with Cheryl Elman

Denise Billen-Mejia MD CH www.healandberadiant.com  office@aahypnosis.com

Les Roberts www.lesrobertshypnotherapy.co.uk contact@lesrobertshypnotherapy.co.uk

Cheryl Elman www.elmanhypnosis.com      cheryl@elmanhypnosis.com

0:00) Welcome to Two Hypnotherapists Talking with me, Denise Billen-Mejia, here in Delaware, USA. (0:06) And me, Les Roberts in St Helens, United Kingdom. (0:10) This weekly podcast is for anyone and everyone who would like to know more about the fascinating (0:14) world of hypnosis and the benefits that it offers.I'm a clinical hypnotherapist (0:21) and specialist in working with children. And I'm a retired medical doctor and consultant (0:28) hypnotist. We are Two Hypnotherapists Talking.So let's get on with the episode. (0:38) Hi, welcome again. And today we're going to talk to Cheryl Ellman, who some of you may (0:44) remember from before when Marta was recording us, but Cheryl has been a hypnotist for some time.(0:51) And this time she's going to talk about another favourite subject that she likes. (0:55) Okay, take it away, Cheryl. (0:59) Hi, everybody.It's such a pleasure to be with the two of you here. (1:07) Lots been going on in the last year or two. But I wanted to say that back in 2011, (1:14) I was at Shelley Stockwell Nicholas's conference in California, and I met a woman named Joan (1:22) Goulding.And Joan, we got to talking and she had been married to her husband. He had passed away (1:30) and they had a school in Victoria, Australia. And they taught hypnosis.Interestingly enough, (1:40) it was illegal to do hypnosis in Victoria. But what they did was they could teach it, (1:47) but you couldn't hypnotize anybody. So the interesting thing of what they did is they (1:51) went through the coursework.It was like, I think, a two-year course. And then they took (1:56) a bus to another province, another state, and went into like a couple of weeks of really like (2:05) hypnotizing each other and going through all the practice stuff and came back and they graduated. (2:14) So she fought for years to get it legalized in Victoria.So she had a daughter. (2:25) Do you happen to know why it wasn't when it was allowed in the rest of Australia? (2:34) Yeah. No, but there are states in the United States that Israel, you have to be a certain (2:45) doctor to take a certain course to do hypnosis.So there's different things in different countries. (2:52) And also the whole country, Israel requires you to be a physician. (2:58) Yeah.Yeah. (2:59) Anyway, let's get back to Australia. So what did she do? (3:04) So Joan had a daughter and she and her husband, her first husband, had moved.They were, (3:15) what do you call them? Poms? They had moved from England. 10 pound pom, I think it was. (3:20) 10 pound pom, yeah.(3:22) Right. And they moved to Australia. And so she had one daughter and she always felt like (3:32) she was a little clumsy.She wasn't really speaking. And then she had another daughter, (3:38) almost like Irish twins. They were pretty close in age.And what she started to notice is Teresa (3:45) was doing all of the, she was following, instead of following her older sister Michelle, (3:52) Michelle was always following and imitating what Teresa was doing. (3:57) So she and her husband had separated. And meanwhile, Joan had gone to speak to psychologists, (4:09) to schools.She had them in different schools. And Michelle, she'd come in and she saw Michelle (4:17) in this corner. And she really didn't have language.And so all this was going on. And (4:24) then one time her ex-husband had come to take the girls for the weekend and never returned them. (4:33) And she was looking for them.And so he had basically kidnapped them. And so it was nine (4:42) months later, he returned Michelle, who was difficult to deal with because there wasn't (4:46) much communication and

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to Two Hypotherapist Talking with me, Denise Bill and Mahia in Delaware, USA.

SPEAKER_01 0:05

And me, Larry Roberts, in St. Helens, United Kingdom.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

This weekly podcast was for anyone and everyone who would like to know more about the fascinating world of hypnosis and the benefits that it offers.

SPEAKER_01 0:19

I'm a clinical hypnotherapist and specialist in working with children.

SPEAKER_00 0:24

And I'm a retired medical doctor and consultant hypnotist.

SPEAKER_01 0:29

We are two hypnotherapists talking.

SPEAKER_00 0:33

So let's get on with the episode. Hi, welcome again. And today we're going to talk to Cheryl Ellman, which some of you may remember from before when uh Marta was recording with, but Cheryl has been a hypnotist for some time. And this time she's been talking about another favorite subject that she likes. Okay. Take it away, Cheryl.

