Two Hypnotherapists Talking with John Scanlon

Denise Billen-Mejia MD CH  www.healandberadiant.com      office@aahypnosis.com

Les Roberts ACH www.lesrobertshypnotherapy.co.uk contact@lesrobertshypnotherapy.co.uk

Welcome to Two Hypnotherapists Talking with me, Denise Billen-Mejia, in Delaware, USA. (0:06) And me, Les Roberts, in St Helens, United Kingdom. (0:10) This weekly podcast is for anyone and everyone who would like to know more about the fascinating (0:14) world of hypnosis and the benefits that it offers.I'm a clinical hypnotherapist and (0:22) specialist in working with children. And I'm a retired medical doctor (0:26) and consultant hypnotist. We are Two Hypnotherapists Talking.(0:33) So let's get on with the episode. (0:36) Hello everybody and welcome. So we're way into season nine now, aren't we, Denise? (0:43) We are indeed.Talking to a lot of our friends (0:45) and a lot of our colleagues. So I want to introduce John Scanlon. He's a hypnotherapist, (0:53) a trainer and creator, organizer of the Irish Hypnotherapy Conference.He practices in Ireland (1:03) and he specializes in working with clients with trauma, adoption related issues, FND, (1:11) functional neurological disorder and identity change. John also trains therapists in both (1:19) working with trauma, FND and adoption. And he's developed wonderful techniques, (1:27) such as the Little Star and Lighthouse, which John's going to talk about today.(1:32) So welcome, John. It's nice to have you on. (1:35) Thank you.Nice to meet you. (1:38) And you, Denise. We haven't met in person.We'll have to fix that. (1:41) Okay. When we figure out whether we're going to be able to fly from the US to anywhere (1:47) very soon.Anyway, so what are you going to talk to us about today? (1:53) I'm going to Hypnothots in what, six weeks time? Be in Las Vegas. (1:57) Vegas. (1:59) Opposite side to you, isn't it? (2:01) Yeah, I'm in Delaware.It's a long way away from Vegas. (2:04) It's a long way away. (2:05) As far away as here.(2:08) It is a very good place to have a function though. So many hotels. (2:14) Yeah, it is.It's a nice place. (2:17) Wow. (2:18) Anyway, sir, so what are you going to talk to us about Lighthouse? The only thing I know about (2:21) Lighthouse is the shipping aspect of them.So what does it mean to you? (2:26) What is it? Okay. Well, I'll tell you what it is and I'll tell you how I got there. So (2:33) Lighthouse is a model for identity change.(2:37) And I suppose how I got there was that from working with people with trauma and working (2:43) with people with FND and being adopted myself, it changes. I won't say even with adoption, (2:50) it doesn't even change who you are. You become somebody at a very early age and it's not (2:55) always who you wanted to be.And particularly, I suppose, when I started to work with functional (3:01) issues and people couldn't drive and there were so many things they couldn't do that they lost (3:06) the ability to believe in themselves. They lost the ability to be able to do things that (3:11) most of us take for granted. (3:13) To project the future.(3:14) Yeah. (3:16) I mean, you think about the loss of freedom of not being able to drive and not being able to walk. (3:21) You know, that loss of freedom, and if you have it for a couple of years, and I've worked with (3:25) people who've had it for 10 and 15 years, and it just literally, it's a gradual thing, but it does (3:32) change them bit by bit by bit.And suddenly what's available to them is no longer available (3:38) in their own mind. So what Lighthouse came from was a process that I developed where we clear the (3:47) past to a large degree, and we help people to clear the nervous systems and start to reset the (3:52) systems and all that. And what I've always used is the process called Little Star, which is a (3:59) connection back to a very simple idea.It's a really simple idea, which is that we're born as (4:08) unlimited potential and resources, pretty much. We're born confident, we're born resilient. (4:14) And I know we're born confident, and I know we're born resilient because we learn to walk, (4:19) and we fall hundreds of times on the journey, but we get back up each and every time.(4:24) And when we're hungry as a child, we don't really care what you're doing. We're going to say, (4:30) feed me. I don't care.Just give me food. Right? So we're born confident, we're born resilient, (4:35) and we're born with curiosity and joy and so much else. Life knocks it out of us.(4:41) So Little Star was a process that would bring people back to that essence of who they were, (4:47) along with every positive thing that ever happened to them, and taking the lessons then from the not (4:53) so positive stuff, if you want. And the real thing was, I suppose, the first thing I would (4:59) tell my clients each and every time is, everything before today is over. And your left hemisphere (5:06) knows that, but your right hemisphere is now going, but what about, because I'm running this (5:10) loop from whenever, and Little Star journey is a process that says, right, everything before (5:17) today is over.We put a marker here to mark it, and then we start to look forward. And then it (5:23) became, well, what are the tools that people need? So if you think about what a lighthouse is, (5:29) it's an initially, I probably would have thought about it as a beacon, something that could, (5:34) you know, light the way for you. But actually, now it's become more that no matter whether it's (5:41) a storm outside, or whether it's raining, or whether the sun is shining, the lighthouse is (5:45) still solid.It doesn't matter what's going on around it. So if you can instill in people, (5:53) the beliefs, and more importantly, the identities that they want, (5:59) then they're solid within that environment, no matter what's going on around them. (6:03) It also becomes a guide for them.Yeah. So it's based on logical levels. And it is based on that (6:11) logic NLP logical level model.And I do it for two reasons. One is that I use it as a way to (6:20) clear out any remaining bits that might be left. And the other is I use it as a way to install.(6:26) So if you think about it, if we try and change a behavior, but there's a value attached to it, (6:31) and once upon a time, people would have called that secondary gaming, they still do. (6:35) I don't, it's the real game. It's the real reason why people do it.(6:40) You know, you can change, it can be hidden from them. That's the problem. (6:44) Most people aren't aware.Most people aren't aware consciously of that hidden game. (6:49) Correct. Yeah, absolutely.But it's the real reason that goes behind it. And if you try and (6:55) change the behavior, and the value doesn't change, or something higher up that chain doesn't change, (7:00) then suddenly, you may get short term gain, but you won't get that long term thing that people (7:05) are looking for. So what Lighthouse became was a way to clear that stuff for once and for all the (7:11) remaining bits that might have been left, but also to give people a semblance of, they might even see (7:17) a picture in their mind and go, it doesn't bother me now, you know, you can still just get rid of (7:21) it once and for all.And then connect them back to the, the work that was done up to that point, (7:28) which was the star journey, basically everything before today is over. But you're bringing with (7:33) you a toolkit now, that includes all the positive things that have ever happened to you, plus all (7:39) the stuff that you were born with, and then start to build the identity from identity down. Define (7:46) who it is that you, we are, I am, and then work down through the values, work down through the (7:52) beliefs, work down through the behaviors, and ultimately, the environment changes itself.(7:57) And that literally is what Lighthouse is. Now, it was originally developed from working with trauma, (8:03) but actually, most of us arrive at who we are by default. And, and if we try and think about (8:11) how we might want to do something, and there's internal resistance for, or, you know, it's kind (8:17) of like, I use this for everybody at this stage, whether they've had trauma or not.(8:21) Mm hmm. And you don't always know what's traumatic to somebody. (8:28) Well, trauma is perceived, perceived meaning.It's there, exactly. Especially if they were little. (8:37) Correct.Absolutely correct. And what Lighthouse allows me to do is help people to create the (8:43) future they want. Very clearly.Yeah. When did you develop it? About 18 months ago, (8:50) about 18 months ago, I'd say. Okay.And because I was getting to that stage where (8:55) people were, they were, they cleared the reasons that came in the first place, but now they were (9:01) going, what goes next? Yeah. So it kind of was demand driven, almost. Okay.Yeah. You know. (9:09) How long have you been inhibitors? How long have you been inhibitors? 10 years.Okay. 10 years. (9:15) There was a real surge of, I trained in 2019.You were a couple of years before me, Les. (9:23) 2015. 2015, yeah.(9:24) We seem to be a lot of people all of a sudden in this. We're a big cohort of recent people. (9:32) Do you think 2015, 2016, there was nothing else to do? (9:39) We all must have known something was coming, that we were going to be sitting on Zoom.(9:45) Helping people all over the world. Yeah, yeah. Can I ask you, John, (9:49) how do you use this model? Because I know you work with people who are adopted and are going (9:57) through that journey.How do you use this model? Is it to help them to find their identity? (10:04) It's to help them create it to a large, sorry, create the one they want. (10:10) Okay. Yeah.(10:11) Not, I mean, they have an identity, right? Yeah, of course, yeah. (10:14) If you think about, say, people with adoption,

