Counterfeit: Gospels - #008

The week wraps up our "Counterfeit" series with one of the most important conversations yet; Counterfeit: Gospels.
We're diving into messages that sound good on the surface but ultimately miss the truth: Universalism, new age beliefs, prosperity gospel, and the "vending machine" view of God where faith becomes works-based. These ideas can feel appealing, but they fall short of the real thing. 
The true Gospel of Jesus isn't something we earn, manipulate, or redefine— its a gift of grace and it's better than anything we could manufacture. And the truth is so good, it never gets old. 
If you've ever wondered what's real and what's just close enough to be convincing, this episode is for you.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:13

Hey guys, welcome back to the Pockets of Paradise podcast. Um, it is the Tuesday after Easter that we're recording this, so I don't know when you're gonna hear this, but that's what day it is right now, just so you know. So how was your Easter, Larson? What are some things that you and your family did?

SPEAKER_01 0:30

Uh it was good. Um I it was like maybe, well, we came to church, um, which was great. Um, and there were salvations here this weekend, which was phenomenal. It's exciting. Yes. Um, and then we went and ate with my sister and her family, and then I did like little Easter baskets for the kids because I I just I think one of my love languages is like gifts. So I love to give them. Um, and so we did that, and then it was like maybe 30 minutes before the kids were supposed to like shower and get ready for bed. And Judah comes running in and he's like, We didn't do an egg hunt. And I was like, No, we haven't, because I'm unpacking. I was like, I thought we were forgetting about that this time. So we didn't. Um, so we did a little mini egg hunt in the house, and it took like 20 minutes for him to find his last egg, which was so abnormal for him. Um but yeah, it drove him nuts.

SPEAKER_00 1:31

But that's fun. Yes, yeah. Like it's a game. Yeah. Our family, we both have big families, which is fun. But my dad's side of the family, we always get together at my Mima's house because she's still alive, and she has a lot of great-grands now. So all of us cousins have kids, and so there's like, I don't know, 30 kids, great grandkids out there doing an Easter egg hunt, and we have like, you know, slip and slide, and we always have homemade ice cream, and we do a like a potluck lunch, and it's just absolute chaos, and the dogs are there and the kids are there, and it's a lot of sugar, and it's so fun. Um, a lot of rocking chairs. My family just sits in a circle of rocking chairs and talks all day. That's awesome, and it's the best. Um, and then um Clint and I just moved into our new house in the fall, and so we were like, we want to host Easter for Clint's side of the family. So it was just our intimate, like immediate family. So my sister-in-law and um my nephew and um my in-laws, and I love them so much. And we it was our first time doing it at our house, and so we were able to say, okay, what do we want to do? Um, so I we did uh they spent the night with us Good Friday night, and we went to that service, which is so special. And then um another lowlight of that weekend, the only lowlight of that weekend was I took a shower and there was a scorpion in my shower, and I don't think I think I lost like a year of my life. But other than that, the rest of the time was great. So we had a made a big lunch, and then we did an Easter egg hunt in the backyard, and we played phase 10, which have you ever played phase 10? Yes. I'd never played before, so it was like a two-hour ordeal, but it was so fun, and it was just like we didn't know what time it was, and it was just nice to just be a family and enjoy each other, so it was a lot of fun. So I think we're gonna have an annual phase 10 game. Well, that sounds fun. Unfortunately, my husband won. So now we're we need a rematch because I was like, no. Um, but it was a lot of fun. So it's awesome. Yeah, basically besides the scorpion. I'm like, is this I'm not gonna look too much into this.

SPEAKER_01 3:39

I I only aged a few years. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:43

Yeah, I told before we started recording, I was telling you that I felt it on my foot and I looked down and saw it, and I kind of had to blink a couple of times because I have water in my eyes. I'm like, there's no way I'm seeing what I think I'm seeing right now. And I have a very clean house. Like it's not like I've never seen a scorpion in my house before. And so I didn't want to startle it because I don't want to get stung. So I just started like silently screaming, like like there was sound coming up, but it was like I was whisper screaming, and I ran out and I was like, and my towel, and my in-laws were like, What is going on? Oh my god, kill this thing. I don't I don't even know what to do. So yeah, we we got even closer over Easter. It was a great, great holiday, and we got to uh celebrate Jesus. It's my favorite holiday, actually. It's so special. So it is. It's and it's kind of what we're talking about today. So this is the last episode of our counterfeit series. Yes. Uh that's been really fun to do. Thanks for doing it with me, Larson. Of course. Um, and today we're gonna talk about counterfeit gospel. Plural. Gospel had an S. Um, because there's so many different uh gospels or or counterfeit gospels, and gospel is just a fancy word for good news. And the good news is that um there's a way to be saved from yourself, and but the only way is Jesus. And so we're gonna kind of briefly talk about some of the other ways that the world tries to sell you, and they're really sparkly and pretty, but they're not real. And so, and then we're gonna finish up on the real one, which is the best one.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

And even for people who've been Christians their whole life, I think it's good to go through. I mean, you could hear the gospel every day and it not get old because there's so much beauty and depth to it.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

Um yeah, I feel like a lot of lines have been blurred, like misrepresentation of certain things we're gonna talk about. Like, I really liked how we're we're gonna get there, but how you were talking about, well, that that did come from the Lord, but now it is being misrepresented in this way.

