Neil 'Dolly' Dalton | Tales of a Physio - Part 2

Part 2 of this 3 In The Middle two parter as the lads welcome Neil 'Dolly' Dalton for a glimpse into the life of a first team physio with over 1,000 professional games under his belt. 

Look forward to hearing him chat about setting fire to player's personal belongings, X rated Secret Santa gifts to one of the lads and Nigel Pearson's game day magic eye drops as well as a host of stories from his 1,000+ games at Carlisle United, from being in the golden generation to the Roddy Collins days. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

So you're talking about the Roddy Yeahs. You are dead and buried that season, aren't you? Aye. Simo comes in as a player.

SPEAKER_04 0:06

Yeah. Simo was player just yeah, just as a player at first, because he'd be touching he'd be about 39 touching the. The big lad comes in, didn't he? Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 0:14

Yeah. Oh good with Simo still. His left peg was really umbro specialished.

SPEAKER_04 0:20

A wand, and he would yeah, he could just do things.

SPEAKER_01 0:23

I'd run it gone by then though. Like as in like, you know, training and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_04 0:28

I think him and John had had some big fallouts. We'd we'd paid a hundred grand for Andy Cousins from Leeds, we paid a hundred grand from Daz Kelly from um mental money when you think about it back then, isn't it? But uh not Bose. Derry, we paid a hundred grand for him and he was putting them on good money. And you know, you say the money now, but they'd been on well over a grand a week. Yeah, you know, 1500 quid a week. Back then. I mean it's 25 years ago. Oh no, yeah, yeah. You know, it's good door and giving them sign-on fees, and getting them a flat, yeah, you know, and it was we were hemorrhaging money. We we went to to Cardiff with one of the cup finals. We never met a penny. We stayed in the we stayed. We got them all suits, didn't we? We we played Louis Copeland suits, a suit each, and they were all pinstriped like gangsters and all time.

SPEAKER_01 1:13

He wasn't even doing the team tour before he went, we're gonna get you suits, you're gonna get you bring me tailor over.

SPEAKER_04 1:18

So that week, so we get all fitted, Louis Copeland, two tailors comes in, measure you up the balls, everything, the full thing. We got belts, we got shoes. So we played Oxford on a Tuesday night, or a Monday night before the final on a Friday. We goes down to Oxford Monday, we don't come home. We have Oxford in the Monday night, Oxford play the game night out, Wednesday, night out, Thursday. We move to the Vail of Morgan, the nicest hotel in Cardiff, and stays there till Monday, then moves to another hotel and comes home on the Tuesday or something like that. Which yeah, we stayed before spent a five year so the ties the ties are um he doesn't like the ties when we get them on on the final day because the gold, he doesn't think the match. So he likes the waiters' ties in the Villa Glamorgan Posh Hotel, the pink. So he goes to the boss, I want 50 ties, all your staff's ties. So we text off, he goes and buys all the ties off the waiters, and we wear the waiters' ties on the cup final day because he liked them better with the suits.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

Oh, just thank god, man. What's uh he was building a boxing ring, wasn't he? Yeah, then some gate done.

SPEAKER_04 2:25

When he got sacked, which the the squash court uh where the gym is now dealt, yeah, that was two squash courts with a corridor in the middle, we knocked them through, one side bit of a gym, other side was a boxing, so he'd got all the fixings in, he'd got the floor put in, and we were just waiting for the the uprights to come in with. And was he gonna get the lads in then? And he was gonna get the lads out because he'd done that a couple of times when he was trying to get some lads out, when he was trying to get a couple of lads out, like uh Birchie and Lee Madison and that. We used to go down to the dragon's gym because I used to treat a few of the dragons lads with Mike Aslem. We used to go there and do a bit of fitness. Do you know any fix uh any boxing gyms? Yeah, yeah, and no Mike's place. So we went down there, so he does do a bit of training, so he thinks he gets the gloves on because Roddy used to spar with his brother. Yeah, he was there. Send the blood, don't you can still his brother off tangent here? His brother used to have a flyweight, a midweight in his own, and then or a whatever he was, and then a heavyweight. Roddy was his last four rounds of heavy, so he would just be there to hold him and lean on him and give him a bat and then things. So Roddy gets in the ring, and everybody has to do a minute with him.

SPEAKER_00 3:25

Oh the Irish boys.

SPEAKER_04 3:28

Irish boys are quite alright with it. Couple of bats exchanged, and and some of the Ryan Baldcino, people like that. They didn't want to do anything. There weren't anything for the battery. Maddy, he gives him proper bat too. Yeah, the ones he wanted out, he gave them a dig. Did he? Yeah, proper dig. Gloves on, like it wasn't, you know, things, but he burst them up and that's it.

SPEAKER_01 3:50

Good job, you had that call. Tell you what, the bomb squat the bomb squad would have been.

SPEAKER_04 3:54

And then most times there was a couple of windows smashed, there was a couple of cars vandalised, and nobody never knew who it was.

SPEAKER_03 4:00

Well, work it out.

