Episode 3: Facing Demons and Finding Purpose with Vietnam Veteran Joe Ruszala

Joe Ruszala, a Vietnam veteran, shares his story, his struggles, and how he finally was able to come all the way home through healing, revisiting, and coming to terms with the dark, facing demons to allow better angels to come out, unseen soul injuries, the importance of telling your story, his struggles with PTSD (post-traumatic stress disorder), mental health, finding silver linings, and the creation of his memoirs, The Disappearing Man.

Notes:

• This episode contains discussions of mental health and suicide. For help, please dial the Suicide and Crisis Lifeline at 998 or visit spotify.com/resources. If you are a veteran, visit va.gov and search “mental health resources.”
• Guest host: Seema Mojawalla, subbing for Fahim Mojawalla
• For more information on Joe Ruszala and his work with Island Ship Center, visit islandshipcenter.com/producing-books-for-joe-to-help-with-ptsd
• To purchase a copy of Joe’s book, The Disappearing Man, search “The Dissappearing Man” (with two s’s) on Facebook
• For more information on Shellback Farms in Silver Creek, New York, search “Shellback Farms” on Facebook or email shellback268@gmail.com
• To watch or listen to the episode IMO with Michelle Obama and Craig Robinson that was referenced about grief with guest Anderson Cooper, visit imopod.com/episodes/hold-space-for-grief-with-anderson-cooper
• For more information on AYM High Consultants, visit aymhigh.com
• For more episodes of MoJo Motivation™, please visit mojomotivation.com
• For more information on Island Ship Center, visit islandshipcenter.com 
• MoJo Motivation’s four mantra words for 2026: opportunity, generosity, authenticity, and gratitude

Episode Run Time: 37:52

Episode Recorded: January 2026

Episode Released: April 2026

Please leave MoJo Motivation™ a review and be sure to follow on your favorite podcast platform and/or on YouTube so you never miss an episode.

Episode copyright 2026 Social Media & Design Coaches LLC, dba AYM High Consultants, all rights reserved.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

This episode of Mojo Motivation contains discussions about suicide, mental health, and substance abuse. Please listen with care.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

Tackling this project, we're look asking the wrong question. It's what happened.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

Find a way to live life grateful that you have another day.

SPEAKER_00 0:17

You can get through it alone. You have to have people that are solidly in your corner, even when you're being a you're gonna bleep down.

SPEAKER_02 0:37

Welcome to Mojo Motivation, the official podcast of Aim High Consultants.

SPEAKER_01 0:43

I am Seema Majowala filling in for my husband and partner, Fahim Majowala.

SPEAKER_02 0:49

And I'm Marty Johnson.

SPEAKER_01 0:53

Because everyone needs a thumble.

SPEAKER_02 0:54

And everyone needs a little jumbo.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

I am feeling it.

SPEAKER_02 0:59

I love it. That's great. You did great, Seema. I love it.

SPEAKER_01 1:05

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 1:07

Appreciate that you could pinch hit right now. Um but Sima is for our listeners who don't know, um, the third part but most important part of our consulting group, Aim High Consultants. So Seema's our rock. She's the uh the reality check between Feme and I, who are a little bit flighty at times, but Sima's like she's stable. And she's kind words. Yeah, so so glad you could be here today. And it's very appropriate. Our guest today, Joe, has um has worked with you quite a bit, and you've been an integral part in getting a book of his ready to go so that it could be sold and published.

SPEAKER_01 1:46

Yes. Uh so we have a dear friend of ours, Pablo Hortado, and client. He came in one day and he asked us, hey, you know, I have a request to do, I've been trying to work this out, I've been sitting on this for years, and um, I have a really close friend that needs help. Are you able to help me out on a project? And I said, sure, what's the project? He's like, Well, you know, he has a life memoir that he would like to get published and put into a book format. Can you help with that? So I said, Yeah, why don't you uh have us connected and then we'll see what we can do. So then uh I guess Pablo went back, called you up, and then you called me.

SPEAKER_00 2:23

Uh yeah, we had dinner, he came in with a black and white proof that you guys had thrown together. And it was a lifelong dream for me. I just in a million years, this is never gonna happen. It was a bucket list item for me to publish to tell my story. And he did it. And he gave me you guys name and this call. So Courtney, who was an assistant, he had uh the operations under this thing. We came in and had a several meetings with you. Oh, yes, quite hard.

SPEAKER_01 2:49

We we sat probably like about five times, yeah, five meetings that we had going back and forth. So for changes.