SPEAKER_00 5:55

Yeah, there's so many things that the world has perverted for lack of a better term, that came from God. And then the enemy, he doesn't, he's the king of half truths. Like he lies a lot, but he ha half truth is a lie, right? Because it's just enough to make you miss the mark. Everyone hear that. Yes. Yes, it's just enough to make you miss the mark. And sin literally, that word means miss the mark, right? Like the way is narrow and it's not easy, and it's designed to be that way. But Jesus made a way. The good news is that there is a way and that we get to walk in it, but you have to have discernment to know what's true and what's not, and you only get that from the word and the Holy Spirit. And knowing it, yeah. Yeah, and knowing him. Knowing him, exactly. Right. Which is kind of what we touched on last time. So um, which one shall we start with? Because there's a laundry list. We picked our our top few. Yeah. Um, we're gonna try to keep this short so it'll be like a summarized version, but I think we should do universalism first. Okay, that's a good one. Yeah, I don't know why.

unknown 7:03

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 7:04

I have no reason. Let's dive in. So one of the messages that the world is putting out and has put out for a long time is universalism, where people believe that there are many ways to get to heaven, right? Like you can go through Buddha, you can go through Taoism, you can go through um Allah and Muslim Islam. Um, you can uh just be a good person. You can like all they just think all roads, if you're trying to be good and be a good person lead to heaven, right? Or God. They think that God is big and he transcends a religion and he's all of these things. Um, which sounds beautiful, right?

SPEAKER_01 7:46

That sounds Yeah, because in the end everybody wins.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

Yes, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:50

Like it sounds nice.

SPEAKER_00 7:52

Yes. Um, but there's no real meat and potatoes underneath that. Right. There's no substance under that and you miss the journey of knowing God. You miss the daily picking up your cross, which sounds like, oh, that's something I might want to miss. I don't want to suffer. But it you miss the meaning of life. You miss you miss so much in that. Um it's tragic to me.

SPEAKER_01 8:20

Yeah, I know we're gonna get to the um like the real thing in a little bit, but I mean, whenever you said it earlier, the the narrow road, like that's an immediate thing that debunks uh in Matthew that verse, enter through the narrow gate for wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it, but small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. Right. And that like, you know, quickly debunks universalism, but at the same time, like You have to believe the word is true.

SPEAKER_00 8:53

Right. Right. And then another thing too that debunks that is Jesus himself said, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one gets the to the Father except through me. And what I love about that is that in the tabernacle, you know, there are levels to get to the Holy of Holies, which was the center of the church, like the the building. It was called the tabernacle.

SPEAKER_01 9:17

We could do a whole thing on the tabernacle.

SPEAKER_00 9:19

Oh, yeah, I love it. But the gates to get into deeper and deeper into the heart of the church and into the presence of God were called the way. The second one was called the truth, and the third one was called the life. So not only is Jesus saying, I'm the way, the truth, and the life, literally, but I'm also the gate to get to God. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:42

The good thing about gates is that they open up.

SPEAKER_01 9:45

Right.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

Isn't that wild?

SPEAKER_01 9:48

Like Yeah. It's like letting it sink in for a minute because we didn't necessarily talk in depth about this before.

SPEAKER_00 9:54

We didn't talk at all about this before. We just said we're gonna talk about again.

SPEAKER_01 9:58

We prepare until no, we've been getting praying.

SPEAKER_00 10:00

Yeah. I feel like we do better when we just like go. We have an outline and let God do it.

SPEAKER_01 10:05

So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:06

Yeah. But no, so he is the way, the truth, and the life. Right. And I think um I was talking to a Muslim the other day who I'm a dear friend of, and we go back and forth all the time, and um, which he is so close to coming to know the Lord, he's right there. Um, but he was saying, you know, we we believe Jesus is a prophet, and we believe that, you know, we believe that if you do live the way of Jesus, that you'll go to heaven. I'm like, interesting. I said, So you how do you get to heaven? How do you I said, Do you know you're going to heaven? And he's like, Well, no, no one really does. And I said, huh. And I said, I do. And he's like, What do you mean? And I said, Well, well, what do you think gets you to heaven? Like, what do you and he's like, well, in my religion we have different things that we try to check off of the list if we can. He said, but like going to Mecca and doing the uh fasts and festivals and doing all the good little religious things, right? And he said, but and being generous is a big one. Beautiful thing, like some of the things that they do are absolutely beautiful. Generosity, hospitality, integrity. Like in some ways, this man is the most integrity has the most integrity I've ever seen in a person.

SPEAKER_01 11:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:24

Um, and so there's beautiful things, but that it just misses the mark. And so I was talking to him, and and we were having like a beautiful, rich conversation about it, but I was like, okay, so you believe that good works get you into heaven. If you're a good person, you get into heaven. He's like, Yeah, if you're good enough, you go. And I said, Okay, so have you ever sinned? And he just kind of laughed and he's like, Well, yeah. I know. And I was like, Okay, well, me too.

SPEAKER_01 11:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:49

I said, So where's the line of too much sin? I was like, and and if how do you keep track of that? Right. And I was like, and if you believe your God is holy, holy and sin are they cannot intermix. Like you that is just the way that it works.

SPEAKER_01 12:05

Yeah, they're opposites.

SPEAKER_00 12:06

Yes, and so it's like light and darkness, like they can't be in each other's presence. So what do you do with it? Yeah, how do you dispose of it? And he's like, Well, our God is a God of mercy. I said, That doesn't I said the difference between me and you is my God is a God of mercy too, but he's also a God of justice. And so he took that sin on himself and was the sacrifice to pay for it so that I can have assurance and knowing that I don't have to be good enough because he was good enough for me, which is the true gospel, right? But going back to universalism, it breaks my heart because they're like, Well, if I'm a good enough person, I go to heaven. But when you sit there and look at your life and mine too, yeah, I would never be good enough.