SPEAKER_01 4:03

So that's mad. Simo's time.

SPEAKER_04 4:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

Needed. Yeah, massively, massively.

SPEAKER_04 4:09

I mean, when he took over, how we never stayed up. We were we would have finished, we would have got promoted had he been in with the points that we'd won. So we just think and you thought, oh god, here we go. But yeah, his recruitment, as I said to John Coleman the other week, it wasn't just recruitment for player, he background checked everybody. There was a a personal, you know, somebody would say, Look, go for him, he's a good lad. He he tried to really do everything with it team-wise and and players, and then have a bit of special stuff in, and we we just well we flew, didn't we?

SPEAKER_01 4:42

He uh he took the boxing ring down straight away, straight away.

SPEAKER_04 4:45

First thing he done was. Some we're gonna fancy a box. And and I had to sort of dismantle it, but yeah. We had a tough time in the in the conference for a few you know, a few weeks where we dropped a bit and he got a bit of stick.

SPEAKER_01 5:18

So when are you you you look looking at you had like a great time, you know, with the Merv and that. You're looking at the kind of you're talking about them, Darren Kellys and that, but then he brings in the Kev Greer, they're chalk and cheese. Unbelievable.

SPEAKER_04 5:32

Kev would do a thousand sit-ups a day. Right. A thousand sit-ups a day. And when he was injured, it was a it wasn't a nightmare because you couldn't you shouldn't say that about him, but it was a nightmare because he was just desperate to be fit. So he would do everything over like overdo, which was brilliant, but yeah, sometimes some players.

SPEAKER_01 5:51

Yeah we talk about the team spirit in there and stuff like that, and we go on about it. But as you say, it went quite tough for a bit, and then Fred came in, didn't he? And started up in the bonus. He didn't. Money, money, get a move yourself. But everything's here for you, and you're like, right, whoever, whichever applies to it, yeah. If you want to make money, if you want to better yourself, if you want to and then you're like, right.

SPEAKER_04 6:17

We struggled like for a period where we just couldn't we just couldn't get a win, and and the floods are probably about that time and things. And I remember Radio Company going around saying asking, should Simul be sacked in town? And uh never forgot that. Never he'll never forget that. That's one thing about holds a grudge. If it really upsets him or gets him, he will hold it for the rest of his life. Yeah, um, you know, arguments and disputes, nah, no problem. But yeah, we we had a tough time. But yeah.

SPEAKER_03 6:42

What do you mean they're walking around with a mic or something?

SPEAKER_04 6:44

Yeah, just asking them like random stuff. Like women shopping and that. Do you think Paul Simpson should be satisfied?

SPEAKER_01 6:48

And then they got Fred on to Fred rang Paul Simon and went, I'm going on radio now to give you a vote of confidence. And Simon went, all right. And then Fred went, Do I have to go on? He went, Well, do you need to give us one? He went, No.

SPEAKER_04 7:00

No, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:01

And then that's it. No, no, absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 7:02

Where were you in the league at the time? We we dropped. We were we were up the top in playoffs, and then we dropped to about eighth or tenth or something. Oh, didn't we? Yeah, we did. We had a right bad spell.

SPEAKER_01 7:11

We were playing at Morecambe and more playing.

SPEAKER_04 7:13

We played a Blackburn a game, um, Morecamber game. We were due to play at Gretna, but it was called off. Is that because of the flood? Yeah, yeah. We were training up at Dalston at a place. We could train the Sands, couldn't do not. We were doing spinning classes, we just we had no. Anything you could think of. And people just didn't accept it, you know, that you should be winning X, Y, and Z with the biggest team. But yeah, we pulled it round and got up, you know. Wasn't the greatest games, but we managed it. And then cracked right on Bob. Absolutely. Did he go on all day? Absolutely pissed the next league, really, with a without. Was that the best season? The one after they're coming from the conference. The one after was unreal. Yeah, Carl scoring about 26. Carl came back ripped, didn't he? Yeah, like yeah, unbelievable. And he done it proof. Yeah, yeah. He just he was in unbelievable Nick. Um Bridgie come in and just he knocked something like 15 goals in in half a season. And the tight games we went went to was it Northampton? And he he sort of almost like a lititia, he flicked it up on his knee and volleyed it in the top of his and you just think we're never winning that game. We it's a nil-nil crap game, or windy night, dark, and he just bangs that in, and you think, Oh my god, that's just and he got his move, he went for about 350 grand after that. Where did he go to? Hull. Hull right to come. Yeah, yeah, when they were at uh Champlain.

SPEAKER_03 8:33

Just to go back to that the 20th anniversary thing on um that BBC Sound, you can see, you can tell by the way he speaks about Carl. He thinks massively of Carl, doesn't he? Saved him really. Saved his head.

SPEAKER_04 8:43

Yeah, he was he was struggling. He didn't really get injured with us, did he? Didn't that first time he never because he'd had big struggles? Yeah. More just looked after him. Took him out for a drink. Well, actually, to be honest, it was more the stuff we'd done when he when he we so we looked after him better than him because we gave him the odd day where he didn't so like a Monday maybe or a Tuesday, he didn't train, he stayed with me. That's when we would get up to mischief, where he would shite in a shoe and hide it in places and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_00 9:15

Which was at that time.

