Counterfeit: Connection (Part 2) - #007

Last week, we talked about Counterfeit Connection with God and how we often settle for surface-level habits that look spiritual but lack real intimacy. This week, we're diving deeper into how that same pattern shows up in our relationships with others. What does counterfeit connection look like in friendships, dating, and community? Why do we settle for shallow or performative relationships when we were created for something deeper? Join us as we unpack the difference between true, life-giving connection and the imitations that leave us feeling empty...and how to start building relationships rooted in authenticity and truth.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:14

Hey guys, welcome back to the podcast. We're so excited to have you here. Last time we talked a little bit about connection. It's kind of funny because I feel like we always have a game plan of what we're going to talk about, and then we never stick to the game plan. Lord just takes it away. Yeah, but it always ends up being what it's supposed to be, I think, hopefully. So um, but last time we focused a little bit more on connection with God. This time we want to focus a little bit more on connection with others. Um, so we're excited to kind of involve you in that conversation as well. Um to Larson, when you think of counterfeit connection, yes, like almost the real thing, but not the real thing. What comes to your mind?

SPEAKER_00 0:57

Christians. We did not rehearse that part. Okay, so with the best intentions, you know what?

SPEAKER_01 1:07

I feel like I experienced the fake and the real thing in that answer. So yeah, I can see that.

SPEAKER_00 1:14

Yeah, because I feel like there is, you know, a place, we'll talk more about it, but where you can get vulnerable with other people, things like that, especially other believers. But I do feel like there's kind of like this shallow end that people um sometimes I think are in a lot of times because we we don't feel like we can go deep with someone or we'll be too much. And so, you know, I was talking with a friend and um they even shared, like, you know, when you come into church and you're like, hey, hey, hey, do you know to everyone you well, some people do? Some people are like head sometimes. I'm like that, like head down, just keep walking. Just get where you need to get. Go to kids' ministry, check the kids in, go sit down. Like sometimes you have those weeks. But there's other times where like you it's like you desire connection, like you want it. So you're kind and you say hello and stuff, but then there's never enough time in those moments.

SPEAKER_01 2:10

Yeah. You're rushing to get to service or yeah, so it can't it's hard to linger. Yeah, it can like come off like that a lot of times. It can come across as fake, but it's actually people desiring most of the time to connect. But I can tell if if I had never been to church before in my life and I walked in and 45 people said hi and nothing else, I could see that being a little overwhelming and being like, wow, that's yeah, you want to talk? Yeah. Or can I just hide and not talk? Please don't talk to me. It depends on your personality.

SPEAKER_00 2:38

Um Yeah, some people are better with their face. I'm not, but some people I love that about you though.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

I never have to wonder what's going on over there. I've had to get a lot better at that. I'm still not great. Um, people who know me know me. Like I walk in the room and they're like, oh, okay. Um, but with counseling, like we were trained on how to not react. And it was quite comical.

SPEAKER_00 3:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:05

I don't know that I could do that. Yeah, it was hard. And it and it was hard because I'm like, I want to be genuine, but I but I also want to give this person the space to be vulnerable and not feel judged or try to read me in a way like, oh, is she okay? Is she comfortable? Is she not comfortable? Like, I just wanted to be a blank sounding board.

SPEAKER_00 3:23

Yeah. Um, yeah, I can see that because sometimes when I would uh go into sessions, I'm like, is what I'm saying crazy? I don't know. I can't tell. And then other times I'm like, she's gotta just want to shake me and tell me something. Like sometimes that's true. Yeah, no, not really.

SPEAKER_01 3:40

No, it's so funny. This is a great topic for connection. And I we again we're not planning on talking about this, but in order to have genuine connection with someone, you have to be willing to be connected to. And I know that sounds weird, but like to invest. Yes, to invest your time um and be a good listener. Cause in order to connect with someone, you have to get to know someone. And in order to get to know someone, you actually have to create space to hear them. Right. Um, and vice versa.

SPEAKER_00 4:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

And so, and it's hard to do in this day and age, like you have to be intentional about it or it doesn't happen.