SPEAKER_02 0:59

Hi, everybody. It's such a pleasure, a pleasure to be with the two of you here. A lot's been going on in the last year or two. But I wanted to say that back in 2011, I was at Shelly Stockwell Nicholas's conference in California, and I met a woman named Joan Goulding. And Joan, we got to talking, and she had been married to her husband. He had passed away, and they had a school in Victoria, Australia, and they taught hypnosis. Interestingly enough, it was illegal to do hypnosis in Victoria. But what they did was they could teach it, but you couldn't hypnotize anybody. So the interesting thing of what they did is they went through the coursework. It was like, I think a two-year course. And then they took a bus to another province, another state, and went into like a couple of weeks, a couple of weeks of really like hypnotizing each other and going through all the uh the practice stuff and came back and and they and they graduated. So she fought for years to get to get it legalized in Victoria. But uh so she had a daughter.

SPEAKER_00 2:19

Do you happen to know why it wasn't? Do you know why it wasn't? Do you know why it wasn't when it was allowed in the rest of Australia? Okay.

SPEAKER_02 2:31

No, but again, there are state there are states in the United States that you you know that Israel, you're you have to be a certain doctor to take a certain licensure to do hypnosis, uh to do hypnosis.

SPEAKER_00 2:44

So there's different things in different also the whole the whole country of Israel requires you to be licensed, you have to be a physician. Yeah, yeah. Anyway, let's get back to Australia.

SPEAKER_02 2:56

So what was so she so Joan had a daughter, and and she and her husband, her first husband, had moved, they were what do you call them, palms? They had moved from England, a 10 10-pound palm, I think it was. They paid 10 palms.

SPEAKER_00 3:15

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:15

Right. And and and they moved to Australia. And uh, so she had one daughter, and she always felt like you know, she was a little clumsy, she wasn't really speaking, and then she had another daughter, almost like Irish twins, you know, they were pretty close in age. And what she started to notice is Teresa was doing all of the she was following instead of following her older sister, Michelle, Michelle was always following and imitating what Teresa was doing. So she and her husband had separated, and meanwhile, you know, Joan had gone to, you know, speak to psychologists, to schools, you know, she had she had them in different schools, and Michelle, she'd come in and she saw Michelle in this corner, you know, and she really didn't have language. And so all this was going on, and then one time her ex-husband had come to take the girls for the weekend and never returned them. And she was looking for them, and and he so he could basically kidnapped them. And so it was nine months later he returned Michelle, who was difficult to deal with because there wasn't much communication and there was a lot going on, and but she never saw Teresa again until Teresa's 18th birthday when she knocked on her door. So that wouldn't uh to go through that. Meanwhile, she had met John Goulding and who had was doing the hypnosis, so she learned that. And they finally, you know, she'd go to professionals, and one professional said, you know, you really ought to, you know, put put the your daughter in the hands of professionals and go to work, you know, and then she'd go to somebody else and they'd say, you know, you really should be taking care of your daughter yourself and not leave it to others. So they were constantly being told different things, less I'm sure when I know you work with children, I'm sure you hear stories of all the different stories they're all told, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So they went ahead and when they were in Australia, so some of that was going on in England before they moved. And when finally they were in a school when she got Michelle back, and the teacher said, You know, I think there's wrong, something wrong with Michelle. And and Joan said, You think? So they tested her, and what they found is she had cerebral palsy, which was part of the clumsiness. She had an IQ of about 45, and she had dyslexia and dyspraxia.

SPEAKER_03 6:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

So that was part of the communication. So now by now she was married to John and they couldn't do hypnosis on her. They were trying to figure out how they can help. And one day they were driving down this road, and all of a sudden, Michelle was in the back, and basically she knew the word no. And there she was in the back, and she started getting all excited. She goes, Ooh, ah, ooh, ooh, ooh, and she was just so excited. And so, in trying to figure out what they were excited about, they just looked. She was looking at an empty paddock, or what we call a pasture here in the States, and it was empty. And so when they got home, and they just looked at her and says, Very good, Michelle. And she was so proud of herself. She was just sitting in the back there, you know, feeling so good about herself. So they were sitting and talking that evening and going, What is it that she was reacting to? And then they remembered it had been whether it was weeks earlier or a month earlier, but they had gone down that same road and there had been a circus. And what was Michelle saying when she was looking? She's going, Uk, erk, look, erk, you know, so she was actually trying to bring out those words. And they started to think, yeah, she was remembering it. And and so they started to think about it and go, Well, you know, she has a lot more knowledge and words and language underneath all that, you know. And so they started to think, how could they work with her? So they started talking to her in her sleep, you know, and they started to, and over the course of the time, they started building up this foundation, and it started and it worked with her, and she ended up, she's still alive today. She's in her late 50s, I think, now. And she actually she went to school, she she learned how there was a teacher there that was so so taken with her. She taught her how to ride the bus, you know, the different routes. She, you know, she was real clever. The class went one day, they went to a cavern, and so she called Joan from the from the cavern. And and and she's talking to her and telling her things. And Joan's going, very good, dear. This is costing a lot of money, though. And she goes, No. And I she goes, and she goes, why not? And she goes, uh, collect. She called her collect. So so she, you know, so she really had a whole different life be based on it. And she met a guy who also had special needs, but he was very high functioning. And they'd been married all these years. And I remember it was years ago they went on a cruise for their 25th anniversary, and he got so frustrated with himself because he he forgot, I think they were going to Singapore, and they had friends, family friends in Singapore, and and he forgot the paper. He couldn't find the paper with the hotel and the people's names. So I said, would you please just tell him, would you please tell him that I'm travel all over the world and I always forget that stuff too. Don't beat yourself up. And so and so that's how sleep talk came about. And it's been used in groups, it was used during the fires in in Australia. You know, it's great whether you're working with parents, it's great for hypnotists, social workers, teachers, you know, to learn it to teach parents. Because if you think about it, so many parents never felt unconditionally loved. And if you don't feel unconditionally loved, then you don't know how to give it to the next generation. Uh, it's similar to sexual abuse, physical or emotional abuse, you know, this lack of having somebody feel.

