like, oh man, it's been it's been because I think it does kind of sap the joy away a little bit. And when you don't, it's hard to stay motivated to do things that you're not finding joy in either.

SPEAKER_01

So And think about whatever that event was, how long did it last? Yeah. Maybe 10 minutes.

unknown

Right?

SPEAKER_01

Maybe you felt good the next day too. Yeah. But quickly after that, it fades. Sure. Okay. When was the last big stressful event you experienced? You don't have to answer, but how long did that last?

SPEAKER_00

Yes. Longer.

SPEAKER_01

How long does that affect us?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, the joy moments are like this like a point in time where you feel away for just a few minutes and then it's quickly gone.

SPEAKER_01

You get the house you always wanted, you get the girl you always wanted, you get the promotion. Sure. And you're like, okay, well, I did that. Now like it doesn't feed you. Right? It's there's an illusion it does, though. There's an illusion, and the chase is fun, right? Because we like to tackle things, right, as accomplishing men. But we hold on, our bodies naturally hold on to the stress and the negative stuff way more than the positive stuff. So what I found the secret to be is we need an effective way to let go and release what we're holding on to, release the stress, like a pressure valve.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Most people don't have an efficient way to do so. Going to the gym can help, meditation can kind of help, right? If you can do it long enough so that it becomes effective, but a lot of people get frustrated because my mind is too loud, it doesn't work for me.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. You know? It's interesting. You know, I should go off on a little bit of a tangent when it comes to meditation. So there's two ways I've heard meditation described to me is uh there's like kind of the eastern view versus the western view, which is the eastern view is you're trying to empty your mind of everything. Whereas the western view is you find one thing to kind of hyper focus on. So like I grew up in a church environment, so like of like biblical meditation is like you pick a verse and you just meditate on that one thing and your mind kind of focuses on that. From your perspective, what do you think meditation is or some of the most effective means of that? What are the most effective means of meditation? Yeah, like have you heard these two different views, or like what's kind of your thoughts around meditation and how it can be usefully applied?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. So what I offer, and not to pitch it, but what I have created as a what I'm teaching people in my my coaching program is something that's an alternative to meditation. Because meditation to me feels like an awareness builder. Okay. It feels like notice your thoughts, but don't do anything about them. Okay. Try to empty your thoughts. One thing that does work, and I think like Andrew Huberman talks about it, it's not even a meditation, it's more of a body-focused exercise. I think it's called progressive muscle relaxation. Okay. Where you progressively like you relax your feet and then your calves, and then your thighs, and then your whole legs, progressively little by little. Okay. And so it's a body-centered thing, not even a mind-centered thing. Right? I think there's a lot of faith and hope that needs to be had by the person who starts meditating to get past the not learning curve, but just the noise in their own minds to be able to sit and do meditation successfully before they really get much benefit out of it.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. No, that makes sense. Well, not to get too much into it because I don't want you to reveal all your cards because people gotta hit you up and figure out everything else. But um, so talking about that, what are some other things? So there's meditation, what are some other things that like can be kind of sort of helpful, but maybe don't quite like get at the root cause that you've seen?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I would say a lot of people like breath work.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

I think breath work is very forced.

SPEAKER_00

Um I think it's good physiologically. Like in the military, we actually learned breath work as well. Yeah. Uh it was it was interesting. We did like a what's called a stress shoot where you put on body armor and you run and do obstacle course, and then uh right before you start getting to take the shots, you they like trained you how to do breath work to kind of relax everything so you can hone in on the shot. But it's purely physiological. I mean, mentally, it did a lot to kind of calm you down because everything's connected. But um, it was weird because I was like, when I was learning, I'm like, all this hippie breathing crap. Like, what's that gonna do in like a gunfight? And then I was like, oh my gosh, that worked. Because like you know, when you're shooting, you you know, after all that, you're like, ah, but then when you focus and breathe, I you could kind of learn to kind of like flow a little bit and then get your shot a lot more focused in after running three miles in body armor.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. And people can have like PRs in the gym once they kind of get back into their body. Because again, all the all the energy is going to the head, right? Because we think so much. So coming back into your body, building that mind-body connection, maybe an answer to your question is doing things that are more physical with your body, right? Whether that's the gym or like obstacle courses, um, something to get your body involved more and get out of your head.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So kind of getting out of the cognitive and being more present outside. That's an interesting, that's an interesting viewpoint. Well, and the reason I I I'm going into this is for a lot of men that are thinking about this, like, yeah, I know it's probably needed, but unless it's like tied into like performance metrics, it's hard to care. So but I think the thing you described, like instance using breathing techniques for the military, using meditation or something else to kind of refocus clarity and some of those other things. I think it it is important if you learn how to do those things. But how how long was that journey for you of realizing not only is it important that I fix this, but there are tools that can actually help me accomplish this.