SPEAKER_01 12:48

Yeah. I've never really been like, oh yeah, I've arrived. Like I'm good. I've always been like, save my butt because I need it. My thoughts are not great right now. Like you need that grace and mercy.

SPEAKER_00 13:03

But it goes back to it looks sparkly on the outside, and the deeper you go into it, you realize there's actually no hope in universalism.

SPEAKER_01 13:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:10

Because it all depends on you. And if it all depends on us, we are as flawed humans. We're screwed. Yeah. Yeah. For lack of a better term. Yeah. So that's universalism. New age was another one we wanted to talk about. Yes. Um, okay, yes, New Age. Do you want to start that one?

SPEAKER_01 13:28

Oh, there's so many things in it. Um, but one thing that I see a lot that falls under New Age is astrology and um, you know, all the all the horoscopes and stuff like that. I feel like that's the one when I worked with teenagers and young adults was like the one that I had to um, I don't know, I don't debunk, I guess, the most, or um try to explain of how like that's not a Jesus when like that's what you're relying on is your hope. And I mentioned it before we started recording to you when we were talking about it. But like I feel like a lot of times if you start with a conclusion, even in a a conversation with someone, like you already have in your mind how you're gonna respond and what they're gonna say, then you're gonna be looking for those things and it's gonna add up. And so I think it is a very scary line and thing to dive into.

SPEAKER_00 14:30

Um, but then you said Yeah, well, I agree with everything you just said. I think new age as a whole is um worshipping creation over the creator. Yeah. So it's everything from your own body to crystals to like the self-love self-love to um vibrations and frequencies and um horoscopes and enneagrams and all these things. But what's crazy is all of those things are God-given things that have been perverted. So that's when I came in and we were talking about astrology, right? Yeah, God is the God of the cosmos, he created everything with order. He didn't just like fling up some stars and said, Whoop, there they go. Like that one looks like a dipper. He that's just not yeah, that's just not his character. I mean, he chose to signify his birth with a star. He chose to have a full moon and a blood moon around Easter time, like to signify he loves the cosmos and the stars, and he's so big and a god of order. And I do believe there is some half-truth in astrology and and personality types and those types of things. When it becomes an issue is when it becomes your identity and you make agreements with it. Right. Because the enemy is also the prince of the air. And he can take something and create it an identity, and what you're saying, like a filter. Well, if I'm this horoscope and you're that horoscope, we can't date. Or you make life decisions and you take counsel from stars instead of a god who made them. And so I think it goes back to like, you know, for example, like we were talking about frequency before, you know. So often people are like, you know, he I they just give me a bad vibe.

unknown 16:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:15

Their energy is just off, their aura is off, they're like whatever. And there's truth to all of that. We are walking in a spiritual world, and there is truth to all of that. But the way they worship it and the way they try to manipulate it is very different.

SPEAKER_01 16:30

I think um um one student we had, I I love her to death. Um, but her name um is Abby. And whenever we were, you know, her youth pastors at the time, uh, she came in one day and she was doing like um a positive energy thing, right? Positive vibes. It was like a whole thing. And it's like, yes, we want you to be joyful in the Lord. Yeah. And so we had to kind of like talk through that. But it was, it took on a different meaning, I feel like, for her, even in that time when we were like, well, yes, but it was being skewed in a different way through social media or whatever. Like through the city. It's perverted, yes, God given, and then it's perverted. Right.

SPEAKER_00 17:12

So, like, for example, we were talking about frequencies, right? And there are different sounds and frequencies that trigger things, trigger good and bad things in us. For example, there is scientific proof that when you can hear birds singing, your nervous system regulates. Right? There are different things that your body and brain react to different frequencies in different ways, and it's amazing. That's why people on the spectrum interact with frequencies very differently than we do. Yeah, right. There's there's certain people are sensitive to different things. I I believe people with a gift of discernment can pick up when someone is carrying something dark.

SPEAKER_01 17:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:48

Right? That is all energy and and spiritual things around us that we can't see but we can sense, right? Yeah. And but we're talking about frequencies, and we're talking about okay, well, people were worship this, and we you you go to these music festivals with all these lights and these different sounds, and people are taking drugs to enhance these experiences, and they'll tell you. And back in my day, I was telling Larson, I was at a few of those, and I can tell you it feels like a spiritual experience. And if I did not know Jesus, yeah, it would be so easy to fall into that feeling because it just is right, it feels good, but but what they're using frequencies that make your brain happy and release dopamine, and they're using lights that do the same thing. And you're with a group of people that are singing and happy, and it's just it feels like what church should feel like. You know, it feels like what but it's just interesting. But we were talking about frequencies, sorry, I'm talking a lot. And I was like, Well, how was the earth created? Yeah, by words, sound by sound, yes. He spoke it into existence, right? So there's truth in that. And the Bible says even the rocks cry out. Yeah. I don't know if you've seen this, but this is so like funny to me, and a perfect example of new age, like worshiping creation and not the creator. But the mushroom church, have you seen this? No, but I like mushrooms. So it's so it's people, you should look it up. It's people and they hook up these like little electro things, like they clamps, they like clamp it on and they like you wire to a car, yeah. Okay, but it picks up the different electro frequencies that are coming off of these mushrooms, yes, and the mushrooms make music. What? And so they go in and they and they're not- How do I not know about you? But it goes into saying like every living thing on this earth has a frequency and it's singing worship to its creator. I believe it. But so what do they do with this church? So they're not a Christian church, they're they're worshiping creation, but they're sitting here and they're just admiring how the creation is singing. And I'm like, do you not see who they're singing to? Yeah. Who created it? And that is new age in a nutshell to me. It doesn't just like happen. No, no, and that should make you want to sing to the same gods who created you.

unknown 20:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:09

And we are the only religion in the world who sings worship. Why is that? Wait, okay, I'm thinking. Like there's people who sing chants and do different things, but in the way that we worship, yeah, no other religion in the world does that. I've never really thought about that. Because the only real response to the true gospel is praise.