SPEAKER_00 10:16

Right, but but not necessarily because from from a cruel point of view, but for because those people also are not loved.

SPEAKER_02 10:22

So it was brought down the generations, and so this also, so if you could stop the stop it by teaching the parents sleep talk foundation and sleep talk and the process, and it teaches them communication. The thing I love about it is we sneak in the education on parents, you know. I mean, they they end up growing so much for it. And it changes when they're working with people at work, changes their communication skills too.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

I like I like the thought that what we can do is I know we educate our parents, don't we? We educate our clients that come in to see us, but I like I like it more, even more, because what we're doing is we're putting the onus back onto the parents to continue to do it at home rather than just spend the hour with us in you know in the therapy movement. And it's great, and they can see that shift. It might be a subtle shift at first, but they can see that. And the minute they see that, that's when they think, oh yeah, this works, you know, like let's go for it even more. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:36

You know, and I've had parents say to me, Oh, I talk to my children this sleep, and I said, Really? What do you say? My son, the doctor, my daughter, the lawyer, you're gonna get 100 on the exam tomorrow. You're the most beautiful girl in the world, and no pressure there, right? So the whole concept is to give them emotional hugs, yeah, to give them and build this self-esteem and also emotional resilience. And you're right, it gives that parent the fact that the child is sleeping, and you're giving them the words initially. You're giving them, you know, because my husband, my my father-in-law is famous for teaching hypnosis to doctors and dentists and his book, hypnotherapy. And my my husband, who just passed in August, but he was the little boy in the book that was the little boy that Dave did hypnosis attached to sleep with to help him with allergies, which actually came from a trauma, you know. So he was able to really work with that. And uh Larry was about 12 at the time, and then he said, Dad, don't do that anymore. So he stopped, but it really did help. Uh so, but you know, here he was also talking to Larry in his sleep, and actually had Larry responding to him, but he was a hypnotist, he knew you know about how to use it. So the parents are not hypnotized.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

But the parents who come to you, exactly. They don't need it isn't necessary to be able to have that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_02 13:12

Correct, because there's a foundation that they start with, right? You know, that that that moves it along, and then there's also assessments. So you get to see where the the they're they're taking a snapshot of where that child is at that point. Or is it really is it fact, or is it it's that parents, what you're getting that snapshot is that parents' emotional thoughts of those questions that day, that time, and how they how they respond to it.

SPEAKER_00 13:46

But how do children and of course the parents feel so much more confident in being parents, right?

SPEAKER_02 13:52

Because somebody can so they see where the children are starting at, and then you know, we do this assessment about three times over a period of six months, and you see the growth, and then you build statements with the parents built on what what things still need to be worked on, and at the same time, you're also teaching parents how to build those statements. So these are things that will last a lifetime for the parents and for the children.

SPEAKER_01 14:20

Yeah, exactly. I totally agree with you. When I was training, before I actually did my hypnosis training, when I was training to be an LP practitioner, that's the first thing that I did. My youngest grandson came to stay with us. He has an older brother who's two and a bit years older than him. And of course, the older brother was my oldest grandson wasn't in nappies, pull-ups, or anything like that, whereas my youngest one was, and he's he wanted to be like his brother. He really wanted not to wear his pull-up or his diaper at night time. So I did what I didn't know it was sleep talk, but I did that so it would have been 12, 13 years ago, and I went into the room, spoke very, very gently, and it was all positive. It was like an affirmation, really, positive things, you know, like nana loves you, pops loves you, mummy loves you, dad loves you. Exactly what sleep talk teaches us to do at the foundation level, but also said to him, when you wake up tomorrow morning, imagine how it would be to stay in bed, yeah, that little bit longer because you're dry and you can cuddle woo-woo, which was his toy. And we did it, I did it for three nights. The first night, not really, but the second and third, yeah. And it was just, and I and I thought, well, if you think about it, what we do is years and years ago, you would go out and buy a recording that you could listen to while she sleep. So, what's the best time for it to sink straight into the subconscious mind without question? Is when they're asleep.

