Episode 2 - The Reality of Youth Homelessness

In this episode, we have a real, unfiltered conversation about what youth homelessness actually looks and feels like, and why so many people get it wrong. We talk about the frustration of hearing homelessness reduced to simple “solutions”, ignoring the trauma, dignity, and humanity of people going through it.

Drawing from lived experience, we get into the emotional weight of instability, the stigma and judgment people face, and how easy it is for others to look away or misunderstand. Rising rent, low wages, broken systems, and why quick fixes don’t lead to real, lasting change.

More than anything, we ask people to lead with empathy, question what they’ve been told, and recognize that homelessness isn’t some distant issue, it’s something that could impact anyone.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:08

The views and opinions expressed are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of any entities that they may represent.

SPEAKER_07 0:14

Hello and welcome to the System Remix Podcast. It's your host, JW, and I'm joined here with Janae.

SPEAKER_04 0:22

Hi.

SPEAKER_07 0:22

I'm also joined with Mel Dam Miami. Come on now. And Crish. Daphne. And also Daphne. Marley. And Marley. Welcome everybody. We also have behind the camera Miss Natasha. Hey, say and I'm so excited to have you guys here today. Fun fact about these lovely people here at the table with me, they are all Yab members in some way, shape, form, or fashion. Feel free to just let the people know a little bit about your Yabs. I'm, of course, part of the Youth Action Society of Central Florida. And anybody can go, really, no particular order.

SPEAKER_05 0:56

Maybe we can go in the order in which we introduce ourselves. Sure, Jenny.

SPEAKER_04 1:01

So I have been a Youth Voice Action Collective member a little over four years now. Based out of Miami Dave County. Thanks.

SPEAKER_05 1:13

Mel again. Currently I am the communications associate for the Youth Voice Action Collective through Miami Holmes Raw. I'm the communications and marketing chair for Florida Youth Shrine, the leading foster care reform organization in Florida. And I'm also part of Fly as a captain, and I'm overseeing the Communications and Marketing Committee. Dope. And yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:42

I'm Crushe, but you can call me Shay. I am currently the social media manager of the Charlotte County YAB. I am also a part of Fly and I am under the Marketing Committee as well.

SPEAKER_01 1:56

I got a lot going on. So um I'm part of uh the National Council. I'm representing Florida. Also part of FLI. I'm a secretary for LSF's Youth Advisory Board and then president for Charlotte County Action Board.

SPEAKER_02 2:10

My name is Marley. I'm part of Fly, part of the data community. And outside of that, I'm very passionate about education and the different resources that's available to us. I feel like there's not enough of like information out there for people to get access to the resources that are available to them. Currently, I'm doing an Americorpse program with Cityer where we work with Title I schools and we help get their scores up, help them just overall being their mentor, and I'm always trying to impact my community.

SPEAKER_07 2:50

That's dope. For sure. Thank you guys for being here. For people who maybe don't know, the youth action boards are essentially groups of young people between most times between the ages of 16 to 24 who have some kind of lived experience, right? In this case, we all have lived experience of being unhoused, right? We have lived experience of homelessness. So we've been a part of these YABs really for a while. All of our communities have been awarded some kind of funding in some way, shape, form, or fashion for young adults who are experiencing homelessness. And some of our CLCs even like support in homelessness in different capacities, right? Like whether that's elders or just general, the general population, right? Of people who don't have a place to stay. And for today's podcast, we're actually gonna be answering some questions, just kind of having a bit of open discussion. I think a lot of us have spoken to each other. The reason that all of us are connected is of course we're part of youth action boards, but we are now connected through FLY, which is a statewide youth action board movement, and it's essentially just to bring a bunch of people who have experience of homelessness in different places in Florida because homelessness looks different across the state. So yeah, I don't know if anybody wanted to start off with anything in particular, but I'm so down.