SPEAKER_01 20:33

Like your outward expression. Wow. Isn't that wild? It's pretty. Like it's it's it's just so nice. It sounds like I'm on those.

SPEAKER_00 20:46

She does like mushrooms.

SPEAKER_01 20:49

I mean, I'm just kidding. No, for real though, like that's it's a beautiful thing when you really like think about that and sing into even with the bird thing, like it makes so much sense. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:02

And people will say, Well, our ancestors knew that there weren't predators around when birds weren't were singing, right? Which there's some truth in that. But more so, I think when we're in a in in the presence of peace and the birds are doing their thing and you're in nature, like there's something that releases in us that we know this is a slice of paradise on earth. Yeah. This is a slice of heaven on earth. It's your pocket, it's your pocket of paradise right here.

SPEAKER_01 21:32

I think that's that's so important. Like, if I'm ever, I don't know if we've said this in a previous one or not. Um, but like if I'm ever starting to spiral, sometimes I just need to step outside. Oh, yeah. And feel either the warmth of the sunlight, hear the words. That's like that's another thing. The bigger picture. Is grounding. Have you heard of grounding? I have. I met a lady at the nail salon.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:55

Um, she educated you. She did. She uh we actually. Have a little bit of the same story with our uh husbands passing away. Um, she was just, you know, getting a pedicure beside me, so I just, you know, start talking. Um, and she has all the questions for me. So I'm like, I don't really know this lady, but sure, why not? And so we start talking, and then she she had come in barefoot. And then she just I learned so much, yeah, like in that next 20 minutes, like about grounding, but it makes so much sense. Um and I had, you know what I had to do though? I had to ask the Lord, like I was I was like, is this one of those things, like a trend, like a kind of thing, or is this like I mean, Lord, you didn't create as in a garden? Like, I don't know. I had to like we're really think about it. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:43

So what grounding is for those of you who might not know, is you literally take your shoes off and stick them in dirt somewhere and connect with the earth, right? They even have grounding mats you can buy. They have grounding mats. So you have we we ground our garden and it makes the plants grow better. Like it's just crazy, like the with wiring and everything. But so basically you connect to creation and it helps with inflammation, it helps regulate your nervous system, it helps so many things. But again, God is in creation, right? He made all of those things, he made all of those things, he also made everything medicinal that we would ever need in creation. Right, right. I mean, like you I can go on and on and on. Yeah, but again, we worship creation and not the creator, and it's like, how in the world do you miss that? Yeah, but it's easy to do if you don't know Jesus.

SPEAKER_01 23:36

Um, and then there's like a deeper level to it. I think that's like the big thing about it. Like, I can see all the people fascinated with creation, which I am also fascinated with creation, but because I'm like, where did it all come from? It should, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:50

Like I saw a thing the other day where it was like a reel of all these incredible things in nature. Scenes, yeah. I was like, who the heck looked at this and said, hmm, this looks random. Right. Like, uh yeah. That don't make no sense. No, yeah. But and then you watch how your body and your soul react to God's design, which is the whole purpose of this podcast is to talk about heaven on earth. And that's what Jesus prayed for is like, Lord, we as Christians carry the presence of God into this earth. We are called to be salt and light, right? And we're called to cultivate pockets of paradise where people can experience and taste and see that God is good. Yeah. And so all of these false gospels take what God has given you that is so good and just twist it a little bit to where you completely miss Him.

SPEAKER_01 24:37

Very like it can just be the littlest skew of it.

SPEAKER_00 24:42

Same thing with so New Age, I also clumped like I'm gonna make some people mad with this one, but clump yoga into this because I was I loved yoga. Listen, in college, I loved it and I felt so good, and there were so many like physical things that came from it, good things like strength and like my shoulder. I was able to unlock my shoulder, I was stretched out, like so many good things health-wise that happened from it. And I just felt good. But um I I have some funny stories from yoga, but I so in college, just as a side note, but it just made me laugh thinking about it. Um, I needed a class that was like one credit. Yeah, you know, like that one hour exercise thing. Yeah, so but so I signed up for yoga. Yeah, LinkedIn. Yes, thinking, oh, this will be easy. And it was Ash, not what is it? Ashtonga power yoga. I have no idea what you're talking about, but I'm gonna Google it later. I think it's called Ashtonga. Starts with an A. I almost said Ashwagonda and that's what I thought you were gonna say. I was like, that's a form of yoga.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

No, oh, that was one of those pills y'all were talking to telling me about from a hormones the other night.

SPEAKER_00 25:53

No, ashwagon is great for anxiety, but no, but I it was um ashtonga power yoga. All I know is it was power yoga. And so I go in there thinking, oh, this is gonna be a little fruity tea to class. And I go in there. Number one, the whole baseball team was in there. And I'm like, oh my gosh. And number two, we were doing headstands in the first 10 minutes. And I've never done a headstand in my life. Power yoga. And I, oh my gosh, the amount of just like times I just busted it in there was just hilarious. And the amount of like toots that slipped out of those boys was also hilarious because there was so much training in that class when we were, it was so funny. But that was when I really started to get hooked on this yoga thing. And my instructor was so cool. She was one of those people who was just like, she looked like Cheryl Crow, and she was just always barefoot grounded and like just a free spirit. But later on, I found out she actually struggled deeply with depression, and I had no idea.

