Counterfeit: Connection (Part 1) - #006

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:12

Hey, welcome back to Pockets of Paradise with Larson and Megan. And we are so glad you are here. We've got some interesting things to dive into today. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 0:24

Today we're um continuing our counterfeit series talking about the real thing versus the fake thing. And we want to talk about counterfeit connection, which uh me and Larson have been sitting here for 30 minutes talking about how we're gonna talk about this because there's so much that we want to say. But um we hope you're blessed by what we talk about today. Yes. Yeah. So when we were trying to research what we wanted to talk about, I got on my soapbox about um uh brain research because I'm a bit of a nerd about that. But um Yeah, we found something else we have in common because I'm like neurology, yay! Yay, no, I love it. And the more they discover, the more it's evident that there's a God. And it's just so exciting to watch all of these really smart people figure it out. Um but uh so one of the biggest things that they have found is that the brain uh is developed through relationships and it thrives um in relationships and it is formed and shaped by relationships. We are created to connect to each other, and it also is created to connect to something higher, a higher purpose, a higher calling, a higher being. And so the more research they do, the more they discover this, and it just oh, it just gets me going. I just get really excited about it. Um so one of the most important findings um is that early relationships shape neural pathways. And in counseling and in the whole psychology world, we often talk about attachment theory, which later on we'll do a whole series on that, but we'll touch on it today. But it just kind of goes into how you attach to your caretakers as an infant affects the way you it's receive and give love as an adult.

SPEAKER_03 2:22

Um it makes me like overthink, probably like how I was with my kids at first. I'm like, oh lord. Like I feel like I was surviving at one point, but yeah, no, I think yeah, I think that's real.

SPEAKER_02 2:35

I think that's very real. I still do that on a daily basis. Like, oh gosh, am I ruining them?

SPEAKER_03 2:40

I don't know. They're gonna need their oh, I'll save some money so they can have therapy later fund.

SPEAKER_02 2:47

But the good news about um connection and attachment. Well, first bad news. Bad news is that we're in a fallen world and no one's perfect and we all have a little bit of damage, even from the best parents in the world. They leave a residue of their crap on us, and so it's a lack of a better term. But um yeah, there's no no human that gets out of life unbattered. Yeah. Um unscathed. Unscathed, yeah. And so stinking humans. I know. And so I um I'm gonna just go over the four main or main attachment styles just to like give people a brief overview. There are whole studies and textbooks on this, like trainings in this. There's a it goes very deep, but I'm gonna give you like the flyover version so we can have this conversation. But the four main attachment styles are number one, secure attachment. So this is the healthy, healthiest version of attachment. So um, this is when uh it feels comfortable. The person feels comfortable with closeness and independence. So these are the kids in the playground that go off and play and make friends and they come back and kiss mom every now and then and go back out and play and friends and yeah, are doing great. So they feel comfortable with closeness and independence and taking risks. They trust others and communicate their needs well because they know that they they they can go to that person with anything with their needs. Um, they can regulate their emotions in relationships, um, typically formed when caregivers were consistent and responsive. So that's like in a utopian world, but there are people with secure attachments, right? But even still, we have little tinges of other things in us, right? Um, but the core belief of someone with secure attachment is I know that I'm loved and I can handle conflict without fear or losing the relationship. So there's a security and a home base there that they know that they can turn to. They can turn to and they're not gonna lose it's unconditional love. Um, so that's number one. Number two is anxious attachment style, and some people call it the preoccupied attachment style. Um, this person craves closeness but fears abandonment. Um, they may feel like they're too much or worry about being rejected. They often seek reassurance over and over and over and over. Um, and they usually this usually develops from inconsistent caregiving as a child. So they're trying to be um what that they're just trying to seek that reassurance. Are you gonna stay? Are you gonna stay? Am I enough? Am I too much? Do you love me? And it's just that anxious.

SPEAKER_03 5:38

Um Do they go into like proving their worth in that?

SPEAKER_02 5:43

Sometimes, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:44

Yeah. Sometimes curious. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:47

Or they'll like backfire and self-sabotage. And so they're in control in a weird way.

SPEAKER_03 5:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:51

Where like if I reject you, you can't reject me. So it can go either way.