SPEAKER_02 16:11

Yeah, you're bringing them up slightly and so that they're hearing you, and then you're putting them back down and you're telling them to stay asleep. So it's it's really lovely.

SPEAKER_03 16:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:21

And yeah, it's it's great. So, and that uh I think a lot of families have sibling rivalry, and it's really good for working with sibling rivalry in the family. Oh, do you yeah, have you ever had Les when you you have a c a client that comes in and they have one child that they feel has all the issues, but they also have other children, and then because we tell them that if you're gonna do it with one, do it with all of them, right? And so it was so interesting. One of the first ones I did, there were three kids, and one of them had meltdowns all the time, and they didn't feel there was really any issues with the other two. Well, it was as the one that they had it uh with was improving and not having the all those meltdowns, all of a sudden they started to see behaviors in the other two children, you know, it which were just they didn't notice before. That was interesting.

SPEAKER_00 17:26

Yeah. Well, I'm I'm what percentage of your clients are sleep talk and what are more traditional hypnosis, do you think? Is it something you you see people for a few times a year, or or is it a large portion of what you do?

SPEAKER_02 17:42

It is part of what I do. As far as my training, I probably train I train in both. So a lot of a lot of my stuff that I do is training, because when I came into this, it was like Dave Ellman is not known everywhere in the world. My goal was to keep the legacy and build the legacy of Dave Ellman and his and his protocols, which are very, very good. I mean, he taught doctors and dentists. So I do a lot of training and I do training with both. Like I have a sleep talk class coming up. I'm one of class that Larry and I did uh before. We have coming up through Allie Campbell's school. We worked a lot with Allie over the years since COVID, taught I think five classes for him. Larry and I, they were like three-month classes. So I would say I do more hypnosis and and and teaching, I probably teach, I teach both. So I I can't give you a percentage, Lisa, actually. So the course is I think Jody and I are gonna be doing a talk about it on the 19th of April. Okay, and then but the class is gonna be the last weekend in May and the last weekend in June. And I will hold it.

SPEAKER_01 19:13

I actually it is it's a very good tool to use, and all three of us use it, don't we? It's a very good tool. Yeah, it's excellent.

SPEAKER_02 19:20

And you know what? Uh it's also opens up there are you know, especially beginning hypnotists when they go and try to get like talks or go into schools or churches, a lot of them, you know. I I'm in I'm in Southern Baptist area down here, and it's like hypnosis, but the the sleep talk is interesting. You know, in fact, my license plate says sleep talk, and the other car says D E hypno. So um uh so the fact is that that they will that they you they could go in and talk to groups, you know, parent groups, schools, teachers. You know, think about think about uh Les, do you do things with corporations?

SPEAKER_01 20:10

No, I don't. It's mine's mostly with schools and uh and children and parents and social services.

SPEAKER_02 20:17

Right. And then if you think about it, if you think about when parents are having issues with the kids at home, whether it be sibling rivalry, whether it be, you know, different issues that the children have, they're what what happens? They go to work and they're talking about their kids to their workers, they're stressed, they're getting phone calls, they're not concentrating. So it could also become a benefit to uh for a human resource benefit to teach their you know parents, get give it as an option for them, and that will help them be more focused in work. And remember, we snuck in that education, so they're learning what's good statements to say, you know, what's effective communication. So all of a sudden they have better teamwork also.

SPEAKER_01 21:11

Yeah. So you you mentioned before about you said that not everybody knows about Dave, Dave Elman. Today I was talking to one of my clients' mum's, who she's an NLP, she uh studied NLP, so she knows Ali Campbell. And I said I was doing the podcast tonight, recording the podcast tonight with yourself. I said, and we're talking about sleep talk and we're talking about you know other things. And and she said, Oh, she said that sounds fantastic. So I said, Well, I said, let me tell you who Cheryl is. So I told her who she you were, and she went, Oh, she said, I've got Dave's book. She said it was amazing, absolutely amazing. So, so this is this is a lady who who brought her toad. In to see me, and she's got your book. But she she did some and I think it was NLP training with Ali, so she knows Ali as well. So yeah, right. That was and Allie mentions us a bunch. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:13

Do you remember when that book was first published?