SPEAKER_00 2:54

Yeah, it was to take this idea and how are we gonna do this? And there was a a challenge. Uh I walked in with this thing, and this was actually the memoir, the notes, handwritten. And I gave it to him, and then through a connection, we had to come up with a title for this thing. It's called The Disappearing Man. And I'll get into that in a bit. So it's how are we gonna do this stuff? So a collaboration with uh with you guys was uh what are we gonna do for a cover? And you know, what can we do? Wouldn't it be cool if we did this? And what makes the the book unique is it doesn't look like an any other book, it does not have a stitch binding by design. Um it's very raw because there's two stories involved here. One is my story, I'm a Vietnam veteran, and uh the year that shaped me when I was 20 years old was 1968. So the disappearing man is me, and uh then the the other story is why this book looks the way it looks, and the approach was is to be different. I'm different, and I embrace my differentness. And so when they put this together, they came up with this and it blew me away because it is actually my handwritten notes that are actually the book. So you not only read the words or hear the story, but you see the story, how it develops, and my handwriting changes as I get into some of these difficult moments uh in telling my story, and my story is about coming back all the way home from Vietnam. Um, and there's also uh changes and crossouts and misspelling. Sorry, Mrs. Legerski in English class. I am not a writer, I would it was not my intention to be Longfellow or prose or anything, it was just for me to tell my story, and for me just being me, and you'll see that. And one of the challenges were uh I carried this map every every day with me for nine months, and my life in Vietnam handled happened along Highway One, which are all these checkpoints. Now keep in mind this is before GPS, it's before cell phones, before computers. So, how do I integrate this in the book? And somehow these guys did it. And in the construction of the book, to tell my story, we have one of these, so this comes out. So you get to go down the road with me, literally. And this was a challenge and makes this book very, very unique. And the feedback that I've gotten from people that have bought this thing said that I feel like I'm going down the road with you, which was the original intention.

SPEAKER_02 5:35

Well, our when we um when Sima's on our team, we call her SEMA solves. And if we need a solution and SEMA, so I have a feeling that you had something to do with the thought of that rolled out thing.

SPEAKER_01 5:46

So yeah, when when Joe came, um we were bouncing around ideas. It was um, do we type out right typewriter the whole thing, get it all properly written and in text format? Yeah. And then um, we're talking about his emotions and the feelings that he went through while writing the book. And then we I just came up with that idea. I was like, well, if it's you know, that's important. It's an important part of you, it's an important part of your book that needs to be that people that people should be able to hold it and feel it and see what it is.

SPEAKER_02 6:18

And the image of the handwriting probably tells more, it tells just as much as the story tells, maybe. Um, and so for this, for this podcast season, we have four words we chose to kind of focus on. And those are opportunity, generosity, authenticity, and gratitude. And Joe, you and I were talking a little bit before this, and you told me some of your story, which I hope you'll share with our listeners a little bit, um, not only about being in in Vietnam, what you experienced, um, but the the challenges you had when you came home and what has helped you to find yourself and come home all the way. But I think authenticity is really where it comes from. Um, so if if I'm not mistaken, you had to really find your authentic what what was really going on there, and then in sharing that, you were able to start healing a little more.

SPEAKER_00 7:08

Um the whole the whole book is a a story of healing. Yeah um just a quick review. Um, I'm 78 years old and I was diagnosed with PTSD in 2002. Um I didn't come all the way home. I felt like it never fit in. Um it led to a whole bunch of challenges. Um for years people kept asking me, what's wrong with you, what's wrong with you. And after we in a tackling this project, we're look asking the wrong question, it's what happened to you.

unknown 7:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:40

Now, my what happened to me is is unique to me, but a lot of other folks, and not necessarily military or veterans, are going through the same challenges. What it's not what's wrong with you, it's what happened to you.