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome to Capitol Talking with Me, today's Bill and Media and Delphine Web today.

SPEAKER_03 0:05

And the letter of it in the United Kingdom. And the benefits of the doctor. I'm a clinical hypnotherapist and specialist in working with children.

SPEAKER_02 0:24

And I'm a retired benefit of the doctor. And consultant.

SPEAKER_03 0:29

We are two hypnotherapists talking. So let's get on with the episode. Hello everybody and welcome. So we're way into season nine now, aren't we, Denise? Talking to a lot of our friends and a lot of our colleagues. So I want to introduce John Scanlon. He's a hypnotherapist, a trainer and creator organiser of the Irish Hypnotherapy Conference. He practices in Ireland and he specialises in working with clients with trauma, adoption-related issues, FND, functional neurological disorder, and identity change. John also trains therapists in both working with trauma, FND, and adoption. And he's developed wonderful techniques such as the little star and lighthouse, which John's going to talk about today. So welcome, John. It's nice to have you on.

SPEAKER_01 1:35

Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 1:35

Nice to meet you.

SPEAKER_01 1:37

And you, Denise. We haven't met in person. We'll have to fix that.

unknown 1:41

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:43

When we figure out whether whether we're going to be able to fly from the US to anywhere very soon.

SPEAKER_01 1:49

Anyway.

SPEAKER_02 1:49

So what are you talking about today?

SPEAKER_01 1:52

I'm going to hippotops in what six weeks' time? Being in Las Vegas.

SPEAKER_03 1:58

Opposite side to you, isn't it? Yeah, I'm in Delaware.