SPEAKER_01 9:17

Taff Williams. Oh, Taff Williams. You can relate to it.

SPEAKER_04 9:20

We had a goalie, um Anthony Williams, um desperate to be a coach, he was desperate to be a coach, and and he is a coach, he coaches the kids in Wales now. So, two things. Um, so he used to come in, and I was a I was a naughty and in them days. I'd burn stuff and do things to the lads. So he'd come in this rascal jumper all the time. It was like an argyle valdoonic and thing. And so one day I thought I've had it, I've had enough. So I got a mannequin. We had a flood bank in those days, back, back pitch training, got a mannequin, whipped the mannequin, stood it up on the bank, hooked the the the top on it, and burned it, just burned it, so it's a blaze, and all the lads are trained. This is when the lads are trading, the manager's talking about it. So I'm just burning it, just laughing, and he's he's yeah, I know he's at us. The worst one was he he was doing his goalie licence, his B licence, and then you know you know the work that goes into it. So he used to bring this five in, didn't he, every day. So I used to sing it, so I'm bollocks to this. So I got the file one day, took all the book out of it, but kept the the B licence, the wheels bee licence on, and put like loads of sheets of paper in. So I've gone out with it, bank again. Top of the hill, top of the hill, and and all the lads are training, and some of them must have known because the scene has come out with this file and he's doing goalie coaching. He was playing still, he was sub-goalie, and I'm going, Taff, is this yours, pal? Yeah, yeah, that's mine, Dolly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'd already covered it in surgical spirits. So I put it on the deck, opened the book out with the pages, and just put a fag on it, and he just went whoosh. So he's looked at it, and you can see him is looking. So he's come, he's come for it. He's gone, he's he's the rage in his eyes and the tears. He is raging, so it's it's fully on fire. So he's swinging back to me. Like proper, proper digs, and I'm ducking and stuff like that. And in the end, I said, Taf, taf, taf, it's not your work. And I it's sort of it had half gone out, opened it, it was just blank pages. He he didn't forget it like that. Did he not? No, he's a good lad. But he's a brilliant lad now, like even you know, a few weeks after. But yeah, Joycey used to come in in Rascal Brown Converse. I burned them one day on the on the on the main pitch. Joyce was on the king. We had the Ashfeld, these these things comes as it was 20, 30 quid or something. So he used to come in them, he loved them, didn't he? He was like a skater boy. So I thought, yeah, they're getting it, just got it. Surgical spirits, burn them. It was on soccer, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:45

Put it on soccer, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 11:48

Because I had to buy him a new four car.

SPEAKER_01 11:53

When we have a quick little bit of MacDonald. So I keep it's a we had one with MacDonald, right? His season I really enjoyed, his first season, coaching was good, days off, treat you quite well, treat the first team quite well, but just he'd walk past you one minute in the dressing room, or the corridor and go, All right, lummy, and he'd walk past you 30 seconds later and completely blanket, and you're like he was a strange in maca.

SPEAKER_04 12:20

I I liked him and got on on well with him, but I you wouldn't want to say anything bad about, but I'm sure he's like bipolar or something, you know. He he he would he'd like be brilliant with lads, then he'd be a nightmare. We we used to go out drinking and he loved it, he loved to drink, as we did we all. We would play golf and he'd be brilliant, and then all of a sudden he'd just go off on one, he'd just lose it, he'd go up town. There's a couple of times there was a a few things where he he caused a couple of issues where there was people contacting me who were known in town saying you need to have a word with him. Really? Because he yeah, but he was just he was just excitable, he was brilliant. He he was he was when we were doing well, he he would just get you know really high, really rolling. Yeah, yeah, and he was brilliant. When we we went to Ibiza for free season, and the first day out, we had a night out till early hours, and then there was only me, Bushead and him.

SPEAKER_01 13:14

Yeah, that's only stuff.

SPEAKER_04 13:15

So Busshead was laid in the changing rooms as Kip. I was having to train in a vest with no top on the next day. Like thing, and with the shout, we played the we played somebody the next night, and somebody was shouting at him. Have a good night in the West End, Maca! And he like slumped out and honestly, he was a he was a good fella. He knowledgeable, a great coach. Very good. He brought Sam's principles in from Bolton with the new stuff, the sports science. Very good, like, very good. Were you shocked when he was sacked? Yes and no. Yes, for the timing, no for bits and bobs background that that we can't really say. Um nothing, nothing sort of terrible. There was there were some rumours at the time, but they weren't true. No, there weren't they weren't true at all.

SPEAKER_01 13:59

It was more for me on the bus home. He was giddy, wasn't he? He was very giddy, and he had just we had just spent money on Joe Garner, and he was shouting down at something like get your hand in your pocket.