SPEAKER_02 7:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:52

And in order to heal, you have to go back to those places, them dark spots where it kind of began, and then you come to terms with it, and you have to let it out. And I've been in counseling at the VA for what, 24 years, and uh there are lots of ways to express yourself. Uh I chose to to pick up a pen and write about it, but it's possible to do it with painting, with art. Art expresses what words cannot say, music, photography, yeah, um, anything that will help you let it out. I as you as you know, I don't have a problem expressing myself. But a lot of folks can't say it. Yeah. And it's but it doesn't matter as long as you find a way to let it out. And that was what was with healing to with me. Um, this forced me to face my demons, make my internal demons, and to to go there. And when I wrote about them, yeah, I just felt lighter and better, and and it it it it felt so good about it. I felt like I came home and I'm beginning to fit in. Yeah, and I was showing people or telling people via my words stuff that I had hidden for 50 years, whatever it was. And uh that weight is now off my shoulders. These guys helped me to tell the story because I I my story is is interesting to me, but I found out in in the book and talking to other veterans, be it other Vietnam guys, I know two two kids that are younger than me that were in Iraq and Afghanistan, and they said the fact that I was able to tell my story encouraged them to tell theirs because they've been sitting on it. Yeah, and it's important to go to it first so you don't suffer all these years. Just tell your story.

SPEAKER_02 9:34

Yeah, yeah. And then that helps you. Uh I I'm not saying you you're grateful for the situation or what happened, but there are I'm a big believer in silver linings. Um, and a silver lining doesn't mean that the situation was good or correct or fair or anything, but a silver lining really means that you are finding a way to make something positive come out of it. Yeah, you know, exactly. And I uh this to me, this was what speaks about that tremendously.

SPEAKER_01 10:02

Absolutely. I and Joe, how has the book helped other people that have been able when that have been reading it?

SPEAKER_00 10:08

That is the silver lining. Yeah. Because uh when when I did this, it was just a crapshoot. Let's uh you know, I didn't care if we just sold one, I was happy, but I was surprised that it connected with other people, the people were buying it, and and say they're interested in a story, and the feedback I got, I that returned back to me, was all uplifting uh about guys who said that I have this story that I've been sitting on, I've been wanting to talk about it, but I was reluctant and I didn't know how to do it. And he said, I'm not I'm not doing this to praise myself. He just said, I've seen what you did, and I decided to do it too, and it helped me. And that was, you know, Mike and Steve and Gary and uh a number of other guys that are going through this thing too, and then Greg and and uh other people. It it allows them, I don't want anybody to go through and walk in my footsteps from the past to repeat that kind of behavior. I do want them to walk in my footsteps after the book because it's a pathway for me for healing. Yeah. Okay. And if we help one person, it's it it's it's a victory. Well, I've I've it's it's resonating. Yeah, and uh I've had it's all been by word of mouth and Facebook uh that that it's it's been spreading. And uh I couldn't be more delighted, but you know, I I'm not a writer and I'm I'm not Jeff Bezos, you know, so I don't have this network to do all the stuff, which is kind of good in a way, because it's more of a personal connection with it. But I I would like to offer this the opportunity for people to connect with my story to see if it relates to your story, and then please encourage you to tell it in any way you can.

SPEAKER_02 11:42

Yeah. You know, I uh we were also talking earlier a little bit about um uh substances and things like that. And and um I have a very close person to me who who struggles. And in any 12-step program, um, I don't know if you're familiar with them or not, but the 12th step is becoming a sponsor or a help to someone else. That shows that you've kind of come full circle is when you can then extend that hand to help someone else in a situation. And that 12-step is often one of the hardest ones to get to, but it really shows um, I don't know, I just think it's very symbolic. And the fact that through this, you are now extending a helping hand to other veterans or others who are dealing with trauma and and don't really know how to deal with it. Maybe they're they're self-medicating, maybe they're um just internalizing so much that they don't really understand the cause of it. They might not even be aware of what the cause is, right? A lot of people I think that that do have struggles with some some things. I know this person in my life, I don't think really knows the cause of it.

SPEAKER_01 12:49

But I think if you know it's trauma, it's tra trauma of people in different ways. Yeah, and it's really hard to overcome. And then help is out there. It's it's there are ways to cope with it.

SPEAKER_00 13:01

It's a soul injury that you cannot see, and you don't know you have it. Right. Like in my case, and I'm gonna speak for the the other other folks out there who are just sitting there thinking, yeah, it's me too. Because you just think it's you, okay? And it's and you're not alone. It happens to a lot of people. But in order to get in front of it, you gotta understand it. Yeah, and then you have to muster a little bit of courage, do a little inventory, and say, okay, what is this stuff? So you have to face your demons, right? I chose to write about it. It was just very therapeutic for me. I have a fountain pen. I have kids who don't even know what a fountain pen is. Yeah, you know, but but once you start writing it, I would sit there for you know an hour and a half just letting it go, because it would all just flow out. Another thing in the book is that I did some sketches on some images uh that I had seen that I I I couldn't take pictures of. I'm a photographer and I take pictures everywhere I go, as you guys know. And some of my photos are in this book, but there are sketches I drew of of things that happened to me that have been in my head for many, many years, and I would see them at night when I'd close my eyes. And I did them with uh on an iPad with a program called USketch, and I did it with my finger. Yeah, and it was almost like automatic writing. I was just thinking about what was going on, and my my hand was going, and I looked down, and there's these images. Wow. And I didn't start out to do this stuff, they just came out. That was in 2012. So I sat on them for all these years. Now this is I just realized that these are the words that go along with those images.