SPEAKER_02 2:03

It's a long way away. It is a very good place to have a function, though, because there's so many hotels.

SPEAKER_04 2:14

It is. It is a nice place.

SPEAKER_02 2:16

Wow. Anyway, sir. So when you talk to us about lighthouse, the only thing I know about lighthouses is the shipping aspect of them. So what does it mean to you?

SPEAKER_01 2:25

What is it? Okay, well, I'll tell you what it is, and I'll tell you how I got there. So Lighthouse is a model for identity change. And I suppose how I got there was that from working with people with trauma and working with people with F and D. And being adopted myself, it changes. I won't say it even with adoption, it doesn't even change who you are. You become somebody at a very early age. And it's not always who you wanted to be. And particularly, I suppose, when I started to work with functional issues and people couldn't drive, and there were so many things they couldn't do that they lost the ability to believe in themselves, they lost the ability to be able to do things that most of us or even to project the future. See, even I mean, you think about the loss of freedom of not being able to drive or not being able to walk, or you know, that loss of freedom, and if you had it for a couple of years, and I've worked with people who've had it for 10 and 15 years, and it just literally transferred it, yeah, it's a gradual thing, but it does change them bit by bit by bit. And suddenly what's available to them doesn't is no longer available in their own mind. So what Lighthouse came from was a process that I developed where we clear the past to a large degree and we help people to clear the nervous systems and start to reset the systems and all that. Um, which is that we're born as unlimited potential and resources, pretty much. We're born confident, we're born resilient. And I know we're born confident, and I know we're born resilient because we learn to walk and we fall hundreds of times on the journey, but we get back up each and every time. When we're hungry as a child, we don't really care what you're doing. We're gonna say, feed me. I don't care, just give me food. Right? So we're born confident, we're born resilient, and we're born with curiosity and joy and so much else. Life knocks it out of us. So little star was a process that would bring people back to that essence of who they were, along with every positive thing that ever happened to them. And taking the lessons then from the not so positive stuff, if you want. The real thing was, I suppose, the first thing I would tell my clients each and every time is everything before today is over. And your left hemisphere knows that. Well, your right hemisphere is now gone. But what about because I'm running this loop from whenever in the and little star journey is a process that says, right, everything before today is over, we put a marker here to mark, and then we start to move forward. And then it became well, one of the tools that people need. So if you think about what a lighthouse is, it's and initially I I probably would have thought about it as a beacon, something that could, you know, light the way for you. But actually, now it's become more that no matter whether it's a storm outside or whether it's raining or whether the sun is shining, the lighthouse is still solid. Yeah, it doesn't matter what's going on around it. So if you can instill in people the beliefs and more importantly, the identities that they want, then they're solid within that environment, no matter what's going on around them. It also becomes a guide for them.

SPEAKER_04 6:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:04

So it's based on logical levels, it is based on that logic NLP logical level model. And I do it for two reasons. One is that I use it as a way to clear out any remaining bits that might be left. And the other is I use it as a way to install. So if you think about it, if we try and change a behavior, but there's a value attached to it, and once upon a time, people would call that secondary game, and they still do. I don't. It's the real game, it's the real reason why people do it. You know, you can change it.

SPEAKER_02 6:38

But it can be hidden from them. That's the problem. Most people aren't aware of most people aren't aware consciously of that hidden gain.

SPEAKER_01 6:46

Correct. Yeah, absolutely. But it's the real reason that goes behind it. And if you try and change a behavior and the value doesn't change, or something higher up that chain doesn't change, then suddenly you you may get short-term gain, but you won't get that long-term thing that people are looking for. So what Lighthouse became was a way to clear that stuff for once and for all, the remaining bits that might have been left, but also to give people a semblance of they might even see a picture in their mind and go, it doesn't bother me now. You know, we can still just get rid of it once and for all. And then connect them back to the work that was done up to that point, which was the star journey, basically everything before today is over. But you're bringing with you a toolkit now that includes all the positive things that have ever happened to you, plus all the stuff that you were born with, and then start to build the identity from identity down. Define who it is that you we are, I am, and then work down through the values, work down through the beliefs, work down through the behaviors, and ultimately the environment changes itself. And that literally is what Lighthouse is. Now, it was originally developed from working with trauma, but actually, most of us arrive at who we are by default. You know, and if we try and think about how we might want to do something and there's internal resistance for or you know, it's kind of like I use this for everybody at this stage, whether they've had trauma or not.

SPEAKER_02 8:20

And and you don't always know what's traumatic to somebody.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

Well, trauma is the perceived percept perceived.

SPEAKER_02 8:28

It's there, exactly. Especially if they were little.

SPEAKER_00 8:32

Correct.

SPEAKER_01 8:34

Absolutely correct. And what Lighthouse allows me to do is help people to create the future they want. Very clearly.

SPEAKER_02 8:42

Yeah. When did you develop it?

SPEAKER_01 8:44

About 18 months ago. About 18 months ago, I'd say.

SPEAKER_02 8:48

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 8:48

Um, because I was getting to that stage where people were they were they were what they've they'd cleared the reasons they came in the first place, but now they were going what goes next.