SPEAKER_00 4:16

Yes, because all the busyness, air quote busyness that's happening in our lives that like it could not be like that. Yeah. You know, but it's really hard to make that decision for it to not be that way. But it's true, like intentionality is everything. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

And so I did not realize how bad of a listener I was until I went to grad school for counseling, which is hilarious. Like, I don't know if I should be doing this. Like, this is holy cow. But we would have to sit down and um do different exercises where someone would tell us, like the first time we didn't know what we were doing, right? We think we're doing a counseling like session in front of the class. And um, my professor, like after the person I'm pretending to counsel, shares this whole scenario with me. I'm sitting here thinking about all the all of the ways I need to help them and all the ways I need to connect the dots and all the ways I like I'm thinking about my response more than actually hearing them. Yep. And um my professor was like, Okay, Megan, pause, pause the tape, you know. And he's like, I want you to repeat everything he just said. And I was like, yikes. I know how to fix it. Yeah, well, I'm like, well, I know the right thing to say from the textbook. Yeah. He's like, no, I want you to, where is his heart and what he just said? What is the deeper, what's the deeper thing? Yeah. But by the end, it was hard and it's a discipline and it's a practice. And that's why I love like Jesus is the almighty counselor, right? And he asked more questions than he answered. Yeah. And it's because he could see through a person. Yes. And he wanted to connect with them. And in order to connect with them, he had to draw them out.

SPEAKER_00 6:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:02

Like, how often did you say, What do you want? Yeah. What do you want? I know what you want, but what do you want? Do you know what you want? Um, yeah. But it's just so interesting. And and that is such a crucial thing in true connection and marriage, in friendships, anywhere, is allowing yourself to be vulnerable enough for someone to hear you, and also allowing yourself to hear someone else.

SPEAKER_00 6:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:29

It is, it is hard. And even if you are quote like busy, one of the things that I learned um being married to Rusty was it's like you can do it as you go. Yeah. So like we would have to go and I don't know, pick up random supplies for the youth group or something like that when we were in that season. And um it was like, let's take two teenagers with us. Uh-huh. You know, and one, they can help with the kids, but two, like we can also, you know, yeah. We can also like truly, we just loved like being able to talk about where their walk was with Jesus. And, you know, if we with all the busyness that we were going through at that time, like if we didn't do it as we went and be intentional about it, we would have, we would have never had those kind of uh relationships and being able to really disciple in a lot of ways. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 7:28

Uh Bonnie Barker is one of the best at this. And she's gonna hate that I mentioned her name on the podcast, and I don't care. But she um I consider her, but outside of my parents, she's one of the main people who have discipled me throughout my life and still does. And she's just so good at just inviting you into her life. Like she doesn't stop living. And and there are times where she is intentional, but like for example, the other day, she was I was like, Hey, can I talk to you about something? I want to pick your brain about something. And she's like, Yeah, I'm getting an oil change tomorrow at 12. You want to go with me? I'm like, sure.

SPEAKER_00 8:04

That's what it was one of the times I was here for a session with you, and it I think it was after y'all were like gonna go grab something to eat, and she was like, get in the car. I was like, Okay, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 8:15

She is gonna be like, she's like, I'm gonna go to the bank. You wanna go? Sure. Yeah, um, and it's just windshield caring with someone, yeah. And and just just allowing room for people to come into your life. Yeah. Um, no, I love that.

SPEAKER_00 8:27

Yeah, I think it's I think it's important to even have relationships. Like, I feel like family sometimes is a cheat of like, well, I have a relationship with this cousin and this one. It's like, okay, but like anyone outside of your family that maybe you have a relationship with, I feel like small groups is a good place for that.

SPEAKER_01 8:47

Yeah. And like we were created for community. Right. And everything about our society destroys community. Yeah. Like, um, and so like we were created to know only what was going on in our little radius that we walked to to get our bread and our milk and our meat, and and we knew our neighbor, and we we knew when someone was having a baby, and we knew when someone was dying, and we knew like you couldn't hide. I have a new neighbor.

SPEAKER_00 9:16

Oh yeah. Yeah, she is so nice. Oh she is like the nicest person ever, and like she's from Puerto Rico originally, and she's like she was raised with like just the people around you, like the community around you, and she is so kind and just like she came over the other day. I was painting cabinets, I think, and she like just does all the things. Like, she she also has taken my trash can back to the part that it goes, like all I've only been there for like a week. Like, and she's just she's very intentional with how are you? Are you good? I pray for you, like yeah, just so nice. Yeah, like and what's sad is that's rare.