SPEAKER_02 22:17

Yes, it was first published, and it had three different titles. It had three different titles. The first title was let me think, Findings in Hypnosis. And Dave published it. And then that was in 1964. When he passed away in 1967, my mother-in-law, Pauline, gave it over to a publishing company called Nash Publishing. And you know, she still had the copyright and stuff, but you know, they were going to distribute and and you, you know, the use. And but they she didn't feel that they were really marketing it. So and they had changed it to explorations of a hypnosis. And then in 1977, Gil Boyne from Westwood Publishing contacted my mother-in-law and asked if he could uh publish it. And so he has the use, Westwood Publishing has the use and distribution. And so he and and so he was originally, it was supposed to be that it was going to be called hypnoanalysis and hypnotherapy, right? But he only called it hypnotherapy. And so, and it got shortened, it never got the dust cover. So basically, the inside of that was all the same. Back then they used metal plates, you know. So when so those metal plates from went from 300 some odd pages, went from this publisher to this publisher to that publisher. I was in printing years ago in New York in the 80s. And then so the thing that changed was the forward, you know. So the first one was by Dave. I don't remember who who wrote the second one, and the third one was Gil Boyne. Gil added an index. Dave never put in an index because he wanted people to read it cover to cover. But it makes it so much easier as a reference to be able to look things up. So he added the index at the end. And so there were little changes, but the the bulk of it stayed the same. And it's funny, you know, what came up yesterday, Jason Lynette. I was working, and I don't stay on Facebook very often, but he says, Cheryl, are you here? And so I went to look at my attention. I told you. Oh, you did see that? Yeah, I did. And so what happened was they were discussing who started hypnosis for smoking. And so several people said Dave Elman. That's why he said, Cheryl, are you here? So I told the story. Dave Elman was an avid smoker, heavy smoker. And he was also really good.

SPEAKER_00 25:07

Well, the 40s and 50s, that nobody considered it a strange thing to do.

SPEAKER_02 25:12

You could so when you listen to the recordings, when you listen to the recordings, you're hearing who was he teaching? Doctors and dentists, and you hear them all they're all smokers, you know. And so what happened was that Dave tried using self-hypnosis to stop, you know, it's a habit, so he was trying to get rid of it, but he really didn't want to stop smoking, you know, so he said, This doesn't work. So we went in when he was teaching his classes and told the doctors, you know, the the one thing that does you can't get rid of, the one habit you can't get rid of is smoking. And so and so he had them too. Right. So so he then had some of his students, the doctors, work on him to stop smoking. And did it work? No, because here we had Dave not wanting to stop smoking. We he already gave the doctors the expectation that it's not gonna work, so they didn't have confidence in the process either. And you know, they didn't come up with the the post-hypnotics that would really do it, and so it just didn't work. So I put that out there. And so, you know how many times we've been at conferences and people come running over to Larry, your dad made a mistake, your dad made a mistake, and whenever we would talk and we would say, How many people here make a living working with smokers? You know, and people will laugh, you know, raise their hand, I said, Well, you know, and then we bring up that story that so that's the one thing he wrote right in his book, the one habit that it does not cure is smoking. Uh now, how did I get into hypnosis 16 years before Sean Michael Andrews stuck my hand to the table in my head when he was coming to interview Larry? 16 years earlier, I went to somebody in New York, and I don't know who it was, I don't remember who it was, and got hypnotized to stop smoking. And I never smoked again, and I was two to three packs a day. Never smoked again. So I knew it worked.

SPEAKER_01 27:18

Yeah, me too. Yeah. I gave up smoking through hypnosis, but mine, Cheryl, mine was completely different. I uh I was a model when I was a student. So when we were learning hypnosis, I was a smoker, not a very heavy smoker, but a smoker still. And one of the students said to me, It's smoking cessation weekend next weekend. Can I practice on you? And I went, Yeah, thinking, well, let's see. Never thought about wanting to give up smoking. Well, I have tried before, but it's never worked. And I've never smoked since. Never, never smoked. Don't it there's nothing at all, it doesn't interest me or anything. So I know it works.

unknown 28:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:07

So it was interesting. It was one of the first classes Larry was teaching, and uh, my friend Stephanie and I did had my friend, another friend of mine who was taking the class. She did not really want to stop smoking, but that I knew of, she was the only smoker. I said, Well, let us demo on you. And the two of us did a double induction and and sort of did a double thing on her. She was very ex uh Ericksonian and I was very hypnot Al Manian in our approaches. She, of course, did not stop smoking, but it was like a year or two later, one of the other students in the class said, By the way, since you and Stephanie did that thing for Jan, he goes, I've never smoked since.

SPEAKER_01 28:50

I must have wanted to deep down inside. Yeah, deep down inside, I must have wanted to give up. I've had no inclination whatsoever. And it's one of the furnace, the furthest things from my mind, and it's probably one of the best things that that particular student, and then with any that particular student did for me, definitely.

SPEAKER_00 29:11

But just before, in case does anybody brand new to the idea of hypnosis who's listening here? Generally speaking, people that want to make change, it has to be the client's wish to change, strong wish to change. Yeah, otherwise we don't have magic ones, they'll be saying something else. I do, Cheryl.