SPEAKER_02 14:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:32

So, you know, that story is uh is is starting to take a little more depth. Going back to what you say about people with that have issues. Uh I do a lot of volunteering work and I I I I run into a lot of veterans, not only veterans, that suffer with or deal with substance abuse. And it's self-medicating. There's an issue, okay? And you don't know what's happening, you don't understand it. But the first thing you need to know is number one, you're not alone.

SPEAKER_02 14:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:58

And just you just don't know how to go about it. I think when you show people a pathway and stuff and give them a little bit of encouragement, they'll they they want to get better. Nobody wakes up in the morning and wants to be a drug addict. Nobody, nobody, they hate themselves. And everybody's been telling them they're worthless for so long, they begin to believe it. When you give up hope, that's when the train goes off the tracks. And I hope that these words on your paperwork, what you guys did, it gives people hope. Okay. Just whatever you're doing, there's a way out. There's a way out. There just really, really is. And you and the last thing, you don't have to be in the military to be a warrior. Absolutely not. You know, the struggle is real, and everybody who gets through it, and it there is a way to get through it. I I don't think you can get through it alone. You have to have people that are solidly in your corner, even when you're being a gonna bleep that. Um we might. That's okay. Yeah, they're still there for you. Yeah. Okay, that's important because you nobody goes through this alone. And then there is, you know, when you when you get there, the sun comes out, the birds start chirping, the unicorns run across the street, and you can start living the rest of your life. I'm 78 years old, so I know I have more time behind me than ahead of me, and my time ahead of me is limited because life can turn on a dying. We all know about it. But one thing I learned in Vietnam was that for some, and I have survivor guilt. I don't know why I'm here. For some reason, I was given the gift of continued life. Don't waste it.

SPEAKER_02 16:22

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 16:22

And me sitting here is one day not wasting it. You guys are helping me tell a story.

SPEAKER_02 16:28

I um I'm a cancer survivor. I don't know if Oh, yeah, I mean Steamen knows well, but um, so I'm in my 13th year now, cancer free, and I I frequently will call them bonus years uh because it was a beat the ass kind of situation. And um I think that is a way to to look at things that really changes your perspective. You know, this is the uh I don't I'm a different person because I look at things in that light. Yeah, you know, and I'm not stressed over things, it's allowed me to just I mean Sima knows me very well. She might not think I'm the most chill person, but if you knew me before, you would realize how chill I am now. Like neurotic and chill are different things. But um, but I think that's beautiful. I also I do also do quite a bit of writing, which has helped me get through my own traumas, which are different than than PTSD, which are different than um whatever it is, but they're they're my own, you know, and there are things that are deep within me, just I'm sure you have, and anybody has that um some are public, some are.

SPEAKER_01 17:27

We all have things that we go through.

SPEAKER_02 17:29

And and finding a way to to acknowledge them, to come to terms with them, to embrace them and say this happened and today's a new day, and um find a way to to live life grateful that you have another day, you know, and using that as an opportunity is is is an amazing thing that not everybody can do.

SPEAKER_00 17:51

I think what happened, what I realized along the way here is that by facing your demons, inner demons, allowed my better angels to come out. And they definitely help me. Okay, that's what's driving me to do this. I'm I'm I'm not I'm not hiding behind what happened to me before. The my cup is definitely half full. And I I want to send a message to anybody who just say, look it, give it a shot. Okay, there's a you know, you it's overwhelming at first, but when you take the first step, that was always the hardest one. And then there's people that will guide you, trust the process, and give it a go. What do you got to lose? You know? Um being happy, return your you know, your to your uh quality of life. Yeah, um, you know, it's possible, it's possible. It's not hopeless, it's not overwhelming. The game ain't over. Just keep going.

SPEAKER_02 18:47

Just having a purpose when you get out of bed in the mornings that that will get you out of bed in the morning.