SPEAKER_01 9:57

Oh, it is like you're yeah, the look on your face right now is like she's so nice, like this is so weird. We're not used to this. What is happening? But that's like what we're called to be, right? We're called to be up each other's butt in a healthy way.

unknown 10:10

I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 10:11

That's a well, anyways, but like my friend Haley Stockton, who um is like she's everything I want to be when I grow up. She's just so much fun and so much joy and um so intentional. And she is the best at networking friends. And um, she always jokes and says, I want to just have a big like retreat with all my friends from all around the world. And I'm like, that'd be awesome because I feel like we all know each other because of you. Um but she makes friends wherever she goes, but she keeps them because she's intentional. And like, for example, I she lives an hour away, and um, my son is playing t-ball and she showed up to his game.

SPEAKER_00 10:50

Yeah, showing up as he just shows up. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:53

Um I and I would do the same for her. Like she could call me at two in the morning and I would be there. But it's those routine, like just showing up is half the battle. Showing up. And I I actually had a conversation with a parent today in a session, and he's struggling with his preteen son right now with behavioral issues. I am not looking forward to that. Oh, yeah. And things going on. And um, that's just a hard time to be alive when you're it there's a lot going on. And so um he's like, I don't know what to do. And I said, Well, the biggest thing is you can't force transparency and connection, but you can set the table for it. And that comes with routine structure and showing up. And so we were talking about like, what is your nighttime routine? I know he's almost a teenager, but do you go in there and pray with them? Like set up, or do you go on a drive every Sunday afternoon to get ice cream? Or like set up a time that is consistent, and 90% of the time you're gonna talk about bull crap. Yeah, but that 10% is when they're gonna know, oh, I can talk to dad tonight.

SPEAKER_00 12:04

Right. The safe, the safe place, the safe place, the consistent place.

SPEAKER_01 12:07

The the they know it's there and it's available and it's not going anywhere. And it's like that in friendships, it's like that with your kids, it's like that anywhere. You just have to be intentional about setting the table.

SPEAKER_00 12:21

Yeah. It is hard sometimes for sure to do it. So I can totally get where the struggle is. But like even um with our little kids, like Izzy and Judah play great together. And so sometimes I'm like, I haven't seen him in an hour. Like, are that's a great problem. I'm like, well, I'm usually working, so but um I'm like, what are they what are they doing? But I had like even l last night, I think it was like I have to be intentional to like sit down and even outside on just the routine things, like of yes, they need to be bathed, yes, we need to brush our teeth, I need to feed them, like those kind of things. Like play a game of Uno or play like a little board game with them. You know, it doesn't take that much time. I do not always like playing those things. Um, but they love it. Yeah. And they bother my dad when he comes in town, and they'll play like five rounds of Uno every night. Like, but it is it's intentional and and it matters to them. And they remember it. Oh, absolutely. They know exactly who won what day.

SPEAKER_01 13:30

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I think about my childhood and what I remember, and it's never I couldn't tell you a present I was bought for Christmas when I was seven. But I can tell you what my mom made for breakfast. I can tell you what it sounded like when I woke up. I could tell you what the love felt like in the room. And there's an old quote that says, you know, people don't always remember what you do, but they remember what how you made them feel. And I think a true connection is when someone sees the God in you, the image of God in you, and they call it out of you. And they love you even before you realize it's there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And another thing too, we talked about was boundaries and how I love boundaries. I'm uh I teach class on it. I'm a big fan of healthy boundaries, but our society abuses the crap out of boundaries. Yeah. And it's um it's they use it to the point where they don't ever want to be inconvenienced. Right? Like it's more so to protect protect your peace. It's self-care, like cut people off if they're sucking the life out of you. And actually, um there are some sandpaper people you need in your life because they shine you up and refine you down, you know what I mean? And there's there's different areas where boundaries are definitely needed, and then there's areas where they're not, and people are putting them there and it's isolating themselves, or it's protecting bitterness because they don't want to forgive someone.

SPEAKER_00 15:02

Yeah, they don't want to deal with it or face it.

SPEAKER_01 15:04

Right.

SPEAKER_00 15:05

Yeah, and that's hard. That's that's one of those things where it's hard too when you try to. I mean, as a counselor, you like have I guess like the platform to kind of say that, but in relationships of friendships that I have, it's hard for me to be nice and say that. I don't know how else to put it. I don't know if I'm always nice, but yeah, well, and I mean the truth, we talked about the truth and how that is in love and that's kind. Yeah. Um we have in the past few episodes if you listen to those, but I think it is hard to to do that. And I do agree that culture is just cut them off. Yeah, you're fine.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

And you're like, but but it doesn't feel good, cut it out.

SPEAKER_00 15:49

And it's like yeah, sometimes pain is a good thing.