SPEAKER_04 8:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:00

So it kind of was demand-driven almost.

SPEAKER_02 9:04

Okay. Yeah. You know, um I mean how long have you been a hypnotist? How long have you been a hypnotherapist? 10 years, okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:11

10 years.

SPEAKER_02 9:12

I there was a real surge of I I trained in 2019. You were a couple of years before me last. So in 2015. It seemed to be a lot of people all of a sudden in this. We're a big cohort.

SPEAKER_03 9:27

Do you think 2020? Do you think 2015, 2016, there was nothing else to do?

SPEAKER_00 9:35

We all must have known something was common that we were going to be sitting on Zoom helping people all over the world.

SPEAKER_03 9:43

Yeah, yeah. Can I can I ask you, John, how do you use this model? Because I know you work with people um who are adopted or and are going through that journey. How do you use this model? Is it to help them to find their identity?

SPEAKER_01 10:00

It's to help them create it to a large sorry, create the one they want.

SPEAKER_03 10:07

Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:08

Not, I mean, they have an identity, right?

SPEAKER_03 10:10

Of course, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:11

I mean, if you think about say people with adoption, one of the one of the things that will come true hugely is I'm not good enough or I'm not loved. Right, okay. It comes through.

SPEAKER_02 10:22

Because they've been giv because they've been given away. That's the threat. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 10:27

Absolutely. And that's like just at the moment of birth, they're there thereafter. So it's the pure foundational stage. And it's not even a conscious memory, but it's that it once you know, it's actually also in the body. I remember meeting Bruce Lifton not so long ago, and he said to me, he was talking about something, but from a quantum perspective, he was talking about how the mother retains cells. I think it's in the liver from the baby. So there's always a connection across time and space.

SPEAKER_04 11:00

Right.

SPEAKER_01 11:01

You know, and I know science hasn't necessarily proven that to the same extent that you know it's it's it's given, but it's kind of once once you've given up as adoption, you're not looking, you're you have it in your mind or in your body, or wherever your mind may be, which is a very important question, but we won't go there because we can't prove the answer to it anyway. Uh for me, it's brain and body. So you have it in more particularly, probably in your nervous system, is where it's stored. There's a memory there that you're just not good enough. Little star became the solution for that. The little star was the connection because as part of that process, I bring people back to the room surrounded by unconditional love, and they walk through the journey of life with them, celebrating every success, walking them through the tough times, supporting them through. You know, I I I do that, so that's a big part of it. But to get them there, we've got to clear all the traumatic stuff in the first place. So if you like, for me, it's normally a four to five step process, a four to five session process, depending on the person.

SPEAKER_02 12:12

Do you find that the adopted parents, the people who have adopted these children, do they also need help with this proposal?

SPEAKER_01 12:22

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 12:22

And you you work with them as well.

SPEAKER_01 12:24

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They'll they'll face a different set of issues, obviously. Um, but it can bring up many issues for people who's adopted children. Maybe one of those is they mightn't have been able to have them themselves, and they they're living with that. You know, depending on where you are in the world and the time in which it happened, there were societal expectations. So there's a whole lot of stuff that comes with working with adoptive parents. I suppose primarily it would be those who have been adopted themselves, more so than the parents, but I've worked consider with a considerable number of parents as well, to be fair. So that's how I got to creating lighthouses. Where do you go next? Do you know? Um, and it is a process of clear the emotional baggage. I use a very simple model of the world, right? I'm gonna show it to you. I don't know if you can see that.

SPEAKER_03 13:20

I can.

SPEAKER_01 13:22

You can see it?

SPEAKER_03 13:23

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:25

Okay. We see or feel hear something, right? And it's a particular activating system points out its significance to us, so we determine whether it's significant or not. That sends a message to our brain. And if I have this image with me and I do, there you go. That sends a message to our brain that says, This is X.

SPEAKER_04 13:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:49

So actually, I'm gonna do it this way now because I'm gonna switch, because you have two hemispheres to your brain, and the left side says, This is X. The Y side or the right hand side goes, and it means a Z.

unknown 14:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:04

That then sends a signal to your amygdala, which then sends a signal to your nervous system.

SPEAKER_00 14:11

Very nice.

SPEAKER_01 14:12

The one thing that if we change it, changes everything, is if we change the meaning.

unknown 14:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:20

So we change the emotion, you mean, or the meaning.

SPEAKER_01 14:23

The meaning of it. It's the meaning, it's the meaning of the emotion. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So once we change the meaning, we also update what the RAS is looking for. It's a reverse process with that. So that's basically where so much of my work is is in changing the meaning for people. And then by the time I've got to, by the time they've they've changed the meaning, it's now what's next? So it really is about who do you want to become? I mean, the English language is wonderful, right? It's a communication tool. But so you know I'm about to say something as soon as I say the word bold, I guess.

SPEAKER_02 15:04

You'd rather say in Gaelic?

SPEAKER_01 15:07

Yeah. If you think about something, if have you ever done positive affirmations?

SPEAKER_03 15:13

Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 15:15

And how are you advised to construct them?