SPEAKER_00 18:51

He said the word, no, I'm gonna go off because purpose is everything. It's what keeps the train on the tracks, it's a reason for you to give up, get it, get up in the morning, it's a reason to do things other than just sit there and you know TikTok your way into an early grave. No, no, no, it's no.

SPEAKER_02 19:07

Yeah, yeah, purpose is it. I love that. Yeah. That's great. Um, Joe, if someone wants to um check out your book, uh purchase it, what's the best way? And we wanna uh if you could just give your name clearly to our audience as well as the best place to to find you or find the book or connect. Um what would you prefer?

SPEAKER_00 19:28

Right now, uh because you know we're we're we're not Amazon yet. We're we're just we're we're just we're just rolling here.

SPEAKER_02 19:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:36

Excuse me, Facebook. The disappearing man, two S's. Uh there's a reason for that. I won't go into that.

SPEAKER_01 19:44

So misspell it on purpose.

SPEAKER_00 19:45

Yes, we have to misspell it on purpose to keep it's good. It's branded. Yes, branded. Yeah, to keep to keep Mark, what's his name up there, uh, happy. Anyways, uh uh the but contact us on Facebook. Um please scroll the timeline. Uh you'll see a lot of people that have purchased a book. Um just say, hey, I'm interested in your book. How can I get one? Uh give me your contact information, we'll get it to you. Uh if you're locally here in Western New York, we deliver it. Otherwise, we're we've got them in Albuquerque, New Mexico, and Colorado, so we can ship them. Uh price of the book is$50. I know that's a heavy lift, but my words are worth it, and that's not arrogance. That's that's the real deal. And what you have here, I think, is history. The first 200 books are signed personally by the author, which means they're going to be worth a lot of money when I'm on the other side of the clouds. And uh, but we'll certainly get it to you. And I appreciate feedback. So for right now, we're doing uh uh Facebook as a point of contact.

SPEAKER_02 20:45

And what we'll do is in our show notes when this episode drops, we will put some links so that people know how to get in touch with you.

SPEAKER_01 20:52

Um phone number, Facebook.

SPEAKER_02 20:54

Yeah, whatever is appropriate, you know, and and ways to get in touch with us who can whatever it is, uh we'll do our best. Um, and you know, Joe, we we talked earlier. My father's a Vietnam era vet. He was never in Vietnam, but he was he was a naval officer during that time. Um, and he's a couple years older than you, but he um there's a lot of uh what's the right word? It's it's personal to me. Like your story, and I and I am very grateful not only for your service, and I know it was not by any means an easy service, um, but for what you're doing now to help others try to find a purpose and to heal and to be able to just acknowledge that thing that's eating away that we all have, and whatever it is in different levels, there's all there's something in everyone, and I speak from from personal experience, there are things that eat away at you, and sometimes you you don't deal with them correctly, and sometimes you end up hurting someone else.

SPEAKER_03 21:49

What's going on?

SPEAKER_02 21:50

And um finding a healthy way to address to acknowledge that so that you can address it.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

I think there's another point that needs to be made here. Um, the title Disappearing Man. Is me. Excuse me. It's legacy. How am I going to be remembered?

unknown 22:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:05

Okay. After I'm gone, my words are going to be forgotten. The World War II guys, most of them are gone now. Their stories died with them. That's a tragedy. And everybody wants to know what did grandpa do or what did you do? Or if you're a young man just coming back from deployments, make a record of it. Not today, it seems insignificant, but it will be significant later. Tell your story. Nobody's story is insignificant. If anything, do it for yourself and then for your family. I can tell you story after story about after so and so dad died or grandpa died, and then they find out like we found his ribbons in the attic, and two of them were silver stars. Like, are you kidding me? That's one notch below the Congressional Medal of Honor. They don't give them out for just standing around looking in the air. Yeah. Okay. So what did he do? Um, and it's it's important. Um, tell your story.

SPEAKER_02 23:05

That's wonderful. You know, and another thing that you mentioned earlier, um, PTSD is nothing new. It was just called something different. You you were going through the different the different wars and what it was called. And um, would you just would go through a couple of those before? Because some people think it's a it's a buzzword, it's something new or it's whatever. It is not, it is it's been around since the Trojan War, right? I mean, it's been around since literally tens of thousands of years.

SPEAKER_00 23:28

But it's it's not a new topic. It's it's been around, it's part of part of humanity. It's not a surprise, it's not something a clinician or an academic just you know just thought up.