SPEAKER_01 15:51

I didn't really see Jesus model that like he had boundaries with time, he had boundaries with people, he had boundaries with space, but he he always forgives, right? And so forgiveness is not an option for a Christian, and so often we don't talk about that, um, which we can talk about that another day because that's a whole long thing. But going back to boundaries, like boundaries are supposed to be set when you feel like you've crossed the line of being genuinely kind and giving to the point of feeling resentful. Because if you're doing it out of your flesh and you're resentful because you're not getting something in return that you're looking for, or you feel like you're getting taken advantage of, or someone might actually be hurting you and you need to set a boundary there because that's not okay.

SPEAKER_00 16:42

Yeah, it's absolutely needed.

SPEAKER_01 16:43

Yes. Um, like if someone has been abusing me, right, I probably need to set some guardrails up. Right. Right.

SPEAKER_00 16:51

So, but and you can do the forgiving through that with still not having the access to your life because it's going to literally harm you. Correct. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:03

Correct. And it that goes back to the heart. And I'm so thankful it's not my job to know the heart, but Jesus knows it, and you know it. If you're real with yourself and you sit with Jesus long enough, you're gonna find out. And so you realize, okay, is this boundary up to protect this relationship? Because some like the other day, I was talking to someone in a session and she has a really strange relationship with her mother-in-law. And there's a lot of trauma and damage on the mother-in-law's side. And um, and I said, Well, we can set boundaries on time. Like, okay, hey, I want to be intentional about my time with you, but you can't show up at my house at 10 p.m. without letting me know. Cause that's that's not okay in our house, right? And so, like her her mother-in-law would just show up and like start doing stuff. I don't know, and and then it made her uncomfortable. Right. And she's like, I know some some houses that's okay, but in my house, like, can you come between these hours? Um, because we go to bed at nine o'clock or whatever. Yeah. Like things you don't even think you need to communicate, but but it what happens is like as she began to set the boundaries in the beginning, it was rough. But now, a year into it, their relationship is stronger than it's ever been because there's structure there.

SPEAKER_00 18:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:19

And there's respect there.

SPEAKER_00 18:20

Yeah. And it's not like I didn't want you around. I I love you. I want you to be around, but I'm I'm like dead to the world at that time. Yeah. And it's not healthy for either of us. You know, it can be that I'm not gonna be a good version of myself. Right. Yeah. And that just causes more tension and issues.

SPEAKER_01 18:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:38

So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:38

So I would encourage you to pay attention to where um you feel resentful and where you might need to guard your heart, and then pay attention to where you might need to forgive someone and let a guard down. Yeah. And what that might look like. So going back to connection. Like that's boundaries are a good thing unless they're just to spite or cut off connection because that is not what God would want you to do.

unknown 19:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:04

Can you explain? We were talking earlier, and I think it's very helpful because I feel like um also people in ministry, I felt like I needed to be kind of like open with everyone at one point. Um, not me share, but like be just someone that they can talk to and accessible. Yeah, for every single person. And it got to a point where uh it was just a lot. And I I genuinely cared about all those people, but can you explain the pool analogy?

SPEAKER_01 19:39

Yeah. So in counseling, I do this with kids and adults because it's a great visual. And I draw a really cheesy picture of a pool, and I say, okay, this is this is your heart, like a swimming pool. Sure, it's a masterpiece. Yes, it's this is your heart, right? And there's a shallow end and there's a deep end. And um and the sh the people in the pool are your friends and family, they're your people, right? So there's the shallow end people that you do life with every day. Um, they know most of your life. They're in your life every day. They're the ones that you're in constant communication with or you're just working with whatever.

SPEAKER_00 20:17

Yeah, it can be like a work bestie or something like that, like a same-sex work bestie.

SPEAKER_01 20:22

Yeah. Yes. And then uh I'm just saying. Clear boundaries. Clear boundaries. And then the deep end people is fewer. So, but they're the those are your ride or dies. Those are the people that know everything about you. Those are the people you call at two o'clock in the morning. There's probably only two or three of them in the deep end if you're blessed. They're the ones that can defend your actions if you need.

SPEAKER_00 20:45

They're the ones you call when you're in trouble. Her heart is not really like that, even though she's napped. Let me explain.

SPEAKER_01 20:52

They're gonna have your back, but they're also gonna call you out.

SPEAKER_00 20:54

Yes. And then they're gonna go tell you about it and talk to you about it.