SPEAKER_03 15:18

Write them in the present tense so they're always happening or they're always there.

SPEAKER_01 15:24

I am in the in the present, in the in in the present tense and in a positive way.

SPEAKER_04 15:29

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:30

Yeah. So how many people will come in and tell you I am anxious? We take ownership with the English language of every every emotion. That's identity level stuff. The more you keep saying it. I am anxious, I'm anxious, I'm anxious, I'm anxious. I mean, if you take Irish or a lot of European languages, it would be anxiety is upon me.

SPEAKER_03 15:53

So it's a something that's I tell you what, tell you what I hear very, very often is my anxiety won't let me do this, or my anxiety stops me from doing that. And the first thing I say to my clients is, Who gave it to you? Where have you got it from? And they look at me as if to say, What do you mean? I say, Well, you've taken ownership of it. You take ownership of something away. If you take ownership of something, what we do is we will nurture it, we will care for it, we will look after it, we will encourage it. And when they look at it that way, they go, Oh yeah, totally different.

SPEAKER_01 16:31

Yeah. And yes, so if you think about you're gonna, it's my anxiety. We were saying on TikTok about it. There was a trending song last year for freaking I could hear it everywhere it turns. You know, and then it becomes important, you've got to verify that the brain's always got to be right, so therefore it's my anxiety. So I have to prove something's anxious.

SPEAKER_03 16:54

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 16:55

I mean, you think about say somebody walking down the street, two different people, one who's confident and one who's anxious, they're gonna see two different sets of things.

SPEAKER_03 17:07

Yeah, and they'll be given it. Totally different as well, won't they? The way they walk in, the way they absolutely, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:15

Yeah, which will tend to affect how other people are responding to them, which will reinforce that feeling anyway. Yeah, correct.

SPEAKER_01 17:23

Yeah. So what Lighthouse does is I use it to clear out each and every level. I use it, and I basically ask my clients a very simple question. If you would not choose to pick this up today, don't keep it. It's that simple.

SPEAKER_03 17:38

So isn't it? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:39

Do you do you in hypnosis go through a process of identifying and getting rid of those issues?

SPEAKER_01 17:46

I don't actually a lot of my stuff is content-free. Right? So I don't necessarily know it's not all content free, but I will tell people four things that I want them to understand. And once they understand these four things, and I do it a lot through story and metaphor, right? So I'm bypassing logic when I do this. But I want them to understand four things. The first thing is that everything before today is over.

SPEAKER_03 18:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:17

You can't go back to it even if you tried. The second thing is that everything is perception.

SPEAKER_02 18:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:24

Right. I'll tell a really stupid story about me being a Manchester United football fan and my friend being a Liverpool football fan, and Liverpool and United don't really get on very well. Intense rivalry. And Liverpool won a game, said Vanille, that he and I watched together. I can't.

SPEAKER_04 18:44

That's a different experience.

SPEAKER_01 18:46

Yeah. But the reality is we both saw the exact same thing.

SPEAKER_04 18:50

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:52

Right? We saw the exact same game, exact same score line, it just meant something different for us.

SPEAKER_04 18:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:59

We can change perception because that develops into a conversation then. People will evolve and change their mind about many things. We just don't assume that we can. I mean, something really interesting actually, and I do do it in trance, where I bring people somewhere and I bring them to a beach. And if you ever see, and now the next time you go to a beach, if you're going to look for this, if you ever look out at the water, it very much looks like the water meets the sky.

SPEAKER_04 19:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:28

It doesn't, because we know more, but if you look at it, you'd swear it does.

SPEAKER_02 19:34

And you sort of think of it as a box. It comes through the edge and then it's got.

SPEAKER_01 19:38

Yeah, that's what that's the way it looks like. And so if you think that we develop, you know, and particularly those first few years of our lives, where what looks like is real, what else do we think about that's looks a certain way but necessarily isn't? And I mean, and the other side of it, the the other two things that I'm always getting people to to focus on and think about is that things often seem bigger than they are. Now that's a very simple, you could put a a hand, you know, you could put a hand behind a light and the hand, the shadow will look 50 times bigger than the hand. Right.

SPEAKER_02 20:18

Most well, also if people if people have acquired these problems as a small child, they also don't see them as they did then.

unknown 20:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:27

Correct. And what I'm trying to remind them of, and what I am reminding them of, is the fact that it's not, they're not that same age anymore.

SPEAKER_03 20:35

Yeah, yeah. And and is that when you say again, everything before today is over?

SPEAKER_01 20:42

I really like that.

SPEAKER_03 20:42

Yeah, I really like that. I actually don't saw John's presentation at Hypnotic 2026 about your lighthouse, and it was it was like you said, it's logical levels, isn't it? Anyone who's trained in LLP will understand what logical levels are, but it's common sense, isn't it? Really?

SPEAKER_02 21:05

Common sense not that common.

SPEAKER_03 21:07

Well, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:10

I mean, I arrived at it because the people that I was working with needed it, to be honest. They were the ones looking for it, not me. You know, I mean, I'm curious by nature, and I'm definitely curious with things I'm interested in, and hypnosis is something I'm and the mind I've always been fascinated by, which is probably here.