SPEAKER_04 14:09

There was a few things. There was a bit to do with Joe, there was other things, and there was bits with Fred. Fred was Fred. Fred was brilliant. If if you justified it, Fred would back it at the hill. But you don't go up against him. No, you do not go up against Fred. And he did a couple of times, and he did offer the Joe, and he did offer some other bits and bobs. And I think Joe, uh Fred uh just decided enough was enough. We drew one each at Walsh.

SPEAKER_01 14:34

Uh Curl. You thought curl was gonna be the the worst, didn't you?

SPEAKER_04 14:41

Yeah, yeah, I did, and he wasn't. Um a strange relationship with him. Some sometimes smashing, like great, like really good. And you know, again, bits and bobs with nights out. We went to Motram all pre-season, we had a night out. He was coming, obviously, he was off the drink completely in them days, and off the fags. And he was he was basically he was in great nick for an older guy, but again, very up and down with how he would be, you know. And I'm not like that, I'm just straight-laced. We were all really change. I I don't really change much. I'm I'm never too high with wins, I'm never too low with defeats or relegations promotions. I don't know if it's because of the career he had, he was he was quite up and down, and I I found him hard work, and I think because I was a bit older, I could I would stand my corner a little bit more with things, and there was a few things I didn't agree with, treating players and bits and bobs, and he he would like he he would like me wanting us to be in on a Sunday training and stuff stuff like that, and I'm thinking, nah, one, I'm on shite money, two, I've got a family. Yeah, there was no other staff at the time that had to be in, and I thought, oh sod that, I'm not doing it. And I stood up and I said, nah, you can by all means do something and bring a coach in, but I'm not coming in. And I don't think obviously those type of things he he didn't like anybody sort of standing up to him. Speech?

SPEAKER_01 16:05

Yeah, was this the was this the straw that brought the thing?

SPEAKER_04 16:07

That was the sort of the end of it, really. Yeah, I'd been sort of coming to the end for a couple of years, maybe two or three years. I was not bringing a lot home as in we would fall out with the missus, but she said it when I look back, I was sharp with the kids when I didn't need to be. Yeah, I wasn't a great sleeper in those days. Like I could be up at three in the morning thinking about things, worrying about stuff, and and obviously there was only really me, anyway, physio-wise. We had we had Fernie, the fitness coach, and things like that.

SPEAKER_01 16:40

But the club had changed as well, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 16:41

Very much changed, and there was things went on that I just I completely and this wasn't with with Keith, this was to do with other things in the club, were just not not good and and shouldn't have happened and weren't great, and you know, I wasn't on great money, and I turned Aberdeen down a year two years earlier. You turned wolves down, hadn't you? Turned wolves down, turned Gretna down, didn't you? Turned Gretna down in 2006 or eight. Yeah. And I actually left Carlisle on less money than what they offered us, about six grand less. What a mug. But nah, to be honest, it meant it ended up a good decision with it going tits up. But yeah, I'd had some good offers, I'd wolves, I'd Charlton, I'd uh seem to be a big thing. Ever close to any of them at doll or not? Nah, just just wrong times with family, right? Married kids, first kids, second kids, going to senior school, and and you'd have had to move really. I couldn't, I'd I couldn't have I'd have to move everybody in it just wrong times. I had some crackers, some good offers, really.

SPEAKER_01 17:38

So why did Aberdeen come out?

SPEAKER_04 17:40

Well I turned it down the first time, and then Russ, who was our chief scout, he was Dell's man. Yeah, he was Del uh Daddy McKinnis' man. Um a brilliant fella, and he he was at us.

SPEAKER_01 17:51

And he got me to Barnes, Russ. Yeah, he it just came at the right time.

SPEAKER_04 17:55

I'd had enough barns and uh little did I know Covid was coming. Um I I was just sick of the club, like what the in the ins and outs and the the ongoings, and I thought, oh, if I don't do it now, I'll never I'll I'll be there till I've till I retire. And to be honest, it was the best thing I'd ever done. Because you met me, was it? Because I was up there, wasn't it? Completely different completely proper. They up and Cormac Park, 12 million quid. Dell was a proper old school manager with new ideas. Oh, was it McKinnon? No, not now, he's he's Dell was in charge. Um peeing up, Paul Sheeran was uh first team coach, Doc assistant manager. We had a top sports science department, the two lads in there. Stokesy, who was my boss at the time. We had three doctors, we had two full-time physios. We had George, who was like he took over from me after Celtic after that, and uh, he was like the in-between physio. We just had a proper staff, proper facilities, everything was done right.

SPEAKER_01 18:57

Everything everything was done right, was it? Everything. What am I hearing about prostitutes at Christmas?

SPEAKER_04 19:04

Prostitutes, it wasn't prostitute, it was it wasn't it was we used to we used to do a secret Santa. And um we used to do a secret santer, so obviously I'm involved because I got on really well with them lads as well. That group I was like us lot.

SPEAKER_02 19:25

I'll say I'll I'll bat you with that the boys love document.