SPEAKER_03 5:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:56

Um, avoidant attachment style, or oftentimes called dismissive attachment style. Uh, this person values independence over closeness. They're like hyper independent. Like, leave me alone. Like, I got this, I don't need nobody. Yeah. Oh. Um. They may struggle to open up or rely on others. They often minimize emotions. Um, their tagline is usually I'm fine. Uh typically comes from emotionally distant caregiving, um, where they were kind of forced to be independent at a young age. Um, so the core belief of the one before I forgot to say, uh, the anxious one, is um do they really love me? Why haven't like, do they really love me?

SPEAKER_03 6:43

They haven't told me in an hour or two. Right.

SPEAKER_02 6:45

Like, am I enough to am I am I gonna lose this? Is this secure? It doesn't feel secure.

SPEAKER_03 6:51

I feel like it's like if you get like a look, you know how parents have looks that they give their kids.

unknown 6:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 6:57

I feel like sometimes I would get one, I'd be like, ah, I don't know what do they still love me? Like, what do I do? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:05

No, my mom had an eyebrow that can bring a grown man to his knees. Yeah, no, no, but I always knew my parents loved me. But yeah, no, I know exactly I know the look.

SPEAKER_03 7:15

I feel like that's a thing. Yes. I think it's good to fear your parents a little bit. Yes, I think there's a healthy balance.

SPEAKER_02 7:23

But it's like I'm dead, but I'm but I'm also not gonna I'm gonna eat dinner tonight. Yes. Um, yeah, I might be grounded for life, but yeah, I'm left. Um and then the last one is disorganized attachment, which can be called fearful avoidant. So um, this is the person that desires connection deeply, but is also terrified of it. Um, they may feel confused, overwhelmed, or unpredictable uh in relationships because one minute they'll be all about it, the next minute they'll be shutting down. And it's kind of like a tug of war in their mind and their heart of I want this so bad, but I'm terrified to get hurt. Yeah. Um, and it's often linked to trauma or frightening caregiver experiences. Um I want closeness, but I also feel unsafe.

SPEAKER_03 8:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:15

Um, so I don't know if I explained those wells. There's a lot of things. I think you did.

SPEAKER_03 8:19

I'm I'm glad that we're not. I mean, even I feel like even for the healthy nowadays, like I can't I'm glad that we're not all just one of those.

SPEAKER_02 8:28

Oh no.

SPEAKER_03 8:29

You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 8:29

Like I could there's categories, but the lines are blurred for sure. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:33

Yeah. Like you can have a like you said, a tinge of all of them, maybe. Even in certain like different people in your family and how you react with them or friendships. Right.

SPEAKER_02 8:42

Or like early relationships you had. Like I had a very secure home attachment to my parents, but I had early relationships that were not they were off the hinges, yes. But like and and different traumas that and traumas that shaped me in ways that my parents couldn't protect me from, you know what I mean? Yeah. And so you can't protect your kids from their testimony.

SPEAKER_01 9:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:07

But the good news about attachment styles is that um a non-Christian counselor would say you can uh heal through healthy relationships and self-awareness and therapy, which is all true. But the most true version of healing in that is that Jesus redeems the connection. Yeah. Because in the garden before the fall, before sin caused all of this, we had the ultimate secure connection with God. And as soon as that happened, that tie was cut. And I feel like we've all been running around with like what was the term I used earlier?

SPEAKER_03 9:50

I don't think it chickens with their heads cut off. I don't know. I feel like that relates to what you're saying. I just like completely lost the word and I know it.

SPEAKER_02 9:59

Um separation anxiety. No, that's what I was saying. I was thinking not chickens with hang up. Same thing, same thing. It's a dog chewing through the door when you leave. Yeah. But it's like separation anxiety. That's what it is. Same thing. I'm like, whoa, where did that go? Yeah. Um, but I feel like as soon as that that happened, every human being has been searching for that security again.

SPEAKER_03 10:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:24

And it kind of goes back to the peace and the love episodes that we did. Like we're all aching for only what God can get.

SPEAKER_03 10:31

Yes. Only God can feel that.

SPEAKER_02 10:33

Yeah. Which is kind of wild.