SPEAKER_01 20:57

Like, I'm gonna honor you when you're not in the room, but um, I'm gonna call you out to make sure it don't happen again. The heck were you doing? What were you thinking? Um, or or where are you? Like the people who when you walk in the room, they know you well enough to to say what's going on. Yeah. Those are your people. How are you really? How are you really? The ones that you can show up at their house and you feel like you can let your hair down and you don't have to feel like rushed or apologetic for being there.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

Five hours passes and you're like, oh, we need to go get the kids.

SPEAKER_01 21:22

Yeah, well, we should probably go now. Yeah, yeah. So those are those are deep end people. So deep end, shallow end, and then there's people around the pool, right? So these are the people that can kind of come in, kind of come out. Sometimes these are seasonal people, someone who's in your small group for six weeks and then you see them at church. Or these can be people who, um, depending on what's going on in your life, they're there, but they're not, they don't have full daily access all the time because you can't be everything to everybody. True. And then there's the fence around the pool, and the pool rolls on the outside, and there's a gate that but good. Boundaries have gates that you have the key to, right? And so they there's people outside of this gate, and the pool rules are decided by your heart. Okay, is this person respect me? Is this person someone I want around my kids? Is this person that's huge? Someone that um you know makes me better. And this this goes to fr this is all about friends, right? So of course you're gonna be open to someone who's different than you. Of course you're gonna love people God puts in your path, but these are the people you let into your little inner world, right? And so you have standards for that of what you're looking for in friends, because you can't be everything to everyone, so you need to be selective on who you hang out with because the Bible is very clear about the company you keep. Yes. And so that's kind of the analogy I give for boundaries. It's like you have a few people in the pool who are your close ride or dies, and then um you have the community outside of the pool, and then you have people outside of the gate who um can come and go, but you have to decide if they're um if they're able to uphold those expectations. And you don't want perfection, but you do want respect.

SPEAKER_00 23:19

Right.

SPEAKER_01 23:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:20

I mean, and it says it all throughout scripture, like about um what kind of friend, you know, is good for you. So like carrying each other's burdens and you'll fulfill the law of Christ. So in Christ, though many that was in Galatians uh 6, 2, but then uh there's another one um that talks about like encouraging one another until the day approaches when Jesus comes back. Yeah. Um in Hebrews and stuff. And so there is there's tons. There's iron sharpens iron um in Proverbs, and I think it's it's super helpful. I really liked when doing a little bit of research, like about I mean, obviously, Ruth and Naomi really relate, I relate to that a lot in my life story, but then there's um in the Bible David and Jonathan. I love their relationship. Yeah, very loyal loyal friendship. Um, obviously. It was so sweet. So the new David movie came out.

SPEAKER_01 24:19

My son is obsessed with it, which is a great movie to be obsessed with.

SPEAKER_00 24:22

And I I love I um Thanks, Bill Wilkhamon. Yeah, yes, it's so good.

SPEAKER_01 24:28

I did enjoy it as an adult. Like it's a good movie. If you haven't seen it or your kids haven't seen it, go watch it. And then the younger one on Minno is it's good too. So good. Yes. But um Dawson is asking some really good questions, especially at bedtime. Like at night we're laying in bed, I'm like, wow, where did that come from? Yeah. Um, but David and Jonathan, if you don't know that story, King Saul had a son named Jonathan. David was anointed to be king. David was Jonathan's friend. Saul loved David like a son. Um and then Saul kind of went a little baddie when he realized that David was the next king and not Jonathan. So he felt betrayed. So he felt betrayed, even though it wasn't in David's control. And David never did anything wrong, right? And but Jonathan was always loyal to David, um, even to the end. Like he knew he had to die in order for David to take the throne, and he did it willingly and courageously. And it was a it's just a beautiful picture of laying your life down for the will of God and for a friend. But d Dawson was asking me, he's like, Mommy, like, did David miss Jonathan? No. And I said, I bet he missed him every day. Yeah. And um he said, Well, where are they now? And I said, They're together. They're together. And I, you know, we know that. But I sat and thought about that after Dawson fell asleep. I was just laying in his bed and I just was like, Wow, how sweet it's gonna be when we get to heaven with all of the people in our world that we were able to encourage and that were able to encourage us and that sharpened us and that we wrestled with and that we got offended and forgave and got through it, and like that we did life with. And it was all worth it. Yeah, right. And so I just my encouragement if you get nothing out of this podcast today, is to allow yourself to step into community and know that it's gonna be messy. Yeah, know that being offended is a choice that you don't have to choose. That could be a whole nother podcast, yeah. But choose to see the best in other people, choose to listen, choose to allow yourself to be known because you're worthy of being known.