SPEAKER_04 19:27

Uh top, talk. Uh yeah, so we we do secret santer, and whoever I do it for, we do it, and we go for presents, so it's my turn, I'm up, and we're in front of everybody in the in the canteen in the canteen, so I'm stood there. It was all wrapped, was it not? Every wrapped the table and then you can individually, and so I go and get mine, and I can't remember what the first thing was, something or nothing. I opened the next one and I've got like a certificate. Britain's horniest video or Scotland's hornif video, awarded to Neil Dalton. It was flame. So the the backstory is I've I've gone up there, the start of it was COVID, yeah, and it well it was still covered all the 14 months basically. So the missus and kids couldn't go up. So I was up there by myself. So obviously, I was just there for a long time. So we used to talk about things, and I could talk to the lads, and we just talk about all sorts of skit.

SPEAKER_01 20:15

And anyway, so Alan Potridge at the uh hotel could you put the pawn on pretty good.

SPEAKER_04 20:23

So I get this this certificate, Britain, all frames, Britain's horniest physio. So the next thing, I get some gel, like a KY gel or a lube gel thing. And I'm thinking, what's this for? So the last the last thing, the last thing I get, I open and I look at it and I'm thinking, what the hell's that?

SPEAKER_00 20:40

It was a pocket pussy, so it was basically a a funny with like lips that you could basically ride it.

SPEAKER_04 20:50

Yeah, so that's what the gel was for. And I didn't know, so nobody knew Secret Center, so nobody knew until about two months later who got the uh who got the present for us, and we find out it's uh one of the panel members in all.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

Where'd you get that from?

SPEAKER_04 21:04

You know, love honey. So but having said that, so I leave the season after, yeah, finish and move on. I was coming out of football, but then I moved on and goes to Celtic then and has a few months there. But then Stokesy, the boss, I got on really well with him and and George and and all of the staff, to be honest, everybody. They it was uh they do the uh winter shutdowns. So I goes, uh Stokesy rings and asks and says, Look, would you come back up and just staff a week or two for us? I said, I no bother, I fancy a bit of that. You know, I was uh started the clinic and that then. So I goes back up and uh there's a few of the boys still there. Scott Brown's there at that time, so I get introduced to him. How are you doing, X, Y, and Z.

SPEAKER_00 21:47

Walks into the physio room, the certificate's still up there. I've been gone eight months on ten months or something. He's still there. I was like, fantastic.

SPEAKER_04 21:57

Yeah, he's missing the dice.

SPEAKER_02 22:03

There was a few times when, like, I can't remember the top of my head, but some certain people would come in now, like fans and stuff like that, and like you would realise it was still. Oh boys, down here because somebody who doesn't know the back the backstory thinking what's going on here. Do you know?

SPEAKER_01 22:18

Yeah, you had to be put shut down flat on the floor, shuttle. Can I can I go through some questions outfad? Yeah. Quick fire. Best time at any club?

SPEAKER_04 22:29

Uh what we've just mentioned. So the obviously the first Wembley was unreal because it was the first Wembley in 95. Yeah. Symour's time, but then Aberdeen was Aberdeen class.

SPEAKER_01 22:39

Yeah. If Aberdeen was that because you Edinburgh Glasgow, I would never have to be able to do that. Is that because you were mature as well?

SPEAKER_04 22:43

And you I think so, and I got on well with everybody. And I mean everybody, like I sat because I was there a long time, as in the days I'd be there till six at night.

SPEAKER_01 22:54

Was it easier as well that you didn't because obviously here you brought it home with you because people asked you a lot up there, no one yeah, no, it was it was just I'd I spent time with everybody in the club and I got on well with everybody. Biggest match.

SPEAKER_04 23:06

Um maybe two ways. First Wembley, because it was the old proper Wembley walking up the hill, and there was 90, there was more at that game than there was the FA Cup final that yeah. Birmingham? Yeah, yeah, Birmingham. Um I can't remember who the cup final was that year, 95.

SPEAKER_05 23:22

But there was 2,000 more than manu rideout header, was it? Yeah, good knowledge, yes.

SPEAKER_04 23:29

So there was 2,000 more at that game than there was at the FA final, and and obviously the Stevenage game, because that was such so important to get out and get back to the game.

SPEAKER_01 23:39

So those two as a as the major games, worst player attitude-wise, maybe not not just you know when I was a bit of a nasty like not in a horrible way, or it could be a horrible like you said before, Kev, you just wanted to be fit.

SPEAKER_02 23:53

Like the hardest, the hardest player to treat, probably, isn't it? Like you would say, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 23:57

So I say rat. He's a legend, man. He was fit for a career playing on the field with his mates, but he played like that when he played professionally, which was great. He was unbelievable. He was he was so difficult to get to do out, but so easy because he was my mate, and he's my mate that we just we could just get by, you know. I don't know, the players who who over-rehab are hard, yeah. The players who just want to do now, so yeah, like we talked back to Aspers in those days, it times were different, and you're talking 30 go nearly, but bloody hell, they were hard to manage. And I was a boy, I was 22.

SPEAKER_01 24:36

I remember reading something about Yans. You said that Danny Granger was a nightmare because he was frustrated. Danny you had to keep his head right now. So Danny wanted to play.