SPEAKER_02 21:30

How do you find hypnosis?

SPEAKER_01 21:32

I had been practicing meditation and practicing Reiki for a while, and somebody gave me the opportunity to study it in Ireland, and I just fell in love with it.

SPEAKER_02 21:48

Absolutely. I was I trained in it thinking it was gonna be an add on to something else I was doing, and I had a second class and it was this is where I'm going now.

SPEAKER_04 21:58

Yeah, yeah, and I

SPEAKER_03 22:02

I think a lot of us were like that. I did NLP first, and within 30 minutes to you know half an hour, really, I was completely hooked thinking this is just amazing. And it's common sense and it's how you talk to yourself and it's how the way you talk to yourself or the way you think changes your actions, blah, blah, blah. And I the only reason why I went into hypnosis or hypnotherapy is because from as a standalone methodology, NLP just wasn't cutting it for me. I wanted to do a little bit more. So I did the hypnosis. Again, within 30 minutes to an hour, I was completely hooked. And like Denise thought, yeah, this is this is this is my way forward. Never looked back, never regretted it. And thoroughly.

SPEAKER_02 22:58

No, the only regrets I have is that I I didn't look at it earlier. Yeah. I I didn't really have the opportunity, but it infuriates me that it's not taught in medical school.

SPEAKER_03 23:07

I was just going to say, I do think that when you do, you know, either hypnosis, NLP, or of course the learning like Reiki, or I I do, I used to do Reiki as well. I don't really do it anymore. I do think that we go through a process of change, we start to to pick up on these things. And I do think it helps us to become, this isn't my opinion only, to become better practitioners. I do think it does help us to become better better practitioners.

SPEAKER_01 23:37

I think it does. Well, yeah, and I think, and it's something that I advise everybody to do, is to use your own tools on yourself.

SPEAKER_03 23:46

Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:49

Because you have a set of tools. You know, so whether you do it in self-hypnosis or do an arrangement with someone else.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

We've talked about also is is that you know it's why don't patients, why don't clients come back to you and come back to you? Because we teach them how to do it themselves. They don't need us after a short time. Yeah sometimes. Sometimes you you don't want to examine you want somebody else to have to deal with it. But but for the vast majority of people, you've taught them something now they can take they are not going to go out and practice hypnosis on others, but they've learned how they can help them.

SPEAKER_03 24:26

Yeah, and that speaks volumes, doesn't it? So, John, tell us about the Irish Hypnosis Conference. How did that come about? How did that come about as well?

SPEAKER_01 24:37

That was in a conversation actually in London three years ago now. No, nearly four. Um, November 22. And I had been going to London for a couple of years. I actually didn't know that many hypnotherapists in Ireland because the people I train with, a lot of them, like in most, maybe 20% continue. A lot of them drop out. They just, you know, that's across the world, that's just not here, but that's everywhere. Yeah, a lot of people train with dunk fractures, but as a correct, yeah, they use it either for themselves or they don't use it at all, you know, whatever. I went, I just literally asked myself a simple question. Well, there were two friends with me, and I went, Why is there not one of these in Ireland? So they went, Yeah, why isn't there? You should do it. I'm like looking at the pair of them going, Yeah, thanks very much. I came back and I spoke to a few hypnotherapists, and they all said, That's a great idea. And I said, Okay, well, if it's such a great idea, why has nobody done it? That was my only question. Of course, I never got an answer to that question. And then I kind of it was pure accident after. Well, I'm not gonna say accident, but it's like the way things line up. I happened to be sitting on a Thursday evening and I saw a workshop that following weekend coming up with somebody who's now a very dear friend of mine, Linda Emmett, and Freddie Jackson's at it. And I asked Freddie there, and he went, yeah. And then Carol came along, and then there was four or five others, and three months later, the first ever ship and therapy conference happened. And there was 50 people at that one, and there was 200 people then last April, last month.

unknown 26:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:15

Are the people who attend mostly from Ireland or are they coming from out of the house?

SPEAKER_01 26:21

About 50, 50. Like the other side of it is like Melissa Tears was there this year, Scott Sandlin was there this year. So people have come from all over Europe. Mike Mandel will be there next year. So people are coming from all over Europe. Not just I'll be there. There was quite a lot of Americans and Canadians as well, actually.

SPEAKER_03 26:38

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:39

Ireland being the tourist spot that it is, people want to make a a reason to come, you know.

SPEAKER_03 26:44

Of course, yeah, Dublin's gorgeous anyway. So I'll be there next year anyway. So uh circumstances this year and last year it just uh just didn't work out, but I'll be there.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

Life happens.

SPEAKER_03 26:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:58

It'd be life happens.

SPEAKER_02 27:00

Yeah, since since you if you a hypnotist, which I don't think of having very many hypnotherapists, you know, and the general public must think you're invisible. How well accepted is the idea of hypnosis by the general public and by the medical.