SPEAKER_00 26:44

Right.

SPEAKER_01 26:45

Right? Your story is a good one and it's still being written. And you could be someone's Jonathan, you could be someone's David, you could be someone's Ruth, you could be someone's Naomi. But I just completely hijacked what you're saying.

SPEAKER_00 26:58

No, I I mean like we haven't none of us have fully arrived, and so it is worth to take the risk. Yeah, it's sometimes hard to get yourself to take that first step, but it is totally worth it. I mean, anything you do in life, there's it's not promised, it's not guaranteed. And so it it is totally worth it. I think that's actually really good.

SPEAKER_01 27:20

Yeah, don't be in isolation, right?

SPEAKER_00 27:24

Absolutely. Um yeah, I mean, there were there's verses about in the Bible about like harmful connections. Uh you know, you want to obviously stay away from gossip, division, bad company. Says in First Corinthians it corrupts good character, like all of those types of things. Something that is super someone that could be super divisive. Like if you just talk to a certain friend when you're gossiping, like, yeah, it's not real. Like be very careful. Because it can come off too as someone being concerned when they're they're just wanting to know the T. Yeah. Still it. Yeah, still it. Yeah, yeah. So but there's so much more good uh in even taking the risk in connection than there is. Yeah, I feel like that I feel like we're combating that as a generation too. Oh yeah. Like we're done with the fake.

SPEAKER_01 28:18

Yeah. I think our generation is so hungry for truth. And what's exciting about that is that they're finding it.

SPEAKER_00 28:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:24

They're finding it. Yes. I agree. Um praise God. So yeah. But no, I love that you said that because a way that you can test if the relationship is God honoring, is look at the fruit of the conversation. Is it uplifting? Is it are you talking about dreams or are you talking about people? Are you talking about calling? Are you talking about Betty Sue?

SPEAKER_00 28:45

Like Is Jesus in the conversation at all? Right.

SPEAKER_01 28:47

Is it is it making you want to be better? Is it making you want to does it make you feel alive? Does it is it healing? Like, is is there laughter? Like it should be fun. Like it shouldn't be like we laugh more than we cry, but we do both, yeah, right? So, but I think most of our conversations are about God. Yeah. And there's such an intimacy and a depth to that because you see meaning in everything you do. Yeah. And I'm like, I don't really know how people live without it. And now, because of I've experienced good relationships, I stink at small talk. Like, I feel I can't What?

SPEAKER_00 29:22

It's my favorite thing, Megan.

SPEAKER_01 29:24

I can't. I hate it. I'm so bad at it. And I'm like, I told my husband the other day, because we went to an event and I used to like rock a room. Like I can walk in there and talk, and I can still talk to anybody. I was just in my own head that night, I think. But I looked at him and I was like, am I awkward? And he was like, What? But I love you. And I was like, Am I awkward? And he's like, Well, I don't think so. I was like, okay. I was like, because I just I don't know how to talk to people about nothing. Like it's really hard for me because so many of my conversations and what a blessing to have a community of people that know me so well that when we have a conversation, it's already like we're we're in it. And we're laughing and we have inside jokes, and there's layers to our relationship.

SPEAKER_00 30:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:06

So it's like, man, where how where do we begin?

SPEAKER_00 30:09

Um, yeah, but I will say, like, it's gonna take that risk of getting past that small talk. Like it's gonna happen. It's so it's part of it, painful sometimes, but but it is it is worth it because that's where it starts, you know? It's where I mean, we have a very abnormal friendship, you and I, but yeah, um, of how it started. But I feel like even if it didn't start the way it did through me actually first being counseled by Megan, if you didn't know that. Um, so she learned a lot of me real fast. Yeah, real closer. Yeah, like I didn't know we were gonna be friends after. Maybe I wouldn't have said some of that stuff. But but um I feel like it I don't know where I was going. Like I feel like it's worth basically taking taking that risk to just move past it. You know, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:05

Yeah, some of my best friends I was blessed to be born with. Like our we were friends since birth, and I have several of those, which is rare. Um it is rare. I have yeah, I probably have five or six of those that we're still really close. And then I have there's there's different seasonal friends, right? Yeah, that's been hard for me. That's hard for me too. Because some some are meant to be there for a season, some are meant to be there for a lifetime. Um you know, and then and that's okay. Like there's nothing good or bad about that. That's just what it is. Yeah. Um, but it's sad sometimes. Yeah. Um I was gonna say something.