SPEAKER_04 24:44

Danny came to us off the back of his cruise ship when he got bombed from Hart. He was he was going to go to Sheffield United as a move, I think it was. But obviously done his knee and they backed out, and Hart's done him, yeah, like bombed him, which was terrible the way they'd done it. So he was he was coming into us, so his his knee was still swelling at the time, but he was desperate to get in and get a contract. So I wasn't, I was gonna say I was constantly fighting with him, not fighting in a fighting sense, but constantly dialogued with him to to try and keep him because I knew I knew him anyways. He was I think he maybe cleaned my boots or something, or whether it was that Garvard, I can't remember anyway. But I'd known him for such a long time. I was desperate for it to get him in, yeah, and I knew he would be brilliant for us if we got him because he'd come from that. The right time as well. He had a wander an absolute hammer and a wand, but yeah, difficult but manageable.

SPEAKER_00 25:30

Carl Hawley had a hammer in more ways than wanted. That's the next question.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

Worst injury you've tried where you've gone fucking L.

SPEAKER_04 25:41

Ah a lot of the biggies are bad. So your fracture dislocations of the ankle, what Charlie Rory Loy was a double fracture, the same as the Barcelona strike? David Grey. Yeah, he done him at pressure. Did he do him, didn't he? Yeah, he done him. Oh, did he? And they played 21 together and he did do it. They did know each other, I remember that. They did know each other, he did do him, definitely. It was a nasty tackle. But what Charlie's just done, that I've done one of those, I've treat one of those, and Rory a double fracture was was really difficult. But to be honest, all your long term is your cruciates, your backs, yeah, all your long-term stuff is.

SPEAKER_02 26:18

Here's one for you, Dolly. See, see the boy uh the Liverpool boy's just done his Achilles. Was that as like common? No.

SPEAKER_04 26:27

We had uh Steve Stevie Elliott done his.

SPEAKER_02 26:30

Um like cutting through your like nah coming up there those ones. Was it like very rare?

SPEAKER_04 26:35

Very rare, because I think your pitches were a bit buggy, a bit heavier. Now, I think just the pace the pace of the game and that as well. Your axels, your D cell, so you're stopping your dark as well, really intense, and the firmness of your pitches, which has changed injuries nowadays. Um remember they changed the studs on like preads when they had the blades because a lot of people were doing their knees, they were doing knees and they were getting stuck and and rupturing ankle and things, and they tried to change them to overcome that. You but now we get crucius for a different reason. It's you it's your rapid desell now. It's just that physical problem is the game, isn't it? Like it's just that's people are running faster. Just give you one before we before we go that I'll tell, and I won't tell you the name. The worst injury I've I'll I've done was around about that 2000. I couldn't tell you exactly. And it was a lad who snapped his dick. No chance, nailing a bird, and it wasn't his um it wasn't his thing, so I can't give you the name. I know who we'll talk about. No, it wasn't his last.

SPEAKER_02 27:32

That was one of the first teams I've ever met him.

SPEAKER_04 27:34

Dylan knows the lad uh uh because he played in Scotland. No, no, no, it was in Carlisle. So he's he's seeing a las, and I get a call early in the morning. I don't I'm in hospital. You what? I'm in hospital, I've done something to me. Aye, you have to have your vanjo or something, and you're not bothering. I said, No, no, it's way worse than that. I've had to get an ambulance. So I'm like, all right, okay, it goes up. So I can't remember who gaffer was at that time. Maybe Marty Wilkinson or somebody like that. I don't know. Anyway, so I text the gaffer. Scott, he's had an injury, he's not coming in. I'm going up to the hospital now. So I goes in the hospital, so he's he's in the bed. So I said, What are you doing? So he just lifts the covers up, and honestly, it's like a black pudding. Like huge, massive, swollen, and black and blue. I said, What's happened? He said, Well, I was thinking, and she's sat on top and she's come off, and the bone, uh, a pubic bone has come right down. Oh man. So not to get anatomy-wise, but it it's basically two chambers of muscle, and that's how he goes, ah, it's blood, and he basically ruptured the muscle.

SPEAKER_05 28:36

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_04 28:37

So they basically had to operate. So obviously, one I had to tell his missus and say that he'd been studied in training. Oh, don't snow his own missus. So his own missus, and two is we come out with a median ligament for eight weeks.

SPEAKER_00 28:50

In the news at the start. In the news at the start.

SPEAKER_04 28:52

So he has the operation all done and duty, but stitches, but he can't wash for honestly, it's stark with a disgusting.

SPEAKER_00 28:59

But the lads would ask him, how's it smelling today? So we'd let them have a two, no.

SPEAKER_02 29:04

Dolly, I thought we were talking about uh the boy Shea Logan. No, no, no. Oh, Shea Logan would be. No, no, no, how are you doing? Blah lies. I snapped my dick. So same thing. What?

SPEAKER_04 29:15

Yeah, Shea Logan. You remember Shea from Brentford? Right back.