SPEAKER_03 10:34

It is interesting because there's a couple books, like um the one that uh you actually gave me it was the Daily Grace Goes, the like for the grief and loss. Yeah. Like we were we were kind of going through it and I was still like reading through it and stuff. And um one of the things it says, like I had to correct my mindset because when it talks about escapism and stuff like that, I felt like I was escaping through reading my Bible all the time because it I know that sounds like, oh, well, good for her. You know, that kind of rose on you. Yeah, but I literally I was like, is this healthy? Like, I don't know. Cause anytime something would happen with the kids or someone else, I'd be like, Where's my Bible? I need something. And this is. I would chicken up my headgun. Yes. Yeah. Like I felt like life was spinning. And I know it still feels like that sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 11:30

I don't think that's wrong at all. I think that's you seeking refuge and your secure attachment.

SPEAKER_03 11:34

But I had to, like, it's crazy to me that I would question that. And I feel like that has something to do with like what I would attach to previously or what I would attach to, like, I don't know, we talked about last time, like shows, even and stuff like that. Like, I was like, is this okay? Like, but then it's that higher power, it's God, you know. So yeah, it's okay. Like, yeah, but it's funny that actually you need to run to me.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Yeah, like it crossed my mind, and that's I don't know, it's just and that's another thing to be aware of too, because when you're in that state, yeah, the enemy he smells blood. You know what I mean? And he can I don't like to give him more credit than he's due. Right. But he will shoot his shot when he sees it and he will send doubt, he will send shame. Like, cause the fruit of that thought was what? Uh was it shame?

SPEAKER_03 12:28

It was just like, am I am I facing reality? Yeah. Like that's kind of what I would I It's doubt. Yes, doubt. There you go. We got to it. So I'm like, is it welcome to my mega session? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:42

But you have to like when when a thought comes in at you, you know that you know what is true. Yes. You were trying to hang on to your anchor in this storm, and then this thought comes in and says, Oh, you think you're doing this too much? Yeah. Is it just escapism? Well, you just escaping. What? Uh yeah. I hate the term um when people are on vacation and they're like, we gotta get back to reality. No, I hate that for a lot of reasons because I like vacations.

SPEAKER_03 13:11

Wait, have you ever been on vacation with kids? There's nothing but reality you're facing. That's so true.

SPEAKER_02 13:16

Sometimes I'm like, please get me home. Um but I mean, like we were created for paradise. Yeah. That's why I named this pockets paradise because we were created for like God's version of this world and heaven, right? And connection and pure relationships and rich, like everything is just rich. But I just I can't wait to do that.

SPEAKER_03 13:40

I wish I could see her arms out being like, you know, grunting at it like rich. Oh man, good stuff.

SPEAKER_02 13:47

But I um I hate that term because it's like, oh, we got to get back to reality, but our reality is paradise.

SPEAKER_03 13:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:56

So this is a temporary reality, and it's learning how to get back to that. But when you are in that state of like, ah, this is a lot and it hurts, and I don't want to don't know what to do with these feelings. I don't know who to talk to. And I put this, you ran back to your reality. Yeah. Like that's true. You ran back to your the the truth, the compass, the true Norse that like makes sense of what you're going through. And if it doesn't make sense yet, he gives you hope to hang on to in the meantime.

SPEAKER_03 14:28

Yeah, I think that is so needed, just going through everyday life. Like, even if you would look at your life, because there was a time where I would do this, I would look at my life and I'd be like, well, you know, I didn't do too many crazy things when I was younger and growing up, but I also like I, I don't know, I I needed still like an anchor because I was still searching, even though I wasn't like, I wouldn't say I was lost, but I was also very much still like looking for that higher power, like looking towards God because I'm like, I I don't know how to function. And it wasn't because of what my parents taught me, because I had these feelings on my own. You know, it was like it was just, I don't know, part of part of nature. Yeah. Maybe of like trying to trying to search.

SPEAKER_02 15:22

Yeah. I think, yeah, we all I don't know who said this, but I think every if you've been in the church since the 90s, you've heard this term, but it's like we all have this like Jesus shape hole, like vacuum in our chest.

SPEAKER_03 15:33

I think I said that one of the last episodes. I was like, take the back.

SPEAKER_02 15:38

It's funny, but it's true, yeah. Like, and the the Bible says like we have eternity place in our hearts.

SPEAKER_03 15:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

And we're we're trying to get back there. So uh and we will. That's the good news.

SPEAKER_03 15:50

It's not my temperature. You know, break it down.

SPEAKER_02 15:54

I'm not gonna sing for the Megan, they will never come.

SPEAKER_03 15:57

That's all they get, but like two snaps.