SPEAKER_02 23:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:39

Um Odysseus, if you if you read the Iliad and stuff, and they talk about Odysseus, and he as they described his behavior, he had PTSD. Yeah, he was generally an unpleasant fellow. He liked to wander, he didn't play well with others. You know, he had his own way of doing stuff, and he didn't care about what anybody thought, right? So then when you go through the Civil War, it was called Soldier's Heart, that thousand-yard stare. You know, when you have human-to-human trauma, you don't walk away from that. And anybody thinks, oh, it's all in your head. Yeah, it is. Yeah, it is, but it's also hardwired in your body, too. During World War I, it was called shell shock. During World War II, it was battle fatigue. PTSD, in 1979, it was all in your head. In 1980, it became a confirmed diagnosis, post-traumatic stress disorder. And then now, coming back to the kids coming back from the sandbox, um, they're they're having uh PTSD, and then they're also dealing with um burn pits and depleted uranium and TBIs and stuff. It keeps keeps around here. So it's gonna be around a long time, and we can minimize a lot of grief and heartache and stuff on people if we first understand it. And don't get me wrong, my friends at the VA have helped me uh immensely, but they're they're they're kind of a little behind the curve in dealing with this stuff. Uh and on camera they won't admit it, but off camera they're all gonna nod their heads and stuff because the way we're dealing with it right now is with talk therapy and and pharmaceuticals. So when they carpet bomb you with benzo, and everybody out there who's on them are going to say, Oh, yeah, what do you want? You know, oh, colanopin. Okay, the turn, you know, there's other ways of doing this stuff. I'm not saying this is a cure for PTSD, but I'm saying let's put as many tools in the toolbox as we can to help deal with this stuff. And that's all we're doing here. And I think what one of the things we haven't been doing is we haven't been talking about it because it's taboo. You don't talk about that, you know, it's just trauma stuff. No, it's okay to talk about it. Um that's in fact, that's how we get it. It's important to talk about it. And we have to change the narrative instead of hiding, hiding about it. Go ahead and talk about it and stuff. Yeah, people will understand you. For me, my personally, because of what happened to me on the 25th, the last Wednesday of 1968, uh, which happened to be Christmas Day, I did not enjoy Christmas until last year was the first time I put up a Christmas tree for me, because it was attached to such negative memories. I was an unpleasant fellow to be around. Then I I knew I was affecting other people, so I would withdraw. And I didn't want to say piss on Christmas for any anybody, but that's what happened, and I was, you know, was just an idiot. But now I know why it happened and stuff. So I my granted, my Christmas tree was three and a half feet tall, but it was out there. That's okay. Okay, and I didn't do that for a while. And so I did. So now I'm able to able to embrace Christmas and the spirit of it and stuff, and that's not all about me. It's it's let's live life and and and whatever time you got left, just enjoy it, you know, and you don't suffer, it's not necessary.

SPEAKER_02 26:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:36

Um, previously, Joe, you had mentioned that you were working on a project with Courtney, was unable to be here today because of her not feeling well. Um, something as a transition for veterans that are coming back.

SPEAKER_00 26:48

Um, it's Courtney's program.

SPEAKER_01 26:50

Um okay, it's Courtney's.

SPEAKER_00 26:51

We yes, it's a project called Shellback. And we homeless veteran issues are very, very near and dear to us. Uh me too. Just to rewind, there is no reason for a veteran to be homeless today with all the resources that are out there unless they choose to be. They choose to be. Now that's going to be a shock to some people, and I know this for a fact because Courtney and I, we went out in the field and we interviewed people that were homeless. Why? And no, 90% of the guys that will come back said they didn't feel safe. Okay, wherever they were. It's tied to a substance abuse issue because they're they're dealing with some pain in their head that they can't understand, and they self-medicate. So they isolate, which is not good, and and then they kind of withdraw from society. I I've talked to a guy with one leg, he said he felt safer on the back of a bus, riding the bus all back and forth all night long in cold weather, so he didn't have to be um um around people or under a bridge because he felt safe. So our approach was this. Instead of what was there's a lot of people out there that they're helping veterans and they're throwing all kinds of money at it. But if you if you take a veteran off the street, uh off the street and you take him into uh veteran housing and like in the city, and you put him in an apartment building of four and a half floors of other veterans who are drug addicts and alcoholics, this guy lasted two days. He said I felt safer on the street.