SPEAKER_02 29:19

Good, good lad. So I thought you asked who you were talking about.

SPEAKER_04 29:21

He's a great lad, he's a he's a dafty as well. He's a good lad.

SPEAKER_01 29:23

I got to go with him. Question from C UFC Danny. Who did you like working for the best? And which manner did you not get on with? You've said they're not getting on with. Who was so simo McKinnon?

SPEAKER_04 29:34

Sim O'Dell, yeah. Poster Cogley was good at Celtic, you know. Oh, I just not in a friendly way, just his training was brilliant. Like, was it quite standoffish?

SPEAKER_02 29:44

Like, a lot of the players said that they never really wanted that.

SPEAKER_04 29:47

He didn't personally like so physios and staff. He didn't want to know about have you got kids? Are you where do you live? Anything. Morning, Neil, how are you doing? Morning, Gaff are you okay? Wouldn't eat with us, so we'd go upstairs, have the food. He would take it back to his office, but his training was so good. Like, so coaches are him. No, him, him, he took it. Or was he proper hands on the Kendo was his assistant, he didn't bring coaches. So John Kennedy didn't know what I'm saying. He's come in his cell, yeah. Ken Kendo and Gavstracken. Hi, Gav Strack. So they were they were the first thing coach and an assistant manager. He didn't bring anyone, he'd done it.

SPEAKER_02 30:19

He was oh that's like everything you would go against. Like, as if you had to say like what you would do, not be successful at a club as a manager, you would say like isolate yourself, don't really get personal with your staff. Aye, that's aye.

SPEAKER_04 30:30

I asked him about it before.

SPEAKER_02 30:33

Was there a reason for it?

SPEAKER_04 30:33

And I said, Gaffett, can I ask you a question? He said, Yeah, sure. I said, You know that you you don't get involved. He said, Why? He said, Because every decision I make is football, there's nothing personal. And that's if that was uh getting rid of my assistant manager, it's nothing to do with John. It's football, performance related everything was that way, and I thought, fair play, I get you now, right?

SPEAKER_01 30:56

Yeah, I would got one for you, and you better tell the truth. Ever had an influence on picking the team?

SPEAKER_04 31:07

Yes, I have, but I'm trying to remember, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:09

MacDonald goes, Greg, that berry game. Remember MacDonald goes on the Monday, we got a game Tuesday night, and you were basically assistant manager with Greg.

SPEAKER_04 31:19

Yeah, yeah. I was so shown on the touchline.

SPEAKER_01 31:24

I thought he's had an advantage, yeah. Did somebody do the someone back in the day as well, is obviously.

SPEAKER_04 31:30

Yeah, there is back in the day, definitely. The ones I got on well with, like yeah, ones I got on really well with, like trusted. Simo even would ask us questions just because it was a completely different, it's not a like football as in professional footballers' opinion.

SPEAKER_00 31:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 31:47

Yeah, what was that?

SPEAKER_01 31:48

Um I just as you say, trust Greg would turn to you, Simmo would turn to you, and just before he brought Billy in. Yeah. Because Billy was used to be. And it was just you and Dennis. Yeah, you just had the conversations.

SPEAKER_04 32:01

Well, yeah, there's it there's been many over the over the years that I've been asked an opinion whether or not it's been, you know, danger than yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:08

Right, last bit of man Dabba again. But don't worry, Dabba Houston, ex-working the manager. Absolute top class lads. Love listening each week on the lonely drives home from West Cumbria. The discussion last week on the hairdryer treatment made me think and remember one of mine in particular. I am no hard man by any means, but very passionate, you could say, about football and winning. During my short time in management at working at Reds, I defo-dished out a few, spitting all over the lads who must have been thinking, and what is he going on about? Me and Degsy would try and go good cop and bad cop, but we'd both end up being bad and bad at cop, leaving bones as good cop the Andrews. One game, Tuesday night, away at Spennymoor, we have been humped for one and we were woeful. At full time I was raging and they were fairly massive and they were fairly massive time and could tell they looked down on us. I'd gone in screaming and shouting, pointing at the lads and shouting, come on, fucking say something then, say something back, just wanting some sort of response and reaction. All sand silent as they probably knew they weren't at it. I've then turned to the medal medical bench in rage and tried to flip it. It was bolted to the floor and didn't move an inch. Didn't know what to do, so I just give it a flaccid right hand jab and walked out to the radio, fist throbbing. The lads, who many of which I'm good pals with still, said everyone just out burst out laughing their tits off. On the bus home, I'm still fuming, sat at the front, not speaking, while the lads are secretly filming videos, pretending to flip empty sandwich packets and drinks off the chairs, but being too weak to do so. About four months later, they show me the videos. Phil McClucky, the main culprit, absolutely rinsing me. Still have a laugh about it to this day, but man at the time I was a very angry man. Keep it up. Love listening to stories from three experienced pros who clearly know the game inside out and lived and breathed it. Cheers, dabba. Question What's the funniest thing you've seen from a manager in terms of head loss, or when they've had a beast and made a prat out of themselves and you've laughed soon as they've gone. I think the one for me was when we signed the balls, Pele and Platini and that. And Leo MacDonald tried to come in, didn't he? Yeah. And went, listen, when you have scored a thousand goals in summer soccer, you can sign balls, and then we've just pissed ourselves.