SPEAKER_01

How long was that?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, how long was that?

SPEAKER_01

Years. Fair enough. Okay. It took me a long time. I think I started meditating in 2017, right before I left. Okay because you know, I heard like Tim Ferris, Oprah, Steve Jobs, a lot of very successful people, like, oh yeah, meditation really helped, right? So I tried to figure it out, but my noise my mind was way too noisy. Sure. So I revisited it, and again, I like read all these different books and just kind of pieced together things that seemed unique and different enough. Um, so it took a long time. And then even once I started doing my own process, I was confused and I was like, I don't even know what this is doing. I just know it's kind of doing something. Sure. Um but yeah, I would have, I would have been probably in a pretty bad place if I never figured that out.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. Um and right now you're running a course where you can basically go through a baseline within about 10 weeks. Okay. What? So let's let's transition a little bit out of the the what the business is to like the model of it and how you're transitioning. Because right now you're in the middle of transitioning from W-2 into this. And you said it's about 50-50 right now?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I'm a part-time contractor. Okay. And then I've got the the new business that I'm starting.

SPEAKER_00

So let me ask you this for a lot of people here that are trying to transition out of W-2 into this, what's your philosophy or what's been working well for you on getting out of something safe and stable, but you don't really want to do for the rest of your life, and to doing something you really want to do. There's a little, there can be fear, there can be excitement. Like, how did you manage that?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, for sure. Um There's several levels to it. You know, the first thing is just decide if you're actually gonna do it or not. You know, a lot of people think it's a nice idea, but they don't actually take the uncomfortable actions to actually take steps in that direction. Right. So that's kind of the first thing. If you're gonna start it, it's going to be hard. And so I would say you have to have a very strong why, or it has to be like that calling, that passion for you. Otherwise, you're not gonna stick with it when times get hard and you're not gonna want to leave the cozy paycheck of the W-2 world. So that also needs to be there.

SPEAKER_00

Because I do think a lot of people they they hear about like drop shipping or or um laundry mats or something like, oh, it's a quick butt. But like, you know, if you're not really passionate about laundry mats, is that really gonna be the thing that's gonna pull you through? Because it's not super sexy. And when it gets hard, and any job worth any side hustle or business worth doing is gonna be hard at some point. Are you gonna stick with it if you're not at least somewhat passionate about it?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. But also like your family can be your why. Yeah. Right. And a man with a strong enough why will bear any how. And so if laundromats is the answer to build the life you want for your family, great. Right? Go for it. Laundromats are great, you know. But that has something there needs to be your towards motivation. Okay. Right? You can't only have the away from motivation. You need a towards motivation that pulls you forward as well. And then what has worked for me is having flexibility of time. So because I went, I quit my W-2 and went contracting part-time, I've had a lot of control and flexibility over my own schedule, which allows me to go out in the middle of the day and network or go to an event or whatever it may be, spend time building my website or something like that. So if you don't have that, then you really have to manage your time. Okay. Especially if you have a family, right? To have the time to actually build a thing or hire somebody if you can go that route too.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So your first thought would be trying to trying to put yourself in a position job-wise, where you have a little more, whether it's remote or I find that sales you get a little bit more freedom too, because it's more on like building connections than necessarily sitting at a desk like working on something. So that's a that's a good piece of advice. Um what how long do you think it'll be before you make this full transition into it? Do you have a timeline or a deadline set in place?

SPEAKER_01

That's a good question. I already told my client that I'm not gonna stay with them forever. So they already know they're building out a team. Okay. Um, and so it's gonna be this balance of growing the revenue to a point where I'm comfortable. And if I have to live off savings for a little bit, then I do. Okay. You know, and that's just something I accept because I'm willing to do it. So I don't know yet what that's gonna look like, especially since I'm about to move, you know, here pretty soon. So there's a lot of faith and trust that I have in trusting the process and just trusting my calling and taking the next step, even when you can't see all the way down the highway.

SPEAKER_00

What's your bottleneck right now that's keeping that business from really flourishing?