SPEAKER_02 16:01

Um, so yeah. So the solution. Yeah, connection. So important. The connection and coming back to secure attachment. That's what we're talking about.

SPEAKER_03 16:13

The good, the good stuff, yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:15

Um, so I was thinking about my testimony. Um and there's so many chapters to a testimony, like I could talk about all kinds of things, and you could too, because we have so many stories in different seasons of life and things, but I was thinking about connection, and um I'm trying to think of what story to tell because I'm like, oh, that's nerve-wracking. But I so I'll tell this one. So in college, um something happened to me that made me question everything. And I was very angry at God. I s I was I knew there was a God, yeah, but I didn't believe he was benevolent and loving if he would have let that happen to me. I didn't have the full wisdom or maturity to understand what was going on. Yeah, and so I um I continued to go to church because I was like volunteering, um, but I was so far from God in my heart. And I during that time I was searching in people and alcohol and um some drugs, like I was just very I was living a double life, and then I started to um reach out to people who believed in different things. So I was like, all right, uh why do I believe in Jesus? Because my parents told me to. Okay, well, yeah, challenge accepted. Like, I'm gonna find a God who fits me, you know, like just prideful brat. I think back on that, and I'm like, Lord, thank you for loving such a hood rat like me. But um, so I met and I would have coffee dates with people, and I met with people who were new age, and I met with people who were uh atheists, agnostic, Hindu, um, Muslim. Um across the board, all across the board. I was looking, like searching for real. And I was researching different religions. I was in a world religions class at the same time. Um, and I was just trying to figure out what was true. And at the end of all of that, um, my dad gave me a book by John Eldridge, which uh you know I love John Eldridge, I talk about him all the time. It's called Beautiful Outlaw, and it's basically like the human side of Jesus, like the scandalous, relatable side of him. Uh, and it just kind of rips off the really religiosity and it makes him a person that you can touch. Yeah. And so my dad was like, You should read this. I was like, you know what? What the heck? So I read it, and that was when I finally was like, you know what, this is a God I can believe in. And it was Jesus, and it makes you cry thinking about it now, but I like recommitted my life to him, and quickly my whole mindset changed, my bitterness was gone. Wow, I had purpose again. Um, my depression was gone, my anger was gone, all of it. And it was just a reattachment to something secure.

SPEAKER_03 19:38

Yeah, you were like delivered from all those things. Yeah, like that's huge. Yeah, and that's a lot to be delivered from at one time. Like that's incredible.

SPEAKER_02 19:47

Yeah, and being able to say, you know what, like to receive love for the first time. Yeah. Because I received it for my parents, I had secure love for my parents, and then I had some rough relationships in between. Yeah. That changed the way I viewed my worth, that changed the way I viewed other people. Yeah. Um, and I it was like I had to go back to my secure attachment to remind me of the truth. Yeah. And and I think of like the prodigal son in that story because I was eating with the pigs when I came back. I smelled. I stink, right? And so when I came back and he hugged me, like the warm embrace from Jesus and his community is something that will alter your brain chemistry. Yeah. Literally and literally, like for real. Like there's brains brain uh research behind the power of connection with the body of Christ and Christ alone and how it changes you and it redeems the parts that the enemy tried to steal, and the anxious and the fearful, and the dismissive, and the avoidant parts of us that um were never a part of his plan. He starts to chisel away at over time, and I'm just so thankful for that.

SPEAKER_03 21:09

Yeah, it is. I mean his love is so big. Like, I know it sounds so cheesy saying that. Like, I think of that song in Kids Church, like, God is so big, he's so big. Yes. You're doing the O's above your head, like that kind of thing. But I mean, it really is, and it's all in it's all encompassing, and it's it's intimate too. Oh you know, like it's so I know we've talked about doing one on that, but like on intimacy, but it is it's another level that you cannot get from a human, you cannot get from a substance, you cannot get from anything else. And you're not like I know even through times in my life whenever I would try to run towards the Lord. Like there would be the enemy whispers of um you're just trying to convince yourself and you're just trying to trick yourself into believing. But the only real thing that I feel like I've actually encountered is the Lord. Yeah. And is that relationship with him? And it's also been the one that's shifted my mindset and and delivered and all those things. Like nothing else can do that.