SPEAKER_01 26:55

But right, she was missing the peace, the yes, the inner thing.

SPEAKER_00 27:00

So she's traveling all over the world chasing it, and she's an amazing yogi, but missing it, right? And so, and I enjoyed it, and then I I don't even remember Larson. I'm trying to remember right now if it was someone who spoke to me. No, it was in my world religions class. So I was in a world religion class at this time with a hyper atheist uh professor, and we got on the topic of yoga and Hinduism and all these things, and I realized what yoga was and how each move was actually a worship of a different Hindu god, little G God. And so, and like the Namaste at the end, and like I and so I started researching it, and I was so convicted that I would like I finished the class to get the grade, and after that I was like, I can't do this anymore. And Larson, I was so sad, yeah, because I loved it, and I would just felt so convicted. But I think sometimes we interact with things that seem good, um, but they actually open doors to things that aren't. And so you just need that discernment. And I don't judge anybody who does yoga, like that's you know, but that was something that in my walk with the Lord He had to show me, and I was like, okay, I'll lay it down. He did the same thing with certain singers that I used to love to listen to. I used to go to all their concerts, and now I'm like, I get nauseous when I hear them because he I'm physically uncomfortable because I know what they're singing about. You know what I mean? So, but God is gentle and he'll reveal those things to you, but you need to know him to have the discernment, right? Yeah, and I'm sure there's still things in my life that he needs to dig out.

SPEAKER_01 28:41

Right.

SPEAKER_00 28:42

But it's just being open to him, allowing him to do it.

SPEAKER_01 28:45

Yeah, like really that's what um again, I'm working with teenagers about this, is where I face it a lot and some adults, but um, like I'm like, but but what does God say about that? And they're like, well, I don't know. And I'm like, well, how do you think you're gonna find out? Yeah. I was like, I'm not gonna give you the answer. Like, let's let's take the time and look into yeah, dig into it so that you can realize that there is that missing piece or it's tiptoeing the line, or whatever it might be that, like you said, in a gentle way, he'll reveal it. And like, you know, I I go back and forth on the you know, Western church in general, um, and how things are done or not done, but I do feel like that is definitely a place where you can be honest and figure things out like that. Please ask questions. Yes, don't just assume someone's gonna look at you in a different way. You know, these these are the people that God has put before you if you're involved in a church to to ask. So funny. To learn.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

Yes. Yes. So yesterday, funny story, I had to get some dental work done. So and I don't know why they make you talk to the I've never heard funny story and dental work in the same time. It's funny now, but everything's funny in my life. You should you should know that by now, Larson. I'm not normal and I make things way weirder than they need to be. So I went to get dental work done, and I could tell you remind me to tell you that story later because that was also funny. But this is the part I want you to hear now, for time's sake. So um I don't know why they make you talk to the finance person after you get your face numbed, but that's just if anyone's a dentist out there, can you fix that? So I literally just had half, I look like, you know, my face is drooping. I'm trying not to drool. And I go in and I'm paying for my whatever just I had just had done, and I'm just talking to this girl, and she for one reason or another just starts open up to me. She's sort of about her life and about God, and she's searching and seeking, and she's been hard.

SPEAKER_01 30:56

Her heart is- You didn't even say anything. No, I'm literally like Does my face look like this if I'm one of those people?

unknown 31:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:02

I don't like I can probably listen really well because I'm slurping up my spit ever here, but it was so precious though. So I'm like listening to her and I'm talking to her, and she's just like talking about how her heart has been hardened and she's opening up to the Lord and blah blah blah. So I um she was saying, like, I just have so many questions. Like I'm so skeptical and I have so many questions. I said, Good. Yeah. I said, that is good. I said, questions are healthy. I said, I found in my journey, I found my true faith when I stopped I was not eating off of someone else's plate. Like it needs to be your faith. You and when you seek the truth, you find it. And when you find the answers, it's that much better.

SPEAKER_01 31:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:46

And so please keep asking, keep showing up, keep questioning and seek the truth and seek wise counsel.

SPEAKER_01 31:53

Will you break down what you mean by your faith?

SPEAKER_00 31:56

Like it's not the self-no, your faith because to specify, she's trying to come back to Jesus. Yeah. But she's like, I have so many questions, but I want to believe. Yeah. And I said that's the perfect place to start.

SPEAKER_01 32:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:08

And aligned with because Jesus is the way. Right. So I'm like, you have to seek the truth and you will find it. But the truth is in the word of God. Right. But her thing is like, well, how do I know if the word of God is true? And I'm like, oh, I could we need to have coffee because I can talk to you about that. When I'm not numb. Yeah. And so, but it was just this sweet, unexpected encounter of when you feel like you're doing it. Yes, but people are so hungry. Yes. And I think sometimes we feel like because in the society we live in, we're told in school, you know, you be quiet, you raise your hand, you don't question the system, and you get good grades and get by, right? Where in real life you need to question everything.

SPEAKER_01 32:46

Yeah. But I feel like there's the extremes now. Like I feel like it was like that growing up.

SPEAKER_00 32:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:53

And now it's like question everything. And it's like, it's not bad to question, but like at some point.