SPEAKER_04 34:27

Yeah, that was brilliant. I'm sure you've seen the reels now about Roddy. Roddy was just mad. He would he I've seen him boot a one and a half litre, because he drank a lot of water. He would boot the bottle down the touch line, he would shout at the everybody.

SPEAKER_01 34:39

Yeah, just Steve Poppin kicked the we had dugout at Barnsley, assistant manager at Wrexham, but he had concrete and he used to fight men for money back in the day. And he was he was hard, yeah, but he kicked it with his Adidas like uh copper mondials, and you could tell he's broke his foot. He's got like 60 gate 60 minutes to go, and he's just like ah, you just see the boot guard second off, he's got a trainer never wears a train. Oh class. Who was that loser rag anyone? Horton.

SPEAKER_03 35:11

He's done it loads of times, but I was I was young at the time, so but like I said, it in the end with him it become quite regular and it it wears off a bit. Yeah, he wears off a bit. But the first few times I was like taken aback.

SPEAKER_01 35:22

Dylan's more of the thinker manager now. Could Derek McInnes lose it or not?

SPEAKER_02 35:26

Nah, he could. Del could. I wouldn't say he would like throw things about in that, but he was he was on it, he was on it all the time, training every day, games. But he would you would know if if he wasn't happy, and then Doc would Doc would come in and kind of start, kind of maybe medium, and then by the more he kept speaking, it was getting worse and worse and worse. Do you know? And it was like and the boys are sitting thinking, like, wrap it up, man. Like wrap up. Do you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 35:52

I was in the back of the physical room, man.

SPEAKER_01 35:54

Steve Parkin used to talk himself into a bad mood sometimes. We're doing alright. Then he as he's telling it, he's gonna get the next thing we're in on a Sunday. You remember something interrupt him? I've got a little picture there sent in by Eddie Thompson from Keswick, Paul Nixon testimonial. You, Martin Johnson, and Eric Pollard in a midfield three. I was looking for the power of things. So cheers for that Eddie and cheers for that Dolly. Um top draw. We'll get to get some out of that.

SPEAKER_03 36:25

I know it's been long, but just mention Tony, like what type of lad he was, and how much of a piss he is. I know how close you were to him.

SPEAKER_04 36:34

To be honest, yeah, I I mean grew up with him and played with him for like eight-year-old.

SPEAKER_01 36:39

For our listeners, Tony Hopper, ex-carlisle workington player. There's a charity game and charity even the end of May. Sadly, he sadly passed away from motor neurons disease. So there's lots of uh, but what a lad.

SPEAKER_04 36:51

Yeah, top lad. It'll be it'll be eight, eight year old this year.

SPEAKER_01 36:54

It'll be his 50th, I think.

SPEAKER_04 36:56

So it'll be his 50th. Yeah, I'm February, he's May, and Rory will be August, July. He was the only thing where I can sub Tony up, I have never met one single person in my entire life that has a bad word for you.

SPEAKER_03 37:08

Exactly. My what I was saying.

SPEAKER_04 37:10

We've all we're all I mean, I'm 50, we're all older. A lot of people, ah, he's a good lad, he's a good lad. There'll always be people who say he's a knobhead and he's this, he's that. There's nothing for Tony, and that's probably the biggest thing I could ever say about him.

SPEAKER_03 37:22

And he's a big miss. Massive. Yes, he isn't that.

SPEAKER_01 37:24

He um, as I say, he done my mate. Well, my mate actually thinks he didn't do him. I didn't know he'd and and from that tackle came the added time, didn't it? A lot of the added time. Yeah, imagine it was him who scored that goal as well. Yeah, yeah, but uh he was a top player. Oh, it was your top energy. Son's doing well, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 37:42

He's doing well, Dan. Good lad, good, very good, lovely family, great family. Good thing, and uh a little shout out to his to his ex-missus Sue. Um obviously, she's having a tough time at present. Yeah, so we're all thinking about it. Yeah, we are soon.

SPEAKER_01 37:56

Uh yeah, she's having to arrange this and also going on with us with our own thing. So yeah, shout out to her and yeah, perfect, perfect ending to a very, very episode. Very good. Just one shout out. We had your mate on here the other week, both said how black are horizontally.

SPEAKER_00 38:15

Somebody could eat it in a week.

SPEAKER_02 38:18

I thought you shouldn't lick it.

SPEAKER_01 38:21

He didn't sing it at the time, didn't he?

SPEAKER_04 38:25

Honestly, if I'm good doing you would have thought he got them somewhere.

SPEAKER_01 38:29

Simbo couldn't believe it when Simbo come back. Bust have pulled in the car, but arranging. I've gone up in the wheel of that, I'm gonna have gone up in the wheel of eye. Right, top of my hand of the ball back to the