SPEAKER_02 22:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:25

So kick the enemy. We say kick the enemy in the in the house. We say kick the enemy in the house and make him run like a little baby. And the kids love it because they're like, run away, little baby. Is that kind of I'm like, take that salt and give it to the Lord and we're gonna kick your foot out and kick them in the face. I'm like, please, please don't do this to humans.

SPEAKER_02 22:46

But but but yeah, no, that's fun. That's awesome. That's awesome. Telling us, stick it where the sun don't shine. Right.

SPEAKER_03 22:54

Like a G-rain divergent, I guess.

SPEAKER_02 22:56

Sorry, sorry. Oh that's funny.

SPEAKER_03 23:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:01

No, going going back to um some of the research that I did on the brain, yeah, one of the fascinating ones that I saw um is that our brain responds to God as a relational presence, which is like what? So it says studies using brain imaging show that when people pray or engage with God personally, the brain activates in regions associated with relationships, attachment, social cognition, and how they understand others' thoughts and feelings. In other words, the brain often treats God not as an abstract idea, but as an actual person because he is.

SPEAKER_03 23:46

I love that.

SPEAKER_02 23:47

Um so personal prayer lights up similar similar areas as talking to a loved one on the scans, and then people experience a genuine sense of interaction and presence um when they're experiencing communion with God.

SPEAKER_03 24:05

I love that there's proof of that, like in that way.

SPEAKER_02 24:07

It lights up different parts of your brain when you talk to him.

SPEAKER_03 24:10

That's wild.

SPEAKER_02 24:11

Because they also do scans when you are thinking of an abstract idea and they because they have to they have to have a basis of what they're comparing it to.

SPEAKER_03 24:19

Yeah. That was crazy. Yeah. I would have liked to have been like in that room. You know, when they were discovering that. And I'm like, wait a minute, what are you thinking about? Yes. That would have been really cool to see. Um, I'm sure there's videos on YouTube at this point. Yeah, we gotta go, we should go find them. Nerd out on it. Put the put the link below.

SPEAKER_02 24:43

Uh another, another one. I'm like reading through them right now, my notes. It says another one, um, faith can function like an attachment relationship. So um God can be a secure base and a safe haven that rewires your brain to have secure attachment to others.

SPEAKER_03 25:01

Yeah. I think it's Dr. Caroline Lee talks a lot about yeah, she talks a lot about um like your synapses and what it takes to like the three cycles of 60 days or whatever. I that could be totally wrong. It's been years since I've heard her talk.

SPEAKER_02 25:16

Um, and or read one of her books talking of watching your eyes just go back, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:21

Like, oh gosh, that could be totally wrong. But it does take time to do that. But I think it's so cool how like it can be rewired. I feel like faster and like you like in your story, like it was more of an instant thing.

SPEAKER_02 25:39

It was instant and gradual, yes. Like, yeah, because I'm God's still working on things, but yes, yes.

SPEAKER_03 25:45

But there's like there is a difference initially, like when you encounter the shift, yes, you feel the shift, and then obviously you have to fight the allies of the enemy because he's gonna attack, you know, that's inevitable, especially right before breakthrough.

SPEAKER_02 25:59

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 26:00

So I feel like that's just so beautiful to to even I'm like thinking of like looking at a brain scan, like what that looks like, and I don't even really know, but I know enough to get me in trouble, so it's cool, it's so cool.

SPEAKER_02 26:15

Um, I know, and another thing in attachment style that they John Bowlby studied was like um how a child was soothed. So yeah, um, that's a big indicator on the attachment style, like how the child connects to being the caregiver and being soothed when they're in distress. And um a lot of times adults you'll see adults who don't know how to regulate their emotions because of their attachment style. And they've they've just flipped a lid because they've been in survival mode since they were little and they don't know how to calm down. Um same thing with anyone who struggles with anxiety or things like that. Um and so in counseling we do a lot of things that help people regulate their nervous system. Um, and then and as infants, like when your baby was screaming, let's say Judah skins his knee. Yeah, what is your initial reaction?

SPEAKER_03 27:24

Okay, so it's different for Izzy and Judah. Okay. From a girl and a boy, it's very different. Yeah. Um for Judah, I run to him and I'm like, Are you okay? Like, you know, checking on him, like, it's gonna be okay. And just trying to, you know, doctor him up and you know, hold the holding. Yeah, yeah. The holding. What do you do with Izzy?