SPEAKER_05 4:03

I feel like there's a huge disconnect between people who are in the work and people who think they know about the work, in the sense of like, when I talk to people who are not in this work and they don't see the problem with criminalizing homeless people or like criminalizing homelessness, and they're like, Oh, but you know, they're gonna have a bed, they're gonna eat at the jail. And I'm like, bro, if it was really that easy, I would have just walked up to the jail and be like, take me, please, yeah, give me a bed, give me some food. Like, like, we're not gonna romanticize jail. Yeah, what we're not gonna do is that, and it's just like it's almost like the lack of compassion and the lack of empathy and just like awareness as a whole, is it's just like like we're not gonna create a thousand Malcolm Xs who are going to get their lives together going back in jail. Like, if anything, for a lot of folk, going to jail is a confirmation that they're not worthy of anything greater, you know? So it's just like we don't talk about the emotional trauma that comes with one being homeless, two, feeling like nothing is ever gonna come. Some people really don't believe there's like an other side to the tunnel. They think that the like, oh, I belong in this tunnel and I deserve the tunnel. And it's like I wish people who are not in this work can really just like think critically, because it's like the work isn't easy, the work is taxing both physically and emotionally, yeah. And in another, in other ways, it's like disrespectful to us who are doing the work because it's like y'all don't see what we see every single day.

SPEAKER_07 5:42

True, so true. You spoke about criminalizing homelessness. How do the rest of you guys feel about that? Like that that that could change because I I feel like I've been thinking about that for a little over a year now. I mean, they've been doing that for quite some time, and I don't think it's the right solution either. Like, I I don't think it's right. Romanticizing jail, heavy on romanticizing jail because there's nothing fun or comfortable about jail.

SPEAKER_06 6:07

Right.

SPEAKER_07 6:08

The freaking beds are cold and hard, right? And you're sleeping on a cot that barely has any filling in it. Yeah. Facts. Literally, literally, it doesn't make sense.

SPEAKER_03 6:22

So, like, I feel like the people that don't understand, they're mostly the people that have never even thought about what it's like to not have anywhere to go. Like, they always had somewhere to go, even if that's a parent's house or friend's house. But there are literally people that have actually no place to go and they don't know what it's like.

unknown 6:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:44

America's one of America's values is freedom. So, like romanticizing criminal like the jail is like hypocrite, basically, because being in that jail and putting those youth in those jails for because they have food and a place to sleep and you know, people to socialize, it's it blows my mind because you know, we're saying plus these politicians have all the freedom in the world, so they don't there's not even a space in their mind to even like the there's not even a space in their mind for this part of the world, you know what I mean? So, like the middle class and the class lower than them. So romanticizing jail for them is a whole different aspect because it's a place for them to stay instead of you know it's like dehumanization, like we don't even exist as humans.

SPEAKER_05 7:34

Yeah, we're animals. Like, look, you have your cage, you have your food, you have your bed, it's hard, but you could rest your head on it.

SPEAKER_01 7:41

Right, right.

SPEAKER_05 7:42

I don't think they see that like golden retrievers get treated better.

SPEAKER_07 7:46

No, okay, but like why is that so real though? Like, some people care about dogs more than they care about people, and I'm honestly s like I'm like I'm scared, I'm sick and tired, I'm fed up.

SPEAKER_05 8:01

Like, think of another cat. Like, did you take your vitamins today? Oh, you're there's a little speck on your paw. Oh, let me get that for you. Let me fix that. Let me fix that.

SPEAKER_07 8:10

Okay, look at your outfit today, isn't it so cute? I mean, a great point is being brought up though, right? Like, think about how much how much value people will assign to an animal before they do a person. Especially like people that take in straight cats every day. Every day. And no, no, the cat and his kittens. No, the same. Because you know it's out there being fast.

SPEAKER_05 8:33

The same baddies at the corner that have a whole congregation of cats. No, and they're like, Fifi, you got yours today. Choo G, you I already fed you today, but here's another plate. But are they at the homeless shelter being like, you got resources, you got resources, I got a number for you to call. Yeah. Like, it's not, it's not the same. It's very sad. It's othering too, because it's not even a thing of like they're giving more attention to people. It's a I personally believe that some people don't think that homeless people are people. Like it's like there's us and then there's them. Those homeless people don't look at them when they're coming up to our cars. Don't even like like it's almost like there's a huge like othering that happens when we encounter homeless people.