SPEAKER_00 31:41

I forgot.

SPEAKER_01 31:42

Oh, you were gonna say something about Ruth and Naomi, and I totally cut you off.

SPEAKER_00 31:46

No, I was just saying for mine, like with Ruth and Naomi, I just love how devoted Ruth was to Naomi. And then you saw the fruit because she was instructed by the Lord, like you saw the fruit in her life um as she went through her journey. Um, and that was only God. Like, oh yeah, I feel like there's so many cool things that can come from connection with others and friendships and not just your family, but uh other people too that maybe even think a little differently than you. Like I feel like there's such a building of that, and God can bring so much glory out of it. Oh yeah, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 32:27

Yes, all that it makes a lot of sense. All that just there.

SPEAKER_00 32:32

I wish you could see my fingers, but it's just like I can hear them. Yeah. That's my nails.

SPEAKER_01 32:40

Yes. Yeah. No, I think about I was I was thinking about ways that I met friends along the way. So one of my favorites is um my friend Jen. Oh gosh. She um we were in the same college church group. Like I showed up and I see this girl and I'm like, oh, she seems really nice. I want to try to make be her friend. Yeah. And so I I've never been shy, which has been a blessing. But it's still, even when you're not shy, it's still like it feels like asking someone out on a date. Yeah. Oh no, I walked up to her and I was like, Hey, do you like coffee? And she's like, No. And I was like, Oh, and she's like, But I do like tea. You want to go get tea? I was like, which is totally her personality, just dry, like, oh, so funny. But I was like, uh, yeah, you want to go tomorrow? And she's like, sure. So we went and had tea by the beach and we ended up being best friends ever since. But sometimes it's all it takes is just showing up and and spending time.

SPEAKER_00 33:40

Yeah, I think that's a good like place to start. Whether you're at a church and you're in a youth group, if you're younger listening to this, or if you're an adult, you can try a small group. Like I've had some great friends come out of going through a small group together. Oh yeah. Um, and very entertaining friends, can I say? Like, I hope they're listening, they know who they are. Um, but then I mean, because it I will say for me, it is hard like to go to a grocery store and just randomly go talk to someone. Yeah. But if I see the same person at a coffee house every day, I'm like, hi, like that awkward, like, that's me. Yeah, I know I'm awkward, Megan. Like, I don't need to ask anyone. Um, but yeah, I think like those are some great places to start. Yeah. Um, if you're, you know, wanting that. Because there was a time in my life where I didn't have a lot of friend connection that was healthy. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:39

And if you have one or two real, genuine friends, you are blessed. I mean, I read a study the other day, and I'm gonna misquote it, but it was something along the lines of like most people can't say they have one. Yeah. Uh, because all of their friends are on social media or they're isolated and they never get out of their house. And it's like that's tragic to me because there's so much more to you that you don't even know because you haven't allowed things in other people to unlock that in you. Like to pull it out of you. Yeah, yeah, it does. I remember this is funny, but um, before I met my husband, I was in another country doing mission work and I was single on purpose for a while. And then I came back home and I needed some time to like reacclimate. Yeah. And then once I got my bearings, I woke up one day and I was like, you know what? I want to date again. And I was like, just like I was ready. Like, and um then I then the next thought was, oh, but how? Because I'm a little podcast frostproof, and uh I haven't been here a while and I feel awkward and I don't know how to connect to people.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

And so someone at that McDonald's like no little four-way stop, yeah, or dollar general.

SPEAKER_01 36:08

Just put a like one at boyfriend one into nine on the post.

SPEAKER_00 36:11

I wish you would have.

SPEAKER_01 36:13

Oh Lord, but I would have helped you. So I was like, I went to all my close friends who know me, right? And I went to my family and I was like, listen, it's been on my bucket list to go on a blind date. Which you're crazy for, can I just say? Yeah, which I'm so glad I did it. It's so funny. Well, but um, but I was like, yeah, it's on my bucket list to go on a blind date. My only role is that I can't say no, right? So my worst thing that can happen is um I get a free meal. Yeah. The best thing that can happen is I make I meet my husband, and the truth is gonna probably be somewhere in between where I have an encounter with someone and I learn something about myself and about them, and I might make a friend, right? It's I like I have nothing to lose. And that was my mentality of like, let's I'm just gonna go meet people. That's fine. Um that has never been on my book. Yeah. So when I tell people this, they look at me like, what?