SPEAKER_02 27:46

Poor Izzy.

SPEAKER_03 27:48

Okay, so okay, to be fair, Izzy gets hurt on things that like it's very rare where it's just like some random weird thing that happens and she gets hurt. Like, she will do things after I tell her not to. And so like, you deserve it. I'm like, okay, I don't say that, but I do have to remind myself. This is this is sad, but I have to remind myself. I go to comfort her and I hold her. I know you do, I'm just but I have to remind myself to like give her a little bit of time to calm down before I'm like, hey, did mommy say before you did that idea? Like the floor is hard. That's my dad's like favorite saying with Izzy, the floor is hard because she's like, I know, like, and she'll just still do whatever. So, like, I sometimes it's interesting with her because I have to like remind myself to give her a little bit of time to like break down, have the moment. And and then I'm like, hey, can we let's talk about that? Yeah, let's not do that again. Like when Judah, like he would for the most part listen. Although, if you knew him when he was a little kid, like he always had some type of bruise on his head. I think the kid was just head heavy, but like I didn't drop him, he just fell all the time. Like the kid's head heavy. Good night. That's the best I got. But I'm like, holding is definitely like my go go to making sure they're okay. And you can tell, like, when they have different screens or cry. Oh, you know, they heard cry.

SPEAKER_02 29:24

You know, like yeah, Lena has the best fake cry I've heard in a while. People are like, oh my gosh, is she okay? The girls are good. Um but no, I totally understand that. So with I feel like I just totaled myself. All mothers everywhere. Can I do that? Yeah. Um so yeah, the holding thing. So the natural reaction is for a caretaker to hold that child and put them on their chest. You think of a newborn when they're screaming, they want to smell their mommy or their daddy. Bring them in and bring them in heart to heart. And there is science behind that, and it's called co-regulation. And in healthy, secure attachment, children are learned they learn to co-regulate, and this the adult who hopefully has a secure attachment style and is able to regulate their emotions, picks up the baby and then teaches them how to their heart rate and their bri breathing rate to come back down to theirs. Adults can do this. So it's really funny. I've had couples in my office where one had a secure attachment and one did not. And we would be in a conversation, someone would be getting anxious and upset, and I'm like, okay, time out. We're gonna do something really weird, and I need you to trust me. Yeah. And I'll have them stand up and I'll kind of briefly explain to them like this is co-regulation, and I just want you to hold each other until you until I tell you to let go. And I said, and to the secure person, I'm like, I want you to just focus on breathing slowly. I was like, they can do whatever they want, they just have to hang on to you, but just breathe slowly. And sometimes it takes 30 seconds, sometimes it takes 10 minutes, and it feels like an eternity.

SPEAKER_03 31:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:09

But they always come down to the secure person and they co-regulate. And every time they do that, they reset their nervous system, which is wild. So, and then in research, I'm gonna whip out my research again. It has been proven that spiritual practices um such as prayer, worship, meditation on scripture, and scripture reflection, which is similar, um, have measurable effects on the brain and the body. So they decrease the activity and the fear and stress part of your brain, which is the amygdala. Uh, they increase feelings of peace and safety, and they improve focus and emotional regulation. So literally doing the dailies, doing the little things, praying, worshiping the Lord, being in community, like anchoring yourself to that refuge. I need my Bible. Like that was what you were doing. You were co-regulating with the with your father.

SPEAKER_03 32:09

Yeah. It is interesting because I like whenever Rusty and I were married and walking through like tough situations, I would do that. Like I even if I felt like physically sick, like if he just rubbed his hand on my back, it was like, I'm gonna be okay. I'm okay. Yeah, like it's crazy. Yeah now that you're talking about, I'm like trying to think even before being married him and like figuring out what what did I turn to? Like what did I yeah, I don't really know right now. My brain has like a block. But like, yeah, it's it definitely makes a difference. Yeah. Oh, and then with with the Lord, like I um I always imagine for some reason, I don't know why. I oh it's probably because of that song, the lay back against him and breathe. Oh, yeah, feel his heartbeat. Like I've always imagined, like through everything that's happened in my life, I feel like when I really like actually focus and turn to him, I'm like, that's what I picture. Like me just like laying back and I can feel just letting go.

SPEAKER_02 33:18

Yeah, letting him hold you.

SPEAKER_03 33:19

Yeah, because it's secure. That's wild, isn't it? Whoop, science.