SPEAKER_03 28:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:16

So our approach is this. This is Courtney's idea. And now I met Courtney through horses, veterans and horse equine therapy, which is a really cool thing. But, anyways, her vision was this um five tiny homes on this spectacular piece of property in the southern tier. And it's not permanent housing, it's to get the guys to come off the street, to come in and get safe, to feel safe. Okay, so we have buy-in from the local community, the American Legion, the VFW, the town of Silver Creek said they wanted in. The CBOC, that's the clin, the VA clinic in Dunkirk, says we want in on this stuff. And that would be to simply have one of the guys come in and they're evaluated behaviorally and physically. If they got anything going on, we can address them. Then the VA can direct them to the resources that are out there, veteran service officers or the or whatever uh programs that are to help these guys, and then get them on their feet. But at the end of the day, if they still choose to be uh homeless, you can't stop them. You can't help somebody that does want to be helped. But what we can do is we can make an impact on that overall number and make it smaller.

SPEAKER_03 29:16

Right.

SPEAKER_00 29:17

Okay. And the reason the community wanted to buy in, because you have um somebody, a homeless guy wandering the streets of the village, and then he he goes into the dollar general, and you know he's stuffing his his pockets full of stuff. You get in front of all that, you eliminate that. Can you imagine a stop loss that that would have a financial impact on tops markets or dollar general if guys didn't have to steal to survive? Because they're really, really good at surviving. Okay? And we can get in front of all that stuff by just saying, hey, look, we want the cause of this problem is let's direct you to some stuff that will really give you help. Yeah. Okay. And that and in a lot of cases, I had I knew one guy's name was Tommy. He didn't know the the VA had disability benefits. He didn't know. He didn't know. Wow. So you know, you can you could be connected where you could have all these medical benefits for the rest of your life and you wouldn't take it. I didn't know about it. Now he's got to go through an administration, you know, administrative or bureaucratic uh playground of stuff to get connected. But that's what we're there for. We'll help you do that stuff. And then we just take that guy off the street so law enforcement doesn't connect with him. You know, uh, you got better things to do. Cost$72,000 to incarcerate one person for one year in New York State. Yeah. Give me half that money for this horse program, and we're we're good to go.

SPEAKER_03 30:30

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:32

Yeah, it was it's an amazing project that you're working on. Um, and it's also like a nice, it's it's the goal was to help with the transition of coming back and easing into back into the life that they left.

SPEAKER_00 30:45

Yeah. If you can give me a minute, I'll what happens now is you they don't decompress you when you get out of the service. Now, in my case, personally, and it's in the book, I get came home on February 22nd, I think it was. And then on the on the 18th of February, I was in the biggest ground attack where I was almost killed, almost a POW. I it was a source of my major league trauma, and four days later I'm on my parents' porch drinking a Pepsi and everybody asking me why I'm so quiet, what's wrong with me? And I'm saying, hell, I don't know. You know, I I don't know. You know, and and what happens in a traumatic situation is that for me, I could just describe it, is that when when something happens, it is so intense, the fear is is off the chart. You can't, there are no words that can comprehend it. Uh a firefight, we're in the process of being overrun, and it stops. Then it stops. And what follows is um a couple of minutes of this incredible silence. We can hear your heart pumping, you can hear the brain, the blood pumping through your head. And that's a void, like an explosion where all the air gets pushed out and there's a vacuum, and then all of a sudden it all comes running back, and your mind can't comprehend it all because there's all this stuff, it's just just comes past you, and then what? And you're trying, and then in service, go, go, go, go. You don't get a chance to deal with it until years later. So I'm on my parents' porch just trying to think, what the hell's going on? You know? And then I'm and then you come back home. I'm in a structured military environment where you count on each other, and it's literal teamwork, and and you know, we we we coordinate so well. And out here, every everybody's for themselves. And you can't you can't fit in, you know, and you can you can do that, but you got to do it slowly, and you have to have people understand you and translate to you like, okay, this is the way it works. There's a you know, let's find out what's going on, pump the brakes, let's we'll figure it out. And it's it's just an enormous challenge. So that's what happened to me uh in 1968. When the kid's coming back from the sandbox, as I understand it now, what happens is you come in, you're you're home for about three to five days or whatever, and then they'll talk to you, and it's presented to you and say, Well, you know, you can go through that door and be home with your family in six hours, or if you want to talk to the chaplain, you can go over there. What do you think's happening? So when you sign that piece of paper that says, No, I'm okay, then the VA comes back 20 years later and says, No, you say you're all right. Well, no, come on, man, that's wrong. So things are a little out of whack.