SPEAKER_01 29:33

I do. Oh, you're cute.

SPEAKER_00 29:36

Oh, when you work with children, you work with children too.

SPEAKER_02 29:40

And so the toys at the back as well. It's very consensual. You know, also people will say, Oh, you do hypnosis, are you gonna make me bark like a dog and cluck like a chicken? And I look at them and go, I don't know, do you want to? You know, and and I mean, because if you want to, we could do that, but you know, but no, that's not my thing.

SPEAKER_01 30:00

Yeah, is that what you come in here for to cluck like a chicken and not stop a fear or a phobia? Yeah, yeah.

unknown 30:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:08

But but how do you how do you how do you advertise your business? It's another thing. I've completely dropped off of Google. I checked today, and uh, used to be number one in the area. So if I look for something near me, I was not first not there anymore. People I've never heard of who are in Delaware. I'm I'm interested. How do you publicize your work?

SPEAKER_02 30:33

For a while, I I was doing something with keywords at one point, and I was paying a company to do keywords, and then also, you know, my my website got switched, so uh it's still being built. Jason Lynette is building and changing it, and I'm learning click funnels, which is wonderful. I mean, it's hard, it is hard, but but when uh but I'm learning, and so I chose, so I chose somebody because I've had my website worked on but over the years. I built the original, and then when I went to WordPress, I had I think four or five different people do it. But if you get somebody who knows websites but doesn't know hypnosis and the jargon in hypnosis and keywords, and then if they don't know marketing and all they're doing is putting a sign up basically, and you know, put it up and they will come is not necessarily it. So one of the reasons I started working with Jason Lynette was because he does all three and he's very good at click funnels. And we know we definitely know yeah, not only does he know hypnosis, Larry and I talked with him jointly several times. So he knows Al Manian and he knows us, although he loves to tell the story that the first year I was had a booth at NGH, my first conference, and I had a booth there, and I he came by and I was trying to sell him this video DVD set that Sean Michael Andrews had produced, and it had some it had Sean doing some hypnosis on the second disc, and the first one was an interview between Larry and and Sean Michael Andrews. And so I was sitting there and he looked at me and he goes, and and I kept saying, Well, this is a really good set, etc. And he goes, Have you watched it? And he kept saying, But have you watched it? He was a key person as as as a volunteer in the in it. So he loves to tell that story, but so since then, you know, um we and he used to be close, so I had the key to his office. So when I was going through Washington, DC, or Northern Virginia, and I had the dog in the car, and Larry and I wanted to go to a restaurant, and it whether he was at his office or not, I'd let Rosie, my little poodle, who would go traveling with us, she was the one I used to hypnotize, sleep. And so I would put him her in the office, and she had been there many times for us teaching there and meetups and stuff. And and so, because there were times that he came in and he'd see Rosie up on the back of the couch going, Oh, the Elmonds must be in town. So I had the uh key to his house. Uh I mean to his office, which is funny. He told me I could throw it away now because his newer office he he sold the building. So uh something.

SPEAKER_01 33:24

I had the pleasure, I had the pleasure of meeting him at the UK hypnosis convention last uh November. What a gentleman. He's got a lot of energy.

unknown 33:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:38

Yeah. So and so I'm now building it, and and the goal, my goal is that we are going to, in fact, I've thought of it. I think in building this, and we're gonna do some online courses, and we're having a you're out there and you're a hypnotist and you want to attend April 21st. We're going to have it's my anniversary, it's our anniversary, and my husband passed away August 26th. We're still waiting, it's about a 15-month wait to have him have a military funeral up at Arlington Cemetery. So, so we're gonna do a we had a little neighborhood thing originally here, and we're gonna do a celebration of life. And Larry used to love telling stories, and I think that's something people really loved about him. If you got to meet him, and he and during his teaching, he loved telling stories, and he was a retired Air Force Colonel and aeronautical engineer. If anybody wants aviation and history books, I have 23 bookcases, so I am working on selling some, giving some, and you know, so it's it's a good thing we I I we were never gonna downsize because we have 23 bookcases and that would break his heart. I forgot where oh, so I'm going to have people from all different walks of life, like Allie, Sean Michael Andrews, probably Jason, and I'm going through some relatives, some people from the military, and so to do each of them like maybe five to seven minute stories, a story of a story with them and Larry in some way. And so we're gonna be doing that. I'm not sure if it's gonna start at 3 or 3:30 to 5:30 on the 21st of April, which would have been our 24th. 24th. We got married in 2002, our 24th, and online also, and that will be on Zoom online. Wow, so and that will actually become part of a legacy, and it'll be a landing page, and there'll be cutouts, and so that'll be there. So, my goal is even past my lifetime to have this website stay, leave, leave some money to keep it.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

The Alma legacy continues, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:03

And I also want to let you know that I had done three, you spoke at you each spoke at one of the conferences that I did online Zoom conferences with 86 speakers each year, and I did three of them, and so one of them is already on the website, and we're gonna figure out what you know how to do it. And well, it's time consuming to put all that on there. But instead of doing that now, every month, I'm doing I have the Elmond Cafe, which is we had three rooms, and then we had the Elm Cafe, which was like going to the alligator bar or the coffee shop when you're at conferences, because that was really where you got to meet people and network.