SPEAKER_01

Uh yeah, it's it's having the product market fit. You know, when it comes to something like stress relief, let's call it, it's such a broad term, such a broad niche. There's so many ways you can go. And I have a personality where it's like I want to help everybody. And if you're trying to help everybody, you're gonna help nobody. Sure. So narrowing that down and just really deciding and getting traction in a lane is kind of where I'm at.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So kind of developing the ideal customer profile and kind of where to go from there. Okay. No, that makes sense. Um how like how is that journey, I guess, going? Are you do you find like you're finding that, or are you still kind of in the journey of figuring out what that ideal customer profile is?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's it's evolved over the years and it's getting closer. Like we just had a a really great session with the standard, some of the guys from the standard. Um, I think it was yesterday, a couple of days ago, where we all dived into each other's businesses a little bit. Yeah. And they were saying, like, Andre, go the corporate route, corporate wellness, which would be interesting. I hadn't really thought of that too much before. Yeah, it was a big thing, yeah. But I came from the corporate world, right? Sure. So like it makes sense. Like it could be a very relatable way in. Um, I was just targeting, you know, ambitious men. Um, I mean, I've worked with women too. So anyone who's like stressed out enough that they gotta do something so that they can get their performance back or their health back. You know, so it's been kind of scattered up until this point.

SPEAKER_00

Well, you know, you just talked about like kind of the boardroom meeting that you did with the standard. How long have you been with the standard for?

SPEAKER_01

Almost two years, like a year and a half at least.

SPEAKER_00

What made you want to join in the first place?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it was so I've been part of a lot of communities over the years, right? So the travel one I told you about, a couple other business ones or entrepreneur ones, but there was always that part of me that was searching for more in a community. And the standard was the first one that I found that it wasn't just a business community, it wasn't just a traveling community, it wasn't just any like that, it was everything. A multifaceted identity. We want to be men of excellence in all areas of life. And I was like, yeah, that's me. Finally, like I found these people. Sure, sure, sure, yeah. So I had just moved to Tampa from Puerto Rico, and I didn't know anybody. And so it was exactly what I was looking for at the time. I was like, perfect. I found well, it took me a while to find them and joined, but I was like, this is this has been the thing that I've been wanting, right? Because every other community felt like it was missing something, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_00

You said you went on a trip. Was it last year with Standard, or what when was that?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, so I went to Mykonos and to um Dubai last year. Excellent. Yes, super cool. So fun, man. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

So fun. Good deal. Yeah, it was great. All right. Well, you found you found that group there, which is kind of why they're you're on here today. Uh, one big pillar with the standard and with us in general is a legacy. And so I know you're talking about family and all that kind of stuff. It was, they mentioned that a lot at the conference last year, which is what is the kind of legacy that you want to leave behind? So, what does that mean to you?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, that's a good question. And something that's been on my mind because I've struggled with it, to be honest. Yeah. You know, because of the family environment that I grew up in, yeah, family hasn't been a very strong pillar in my life. I mean, I left California 10 years ago, you know, and I've been away from them for so long. So since I joined the standard, it's been fantastic to help bring that perspective back into my life.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

It's part of why I'm moving back to California. Yeah, that's awesome. Back to be closer with my family. So something around um how important it is to support the people around you. And even if I have a successful family or not in my own future, right? Like if I want kids, I'll have to decide that. Um but having leaving something behind that positively impacts the next generation. And not just the next generation, but the community, whether that's just the family or the extended family, or the city I live in, the neighborhood, or just humanity as a whole. So leaving a positive impact, um, whether it's within my own family or just in my community, is what I'm going for.

SPEAKER_00

I had a discussion with my pastor, so him and his wife can't have kids. And so we kind of asked them a similar question in a in a different show. And he was talking very much about just like the he wants to be known, not necessarily by what he's leaving behind, like when people think of him, but just on like the values that he represents. I like that more or less, which I thought was very interesting, which I I like the values that he brought on here. I mean, this has been a really interesting discussion and a really interesting talk. Um, usually one of the final questions you usually ask is like, what do you want to be remembered as whenever, you know, the day that we all eventually fade away.

SPEAKER_01

Which is coming. Well, yeah, it comes for us all at some point, yeah. Yep, can't get away from it. I think what's driven me over the years, a big part of it is innovation. And Silicon Valley is about innovation, right? That's what created Silicon Valley. It's like we have new solutions to problems that are innovative and they're gonna change the world. I don't need to change the world, you know, but uh I do want to instill some change and being somebody who didn't just follow the script. Okay, being somebody who broke his way outside of the box and found innovative ways and pursued them to whatever degree of success, but followed what he wanted to do because it was the right thing for him and not somebody else's agenda.

SPEAKER_00

As you're building this new business, uh, we want to be able to plug you in for people that want to find you. But how can people find you if they have more questions about this wellness brand that you're developing?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, sure. So my website is tophuman.co. I'm on Instagram as tophuman with an underscore on either side. Okay. That's probably the easiest way to find me these days.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So you can find you that way. Okay. Well, hey, man, I appreciate you, Tom, and coming on here and speaking to all of us. Thanks a lot, Mitchell. Really enjoyed our conversation.