SPEAKER_01 27:22

I mean, the conference was about a multitude of different things. One was connecting people because it it's a fairly isolated job when you're doing it on your own. Yeah. It was so it was connecting people, it was obviously education because that's part of what any conference is about. But it's also about building a community. So there's now about a hundred hypnotherapists that come together both online and occasionally in person a couple of times a year. So people meet, they swap, they practice from each other, they learn from each other. We did a lot of peer-to-peer stuff. We're just I'm literally just about in the next couple of weeks setting up a kind of a registered organization that can actually promote hypnotherapy on behalf of the public, it is becoming more, it's still a bit, ooh, like I do get asked, you know, the usual, can you turn me into a chicken? For about 10 times the price I will is is this kind of standard answer.

SPEAKER_02 28:23

But if you really want to be one, yeah, we can do that.

SPEAKER_01 28:26

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We can do that. It's kind of it's becoming more, and so much of it is feedback. I mean, pretty much most of my business comes from referrals.

unknown 28:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:36

You know, and about 70% of it is in Ireland and about 30% of it's abroad. And that's coming from people going out and then people seeing transfer transformations, and then they're talking about it. Now, that mainly comes with the F and D and adoption space, actually. Trauma, people just still don't want to talk about it a whole lot. They don't want to talk about their traumas, but people will see the difference in them. Yeah, and then they're they'll want to come. I don't really deal a whole lot with uh smoking and weight loss and that kind of stuff. It's not in the trauma stuff. It's not my theme, it just doesn't work for me.

SPEAKER_03 29:10

Yeah, we had this conversation, Denise and I with somebody else, we have this conversation about sometimes things are drawn to you, aren't they? You attract certain things and and everything. Same with me and children, even though my background is working with children, but from a different perspective, like OT, physio and speech and language. I thought, well, I've got all that knowledge about how the brain works and how it develops, and you know, your motor functions and everything, why not use it? And it's just fallen naturally. And I do see adults still, but weight loss is not for me. No, even though I'm on a fantastic weight loss journey myself at the moment, and I'm doing really, really well, but it's not, it doesn't interest me. Doesn't interest me at all. Addiction interests me, and possibly a little bit of trauma, but not, you know, nothing else really.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

Yeah, it's interesting actually, because it only dawned on me well about a year or two ago. I do work a lot in the functional neurological space, right? My father died when I was 15, and my mother died two years later when I was 17. And I all no, my mother died of cancer. And this is not this is not about poor me. This is not I I always said my mother died of a broken heart. And it kind of suddenly dawned on me, and here I am helping people in a field that I never thought I'd be in, but is actually connected to the way they feel, which affects their physical health.

SPEAKER_03 30:44

Yeah, yeah. I think you just get stirred in in in different directions, don't you? Some it's like a calling, isn't it? That's why I always think it's like a calling.

SPEAKER_01 30:53

Don't think there are any accidents, actually. I think you know there's opportunities for us to arrive at where we unconsciously want to be, even if we don't know it. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 31:03

Do you do you run any courses? I know you run a course uh about the adoption because I know you you did one with Sheila Grande, didn't you? Unfortunately, I missed it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:12

I'm actually doing it this weekend and coming actually. It's a small group, but it's on uh Lighthouse and Trauma and F.

SPEAKER_02 31:19

Yeah. Do you work online or is these groups in person?

SPEAKER_01 31:23

No, it's online. It's because there's people from all over, so it's uh it's online. But it's the tools that are there, the results they get are just phenomenal. You know, and I love some of the language that that like even just recently I had a man and he'd rung me, he had just done done the lighthouse stuff, so he's back for more now that we've done it. But he's like he he'd met a huge dilemma in his life, and I thought he was gonna need a whole load of support, blah blah blah. And he went, no, no, I'm fine. I'm loving who I'm becoming. And I thought there's a set of words.

SPEAKER_03 31:59

And that's enough sometimes because yeah, it's a journey.

SPEAKER_01 32:04

I mean, one of the ways I've often described it is if you live in a valley all your life, you have no idea what it's like at the top of the hill. And when you clear your traumas or clear your limiting beliefs in whatever way they are, you suddenly have a brand new vista, you know, and that's when the work becomes even even nicer because people literally choose rather than a generic set of choosing, and it's a continually evolving process then, but it's an empowered process, yeah. You know, Carl Smith, I don't know if you've seen Carl do this, but with logic and emotion have an argument, emotion always wins. Have you seen him do that?

SPEAKER_03 32:38

No, but that's true.

SPEAKER_01 32:41

But he does it all the time, and I have this wonderful, I like this idea that when logic is mixed with positive emotion, as human beings, we're unstoppable, we'll just keep on going. Wow, and that's where I'm really trying to tap into. Yeah, it's it's background, its origin was trauma, its origin was however, it is about human potential and the ability that we all have.

SPEAKER_03 33:04

Yeah. Wow. So what's apart from the Irish hypnosis hypnotherapy convention next year, what's the future looking like for John Scanlon?