SPEAKER_00 37:12

Um, I remember the first time you told me, I was like, What?

SPEAKER_01 37:15

Yeah. And so, but I'm like, no, like do it in a safe way. And if it's people who love you, they're gonna try to hook you up with someone you might like.

SPEAKER_00 37:22

Unless they really love you and then they play a trick on you.

SPEAKER_01 37:24

Well, that happened too. So I could write a book on the experiences that I went through. Maybe one day I can't wait. Remember, I got, yeah. So I had some really awkward dates.

SPEAKER_00 37:35

Um but did you have good food?

SPEAKER_01 37:37

Oh, yeah, always. I love food, so I was I was there for it. But I had some really awkward dates and I just belly laughed all the way home. Like, yep, never seen him again. And then I had some really fun dates where I was like, wow, he's boyfriend material would never marry that guy. And not at least not that version of him. He needs to he needs to work out some things.

SPEAKER_00 37:56

Give him a few more years to kindle in the fire.

SPEAKER_01 37:59

Yes. But I remember learning about different parts of my heart, all that to say. So that by the time I met my husband, he was the last blind date. Um, I was like, that's it. That's awesome. That's it. Because I like who I am with him. And and I am proud of who I am with him. And I think it's the same thing with friendships. Like, not everyone is gonna be your shoe size. Yeah. Um, same thing with counselors. You're not gonna connect with every counselor. Like, try on a few, and that's okay. Like you can be acquaintances and be kind. Um, but in order to invest in a friendship, you need to know that that's someone you want to spend your time on. Um and when you find those friendships, it's always worth it.

SPEAKER_00 38:44

Yeah. I agree. I like how you met your husband. That's an awesome story. It's really funny.

SPEAKER_01 38:50

Gator baseball game. That was the that was the date? Yeah. Gator baseball game. Well, it never ended. So it was like it was his college roommate was my cousin, which is so funny because we never met until after college. Oh wow, which is probably a good thing. Yeah. And then um, because I don't think he would have liked me at that time version of me. Yeah. God was working on me and him separately, um, which is good. But I his college roommate was my cousin, and then my cousin was dating my childhood best friend. Oh wow. And so when I was like, I went and and Clint was still living with Seth at the time in Plant City, and so but I had never met Clint, which is so weird. And then I was best friends with Clint's cousin at Flagler and undergrad. Which is so weird. All these connections. I never knew he existed. I actually looked up his social media and I was like, oh crap, he dated Kelly. I can't date him. Like they're cousins, they're like best friends, but I thought that they dated because she was in every picture. So, but I um yeah. So when I told my cousin Seth and my best friend Kaylee, I was like, Do you know anybody? And they're like, actually, we do know a guy. And so we went on a double date to a gator baseball game, and then we went to eat, and then we went to dinner, and then we it was like Clint was like, Well, do you want to go do this? And I'm like, sure, do you want to go do this? And it was like 10 o'clock at night, and we've been together since eight o'clock that morning. So it was sweet.

SPEAKER_00 40:19

That is cool. Yeah, that's a full day. You can you can learn a lot about somebody. Oh, I was grilling him.

SPEAKER_01 40:24

I was wasting no time. And looking back on that now, it's so funny because we joke because Clint is just like steady, steady Freddie. So chill. He seems so chill. And I'm like, you know, I talk about emotions for a living and he doesn't have any. So that's what we say, which is not true, but it's kind of true. Um, but it's just it's just funny. God has a sense of humor and I love him. So anyways, it's worth the risk. Yes. Connection is always worth the risk. And and God sanctifies you through it and blesses you through it. Yes. Is there anything you want to add?

SPEAKER_00 41:00

I don't think so. I think that's that's the end. I think that thanks for joining us today. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:10

Lord, thank you so much for um creating friendship. Thank you for uh allowing us to be friends with you. Thank you for being the ultimate friend, the ultimate um partner, the ultimate everything. God, it's just overwhelming to know that we get to walk life out with you and we get to be fully known by you and we get to get to know you for the rest of forever. And what a gift and an honor that is. I pray that you give us the courage to um set clear boundaries, but also be open. Lord, I pray that our hearts are softened to people. I pray that we're willing to be inconvenienced in order to show up for people. I pray that we're willing to be the friend that we so desire to have. In Jesus' name I pray. Amen. Amen.