SPEAKER_02 33:25

It's awesome. I love that everything in science is a discovery because it's not it's not a creation, it's a discovery because it already existed, and God's just sitting back waiting for us to find it.

SPEAKER_01 33:35

Yeah, that's cool.

SPEAKER_02 33:36

Um and each discovery is leading you closer and closer to the truth. Yeah. Which is just really fascinating to me. It is. All right. I just feel like we need a heartbeat in the back. I know. I need I feel like I need a hug. You don't co-regulate.

SPEAKER_03 33:57

That's how you make friends fast. Yeah. Well, you've co-regulated. Um sorry. We are not currently hugging if anyone was wondering. Not saying I will hug her when we're done.

unknown 34:12

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 34:14

Oh man.

SPEAKER_02 34:15

Do you have, I know we had some scripture to kind of close out with.

SPEAKER_03 34:21

Yes. Let me get to my pictures of my screenshots. Okay. So John 10, 28 through 29 says, I give them eternal life and they shall never perish. No one will snatch them out of my hand. My father who has given them to me is greater than all. No one can snatch them out of my father's hand. I feel like that sounds like a double security right there. I mean, I know there's like the Trinity three and one, but like the you've got the father's son, and then the father, and it's like, all right, no one can snatch it out, and no one can take it from my father either. Like, yeah, it's like extra to me. Yeah. Extra good security. Yes. Not extra to say it in the Bible. That one's good. And then um, let's see. What other one did I have? Um, the Romans eight. Yeah, eight, thirty-eight through thirty-nine. Um I think like sometimes we read it so I was literally reading it to her, like neither death nor life, nor angels nor demons. Yeah, but I feel like we just need to let it so slow it down. Yeah. Um it says, for I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Praise God. I love that one. It just hits all the marks. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:00

Doesn't leave any room for doubt. Yeah. It doesn't. So if you're listening today and you feel isolated and you have a lot of um friends on social media, but not a lot of friends in real life. Yeah. Um, or if you grew up in a home that was not a secure attachment style, I just want you to know that there is hope and that God can redeem it all. And so my encouragement to you is to run to Him for refuge. Um, seek out a good Bible teaching church. If it's not our church, find one. Um and spend time to pray. And prayer is nothing fancy, it's just talking to him. And the more you talk to someone, the more comfortable you get with talking to them. Um, I actually had this conversation with someone yesterday. They were like, Megan, I just don't understand. Like, you just pray, like you just go for it. And I said, Well, I talk to him a lot. He's he probably like turned my volume down sometimes because I'm always talking to him. But like he's a friend, and the longer you walk with him and the more you talk with him and do life with him, um, the easier it becomes. So don't beat yourself up if you don't know what to say. Just start, just start.

SPEAKER_03 37:19

Yeah, abiding with him, trusting him fully. And then if your church does offer small groups, maybe try one of those. Yes. And get around people who are like-minded and searching too. Yeah, yeah, searching for the same thing. Yes, it's can encourage you in your path because it changes everything. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:41

To be surrounded by people who are excited about what you're doing.

SPEAKER_03 37:44

Yes, about the neurology in Jesus.

SPEAKER_02 37:48

Yeah, thanks for bearing with me with my nerdiness today.

SPEAKER_03 37:52

Uh Larson, do you want to pray? Sure. Okay, let's do it. Lord, thank you so much for just these conversations. They're fun, they make us think about life. Um, they always encourage me, even when I'm leaving. Um, I still think about it. So, God, thank you just for one a good friend in Megan and who you've made her. And also, God, just for the people that you are now orchestrating and placing in other listeners' lives that are gonna be their Megan or their person that you have for them to have that connection with, to grow deeper with you, Lord. God, I pray that you will um open any eyes that are close to this, God, that they will know that they can fully trust you and they can abide with you and just spend time in your word, even if they don't know what they're doing, God, just starting somewhere and telling you all the things in their life, God. I pray that they will be able to be vulnerable because it takes that and open up, Lord, to you, because you are the only one that ultimately can feel anything within us. We long for you and we can't wait for that day that we are with you. And God, I that we are with you in heaven, God. Thank you so much just for um the opportunity of the podcast and for each person that's walking through this life and giving a little listen and and fighting for the truth of what your word says. In Jesus' name we pray. Amen.