SPEAKER_04 9:19

But I'd also say that even within like our own systems, in a way, like there is like a hierarchy in a way, of like, you know, we all understand that like the homeless experience like is not a monolith, and like everyone has their own experiences. But even like when it comes to like sometimes like systems, like systems will look at like folks who have been chronically unhoused in the streets in a very different way, be very like you know, almost unwilling to like provide services to them because there's kind of like a association or like a stigma of like there's no helping, like they've been on the streets this long, they want to be there. If we put them somewhere, they're gonna ruin it. You know, it's it's it's even like we gotta address like the things that are even within our own systems, and at the end of the day, like America is thriving on incarceration rates, they've been thriving on incarceration rates, like with the criminalization of homelessness, like we know that that happened like during like you know, the war on drugs, how it it's historically happened within communities of color through the school to prison pipeline. This is just the newest iteration of a system that has existed for years and will continue to exist for years because of the way that our economy and just the United States of America has been. We are the richest country, and yet we are treating people who literally have no choice and cannot afford housing as the bottom of the bear.

SPEAKER_05 10:44

It's almost like there's this continuous moving of the goalpost where it's like, yes, this is how you this is you achieve success and prosperity and abundance. And then it's like actually, there's a software update on abundance, and you have to download it, but you have to pay money to download the new software, and if you can't afford it, then like sucks to be you, I guess. You really don't want to be successful, I guess. Yeah. So it's just kind of like I'm trying to think of like a time in our history where like we really had to work this hard just to be well. Like, like, do animals work this hard in the wildlife to be this hard? But it's just like the stipulations that we have towards like success in this country is actually insane to me because then you have people who are graduating right now with their bachelor's not being able to obtain a job. You have people who have jobs and still can't even afford to pay their rent. Like when I was homeless the first time, there were nurses at the homeless shelter during COVID. So imagine in the midst of a pandemic, like you're trying to save people's lives, making sure that you're well and not trying to get everybody else infected at the shelter. So even just like the misconceptions that we have of like who is the face of homelessness, it's everybody at this point. It's everybody now. Yeah. It's your teachers, it's your like nobody's immune to it. And this idea of like, oh, well, that can never be me. Honey bun, you are one medical emergency, national disaster, loss or death in the family from being homeless. Don't think that you're better than us because it could happen to you at any point in time, it could happen right now. I don't want to go back, it could happen at any point, and it can happen multiple times. Yeah. So it's just like it's it's definitely like a cultural problem more than anything else, but also like the culture influences the policy, it influences the legislation, it influences so much, and we also never talk about that proponent of like what is wrong with our culture that we do not think these people deserve resources, time, attention, and and empathy for the most part.

SPEAKER_07 12:45

I mean, a great point though. Where where is the shift in the narrative? Because at the end of the day, even the richest of the rich, a lot of those people came from not sometimes not the best situation. So you would think, I would hope and pray that there's some people in you know legislation that are like, hey, these people are really being impacted like by this. I've been through this. I just I don't know why those voices aren't as loud. Because I because it just makes me feel like, is it that people are forgetting where they came from? Have they just have they literally most of them just never struggled in their life, and so they just legitimately don't understand what that's like? I feel like I'm trying to really wrap my head around it because for me, it's like though you you may not see the everyday life of a person who's experiencing instability, whether that be financial hardships or your living situation or whatever that looks like, how do you not see it? There was a doctor who told us it would only take about five billion dollars to end homelessness in the state of Florida. Right. And for me, I'm just like, I think it'll probably even take a little bit more. You know, five billion dollars, how far is that really gonna go?

SPEAKER_05 13:56

Like when I see people like Jeff Bezos, sorry to call you out Jeff Bezos, throwing a tacky wedding in Italy, I'm like, that's cool and all. But what about the people that live in your neighborhoods or that like like you are a valid Victorian of Miami Palmetto Senior High, and what have you done with that? But it's just like, you know, like billionaires used to do things. I mean, even going back to before that, like you had like your Egyptian pharaohs and like priestesses donating, like telling people, like, we about to make this holy temple right here. We about to make a cathedral right over there for the people to worship. Like they would donate their ideas, their time, their resources to society. Even like the dukes and the lords back in the day, the king would give them their money and be like give it back to your village and like, okay, village, we eating good today. We having a feast with this surplus of money, y'all. We about to have a festival. So it's like, y'all are getting the money, hoarding the money, and then for what? You build a spaceship to take five of your little besties to brunch and the and the in the in the atmosphere. So it's just kind of like at what point, or even like putting a little submarine to see the Titanic. For what? God knows facts. God knows. Because it's just kind of like, so at what point do we consider that we're all adults and we have to contribute something to someone or to something? Like we live in this like weird individualistic, like, yeah, this is me and mine. So it's like, no, like you share a planet with all of us, dog. You share the street with us, you share the neighborhood, the country, the state. Like, what are you doing?