SPEAKER_01 33:15

That's a really good question. It's primarily one of the big things that's really close to me, and it's something that I want to push even more and create even more awareness on is functional neurological disorder. Because it is such it's becoming more and more prominent. I mean, there's more and more diagnosis of it everywhere you turn. There's no support for it in essence, and it's not even just the diagnosis itself. Firstly, it's a catch-all. I've dealt with everything from people who can't walk to people who have ticks. You know, it's a catch-all, it's it's a huge um, and there's so many different symptoms within it. A big part of it, and I've literally had people here where their child is sitting in the chair and the parent, and every time the child moves, they're just they themselves are in spider flight, and they're in constant alert. And the patients themselves, because they're looking up to doctors as the solution providers and the experts in the field, and they don't have an answer, people are going the stress, the anxiety, the depression that comes with it is huge. And hypnotherapy is the one of the most effective tools. It's literally, I've seen people transform from having multiple seizures every day to none in a few weeks' time.

SPEAKER_03 34:34

Sorry, has any doctors around your area started picking this up and referring to you in Australia have actually, believe it or not, but not necessarily in the average. It takes its time, doesn't it? It does take its time.

SPEAKER_01 34:47

Um I mean I'm not saying it's 100%, it's gonna cure everything 100%. I've had people who've literally stopped all their symptoms, they've they've they're all gone. And I've had people who've dropped them all the way down to about 10-20% of where they were. There's been very few that haven't had any benefit. It's it's you know, and that is it's becoming more prevalent, more common, I should say, and it needs support.

SPEAKER_03 35:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:19

And we've got a set of tools to do it.

SPEAKER_03 35:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:21

Like I literally I have been working with it now for for about three or four years, and I only came across by accident. Well, I'm probably one of if people think of functional neurological disorder and in therapy, my name will probably come into the mix somewhere because you know.

SPEAKER_03 35:37

But that's good though, isn't it? I've only ever had one client with FND. I did help him, I did help him up to the level. But if I knew what I knew now, I wouldn't have seen him, I'd have referred him. Yeah. And this is the beauty about keeping in touch with people with other hypnotherapists, the beauty of this podcast, the beauty of other podcasts and the conventions and the conferences is that we get to know people who are better at something than what we are. And that's the you know, and that's and that's how it should be. You know, we should be able to refer, you know, to to our fellowship.

SPEAKER_02 36:14

Well, yes, but but also when you go to those conferences, the people who are doing that work are very encouraging to the people who are just coming board. Yeah, don't feel you cannot learn this.

SPEAKER_01 36:25

It's just yeah, it's I mean that's I suppose that's the second the second thing in relation to all that. I have three pillars in my business basically adoption, F and D, and and adoption, trauma stroke, F and D. I know it's not always connected, but yeah, in in a lot of cases it is, and identity work. They're the three pillars that I work with pretty much, and I'm gonna continue to do that. And the identity work is really exciting because it's about human potential. If you ever know without the violence, but if you can watch the film Limitless without the violence, it's a great movie. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 37:02

Without the violence.

SPEAKER_01 37:03

Power of the human mind is amazing. I know it's only a movie, but and then the rest of it is about the expansion of hypnotherapy. So it's it's it's it's more accepted. That's the work through the conference, really, to a large degree, to help hypnotherapy to be a more accepted tool, to work with other organizations and other so that people will like we've all seen where somebody comes in for three or four sessions and what would have taken a year or two years of counseling as resolved. And you're kind of going, why? Those why is this? You know, so we can I I'm a very I have a very simple belief, uh, which is you can work to change that with state organizations, but you'll be dragged through the mire in all their protective, or you can take a business approach, which is you know, what do you do? You market it, people see it from results, and then more and more people come. The more talking about it, the more marketing, not and not marketing in a formal way, but marketing by people going out and seeing trans from transforms people's lives, then it's like that's where hypnotherapy will benefit. That's upskilled practitioners, that's connected practitioners, that's new ideas. Because the clients are the ones who change. We just need to give them permission, or we need to show them they're the ones who give the permission. We have tools that allow them to do that.

SPEAKER_03 38:30

I always I always say that to my clients that I'm I'm just your tour guide. I'm gonna guide you to find those solutions and find, you know, that ability and that confidence to to move on, you know. So it's it's lovely, but it's been lovely talking to you, Dom. Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_02 38:48

It's very nice to meet you.

SPEAKER_03 38:49

Yeah, and I will see you in November.

SPEAKER_02 38:52

I'm I'll work on the next Irish one.

SPEAKER_01 38:56

Excellent. Yeah, excellent. You'd be more than welcome.

SPEAKER_03 38:59

Thank you very much. Thank you, John.

SPEAKER_01 39:02

We'll give you the Irish tour a guide journey.

SPEAKER_03 39:07

I've done the Guinness tour, I want to do it again. All right, listen, thank you, guys. Yeah, this time with somebody who drinks Guinness because I went with five girls who doesn't like Guinness, so it was no good.

SPEAKER_01 39:20

Well, well, the next time you come, there'll be an army of people who'll be with you, so you're alright.

SPEAKER_03 39:24

I'll be there. Thank you, John. Thanks very much indeed.

SPEAKER_01 39:29

Listen, thank you guys.

SPEAKER_03 39:31

Thank you. We hope you've enjoyed listening. Please remember this podcast is designed to give you an insight into therapeutic hypnosis. And it's for educational purposes only. So remember, consult with your own healthcare professional if you think something you've heard may apply to you or a loved one.