SPEAKER_00 36:46

That was what we all missed from yeah, but we missed from going to live once. That was how you got connected with people.

SPEAKER_02 36:54

Right. So so people should go and visit with each other and a cup of coffee. Yeah, yeah. Right. So so now I have uh now working on two to three a month that will be in there. So and it's free, and you guys should it's cafe.elmanhypnosis.com.

SPEAKER_00 37:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:16

Is it only hypnotists, or is this also a means of no there are things, there are things like Victoria Gallagher did something on you know getting rid of money blocks, so that could really be with anybody if you do the session. Adam Cox from the UK spoke last month, uh, this past month also, and he spoke about he did two, he did a double feature, and he he did one on his induction, and that's and then the second one he did was using podcasts, yeah. Whether you attend them, speak at them, uh create them, and so he did two. There are talks, Karen Hann did one that was more L N LP. So there's 14 of them already available. So when you join, there's many as recordings.

SPEAKER_00 38:09

Okay. They're available as recordings. There's not a oh you missed it, sorry.

SPEAKER_02 38:14

You can see so once you join the cafe, you get the you get access to the cafe, the cafe replay vault. And so, and right now there's 14, some from last year, you know, and some from this year, and we and continuing to go forward. So there'll be, and so it's a it's a library that keeps continuing.

SPEAKER_00 38:39

Oh, that's lovely. Yeah, that's lovely. Check out the show notes, people.

SPEAKER_01 38:44

Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. So for the sake of uh our listeners who are not hypnotherapists, sleep talk is isn't done you like we we did mention before that you don't need to be a hypnotherapist in order to deliver sleep talk. So can you just within a few sentences, can you just explain what sleep talk is for our listeners?

SPEAKER_02 39:11

So sleep talk, I uh I do two things. I work with parents, okay, and we teach parents to talk to their children two to three minutes a night during their sleep to build their uh uh the child's emotional resilience and and to ego strengthening. And we also do assessments with the parents and see where what areas the child needs growth in. And it's like 41, you know that assessment. I know a lot of psychologists that started using it because it was such a good assessment. It's like 41 different aspects that your the parent is giving you a a score of how they think and feel about their child on that issue. So that's very helpful. And then they you teach them the foundation and you teach them about sleep talk and about communication, and there's a variety of things that you're they're learning, and then there's a feedback where you're going back and forth with them and finding out what's changed, you know, what's improved, what's different, you know, and and we always say if you're gonna do with one child, do it with all. And I have a story about that. There was a nurse, and and the woman said she only wanted to do it with her younger son. And then she called, the mother called and said, My son is being uh the 12-year-old was getting suicidal. And and so, and and I think she had done hypnosis on him before, so she brought him in, and what she found out that the kid was so upset with is my parents tell my brother that every night that they love him, but they don't tell me. Right? Oh, yeah. So if you're gonna do it with one, do it with all of them, and it's only gonna improve everybody's relations and make it a happier family. So that's one aspect. So I do parent programs, I could put together groups, I can put together or do it singly, and then I teach the sleep talk. I now call it sleep talk specialist. I train professionals. I mean, I it could be a somebody in school, a teacher, a social worker, somebody that wants to work with with doesn't want to necessarily work with children, but wants to help families. But then again, you know, if you're working with if you're working with adults and the adults have issues with the kids, you know, nothing's changing there. So it's still gonna be. And if you're working with kids and there's no changes in the environment from the parents, then you can work and and and help them keep going as long as you like.

SPEAKER_00 42:05

What you can keep going as long as you like, nothing's gonna change. The people they're living with need to change.

SPEAKER_02 42:11

Exactly. So so this way there's you know, a change. So there have been parents that have then become consultants or specialists. There are people, it's great for hypnotists and psychologists, psychiatrists, teachers, anybody, church, uh, people within the church, camp directors. I mean, it could be done in so many different ways. Uh, nurses, hospitals, it could be done from with foster kids, you know, it could be uh that would be great to help. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:46

The only thing you need, you need to have a prolonged, they're gonna be working with them for months. No, it's not come in, we'll do this thing and then it's all over. This is a pro progressive thing that happens.