SPEAKER_00 32:58

Question with a curious heart.

SPEAKER_01 32:59

Yes. Yeah. And you have to be, and I feel like social media plays a huge part in that. Yeah. Because you see, like one reel is new age, the next reel is we're all going to heaven anyways. The next one, I'm like, what's wrong with my algorithm? Now it's really going to be messed up after this, but can't wait. Yeah. But it's true. There's so much hitting at everyone at every side.

SPEAKER_00 33:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:21

And the little bit of perversion that comes with it. Like, that's I think that's how the enemy definitely like slips in. Oh, yeah. 100%. And it I can't stand them. Yeah. Kick them in the face, make him run like a little baby.

SPEAKER_00 33:32

Yeah. Wee. Okay. So last two. We gotta round these up. Okay. We're not gonna make it. We're not, we're already over time, but it's okay. Okay, okay. I'll be quiet. No. No, it's my fault. I'm the one who won't shut up. Okay. Um, I just get excited. Yeah. So prosperity gospel. Yes. That's a big one here, but it's also big in third world countries. Um, and prosperity gospel is basically if you are a Christian, the you can have all the wealth in the world. You're gonna be blessed. Like the like no troubles, right? Like the sunshine and rainbows. You're gonna get rich quick scheme. If I do it God's way, he's gonna bless me. And so there is truth in that that that's a half-truth. Right, right. So, yes, the Lord is a provider. Yes, the Lord can bless your business and bless your life. Right. But he is far more concerned with your soul than your belongings. And I think in our nation, who can which is very materialistic, and in a third world nation who can be very um envious of those things, like the enemy preys on both of those things, but it's in the same way. Thanks, Amazon.

SPEAKER_01 34:52

Yeah, I'm just gonna love Amazon. But yeah, I I agree. Yeah. It's like I have to have all of these things to make it look there, but then sit there empty in all of those things. Right.

SPEAKER_00 35:06

And I think our description or like our idea of the word blessed is very skewed. Yeah. And the the person I think of is Mary, Mother Mary. Like, and the angel comes to her and says, Mary, you are blessed. You are chosen and highly favored. And she's like, What? I ain't even married. I know. But but then you think about what that meant. She had to deal with the scrutiny of being pregnant out of wedlock in a in a place where they could have stoned her to death for it. Right. She had to walk through the fear of being left by Joseph. Thank God Joseph was a good man and he obeyed God, right? And then she had to raise this precious baby boy and give her everything she had to watch him be murdered. Right. And before that, she had to watch him run for his life everywhere he went. She got to see the most intimate moments of his life. Like she was the one changing his diapers, and she was the one kissing his face at the cross. And she's called blessed. Right. And so, and she was blessed because great was her reward. Right. And I think as Christians, the blessing, it goes back to the peace episode we did of like the blessing is knowing God and doing life with him.

SPEAKER_01 36:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:28

Suffering is a part of that.

SPEAKER_01 36:30

Yeah. Cause if you wrote like the things that happen in your life down on paper, you'd be like, you call that what? Yeah. Like, yeah. But meeting him in those things and walking with him is what brings that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:45

And you think about all the stories in the Bible, and then we can parallel them with stories in our life. Like, yeah, there is a crushing. Yes. Before there is new wine. Chiseling. There is a chiseling. Yeah. There's a there's a sanctification. Like there's a fire that cleans you up, but fire burns. It burns the crap off. I keep saying that word. I'm sorry. It burns the junk off. Before. Crap, crap, crap, crap, crap, crap. There you go. Now we're even. I need to like broaden my vocabulary. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:14

Um, but yeah. So be my my grandmother actually has this wild story that she's lived through. And she has a book called Chiseled. Oh. And it's it's on Amazon. Her name's Carol Johnson. Um, but it is a beautiful story of how she leaned on the Lord. And like how, yes, on paper, literally in the book, it doesn't seem like that great because of all the tragedy um that happened in her life. But she's always been my like role model. Um, and now you see, like, once she she points it back to the towards the Lord and like how he was with her in every single moment. Yeah. In that. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely check it out. I I have a copy you can have. Okay, I would love that. I would love that. And she wrote it like a devo, so it's like really cool because you can do like a little small group on it and stuff. But yes, I didn't really mean to plug it, but a little plug there.

SPEAKER_00 38:17

No, I love it. It's very special. Yes, it is special. And then what a legacy to leave. Yeah. Like what a gift. To it is such a gift could because I've been able to watch my family walk through things and walk through things with them.

SPEAKER_02 38:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:31

The gift of watching someone suffer well is you can't put a price tag on that.

SPEAKER_02 38:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:39

And it changes the way I want to suffer. Right. Because everybody suffers. Like your time's coming if it hasn't already already, right? So but being able to watch someone love and lean on the Lord and tragedy, it's the only thing that makes sense is God. And I feel like it is such a witness and such a testimony. Yeah. Um, and so yeah, I could go on a lot about that, but trying to reel it in. All right. Last one. Vending machine God. You go for it.

SPEAKER_01 39:09

Yeah. So vending machine God is basically like I use some type of payment. So like I do this good deed. And then I don't know, it kind of goes a little bit with what we were just talking about, because then I get all of these things. I do it with the intention of I'm gonna get the blessing.

SPEAKER_00 39:28

Or we think like if someone has something bad happening in their life, it's because they're bad.

SPEAKER_01 39:34

Yeah. Um, in the Bible, was it the shoot, I'm gonna get my stories all mixed up. Was it when the blind man, the blind man, I couldn't remember if it was lame or blind, like I couldn't, I was getting confused. But like who in their family sinned? Yeah, that was the first question.