SPEAKER_02 33:12

Yeah. It's like I was just listening, I know we're we're really pushing time, but I was just listening to a um a podcast episode the other day on grief. And um it was uh Anderson Cooper has a podcast on grief, but he was a guest on another podcast and was talking about um just what you know when you go through it, generally you get two or three days off for bereavement, and then you go back to work and you gotta get back to work. And you don't have time to really acknowledge the situation or really come to terms. And sometimes it's years or decades later when another thing happens that you really start grieving for an old loss. And uh it's too much to get into right now, but you know, some of these experiences and some of the some of the trauma you're not in a place to acknowledge or deal with right away. Or or fully, you know, you just you just whether you're forced to or you choose to keep going and go on to the next thing, but it will come up. Yes, it resurfaces years later.

SPEAKER_01 34:02

When you sit down, yes, when you get a chance to sit down, yes. When you get a chance to sit down and think about it, it all just resurface, and then all of a sudden you're like, where did this come from?

SPEAKER_02 34:10

And then you realize so many behaviors that have happened over the years may be due to that to that trigger.

SPEAKER_00 34:16

And you know, grief is I that's a subject. Well, one of the reasons why Courtney's involved in this thing was grief, and and she's processing the stuff, and there's no handbook, there's no manual on how to how to deal with it and stuff. But one of the things we fought we found is when you have someone who passed, uh to you you tend to wall them off, just block it, you know, because it's associated with bad memories. But if you go back there and think about the good memories and stuff and put a positive light on it, and then live the rest of your life in their memory, yeah, doing good, not just duplicate what they're doing, okay? And set the example for the for the next person. Grief is a difficult tub uh subject, just like suicide. Veterans suicide 22 a day, commit suicide. We don't talk about it. We know why it happens. Hopelessness. You don't have a reason to get up in the morning, you don't. So, how do you do that? Horses was one, dogs are another one.

SPEAKER_02 35:09

Yeah, uh purpose, art, art writing, news journaling, music, all those things. All those things. You know what one thing that was on that podcast. Um he was mentioning he, you know, very public figure, travels in airports, and people stop him and tell now that he has this podcast on grief, tell him stories about grief. And he says he just listens. And rather than saying, Oh, how did it die, or all that, going back to the traumatic moment and say, Well, well, how did you meet your husband? Going back to a positive moment and bringing more light back into feeling like they can touch that person again. I had and that was healing. I thought that was a nice, a nice way to look at something.

SPEAKER_01 35:43

I had this one lady, she came in after her husband passed away, and she bought she bought a book that um it's a journal, it's a uh guided journal. Yeah, and it was about love, and she started feeling it out after he passed away. It was just a step of step step by step how you met, what do you enjoy eating, what do you enjoy doing together.

SPEAKER_00 36:03

What I've learned along the way is people we talk about suicide, because uh unfortunately I'm familiar with it. Um I don't know what to say. Well, you don't have to say anything, you have to listen. Just they're looking for an outlet. Just just listen. For myself, I journal. I have I think I have 17 of them going back a number of years, and I still write a daily note or whenever we get around to it to a mother and father, because I I miss them terribly. So I let them know what's going on. Oh, it's cold of 15 degrees of snowing. Oh, my battery died, goddamn it, you know. Sorry. And uh, you know, it's just little anecdotes with them. And I know they read them. Yeah, I know they read them because you know I'll ask for a sign and I'll get one, you know. And uh, but it but it does help you lighten the burden because they are not gone. I choose to believe they're not, they're they're not with me right here, but they are around. They're with you right here, and I they they do read the words, you know, and yeah, and I and they feel them. So that's my story.

SPEAKER_02 37:01

Joe, thank you. Thank you. We're touched. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:05

Oh, we missed Courtney.

SPEAKER_00 37:06

Yeah, yeah, I'll get her here.

SPEAKER_01 37:08

Well, yes, looking forward to having her next time.

SPEAKER_02 37:11

Absolutely. Appreciate you being here, and we will be seeing you soon. Thank you. Enjoy it. Thanks a lot, thank you very much. Okay, guys. If you or a loved one are struggling with mental health issues, thoughts of suicide, and need some resources, please visit spotify.com slash resources. If you're a veteran, visit va.gov and search mental health resources. Mojo Motivation is the official podcast of AI Consultants. Your co-hosts are Fahim Mojiwala and Marty Johnson. Special thanks to SEMA Mojiwala and our producer, Ryan McCarthy. Learn more at Mojo Motivation.com or AimHi.com. That's A Y M H I G H dot com.