SPEAKER_04 15:23

Agreed, but like, because of how like our country is just structured, like, he'll never see the struggles of like a homeless person because he lives in his bubble. The same way that like all of us who live in working class neighborhoods, like, it's just such a systemic issue. And like, I personally feel like it's completely unethical to be a billionaire. Earned it off the backs of your low-wage workers who are literally in the most unsafe work conditions, and treated like the end of the day, you're always going to success off of the backs of oppressed.

SPEAKER_07 15:56

Of other people, of other people. And you know what? At the end of the day, we come from the perspective of people who have been in very sometimes precarious, uncomfortable, terrible situations, traumatic, traumatizing situations that just nobody should have to go through.

SPEAKER_05 16:16

So before anybody hears this and is like, oh, people sound like some young people who just want to talk crap about us because we have money. I've lived with raps. Don't mess with me.

SPEAKER_07 16:27

I'll send the raps in. Like, think about the people who unfortunately they're not gonna get to go to school because they have to take care of their parents' kids, right? Their little siblings, right? Or they're not gonna be able to afford a meal before they go to sleep. They're gonna go to sleep hungry, right?

SPEAKER_05 16:45

But also, like, this is never that. This is like tailored as old as time. Like, whenever I think about unethical billionaires, I think about that one part of the Christmas carol where Ebenezer Scrooge is like trying to work through Christmas, his employees are like, please, sir, I would like to see my family for Christmas. And he's like, no mom. And them three ghosts went to his bedroom at midnight, been like, You go to hell. You gonna hell. So it's it's like this these complaints have been in our history for a long time. Yeah, the story of King Might is like you don't want all that gold, son. That's that gold gonna kill you. So it's like, when are we gonna learn this lesson for real? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:30

Because it's not gonna last forever, and they're just gonna turn a blind eye to us, like, oh, we tried, so whatever.

SPEAKER_04 17:38

If they don't put money in the pockets of people who are homeless, yeah, you can get out of a situation versus funding more projects and more projects and hiring more staff, and like it's great, but at the same time, like it's it's in a way like creating more of these systems or like more of these safety nets versus like increasing wages and increasing money is not going to be able to make sure that that person can sustain housing for the rest of their life. It's like, okay, you're good for two years, or you're good for five years, or you're good for maybe six, seven. But when is that going to continue? When we know that the cost of living is going to continue to rise every year. Wages have been stagnated for decades. Like, I was watching High Fidelity the other day, and he was talking about like he was he was in an argument with like you know his ex, and he was like, What are you making now? 65k, 75k? I was like, that's a lot of money back in the day. I googled it that like you would have to make around like 120 to like 115k today to have the same purchasing power as that, and it's like that was just you know 25 years ago, that's gonna continue to snowball. Yeah, so at the end of the day, I think that if we put money in the pockets of people, yes, I think that's a way more sustainable solution than like making another transitional housing program because we're doing more of this, doing more of that, and I love it, I work in this system, but to get to the root cause, we need to address money, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 19:17