SPEAKER_00 39:51

It's like, well, if he has a birth defect, then who it's someone's sin, it's someone's who whose fault was it? And it's actually the world is a fallen world, and sometimes it's not your fault at all. For each. Um, sometimes there's there's always consequences for sin. Right. But sometimes it's just sin overall. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:07

And sometimes things are then to you that like you can't control.

SPEAKER_00 40:12

Yeah. And so, but even God can can turn those things into something good. So it's learning how to give them back to him. But um, but yeah, so the vending machine God is like, if I'm a good good boy or good girl, I'll get good things. And if I'm a bad boy or bad girl, I get bad things and I get what I put in.

SPEAKER_01 40:32

Right. I think whenever I know this also sounds a little silly, but when I was talking to teenagers again, it just keeps coming up.

SPEAKER_00 40:38

Um because there was for those of you who don't know, how long were you a youth pastor with um so You were a kid in youth with your husband, but yes, how long?

SPEAKER_01 40:46

Uh I did youth ministry with Rusty um for 10, 11, 12, 12 years? Yeah. 12 years. Um, and working with teenagers is like so fun and so crazy.

SPEAKER_00 41:01

And you're so good at it.

SPEAKER_01 41:02

It was some of the best times. Um, and they some of them are now, you know, graduated out and they're like good friends of mine. Yeah. So it's kind of going down their babysitters. Um, but um one of the things that they would talk about, like if they were dating someone new, um, they're like, they're such a good person. I'm like, cool, but that do they know Jesus? Because like you can be a good person and good things can happen, and like those kind of, you know, that thought process. And so I was like, Yeah, but do they know Jesus? Because the good in in human is not gonna last very long. Right. And it's not truly good because what is good is God.

SPEAKER_00 41:41

Yeah. God Jesus is the only good thing about me. Right, right. He is the only good thing about me. And I yeah, there was a time in my life where I thought, oh, I'm pretty good. And I think the older I get, the more I realize how not true that is. Yeah. And how thankful I am for him. Because he's the one who's like, hey, you should probably go apologize, or hey, you need to go figure work this out. But he's gentle and he's loving and he's he works it out with you. He doesn't expect you to figure it out on your own.

SPEAKER_01 42:08

Yeah. And I think if you like feel like you're in the, no, I got it all figured out. Like, I don't know many people who actually admit that, but I do feel like you're like, that's when if I get to that point at all, or if I tiptoe that line, I have to say, Lord, search my heart and reveal what needs to be more Christ-like, more like you. What needs to be chiseled. Yeah, yeah. Boom. Yeah. Back to that. Yeah. Those are just a few of the things that like I feel like the world is skewed. Yes. That we talked about.

SPEAKER_00 42:38

Like so we just went over four, but it took us 45 minutes. We hope you enjoy. But I wanted to close out with, and we talked about the true gospel all throughout that, but yes, I want to kind of pretend like the person listening has never heard it before.

SPEAKER_01 42:56

Or one that does let it sink in.

SPEAKER_00 42:58

Yeah, or just let it sink in for a new it's a new day. Yeah. With new mercies. And the Lord has He has it for you ready every single day. Yeah. So do you want to start? From which part? Just hearing pretend I have never I was not ready for this though. No, it's supposed to always be ready. Always. But just be able to say, like, okay. Um, so what is the gospel?

SPEAKER_01 43:30

Yeah. So gospel is good news, and good news, like we said earlier. A gospel is where Jesus came to the earth in human form and he suffered and he died on the cross for your sins. And he was put in a grave, and then he arose after because that was one full fulfillment of the scriptures. But he sacrificed for you because he loves you so much. I guess that's how I would explain to myself. toddler. Yeah. Yeah. But plain and simple. Like so simple.

SPEAKER_00 44:05

Yeah. It's simple enough for a toddler to understand and deep enough for you to study it the rest of your life.

SPEAKER_01 44:11

Yes. And impact how you do literally everything.

SPEAKER_00 44:15

And how you see everyone. I think that's the biggest thing that's happened with me is like the way I view people. Yeah. In a good way. It's not a judgmental way because some people that can go the other way. But but when the true gospel penetrates your heart and you realize how deeply forgiven and loved you are. Yeah. It makes you want to see other people in the image of God. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:36

And then you're all on this journey to try and figure out how I feel like to be more Christlike and how to live with him in every aspect of your life.

SPEAKER_00 44:46

And I feel like when you experience the true gospel in your life, it's such a gift. And when I finally like laid down the religion side of things and picked up the relationship side of things, I want, I want all my friends to go to heaven. I want, and not only heaven, I want them to experience it now. Yeah. Like there is so much even in the pain, even in the tragedy, even in the suffering, even in the chiseling, there is good. Yeah. And like yes, I just in the pressing.

SPEAKER_01 45:19

I think of the the song New Wine. Yes. I so I loved that song when it first came out and it has a whole different meaning now. Oh yeah. In my life, but I'm like, oh my gosh, it is that like that is that is walking with the Lord. Like he is going to bring newness like you were talking about and it says in Lamentations like the new mercies every morning.