SPEAKER_02 43:01

Right. So so let's say it's a foster kid and and they're in this foster family and they're going to another foster family. Wouldn't it be nice if the foster, the foster social worker then teaches it to the next family? And then sometimes there has to be adjustments in what's being said because you know, families have different structures. Beryl Comar had a family when she was in Dubai that had several mommies, and they all wanted to do it. So was mommy one, mommy two, mommy three, you know, everybody wanted to do it. Who do you mention? You know, you you don't want a child to feel just because let's say one of their parents is not there, that that parent doesn't love them. Yeah, because then they feel like there's this hole in their heart. So for so there's all different ways and uh of of working with the child and with the family.

SPEAKER_01 43:57

Yeah. I um I have a I Young boy at the moment, but parents are delivering uh foundation sleep talk, and the but the parents are divorced, but mum delivers exactly the same as dad, and dad is mentioned in mum's, and mum is mentioned in dads, so that's no dad, yeah, there's no difference whatsoever. And that they're quite happy to do that, right?

SPEAKER_00 44:25

And then they're not necessarily a so-called broken home. It's not necessarily a broken home situation, but there's there's a lot of reasons that parents may not be in the house every night.

SPEAKER_01 44:37

Yeah, so it does it dad works. If dad if dad works long hours, or like you said, if dad works away, or even mum works away, and you know, it's it's it's about that give and take, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 44:48

And I think delivered. Have you ever worked with anybody who's used it at nap time with little children?

SPEAKER_02 44:57

I I I suggest that. I do suggest that. I have suggested that to some people when their child that they're afraid to wake them up at night. So I said, do it during nap.

SPEAKER_00 45:06

Yeah. They're afraid they're afraid they're gonna fall asleep halfway through because they're so tired themselves.

SPEAKER_02 45:12

No, no, or that they're afraid that you know the child wakes up and then doesn't go back to sleep. And, you know, so that could be it. And you know, going back to also when when it's parents, you know, I've had it where I know originally when I learned it, somebody had said, Oh, you got to do it every night. And then I've told parents where it was only one parent doing it, the other one was not doing it and didn't would didn't want it, and or you know, there was not enough communication there. And I said, you know, if if that child is hearing that three times a week, you know, nothing, four times a week, it's better than nothing, you know. And and also, you know, you start saying some of the same vocabulary during the day. So going back to when they first started doing it with Michelle, one day Michelle came down for breakfast and Joan said to her, Good morning, darling. How are you? And she just looked and cocked her head like this and went, Happy. So it was one of the words she heard during her foundation statement. And and it was, you know, so her vocabulary was growing and into more, and she was eight years old when they finally got the diagnosis of what was going on with her. You know, and so it's it's a great process. It's great for building families and for building character and communication in adults and children.

SPEAKER_00 46:42

Yeah, yeah. I think another place to tell about this are pediatricians' officers. Pediatricians have all sorts of mothers in telling them, I can't get any sleeping bunch of them. We're gonna sleep. My kids are up all night. That's all sorts of reasons, don't they?

SPEAKER_02 46:59

Yeah. Another good thing is going to going to daycares and preschools and doing a little program, a free program for the parents about, you know, a little talk for 20 minutes or so. And that's also a way, maybe even putting that into a group situation. So if they can't afford, you know, one-on-one that they could afford as a group. Yeah. What did Sheila say? Liz and I have we're in a group with Sheila Granger, and did she say she does for groups about 25% of her fee for private individuals? So there's a way of doing it that we've been taught. And we teach how to do it as a group. Yeah. So that's also good. Another thing is going to schools. You know, the school guidance counselor, they're the ones that, you know, that they would love to have families that those kids are always in. You know, I was a director of Sylvan Learning Center programs back in the No Child Left Behind era. And so I used to tell the kids if they were misbehaving, they'd be sent out to me and they'd be walking the halls with me. And I said, you know, if I know your name, that's not necessarily a good thing.

unknown 48:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:20

Well, thank you so much, Hara, for coming on. It's just been I've I've written loads of things down again. Every day's a school day, isn't it? And it's just so nice to to talk to you. It's so nice to see you. Thank you very much. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:34

Thank you all very much. I'm very happy to talk to you. So good to see you again. Yeah, it's lovely to see you. Really lovely to you. Great to see you guys. And will I see you tomorrow morning?

SPEAKER_01 48:47

You will, yeah, you will. What are you speaking about? Uh I'm talking about metaphors and storytelling with children. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:58

So and we have to schedule you in the cafe.

SPEAKER_01 49:02

I'd love to. That would be wonderful, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So connecting again with you. So thank you, Cheryl, and goodbye. And hopefully, we'll see each other soon. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 49:15

Yes, and thank you all. And it was a pleasure. It was a pleasure talking with you. Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 49:22

We hope you've enjoyed listening. Please remember this podcast is designed to give you an insight into therapeutic hypnosis and is for educational purposes only. So remember, consult with your own healthcare professional if you think something you've heard may apply to you or a loved one.