That and like I think also going back to like the cultural aspect too, is that we can't just throw this money around and just be like, Yeah, it's gonna be solved in a year, it's gonna take a long time to do these restorative practices, not only for us to build that infrastructure, but also for the quote unquote clients. Because even in my own personal experience, like I was in a transitional housing program that focused mainly on education. Like, as long as you're in school, you're gonna be paying your rent for like 400 bucks. Which at the time and even now, that's like nothing. That's pennies that you're paying for. On the other hand, I was dealing with a lot of mental health issues that also prevented me from continuing my education, which I did utilize that time to see two therapists at the same time, one for ADHD and one for like PTSD. I don't know how to self-regulate my emotions. But it's like we can't expect that we're just gonna have like a like a one-size-fits-all solution for everybody, and just be like, okay, so like we have the formula, why don't you work with the formula? Like, no, like everybody has like their own set of problems, whether they're disabled, whether if they have to navigate through immigration problems, or they've been through the foster care system, they don't have access to their records. Like, there's all these different things that we have to like one, create true collaboration between these systems, and two, also like there's not enough research on one failed adoptions, because we're seeing the numbers rise with adopted youth become homeless because their adopted parents kick them out after they turn 18. Like, there's so many things that we're not even considering that is also contributing to the causes of homelessness that it's like we have to do like an internal huddle of being like, okay, like what are the things that we need to focus on? Who are we forgetting when we have these conversations and document these things, create research, find out why is it that people are struggling once they transition out of transitional housing? Like, why is it that like they don't have access to higher education? What's stopping them from receiving their bachelor's or even their master's or whatever? Like, like there's all these different thoroughs that we just don't talk about. Right. And it's just like if we really want to create true sustainability instead of being like, oh, well, I got that person out of the shelter, okay. What happened after that then? Yeah. Like if they didn't stay, like if they went back into the shelter six months or a year after leaving, we didn't really do much, did we? Years not that long to be to be unhoused. So it's just kind of like we really have to have these conversations of like, how do we create true long lasting sustainability within our neighborhoods, within our our systems? Like, like I'm sick and Tired of the like, oh, we have funding and we created this project and we have five clients, and like, you know, after they were done with our program, we don't know what happened to them. They were under your care for two or three years. Like, what do you mean you don't know what happened to them? So it's just like it's a part of it is really just like the cultural problem of like making things transactional and being like, yeah, like I did my part of the contract. No, your part of the contract continues after the quote unquote work is done. That's when the true success and the true results really happen.

SPEAKER_07 22:26

Yo, what do y'all think would help with that though? Because I'm thinking, is it's a social media platform that youth get connected to, you know, once case management ends? Would that even help? Like, do you think people would use it? I or is it that people, the people, the case management should be continuing to follow up? Just for me, being a person who's on the service provider end capacity. I feel like since we're talking about it, it's a great conversation. Like, what do you guys think will help to keep youth connected even after services end? Because, especially given, like, we were literally talking about this yesterday. Like, right now is the time to be organizing. You said that, Mel. I literally, I just got deja vu. You literally said that. Like, right now is the time to be organizing because a year from now, it's gonna be a drought, it's gonna get dry. It's gonna be a long winter. It's gonna be a long winter. It's gonna be a long, long, long winter. And hopefully not, right? Fundraising is gonna be huge. I feel like we could really actually do something about it. It's gonna be huge next year. Absolutely. And if we could if we could do something right now that would yeah, facts, because I mean, we see it for ourselves, right? Like paying rent is hard. Like, we just I'm not gonna put y'all rent out there, but mine, high. Okay, like rent is expensive. The headphones almost fell off. That's how high the rent is. Because it's ridiculous. And then that's not like when you're paying rent, it's like you're paying rent and then you gotta deal with your utilities. You gotta you gotta pay your wi-fi because you can't even live without Wi-Fi these days. Like, your your whole life is connected to your phone, so you need it, you know. It's like become a need. If you want to get work done, you need your phone. If you're working from home, you need your wi-fi, right? Like, you need your electricity, all that stuff needs to get paid. So, but it's not getting easier to pay it, it's just getting harder. Like, we spoke about like rates of pay from years ago, right? Like, where a 65,000 salary was $120,000. Think about a person $120,000 now. That sounds like a lot, but what I've heard is a lot of them is living paycheck to paycheck. So, I don't know. Like, what do you guys think?

SPEAKER_03 24:27

I know that was a long question. Like, yes, okay, you give us the money, boom, we got the money. But there's more to that. Yeah, we need to know how to manage that money, how to keep that money, how to save that money, how to spend that money, and how to invest the money, and even beyond the money, how to keep our mental in the same aspect of us paying all these bills. This is our first time doing this. We don't know what the heck to do. Yeah, so it's just like it's so much for us. We don't we really just are blank, like I know thinking about all that just makes your mind just go blank. You don't even want to think about it no more. Yeah, and that's the mental health that comes behind it. It's more than just not having the money, it's not having the mental, not having the money, not having anything, any support and all of that goes into it as well. So it's not just a money thing.