SPEAKER_00 45:44

Yes. I love him. So if you have not accepted this gift, so one last thing I'll say is that there is a heaven and there is a hell and we are all terminal. We're all gonna die. Right. Right. And that sounds really heavy but it's really true. And it can actually make you live more fully when you think think with the end in mind. Like my dad has this he journals every morning and he has forever and he always writes this number in the top of his journal. And when I was in high school every morning I'd wake up you know grab breakfast or whatever and I walk out and he's journal journaling, reading his Bible and drinking a coffee and I would always see that number. And I finally asked him I said what is that? Yeah. And he said I've numbered the days to if I live to be as old as my grandpa, that's how many days I have left.

SPEAKER_01 46:34

Oh jeez.

SPEAKER_00 46:35

Yeah wow and so every day he'd tick it down and he still does ticks it down. But he said it's not a dreadful thing like I'm not afraid to die. Right. He said but it makes me want to live live intentionally live intentionally. Yeah. And so that's what the gospel should do too is like there is no fear in death because you have blessed assurance that you are going to be okay because Jesus bought your ticket.

SPEAKER_01 47:00

It is urgent.

SPEAKER_00 47:01

It is urgent and your friends need to know. Yeah like and that's why Christianity goes all around the world to share this good news because hey like you're not good enough and that's okay because the Lord came down out of all the religions to go back to universalism. Yeah. The only one where it all the other ones man is trying to reach God through good works or through whatever trying to reach God or trying to reach nirvana or trying to reach a higher in um what is it where you come back to something else? Reincarnation. Reincarnation yes yeah that goes under new age yeah that's all a new age in in universalism but yeah like every other religion is man trying to be good enough to get to God or get to whatever they're trying to get to that is good. Except for Christianity. Christianity God said there is no way even your good deeds are filthy rags in my sight because they're tainted by sin. And they're the only way that you get to come back and be with me which is what we were created for was unity with him and his presence in paradise. The only way that happens is if I make it happen. And so he came down he put on a body like a costume he lived the full human experience and did not sin. He was tempted in every way he suffered in every way he did not sin because he had the end goal in mind that I am going to die and shed my blood as the ultimate sacrifice to pay for the sins of the world.

SPEAKER_01 48:33

Right.

SPEAKER_00 48:33

So now one day we're all going to be in a judgment room and we're going to have to take account for our life and we're going to stand before the holy of holies and we're going to be judged and then Jesus is going to stand up and say that one's mine. I paid for her I covered her she gets to go in and it's a gift. And the only thing you have to do to receive that you don't have to raise your hand in church you don't have to say a certain thing like those are great things to do. But if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and you believe in your heart that he is because when you believe it you act like it right the actions follow. So you confess in your mouth you believe in your heart that Jesus Christ is Lord He is faithful and just to forgive you of everything and he and he will start walking with you and then you start praying and talking to him and you start surrounding yourself with people who believe and know him and people who can speak life into you and you watch when you start aligning your life with what the word of God says the ways that he shows up for you. Yeah because it's not going to be perfect.

SPEAKER_01 49:47

No and he doesn't expect you to be but it's it's like uh enrich enrichment.

SPEAKER_00 49:52

Oh yeah like that's a yeah you don't you don't become a Christian for sunshine and rainbows but you do get the peace you do get the joy you do get everything we talked about in the series. Yeah. Which is kind of why we're wrapping this up in a bow is like you get so much more than perfect. Yeah it is yeah it's so fulfilling and one day it is going to be perfect. Yeah like this is just a suffering for a little while just a little while Jesus says and then we have the rest of forever to enjoy it.

SPEAKER_01 50:25

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 50:26

So look up look up and if you haven't taken that step it's so simple it's a gift you don't have to earn it you don't have to be clean to receive it just come as you are and he cleans you up on the way. Yep. Is there anything you want to add?

SPEAKER_01 50:41

I don't think so all right I think I think that's really good. And I think it's so needed.

SPEAKER_00 50:49

Yeah even for me.

SPEAKER_01 50:50

Every time I tell it I get choked up because I'm like I'm just sitting here like uh like just soaking it all in as she's saying it so eloquently but it's just I'm so passionate about it because I know how forgiven I am.

SPEAKER_00 51:03

Yeah. Yeah. So and that's free. It's a gift yeah so and Jesus never wanted last thing Jesus never wanted anyone to go to hell. Hell was actually created for the demons not for us. But hell is just the ultimate separation from the presence of God right and there's a lot more to that that we could talk about different day but so Jesus did everything in his power to make sure no one went to hell. And the only time someone goes is if they choose it. That's what's wild to me is like some people are not going to choose the free ticket laying on the table.

SPEAKER_01 51:39

Yeah turning away.

SPEAKER_00 51:41

And that breaks my heart so my prayer is that today if you're listening and haven't accepted Jesus reach out if you have questions please um let us pray with you let us talk to you and there's an Instagram account yes uh pockets of paradise yes if you want to or reach out and I think we're gonna have Ben put the link down the fan mail on here too so forum to kind of reach out. Reach out and we'd love to connect with you. So all right you want to pray us out? Sure.

SPEAKER_01 52:14

Go Lord thank you so much. Thank you for um bringing clarity to so many things that have been um skewed Lord thank you for giving us your word as a clear map of of life and how we can uh become more like you and become Christ like thank you for the free gift of salvation that you've given us God I pray that everyone who is listening either um accepts the free gift Lord or they wake up um to the decision they've already made in their past to accept that but they they take accountability and start living it out Lord I pray God that you will just uh consume us like the set of fire in our souls Lord and I pray that you will just be able to um put people in our path God that we can share the good news with a numb face at the dentist whatever it might be Lord thank you for opportunities to be able to talk about you in our daily life and thank you so much for just the sacrifice that you made and that you love us so dearly in Jesus name amen amen