SPEAKER_05 25:17

Yeah, it's money money. And I think too, it's also learning how to honor your money. Because I've seen so many people pay so much for nothing. Yeah, like I'm just kinda like they're like like I remember one time when I was transitioning out of transitional housing and I was looking at a place and it was like $1,200, and my budget was like $1,300, given with the the 30% of your income, she big or whatever. And I I just remember like just like the atmosphere. I was kind of like, there's no way that I'm paying this much for this. And then on top of that, she was like, Oh, do you have a boyfriend? And I was like, No, she's like, Oh, that's good because I wouldn't want you to bring anybody over here, and I'm like, now, now this is unethical. Now you're trying to micromanage who I bring over to the place that I'm paying for. Like, I understand like the whole thing of like being a little bit too bougie or like being too picky, whatever, but some things you should not compromise. Yeah, like disrespect from your landlord. Like, I've known people who their landlords would turn off their electricity on some petty stuff when like that's illegal, that's super illegal. Like, like you can't be doing that, but it's just like some people like really be paying so much, and they're like, Yeah, it's Miami. And I'm like, no, this is Liberty City. No, there's roaches in this building. I don't know the difference, but I can tell that I'm not sure. But it's also just like it's like, why am I paying so much when there's known to be rats in this building? Like, don't don't try to like sell me a dream and then I scratch the surface and then it fall apart. Also, like don't apart. I'm paying this much and there's mold in this building. Yeah, like like be so for real. Like, have respect on my money. Like, I've met people who on the other side of things, their landlord was like, oh, we're raising your rent by 30%. And they were like, no, that's not gonna happen. And you know what? How about you renew my furniture? And if you want me to stay, you keep my rent the same. Yeah, it's either that or I leave. And they're like, no, sir, please we'll we'll we'll replace your furniture and we'll keep your rent the same. Please just don't leave. And it's like, dog, what? So it's just like the whole people really don't know how to put their money into honoring themselves. Yeah, like we don't teach one like our youth or even just like our clients, like how to really look for units. Like, if there is like what, like the laundry in the bathroom, I've seen units like that where it's like the the laundry is in the bathroom next to the shower. Yeah, I'm like, who made this layout, dog? And you're putting all this money on it to pay rent and be like, yeah, all that, and no utilities included. What am I paying for, dog? So it's just like there's the the homeless issue, and there's also just like the landlord issue that we never talk about. Because we're always like, yeah, but there's good landlords out there, and yes, 100%, but we never talk about the predatory practices that happens with bad landlords. We always focus on, like, no, you have to believe in the good ones. But can we talk about the signs and the red flags with the bad ones? We always see them as like this ominous bad guy of like, oh, beware, beware of the slumlord. But we never talk about the slum lord. Yeah. What do they look like? What do they do? What do they sound like? What are the practices in the leafs that are super messed up and predatory? We don't teach people to read the leafs. We're like, oh, you can afford it to sign.

SPEAKER_03 28:35

Yeah.

unknown 28:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:36

That's about it. And it's like, oh, well, you have nowhere to go, so you you might as well just stay here. Right. It's either this or the brand. No, I don't want to be able to do it. I don't want to be here. Yeah. Like, I want somewhere where I'm comfortable, where I feel like I this is home. Yeah. But it's like, well, you're homeless, so you need it.

unknown 28:51

No.

SPEAKER_07 28:52

And I don't. I don't need to take this. No. And honestly, you know, I'll talk about this. Like, I've heard that a few times, even in case management, right? Where people will, you know, they'll be waiting for a unit and then they come, they get a unit, but it is not what they signed up for. Rat infestations, mold, fire damage, things like that, where people, they then they want to be it's somewhere stable, but then it's like, bro, I don't want to be in this place where I'm hearing squeak, squeak in my wall.

SPEAKER_05 29:25

I hated that sound every it's like three in the morning, and you're like, no, I'm not crazy.

SPEAKER_04 29:32

You turn on the light and all the roaches just disappeared.

SPEAKER_07 29:37

This is horrible. Recently, the hot water in my apartment stopped working, and then I found out it was because there was a leak from my water heater that was going to the bottom of my apartment. No. But that's not that bad. I heard recently, actually, I didn't know that there were rats in Central Florida. You know, I'm from New York, so I know there's rats in New York City. Not as big as the ones in New York, I'll tell you that.

SPEAKER_03 30:07

That's perfect. Yep.